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Game of Thrones: The Debate of Liars
It was fairly unanimous in the MSM that Romney won the debate. Comments were that he was forceful, engaged, animated, presidential, challenging, and on the offensive. The president seemed lackluster, dull, unresponsive, and tired. All this is true.
Unfortunately they both lied.
I wish to point out that I will vote for Romney and I was pleased that he is perceived to have won the debate. But I thought he won based on theatrical performance rather than content, which, to be honest, is how most of the great unwashed judge candidates.
Neither candidate made much sense. Saying words people want to hear won't make it so.
Look, President Obama is a left-wing liberal (Progressive, socialist, whatever). He is an ideologue and I respect him for at least letting us know what he stands for. I know exactly what to expect from him and I strongly disagree with most of his policies. There are two really good reasons to vote him out, beside the fact that his policies have failed.
I've written many times about the danger of Obamacare to the overall economy and the social fabric of America. It is not just another government program. It is a major entitlement that will end up like every form of regulated or nationalized health care system around the world—broke. Costs will skyrocket, more regulations will be imposed, people (you 47 percenters) will demand more services, taxes will go up to pay for it, health care prices and wages will be controlled in some form or another, the quality of health care will go down, the economy will remain moribund with the high cost burden to producers, and unemployment will remain high (see, Europe).
The other major issue is that Obama will appoint Progressive "living Constitution" Supreme Court justices who will turn the country seriously to the left similar to what FDR did back in the Thirties when he tried to nationalize the economy.
What is there to say about Romney? Those who claim he is an advocate of liberty and free markets are blind to the meaning of those words because his history as a governor and presidential aspirant belie those ideals. Here is the thing about Romney: he will say and do anything to get elected. He is not an ideologue. An ideologue is "A person who zealously advocates a particular idea, concept, theory or ideology." The words he uses, like "free markets", have no more meaning to him than "I love you, man." ("No, Mitt, you can't have my Bud Lite.") He also believes in “... an America where millions of Americans believe in an America that’s the America millions of Americans believe in. That’s the America I love.” (Thanks, Tim Price for that wonderful quote.)
He derides Obamacare but supported Romneycare. He didn't want to tax the rich, but now he does, at least as of last night's debate. He scapegoats China for our government's reckless spending yet professes he's for free trade. He may favor abortion or the right to life. He thinks he can balance the budget by creating a growing economy, which is true but not very feasible based on his Laffer Curve idea that tax cuts alone will grow the economy. Tax cuts can help, but it's the Fed that's driving this train. As the Fed continues to destroy capital with QE?, more private spending as a result of tax cuts will just destroy more capital (we need to save, not spend, to revive the economy). He supports a "strong military" which I assume means more U.S. intervention and new wars since we already have the most powerful military on the planet.
Romney has some good points if we can believe him. He will do his best to repeal Obamacare and, hopefully,not replace it with some similar, junior entitlement version. Yes, he does believe that "excessive" government regulation is harmful to business. I'm hopeful that he actually believes that (they all say this) but my guess is that he will take a "balanced" (i.e., weak-kneed) approach on this (he'll deal away regulatory cutbacks to get something else). He says he will try to semi-privatize Medicare for pre-retirees (Good luck! Ask W about that one). He says he will appoint "conservative" justices to the Supreme Court, which I applaud.
During the debate Romney lied about deficits, entitlements, and economic growth, but so did Obama. They are pandering to us dimwits, throwing out buzz words to gloss over the fact that their "reforms" have failed or can't work.
I do think however there is one major difference between the candidates. It is obvious that Obama has no faith in the private economy to pull us out of our continuing recession. I actually don't think he believes the economy will recover, based on his many policy failures. His entire campaign theme is for government programs, funded by higher taxes, to alleviate the continuing misery caused by the Obama recession. Romney does believe the private sector can lead us to recovery, but that will work only if he (a) leaves us alone and (b) replaces Ben Bernanke with a Paul Volcker. Those, my fellow citizens, are big ifs. But it will be better than another four years of Obama.
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Edited to place correctly in thread.
why in the name of god would anyone down vote that post?!
I'm a tad disappointed in the Econophile. Perhaps my hopes for a piece above the political fray was asking too much. This from the article: " They are pandering to us dimwits...". Now that you have included yourself in the dimwit group I suppose you are being honest about it after all. I dunno. My skin gets thicker and thicker as the years wear on. The usual bending of the will by politicians, religious folk, advertisers, and car mechanics has less and less effect. I'll vote... for any name on the ballot that I don't recognize.
The vast majority of people -- including the lamer, weak-minded posters here -- much prefer the "warm, reassuring smell of the herd."
That smell is coming from the one in front. You know what they say about not being the lead dog.
The view never changes.
But I have to agree with Jeff's larger thesis here...IF Romney can be trusted is the real question.
And I'm still up for promoting the Libertarian Party as a viable option thereby weakening both established parties...but only after this narcissistic line reader is removed from power and sent back to the bath house showers of Chicago.
Romney should have continued when talking about the constitution and declaration and said " when the gov becomes oppressive, it's your duty to overthrow it, or something to that effect.
Yeah voting for the lesser of two evils isn't worth your time. Send a message to the GOP. We don't want his crap.
The message to send is Dr. Ron Paul. And if anyone wants to bring down the cost of health care let them make a suggestion on how to do it. How about a $10 co-pay for every visit no matter what your plan is. That will cut out a lot of trivial trips to the ER and to the Dr., especially those Saturday night ER visits.
Ron Paul is busy collecting Social Security and all the more power to him he paid in he should get as much of it back as he can. I am with the Author I will be voting for Romney to help stop the slide into Totalitarian Oblivion. Those of you who don't vote either way then don't bitch later because you have no right to do so.
Ron Paul, Social Security opponent, acknowledges he receives benefits
Ron Paul Admits He's On Social Security, Even Though He Believes It's Unconstitutional
Never voted to spend one penny of Social Security money
You Are Not Paranoid: Governments Really Are Tracking Your Every Movement
If we are going to be serious about this, then the co-pay should be at least the cost of a person's monthly iToy data plan.
Obama will probably secretly be hoping he DOESN'T win the election, that way he can say that he was at the helm for the 4 years of (stock market) 'recovery'.
Much in the same way that Tony B. Liar handed the reins of power in the UK to Gordon Brown just before the crisis hit - except his scruples were/are such that he fucked a member of his own party.
DavidC
I remember Phoney Tony - came to power on the "Vote Labour for Change" agenda, and who was the FIRST person he had a chat with once elected?? None other than Margaret Thatcher.
"New Labour" was simple another name for "Old Tory" failed policies, but plenty of support for th FIRE economy (after all why make things when it's cheaper in the short term to buy them in from the Far East??)
Only problem there is / was that once the Far East have your manufacturing capability sown up (and in many cases bought out!), it is they who call the shots . . .
Now look at the consequences - including the highest (financial) debt to GDP level of any European economy. As an ex NHS employee I should be looking forward to some pension on retirement, but being realistic, I'll be in the same boat as all the other "unconnected" Brits - no pension for me (paid for or "State" (also paid for at the highest National Insurance rate too!), so in reality "National Insurance" is now clearly just another tax - and added to all the other National and "EU inspired" taxes, Britain becomes quite a high tax economy for those who actually work . . . . .
That's why I left. And I note MANY others have made the same choice too. Wonder why????
The people of the UK are slaves to the banking cartel where QE is barely questioned.
The situation in the USA sounds similar but i am not qualified to comment as i have never lived there
It is economic (and, therefore, by extension political and social) warfare between the bankster owned - Political Class
(that is, the UK's homogenous (eton , harvard) political elite and everyone and everything that hangs off that elite: economists, bureaucrats, lobbyists, the BBC, corporate executives)
and the British people.
The British people are now being shafted, or at least being lined up to be shafted by their "rulers" (Political Class) on a scale without precedent in modern history.
The Political Class is panicing; it's running amok, unchecked and unbalanced by normal democratic means. The Political Class knows full-well what's going on, how bad this is, where it's all heading and the threat to its powers and privileges that lies within the Developed World's debt crisis.
The tragedy, of course, is that the overwhelming majority of citizens in the UK and in Europe remain, by and large, ignorant of the socio-economic catastrophe that is now being systematically engineered by that contemptible Political Class.
I cant make up my mind whether it will be a long slow grind downward or bloody civil war.
My money (or rather what's left of it) is on a Civil War - quite probably Europe-wide.
I still correspond with former colleagues in the UK, and believe me there 's a LOT of REAL HATRED for the "Well Connected" even in ostensibly well off areas. British history clearly shows that the population can only be pushed so far, and I suspect the limits are being reached. What about the rest of the EU? LOTS of history of Civil Uprisings, and it'll ony take one, quite possibly minor, event to start the ball rolling.
VERY happy not to be anywhere nere there these days - maybe a place to visit one=ce the dust has settled??
I agree, it's going to be nasty.
And it will have to be or nothing will change.
Are u as amazed as I am at how the uk became a basket case in 20 years?
Or is it now only clear as an outsider looking in.
And I do think wistfully of a little flat in one of the seaside golf towns when I retire for escaping the 'winter' down under.
It gets 5% cheaper every year as the country slides not just for us but the oligarchs and Arabs that stash their criminal wealth.
I can't think of a rosy outcome...
Famous true words on elections:
"If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal."
- Emma Goldman (1889-1940)
Voting got us Obama. Don't tell me voting doesn't change anything. Since taking office Obama has failed to uphold the constitution. Obama brought us the Muslim Brotherhood to the White House. Obama supported the spring uprisings which were a front to allow the Muslim Brotherhood to take power in Egypt and much of the Middle East. Yes Elections do matter. See what happens if you allow Obama four more years. You might not be able to post on this site anymore if he decides to bypass the constitution and our First Amendment. Its coming if you give him four more years. Sharia law is working its way into our courts. Obama gave us Eric Holder and Fast and Furious and with it hundreds of dead Mexicans and a dead border guard. 47 Million on foodstamps and the Obama regime is working with Mexico to give food stamps to Illegals that make it across our border. When Ahmendinejad and Chavez endorse Obama, doesn't that say something?
Sharia prohibits the fixed or floating payment or acceptance of specific interest or fees (known as riba, or usury) for loans of money. Not seeing THAT happing anytime soon.
Sharia "no interest" is a ruse. There is always a quid pro quo.
Forbids it, but it still seems to be happening in a number of wrappers that suggest it is possible to do it and have it comply ... Bankers, like water, will always find a way.
As an intellectual exercise, I wonder how things would have been with McCain/Palin. I'm not being contrarian, but it would be a wonder to behold if we could just be a fly on the wall of that alternate universe. The mind reels at the possibilities. Ole Rush would certainly have had his hands full defending some of the stuff that would have evolved since much of the economic malaise would be about the same. I can just envision Fox News updates on the evil doings of the few Democrats left alive in Washington. Demons would be harder and harder to find, except for the folks at MSNBC.
Bullshit.
The following list is from http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/40-points-that-prove-that-bara...
1. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both supported TARP.
2. Mitt Romney supported Barack Obama's "economic stimulus" packages.
3. Mitt Romney says that Barack Obama's bailout of the auto industry was actually his idea.
4. Neither candidate supports immediately balancing the federal budget.
5. They both believe in big government and they both have a track record of being big spenders while in office.
6. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both fully support the Federal Reserve.
7. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney are both on record as saying that the president should not question the "independence" of the Federal Reserve.
8. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney have both said that Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke did a good job during the last financial crisis.
9. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both felt that Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke deserved to be renominated to a second term.
10. Both candidates oppose a full audit of the Federal Reserve.
11. Both candidates are on record as saying that U.S. Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner has done a good job.
12. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney have both been big promoters of universal health care.
13. Mitt Romney was the one who developed the plan that Obamacare was later based upon.
14. Wall Street absolutely showers both candidates with campaign contributions.
15. Neither candidate wants to eliminate the income tax or the IRS.
16. Both candidates want to keep personal income tax rates at the exact same levels for the vast majority of Americans.
17. Both candidates are "open" to the idea of imposing a Value Added Tax on the American people.
18. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both believe that the TSA is doing a great job.
19. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both supported the NDAA.
20. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both supported the renewal of the Patriot Act.
21. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both believe that the federal government should be able to indefinitely detain American citizens that are considered to be terrorists.
22. Both candidates believe that American citizens suspected of being terrorists can be killed by the president without a trial.
23. Barack Obama has not closed Guantanamo Bay like he promised to do, and Mitt Romney actually wants to double the number of prisoners held there.
24. Both candidates support the practice of "extraordinary rendition".
25. They both support the job-killing "free trade" agenda of the global elite.
26. They both accuse each other of shipping jobs out of the country and both of them are right.
27. Both candidates are extremely soft on illegal immigration.
28. Neither candidate has any military experience. This is the first time that this has happened in a U.S. election since 1944.
29. Both candidates earned a degree from Harvard University.
30. They both believe in the theory of man-made global warming.
31. Mitt Romney has said that he will support a "cap and trade" carbon tax scheme (like the one Barack Obama wants) as long as the entire globe goes along with it.
32. Both candidates have a very long record of supporting strict gun control measures.
33. Both candidates have been pro-abortion most of their careers. Mitt Romney's "conversion" to the pro-life cause has been questioned by many. In fact, Mitt Romney has made millions on Bain Capital's investment in a company called "Stericycle" that incinerates aborted babies collected from family planning clinics.
34. Barack Obama and Mitt Romney both believe that the Boy Scout ban on openly gay troop leaders is wrong.
35. They both believe that a "two state solution" will bring lasting peace between the Palestinians and Israel.
36. Both candidates have a history of nominating extremely liberal judges.
37. Like Barack Obama, Mitt Romney also plans to add "signing statements" to bills when he signs them into law.
38. They both have a horrible record when it comes to job creation.
39. Both candidates believe that the president has the power to take the country to war without getting the approval of the U.S. Congress.
40. Both candidates plan to continue running up more government debt even though the U.S. government is already 16 trillion dollars in debt.
The only difference you get in voting for Romney is you'll get to watch footage from riots on the evening news.
That's why I'll proudly vote for neither.
Exactly, why waste your time to vote a piece of shit out, by voting another in. Give me Dr. Ron Paul on the ballot or I'm a non voter.
FUCK IT! Who cares, we are going to war with Iran, we are going to debase the $ to ZERO, we are going to inflate commodities to hell, we are going to cull the population in the mean time using social disorder as a scape goat, we are then going to have greater control over the uneducated population. You are right: black, white, rebuplican, democrat...it doesnt matter US politics is in bed with the same whore. The same whore that wants the population of America's liberties dead and under control for the greater good of self destruction. Ciao.
If McCain had won we wouldn't have heard the nuanced pro-war defense of Obama's foray into Libya. Listening to the so-called anti-war Democrats tie themselves into knots justifying what he did has provided me wonderful fodder with which to hammer them with.
No, the candidates aren't that different. Only their advocates.
"No, the candidates aren't that different. Only their advocates."
Let's face it, what counts at the end of day is the Mother of Dragons was looking at an empty vault. --- Game of Thrones.
Dragons will have to rise from the ashes.
here here
What was more disturbing than the lies was the breadth of serious issues that were never even hinted at, much less discussed.
Guess we had to destroy the American way of life to preserve it.