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Guest Post: A Thought Experiment: Iran
Submitted by Gonzalo Lira
A
Thought Experiment: Iran
A whole bunch of American ships are headed to Iran, including one
aircraft carrier. Some claim this
deployment is “normal”, while others think it
might be the first move in a U.S. offensive against Iran, either
actual or diplomatic.
aircraft carrier. Some claim this
deployment is “normal”, while others think it
might be the first move in a U.S. offensive against Iran, either
actual or diplomatic.
From the Iranians’ point
of view, there’s only one way to look at this deployment: As another
provocation.
of view, there’s only one way to look at this deployment: As another
provocation.
American leadership—educated at
the best schools and colleges, multi-cultural up the wazoo—don’t have a
clue why Iranians feel besieged. They have no idea why Iran acts the way
it does. They don’t even realize that they don’t understand Iran’s
motivations.
the best schools and colleges, multi-cultural up the wazoo—don’t have a
clue why Iranians feel besieged. They have no idea why Iran acts the way
it does. They don’t even realize that they don’t understand Iran’s
motivations.
There has been a complete lack of
imagination, in America’s dealings with Iran—and that failure of
imagination is why things are so fucked up in the Middle East. (Is there
any other way to characterize the whole mess? False politesse does not
capture the sheer fucked-up-edness of the situation.)
imagination, in America’s dealings with Iran—and that failure of
imagination is why things are so fucked up in the Middle East. (Is there
any other way to characterize the whole mess? False politesse does not
capture the sheer fucked-up-edness of the situation.)
Iran:
The failure of imagination has been Iran.
The failure of imagination has been Iran.
So
perhaps a thought experiment is in order—for once, let’s try looking at
the world from the Iranians’ point of view:
perhaps a thought experiment is in order—for once, let’s try looking at
the world from the Iranians’ point of view:
To
begin: Let’s imagine some obscure Brazilian terrorist attacks China, way
on the other side of the earth, literally. This Brazilian and his
minions blow up the Forbidden City and the Great Wall, in one fairly
spectacular terrorist attack.
We’re in America—this
shouldn’t involve us. But as a consequence of these terrorist attacks,
the Chinese—screaming for vengeance—deploy their sophisticated weapons
and their millions of soldiers, and invade Canada. Supposedly, this
Brazilian terrorist who attacked China is hiding out in the Great White
North—which is why the Chinese are invading Canada.
shouldn’t involve us. But as a consequence of these terrorist attacks,
the Chinese—screaming for vengeance—deploy their sophisticated weapons
and their millions of soldiers, and invade Canada. Supposedly, this
Brazilian terrorist who attacked China is hiding out in the Great White
North—which is why the Chinese are invading Canada.
We
Americans express genuine sympathy for the Chinese’ loss. We decide to
actually help the Chinese find the Brazilian terrorist! We even decide
to help
the Chinese with their conquest of Canada! That's how much we
repudiate this cowardly terrorist attack.
Americans express genuine sympathy for the Chinese’ loss. We decide to
actually help the Chinese find the Brazilian terrorist! We even decide
to help
the Chinese with their conquest of Canada! That's how much we
repudiate this cowardly terrorist attack.
But then, out
of the blue, the Chinese leader—in a carefully choreographed official
speech—declares our country part of an “axis of evil”. And with no
provocation on our part—indeed, after we have helped the Chinese
conquer Canada—they vow to wipe us out at the slightest provocation,
presumably with nuclear weapons.
of the blue, the Chinese leader—in a carefully choreographed official
speech—declares our country part of an “axis of evil”. And with no
provocation on our part—indeed, after we have helped the Chinese
conquer Canada—they vow to wipe us out at the slightest provocation,
presumably with nuclear weapons.
Then, the
Chinese start to claim that Mexico,
of all countries, was involved in the terrorist attacks against
China. Nevermind that the Mexican leadership hates and fears the
Brazilian terrorist. Nevermind that the Brazilian is an ultra-Catholic,
who hates and distrusts the Mexican leadership for being born-again
Baptists. Nevermind that there's no rhyme or reason for this alleged
collusion.
Chinese start to claim that Mexico,
of all countries, was involved in the terrorist attacks against
China. Nevermind that the Mexican leadership hates and fears the
Brazilian terrorist. Nevermind that the Brazilian is an ultra-Catholic,
who hates and distrusts the Mexican leadership for being born-again
Baptists. Nevermind that there's no rhyme or reason for this alleged
collusion.
The Chinese use trumped up and
extraordinarily dubious “evidence” to back up this claim of
collusion—they even claim that the Mexicans are developing WMD’s that
they intend to use on China, which stirs the Chinese populace into a
frenzy.
extraordinarily dubious “evidence” to back up this claim of
collusion—they even claim that the Mexicans are developing WMD’s that
they intend to use on China, which stirs the Chinese populace into a
frenzy.
Then, the Chinese illegally invade
Mexico, and outright occupy the country.
Mexico, and outright occupy the country.
Our nation
now finds itself besieged: There are a hundred-thousand odd Chinese
troops in Canada to the north, and another couple of hundred thousand
odd Chinese troops in Mexico to the south—all of them armed to the
teeth. And back in China, they're hysterically screaming for “regime
change in America”.
now finds itself besieged: There are a hundred-thousand odd Chinese
troops in Canada to the north, and another couple of hundred thousand
odd Chinese troops in Mexico to the south—all of them armed to the
teeth. And back in China, they're hysterically screaming for “regime
change in America”.
We in America know what
the Chinese really want—they want our food. We’re the world’s
breadbasket. And while China has plenty of food, they want more. They
are unwilling to make their citizens pay fair market prices for food—so
they want to capture our food, so they can feed their citizens at our
expense.
the Chinese really want—they want our food. We’re the world’s
breadbasket. And while China has plenty of food, they want more. They
are unwilling to make their citizens pay fair market prices for food—so
they want to capture our food, so they can feed their citizens at our
expense.
Meanwhile, Venezuela—a country one
tenth the size of the U.S. in terms of territory and population—is
hell-bent on regional hegemony. Venezuela consistently antagonizes and
provokes the U.S. with their undeclared nuclear weapons.
tenth the size of the U.S. in terms of territory and population—is
hell-bent on regional hegemony. Venezuela consistently antagonizes and
provokes the U.S. with their undeclared nuclear weapons.
But
what can we do? The Chinese support Venezuela with weapons, billions of
dollars in aid money, and the full weight of their political and
military power. Venezuela provokes us constantly, to the point of
stationing three of their submarines—loaded with nuclear missiles—not
fifty miles off America's East Coast. In easy striking distance of
America’s major cities.
what can we do? The Chinese support Venezuela with weapons, billions of
dollars in aid money, and the full weight of their political and
military power. Venezuela provokes us constantly, to the point of
stationing three of their submarines—loaded with nuclear missiles—not
fifty miles off America's East Coast. In easy striking distance of
America’s major cities.
Meanwhile, back in
China, the woman who is the current Foreign Secretary not only openly
hates us, she once said that even a minor skirmish with Venezuela would
result in the U.S. being "wiped off the face of the map"—meaning,
presumably, a nuclear response.
China, the woman who is the current Foreign Secretary not only openly
hates us, she once said that even a minor skirmish with Venezuela would
result in the U.S. being "wiped off the face of the map"—meaning,
presumably, a nuclear response.
We have no
nuclear weapons. But we do have a whole lot of hate for both China and
Venezuela—justifiable hatred.
nuclear weapons. But we do have a whole lot of hate for both China and
Venezuela—justifiable hatred.
America’s
history (in this thought experiment) is inextricably tied to China's
foreign policy. Back in 1953, China forcibly overthrew the
democratically elected government of Dwight Eisenhower, in a covert
operation known as Operation
Ajax.
history (in this thought experiment) is inextricably tied to China's
foreign policy. Back in 1953, China forcibly overthrew the
democratically elected government of Dwight Eisenhower, in a covert
operation known as Operation
Ajax.
Then, China installed their
puppet-dictator, Richard Nixon, who ruled for 25 years with an iron
fist, using the SAVAK—Nixon's
feared secret police, trained by Venezuela’s Mossad security agency,
and China’s own CIA.
puppet-dictator, Richard Nixon, who ruled for 25 years with an iron
fist, using the SAVAK—Nixon's
feared secret police, trained by Venezuela’s Mossad security agency,
and China’s own CIA.
China and Venezuela kept
the puppet-dictator Nixon in power for 25 years, using SAVAK to kidnap,
torture and kill American freedom-fighters. Great American men and women
were lost. People like Robert Kennedy, Martin Luther King, Jesse
Jackson, Gloria Steinem, David Halberstam, Woodward & Bernstein, Bob
Dylan, Willie Nelson, Ray Charles, Paul Newman, Francis Ford Coppola,
Billy Graham, Jerry Falwell, Naom Chomsky, Jonas Salk, Harper Lee, even
poor Rosa Parks and countless others were all tortured and/or killed by
SAVAK, often with the assistance of Venezuela’s Mossad and China’s CIA.
the puppet-dictator Nixon in power for 25 years, using SAVAK to kidnap,
torture and kill American freedom-fighters. Great American men and women
were lost. People like Robert Kennedy, Martin Luther King, Jesse
Jackson, Gloria Steinem, David Halberstam, Woodward & Bernstein, Bob
Dylan, Willie Nelson, Ray Charles, Paul Newman, Francis Ford Coppola,
Billy Graham, Jerry Falwell, Naom Chomsky, Jonas Salk, Harper Lee, even
poor Rosa Parks and countless others were all tortured and/or killed by
SAVAK, often with the assistance of Venezuela’s Mossad and China’s CIA.
While
the flower of America was being tortured and killed, America’s
breadbasket was being raped by Chinese and Venezuelean interests—from
1953 to 1979, they took our food and didn't pay a dime for it. Or else
they “paid” for it by giving their puppet-dictator credit to buy Chinese
weapons—weapons which their puppet-dictator then used against American
citizens!
the flower of America was being tortured and killed, America’s
breadbasket was being raped by Chinese and Venezuelean interests—from
1953 to 1979, they took our food and didn't pay a dime for it. Or else
they “paid” for it by giving their puppet-dictator credit to buy Chinese
weapons—weapons which their puppet-dictator then used against American
citizens!
Finally, we Americans—after
tremendous struggles—managed to overthrow the Chinese puppet-dictator in
1979. (And where did the murderous bastard seek asylum? His
patron-state, of course—do we need any more evidence that he was their
marionette?)
tremendous struggles—managed to overthrow the Chinese puppet-dictator in
1979. (And where did the murderous bastard seek asylum? His
patron-state, of course—do we need any more evidence that he was their
marionette?)
China declared us a “rogue nation”
after we overthrew the dictator who had repressed us so horribly. Since
then, 30 years later, the Chinese have been consistently trying to
undermine our economy with sanctions and United Nations embargoes.
after we overthrew the dictator who had repressed us so horribly. Since
then, 30 years later, the Chinese have been consistently trying to
undermine our economy with sanctions and United Nations embargoes.
They’ve
succeeded, too—our economy is not a fraction of what it could have
been, had the Chinese not had this vendetta against us. They choke our
economy, while threatening us with their overwhelming military power,
and goad us with the Venezueleans just to annoy and humiliate us.
succeeded, too—our economy is not a fraction of what it could have
been, had the Chinese not had this vendetta against us. They choke our
economy, while threatening us with their overwhelming military power,
and goad us with the Venezueleans just to annoy and humiliate us.
All
because of our resources—the Chinese are so insane to possess what is
ours that they will do whatever is necessary to take it away. That is
why they hate us. That is why they have interfered unforgivably in our
history. That is why they want to destroy our country, and turn it into
their “protectorate”—so they can once again rape our land, and take away
what belongs to us, and to our children.
because of our resources—the Chinese are so insane to possess what is
ours that they will do whatever is necessary to take it away. That is
why they hate us. That is why they have interfered unforgivably in our
history. That is why they want to destroy our country, and turn it into
their “protectorate”—so they can once again rape our land, and take away
what belongs to us, and to our children.
They
openly say that they want a “Chinese-friendly regime change”. They say
they want “moderate Americans” to control our country—but the people
they refer to as “moderates” are people who worked for the bloody
dictator we overthrew. Our current leaders—members of the
America-First/America-Free party, good Mormons one and all—sometimes are
over-the-top, no one will deny it: Sometimes they say stupid things.
But we trust them. We know they are our representatives—not
Chinese puppets, like Nixon and his goons.
openly say that they want a “Chinese-friendly regime change”. They say
they want “moderate Americans” to control our country—but the people
they refer to as “moderates” are people who worked for the bloody
dictator we overthrew. Our current leaders—members of the
America-First/America-Free party, good Mormons one and all—sometimes are
over-the-top, no one will deny it: Sometimes they say stupid things.
But we trust them. We know they are our representatives—not
Chinese puppets, like Nixon and his goons.
The
Chinese claim that they invaded Canada and Mexico in order to
find this Brazilian terrorist—but with all their power, they still
haven't found him after almost ten years. Was there ever a terrorist? Or
was it a false-flag operation? Did the Chinese themselves blow up the
Forbidden City and the Great Wall, in order to have an excuse to invade
the North American continent? Some of their own people publicly believe
that the Chinese government staged the terrorist attacks as an excuse to
invade the region—that should tell us something.
Chinese claim that they invaded Canada and Mexico in order to
find this Brazilian terrorist—but with all their power, they still
haven't found him after almost ten years. Was there ever a terrorist? Or
was it a false-flag operation? Did the Chinese themselves blow up the
Forbidden City and the Great Wall, in order to have an excuse to invade
the North American continent? Some of their own people publicly believe
that the Chinese government staged the terrorist attacks as an excuse to
invade the region—that should tell us something.
The
Chinese plan to invade and/or destroy us—that is obvious. So we won't
give them the chance: Instead, we’ll help the Mexican and Canadian
insurgents. We’ll give them weapons and money, so we can buy time. Soon,
our scientists will develop nuclear weapons of our own: Then neither
the Chinese nor the despicable Venezueleans will ever again hold their
nuclear sword to our throats with impunity. Soon, we will be able to
strike back—and if they provoke us, we will strike back.
Even if it means our own destruction.
Chinese plan to invade and/or destroy us—that is obvious. So we won't
give them the chance: Instead, we’ll help the Mexican and Canadian
insurgents. We’ll give them weapons and money, so we can buy time. Soon,
our scientists will develop nuclear weapons of our own: Then neither
the Chinese nor the despicable Venezueleans will ever again hold their
nuclear sword to our throats with impunity. Soon, we will be able to
strike back—and if they provoke us, we will strike back.
Even if it means our own destruction.
After
all, it’s a thousand times better to die free than to live on your
knees. Living under the Chinese-controlled puppet-dictatorship taught us
that. We won't let it happen again.
all, it’s a thousand times better to die free than to live on your
knees. Living under the Chinese-controlled puppet-dictatorship taught us
that. We won't let it happen again.
Here ends
the thought experiment—but not the questions.
the thought experiment—but not the questions.
———————————
First
of all, the more you think through America’s provocations and
interference in Iran’s history, the more you can’t help but be impressed
by Iran’s self-control. They’ve played their cards much better than
either the U.S. or Israel.
of all, the more you think through America’s provocations and
interference in Iran’s history, the more you can’t help but be impressed
by Iran’s self-control. They’ve played their cards much better than
either the U.S. or Israel.
Precisely
because of all the foolish, pointless tauntings and provocations by the
U.S. and Israel, I think it’s likely that—regardless of what they
say—Iran is very busy trying to acquire nuclear weapons. Israel’s and
the U.S.’s nuclear taunting guarantees that the only thing that will
give Iran’s people and leadership peace of mind is a few dozen
nuclear-tipped rockets. And they will in all likelihood acquire them—one
way or another. Fear will drive them.
because of all the foolish, pointless tauntings and provocations by the
U.S. and Israel, I think it’s likely that—regardless of what they
say—Iran is very busy trying to acquire nuclear weapons. Israel’s and
the U.S.’s nuclear taunting guarantees that the only thing that will
give Iran’s people and leadership peace of mind is a few dozen
nuclear-tipped rockets. And they will in all likelihood acquire them—one
way or another. Fear will drive them.
For
now, Iran’s strategy of quietly but steadily fomenting insurgents in
Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine is the only sensible approach Iran can
take. It has to keep America pinned down in those two quagmires while it
develops nuclear weapons.
now, Iran’s strategy of quietly but steadily fomenting insurgents in
Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine is the only sensible approach Iran can
take. It has to keep America pinned down in those two quagmires while it
develops nuclear weapons.
Because that’s
Iran’s ultimate goal—obviously: From the point of view of Iran’s
leadership, any other strategy would be irresponsible and foolish. The
Iranian leadership want to protect their population from both the U.S.
and Israel. From Iran’s point of view, only the acquisition of nukes
guarantees their safety.
Iran’s ultimate goal—obviously: From the point of view of Iran’s
leadership, any other strategy would be irresponsible and foolish. The
Iranian leadership want to protect their population from both the U.S.
and Israel. From Iran’s point of view, only the acquisition of nukes
guarantees their safety.
However, a nuclear
Iran isn't a disaster—on the contrary: My own sense is, if and when Iran
actually acquires nuclear weapons, regional tension will paradoxically
ease—think India/Pakistan. And Iran is a far more stable country than
Pakistan, with none of the territorial ambitions or frictions.
Iran isn't a disaster—on the contrary: My own sense is, if and when Iran
actually acquires nuclear weapons, regional tension will paradoxically
ease—think India/Pakistan. And Iran is a far more stable country than
Pakistan, with none of the territorial ambitions or frictions.
If
and when Iran acquires nukes, the U.S. will realize it can’t fuck with
Iran anymore—it has to negotiate. The same conclusion will be arrived at
in Tel Aviv.
and when Iran acquires nukes, the U.S. will realize it can’t fuck with
Iran anymore—it has to negotiate. The same conclusion will be arrived at
in Tel Aviv.
The danger zone, I think, will
be that uncertain period before Iran for-sure has nuclear weapons—in
other words, the period we are living in now.
be that uncertain period before Iran for-sure has nuclear weapons—in
other words, the period we are living in now.
It
is conceivable that Israel will stupidly launch a pre-emptive strike,
in a misguided attempt to “protect Israel” from Iran acquiring nukes. In
fact, I would argue that this is a very possible outcome. This
pre-emptive strike will bring about a nuclear retaliation by
Iran—they’ll simply buy a few from Russia (which would be happy to sell
them, if Israel starts launching nukes helter-skelter), and that will be
that for Israel. Israel is smaller, and more concentrated. In any
nuclear war, Israel will lose.
is conceivable that Israel will stupidly launch a pre-emptive strike,
in a misguided attempt to “protect Israel” from Iran acquiring nukes. In
fact, I would argue that this is a very possible outcome. This
pre-emptive strike will bring about a nuclear retaliation by
Iran—they’ll simply buy a few from Russia (which would be happy to sell
them, if Israel starts launching nukes helter-skelter), and that will be
that for Israel. Israel is smaller, and more concentrated. In any
nuclear war, Israel will lose.
Now is the
danger-time. And it will be the Americans and the Israelis—not the
Iranians—who will pull the trigger on the regional suicide.
danger-time. And it will be the Americans and the Israelis—not the
Iranians—who will pull the trigger on the regional suicide.
»
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Junior high, if he's claiming Israel has expanionistic plans on Iranian real estate.
A surgical air strike can be done at any time. No big deal. Landing troops requires months of planning and moving logistical assets into place. A very big deal.
Especially since all, or nearly all of the strategic warehouses on Diego Garcia, Europe & the US were emptied to avoid having to pay to repair all the equipment damaged in Iraq & Afghanistan. Hell, we cannot even maintain a "surge" in personnel while having a strategic reserve of people or equipment worthy of the name reserve. It all goes to the Con-Tractors and most especially the back baggers who are more concerned with observing Americans right here in the US.
Any deep thrust into Iran would not be possible unless we restarted the draft. It would require a huge number of troops to invade and occupy Iran. Since a draft is not in the cards you can forget that option. We can capture some of the Iranian oil fields but our supply lines and flanks would be extremely vunerable.
No ground war, no way, I agree 100%.
Though we could help Israel by bombing the 12th Imam's hole in Qom (and the Ayatollahs as a bonus), take out the distillation tower at the refinery at Esfahan (50% of Iran's gasoline supply), take out all northern rail bridges near their frontiers (no gasoline from Russia, Iran can then WALK to work not ride), not to mention their nuke sites (I disagree with above poster that Iran having nukes makes things more stable).
Maybe Israel could just do us the favor of getting all of this done ASAP, bring TSHTF, and we deal with it from there. Our economy / financial system is going down anyway, let's just allow Israel to be the catalyst, and get this OVER WITH!
Got Gold? Got food? Got secure water?
take a deep breath -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uohP4gk0wU
This is very much an elitist friction. I harbor no animosity toward the Iranian people and those who live here in freedumb's land are largely peaceful and productive. If it were up to me Obaba, Ahmadinejad, and the Zionist president would strip to the waist and fight to the death in a thunderdome type setting and leave the rest of us out of it.
It is up to you. And it's up to me. And it's up to them and those and they. It's up to all of us and to say otherwise is to run from our responsibility.
Again, I get that the U.S. might want to control Iran in order to control the oil. And I get that Israel would defend itself if Iran attacked it. But I don't get why you think Israel would want to fight Iran?
Yeah, poor Israel, all they want is peace. (and state of the art weapons, and white phosphorus, and dime weapons, and nukes, and...) LMAO!!
+10000 and a I not an anti-Semite.
you forgot the diamonds
Israel is running out of water, arable land and cheap energy. According to Ariel Sharon, they also need about 2 million more Jews to move there.
Back in the day of the Shah, Israel got the majority of their oil from Iran. Iranian oil went by tanker through the Red Sea to the Israeli port of Ashkelon. The Shah allowed the Israelis to siphon off oil beyond what made economic sense. This really pissed off many Iranians. Israel was promised recently by the Shah's son that once he retook power, Israel and Iran wiould once again be friends and the oil would flow again. It is a pipe dream but the Israelis and the Iranian Monarchists living in the US believe it will happen.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eilat_Ashkelon_Pipeline_Company
As far as solving the Israeli fresh water and arable land problem, the goal is to attack and invade Lebanon and drive all Lebanese north of the Litani river. Israeli settlers will then be moved in Lebanon.
Ariel Sharon told some American Congressmen that the 2 million Jews they need to emigrate to Israel will need to come from France and the USA. This is because only the US and France have sizable populations of Jews. Ariel Sharon told the Congressmen that they have the means to get the American and French Jews to emigrate. I assume that means they will use the same methods used against Arab and Persian Jews in the 40's and 50's. Look for attacks by the Israelis against American and French Jews to start in ernest at some future date.
Useful info. I didn't know. But what has attacking Lebonon got to do with Iran? My question was why are folks talking like Israel wants to fight with Iran? Do they want to take Iran's land for their own?
As I said Israel needs water, oil, gas and arable land. The closest country with water and arable land is Lebanon. Also the poulation in southern Lebanon is not that big. Less people you have to route. Israel only has a few options to get oil cheaply. The US has promised Israel that the old pipelines from Iraq to Israel will be rebuilt. The Israelis also want to re-establish their old Iranian oil source.
The US wants to limit who Iran can sell oil and gas to. That can only be done via a puppet government. The US will not rest until a puppet is installed in Iran. Also a puppet Iranian government would stop funding Hezbollah and Hamas. Israel cannot invade an hold southern Lebanon as long as Hezbollah is getting supplies from the Iranians. If Hamas is out of the way, the Israelis and the US can install their old Palestinian stooges Fatah. Fatah will then sign the right of the Palestinians away.
Thanks for the response. I think I get it. If Israel defeats Iran, they can move into Lebanon.
And what happens to Israel when America flops over?
They and spit in our face and brazenly flout their longterm military and economic relationship with the Chinese. The Israelis will help the Chinese plan for a future conflict with the US. For this treason they will get the money required to fund their military and expansionist plans.
A bonus for Israel will be backlash of the American populous against American Jews. Emmigration from the USA to Israel will go into overdrive. The Zionist Dreams of "Greater Israel" will get another shot in the arm with this influx. Israel presently does not have a large enough population to occupy all the land they believe they will acquire in future wars. They also do not have enough military age males.
Insightful post, Anarchist. Thx.
"Let's get rid of U.S. Jews"?
And Israel has "expansionist plans"? Despite never progressing farther than the Golan Heights and the Sinai peninsula?
Do you guys ever think about what you're saying?
misattributing, misquoting, misrepresenting: typical jew-jitsu tricks.
Actually Shylockracy, it's called Krav-Maga, and Israeli women are very good at it...
Pray tell, what else have you learned about Israel from watching The Simpsons?
I know from experience, since I am one of those jews that you seem to be so fond of. As such, I've had the pleasure to meet many Israeli women, many of which were very proficient at self-defense. But since you think I get my information from the boob tube, here you go - meet Avivit Cohen:
Part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHi1ekrF9Qg
Part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9T5aSibexjU
Part 3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=as_hajxRoHA&feature=related
Part 4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-bXcqbeyJ8&feature=related
Part 5 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7IOcoDx5fw&feature=related
Beautiful and deadly, now that's sexy. Cheers!
you consistently offer thought-provoking posts here, Anarchist - I might have chosen any of them to respond with a thank you, but this one is really nails it.
it's a wide-angle point-of-view, yet sharply focused. . . artful!
I do not know your age.
But what you suggest was actually a good television add from the 70s (for real)
(without the dome) against Nuclear War.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxbZUF1zQ0U&feature=related
Second, from Sun Tzu's time forward the ability to see things from your opponent's perspective has been valued -- considered a sign of intelligence and a source of wisdom for strategies military and otherwise.
This is correct, but making a fantasy of what your opponent's perspective may be is the height of folly.
And to try to influence people with this fantasy is called something to do with scaring of the crows......oh, that's it. A straw man.
A lot of cawing ensues....
The Iranians have simple motivations. They want to study in Los Angeles, keep their women locked up in Tehran and party on weekends in London.
Looking at it from this perspective, their behavior is rational.
Pretty much like all privileged males in the Mideast do now. They also love to gamble, drink, screw Hos and drive fast cars. Unfortunately for those who are not of the priviledged classes, you need to try and do these things back home. Not too easy to do unless you are in Lebanon, Syria or Bahrain.
Author might be forgetting that Iran is at war with the US and has been since they took our embassy. As to peaceful thoughts and fuzzy feelings towards their neighbors, that will only happen when all Jews and non-muslims are dead or subjugated, as per their take on the koran and the leaders of their death cult preachings. mpw
You are clueless. Over a million Sephardic Jews and millions of Christians were living all over the Mideast prior to WWII. They were in Iraq, Iran, Yemin, Syria, Lebanon ..etc. They were living productive lives until a million Eurotrash Ashkenazi Jews showed up and started raising hell. In fact Iranian Sephardic Jews were some of the wealthiest people on the continent.
Why don't you look up Sephardic and Ashkenazi? You might educate yourself. Sephardic Jews are darker skin and look like Arabs and Iranians and Ashkenazi Jews are light skin and look like Russians and Poles.
cbtrice, you are joking, aren't you. If not, I worry that you are hopelessly ignorant.
Cramer takes $ for recommending a stock on TV = Tyler getting a reach-around for sending viewers to Lira's terrible blog.
Hey, what happened to the Iranian escorted flotilla to save the starving Gazans? Did they decide they had to wash their hair that day?
It was cancelled, for real. Google it.
Too many words. Kinda got where you were goin there with that China and Canada thing and then zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Gearing up for war...
It is not our business to be concerned with what Iranians "think." We need to be concerned with our goals and ideals with an understanding that the best society will win and the weak shall perish.
So you agree that leading by example is the best way forward, or is the best society the one that is most aggressive and dangerous?
That sounds like it is straight out of the Trilateral Commission/Bilderberg/PNAC handbook. Congratulations.
Perhaps this is the height of naivety, but I wonder if the world wouldn't be a more peaceful place if "Venezuela" were nuked off the face of the planet.
I would agree if you had of said "vuvuzelas"
on Tue, 06/29/2010 - 20:20
#443497
"Perhaps this is the height of naivety, but I wonder if the world wouldn't be a more peaceful place if "Venezuela" were nuked off the face of the planet."
Hey, don't I know you?
There you go. A freshman level stream-of-consciousness assignment to his typical C quality work while taking hits off the hookah.
Wow.
And here I was hoping that the word 'thought' in the title might be indicative of something interesting.
Like this - try on for a fact that the Persians I've met disdain the people they consider rag-heads. They've left Iran looking for freedom, and I might mention in some pretty dispicable places, and done well. Not to mention that they can turn a mean kabab if you get the chance.
Or perhaps that Persians consider themselves part of a 4 millenia-old culture that is on the brink of rising again.
Again, so disappointed.
Nevermind the kababs, it's all about the Sabzi polo! My man's mother makes the baddest one in town.
.
If you had been born 80 years earlier you would have made a fine Nazi apoligist...
We need spell check on ZH? And an IQ test...an easy one...
ouw, that's gonna leeva mark.
1) In the long term, US cannot stop nations from developing nukes. Futile policy.
2) So Iran builds a bomb
A) if they don't use it, or give it to someone who does...what's the issue?
B) if they do, what is all this invade and occupy crap about. It's all about punishing them and letting them rebuild their cities at cost to
themselves.
3) This whole argument is about the legality of the creation of Israel anyway. If any country thinks it was illegal then they can say everything they want about Israel. If they recognize the state as legitimate, then every rocket that flies over the border and suicide bombing (which we all know is funded by foreign states) is an act of war. No reason to get hurt feelings about this. This is not the first or last conflict over territory. The middle east is not unique.
Best moviequote of ALL time:
"Mr. President, I'm not saying we wouldn't get our hair mussed, but I do say no more than ten to twenty million killed, tops, that is, depending on the breaks."
Best moviequote of ALL time:
"Mr. President, I'm not saying we wouldn't get our hair mussed, but I do say no more than ten to twenty million killed, tops, that is, depending on the breaks."
The movie - Dr. Strangelove.
it's all coming full circle, people.
If the US acquired at least as much nuclear firepower as Venezuela, then perhaps Venezuela and China might learn some manners, shut the fuck up and not drag the rest of us into WW3 already.
Brilliant point. If Iran had the nukes, while Israel was running around like "retards" trying to build a crappy one, while Israel was swearing to wipe Iran off the face of the Earth I am sure Iran would show constraint. You sir, are a rocket scientist. May your camel's ass be warm and accepting...
Good point. If there were any other nuclear weapons capable countries in the world other than Israel, all would be well.
The Bat Phone at the PPT headquarters must have been ringing tonight.
LOL..
From shorty over at Cap Stool...
Too many death crosses to count on many of the usual charts. I keep trying the hedge my physical positions in precious metals and keep loosing money. That's good I guess.
Looks like a retest of the broken H&S neckline for a quick decompression stop before we continue our descent further into the abyss. Europe might be waking up with the Bends so go long Nitrogen bubbles LOL
If you continue pushing Israel, whose founding was triggered by the Holocaust, and whose people's most intense passions are fear and anger at being threatened constantly with annihilation, you will have yourself another Middle East war. Nuclear if necessary.
Isn't being threatened constantly with annihilation part of the job description?
From time immemorial?
Still some left? How did that happen?
Nope. Ashkenazi Jews are not the Biblical Jews. The Sephardic Jews are. Ashkenazi Jews did not exist 1000 years ago so time immorial would be a stretch. Ashkenazi Jews are the majority in Israel and control the government and the economy.
They are also the Jews affected by the Holocaust. Israel was established, in part, to give those folks a place to escape to.
But your broader point bears some examination (more than we can give it here). God promised the land of Canaan (Israel) to Abraham's offspring. Let's ignore the issue of Ishmael for now. Abraham's grandson had twelve sons, which became the Twelve Tribes of Israel. Again, ignoring the issue of Ishmael, the land of Israel was promised to the Twelve Tribes. At some future point, the single 12-Tribe Kingdom of Israel split into two Kingdoms - the 10 Northern tribes and 2 Southern tribes (Judah and Benjamin). The 10 Northern tribes were conquered and carried off as captives and have disappeared from history. Two hundred years later, the two southern tribes were conquered by Babylon and carried off as captives. About 50 years later, Babylon was conquered by Persia, and the "Jews" were given permission to leave. Some returned to Jerusalem, some to Egypt, some stayed in Persia, and others went elsewhere. The point being, the offspring of the Tribes of Judah and Benjamin have pretty much stayed visible in history. I think you will have trouble "proving" that the Ashkenazi are not descended from Biblical Jews.
Now consider - the land of Canaan (Israel) was promised to Abraham and his decendents. Abraham's decendents are:
1. The Tribes of Judah and Benjamin, who have remained visible in history.
2. Ishmael - whose decendents have remained visible in history; and
3. The 10 Northern Tribes, who have been lost to history. Who are they? We don't know, but the Land of Canaan (Israel) has also been promised to them.
Anybody who says that the claim to the current land of Israel is simple is not well informed.
Wrong anarchist.
Genetic tests tell no lies. The origin of the Hopi and Navajo indians has been traced to Mongolia. Their ancestors came here via the Bering Straight 15,000 years ago. No amount of genetic testing has shown Ashkenazi Jews are the Biblical Jews. Tests show they came from the Russian steppes. Ashkenazi Jews also have genetic defects almost unknown in the Sephardic Jewish population. Tay Sachs ..etc.
http://judaism.about.com/od/health/a/geneticdisorder.htm
Test after test has shown that Sephardic Jews share the same genetic markers as many Arab and Persian Muslims and Christans. The Mideast has been conquered and colonized over and over again. You will find the genetic markers of many Western Europeans in the local Christian and Muslim populous.
According to you, who are the Biblical Jews? And of what importance is that designation to this discussion? The Land of Canaan (Israel) was promised to Abraham's descendents, whom I identified in my last post. Are you claiming that the Ashkenazi cannot trace their roots back to one of those groups? Or are you making the larger claim that the gene pool has become so diluted that almost anyone can make a claim on Israel?
Exellent post, Gonzalo Lira. Go ahead and junk me now neocons.
One does not have to be a neocon to point to the straw man nature of Gonzalo Lira's guest post. One has to just be cognizant of logic and fact.
Reducing opponent's retorts to the post as being neo-con is ad hominem, by the way, and not logical.
zen0 Spock out......
Where is the straw-man that you speak of? Your critisism is just about as effective as the the GP.
zen0, you say it is a straw man, but just because you say its so, does not make it true. Without any supporting facts your straw man comment is irrelevant.
My neocon comment was a mistake as I was being too narrow. I should have said everyone who disagrees with GL's post can junk me. There people who are not neocons who have junked comments made by people praising GL's thinking. Sadly, they are most like you, offering no evidence to support their criticism.
Sorry, double post.
"Gonzo Lira?" Is this a joke?
I wish I remember who said "American foreign policy only makes sense only if you assume that they own the world"
You are probably paraphrasing Noam Chomsky. Just a guess.
If the US is at war with Iran it started in 1953 when the US overthrew their government.
The discovery of oil in 1908 by the British in Khuzestan spawned intense renewed interest in Persia by the British Empire (see William Knox D'Arcy and Anglo-Iranian Oil Company, now BP). Control of Persia remained contested between the United Kingdom and Russia, in what became known as The Great Game, and codified in the Anglo-Russian Convention of 1907, which divided Persia into spheres of influence, regardless of her national sovereignty.
This happened before that. Internet is awesome.
Iran has been a plaything for the US, Brits and Russians for 100 years.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/tehran/etc/cron.html
You left out the part about where the Americans attacked sovereign Chinese territory, took hostages that we held for over a year (one of whom died later as a result of the delay in receiving appropriate medical treatment), stole Chinese property, and vowed to exterminate one of China's best allies. And our "generosity" in helping this invasion of Canada couldn't have anything to do with the fact that we were at war with Canada, could it? Burning Chinese flags, aiding China's enemies at every turn, seizing every and any opportunity to imprison Chinese journalists and tourists who might end up in or near our country?
Moral relativism makes me want to puke my friggin guts out. I'm not afraid to say that American culture is vastly superior, in virtually every aspect, to Iranian culture. Thanks to the fanatics and mullahs and their stranglehold on education and media, the country has become a hovel of fanatics, lunatics, and mysogynist savages. Their once-modern cities are a shambles (not our fault). Their country is an abject failure, and they have nobody to blame but themselves...with the possible exception of Jimmy ("Jimmuh") Carter.
So in your world white men do no wrong. I guess the 4 wars the US fought against China never happened. Millions of Chinese dead don't matter cause they are yellow right?
Here is some tidbits of History for you to chew on.
Q: During WWII what two enemies both sent weapons and money to the Nationalist Chinese army?
A: The USA and Nazi Germany. Sweet huh
Q: After the Nationalist Chinese army in the east escaped to Taiwan, how many Taiwanese did they execute with aid from the US millitary?
A: 100,000 Taiwanese politicians, land owners and academics with US supplied bullets
Q: The Nationaist Chinese Army in the west escaped to what countries?
A: Burma and Laos where many are still today. They still have strong ties with Taiwan and the USA
Q: What is the source of funding for the Nationalist Chinese still living in Burma and Laos?
A: Opium and Heroin. The proceeds are laundered through Taiwanese banks with full knowledge of the US government.
More cynical people would say the CIA is still in the drug business with their old Nationalist Chinese cronies. Ya think the CIA is at it again in Afghanistan?
typical lost dude (may i say mainstream republicanasaur?) who is still caught in reagan's evil empire. go home, back to the jurassic age.
So it is your contention that the prevalent culture in Iran today is superior to, or at least equal to, mainstream American culture? Which part, exactly? The prohibition of any religion other than Islam (punishable by death, of course)? Rampant, codified mysogyny? Rabid, institutional anti-Jewish sentiment? The wholesale slaughter of citizens as punishment for protests against sham elections? Supression of the media? Sharia law? State sponsored terrorism? They are sitting on more wealth than can be imagined, yet their citizens live in abject poverty under the thumb of their crazed mullahs. Hey, you want to live like that, be my guest. But I say No Thanks. It's got nothing to do with skin color (cheap, cowardly, moronic, lazy accusation tossed out when people just can't seem to grasp that whole logic thing)...it's culture. Backwards, thousand year-old re-tread culture custom made to promote serfdom. I'll take 1 Reagan over a thousand of the fuck-tards running the show today. Don't recall Reagan sending out his minions to videotape little mind-numbed drone children singing songs of praise to their exalted leader like this Newport sucking loser. And after 8 years of watching your gal Nancy Pelosi cackle and bang that gavel, I put the Democrat party just a notch or two below the dill-weeds in Iran
George HW Bush did a fine job running the country when Reagan was president. ;)
Who said anything about superior? The Iranian leadership is mostly scum and street trash. They took power from the Monarchists with the aid of 90% of the population. The manintain power because they keep their base reasonably happy by doling out huge subsidies for housing, food and fuel. 25% of Irans budget is used for these subsidies.If the Monarchist retake power they will end the subsidies and sell the country out to the US and ISrael. This was promised by the Monarchist's exiled leader the Shah of Irans son.
The Monarchists fled to the US and Europe after the Shah fell and have been waiting for decades to retake power. I don't any reason to put them back in power since they represent a minority of the Iranian population and could not stay in power without the US sending in an occupation army. You wanna volunteer to keep a bunch of rich Iranian snobs in power? Didn't think so.
The Western leadership is mostly scum and are controlled by the elite. The goal of the Western elite is to drop my standard of living and steal my savings. That is not something I support.
haha now I know you're trolling, "American culture" that's a good one, youre funny ;)
obviously everyone knows there is no such thing, being a brand new and fast floundering country still looking for its own identity.
news for you numpty, burger king and x factor is not a culture,
and 200 years as opposed to nearly 6000 now is just laughable.
you personally typify what is wrong with your nation pretty well.
I liked the article, and I would like to see this thought exercise played out in a very realistic full immersion video game by numpties like you, and let you see and feel exactly how it looks to the 5.8 billion of us not suffering your USA style delusions.
+100, for jumping on the amrkn "culture" joke, hehe.
The looming war has nothing to do with America. We are merely the latest host. When we're empty, the foreign object will move on.
That was g-damn brilliant. It's also easier to read on the original blog where it has actual paragraph breaks. Where'd you go to copypasta school, TD?
Many public policy makers do understand this line of thought, and people within the intelligence/military community definitely do. However, letting this "thought experiment" become a valid narrative in the mainstream wouldnt help your Iran end game whatever that is, hence the apparent lack of imagination.
you forgot the bit about the brazilian terrorist having worked for the chinese already....AND the fact that the chinese government already admitted that he actually had no part in it!!....but the people are so stupid in china that they dont care and just want to ATTACK something west of them....maybe it will help their economy since they the chinese are the worlds biggest weapons manufacturers....HAHA ....FACT IS americans are too stupid for your thought experiment...too uninformed. they dont care thats why this country is going down the tubes. besides the chinese corporations control everything anyway...they have the media all locked up....here is the link about your brazilian terrorist if any half thoughtful people want to see it...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4646091253905495376#
This article is way too incendiary. Can we just have some harmless gold price target article and let the goldbugs and deflationists do battle?
I expected better from ZH squatters in general.
But as soon as the original post ended, a tiny, silly-looking car rolled in, the doors popped open and at least a dozen clowns tumbled out the doors and started an incoherent little show.
Glad I didn't pay to see this.
Oh shit, I DID pay. That'll teach me.
"But as soon as the original post ended, a tiny, silly-looking car rolled in, the doors popped open and at least a dozen clowns tumbled out the doors and started an incoherent little show."
Brilliant (and accurate) mental image!
European, Russian and Chinese oil companies including Shell, Lukoil, CNPC and BP are having a field day winning auctions to develop big Iraqi oil fields. Shell and Petronas have obtained the right to develop Majnoon with 7 billion barrels of reserves, Lukoil and Statoil the West Qurna 2 field which in total holds 9.75 billion barrels, and Total and Petronas the Halfaya field with 0.5 billion barrels. The only US company that secured a deal is ExxonMobil over the development of West Qurna .
Quite a disappointment given the amount of money the US has invested in Iraq through the Iraqi war?
Maybe not!!
I have heard lately from different sources rumors that their was a deal made between China, Russia, and the United States. China and Russia have been selling weapons to different terrorist groups in Iraq AND NOW THEY HAVE AN INTEREST THAT PLACE WILL BE SAFE.
Source:
Heavy rumors about secert deal between the U.S, China and Russia over Iraqi oil
And?
Who cares about who extracts the oil out of Iraq?
Lords dont care about who work the fields. All they want is the goods delivered to their home.
Do you have any point telling that China will have a monopoly of consumption over the oil extracted in Iraq? Same for Russia? All the others (excluding the US)?
Dollar pegged to oil exists.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tAsFSI1jc0
Metaphorically speaking, basically the way I see any war with Iran playing out. Pretty much like Marvin Hagler third round KO of Mustafa Hamsho 1982...
No contest...
How about this thought experiment for Iran: Nuke the fuckers back to dirt...
metaphorically speaking of course...
The gorilla in the room that no one sees is Israel, but the taboo around discussing why we have a special relationship with them still prevents us from discussing openly and logically, without falling into personal or ethnic tirades, what has happened. Imagine this thought experiment, what if there was no Israel...if the whole project never got off the ground would 9/11 have occurred? Would there be a war in Iraq and Afghanistan? The answer is no. What strategic interest does the US have by maintaining a special relationship with Israel? It is entirely negative. Israel gains enormously, the US is adversly effected, there are no net benefits for the US. So why does it persist and why don't we change course? This is a tremendously thorny question which opens a pandora's box on the power of media and money in politics that few are willing to open, and those that do are almost always branded anti-semetic. The anti-semtic lable is the last dike holding back a suppressed feeling of manipulation that many feel.
There is a danger here. Listen to what people whisper about, what they say in aynomuous comments, and you see a lot of pent up anger and resentment. In public discourse this is never mentioned. If, like many postulate, we are headed for a true economic meltdown scapegoats will be sought, and demogogues will emerge, and it will become very ugly, as they will say what has been whispered about and will be seen as courageuous for doing so. We MUST discuss this openly, without hate or violence, but with honesty and deceny, or something quite ugly could occur. Here is an article that discusses this quite openly. http://www.thecactusland.com/2010/04/end-of-republic.html
The reason we have a special relationship with them is twofold. First, they are the only functional democracy in the entire region. Second, Israel, quite frankly, really doesn't give a flying crap what anybody thinks of them (since everyone in the region hates them anyway) and is more than happy to use some US hardware to pound the holy hell out of trouble-makers in the region. That is a good friend to have. The real question to ask is why none of the middle eastern countries that care so much about the Palestinians want them anywhere near their border? The Palestinians are the functional equivalent of the blue-tarp, duct-tape, '72 Pinto up on blocks in the front yard, Foghat blasting white trash that you pray to God doesn't move into the house next door...you wish them well, as long as they are living across town. The history of the madness known as Islam is well-documented. They cannot accept anything less than the complete extermination of all Jews from every corner of the Earth. The thing is, when they're done with the Jews, they're coming for you. And they won't let up until your nose is in the dirt with your dome pointed toward Mecca 5 times a day.
Wow, you're an idiot, let me guess you learned all that in Church?
But why do we care if Israel is a democracy? How they decide to rule themselves is irrelevant to America. Second, if you are a Palestinian, living in Gaza ,and you, your parents and grandparents were born in Palestine, is Israel a democracy? Trashing peoples religons is not a great way to create intelligent dialogues..
I was with ya until you took the cheap shot at Foghat.
Muslims are bound by the Koran to protect allow religious freedom to peoples of the book. That would be both Christians and Jews. And so it is in Iran.
And how many Jews were killed by Muslims in North Africa and the Middle East before the zionists invaded Israel? A couple of millenia of peaceful living wasn't it? Good jobs like that for Jewish philosopher Maimonedes as surgeon for the Egyptian King, after being chased out of Spain just like the moors by the christians. I
ranian Jews do just fine they have their representation in parliament and have no special regard for the zionists publicly or privately.
"Muslims are bound by the Koran to protect allow religious freedom to peoples of the book. That would be both Christians and Jews."
Not entirely...
Surah 9 (in part):
Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.
Christians and Jews are only marginally protected under Sharia law as lower-class citizens, as long as they pay the Jizya (tribute tax), and live willingly as dhimmis, under submission to the Islamic state.
la'n astaslam
This is a selected reading appropriate only to the issue of Jizya. We all pay taxes and this could be expressed as a sensibility that all are welcome as long as they pay tax. But you know better don't you? Jizya was only ever applicable to adult males of working/fighting age who were not part of the Islamic Army, so they were paying tax in order to be conscientious objectors while they kept working while the rest of the population was out soldiering.
The Mughali Empire pretty much held that view with the Hindu didn't they so people of the book might be held as mostly a universal concept in the historical record.And Akbar killed off Jizya anyway.
It may suit your purpose to compartmentalise Jizya but when we say Islamic State we read tax as tax right? Or on Islamic State in the Iranian example we mean a Muhammedan democracy fostered by Amercan libertarian idealism where the religious authority retains reserve powers expressed mainly through vetting of the candidates during preselection and a house of review that cannot introduce legislation. Lots of independents get up there. More than in the US right?
So what was your point?
Democracy? LOL! It's called "apartheid" and genocide. Open-air prison. Israel has committed war crimes against these people. Do you not expect them to retaliate? The palis were born there. Where are they going to go?
Boogey boogey! The ragheads will cut off your head and steal your daughters! Junk!
If you remain vigilant in the defense of human rights you have nothing to worry about.
Here's a thought experiment for those that junked this article. Let's imagine a country as a person, and all the different factions, populace, corporations et al are just organs within his body. Now some people have healthy bodies, others have certain health problems due to some organ failiure or them hogging the main resources of the body thus starvinf everyone else. Well, shit happens - either through misfortune or, more likely, through your own lifestyle choices. But that's not what the article is about - it's not about your kidney calling it a day after twnty years of alcoholism or your heart from a diet of fastfood and no excercise. No, it is about how one person (Iran) interacts with others - in this case his bullies (United States of Isrealiamerica). And notwithstanding his internal health problems it looks like this person is sane and sticks to his guns, while the bullies in the schoolyard decided it's time to increase their pressure on him so that he plays by their rules (give us your lunch money and we will let you walk with nary a blackeye).
So who gives a fuck if Iran is totalitarian? Today even the Great Democracy (somewhere between Canada and Mexico) is pulling all sort of totalitarian shit almost on a daily basis. At least Iran does it in the open and doesn't try to pretend about it.
Therefore let's stick to what this article was discussing and not what we want it to discuss.
Good Read, Nationalistic (Fascist) Isrealis and the retarded Christian Zionist they string along are the ones pushing for a War with Iran. They are acting like rabid dogs.
Great thinking, great writing.
Thanks
OK. Picking up the challenge of "looking at the world as an Iranian", I took a longer look at Google maps. On your left, Iraq. On your right, Afghanistan. Hmmmmmm....if I'm an Iranian, right now I'm feeling boxed in and threatened by the US military.
DING!!
the penny drops, for one at least....
This is the Democratic nation...
http://ow.ly/20BJN
It is supposed to be a Consttutional Republic...but I agree it has become that of mob rule.
It's sad to see that ZH has been hijacked by a bunch of rednecks. You shout foul-mouthed one-liners, junk the hell out of everything and generally behave like m-o-r-o-n-s. If you are not brain damaged by nature's design i suspect you are paid a few cents to spew your shit here.
Iran is one of the major (2nd largest if i'm correct) oil suppliers to China. They built the Gwadar deep-sea port. Destabilize Afghanistan, Pakistan - and now Iran - and you score another point in the game to undermine China. Is that plain enough? Add to that Israel being scared of Iran aquiring nuclear weapons. Don't forget to add the "distract from the bad economy" ingredient.
Other than being a jew-loving redneck brainwashed neocon dork, i don't see how anyone in their sane mind can really "support" what's going on with the current US ships amassment.
Zionist Christians are placated by the deaths of Muslims. You haven't figured that out yet? Along with their Israeli fascist brothers they share a war criminal mentality of collective punishment on Islam. I don't see how anybody could support U.S. actions after 9/11, the country has gone considerably down hill since the attacks were allowed to happen. Mentally, financially, reputation wise...ect.
Osama said it best.
"Since the 11th, many of America's policies have come under the influence of the Mujahideen, and that is by the grace of Allah, the Most High. And as a result, the people discovered the truth about it, its reputation worsened, its prestige was broken globally and it was bled dry economically, even if our interests overlap with the interests of the major corporations and also with those of the neoconservatives, despite the differing intentions."
"And for your information media, during the first years of the war, lost its credibility and manifested itself as a tool of the colonialist empires, and its condition has often been worse than the condition of the media of the dictatorial regimes which march in the caravan of the single leader."
I full agree with the statement about US media, we have no mainstream voice to counterbalance the overwhelmingly Zionists MSM...nothing wrong with some of the US media being Zionist, the problems is all dissenting voices are blackballed, in politics, academinia and the media.
I assume you are talking about the some of the comments and not the article, otherwise you need to reread the article. Seemed to me the majority of comments were against the Israelis or rather support of Israeli poliy..
Other than being a jew-loving redneck brainwashed neocon dork, i don't see how anyone in their sane mind can really "support" what's going on with the current US ships amassment.
Talk to the Saudi government. For whatever reason, they are our friends. They are scared spitless that Iran will get nuclear weapons. They have urged us to deal with Iran for some time now. This has been reported in the news over and over. Why is it that folks here only discuss Israel's concern? There are Arab countries that are plenty concerned as well. If Israel didn't exist, these Arab countries would still be urging the U.S. to take care of the Iran problem.
The lack of understanding of the global picture around here, or the unwillingness to admit to the global picture, is astonishing.
If Israel didn't have at least 100 nukes, do you really think Iran would be obsessed with having one? We haven't had a nuclear confrontation because opposing sides always balanced out the threat. If I were an Iranian stratagist, I would feel much safer having a few nukes in my pocket to balance the Israeli threat. Why should Israel have QME? Imagine if Mexico had QME (Qualitative Military Edge) supplied by China? How would we feel?
Yes, I really do think Iran would be obsessed with having one...Conquest runs deep in the Persian blood.
here, let me fix that for you:
Conquest runs deep in the hyper-competitive nationstate's blood.
and for "blood" read: psyche.
Because they're intellectually dishonest. They don't really give a shit about Palestinians or Iranians. They only care about about attacking capitalism vis a vis the U.S and Israel.
Saudi Arabia is a time bomb.
Many, many problems are building up on their territory. And they see the reality of the deal the US offered which as days pass by, diminish their capability of tackling their internal issues.
Saudi Arabia only lives as the swinger producer to the US in order to break the oil cartel. The day they lose that capability, the day they are useless to the US. The day they lose the US protection.
Their position is highly uncomfortable and they fear the day of pay back.
Not a surprise 9,11 was fomented by Saudi Arabians. They have come to realize the dead end the US has put them in.
Don't view myself as "truther" but clearly, "Osama" whoever he was, is dead physically long ago (i'd rather believe corrupt Bhutto, than MSM) and is nothing but a construct of fear, a boogeyman meant to scare and incite righteous anger in american patriots. I have a hard time believing that some caveman terrorists hijacked a number of planes and managed to drive them straight into WTC towers after taking a few hours of basic flight training. Also WTC-7 collapse and Larry Silverstein quips and his buying lease and insurance on the complex just weeks before 9-11, i don't know...
All the conspiracy theories just muddy the waters, the attacks were allowed to happen to launch an imperial campaign of the middle east. Bottom line.
I believe you are correct about Osama though, long been dead, the quotes I posted above were most likely written by Adam the American, who was ghost writing for him for a few years.
Agreed. The conspiracy theories are a trap, they set them, folks fall in, and they by siting them they are completly discredited. There was no conspiracy, Al Queda pulled it off, and the neo cons took full advantage of it to carry out there pro Israel agenda.
http://polidics.com/cia/top-ranking-cia-operatives-admit-al-qaeda-is-a-c...
"...and just like that, he's gone..."
In completely unrelated news....the housing tax credit gets an extension for those under contract....here comes more govt propping of the fake market.
"The U.S. House of Representatives voted to give homebuyers who qualified for a federal tax credit more time to settle on their pending purchases."
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-06-29/homebuyer-tax-credit-s-closing-...
Boy, this place is starting to resemble a real leftist blog: Deadbeats, junkies, and losers trying to promote their own lame blogs that no one visits.
All we need, now, is a shitty musician pimping his "Politically Aware" band.
Tyler needs to contact Gandolf and Orkin about this AIPAC-troll & Dick Cheney body crab infestation on these boards.
"rouge nations armed with top secret exotic weapons"
...Fabulous...
Fing Genius!
Brazilian terrorists only attack the locker room of Argentina's football team.
We have no reason to attack China. The chinese buy all our iron ore and copper!
Sorry to see the article was "lost in translation" for you.
I've just read through this entire thread & not a single person has observed the blatantly obvious link that w/ in a week of the USA sending a carrier fleet off the coast of Iran, that we also "just" discovered a 15 year old "deep cover" Russian spy ring.
Come on guys, this is glaring, I had hoped some one here could post the 3rd side of this relationship, but it's clearly not going to happen.
Hey Geopol, where the hell are you on this?
Very good point.
I can only share my thoughts, though I am only an amateur at this.
I see Iran as a proxy war with Russia and China - they both want to see the end of the US. It's a tricky game; resource wars is another cold war. Iran is one of the final stands for R and C. We have yet to see in MSM any proxy conflicts in Africa.
The West is collapsing; obvious death throes. Will R and C make an attack on US intl bases/lower 48 or just sit back and watch another source of petro dry up for them?
The intrigue is astounding yet the American public lay asleep. Remember the billions in US bonds caught on the Swiss border a while back? Was that an attempt to collapse the dollar? The outright decapitation of Polish leadership is another "WTF?". The Georgian conflict summer '08. Wonder if North Korea actually produced their nukes or acquired them? What if Iran already has nukes? Sinking of SK vessel is very odd as well. I do believe that the Iranian nuke program is for peaceful energy; but they could also have acquired weapons being pushed into a corner.
The main question I have in my mind is whether or not R and C will make a move.
Back to Lady Gaga.
The more obvious it becomes that Obama is a gutless turd who is in way over his head, the more these types of situations are going to occur. Nobody needs to attack us...the voters of this country started the clock on a time bomb when they elected Mr. HopeChange. Our enemies need only to sit back and watch as he destroys our economy, weakens our military, chokes out our industries, effectively kills agriculture with ridiculous regulations, stirs up racial tensions, incites class warfare, disarms the citizens, and basically kills off what remains of our collective spirit.
Iran is run by religious, totalitarian fanatics. In the evolution of matters, therein are the issues that this article blows by. Last I checked, I share not a single value with them. I may share some with the IRANIAN people but the dictatorship, nada.
IT will take a deeper thought process than this person/writer to uncover a path to freedom, liberty and harmony in the ME.
In case you all missed this, and it's not a Onion headline.
On the Drudge. "can the gov tell you want to eat?" yes according to Kagan.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSoWGlyugTo
Americans could not comprehend foreign military bases on our soil
We have these all over the world; OUR military forces are occupying others' territory.
Imagine a chinese military base in your state. With Chinese soldiers out and about and protected by your gov't, operating sometimes above the law. Now imagine also a foreign aircraft carrier off our coast...in sight of you sitting on the beach. With total air and naval superiority over you. If they want to bomb you on the beach or attack suddenly, they have the means to do so.
THAT is how others see us. Our military posture is VERY aggressive.
We didn't just show up in those countries and set up a military base. In some cases, such as in Germany and Japan, allowing us to keep a military presence was part of their surrender after WWII...sorry, but if you go to war with a country and lose, there are consequences. In other cases, the host country has happily invited us to set up a base because it enhances their own security. We don't have 'occupation forces' in these countries, patrolling the streets, enforcing curfews, etc.
We don't have Chinese bases in the US because (a) we didn't sign a surrender to them, and (b) we don't want or need them here to protect us.
I am curious as to why you hate the US so much.
the chickens are coming home to roost http://snardfarker.ning.com/video/us-and-polish-troops-in
accurate but ignoring the reality that eventually nukes will be used by someone eventually.
and iran will behave just like the u.s. if they were as powerful as the u.s.
our empire needs consolidation. we need to pre-empt over-extension of our empire or the u.s. will wind up
like the british, a has-been decaying imperial empire.
the problem you don't address, is whether or not the world is trending toward rule by fewer larger powers, or towards more smaller powers.i believe it is trending towards fewer larger powers and eventually 'one world order' of less than 20 governments that fully cooperate with one another. given this reality, i believe that the death of funamentalist christian theocratic eocnomic-political institutions foreshadows the death of islam as a governmental-economic force. the financial geo-political power of religion in the west ended with the enlightenment. the same will happen to islam within the next few hundred years.
the faster it happens , the better off the west will be. the slower it happens the worse off the west will be.
If I were Iran, I'd kick China in the Nutz!
Certainly a lot of details like that to take into consideration. Thanks windows vps | cheap vps | cheap hosting | forex vps