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Chart Of The Day: The Fiscal Cliff For The Rest Of Us

Tyler Durden's picture


We have discussed the fiscal cliff from many angles: timeline, the potential impact, the scenarios, whether its impact is priced in, why a bounce on success is unlikely, the endgame 'solution', and the long-term fiscal probity of the USA. As it appears everyone is becoming more aware of this pending reality, we note USA Today's great one-stop-shop infographic which simplifies the fiscal cliff impact for the rest of us: A raft of tax and spending changes scheduled to take effect in January will sharply reduce the federal budget deficit, but will also send the economy back into recession if they all happen at once.



Chart: USA Today


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Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:31 | 2979561 Aziz
Aziz's picture

We're already over the cliff. We went over the cliff a long, long time ago.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:33 | 2979568 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Should probably stick our heads between our legs at this point.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:36 | 2979578 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

We fell of the last of a series of cliffs on November 6.  The rest is commentary and details.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:56 | 2979647 new game
new game's picture

never was a fan of free falling without  a chute, but gold seems less dense that fiat, damn the newton stuff...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:03 | 2979664 sickofthepunx
sickofthepunx's picture

nothing is going to happen.


congress will cut a half-assed deal, kick the can down the road another 2 years and the market will rally.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:09 | 2979678 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Nice of USA Today to get a little bit real after November 6.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:20 | 2979731 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

You could call this the 'Thelma and Louise Economy'...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 15:33 | 2981031 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

... or "Amos & Andrew"

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:33 | 2979797 semperfi
semperfi's picture

'thong - nothing against you but FUCK USELESS A' TODAY - AND FUCK ALL THE MSM !!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:10 | 2979679 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

$250k in 2001 is worth $325k today. Bracket creep bitchez!!!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:47 | 2979858 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

That is a very astute observation.

We are now extending the AMT to those making $180K or probably less in 2001 dollars.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:15 | 2979712 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Oh, a new idea?  Yeah, that'll work!


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:10 | 2979951 derek_vineyard
derek_vineyard's picture

we went off the cliff long ago....when will have impact (crash)?

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:42 | 2980133 indygo55
indygo55's picture

That's what I think too. They havent extracted every last dime from us yet. These things take time. All part of the plan.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:41 | 2979601 BobPaulson
BobPaulson's picture

Pay me later or pay me much later.

Discounting the future is nothing new. If the rest of the world falls for the scam of the US printing money to spend on things it can't afford, it isn't surprising that some people want to run that scam as long as possible.

Humans love denial because we have a genetic predisposition for denial in the face of mortality. So what happens when they can't afford the carrier fleet and Pax Americana wilts? There is going to be a shitload of medium sized powers exerting their local powers spheres in that world. We might actually see a balance of power again.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:51 | 2979874 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

a lot of win in this post.  +1

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:26 | 2980042 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

A "kiln dried 2x4"'dollar is not valueless. Just avoid "the debt plague" and I think you will prosper beyond all measure.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:54 | 2979644 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I agree, John. The next event on the time-line isn't the beginning of the plunge; rather it is the sudden impact at the bottom.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:56 | 2979645 Eireann go Brach
Eireann go Brach's picture

The US is like a one armed man hanging off a cliff with itchy balls, just fucked! Let Obama finish off what he started and drive us straight over the Ledge, I am happy he was re-elected!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:48 | 2979865 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

When you really only get one swing at it...


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:02 | 2979662 ejmoosa
ejmoosa's picture

It's not the fall that's gonna hurt.


It's the sudden stop.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:44 | 2980147 carguym14
carguym14's picture

Yep,but like Wile E. Coyote,as long as we don't look down we'll be OK.


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:18 | 2980304 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

Just hanging out mid-air like Wile E. Coyote eh?



Wed, 11/14/2012 - 14:25 | 2980692 ilovefreedom
ilovefreedom's picture

"GDP will fall 2.9% landing at 1.9%." Weren't we just revised under 2% already to like 1.5% in 2012? How is a 2.9% drop going to equal 1.9% when we are already well below that run rate. Sounds like we should expect a negative GDP rate in 2013....

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 15:32 | 2981021 Breaker
Breaker's picture

"A raft of tax and spending changes scheduled to take effect in January will sharply reduce the federal budget deficit..."

I would quibble with the word "sharply." It will reduce it some. But not by nearly enough.

The conceit of the "avoid the fiscal cliffers" is their argument that going over the cliff will cause a recession. But that is the argument that got us here. In other words, deficits don't matter but recessions do. That works until it doesn't. Eventually, you run out of room for more deficit. We are officially there and have to bite the bullet.

Back to my quibble. I think we need to bite the bullet considerably harder than the fiscal cliff. It's really not even a short term solution. Way too much deficit remains after the fiscal cliff. All a grand compromise will do is reduce the deficit effect of the cliff.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 16:39 | 2981392 Meatier Shower
Meatier Shower's picture


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:31 | 2979563 Robslob
Robslob's picture anybody really knows how fucked we truly are...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:46 | 2979618 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"So there is still room for what Japan calls Shocku." I agree with this. Much is hidden from us Young Grasshopper. And much of it now is BIG. I still believe New York City has been insolvent for decades for example and that the City has for all intents and purposes been looted. Has Sandy changed the game? We shall see..and see shortly I think. One thing is certain: the fiscal cliff does not not solve that problem. Only the private sector can bail out New York City.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:11 | 2979686 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



NYC isn't the only one what about obama's state of Illinois and Ca and pretty much all the blue states except Wisconsin who finally is getting it's house in order because of Gov. Walker

Illinois Debt Takes Toll, Study Finds


For years, Illinois has racked up billions in public debt to plug budget holes, pay overdue bills, and put money into its mismanaged pension funds. And for the people who live there, this has resulted in decrepit commuter trains and buses, thousands of unsound bridges, 200 hazardous dams and one of the most inequitable public school systems in America.

Illinois has the lowest credit rating of the 50 states and has America’s second-biggest public debt per capita, $9,624, including state and local borrowing. Only New York State’s debt is bigger, at $13,840 per capita. But Illinois has not been able to use much of the borrowed money to keep its roads, bridges and schools in good working order, because years of shoddy fiscal practices have taken a heavy toll, the report said.

“Illinois has been doing back flips on a high wire, without a net,” the task force said in the report, which was issued in Chicago.

The task force has been examining the finances of the states out of a concern that huge fiscal problems at the state and local level are being overlooked as the election-year debate in Washington focuses on the federal debt and deficit.

Nearly two-thirds of the Illinois state government’s $58 billion in direct debt consists of bonds the government issued to cover retirement payments for workers, including a $10 billion pension obligation bond that broke all previous records in 2003.

Yet despite all that borrowing, Illinois’ public pension system is still in tatters. In fact, its total pension shortfall is conservatively estimated at $85 billion. (in full)

State's pension is strongest in nation, study finds Wisconsin stands alone as fully funded in fiscal year 2010

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:29 | 2980059 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Go cheeseheads!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:33 | 2980090 ElvisDog
ElvisDog's picture

CA actually has no worries. The Dems have a super-majority in the legislature now and can raise taxes and fees as much as they like. Deficit in CalPers? No problem, just raise property taxes on "the rich", and so on. True, it may drive all productive people out of the state, but at the moment CA can cover any budget shortfalls.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:32 | 2979565 Dumpster Fire
Dumpster Fire's picture

$700 billion the first year and only 160 billion is spending cuts.  lol

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:36 | 2979577 docj
docj's picture

And you can bet that 90% of the spending cuts will never, in reality, happen.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:53 | 2979639 swiss chick
swiss chick's picture

Sounds like Greece!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:32 | 2979791 e-recep
e-recep's picture

Smells like Greece!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:06 | 2980249 exi1ed0ne
exi1ed0ne's picture

I'm sure as hell not gonna taste it.  You first.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:04 | 2979668 toady
toady's picture

Exactly. Even expiring the tax cuts and cutting spending by going off the 'cliff' won't come close to the 16T they keep referencing.

Still, I'd rather see official numbers saying we are in recession than the current faked numbers saying we're not, so jump off the cliff!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:32 | 2979567 Tortfeasor
Tortfeasor's picture

A Festivus for the Rest of Us!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:33 | 2979570 Calidreaming
Calidreaming's picture

Thelma and Louise  , lets go for it!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:57 | 2979650 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



The best way to rob a bank is to own one I don't know who said that but I would add it helps to have Corrupt Government Officials like Holder to avoid any prosecutions and on that note...


He's back. President Barack Obama reportedly asked Eric Holder to stay as attorney general after he's inaugurated for a second term, and the controversial Cabinet head agreed.


Report: Cronyism, political donations likely behind Obama, Holder failure to charge any bankers after 2008 financial meltdown

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:46 | 2979576 q99x2
q99x2's picture

I feel like I'm going to puke. I'm used to these banko/politico types by now. They will simply increase the fraud by 5.6% to keep the US on a solid growth trajectory. Most everyone else will be sensing impending doom as they wonder why everything looked so great on the TV before their cable bill late notice expired.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:36 | 2979581 Fishthatlived
Fishthatlived's picture

USA Today...figures. We're already in FY 2013 and our first monthly deficit was $120 billion.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:58 | 2979652 new game
new game's picture

12 squared = 1.4 trillion

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:02 | 2980233 Midas
Midas's picture

C'mon, who gave the down arrow?  Explain yourself.  Are you a math purist?

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:20 | 2980321 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

Restored its positivity.



Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:21 | 2980329 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

Restored its positivity.



Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:37 | 2979585 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Lets start calling this the " hillock " it actually is.

A hillock on the mountains slope in the path of an unstoppable landside/avalanche.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:37 | 2979588 Awakened Sheeple
Awakened Sheeple's picture

Bring it on!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:52 | 2979631 Atlasshruggedme
Atlasshruggedme's picture

I am making large investments in personal protection. Zombies = People without food stamps. 

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:13 | 2979701 andy_pandy
andy_pandy's picture

=people without hope = uncontrollable

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:51 | 2980189 zapdude
zapdude's picture

When the drooling zombie hoarde arrives at my door, I don't want to go down for lack of shooting back. 

Long 12 ga. shot shells, 9mm and .223 ammo cans!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:40 | 2979597 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

That cliff is not going away at least not without a lot of growth.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:44 | 2979611 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Growth supplied by cheap oil.

Price of oil will rise and choke the growth to death.

Self limiting feedback loop.

This is as good as it gets.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:01 | 2979660 new game
new game's picture

with 25 percent cost as energy to get the stuff; hmmm.

kinda keynsian petro dolla/gub growth model of sel realization that 7 billion standing hungry naked and desparate...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:41 | 2979602 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

watching gold move in a perfect ebb and flow with the spy makes me want to vomit.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:44 | 2979608 DOT
DOT's picture

$250,000/ year = Rich ass mutha billionaire

(Nuage maths)


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:45 | 2979613 NEOSERF
NEOSERF's picture

Would really like to hear the rating agencies weigh in here with a "if you push it off we will downgrade" type comment.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:52 | 2979636 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



Egan Jones weighed in and then obama went after them however they didn't fold they are hero's IMO

'Fiscal Cliff' Deal Won’t Help US Rating: Egan-Jones

SEC Sues the One Rating Firm Not on Wall Street’s Take


SEC Keeps Ratings Game Rigged

SEC Pursues Egan Jones; Moody’s, S&P Remain At Large

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:45 | 2979616 nantucket
nantucket's picture

it's a bad time to be named Cliff. i'd change my name if I was. 

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:48 | 2979622 justanothersucker
justanothersucker's picture

Damn, I was hoping that going over this cliff thingy was going to be a smoother ride....more like free fall.  It's already quite bumpy and getting worse!  WTF?

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:48 | 2979624 Bogdog
Bogdog's picture

As nasty as the cliff is, it barely makes a dent in the annual deficit. And will most probably add to it with all the new unemployed.

Smoke and mirrors. Funny money. I'm sick of it.

Bullish on 5.56mm/7.62mm/.45cal.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:56 | 2979626 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

So between the low income tax increase and the ss tax increase the poor get to pay through the nose because the billionaires write the damn thing. Thanks for the $40B boyz, very generous indeed. Disgusting.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:04 | 2979666 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

It is curiious that multi-millionaires, billionaires, actors/actresses, sports figures and politicians always have loopholes written into the tax code so they aren't "the rich" that end up being taxed.  Taxes are for the little people...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:08 | 2979677 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

these are not the rich that you are looking for...

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:30 | 2979778 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

Ahh.  Good way to put it. 

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:20 | 2979729 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



+1 Hey maybe we should all try to get in on this

Tax-Exempt Firm Gets $600 Million Profit Flying First Class

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:53 | 2979629 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

It does not matter. The books cannot balance no matter what we pay and what we do. This is the Long Emergency and it will grind on with crisis after crisis.

Keep prepping. We always should have been. They were always lying to us from the day we were born. Be your own FEMA (you will do a better job) be your own retirement provider they won't do it because they can't. Folks on this site and others are waking up/awake to this fact. We were all always resonsible for ourselves, it just is not built into our culture as "normal" any more. The only thing that pisses me off is the theft from our pocket books that takes place at gunpoint. They can steal, even though the books will never balance, and keep telling us to our face that they need the money and will spend it wisely when they don't.

Grind on brothers and sisters, grind on.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:53 | 2979642 edifice
edifice's picture

Precisely. ^

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:53 | 2979630 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

If GDP falls, then tax receipts fall at a given level of taxation, the chart above deosn't necessarily reflect that (or the escalating cost of the social safety net as the economy underperforms)

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:01 | 2979634 Mercury
Mercury's picture

Gotta love how taxes never get raised's tax cuts that "expire". 

By the way - can we see some historical data on projected vs. realized tax revenue from past tax hikes?  The notion that the government can simply dial up an exact amount of new tax revenue by raising rates and inventing new taxes is absurd.  People really do change their behavior when incentives change.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:53 | 2979638 nah
nah's picture

der gurn sism' costs to much damn money

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:27 | 2979758 ironmace
ironmace's picture

The rent is too damn high!!

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 10:58 | 2979649 Catullus
Catullus's picture

I love how much bullshit the "cliff" is. Increased taxes don't subtract from the GDP. You have earn the money for it to be taxed away. It's a transfer payment to the government. The economic activity doesn't cease to be.

It amounts to $160bn in spending cuts which is 1.0% of GDP. THE HORROR. And there will still be a $600bn plus cash deficit.

The taxing will reduce future growth because it digs in deeper into the savings base of the US.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:08 | 2979676 DOT
DOT's picture

I would say that the government wants to tax that which has been earned (income), what has been saved and previously taxed (wealth ), and what my children have not yet earned (interest on the debt). The new plantation has no fence. The effective rate will become 100%.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:51 | 2980186 hawk nation
hawk nation's picture

Lets remember historically tax increases do not result in increased revenue for the government

Result will be reduced GDP, reduced revenue to the government and increased costs to entitlment programs as a result of higher unemployment. The net effect of this will be the same size deficits or probably more 

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:02 | 2979661 larz
larz's picture

I for one want to take Buffets lead and pay even more taxes so everyone can get the obama phne and everything else they might need!  yea one armed man with very itchy balls

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:02 | 2979663 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

A drop in GDP is a GOOD thing, if the drop is mainly attributable to the government component, which should never have been part of the GDP calculation in the first place, as government by definition produces nothing at all.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:12 | 2979692 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

When the debt ceiling is raised by $2.5 trillion there will be $250 billion in cuts to the annual budget and 5 million or more high paying jobs cut, especially with the unemployment and severance pay costs.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:06 | 2980250 hooligan2009
hooligan2009's picture

come on now, be much would the debt "ceiling" have to be increased to in five years time before and after fiscal correction (not cliff, that is a misnomer). if we continue wile e coyoteing the fresh air, the debt ceiling would need ot be increased by at least 5 trillion. if the misnomer is implemented, just the odd what? 3 trillion? whats the difference between 20 trillion and 27 trillion when the dollar is worth close to zero? i will gove you a cant hedge it.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 14:09 | 2980620 HurricaneSeason
HurricaneSeason's picture

Well, I think the last $2.5 trillion lasted 15 months or something like that. They will lower the $1300 billion annual deficit by $500 billion with the fiscal cliff, except Obama has already said that the draconian cuts of $50 billion to the military will not happen. So certainly he will ask the $50 billion to discretionary spending will not happen either. They'll probably cut the social security tax discount and unemployment extension for a total savings of $150 billion. My guess is a 10% reduction in the annual deficit. With hurricane Sandy and other reduced revenues, it wont be a very big reduction in deficit. Representative Boner will probably give Obama some job stimulus money to keep higher incomes from paying the old tax so the cliff can be put to rest. Then when the ceiling arrives, represetative Boner has the leverage. He who laughs last laughs best.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:12 | 2979696 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

Market indexes do two things - 1) they represent a combined value of stocks, 2) they represent the FUTURE potential of these companies which are directly related the economy.


Indexes lead the economy by about 3 months.  Indexes will catch up if the economy is worse than first thought.  And this is why markets fall quickly - economic reports in bad times are misleading or just plain lies.


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:46 | 2980160 hawk nation
hawk nation's picture

Or are stocks another form of a fixed asset that is a hedge against the falling value of the dollar? Since the stock market is allowed to move up unlike gold perhaps valuations do not apply because they fail to equate the value of the dollar

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:20 | 2979725 Frank N. Beans
Frank N. Beans's picture

usa = greece

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:19 | 2979726 haskelslocal
haskelslocal's picture

Whomever coined "Fiscal Cliff" needs to be seal-clubbed in the head.

Imagine instead you're talking to your financial advisor and he were to say;

"To get your finances on track, it might be a good idea to increase your earnings and reduce your spending by a mere 3.6%."  

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:25 | 2979749 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Did you mean 36%?

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:28 | 2979764 haskelslocal
haskelslocal's picture

It says at the bottom of that "Scary" Wile-E Coyote chart 3.6%.

Just using their numbers.  

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:30 | 2980051 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

meep meep

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:32 | 2979792 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

No, the HORRIBLE fiscal cliff only reduces spending by about 3.5% overall.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:32 | 2980413 Muppet
Muppet's picture

The term "fiscal cliff" was coined by Ben per the USA.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:23 | 2979728 SilverFish
SilverFish's picture

Just work harder, slaves!


Oh, and buy more doo-dads from your fav box store.



This will be all for now.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:28 | 2979757 semperfi
semperfi's picture

GOP please step out of the way and let The Kenyan Thug and his Army have their way and ASS RAPE all the dumb ass apathetic ignoramuses in this country that either stood by and watched or directly voted in the polititians over the last few decades that brought us to this point. We deserve an ass-raping, no lube, good and hard - bring it.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 11:54 | 2979864 helping_friendl...
helping_friendly_book's picture

What Army?

You mean those idiots trying to get their 'scripts for testosterone and Viagra filled while writing email novellas to their mistresses?

I think the bonheads will be much to busy testifying in front of the Senate for the next four years and getting probed by the FBI!

I suppose the attack on Iran, the peacful nation, will have to wait four more years bicthz!

We might even see a peace dividend out of this!

What we lose via higher taxes we make up double by the falling gas prices the FC will induce.

Bring it on!!! Let those poor rich people pay their taxes.

Short LMT. Long SPXU.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:02 | 2979904 semperfi
semperfi's picture

"Let those poor rich people pay their taxes"


TAX THE RICH plan....


Hollywood tax         90%
Mainstream Media tax  90%

Pro athlete tax       90%

Banker tax            90%

Lawyer tax            90%

Politician tax        95%


And because "everyone" needs to pay their "FAIR SHARE"...

Parasite 47% tax      25%
Illegal Alien tax     50%

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:07 | 2979932 helping_friendl...
helping_friendly_book's picture

Sounds like a plan!

You forgot the 95% inheretnce tax for sum greater than $250,000.

Let everyone start on the same level.

No more trust funds.

Let the gov't take the wealth when you die.

That might change political contributions a bit.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:35 | 2980437 Peterus
Peterus's picture

People would just spend it all than. OK, all the people that did not put Government as the sole benefator in thier testaments right now.

There is no gaming a system of violence. You can't run a gang to actually produce net gains. Whatever it gives away, whoever it will prioritize for help - all of the money is first robbed. Let the gov't die and leave people's wealth alone (and stop shielding all those speciali interests from taking responsiblity!).

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:01 | 2979905 are we there yet
are we there yet's picture

Getting a roomful of politicians to vote for fiscal sanity and smaller government is like hearding 255 cats to take a bath.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 12:38 | 2980109 Money_for_Nothing
Money_for_Nothing's picture

Supposedly falling off the cliff would bring in something like 500 billion a year in more taxes. This would be offset by at least 300 billion going out in unemployment, disability and SNAP. Also a bunch of retirement funds would collapse as the stock market would drop sharply. Banks wouldn't be good as the newly unemployed owning bonds and CDs would start cashing them in. FUBAR would be too mild.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:07 | 2980225 hooligan2009
hooligan2009's picture

you get some idea of the malthinking when you see how these numbers are portrayed.

"cost ot the economy" is a misnomer.

the title should be "savings to the taxpayer" or "avoidance of debt". these idiots should be avoided, as should talking heads, bank economists and of course THAT Nobel prize winner.


Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:08 | 2980255 hooligan2009
hooligan2009's picture

i vote for two things

1. confiscate all cash sitting on the sidelines in the US

2. impose a tax of 150% on cash held overseas by US companies.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:08 | 2980257 Riquin
Riquin's picture

Look mathematically is impossible to pay the debt the sooner we accept that the better we are going to be. We need to get the best mathematical, accounting, financial and legal minds in the nation and come out with a gracious plan of debt forgiveness.  The more we wait the worst it going to get. We are going the way of Spain (taxes and cuts) and that is not fun.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:38 | 2980409 hooligan2009
hooligan2009's picture

ah hah...someone who can spot the truth!! excellent video.

the us needs to run fiscal surplus of 600 billion per annum for ten years, who has got the cahunas to put down a budget with tax increases and social security/pentagon spending cuts?

all i see are used condoms instead of cahunas.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 13:37 | 2980450 hooligan2009
hooligan2009's picture

should change this to obamashambles for the US dictionary!!

The term, defined as "a situation that has been comprehensively mismanaged, characterized by a string of blunders and miscalculations", topped a list of words which academics say reflect the past 12 months in the UK.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 14:14 | 2980644 robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

When the SHTF the rich will have their bought and paid for Generals order their soldiers to shoot the protestors dead.

Wed, 11/14/2012 - 16:58 | 2981473 Hobbleknee
Hobbleknee's picture

Fake. Not one dime will be cut.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 03:56 | 2995299 cgagw
cgagw's picture

However, the route is never crowded and is a nicer variant than the Gouter or Grands Mulet routes,Clif Bar Company Becomesnorth face outlet berkeley Pinnacle Member Of The Conservation AllianceBend, Ore,, July 25, 2011 - Clif Bar Company has committed to become The Conservation Alliance's next Pinnacle Member. However, the route is never crowded and is a nicer variant than the Gouter or Grands Mulet routes,Clif Bar Company Becomes Pinnacle Member Of The Conservation AllianceBend,northface outlet Ore,, July 25, 2011 - Clif Bar Company has committed to become The Conservation Alliance's next Pinnacle Member.

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