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All the Facts.....
Okay, still confused about what the cliff deal means? I mean everyone is spinning this one way or the other, so if you just want the facts and the bottom line, who can you trust? .I have a place for you to get the Facts. The source of this information is impeccable, and ALL of the facts are spelled out in just 1,360 words.
Here's the (Link), It will take you to this page at the White House:
The White House presents the "facts" of this matter. But it leaves out a few facts that are, no doubt, inconvenient for the White House to fess up to. If the President's men really wanted to be honest about the facts, they would have added a paragraph:
-A consequence of the tax agreement is to increase payroll taxes on 155m American workers by $125B. We know this hurts middle and low income workers and their families. We understand that this is a very big tax increase, and that it will knock at least 1% of 2013 GDP (and beyond). We're sorry about this, it couldn't be helped. Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid insisted it be this way.
Now about this fact sheet. Just a few items on the list of "Achievements" that stand out to me:
Strengthens our recovery next year by cutting taxes for the middle-class
This is twice wrong. Middle class taxes are going up $125b in 2013. And the consensus opinion is that the net effect of the tax deal is a drag on GDP of 1%.
Provides greater economic certainty for families and businesses
They gotta be kidding with this line. The tax deal leaves open the pesky questions of A) the debt limit, B) the sequestered amounts, C) cuts in entitlement spending, D) additional taxes and don't forget E) the President needs another Continuing Resolution (CR) to keep the lights on. (No budget from the Prez means another CR is required)
Me? I'm crapping in my pants over that list. The market may be happy today, but what is in front of is much more troubling than what is behind us.
Cuts the deficit and reduces the debt as a share of the economy over the next five years
Compared to what? The fact is the country just agreed to an additional $4t in debt. Here's the picture of the debt profile that is the result of this deal. That ugly orange stuff is the additional debt the country signed up for with the tax deal. How do you call this progress?
I guess if you really want the facts on this deal, you better look elsewhere.
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I was thinking along the lines of a 20 years-on meth addict
moron or liar
I'll take "Both" Alex, for $400 trillion.
"Can we shoot them?"
Phi in 'Burn Notice'
I doubt Maxine can tell you how many sides a triangle has.
Seriously.
We seriously over-estimate the intellectual capacity of today's liberals. The average IQ of today's liberals probably runs about 75.
D'ya hear about Louie Gohmert locking his keys in his car?
Took the other TP caucus members half an hour to get him out.
You do have a thing about "them liberals", eh?
Who is your benchmark, Bush II ? Or his "deficits don't matter" buddy?
@Ghordius, Bush was a republican? With all of those cheep cheep cheep public loans from China? Yup, he sure was! I'm looking for the flying pink llama, sparkly unicorn meat and fairy dust.
"The average IQ of today's liberals probably runs about 75."
Let me bring up a third group of liberals: 1970s liberals. They were and are as dense as a brick. When they finally move on the world will be improved.
Methinks they're a subset of "today's liberals".
With the term "today's liberals", I'm simply attempting to make the distinction between the likes of Hank "Guam" Johnson and "classical liberals" like Hayek and Bastiat.
"Methinks they're a subset of "today's liberals"."
Yes, they are. A particularly stupid and militant subset. Unfortunately TPTB catered to them instead of crushing them after the Viet Nam war.
It's rather important to differentiate "today's liberals" from "classical liberals".
Classical liberals draw their philosophy from Bastiat, Hayek, A. Smith, Kant, etc.
Today's liberals draw their ideology almost exclusively from Karl Marx.
Wot, they can read Marx? I thought you said they didn't/couldn't exercise intellect?
You might want to read a bit of Steve Keen, he says a few things about it. ;)
Well, certainly there are academics and pseudo-intellectuals who have read Marx and have preached that collectivist dogma to their worshipers and followers. Folks like Bill Ayers, Cass Sunstein, Andrew Stern, Gyorgy Schwartz, and Peter Orszag come to mind.
I actually agree with where you're going with that. ;)
How is the Dear Leader going to explain to the sheeple when
the sticker shock hits in that first paycheck ?
They be very dumb,but not that dumb.
thank god it's only fiat huh? ... just like 'creating' it out of thin air, you can writedown the fiat again, and nothing real even happens ... magik stuff! ...
flawlessly follows the 'Conservation of Nothing' law ;-)
He will state, due to Republican feet dragging, the first couple of paychecks may have "not gotten the news". In mid February, when the checks are still depressed, he will state how outraged he is on how Congress doesnt read the bills before they are passed. He will then make it a high priority to "change" it back, and hence, the "Obama tax cuts" will be born.
First thing I did this morning was decrease my withholding by 1 dependant. Phew!!! Crises averted!!
Well all have to pull together my fellow americans; we all have to eat our peas. etc. How much coverage did the raise in government workers salaries, and benefits, get on your mainstreat TV news? hmm? how much? My friend who actually has a TV, says it wasn't even mentioned. The people should be rioting the streets right now. Talk about nerve. It's easy to smooth over a small bite in your paycheck; but suppose we had a real world of journalism; how easy is it to explain why you have to increase salaries and benes. for Govt. "workers", (snort, LOL); while you chop down on Mr. and Mrs. paycheck? With the propaganda machine owned by the ruling class everything comes out like looking through a fun house mirror.
These are the sheeple we're talking about.
They believe anything from Bronco's mouth:
"... (it's the Republican's fault, they made us do it)"
Yes they are. They signed up for another four years.
My wife flipped her lid when she just saw her net pay today
The next couple fridays will bring slaps in the face to us all.
You under estimate the stupidity of the average american voter.
Sure, they will see a small decrease in their pay check, but the Government Party will just tell them its the rich people's fault and taxes need to be raised even moar!
And so average stupid person will think: Ok, Ill vote for that guy cuz he will lower my taxes and raise taxes on everyone richer than me!
This is the key, pols don't cater to the avg ZH reader. They know EXACTLY how dumb the avg. voter is.
That's why during the ENTIRE election they never gave specifics, just "Vote for me", I'm better than him.
Thanks public indoctrination (school) system.
Today's liberals are little more than bundles of animal instincts seeking immediate emotional and/or physical gratification. Trust them at your own peril.
F.B. I am so tired of folks coming to ZH and saying "liberal this and conservative that" or "dem this and rep that".
"Political tags - such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth - are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire." Robert A. Heinlein
More Merkins need to learn to read so they can read Robert Heinlein and find out how shit actually works in the real world.
whatsinaname ,
There is an entire world of color, but our only 2 choices are red or blue.
So those are the colors we discuss.
The other colors have NO effect on our lives.
You must have a preference.
Well, don't be of lazy intellect. You can do better.
Do you not understand the differences between those who are bundles of animal instincts and those who are not?
Today's liberals (not classical liberals) are little more than bundles of animal instincts. Sub-human, frankly.
Those distinctions are critically important. Use your mind.
While it may sound harsh - if you are unable to process and ascertain the difference between marxism and liberty, then you may as well submit yourself as a slave.
Because the civil liberties that evaporated during the last 40 years didn't receive any "conservative" votes?
Tell me another bed-time story, Bonzo.
Certainly, there are many who label themselves "conservative" and are nothing of the sort. For sure.
It's real simple and it has not god damn thing to do with race, color, religion, the invented war on women, immigration or any other horseshit subject that politicians use to divide and conquer. It has everything to do with human nature and greed. In the past we have had leaders who appealed to citizens as a group, as Americans, and have built strength with leadership and bipartisanship. At present we have Chicago style corruption running the country with no fucking desire to lead or work in a bipartisan way (look at the election tactics). This country is divided and it is ruled by a President who cannot lead, who does not have the humiity to reach across the aisle and who alienates anyone who does not agree with him. He recently made a statement that he hopes his presidency lasts for the four more years his new term gives him. I cerrtainly would never condone violence but would say if he continues to run this country as a dictator with no thought for the 47% minority he will have serious problems. (Look at a map showing red vs. blue territory by county...it will astound you). I will also say between the scandal over Fast and Furious and Bengahzi that there are lots of secrets that may yet be revealed which would sink this presidency. Imaging if Fast and Furious was concocted to create antipathy towards guns and push gun control. Imagine if we find outwhat happened in the situation room during the 7 hours that have not been revealed that Obama called off support and or sent the injured to Tripoli (knowing it was going to be attacked) instead of Italy or Germany hoping they would be killed so they could not tell the true story (is that why no Bengahzi survivors have been identified by the state department for interviews?). It sounds fucking crazy I know...it sounds like a nut case for conspiricy theories, but then with the Goebels type propaganda this administration has been spinning, how do we know it's not true. Corzine is walking around. Geithener knew about the Libor scam while he was at the NY Fed...uh oh, I better go...the black helicopters are outside my window!
America voted for Chi-town politics, America receives Chi-town politics. In this country, we are long accustomed to just taking it on the chin and waiting for the next thug to get voted in so we can take it on the chin some more. It just seems like we are nothing but a bunch of down-trodden fools who have accepted this type of fourth-rate leadership from our politicians and the entire federal government - yes military is fucking included.
And y'all voted em in repeatedly more than once!
FB,
I agree with you and would like to clarify that congress is about 99% neo liberal at this point regardless of party affiliation or self proclaimation.
There just arent any classical liberals (private property ownership, limited govt, free markets) anymore. They are not allowed to even run for office.
THAT I agree with completely. It seems anyone who tells the truth and wants to have a constitutional type government gets run out of DC on a rail, they would tar and feather them if they could get away with it.
It's interesting - in at least parts of the world, the middle east for example, the word "liberal" still retains its classical meaning.
Which leads to dire confusion when visitors to the states run into today's American liberals and their primitive counter-liberty marxian superstitions.
Correct, we have not had any sort of truely liberal or conserative representation for quite some time now (as in many decades). This is the naked empire of lies, full monty, un-cut. The propaganda spewing MSM going into overdrive.
Nothing will change until the supply lines for essential goods and services are cut. Same as it ever was, hedge accordingly.