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When the Time Comes Will We Be Able to Forgive?
When the Time Comes Will We Be Able to Forgive?
By
Cognitive Dissonance
How do we live with that soul numbing pain we all know so well, but desperately wish to forget? You know what I’m talking about, the kind of inner pain that cuts a wide swath through our soul and then leaves us vacant and drained. It’s so much easier to be the hard ass, first with ourselves and then with all the others. You can’t be hurt by what you don’t let in, so let’s just raise our shields and hate those bastards because…...because they deserve it, that’s why. Of course, there’s always a special place in my personal hell for a few select psychopaths who deserve my best, most exceptional rage.
The thing is, though, when we finally lay splayed upon the floor exhausted from our hating labors, we still remain unsated and thoroughly dissatisfied. It is only then that we comprehend that we are all that we have left to abhor. Trust me on this one; those are the really ugly hate hangovers, the ones that spring from our own self loathing and disgust, along with our unabashed anger at the cruel world and those who we can single out for special hatred. Come on, we can admit it. We are all so very angry, furious even, at what the sociopaths have dealt us this time around. None the less, here we are. Or soon enough will be. So what are we going to do?
I suspect some of us are sitting smug as a bug thinking that we really aren’t all that angry, just plenty pissed off and loaded for bear. And that might well be the case, at least for now anyway. But just wait until the really shocking stuff is exposed, because the ass hat parade hasn’t even begun to march down Main Street. And between you and me, those stupid little clown cars, the irritating enablers and sycophants, are really going to irritate me to no end when they start to whine. Then what will we do?
I’ll tell you what we do; either we forgive them or we will be consumed by them. Either we dismiss them from our mind with an open and honest heart or we will be owned by them lock, stock and barrel. The choice is up to us and no one else, because at this point we are just renting space in our heads to those little bastards and it is slowly eating us alive. Sure, maybe for now the rented space is just closet sized and free of charge. But when the fecal matter hits several hundred million spinning minds there is going to be giant sized outrage and then the rent rapidly rises from free to mental and emotional slavery.
Forgiving someone or something certainly doesn’t mean forgetting what has been done. Nor does forgiving mean we should let ‘them’ off without punishment or sentence. And I definitely didn’t say a thing about turning the cheek. Nope, I said nothing of the sort. Forgiving is all about giving us permission to let go of all the hate, anger and bile that has been building for years, decades even. Forgiving is about evicting the demons that have occupied our mind for so long that we no longer know where we end and they begin. Forgiving them is all about forgiving ourselves.
Speaking from personal experience and only about me, when it came time for me to forgive I no longer knew how. I didn’t have it in me precisely when I most urgently needed to know how to forgive others so that I could forgive myself. I hadn’t realized that hating for as long as I did effectively sterilized from me my naturally occurring compassion and empathy. So when the time came to turn those healing tools upon others I found to my dismay that I could not heal myself.
Now I have come to understand that if I do not use the tools I have available, they become rusted, blunt and stale. Wait even longer and they are completely forgotten, assuring that I will soon become what I hate. So now I work daily to keep my forgiving sharp and at the ready. And the funny thing is that because of my continuous forgiving labors I now see that the time to forgive might never come because it is here already.
09-06-2011
Cognitive Dissonance
Forgiving Blue
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I disagree with this idea because you simply assume all men use anger in the same way.
Controlled personal anger can get many things accomplished in ones life. Especially if you use it to further your personal vision of a sustainable future. If one continues to look outside for answers one will always be disappointed. Anger coupled with a continual disappointment in others is a failing in ones self.
I gave up trying to make others understand the corruption and malfeasance of The Bureaucracy. So I decided personally to use my anger to find a way to be self sustaining even when central planning fails. If it doesn't, I have lost nothing from hating humanity's unnatural state, because I have personally moved my family and myself back towards nature.
I have land to garden and hunt. I make my own hooch. I have solar cookers and water heating. I can smoke and dehydrate food. I can generate enough electricity to keep my freezer running. I have a water source right out my back door and sitting right next to it my own water purification system. I have a circle of friends who have other skills in healing. I have used the best of technology and married it with the natural world. Comfort but not excess. If my technology breaks and I have not the means to fix it, I will just move that much closer to nature.
When The Bureaucracy finds me and tries to destroy what I have built you can believe they will feel the full force of my anger, even if that only amounts to an ant farting in the wind. The machine will run me and my family over as it has done so many in the past. Because the machine can only sustain itself on others, it is a failure.
One only looses if they quit living before they are dead!
Actually I wasn't. I was very specific in discussing anger and hate that is disabling and corrosive. There is no denying that this describes many people regardless of whether they recognize it in themselves or not. If this doesn't apply to you then just walk away. This essay wasn't for you.
BTW controlled personal anger does not mean it isn't corrosive and self destructive.
I was not being critical of your article. It was well though out. I was addressing a generalization in a posted comment. Anger is a tool, emotional balance dictates how that tool is used.
I believe anything which becomes an obsession can be corrosive and self destructive. I believe most people today are obsessed with being right. They pursue it to the extreme, and lash out at those people who present plausible arguments to the contrary.
It seems our only true freedom left is passing judgment towards each other. I miss actually debating points.
None of the above is directed towards you personally BTW.
Maybe the article does represent others, however, I seriously doubt I can escape such criticism. I enjoyed reading it none the less. Thanks for writing it.
"I believe most people today are obsessed with being right. They pursue it to the extreme, and lash out at those people who present plausible arguments to the contrary."
also my recent experience as well, thanks for the fine distillation.
These are just my simple observations.. My fine distillation comes in the form of a homemade rum!! ;) I raise a toast to you in appreciation!
and a toast of a local (not soylent) green fairy to you my friend.
There you go again confusing and equating two different characteristics - anger and hate.
Never.
Man is no better now than he was a thousand years ago or ten thousand years ago. Indeed we are likely worse with the level of cultural contamination and now with genetic contamination in what we eat, drink, and breathe. It's not going to get better, and I'm not happy to say that, but I can look at the trend. It's going to get more and more wild and insane till even the most mad cry out for a reprieve in the constant changes that will beset them. Man is quite malleable, but every man has their limits. Image what your grandfather would have done if his children and wife had to be molested to travel...I daresay he wouldn't have put up with it and would have been quite angry.
Man is being put in a ever smaller cage, and I don't think being calm is going to help extricating ourselves from this prison. It's taken a lot of work and time to get man into this position, so I cannot see how losing one of the primary motivators helps us. Heck look at the PC movement, it tries to push us to not be agree and accept everything. Reason is simple, because angry people get things done. People don't get active unless there is a fire inside, and 99% of the time that fire is anger.
You can't talk from the "bendover" positon. A big buttfucking is going on and alot of good people are getting ramholed good. (of course, many have been really stoopid.)
You can't talk about forgive when your ass is hurting so bad. Apparently, you are unharmed, thusfar.
No justice, no consideration.
"The answer to the Jewish problem is simple," he said.
"Keep them out of banking, out of education, out of government."
and any other seat of power.
Ezra Pound's formula for preventing Jewish conquest ...
Here we go again. Everything wrong today is caused by "the jews". What fucking bullshit. I suspect you're a plant trying to make ZH look like a site for antisemitic nutters.
As for forgiving the financial/political elite... No. Jail them or execute them. Don't forgive them unless they have paid for what they have done/are doing.
It so happens, the truth be told, the corruptness is heavy in the most powerful industry on the planet earth. Geez, it also happens to be the case that alot of joos are involved. Damn mexicans and their coming here and working, causing tons of "no shit jobs left" problems.
ANd those negros, all sellin drugs, and stuff.
Don't forget those irish bastards that settled in new york, being cops and firemen and drinking like sailors. Control fucking freaks.
Oh those italians, with their mob and killing for profit.
Terroist muslims. Planting bombs all over the country and wrapping towels around their heads.
WHere would be the joke without the Pollock. The 20th century would of never survived.
Sorry, if I left you out, but I think the equality of shitbags is constant and increasing.
Indeed. Pointing the finger at a certain "race" to blame for everything is simply bullshit. I can't believe people still fall for it.
The Big Lie is still alive and kicking, it seems.
The mess we are in now is not a racial issue. Banksters, for example - there are jewish banksters and non-jewish banksters. Are we saying that the elite scum are good guys as long as they're not jewish? If so, then that's lame and bullshit. Since the elite financial/corporate/political scum are comprised of people from every race, what's the point in trying to make this a racial issue?
Ah, you guys found another good thread to sully!
You serve your masters well.
Yeah.... No.
Forgiveness is the prerogative of the individual. Societies need justice.
so true
The crimes committed have been against the very intersantum of what we call our hearts and souls. The punishment must match the orverreaching violence and contempt employed. Justice must be handed out. Milestones
I never said justice should not be handed out Milestones. In fact I said it should.
Forgiving has nothing to do with handing out justice and everything to do with self healing.
You are wrong here as you confuse two completely different qualities - forgiveness and self healing. Your hate is killing you and you need to let it go, it should never have been there in the first place - then you will have your self healing. This is a completely different from forgiveness which requires repentence.
Letting go of hate -> self healing
Repentence -> forgiveness
Justice is another matter.
And you are confusing the terms I used, 'forgiving' and 'forgive', with the term you and others are using, 'forgiveness'. Very different terms used by different parties.
I could forgive an enemy who openly comes into my house with a gun and tries to murder me and my family, such action of brutal people I can understand
I could never forgive an enemy who, poisons me and my family with fluoride so that we become stupid and his servants, an enemy who controls all the media/politics and tries to monopolize the language, an enemy who cares little for my physical possessions but wants to control what I can think and what I can say out loud
An enemy that wants to own your soul is what religious people call the devil, the enemy we face is not supernatural but as evil as the darkest spawn of hell
Then I have to disagree. We can't get to foregiveness until justice has been served. If there is no justice, there need not be foregiveness. I think your article would have been better served after we've had at least a modicum of prosecutions, jail sentences, debt forgiveness, etc... As it stands, I will not forgive, nor will I forget. Ill gotten gains need to addressed first.
You are speaking about forgiveness.
I am speaking about forgiving and to forgive. These are two different subjects that, while related, are not the same thing.
Exactly. Forgiveness is a gift more to yourself than others. This is an excellent and timely post C.D. I thank you for it!
I forgive myself for the enjoyment of porn.
Forgive? Forgiven!
If I forgive them I won't forgive myself
So are you saying you will never be able to forgive? Because it appears that many are missing the thrust of the essay. There will come a time to forgive.
Will we be able to when that time comes?
"WE", no. You, perhaps, others, maybe.
Me? Do chickens have lips?
Actually I'd like them to be in the "Blue Dolphin" prison in Siberia. Then after 5 years of living hell we can have a party and burn hang disembowel feed to dogs behead them. No guilt here whatsoever. No forgiving required, by anybody, ever, just a glorious anniversary every year.
Big Smile
This is the Worst Thing you ever printed. They live on Yachts at our expense. Fuck You too.
It's not forgiveness that we'll carry forward. It will extreme wariness of bankers and all financial institutions, including the government, similar to our grandparents (those of us old enough) after Roosevelt's Theft.
This is a wariness that we try to instill in our grandchildren, stressing that these thieves will return as soon as they turn their backs. To be on guard, prepared to eliminate them before they destroy the country.
We waited too late, certain that our government was 'honest' and 'wise'...foolish us.
Forgiveness is for pussies.
WHen your wife lends out her pussy to the neighbor, it thus becomes a choice whether to forgive the pussy.
If you try to steal my shit when I am present, then I'll learn to forgive myself for pulling the trigger.
Just a thought.
You are present now. So why have you not pulled the trigger? Maybe you enjoy being in a continuous state of unrequited anger.
Just a thought. (CD, I love you, but you think too fucking much)
You are present now. So why have you not pulled the trigger? Maybe you enjoy being in a continuous state of unrequited anger.
Can't pull my finger to even get a good fart off. The consensus is in dream world of ice cream and puppies.
Fuck forgiving let alone to forget the future that thus follows of no-so goodshit.
LOL
I would rather think too much than too little. But that's just me. :>)
Think all you want at your leisure . Sooner or later decisions must be made .
I am already making decisions. What are you doing? :>)
for the christian focused on the rapture of distruction a couple thoughts
I will forgive whom I will forgive .. of you it is required to forgive all men
as you judge so shall ye be judged .bible .. new testiment ..
those not inclined to forgive go to the bible and rip out these pages lol
so those who are selective in their mixed mind and cling to to christian cross should follow the injunction to forgive
other wise your pretend sunday sermons are wells with out water .
...and forgive me my trespasses, as I forgive those who trespass against me.
A part of my daily recital...a struggle to live up to the sentiments, but there is freedom in forgiveness.
As CD makes clear, forgiveness does not eliminate punishment or mean justice denied. It is a way for both parties to begin the healing process. Hatred has the power to consume. There is plenty to rage about, and venting is said to be healthy, but then the day eventually comes when it is also healthy to move on. This is often missed by the immature or less worldly among us, but it is important....somewhat akin to the ability to discern between the clever, the smart, and the wise. We would do well to ask ourselves which category we fall into?
So, junk away if you will....it's OK...I forgive you.
Thanks, you said it for me.
And good job, CD. Love your posts.
Wish I could leave more than one gree for each of you two just above.
Another good one, recently for me:
Lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.
Ah, yes. Another part of the daily recital.
Perhaps it is only when one has realized the need for forgiveness that the need to forgive is revealed.
It is great to see a positive comment first. I agree with you 11b40. I also hope CD will get to read this. When my mind has trouble grasping a word that has been used to mean many things, I clear my head by looking it up in "ye olde college dictionary"- Webster style. Since this is a very important topic to me personally, I tend to post wise sayings on my kitchen wall. I spend a lot of time in that room of nourishment for body and soul. It is essential to let healing and uplifting words go through my mind while I put my hands to work for the good of my family.
Forgive- To give up resentment against or the desire to punish; stop being angry with; pardon; to give up all claim to punish or exact penalty for (an offense); overlook. To show forgiveness- to be inclined to forgive.
I appreciate how CD uses the term "hate hangovers" because to me I do become physically and mentally sick. I am in tune with my true self and I cry out about injustice. It is in how I choose to deal with it that counts. An old saying I have quoted many times to fellow sojurners on the path to reality, love and forgiveness comes to mind. It deals with bitterness which is just anger and hate turned inward and has taken root until it festers and corrupts your mind, body and soul. "Bitterness is like drinking a vile of poison and waiting for the other person to die." When you go through the work to rid your life of the foul and stinking hate anger and bitterness, and you come through to the other side, you will be left with a scar. As we all know, a completely healed wound leaves a scar, but since it is completely healed- you remember what caused it when you look at it or think about it - but you no longer feel the pain.
I encourage all of you reading this- no matter where you are in your life journey- take some time to release anger and to forgive because we all need to stop hurting ourselves and reducing our mental, spiritual, and sometimes physical strength. This is something we all have control over. Thanks for everything you said CD.
Mahalo
This will probably not be re-visited, but I love your quote:
"Bitterness is like drinking a vile of poison and waiting for the other person to die."
Sums it up nicely....thanks.
And thank you as well.
I suspect many will follow the path I took. I became sick and tired of being sick and tired and began looking for another way. Thus the reason I inserted into the essay the word image of the unsated and exhausted angry person (Howard Beale is in the actual image) splayed upon the floor. It is usually only after we have exhausted all our own ways that we then willingly seek alternative ways.
It is only then that the vast majority of us will actively seek peace and healing within.
:)
foe the christian focused on the rapture od distruction a couple thoughts
I will forgive whom I will forgive .. of you it is required to forgive all men
as you judge so shall ye be judged .bible .. new testiment ..
those not inclined to forgive go to the bible and rip out these pages lol
so those who are selective in their mixed mind and cling to to christian cross should follow the injunction to forgive
other wise your pretend sunday sermons are wells with out water .
It's Tuesday. But I always had a problem with that whole calendar thingy anyway.
I have followed dumpster's comments through, well, the years now!
He has a wisdom that is hard to pin down with words, but read him, and you'll get the idea.
dumpster can fight rough (eh, Johnny Bravo?), but how can anyone doubt what he says here: that Christians must forgive, and I think that forgivess a la Cog Dis is perhaps what he has in mind.