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WikiLeaks Releases Iraq War Logs Which Detail Over 100,000 Deaths, Show US Ignored Torture, Expose Routine Friendly Fire
Wikileaks has lifted the embargo on what it dubs the biggest leak of American documents in history. The Guardian, which is the primary nexus of data collection, notes that almost "400,000 secret US army field reports have been passed to the
Guardian and a number of other international media organisations via the
whistleblowing website WikiLeaks. The electronic archive is believed to emanate from the same dissident US
army intelligence analyst who earlier this year is alleged to have
leaked a smaller tranche of 90,000 logs chronicling bloody encounters
and civilian killings in the Afghan war." The reports will likely do little to raise the US' standing in the eyes of the international community: "The numerous reports of detainee abuse, often supported by medical
evidence, describe prisoners shackled, blindfolded and hung by wrists or
ankles, and subjected to whipping, punching, kicking or electric
shocks. Six reports end with a detainee's apparent death."Additionally, the reports detail how friendly fire from US troops became routine: Americans have shot at their own troops or allies so often that in at least one case a strafed British vehicle didn't even stop. Since this will apparnetly now be the main story this weekend, might as well get a head start.
The new logs detail how:
- US authorities failed to investigate
hundreds of reports of abuse, torture, rape and even murder by Iraqi
police and soldiers whose conduct appears to be systematic and normally
unpunished. - A US helicopter gunship involved in a notorious
Baghdad incident had previously killed Iraqi insurgents after they tried
to surrender. - More than 15,000 civilians died in previously
unknown incidents. US and UK officials have insisted that no official
record of civilian casualties exists but the logs record 66,081
non-combatant deaths out of a total of 109,000 fatalities.
More from the Guardian:
As recently as December the Americans were passed a video apparently showing Iraqi army officers executing a prisoner
in Tal Afar, northern Iraq. The log states: "The footage shows
approximately 12 Iraqi army soldiers. Ten IA soldiers were talking to
one another while two soldiers held the detainee. The detainee had his
hands bound … The footage shows the IA soldiers moving the detainee into
the street, pushing him to the ground, punching him and shooting him."
The
report named at least one perpetrator and was passed to coalition
forces. But the logs reveal that the coalition has a formal policy of
ignoring such allegations. They record "no investigation is necessary"
and simply pass reports to the same Iraqi units implicated in the
violence. By contrast all allegations involving coalition forces are
subject to formal inquiries. Some cases of alleged abuse by UK and US
troops are also detailed in the logs.
In two Iraqi cases postmortems revealed evidence of death by torture. On 27 August 2009 a US medical officer found "bruises and burns as well as visible injuries to the head, arm, torso, legs and neck"
on the body of one man claimed by police to have killed himself. On 3
December 2008 another detainee, said by police to have died of "bad
kidneys", was found to have "evidence of some type of unknown surgical procedure on [his] abdomen".
A
Pentagon spokesman told the New York Times this week that under its
procedure, when reports of Iraqi abuse were received the US military
"notifies the responsible government of Iraq agency or ministry for
investigation and follow-up".
The logs also illustrate the readiness of US forces to unleash lethal force. In one chilling incident they detail how an Apache helicopter gunship gunned down two men in February 2007.
The
suspected insurgents had been trying to surrender but a lawyer back at
base told the pilots: "You cannot surrender to an aircraft." The Apache,
callsign Crazyhorse 18, was the same unit and helicopter based at Camp
Taji outside Baghdad that later that year, in July, mistakenly killed
two Reuters employees and wounded two children in the streets of
Baghdad.
Iraq Body Count, the London-based group that monitors
civilian casualties, says it has identified around 15,000 previously
unknown civilian deaths from the data contained in the leaked war logs.
Although
US generals have claimed their army does not carry out body counts and
British ministers still say no official statistics exist, the war logs
show these claims are untrue. The field reports purport to identify all
civilian and insurgent casualties, as well as numbers of coalition
forces wounded and killed in action. They give a total of more than
109,000 violent deaths from all causes between 2004 and the end of 2009.
This
includes 66,081 civilians, 23,984 people classed as "enemy" and 15,196
members of the Iraqi security forces. Another 3,771 dead US and allied
soldiers complete the body count.
No fewer than 31,780 of these
deaths are attributed to improvised roadside bombs (IEDs) planted by
insurgents. The other major recorded tally is of 34,814 victims of
sectarian killings, recorded as murders in the logs.
However, the
US figures appear to be unreliable in respect of civilian deaths caused
by their own military activities. For example, in Falluja, the site of
two major urban battles in 2004, no civilian deaths are recorded. Yet
Iraq Body Count monitors identified more than 1,200 civilians who died
during the fighting.
Legal action is already being prepared:
Phil Shiner, human rights specialist at Public Interest Lawyers, plans to use material from the logs in court to try to force the UK to hold a public inquiry into the unlawful killing of Iraqi civilians.
He also plans to sue the British government over its failure to stop the abuse and torture of detainees by Iraqi forces. The coalition's formal policy of not investigating such allegations is "simply not permissible", he says.
Shiner is already pursuing a series of legal actions for former detainees allegedly killed or tortured by British forces in Iraq.
As before, all the docs will be made available online:
WikiLeaks says it is posting online the entire set of 400,000 Iraq field reports – in defiance of the Pentagon.
The whistleblowing activists say they have deleted all names from the documents that might result in reprisals. They were accused by the US military of possibly having "blood on their hands" over the previous Afghan release by redacting too few names. But the military recently conceded that no harm had been identified.
Condemning this fresh leak, however, the Pentagon said: "This security breach could very well get our troops and those they are fighting with killed. Our enemies will mine this information looking for insights into how we operate, cultivate sources and react in combat situations, even the capability of our equipment."
There are many other stories emanating from the main portal, among which:
- The introduction- The leaking of more than 390,000 previously secret US military reports details the hidden realities of the war in Iraq (link)
- A look at Frago 242 - Secret order that let US ignore abuse;
Mistreatment of helpless prisoners by Iraqi security forces included
beatings, burning, electrocution and rape (link) - Iraq war logs: How friendly fire from US troops became routine: Americans have shot at their own troops or allies so often that in at least one case a strafed British vehicle didn't even stop (link)
- Apache crew killed insurgents who tried to surrender: US military legal adviser told helicopter crew that Iraqi men were valid targets as they could not surrender to aircraft (link)
- Iraq war logs reveal civilian body count of invasion is much higher (link)
- Civilians gunned down at checkpoints (link)
- Iran accused of plotting attack on Green Zone: Audacious strike in Baghdad among allegations against Tehran of everything from gun running to training insurgents (link)
- US fails to answer for deaths of journalists: Highest toll among Iraqi reporters caught in crossfire, mistaken for insurgents or murdered by countrymen in sectarian violence (link)
- Killings in the wake of Saddam's hanging: Brothers named after him were lynched along with their mother – while gallows mocking of dictator led to revenge bombing (link)
- Iraq war logs: US spy balloons blew towards Iran: Hi-tech JLens blimps with secret technology used to detect cruise missiles may have dropped into Tehran's lap (link)
A tabular summary of all the Associated Iraqi deaths is presented below:
The link also denotes the method of death on both sides.
The Guardian has also released a map of the deaths (which for now apparently is not working)
For those pressed for time, the below clip summarizes most of the key findings:
Sure enough, the Pentagon has immediately responded (via the New York Times):
“We deplore WikiLeaks for inducing individuals to break the law, leak
classified documents and then cavalierly share that secret information
with the world, including our enemies. We know terrorist organizations
have been mining the leaked Afghan documents for information to use
against us, and this Iraq leak is more than four times as large. By
disclosing such sensitive information, WikiLeaks continues to put at
risk the lives of our troops, their coalition partners and those Iraqis
and Afghans working with us. The only responsible course of action for
WikiLeaks at this point is to return the stolen material and expunge it
from their Web sites as soon as possible.
“We strongly condemn the unauthorized disclosure of classified
information and will not comment on these leaked documents other than to
note that ‘significant activities’ reports are initial, raw
observations by tactical units. They are essentially snapshots of
events, both tragic and mundane, and do not tell the whole story. That
said, the period covered by these reports has been well chronicled in
news stories, books and films, and the release of these field reports
does not bring new understanding to Iraq’s past.
“However, it does expose secret information that could make our troops
even more vulnerable to attack in the future. Just as with the leaked
Afghan documents, we know our enemies will mine this information,
looking for insights into how we operate, cultivate sources and react in
combat situations, even the capability of our equipment. This security
breach could very well get our troops and those they are fighting with
killed.”
Also, remember, the banks are not allowed to reveal anything about their own criminal ways because otherwise the world will end. Ah, the parallels.
And conveniently enough, here is an interview on the very topic between Dylan Ratigan and Pentagon Papers creator Daniel Ellsberg :
»
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The state is the coldest of cold monsters.
OT> If the Saudis are going to buy 60 billion dollars worth of arms, will they pay us in "dollars"?
But didn't we elect President Obama to restore our image in the world? Now its going back into the gutter. This Julian is a F**King racist!!
Heh.
War is a dirty, nasty, brutal undertaking. It surprises me that the U.S. military takes the time to document all of these events.
Kill them all and let God sort them out.
Jesus already sorted you out, buddy. Read your Bible. It says you're going to hell.
"Whatsoever you do to the least of my brothers, you do unto me."
Could you define "brothers"?
Maybe someone posted it somewhere.....completely unrelated to this article.... 7 banks were closed by the FDIC Friday night.
http://www.fdic.gov/bank/individual/failed/banklist.html
I think we are 1 shy of last years total of 140....and the market continues with all is ok in the world...
I don't know how to submit tips to Tyler, but I made a startling discovery this weekend. I cropped and pasted the rallies from March to mid-April (the second leg up on the rally) to the most recent rally from Sept to mid-Oct. What I discovered were two charts that were almost visually identical, and also the same height.
My question for Tyler and his experts is: What are the odds of this happening in nature?
http://dejavutrading.blogspot.com/2010/10/you-might-find-this-interestin...
My website looks at historical comparisons to look for trading edges: http://dejavutrading.blogspot.com/
Everything is not what it appears to be, illusions are the key to keep control.
Graveyard - Old White Zombie movie clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEI5VasZGwk
Nothing new ! Wiki is CIA! War is hell!
So much straw .... all designed to ignore the truth... truths we know, anyway.
We should have never gone to war in Iraq (from desert storm - thru Clinton air enforced sanctions which killed more Iraqis than desert storm by many reports nor Bush 2 with the biggest lies of all) nor been in Af Pak over 6 months.
We ceded any illusion of high ground and continue to make it worse. We let the rich greedy bastards destro rule of law, once again... and turned our military intel complex into a known gang of global torturers.
And yet many think the loss of rule of law across the board is not connected? Go back a few days to ZH's post on BCI... and tell me these neo fascist criminals players are not all connected.
At least as victors in WWII we prosecuted those who murdered and tortured.... this time we both joined in and protected those who did the same. This is a huge immoral and extremely dangerous turn. These people (congress-wall street/big money-military-police) will not give a fuck when it's time (in their heads) to do the same within their own borders. That should be as clear as the satanic tea-bagging comments in support of what we've done in this very thread.
The enemy is within.
Bitchez, bitchez...this is the essence....government is evil
Over 200,000,000 million dead in the 20th century alone from "government" wars. Poer elite sending the innocent off to do their bidding and to die.
But, do your Patriotic Duty in November and go vote "D" or "R" as we are required to do.
that pretty much sums it up.
One more election for the slow learners.
It will actually help in the long run.
Whoever provided that information to Assange should be given a fair (military) trial and shot.
Our constitution was against a standing army for the exact reason that it could be exploited by industrial forces in foreign wars. Since our army was never disbanded after WWII, this exact scenario has been realized again and again.
Our Constitution allows for a Navy to protect our shores. These days, an Air Force to protect our borders is also in order. Otherwise, State militias and an armed citizenry is more than sufficient to repel/discourage foreign invaders and, more likely these days, to repel/discourage oppressive Federal government tyrants.
As it relates to torture, of course, America is far from the only perpetrator of these types of crimes, which is why I am reticent to self-loathe with everyone here. The phrase "War is hell" may sound cliche, but it is also quite factually true. Our soldiers are young kids who lose buddies virtually every single day. For them, the war IS very, very personal. I can understand how some of them might freely torture their enemies for the purposes of revenge and/or if they felt it could save some of our own soldiers in the future.
Remember, "the enemy" is sawing off the heads of the living. This, too, is torture of the highest order. I can see where war turns each side into the very animals we claim to fight. I do not condone it, but rather understand the complicated psychological effect upon those young men and women who wear our uniforms and fight our State sponsored battles.
ABOVE ALL, this is a WAR OF IDEAS. As such, it will be won in the minds of global inhabitants long before it can ever be won in fields of battle. Importantly, we cannot win this war by engaging in the exact type of brutality that we condemn. This gives "the enemy" rightful ammunition against our way of life. Any "policy of torture" is out of the question, and all other torture should be reprimanded severely as a war crime or otherwise because we have too much at stake. Again, if we do not win the war of ideas, then we have no chance of succeeding long-term. Right now, I do not believe that we are winning the war of ideas, because it has become clear to me that our country has been hijacked by industrial forces.
Muslim folks are like any other folks that simply wish the best for themselves and their children. What makes some Muslim folks "wrong" is that some believe that those of us who do not believe in the full message of Islam should either convert to Islam or be executed as infidels. Of course, this is not liberty, so if any crusading Muslim ever showed up on my doorstep to convert me or my family, then I would be forced to defend myself accordingly.
Obviously, today, this is not what is taking place overseas. We have become the aggressors. Retaliatory efforts from the attacks on September 11th should have been targeted and carried out with targeted intelligence and special forces/air strikes. Nation building has helped nobody but the Wall Street and Military Industrial Complexes. We could defend our country and our borders ten times over with the money we have handed over to the private enterprises, along with the precious lives of our brave young men and women, in order to destroy Iraq and (what exists of) Afghanistan.
bottom line: these wars WOULD NOT EVEN BE POSSIBLE if we did not allow for deficit spending at the Federal level, fiat-based money, centralized money planning, and fractional reserve lending, all of which currently facilitate the enrichment of the banking and military industrial complex at the expense of our freedom.
Great strides would be made towards ending current and future foreign wars if we were to end The Fed, outlaw fractional reserve counterfeiting, and open up our economy to competing currencies including gold and silver.
Achieving this would pull the teeth of both the banking cartel and the military industrial complex who continue to collude against both us and what few liberties we still have in America. Future wars would only be fought by volunteer armies with volunteered private gold and silver in pure defense of our lives and freedoms here. Any war would then be just and I would pity the invaders.
This is a far cry from where we find ourselves today. It is very, very sad, and should enrage us all.
Rest assure, there are far greater terrorists in Washington D.C. and within the Federal Reserve Bank of New York than there are in either Iraq or Afghanistan. These truly "domestic terrorists" will continue to cost many more lives as they relate to foreign wars, in addition to the divorces, murders, and suicides that are caused by artificially prolonged boom/bust cycles that these career politicians and private bankers propagate with their elitist agendas.
One day I look forward to us all defeating them through a velvet revolution OR OTHERWISE.
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.
--George Orwell--
+1776
Funny, I guess no-one ever slept for the 100+ years when we didn't have a standing army.
"Rough men" aren't much use defending anyone when they are 3000+ miles away.
+1776.
So they were not much use defeating Nazism a whole ocean away? Or imperialist Japan on the other side of another ocean?
If you are gonna have a war, it is best not to have it on your own soil. It tends to destroy your industry and impoverish your people.
But you are an idiot, so I doubt you thought of that. You are certainly a shining example of long term mental programmming. Unless you are simply a traitor.
Like it or deny the existence
The Grand Design - World Government 1968 PT-1 of 8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_JGwtBpMHM&feature=related
Watching the inevitable unfold. NWO aka the 'New Normal' Think Tank groups will be fleeing for their life's.
BTW Julian, would you release the documents pertaining to the Sumerian and Roman wars? Perhaps we can categorize the level of inhumanities conducted during the inception of civilization. Maybe we can characterize a 3,000 year old banking system to the current noise of new banking reform policies.
Somehow, everything comes full circle.
Wow ... great link! Thanks for posting.
Sheeple,
What kind of world do you think you'd live in if Radical Islam was left to flourish where ever it wanted?
---No Wikileaks for one, that's for sure.
Grow up, face reality and shake off the comfortable ignorance you've wrapped yourselves into. You actually think the radicals will leave us alone if we leave them alone? No, those assholes will find a reason to attack the west no matter how far back in time they need to go.
They're in a war against you and they will not stop until you're dead or converted. That's how they think.
I believe the war is 1500 years old. Only cease fires to this point.
It will end when Islam ends...or the west surrenders.
I don't feel like surrendering, and God help you if you want to surrender in my name.
Rodent,
Far older than that, Ismael and issac.
That was the start.
Crazy the world will end because some old guy wanted a young piece of tail, huh?
I really can't blame him, but, geez, God has a weird sense of humor.
Secunda, your points are spot on. However, do we really need to treat Israel as the 51st State? I've got major problems with folks who claim that land is theirs because 3,000 years prior their ancestors may have lived nearby and their imaginary friend has promised it to them. Is this the stuff for which we should spill our blood?
I'm all for targeted strikes outward and ample self-defense against invaders, but killing vast amounts of self-labelled Muslims on their own soil is not sustainable. Further, Muslims can and do integrate in Western society much like Christians who have been forced to evolve since the days of Inquisitions, Crusades, and witch hunts. In other words, outside of the lucky folks who were born atop oil fields, every religious fanatic will eventually learn to temper the mood in order to get along with trading partners.
Policies that create free trade amongst common people are the only way to peace. Genocide is not an option, nor is it necessary.
of course, when our Muslim and Christian sons and daughters finally do begin to marry, then folks will find something else over which to kill each other.
It would rapidly fade into obscurity, as it did in the thousand years before the US was founded when no-one was invading their lands.
"Radical Islam" only came into being when the US and other Western powers started meddling. Think about it. You ever hear of a suicide bomber before Israel was founded?
They aren't going to take over the world any more than the Chinese, Russians, the Huns, the Romans, or the Mongolians are. Leave them alone, and they will fight each other as they always have. Present them a common enemy, and you might have a problem.
But seriously, when was the last time an Islamic country invaded a non-Islamic country? 1918? And who did that, our allies, the Turks? Yeah...
you know your history way to well for this mindless discussion, tmosley.
Islam was spread by conquest all the way to Spain, you fucking moron.
Read up on Charles "the hammer" Martel, you clueless fuck.
And the fucking invasion is going on now by different means. France is gonna be majority muslim by 2050. End of story.
660 comments. that's one comment for every 100 dead iraqi civilians...
Civilians?
Could you post a link to the Islamic Fascist military uniform?
+1
By that logic, all Americans should die for the crimes of our military as well.
How dare they try to live life in their own country! Don't they know they are on top of our oil? All those Islamofascists should just kill themselves. Well, they should kill their kids first. But then, our boys can take care of that easily enough.
When they are done, they can come home and do the same thing the the Amerofascists here, using the lessons they learned abroad.
+1+1
Dump Israel, and most of the problems for the US are solved.
"good Christian boys" have been spilling blood for Israel for quite some time. The business of America used to be business, not securing some promise of real estate from an imaginary friend.
While I mostly love you, on this you are wrong.
For Christians, Israel is the Holy Land.
Before you respond, say, "Holy Land" with meaning. My God was born a Jew. Consider that.
It is a small piece of ground you could damn near piss across. If Islam wants to end the world over it, I'm good with that. The fact that they have not should be a clue.
What really sticks in Islam's craw is that they exist because the West allows them to exist.
Rodent,
Sorry Bro, gotta correct you.
"What really sticks in Islam's craw is that they exist because the West allows them to exist."
The West has nothing to do with it, GOD has unfinished business with his chosen people thru Covenants...................when HE's ready,and not until will the end come.
We are but tools in HIS hands for now.
I will defer to your understanding of theology.
I'm just a simple man who sees the world within the framework of the physics I understand.
Rodent, i agree with you on most everything. DosZap, i usually agree with you, although i just lit you up on another message board a few minutes ago (don't take it too personal).
fellas, fellas, fellas, where do I start?
having spent time in Muslim countries, and having Muslim friends who both currently practice the traditions or who have completely rejected Islam, I find religious conflict so desperately unnecessary.
Muslim folks have lived with the same 'god' for thousands of years. this god has been fantastic to them and their ancestors. this god was one of the first to mandate hygiene, for example, which saved lives. importantly, this god instilled disciplined behavior in order to empower cooperation among tribe members. In some cases, this god has been so powerful that some Muslims were born upon billions of dollars of oil. this god is very, very good. further, to turn one's back on this god takes a special amount of courage and is borderline a betrayal of one's ancestors.
Most muslim folks are simply scared to death and wish the best for their children. They see their land confiscated in palestine by other folks who believe that this land was promised to them by a different god.
my point is that, if everyone believes in the same imaginary friend then there is no problem, but because we have been separated for thousands of years in different corners of the world, it is rather difficult to turn our backs on the god of our ancestors which we have been taught is the very reason we are here.
as a young man, i walked down the aisle and "gave my life to jesus". i now realize this was a trick of the mind. one of the many instances that made me realize this was traveling to muslim countries and walking into mosques. the feeling of beauty, wonder and awe within a large and architecturally amazing mosque, especially when common people are having quiet moments of humility whilst on their knees, is will be quite familiar to Westerners. This is the exact feeling that i've experienced in christian churches and other "holy" places.
my epiphany came when i realized that all of these folks are exactly the same in their desire for a better life and they, like followers of any other monotheistic abrahamic religion, "pray" to their version of the same psychological phenomena.
Palestinians have a homeland.
Its name is Jordan.
Sell that shit to the Europeans and other idiots.
man, you've dehumanized an entire group of people because jesus was a jew. that is the only reason. otherwise, you would never stand for this shit. i know you, rodent. you are blinded by your label.
I haven't dehumanized palestinians. I feel bad that the entire rest of Islam is willing to use them as the club to beat on Israel.
Life is hard on clubs. So be it.
I am what I am. I am not open to negotiation on this thing. Declare war on me, or move on. I will not change.
you are what you label yourself. however, labels make it much more difficult to be an individual and think clearly.
Life means NOTHING if it is not lived in service to something larger than one's self.
how about in service of liberty for all? is that large enough for you?
Sure, but it is my certain knowlege Islam will does not equal liberty.
A woman's testimony is half of a man's. Dhimmi taxes. Taqiyya. Abrogation.
And to top it all off, the prophet dissed dogs. What kind of douchebag prophet would hate dogs? That is proof he was a nutbag. I mean forget for a moment he was a pedophile.
Islam is not a religion. It is a political movement wearing religious clothes. It is slavery.
it has also transformed lives, or folks would not choose it so often. in fact, it is the fastest growing religion in the world, and Muslims will soon surpass Christians at the current growth rates.
so Islam is oppressive? How about Crusades, Inquisitions, and witch hunts? We didn't allow women to vote until 1920. Sounds a bit oppressive doesn't it? But Christians seemed to be getting mildly better after a few thousand years. I'm still calling it a major work-in-progress.
So, Muslim women's testimonies count as half that of men's and that gives Jews a right to take their property?
Why would anyone apologize for the Crusades? It was the reclaiming of christian lands from muslim conquest. I only grieve it did not last longer.
As long as the Haggia Sophia is in muslim hands, the war will never end.
I do not follow your logic. We WERE not perfect, so Islam's current shitiness is okay?
Sell that to your daughter. I dare you.
i didn't say it was okay. i am simply saying that it is not worth american lives to interfere half way around the world in order to help jews grab land.
as i have said before. if any muslim extremist comes to my doorstep to convert me by force then he will be met with deadly force. this is not the case today. we are on their doorstep, and Israel is not America, it is an entangling alliance.
hey, Rodent, we can agree to disagree. I do not believe that i can change your mind.
Holy fuck ... you are even more ignorant than I first thought! They were not "christian" lands, they were jewish lands (assuming one even recognises the jews as anything other than a half-Egyptian cult that also plagiarised Mesopotamian legends)! Deal with some facts instead of Twitter slogans for a change.
The current anti-muslim frenzy -- "aaarghh ... muslims are going to rule the world unless we defeat them!" -- being whipped up by the oligarchs is just the latest in their divide-and-conquer tactics against the freedom-loving segments of the west. The previous one was "aaarghh ... communists are going to rule the world unless we defeat them!".
Communism was defeated from within, WITHOUT any help from the west (except for a push from Reagan, 70 years late!) ... indeed, it was despite our very deliberate lack of help for the Hungarians in their uprising of 1956 and the Czechs in their uprising of 1968. Islam will also eventually be defeated from within, not by any military effort from the west.
The topics discussed on this blog are obviously way over your head, so you really should go back to Twitter with your daily nonsense. Come back when you've actually studied the topics you comment on.
Wishful thinking is not strategy.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good slogan!
If you had ever read history, or read anything other than twitter, you would know that the Palestinians come from Palestine ... which was previously known as Philistia (hence, the Philistines) ... which is currently known as "the Gaza Strip" ... which was originally invaded by "the sea peoples" from Crete around 1200BC (ie. about 700 years before the Jews wrote the Old Testament)!
They are Greeks and their homeland is therefore in Greece! Let them know!
You, sir, are an ignorant fucking brainwashed moron!
Olbermann, is that you?
In case it is, bite me.
calling someone Olbermann? Thems fighting words. He's such a hypocrite, I would not cross the street to piss on his burning corpse. still, next to Chris Matthews, Olbermann is a pretty great guy. ha, ha.
Muslim folks have lived with the same 'god' for thousands of years.
Ummm.......NO!
Muhammad ibn ‘Abdull?h (Arabic: ?; Transliteration: Mu?ammad;[n 1] pronounced [m???æmmæd] ( listen); also spelled Muhammed or Mohammed)[n 2][n 3][n 4] (ca. 570/571 Mecca[?????? ]/[ ?????? ] – June 8, 632),
Islam is still a young religion. Maybe it will stop sucking in another 500 years. Maybe not.
And then Jesus said unto the world, "You shall go forth and murder your brothers who still live in the land of your origin, who have changed their religion (but not the Christians, plz), for they are an abomination unto the LORD." "Ye shall take thine metal blades and destroy thine homes, and wall them up, as ye were walled up in the Ghettos, ye shall then deny them food, and water, and electricity for a period of a year. Ye shall allow them rockets, lest they not attack, allowing you to continue their oppression. Ye shall grind them facefirst into the dirt for they have brown skin, a sign of the DEVIL". Then the LORD Jesus Christ rose into the sky, and from his anus issued an unending stream of Skittles, from whence we, his soldiers ate. And then the LORD Jesus Christ commanded that an Arab baby be brought before him, and before each of his soldiers. He then dashed the baby upon the hard ground, commanding "Ye who are of the faith shall murder the children of the Israelites, who have converted their religion, and ye shall dash their children upon the hard stone, for the earth turns with their blood."
-Excerpt from Rodent's New Bible of the Church of Muslim Hateology
But seriously, thank you so much for ALLOWING some people to exist in their own land. Thank you so much for not committing the worst genocide of all time in the extermination of the Arab peoples. Fucking jackass.
Did you ever wonder why the entire rest of the arabic world refuses entry to palestinians?
did you ever use riddles to justify an indefensible position?
Maybe.
But why are Palestinians persona non grata in most every Islamic state, including Lebanon?
because they are viewed as gypsies in the caste system of the muslim world.
this does seem a bit off point. all Palestinians are born as lesser people?
From my experience, the people who know them consider them the most worthless collection of dna on the entire planet.
Dunno myself. What is your experience with them?
well, I know a wrestler who competed for the Palestinian national team and he is a damned good guy. I have also had multiple Iranian wrestling partners in London who are the salt of the earth, and damned good people. I've got a buddy in London who is the son of Pakistani immigrants and has chosen to fully reject Islam: he is a fantastic person. I also have a friend in Morrocco who is a devout Muslim (I've personally watched him pray towards Mecca when we were in the Atlas Mountains) and he is steadfast as it relates to the peaceful and saving message of Allah. Of course, I believe Allah is an imaginary friend, which he does not appreciate, but he is a damn good guy and a self-made millionaire. in fact, he grew up in the streets begging for change as a child. These are to name a few Muslims that I know very well and who are personal friends.
Bitchin. No palestinians?
Maybe you could get them to publically denounce terrorism. That would be a good start.
um, he is a palestinian. sorry i was not more clear for you about this fact. i'll try and keep statements very concrete from here on out.
anyway, they have denounced terrorism publicly. typically, though, media microphones are not being shoved in the faces of amateur wrestlers. ???
look, man, i know EXACTLY where you are coming from, because I used to say the EXACT same things. Frankly, I voted for George H.W. Bush TWICE because I cannot stand socialists, only to find out that he was one of the worst socialist we've ever had. I was equally infuriated after the attacks of September 11th. In fact, i was meant to be in Building number 7 six days later for a job interview. I felt certain that Saddam Hussein's posturing was a sure sign of guilt. I understand that nuclear weapons in the hands of dictators is a very dangerous thing. That said, I also understand that i severely overlooked the powerful forces of the Military Industrial complex and its role in all of our foreign wars since our standing army has been Unconstitutionally maintained. In essence, i am far less naive these days given new evidence. So, I have adjusted my views immensely. I feel certain that someday you will do the same when you look at the facts objectively rather than through the prism of a "christian republican", which is clearly how you label yourself to your detriment.
Dude. There are enemies of the right. Socialism and islam are two for sure.
Yeah, I hate that we are headed full tilt boogie toward fascism in the US, but, at the borders, I will defend the homeland even if it is currently a crony capitalist crapfest.
Just a question: If the US had a coup and became a dictatorship tommorrow, would you really notice?
no, i do not think i would. we're nearly there with the CIA and corporate forces colluding with career politicians and the international banking cartel. i started thinking about all the smarmy ivy league twats running our country, and all the christian good 'ol boys with whom i grew up marching off to die because most have more class and integrity in their pinky toe than any of their commanders, and i really started to wonder why.
Somehow I think that after the revolution -- or coup -- being an Ivy League grad will get one an immediate trip against the wall.
No.
Got any other suggestions?
Dump Israel, and our REAL problems begin.
Any idea why we have been so blessed and protected since we became a nation?.
Signs,signs, everywhere signs........................
we were a nation long before the state of israel. our foreign policy favors israel at the expense of liberty.
How so?
Israel is a western style democracy in a land of despots. They are our ally.
Betray them and you prove all America was supposed to stand for is bullshit.
wrong, my brother. defend our shores. that is all.
Defend the right, wherever it exists.
right to take land because it was promised by an imaginary friend on 3,000 year old scrolls?
The Arabic word for Palestine is Philistine
what is your point?
what gives Jews a right to continuously settle on land that is not theirs, build walls around this land, and violently oppose anyone who attempts to stop the confiscation?
Why isn't it theirs?
it is downright agreed that folks have lived there for 3,000 years before Jews even suggest an ancient claim. are you telling me that if someone showed up on your doorstep with a 3,000 year old scroll that vaguely claimed your backyard was theirs that you would just hand it over?
That land has been traded by empires for a long time.
But if you are claiming a specific piece of property, show the title. Claiming a vague right to a bunch of land you just happen to point a finger at, wouldn't happen in any country on Earth.
there is nothing vague about it. if you toil the same land for thousands of years and that land is passed down through your family, then the imaginary borders around this land traded between outsiders is irrelevant as to whether the land belongs to you.
This is like saying that North America did not have territories for various tribes, so it was free for the taking. it wasn't. North America was taken from natives by force. they had every right to defend themselves. Do you believe Native Americans had no right to fight European settlers?
You only own what you can defend.
The native americans would have won if they were not so eager to kill each other for british and french gold.
You apply too much poetry to a barbarian people.
make no mistake. we are all barbarians. you need not explain to me, i have a distant grandfather who was viciously murdered, along with aunties and uncles, including an infant that was slammed against a tree, by native americans. my distant grandmother was scalped and left for dead. luckily, she was pregnant and crawled through the night back to the safety of a fort or i would not be talking to you right now. i also understand that native americans killed each other for territory long before europeans came with bigger guns. that said, it does not mean that i have to state sanction the wholesale land grab of israel with my tax dollars. sorry, i ain't jewish, and i don't agree with the land grab.
Bummer. Sometimes you just have to live with being disappointed.
I will personally go to Israel and defend it. I will even take what little wealth I have. If this is the hill I die on, so be it.
well, while it is respectful that you are at least willing to do your own dirty work, you are no different than a suicide bomber. Your cause is unjust, and i will be sorry to see you die in vain.
I find that dying in bed has lost its appeal.
IDf is purported to have between 125/150,000 troops of which 35/50,000 are professional and anything from 400,00/800,000 in reserves depending where you get your info.
Yet I don't see Israel or the IDF in the list of allies here:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/iraq_orbat_coalition.htm
or here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multinational_Force_-_Iraq
or anywhere else I can see a list of coalition forces in Iraq.
I mean if they're your ally, shouldn't they be there as part of an allied force? Fucking Iceland wich has a population of roughly 300,000 (that's a population, not troops) managed to send troops as a show of solidarity.
Arabs said they'd take their ball and go home if we allowed Israel to play. Dickheads.
Israel also defered to us when we asked them not to respond to Hussein's lobbing Scuds at them.
Seems like a damn fine ally to me. They are willing to stand down so the arabs won't throw a fit and go home mad.
Right, right. Ok
Hate to be anywhere in the chain of this info outing, real, or propoganda, disinformation, truth or otherwise.
People are going to die for a LONG time over this.A LONG time.
One day, when she was a very young child, I watched my daughter playing in the garden. A smile came to my face as I reflected on how sweet and pure my little girl was. Tears formed in my eyes as I thought about her seeing the wonders of nature through such innocent eyes.
Suddenly she just stopped and stared at the ground. I went over to her to see what work of God had captured her attention. I noticed she was looking at two spiders mating.
“Daddy, what are those two spiders doing?'“ she asked.
“They're mating,” I replied.
“What do you call the spider on top?” she asked.
“That's a Daddy Longlegs,” I answered.
“So, the other one is a Mommy Longlegs?” she asked.
As my heart soared with the joy of such a cute and innocent question, I replied, “No dear. Both of them are Daddy Longlegs.”
Looking a little puzzled, she thought for a moment, then lifted her foot and stomped them into mush. “Well, I’m not gonna have any of that shit in my garden!” she said.
At that moment my heart soared with pride, and my daughter has only made me even prouder ever since, as she has blossomed into full adulthood. Although she will always be my “little girl”, to most of you she would better known as Liz Cheney…
+1 - too funny.
The timing is one week before an election, where the democrats are about to get pasted. Obama has been blaming Bush for passing on this legacy. But after 2 years Obama owns it.
After 9/11, the world was behind us. Now we don't have a friend left. Our civilian and military leaders have dishonored us in every way imaginable. If there is a world war 3, we better clean up our act before the world decides to PUT A STOP TO US!