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Latest Snowden Poll Results: 55% Say Whistleblower; 34% Say Traitor
Immediately in the aftermath of the Snowden revelations, various political action committees and their ideologically affiliated polling services took to convincing the general public that according to "popular opinion", a "majority" of Americans found Snowden to be a [traitor|hero]. A month later, with the the dust having settled somewhat, the US public has had some more time to consider the implications of living in the United Stasi States of America. And sure enough, another poll has just been released, this time by Quinnipiac. Its findings are as follows: a majority of U.S. registered voters consider Edward Snowden a whistle-blower, not a traitor, and a plurality says government anti-terrorism efforts have gone too far in restricting civil liberties, a poll released today shows. Fifty-five percent said Snowden was a whistle-blower in leaking details about top-secret U.S. programs that collect telephone and Internet data, in the survey from Hamden, Connecticut-based Quinnipiac University. Thirty-four percent said he’s a traitor.
The view of Snowden as a whistle-blower rather than traitor predominated among almost every group of respondents broken down by party, gender, income, education and age. Black voters were the lone exception, with 43 percent calling Snowden a traitor compared with 42 percent saying he was a whistle-blower.
More from the poll:
The poll also showed that by 45 percent to 40 percent, respondents said the government goes too far in restricting civil liberties as part of the war on terrorism. That was a reversal from January 2010, when in a similar survey 63 percent said anti-terrorism activities didn’t go far enough to protect the U.S. from attacks, compared with 25 percent who disagreed.
“The massive swing in public opinion about civil liberties and governmental anti-terrorism efforts, and the public view that Edward Snowden is more whistle-blower than traitor, are the public reaction and apparent shock at the extent to which the government has gone in trying to prevent future terrorist incidents,” said Peter Brown, assistant director of Quinnipiac’s polling institute.
“The verdict that Snowden is not a traitor goes against almost the unified view of the nation’s political establishment,” Brown said.
Facing espionage and other charges and with his passport revoked, Snowden has been holed up at Moscow’s Sheremetyevo Airport since arriving there on June 23 from Hong Kong, which refused a U.S. extradition request. President Barack Obama’s administration has been pressuring other countries not to grant Snowden asylum, and U.S. officials who have called him a traitor include House Speaker John Boehner, an Ohio Republican.
The poll showed both Democrats and Republicans about evenly divided on whether government counter-terrorism measures have become excessive. Independent voters view the methods as having gone too far by 49 percent to 36 percent.
“The fact that there is little difference now along party lines about the overall anti-terrorism effort and civil liberties and about Snowden is in itself unusual in a country sharply divided along political lines about almost everything,” Brown said.
A gender gap emerges, though, on the government’s anti-terrorism programs. The poll showed that men, by 54 percent to 34 percent, see the government as having gone too far in its efforts while women, by 47 percent to 36 percent, said the measures haven’t gone far enough.
Despite this divergence, figures for the genders from Quinnipiac’s January 2010 poll exemplify the overall change in attitude on the issue. Male respondents, by 61 percent to 28 percent, said in the earlier survey that the government hadn’t gone far enough to protect the country. Among women, 64 percent said the same.
Likewise, among Republicans the percentage who said government has gone overboard in restricting civil liberties in the fight against terrorism grew to 41 percent in the new poll, compared with 17 percent three years ago.
Of course, this poll will promptly be overturned by another poll conducted by MSNBC (or comparable), finding that 120% of Americans believe Snowden deserves the chair. And the farce will go on.
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Will of the people? How quaint!
They've decided to put a B on it instead
And the Reverend Al Sharpton gets to pull the lever ?
Out of interest, was this poll conducted in a .gov office?
Just wondering why 34% would think he's a traitor. Seriously, any reason?
Because the govt/media complex told them thats what they should think?
Cuz they watch TeeVee
They've been .... televised ....
That is a question which takes WAY too much time to answer on a 'blog', 'jmcadg'.
The reasons are many, and nuanced.
It all boils down to the fact that people are willing to do anything to be 'happy' for the moment, and the emenies of mankind KNOW this.
WATCH THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH_DkBI9Qsk
MORE PEOPLE RECEIVE GOVERNMENT FOOD SUBSIDIES THAN ARE EMPLOYED WITHIN THE UNITED STATES.
I sent this link to the Tylers, and I see that they posted a variation of it.
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/101m-get-food-aid-federal-gov-t-outnumbe...
Dogs know that they get their food from their master. Is this a difficult concept?
34% for all intent and purpose may as well be lobotomized.
all intensive purposes. There, me fix. Brain feel better now.
lol wut?
Sorry, I have coworkers that insist on saying intensive purposes - fingers on chalkboard. At least one thinks Snowden is working with the Chinese.
Good save!
Because Dick Cheney suggested that during a tv interview.. Offer the public a "plausible" reason, and the majority will accept it with no burden to think further, deeper.
This shows that the Red and Blue teams play for the same owners, when the WH puts Cheney into play.
The entire Bush crowd is always "retired" when it comes to conservative issues but as soon as the liberal agenda of amnesty, gay rmarriage, universai healthcare is in trouble, there they are taking time out of "retirement" to help the wrong side. And they still control the GOP.
Emperor Palpatine is still alive?
Do you have any who say 'supposably' all the time? I hate that shit.
LOL - i've been stopped for using the word "condescending" in a joke (you know, when I talk down to you). I'm glad I went tech; any more reading and writing classes, and I'd be unable to communicate at all.
DOH
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/for_all_intents_and_purposes
I could care less.
See what I did there?
Alex Karras says it BEST:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKRma7PDW10
"The verdict that Snowden is not a traitor goes against almost the unified view of the nation’s political establishment,"
What the hell DOESN'T go against the unified view of the establishment these days? They're off having multiple orgasms figuring out ways to enslave us against our wishes and against the Constitution of the United States and you expect them to see things like we do? Seriously?
That's the 'money quote'.
800 lb gorilla in the room....
Seems to be the folks that vote almost 100% for chalky and friends
11% said, "Who's Edward Snowden?"
It doesn't matter to me whether Shakespeare or Bacon wrote the sonnets or plays. What matters is the words.
Likewise, it matter not (to a great degree) whether he is a limited hang or red herring or whether he is the real thing.
The effects are that a TON more people over the whole world are aware of government spying and data collections.
THAT is a good thing. Regardless of the intentions.
Is what the he said about the NSA true? You know it is.
Are more people around the globe more aware than before.
You know they are.
Exactly. You said that well.
That was my original take on the situation.
Disinformation has to be 98% accurate to be effective, so if you take what Snowden says to be 98% true then its essentially irrelevant whether he has been allowed to leak, or not.
At the same time, I still think Jon Rapoport makes a hell of a case that Snowden's background doesn't check out.
...frankly...Jon Rapoport's background doesn't "check-out" either...
Indeed... I wonder what he has to lose if Snowden is the genuine article?
I disagree because it's so obviously a limited hangout by a simulacrum who is obviously backed by state actors.
I think the PURPOSE of state-run media telling the zombie proles that they're being watched 24/7 is to stifle their dissent by adding to their fears.
Nobody who has been paying attention should be surprised by anything that has come out in the WaPo or Guardian, because nothing new has been released and both newspapers are STATE-RUN MEDIA, with wikileaks being an Israeli spy asset.
It's all just the latest in Bread and Circuses to distract the public and give the illusion that there is dissent, and that it's futile to dissent because everyone is being watched at all times.
That is the purpose of Snowden, to stifle dissent.
Yep, and also any one waiting to blow the whistle will now instead 'wait and see' what Snowden releases, because it might 'spare them the effort'.
People will act differently if they know they are being surveilled. That is a fact. The elites use computer models to try predict human behavior. If they can make people behave MORE PREDICTABLY then that helps their models be more accurate as well!
So did you come up with that, or did someone tell you about it?
That's usually how you can tell if you're being played for a fool. You think that information agents aren't out there, and that they have been spreading their BS for decades already? Just find a so called expert on the intelligence agencies, you know like Jon Rapoport.
Intelligence is about making people believe something that isn't true, not about gathering real data.
Thank GOD for DISINFORMATION SCHILLS!
While I'm at it, thank god for MESSIAH OBAMA, my MASTER and LEADER!
FORWARD!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l46t_nrySg4
And that's how your republic falls...with an ill-informed whimper.
"And that's how your republic falls...with an ill-informed whimper."
Nothing is over. That was your queef.
As time goes on those numbers will be more skewed in favor of Ed. If you don't think about being spyed on and adding to your comprehensive profile at least 10 times a day, you may need to ease down on the medication. File this one under eat shit gov tools.
Plus 1 for tactical "queef" use.
I love that word and rarely get to lob it at someone.
My kid calls the Instant Queue on Netflix the "Instant Queef." Middle school humor is a beautiful thing.
"Middle school humor is a beautiful thing."
Your child of a goat (kid) is quite well-programmed (OOPS. er, 'intelligent').
I seem to recall that 'queef', formerly known as 'head cheese', is the bacterial growth that men with uncircumsized penises who don't wash themselves seem to have issues with. It smells bad, and causes all types of issues with male health. It was formerly known as 'splooge', as it also causes discharges from the male genetaiia which women mistakenly associate with 'exitement'.
Ah, yes, those 'middle school' sex lessons were QUITE interesting.
Is it that your 'middle school goat child' is just now educating you about these things?
WTF is 'Netflix', and 'Instant Queue'? I always thought it was spelled 'Que'...as in, 'WTF", or, 'HUH'.
Gotta go wash now. Mcdonald's hamburgers have a habit of making my shit really stink.
Nope
Queef=pussy fart
Queef... can't locate its entry in standard dick...errrgh i mean dict :)
so, what's QUEEF?
A queef is the very scientific term for the fart-like noise your vagina makes as it allows air out of your body. - See more here
no wonder... now i can forgive my dict for missing it
34% say the Obowel Movement are not liars......
I've heard sentiment around here shift because of the China maneuvering - there is a kneejerk reaction to that, even if it's in the same sentence with spying on civilians in Hong Kong - all Chinese to them, so to speak.
OT: Nice write up connecting dots of "the one".
https://plus.google.com/113263537030292985327/posts/GqRAL9PjpwL#113263537030292985327/posts/GqRAL9PjpwL
LOL
"In the 2004 Illinois Democrat primary race for the U.S. Senate, front-runner Blair Hull just happened to be forced out of the race after David Axelrod just happened to manage to get Hull’s sealed divorce records unsealed, which just happened to enable Obama to win the primary, so he could face popular Republican Jack Ryan, whose sealed child custody records from his divorce just happened to become unsealed, forcing Ryan to withdraw from the race, which just happened to enable the unqualified Obama to waltz into the U.S. Senate, where, after a mere 143 days of work, he just happened to decide he was qualified to run for President of the United States."
Prolly all on Penny's dime.
I know which group the US main stream media is in.
Deleted. Wrong post
Oh, no, it's the right post.
HOORAY FOR CAPTAIN SPAULDING!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BMtqqHRvB8
Snowden is a whistleblower to the American PEOPLE, and a traitor to the American GOVERNMENT! He's a threat only to the political and elitist class.
In my mind, he's a hero. His sole motive appears to be one of warning us that tyranny has turned its eyes on us. Kudos to him for his courage in doing that!
As Americans whose primary protection resides in the US Constitution, we have a DUTY to fight a government that tramples any hope that we have to be free. America is not a nation of Nazis where "I was just following orders" is a legitimate excuse for colluding with a criminal government. Snowden blew the whistle on not just unconstitutional activity being engaged in but anti-constitutional activity and in a stupendously big way.
He knew there would be dire consequences for his choice and we are seeing what they are. He knew he was not going to get rich and that he might even get murdered. He gave us the information that proved our worse fears about where our government is going and now it is up to us to find OUR courage to address those problems. The least we could do is be thankful to Snowden for giving us a chance.
+1
For...
As Americans whose primary protection resides in the US Constitution, we have a DUTY to fight a government that tramples any hope that we have to be free. -- Pasadena Phil
So there are 34% of people who live in cuckoo land.
And notice that more women support State surveillance than men. This should not surprise anyone. Men on balance prefer freedom to run their own lives and can survive without government support (notwithstanding hoards of male welfare queens that have emerged), whereas women prefer society to be orderly, controlled and protected from men by more government.
Putting it more bluntly: on balance, women are more socialist than men.
The remaining 11% are in a TV coma.
34% brainwashed republicrat bots.
I now see him as a pretentious douche.
Sure, he pulled back the veil on the scope of domestic surveillance. Thanks, dude.
Anyone paying even scant attention knew this was happening anyhow.
The stamps in his passport lead me to think there is far more going on here than someone who grew a conscience.
He would certainly win more hearts and minds by leaking information here in the U.S., then facing 'The Man', as opposed to doing it on the run through the two largest communist countries in the world. This is over and above the fact that China and Russia are sworn enemies of the U.S..
Hong Kong and Russia for freedom of speech and liberty? Only an idiot, or serious liberal, would believe that. Then again, they are one in the same.
I struggle with the concept of giving Snowden the label of patriot. He reminds me of an asshole calling you names as he runs away.
In the end, I am more pissed at our elected officials who enabled all of this in the first place. All this shit costs big bucks which, in the end, are appropriated by Congress.
As I have said from the start: Snowden will be Stateside or 'disappeared' before the leaves start falling this autumn.
Exactly, Divine Wind. And now Snowden may be bound to South America's bastion of free speech, Venezuela.
But thanks, Ed, for alerting the American press to the obvious and the clueless on ZH who are aghast that one country spies on another. Oh, the horror!
The White House thanks you for your service, thou good and faithful servant.
I'm with you on this Divine Wind, fair play getting flailed, I have, but nothing about this story has added up from the start.
And to top it off, just like Assange, he has shit put to one side that Greenwald is going to release???
Release the lot, all of it, in one go. He's fucked his life twice over now, so let it all out. Do humanity a favour and shut this fucking shit show down.
Can't see the tree's for the wood's though mate eh?
;-)
Inthemix96
I enjoy your posts, btw...
But I respectfully disagree with you on this and have noted your position on other post.
He chose to play this out in the media, such as it is.
If I were him, I'd play it the same way. Release the mundane stuff that's still a surprise to,some of the muppets just stirring from slumber.
Give the politicians and spooks MILES of rope by letting them hyperventilate and spit traitorous venom of him for the the cameras...
Then drop the mother shit. The shit that will be heard round the world.
The only shit we eagerly await.
I wouldn't play my trump first. Not smart. He is smart.
Yeah, but if that day never comes, will you still give him a pass, and/or make excuses for him?
I for one will judge him harshly if he doesn't have MUCH MUCH more to offer.
I will too.
Fairplay Indypat and thanks for being cordial.
I do really hope you are right, only time will tell. Call me an old cynic mate.
:-)
You old cynic you!
+/-
For...
Then drop the mother shit. The shit that will be heard round the world. -- IndyPat
Future preference which assumes he has the shit. I don't know what Snowden is, and I'll wait to see what happens before I reach a conclusion. If he were to ask for help, I would do so, on the chance he is real. But I don't assume automatically that he is...
He's real. Imperfect as we all are but real.
Mail.
+1
For...
Unless you would rather have some fun reshaping opinions... -- ZerOhead
Always a good day for... fishing.
Nah, when waterboarding the Gubmint, a slow drip will prove much more effective...
Some will sacrifice for liberty and some won’t; perhaps your comment speaks for itself.
USA USA USA!!! Come on DV - join in ... louder mate... I can't hear YOU... LOWDER!!!
If only fight club were not virtual my man..... if only.... you can sit there behind your screen you dweeby fucker... and spout your tough guy shit... while guys like Snowden put his life on the line for pieces of total shit like you.... If only fight club were real... IF only...
On the premise that everything you see blasted at you on the news is a lie, and,
so, if state-run media says that he's either one or the other, then,
the truth has to be that he's either BOTH or NEITHER.
dude MSM they says he is a traitor therefore by your premise he is not a traitor.
dude, "media" is a plural.
WaPo and Guardian are BOTH state-run media.
35% Nazis
Hey, everyone miss the ace f spades in the deck and who is playing that card?
"Black voters were the lone exception, with 43 percent calling Snowden a traitor compared with 42 percent saying he was a whistle-blower"
Because he is a CRAZY ASS CRACKA trying to make the POTUS look bad and get our Bamaphone turned off.
It's amazing how..the brothas that I know that see O's bullshit saw it right away and in super3D (42%) while the 43% could see O climbing a telephone pole with earphones and a tap and still deny it. Racist.
I wasnt a racist before this asshole became President.
But after watching him, Holder, Valerie Jarret, Reggie Love, the Harvard Prof, Trayvon--the long lost son, and the Obamaphone woman, I am really getting tired of being called a racist when I just wish people would do their fucking jobs and stop stealing from the system.
And now they are changing all of the Obamacare rules because they passed a bill they never friggen read.
No shit!
So riddle me this:
Supreme Court rules that Corporations are "people" and afforded all protections under law as an individual. Right.
Well, the Administration exempts Corporations of the mandate.
So, how exactly am I equally protected under law by still being held to the fucking mandate?
Soviet Brainwashing Guide
The Brainwashing Manual by L. Ron Hubbard
I wonder, do you factor in the infinitely longer list of non-blacks who have commited the worst crimes in government positions this past century or two, those high in the military ranks, or who own the media, those who run your home cities, the last heads of state, and those before it, etc.?
or just the black ones you see on TeeVee?
Oh I factored them in, alright.
Just like they factored me.
I'm not sure where you were going with it though.
I was pointing out that the wake up call isn't being heeded with 43% of my brothers of darker complexion and stirring debate as to the cause.
while I was replying to the poster who "wasn't racist until" Obama, and his list of irritants, your reply also implies a massive proportion of blame while leaving some convenient others of your hate list.
this arbitrary, imaginary "43%" figure is guaranteed to keep you pre-occupied. the "cause" isn't racial, however much you might be fed a story that it is.
the "cause" is historical. look up, they're the ones pulling the strings.
Fair point to consider. No argument here.
And of course, as most of us know, there is no salient difference between the two parties for all practical purposes.
Casting this particular issue as red versus blue is a futile exercise. This is really the statists versus the people.
Yes. Red and Blue teams have the same owners. This is Owners vs the People.
It's one big club and we ain't in it.--George Carlin
Red or green?
Christmas!
Every comment board, including Yahoo, Guardian and this one, for the most part has been overwhelmingly pro Snowden and anti .gov since this blew up.
Any poll that shows different is bullshit.
There could be a difference between those who will comment and those who only answer surveys and for that matter those who do not comment or answer surveys.
And meanwhile, the NSA has been collecting information in respect to energy from Latin American allies.
What the hell does that have to do with terror or self defence
But who are we to criticize, we are only the people, right? We don't have the capability to make decisions or follow through do we?
It is about time we put a stop to this bs.
http://news.yahoo.com/report-us-spy-program-eyes-135545696.html
Thats odd, my intel says 50% think he's a plant and the other half think he's a whistleblower, and the half who think he's a whistleblower are all young or 'highly specialized'.
Not sure I follow this part...
and the half who think he's a whistleblower are all young or 'highly specialized
Care to tease that bit out a little more?
no
Asshole says no. Well, go hug a nut, range rider. Glad we had this discussion.
We don't know for sure, and I've not made it a habit to make my mind up quickly regarding anythhing. Frankly, we have to entertain the possibility that he is a limited hangout.
Barack Obama’s administration has been pressuring other countries not to grant Snowden asylum, and U.S. officials who have called him a traitor include House Speaker John Boehner, an Ohio Republican. – Poll
Perhaps Justin Raimondo (Antiwar.com) sums up the Snowden unveiling best: If the U.S. should capture Snowden, the result would likely be Snowden capturing the U.S. Specifically, the public uproar would be so great that the Diane Feinstein’s would be transformed from prosecutors to defendants.
Snowden sounded the alarm for patriot Americans: run or fight. Decade after decade the American people have been bullied by this banker controlled government until today the people have lost any representation in their government. Mostly it is about individual and states’ rights, whether the people and the states or the iron fist of the central government shall control.
Snowden’s revelations, for which he is giving his life, are no scare. They are the real thing. And the 55+ percent are facing up to the trouble. If Snowden is run down by Obama’s and Boehner’s thuggish outlaws, if they kill him, it was because he was honest when they wanted him to be otherwise.
We’ve got to face it. We’re up against killers. And you don’t try to reason with men and women who are trying to kill you. If they’ll come for Snowden, eventually they will come for you.
If we want to remain civilized, we’re going to have to fight to protect America from these internationalists who “care not who makes America’s laws,” or all the civilized world as we knew it will be dead, and “we will be back in the darkness of savagery.”
Excellent words JR
i don't remember where I read this, but it's worth repeating: being called a traitor by dick cheney is the highest honor an American can receive.
Snowden said that:
http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/06/17/edward_snowden_nsa_leaks_...
If memory serves me, I think Paul Newman alluded to the same about Nixon.
They didn't include breakout for Cheesepope demographic:
Would that be a return for 100% believe he is Kosher and money well spent? Or 100% of them feel he betrayed the betrayers and them by extension?
So the question remains.
Regardless of what Snowden is or is not, it is apparent the world's biggest "terrorist" organization is headed by the White House.
There are nukes, biological weapons, tomahawk cruise missles and so much more in its arsenal and we know torture, secret prisons and stuff like that are the order of the day. And we can't forget about the lies, there are so many we don't know where to start, do we?
Maybe God is getting pissed off and the reserve currency will somehow be replaced by something else. We all know the allmighty dollar rules, to a point that is....
Anyone of late who occupies America’s executive office has become an executive in crime, evil. He and the Congress and their “supreme court” conduct government as the Mossad or Mafia conduct their business operations, utterly ruthlessly.
These Fed operatives are carefully selected criminal types; totally selfish with a complete disregard for liberty, for the rights of others to either life or property.
This nation originally was shaped by men and women of heroic mold, not, as Louis L’Amour said, by “those soft-bellied ones who come later and find it easy to refer to such things beyond their own grasp (the principles and men that created American achievement) as myth.”
The stuff of which myth is made is hard reality, "the very stuff of life itself"; the men who make the fight, the Edward Snowdens and Julian Assanges and Ron Pauls... the Tyler Durdens.
Well put, cherry picker.
+1
For...
The stuff of which myth is made is hard reality, "the very stuff of life itself" -- JR
Wish I had written this... well said. May I quote you?
You can be against big government and government spying on individual Americans, and still think that Snowden went too far. I supported him as a whistle-blower, but when you give away secrets of US interests and methods for collecting information from other (often hostile) governments, one can be forgiven for thinking he crossed the line to becoming a traitor. Remember, in the real world, things are often not neatly divided into good/bad, right/wrong or whistleblower/traitor. Also remember that the minority's opinion in this country is often wrong.
Seriously?
Yes. All I'm trying to say is that as much as I hate the government, there is some ambiguity to his actions. I'm not calling him a traitor, but this is tricky. And I realize I am in the minority here, even if I was fully behind him at first.
Pair-trade or hedge, you make the call.
Fucking wonderful. Also remember that in the real world journalists are incinerated in their vehicles for what they know.
Yes, agreed, it sure does look that way.
But do you think the US should not be spying on the Chinese? Is there no limit to what he should divulge about the US's activities.
What's the point? They shipped all of the jobs to them. The corporations, by doing just that is what made them a superpower while pandering to WS/bankster greed. So what, now regrets?
FTA
I completely agree. But the Chinese are hacking us everyday, and I still favor the US over China, and hope you do too. I'm trying to make a nuanced point here, not arguing in favor of all of the US's activities. I am just as upset as everyone on this board with the spying on Americans and over-collecting of data. It scares the shit out of me.
+1
Because I get your point...
But, simply stated he should release as much information as possible. If any be held back, under present circumstances, it will be used against us. The more we know the better. Period. The Chinese are more familar with NSA operational capabilities than us. We need to know. But I do understand your point vis a vie the great game.
And publicly expose.
And you thought it was just the Clintons...
I wonder who these 34% are ...
Thats the right question. What is the raw data upon which these claims are based? Did the author accost 9 people in the elevator at Faux News? Did said respondants In NY or SLC, am or pm? Or did they 'poll' 100 people who had landlines in Ohio, and no caller id or boring enough to answer the phone anyway? What were the questions? What order were the questions in, did they lead? Did any of the questions indicate whether these people could do basic logic? What is a 'black voter'? Did they self identify, or is this based on the prejudiced interpretatoion of the person conducting the survey, who needed to complete that blank in order to get paid?
Honorable Ohioans who know better, especially those that might work for defense contractors (and know to keep their mouths shut or quit).
Those Ohioans have caller id and don't answer calls from social engineers.
I wonder how many people voted twice...
The Black voters that monad can't ID...and incidentally the same who take exception for being asked for one before they vote.
Faulty poll, since it doesn't leave the option for calling him something other than traitor but not "hero".
Would be interested to know how much of the DoD-dependent areas of Ohio went, since the Dayton metro area is heavily-invested in that (thanks to the departures of NCR or GM).
Well put.
SNOWDEN FOR FBI CHIEF !!!
Ha!: On Santa Monica beach, my wife and I were recently acousted by a group (6) of college age proselytizers for an evangelical something or other. An enjoyable Q&A went back and forth. At some point I asked what they thought of Edward Snowden. N O N E of them knew who/what he was (one Ooogled it right there). I said "Dewdles! Ewe outa touch!" Then I asked if our gimmemint was a "Christian" gimmemint, I got a guarded "yes", I asked why does the Christian motivated gimmement have the need to monitor and record all their phone and compurter activity .... "They do that?" .....
Mocking Christians doesn't seem to be the answer. Take God out of America and you get Declaration-of-Independence-denier Elena Kagan. You can’t have the law of the land in the hands of someone like Elena Kagan.
And we won’t!
A socialist, secularist America will not be a superpower.
At this point in America, Obama’s and Boehner’s Fed-ordered amnesty and rapid slide into world redistribution of American-made middle class wealth is economic and cultural suicide for America.
Multinational corporations have the immediate benefits from these policies that have put America on the road to serfdom, dead ending in one-world central control by secularist bankers; American citizens have an immediate disaster.
Globalist corporations such as MicroSoft and JP Morgan will use their power grab to become even more powerful in the world while a socialist America begins to decline in its superpower status.
Socialism doesn’t work for a free people. Lenin/Trotsky proved it; Stalin/Trotsky proved it; Mao proved it; the Clintons, the Bushes and the Obamas are proving it.
What worked for America was “an early primary history of the Pilgrims' spirit of adventure, free enterprise, and devotion to religious freedom…”. -- Gov. William Bradford.
And....if you read Bradford's book on the Plymouth settlement, they actually gave socialism a go early on - common town farm worked at by 'those that could' and fruits absorbed by all that couldn't. Once enough people starved, the idea was scrapped and each home had it's own garden which they had to work and people truly in need, oddly enough, were amply taken care of. But, this socialism experiment seems to be the definition of crazy - humans will keep trying it always expecting a different result................
And now, in the post-Plymouth era, in addition to creating starvation, imposed socialism leads to despotism, massive corruption and war.
Dexter, in this short and sweet gem you’ve summed up what it takes most others to do in 500 words. Thx!!
NP. I get lucky once in a great while.
I know luck when I see it, dexter. And this ain't it. :-)
Well, I know many people like this, not all of them are Christians, or at least not as evangelical as these you met, so that 'head in the sand' disease is not exclusive to these types you ran in to. And, some of the ones I have encountered, once informed of these facts, actually think it's a good thing the gimmement is monitoring us all..........
Having said that, true Christians can be more prone to the 'head in the sand' disease since after all a Christian's true citizenship is not of this world, and the best government for them is one that stays out of their business as much as possible, like what the 1st amendment was written to for.
Perhaps it was just the fourth comming up, but services in my hometown Methodist church (parents) were overtly pro-gubbmint patriotic. Given the local employment opportunities, this is perhaps not so surprising. But Lee Greenwood videos?
another snowden thread and no mention of russ tice ..... just sayin'.
(as for 'limited hangout'... it's all about the gub'mint/statist control and no mention of beyond black corporate access to all this information)
What percentage of Government workers included in poll?
Odd isn't it.
So far Mr. Tice's bag of goodies trumps Snowdens. Still watching. And being watched, apparently.
Scary that 34% think it's a bad thing to point out constitutional infringements by the gubmit.
D'oh......forgot that a) constitution is no longer relevant, and b) its been being shredded for years by both parties as in latest 2nd amendment attempted shredding, patriot act, drones, ad nauseum......
For those keeping score at hpme we have our 3 government whistleblowers; Assange, Manning and Snowden. None have revealed anything earth shattering and all are very much alive.
Then we have Hastings...
A few things I infer from the poll. Many blacks are incredibly racist. Can one imagine how different the poll would look if the whistleblower was black and the president was white?
Women's suffrage was a component to the end of the republic. Always desiring more paternalism from the state yet emasculating real men all the time.
I watched the snowden interview yesterday. He looks tournmented.
34% = traitors
Here is a good interview with the original NSA whistleblower Russel Tice on RT's Breaking the set, interview starts at 15 min in.
MUST WATCH.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnE9fkWKVW8
" Snowden: towards an endgame" by Pepe Escobar 7/9/13
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-01-090713.html
Ps. This is perhaps the best... geopolitical journalist[!!!] in the free world! jmo
www.atimes.com/
Yep, Escobar and also several others on ATimes are some of the best. ATimes has long been a treasure trove of excellent geo-political analysis from its offices in the heart of Kowloon/HK.
And he got this spot on: "Western Europe is a poodle wasteland..."
But methinks his suggested Snowden options of getting to Latin America missed one out: Eastwards out of Moscow. But that may have been intentional. Also, it is possible that Snowden pops up in Caracas and nobody in Obama's US can work out how he got there. That may be what's going on ...
"Spengler" is still a bigoted douche.
Is there book on Snowden making it to asylum? A dead pool?
Disregarding the creation of bubbles as ponzi schemes is what got us here.
Threw in your chips. Blazed your way into a couple more zeros at the end of the boom and then some, while the placed burned all around you rich-on-paper GI Joes.
Now, the crying begins and everyone else is to blame (the bitches, the lazy kids, stupid politicians, the poor and desperate...everybody but ~you~
Hypocrits. Money whores are still whores.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jrrqb99Dt7Q
34% of population either stupid or uninformed.
Trattoria maybe?
"Fool me twice, can't get fooled again" -gwb 43