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As BitCoin Touches $400 The Senate Starts Seeking Answers... As Does The Fed
Moments ago BitCoin hit $395, and will likely cross $400 in the immediate future (the chart looks a little less scary in log scale).
So as more and more pile into the electronic currency, some due to ideological reasons, some simply to chase momentum, some out of disappointment with the manipulated gold price looking to park their savings in an alternative, non-fiat based currency, which a year ago traded 40 times lower, the attention of the government is finally starting to shift to what has been the best performing asset class in the past year, outperforming even the infamous Caracas stock market.
Which means one thing: Congressional hearings.
The U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs will meet on Nov. 18 “to explore potential promises and risks related to virtual currency for the federal government and society at large,” it said in a statement today.
The hearing, titled “Beyond Silk Road: Potential Risks, Threats, and Promises of Virtual Currencies,” will invite witnesses to testify about the challenges facing law enforcement and regulatory agencies, and include views from “non-governmental entities who can discuss the promises of virtual currency for the American and global economies.”
“Bitcoin is obviously getting a lot of attention from the federal
government on the regulatory side,” Nicholas Colas, an analyst at ConvergEx Group, said in an interview. “Given the involvement of the currency in illegal activities, that is entirely warranted. I expect these hearings to be largely informational, which is good for Bitcoin.”
“The architecture of the system is elegant from a computer-science perspective, but hard for a non-tech person to understand,” Colas said. “Getting industry professionals to close this gap will be very helpful.”
Or not. Because the only thing the government does when its interest is piqued by something, anything, especially things that have to be looked in log-scale, is to promptly regulate it and then tax it, not necessarily in that order. Just how it will achieve this with Bitcoin remains unclear but one thing is certain: it will try.
Especially, now that even the Fed is looking at BitCoin when a few days ago the Chicago Fed issued 'Bitcoin: A primer" in which the Fed states quite simply:
So far, the uses of bitcoin as a medium of exchange appear limited, particularly if one excludes illegal activities. It has been used as a means to transfer funds outside of traditional and regulated channels and, presumably, as a speculative investment opportunity. People bet on bitcoin because it may develop into a full-fledged currency. Some of bitcoin’s features make it less convenient than existing currencies and payment systems, particularly for those who have no strong desire to avoid them in the first place. Nor does it truly embody what Hayek and others in the “Austrian School of Economics” proposed. Should bitcoin become widely accepted, it is unlikely that it will remain free of government intervention, if only because the governance of the bitcoin code and network is opaque and vulnerable.
Finally, while the Fed may be late to the game, the ECB has already made its feelings on BitCoin well-known long ago: recall from over a year ago: "The ECB Explains What A Ponzi Scheme Is; Awkward Silence Follows" in which the European central banks didn't mince its words: BitCoin is nothing but a ponzi scheme to the central bank tasked with preserving the viability of an entire insolvent continent, and a a currency which unlike BitCoin would never survive absent regulatory intervention.
So while the electronic currency is soaring exponentially as it goes through its appreciation golden age, will the one thing that can finally end the dream of BitCoin holders arrive soon: when the government, and existing monetary authorities, start taking it seriously.
Full Chicago Fed paper on BitCoin
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Sounds like circular logic to me. I guess the internet isn't really a "real" source of information since it simply gives access to information. The idea is to have information with no controls right? You speak in riddles. I'm trying to gain and spread understanding not muddy the pool. Sorry for stirring you up.
And that's fair enough, and you should be in a position to make your own choice in these regards, however that's also a substantially tempered argument compared to others in this thread.
Certainly, I'm just pointing out what it is and is not...and how authority will attack it.
They always seek to regulate, control, tax, restrict or ban. They have legions of fiat paid wonks & geeks eyeballing this thing. Its a conduit for money and as such they will seek control over it.
Again, I'm not against it but I fear people are "levering" a whole lot of faith in it to escape state control, when it may very well be the state itself setting people up to accept the idea of a one world digitized credit/currency system.
I like the idea of its anonymity in exchange, not so much that it relies on something else to facilitate the exchange.
Fanatical adoration and faith in anything is always dangerous. I certainly would never liquidate all my assets and buy just PMs. Though I do not personally participate in Bitcoin, I appreciate the anonymity and the attempt to circumvent a fascistic Government hell bent to tax and or data mine every transaction of the citizenry. I admire those who have drawn a line in the sand and hope they succeed in keeping this viable. Many of us are waiting and watching.
Miffed;-)
There are a lot of moving parts with this thing and its hard to separate the good actors from the bad re: BitCoin.
My own N-Sense tingles danger for anyone with a lot of real money tied up in it. Some would say its a Pump & Dump for good reason but I know some involved are in it for the right reasons, not necessarily for their own profit.
It's obvious the "authorities" have caused many to seek an alternative by their very own actions. As long as those actions continue, people will look for something else.
BITCOIN crash explained; why 2013 --->
http://cosmicconvergence.org/?p=13
2013: The Chinese Year of the Black Water SnakeMaster, is that you?
I tend to forget about the "price" of Bitcoin, Gold and Silver. The denominator in that equation is a theoretical floating point hell-bent upon it's own destruction.
In the end, it's just the Gold-Silver-Bitcoin ratio that counts.
It's approaching one... and fast. Currently one ounce of gold is about 3.5 bitcoins. See www.ounce.me
i like the idea of currency which can not be controlled by a central bank or a hand full of bankers, however can we really trust our life savings to code which can eventually be hacked?
BitCoin is useful for making payments at a distance.
Gold is useful for saving wealth.
hh,
interesting idea, and, i support competing currencies.
however, from what i gather from the video, berkshares are pegged to the dollar at a 5% discount (21 berkshares = 20 $usd), so they will suffer the same fate of the dollar, inflation / devaluation.
better if they had designed it to be local commodity based, such as 1 berkshare = 1oz of locally grown maple syrup, or something of the sort, and free from the taint of central bank fiat.
As my kid points out, market forces in the local community are in control of the exchange rate with the dollar, which could change as the USD is devalued. 20:19 could easily become 20:99.
There is absolutely no correlation between Berkshares and Bitcoin. Berkshares are dollar denominated coupons. AlJaz story is obfuscatory BS.
So fucking sad you have to go to aljazeera to get real news. Just sad.
fuck the fed. barter!
Isn't it though. I don't know how many interviews I have had to watch on RT because the zionist money changers don't allow such discussions on all the media they have stolen.
Try just for a day.
Try finding serious news on US media.
Try logging into offshore search engines.
Ever try?
You're likely to redirected elsewhere.
Try finding hard news on the telly.
Nope.
Radio.
A little better, but all politicized, somebody down some rabbit hole trying to convince you its reality.
Try ....
Oh neverthefucmind
You cannot get there from here.
Be afraid and aware.
Very aware.
May tomorrow be the most beautiful day of your life, that your breakfast will taste better than any meal you or I have ever tasted.
FERAL Reserve Banks.
HH said: "What will The Federal Reserve Banks, and their lapdog federal politicians, do when more people start using a local currency like the hippies terrorists in Western Massachussets?"
Banker's response:
"If that mischievous financial policy,[interest free colonial script money], which had its origin in the North American Republic, should become indurated down to a fixture, then that government will furnish its own money without cost. It will pay off debts and be without a debt. It will have all the money necessary to carry on its commerce. It will become prosperous beyond precedent in the history of civilized governments of the world. The brains and the wealth of all countries will go to North America. That government must be destroyed or it will destroy every monarchy on the globe."
Source: The Flaming Sword, Vol. XII September 2, 1898
I admit, it is all rather Frothy right now in the bitcoin world. Still, I didn't believe back in March when it hit $266 before crashing that it would regain and far surpass before the end of the year.
http://bestbitcoinsites.wordpress.com
Let Bitcoin sink or swim on its own merits and subject to the judgment of the markets.
I think its major test will lie in its ability to be subjected to some form of transaction reporting so that it is not used as a medium for evasion.
WTF??
Evading government theft is one of the better reasons for using Bitcoin.
There are limits to all things inluding government, evasion, illegal activities but not stupidity. So we have to be careful we don't go overboard with Bitcoin because then it will be destroyed for the wrong reasons.
everything that weakens the grip of those who would claim to be our masters / slaveowners, should be supported, and i will support it, as should all free men.
bitcoin is a means, not an end.
It's the perfect currency for people with bi-polar disorder.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYNS5Abazto
Yup, blow off top.
But it's the third blow off top for bitcoin in 3 years.
And each time, bitcoin has had its normal price exceed the high of the top in 9 months to a year. And then go on to 5-10X higher. If this top follows that pattern, we could get over $1K USD/XBT before the pop.
Learn the mining cost incentives and dynamics and realize the price will move much higher.
I'm well aware. I was in the top 100 miners of btcguild until the last couple weeks, and still in the top 500 for mining and shares..
Another couple years and the scarcity really begins.
I hover around #200 :)
Must be nice! I assume that's over 1 TH/s? I'm running about 600GH/s at the moment, and stunned that my BFL units (thanks to the exchange rate) actually have positive ROI now...
yes in the Th club and seems it is starting to get more members... atleast BFL actually shipped you something
There's a lot of new capacity showing, and it's only going to get worse. Until this past week I assumed I'd be negative ROI forever on the equipment and see negative operating profits around late January. Now things don't look quite so bad.
I was assuming my money was lost to fraud by BFL and then the units showed in mid-September, early enough that I got a pretty good head start before the difficulty increases got out of hand. I'd pulled my GPU miners offline in January so it felt good to be getting some coin again.
I have a strong suspicion that BFL was paid to be be slow in delivery. I'd love to have supoena powers over BFL, I'm quite sure it would be very enlightening not only about them but most other ASIC suppliers.
Any recommendations on FPGA hashers? There's such a huge market now, it's getting tedious to sift through their datasheets.
U.S. Senate - totally corrupt institution filled with criminal scum. There might be 10 or 15 decent ones but the rest like Boxer, Schumer, Feinstein, Blumenthal, McCain, and a bunch of others are scum.
Freddie +1000 for you my friend.
Our Senate is a bunch of scum sucking pigs. Execution before torture would be too good for them.
Is there such a thing as a virtual drone strike?
The NSA is preparing to launch one now.
I didn't even know they were unionized. ;)
"blow off top..." -- jaap
I'll take that bet. Bitcoin is heading much higher.
love this bullshit about people funding crime with it. and they don't with Fiat? morons.
Drug money laundering by the banks is the big 'open secret'.
how dare you malign the good name of the banks, which are pillars of the economy and our society, with such unfounded accusations.
i say, how dare you, sir!
unfunded
The Obama-McCain-Rubio-Schumer push for amnesty and open borders is pro-drug cartels.
Worked wonders for Reagan. US Pop 1980, 226M...US Pop 1990, 248M...there are ~900k net births per year in the US...the extra 12M souls were immigrants.
"Secret" Wink Wink.
While I am certain there are people much smarter than me involved with this and other virtual currencies... okay, perhaps there are not people much smarter than me... In any event, I think I prefer my wealth in tangible assets... something about hearing the clink, or surveying the land, that is fundamentally appealing...
Succumb not to the FUD.
yet you gave up the gossip fence for pixels?
is not the zh comments a pixelated gossip fence friend?
See if you can spot the day on this Bitcoin price chart that Bart Chilton resigned from the CFTC. Nothing to see here folks.
http://tradewithdave.com/?p=19115
Damnit.. shhh! Also screw the Fed and the Senate/House.. I'd like to bet in the end, they will never truly figure out why bitcoin is just worth more than the continuing worthless judefetzen they keep defending.
The Fed citing to Hayek is really ripe. What would be more in keeping with Austrian principals? PMs maybe? Can't go there though can we.
Fucking bastards.
FEC to allow political contributions in BitCoin.
Find an easy way to bribe a Washington D.C. politician and you've got a business. BitCoin rules.
Exactly they will demonize it while using it to bypass campaign finance laws to buy off and allow to be bought off in bitcoins since one can slide into and out of bitcoins outside the swift system if they so want with a few shell companies and people place in the right geographical locations. Never underestimate these things being used in this sort of manner. Dual edged nature of a sword.
Yes, very observant. There will never be a complete ban on CA$H, Bitcoins or the equivalent. Crooked Congressmen, judges, cops all need a way to keep their payments from becoming known.
Yep and away from the prying eyes of certain 3 letter agencies. They will just try to make it as unusable for the average schmuck as possible while they can take full advantage of it.
Why "BTFATH" in this Bitcoin thing when you can buy real gold ON SALE...??
The main reason of many is that it has been going up 40 times per year.. The second reason is that its estimated value as a world currency is $795,000 per BitCoin.
Hmmm... dunno. How is bitcoin also not a fiat currency (albeit one whose mode of growth is more disciplined)? Dollars are paper that someone says are worth something. Bitcoins are bits that someone says are worth something. Both are only worth something if someone else will take them.
Bitcoin looks to me like the classic serial ponzi -- goes up and up and up until everyone's in, then kersplash. Seems to be prone to bubble and pop. Strikes me personally as nuts.
True. Same goes for Gold and everything else.
SOMEHOW, I suspect that real gold coins will always be far, far more widely accepted than "Bitcoins" ever will be.
Money is "the most widely accepted commodity." ~ Mises
I can convert bitcoin to fiat a helluva lot faster, and more privately than I can gold.
But, I have been using to profits from swing trading BTC to buy gold over the past several weeks.
This stuff is so 1999.
If this is the case, why is it that businesses are lining up to accept Bitcoin and no businesses are announcing they're accepting gold for payment?
that is not true... Car dealers and auto after market manufacturers are accepting GOLD for payment of their goods.... I know I will work for gold and silver too... No one offers to pay me in AU and AG though
It's the flavor of the month so to speak. Three major problems with Bitcoin, the first is the fact that it is finite. The total number is known and the date when the number is hit is also known. What then?
Second, the average joe has no idea how to use it, for it to be real money it must be easily used by everyone, this is not the case.
Third, the power required to mine it will eventually be so great that it will eat up most of the value of what is mined. Unless of course you plan on tapping systems and power supplies that do not belong to you. Then we've crossed over into the crimes.
"first is the fact that it is finite"
I suppose you would prefer some higher power like Bernanke to print away the value you have accrued?
"average joe has no idea how to use it"
He couldn't use computers in 1980 either but just look how far little average Joey has come now? Or maybe the computers just got easier to use, that's probably it. Technology tends to do that, bitcoin not excluded.
"the power required to mine it will eventually be so great that it will eat up most of the value of what is mined"
Ah yes, supply and demand be damned. It surely won't work. Free markets, such a silly idea.
Only time will tell. For the rest of us there is the option to study the underlying technology and features keeping an eye out to satisify needs and desires in the marketplace.
Yeah, except when someone hits the light switch gold doesn't go away.
I keep hearing this. And I understand what you mean.
But if the lights DO go out, so doesn't most of the fiat. And then all hell breaks loose.
For a pretty long while (probably longer than our timeline) gold won't mean shit either.
Knowing when to convert it all to food, land and/or bullets is kind of the key isn't it?
To a certain extent you are correct. The government and the Federal Reserve Bank currently has a monopoly on what is considered legal tender. If the power goes out - or any calamity for that matter - then all bets are off. People will use anything to barter. Food and fuel will be king. And cigarettes and booze and pot and and D cell batteries and clean water or ways to make it. Bitcoins are the off-the-grid currency du jour. Tomorrow it could be bottles of Dasani water. But I do believe that gold and silver will always remain in favor because of their scarcity. Silver is a great anti microbial as an example and therefore somewhat medicinal. Gold has a long track record of trade, as in thousands of years before electricity. One thing can be said, the dollar will be useless except as toilet tissue.
yes and also ZH will go away too along with your tripe comments!!! win!!!
Gold is famously decorative and extremely useful in electronics (when not too expensive). It also remains gold even in the absence of electricity. Not that I am a gold bug, but gold has intrinsic value.
"Fiat" means that something has value only because I say so. It means "let there be" in Latin. There can be better or worse fiat currencies, less or more abused, but bitcoin is fiat currency.
You need to separate gold as a commodity from gold as a currency. If gold were only used for electronics and not as a currency it's price would be much lower. Most all of it's value is attributed to the fact that due to it's properties as an element, it is one of the best accounting systems that humans have come up with. The fact that it also happens to be a tangible object that you can use to produce certain things is nearly irrelevant to it's current market price.
The traditional definition of fiat is usually 'currency by government decree'. This implies much more force than you let on in your personal definition. It's an, either you pay your 'taxes' in this currency we just made up or we come for you, type situation. Certainly not free choice or free market by any means. No one is going to kidnap you and attempt to take control over your life if you don't use bitcoins.
so when the 'lights go out' gold is useful in electronics??
stacker logic on display
depend on the net for bc=depend on oil to power the coin....whenthe oil is gone how do you access the bc? price of gold will only go up without fossils used to recover it...in the meantime I guess u could come over to my gossip fence and talk gold n silver
Now that you mention it my cable internet modem is running low on dino juice as we speak. Time to fill er up. Oh darnit, looks like the pull start cord broke again.
WTF are you talking about? ROFL, I gave you an up arrow for entertainment value.
You obviously have no idea where your power comes from, another naive innocent born into an age where things magically appear at the flip of a switch without any physical effort on your part. Numb to consequence and dumb as a fucking rock.
Contrary to your gut feeling of where your power might come from, the data says otherwise. Oil is less than 5% of electricity generation in the world. Guess you have no idea.
Bitcoin is a stateless, voluntary, fixed supply currency. The opposite of fiat.
Same goes for Gold and everything else.
Gold and silver have a tad bit longer history than fiat and bitcoin...
So does human slave trade. Your point?
So you're saying that using gold and silver for currency is equal to slavery? You're real bright, aren't you?
How is bitcoin also not a fiat currency?
Oh, let's see:
There may be more, but I haven't a lot of time.
LEARN!
Inherently limited supply.
No it isn't since it is divisible infinitely though at the moment the software is limited to 8 decimal places.
On a long enough timeline the survival rate for bitcoin drops to 0 like everything else.
Let me explain by doing some simple math. As we know bitcoin is asset backed it is backed by various fiat currencies that can grow infinitely though in reality there is a finite limit where confidence is lost and people stop using them usually when they inflate into unusable for pricing purposes.
So with that in mind bitcoin value can be simply stated as amount of bitcoins/amount of fiat assets backing them. or simply BC/FA.
Since FA can grow infinitely let's call it x and since BC is 'limited' let's use the number 21, it can be any number as long as it is a fixed number. This is what happens when BC reaches peak coins since it is infinitely divisible and the fiat backing it can grow infinitely.
So BCV = BC/FA let's do a few calculations.
BCV = 21/1 = 21
BCV = 21/7 = 3
BCV = 21/21 = 1
BCV = Limit x ->inf 21/x = 0
So as you can see the value of bitcoin on a long enough timeline with an inflationary by nature fiat currency(s) backing it will eventually go to 0 if confidence isn't lost in one or the other before that point.
Let's look at prices
Prices = Item Quantity (IQ)/BCV Let's use 21 again for IQ since it is a finite quantity.
P(1) = 21/21 = 1 BTC
P(2) = 21/3 = 7 BTC
P(3) = 21/1 = 21 BTC
P(inf) = 21/0 = undefined
That is exactly what you would expect when BTC is not worth anything, the price is indeterminate using bitcoin at that point.
My point is when BTC hits peak coin that it also hits it's peak value, it is not a ponzi since it has an absolute peak quantity which coincides with peak value and that value though not necessarily determinable is not hidden plus it can be timed when it does reach it by the transparent nature of the system since we always know how many coins are in the system at any given time. It goes to zero is it's ultimate fate at some point regardless of cyclical nature of monetary supply expansion and contraction since inflationary currency ultimately grows over the long term in an expansionary fashion. Either mathematically or when the confidence is lost it dies one way or the other. Nothing escapes death........
What goes up must go down, spinning wheel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kK62tfoCmuQ
So much fail, so little time, but "bitcoin is asset backed it is backed by various fiat currencies" is wrong from the get-go; nobody on Silk Road was talking about dollars or euros, it's directly accepted for goods, so it's more currency than your MasterCard.
It's almost a guarantee the sellers were converting it into their local currency to acquire more goods for sale and to feed themselves.
No it isn't, first off if it was a closed loop system it wouldn't be valued in fiat on the exchanges let alone speculated on. Secondly I trade my coin for a good aka commerce transaction then it gets traded again those goods or services still are valued based on some sort of conversion between fiat and bitcoin whether it is the exchange value or otherwise between the 2 parties. I'm not selling my weed for less in bitcoin than I could get for it selling it in cash in almost all cases and value will ultimately be derived based on some btc/fiat coversion. That bitcoin will always have a fiat equivalent convertable value because the global economic system prices in fiat right now. It has to in the early stages for people to even consider it money. That is how the phase in period works. It also will get recycled at some point into cash as it moves through the system and through hands. If it wasn't backed and being convertable to fiat is a form of asset backing it wouldn't be used for transactions period the way the current monetary system is designed. Bottom line it has to have a convertable dollar value that people agree upon and convertable into because that goes a long way towards getting people to use it seriously as money as opposed to being some monetary thought experiment simulation used by a few 'true believers'.
The availability of bitcoins in dollar denomination has zero effect on the number of bitcoins. Again, you fail right out of the box. Maybe thinking isn't your strong suit.
Two people mining their own coins and growing vegetables could create a market for those goods. It's that simple.
If that's too diificult for you to understand, then you probably shouldn't leave home without an adult.
I normally don't respond to inane comments but literally 0% of that made any sense. My best guess is that all of this is an uninformed rant based on the misunderstanding that divisibility is somehow equal to money printing, it's not. If Paul has 1 gold coin and I have 1 gold coin and Paul splits his gold coin into 2 pieces creating 2 half gold coins, that action doesn't devalue my whole gold coin. If Ben has 1 dollar and I have one dollar and then Ben prints 10 new dollars, that action devalues my dollar. But later on in the insanity that you call math your BC value holds constant, so which is it that you believe, do you think bitcoins are finite or not? Regardless of your opinion the fact is they are.
It appears that what you are calculating with BCV is the amount of bitcoins a dollar can buy you? Unfortunately you call this "the value of a bitcoin" which seems a little ass backwards. So you carry out the calculation and come to the conclusion that due to fiat inflation eventually a dollar will be worth about 0 bitcoins, okay that seems reasonable. Too bad you use that information to jump to the conclusion that since you can't buy bitcoins with worthless dollars anymore that bitcoins must also be valued at 0. Newsflash, people buy gold with dying fiat currency and when that dying fiat currency is dead, gold retains it's value because you can still purchase things with it, the transition happens over time. People are already starting to move away from the dollar as it approaches zero, they aren't going to just sit around and wait until it reaches 0 and then claim that everything ever purchased by a dollar is now valueless, holy shit.
Let me guess...Liberal Arts major?
Wow, and you missed the important one.
Because it has been legislated as the legal tender of the land.
Well, why don't you learn about BC first, before casting half-baked conclusions...
Yes, it is very similar to fiat in that BC also relies on the confidence of it's users. The critical difference, however, is that BC is neither managed nor diluted by a central authority such as the Fed, IMF or WB. This is a very significant difference b/t BC and traditional fiat. And in this difference BC also has something in common w/ PM's.
nuts = declaration w/o understanding.
They don't even understand the unique properties of BitCoin that can't be matched by any previous currency: you could (theoretically) set up subsets of BitCoins that you can vouge for being from particularly tagged sources, say "Known Not to Involve Child Slave Trade", so you could guarantee that your economic transactions are conducted with precision that you just can't do with gold, fiat, or barter. We're often told to "vote with our dollars" (especially in election years!), but what if you could really "speak" while spending?
It's lost on em though. Not shiny enough. Maybe we can hybridize BitCoins with those holographic authenticity fresnel-effect stickers and lure them away somehow.
Those unique properties are in fact the poison pill. Your example of it being taggable is exactly why it is a bag of shit. We need less controls not more. They will tag the fuck out of this thing to the point we will miss the good old days of paper. They will find a way to control it. Watch.
You vastly underestimate the difficulty of that task. Would you say the MPAA "controls" movie content, or just believes they do?
The MPAA can't drone your ass at will. The MPAA didn't just arrest the Dread Pirate Roberts and confiscate his horde of BTC. If they find that it is a legitimate contender, you will see the gloves come off. My opinion is that it will burn itself out after a sweet run.
Yes, they could; they are "shareholders" in the same Senators as the MIC after all.
The easiest way to prevent them from controlling it is to have a very large number of participants as well as dire economic effect should they remove the markets created by bitcoins.
Well then, it's mere speculation...guessing. You're supposed to buy things when the price is LOW, not BTFATH...why would any sane person - with limited capital to blow - buy something that has already risen 40x...?
Because they all know in their heart of hearts they'll be able to sell to a dumber schmuck at 50X!
You're approaching BC with an "investment" mentality. That is the entire problem. If I had to worry about that, I would never, ever, have purchased ANY gold at all. I have no ownership in BC but an cheering it all the way as an alternative -- any alternative -- to the crap that we are now calling our "money".
Why would anyone be against BC? It's their money if they want to use it in that form. It's absolutely none of my business who does what with their money or computing power. How could anyone be against a competitor to the U. S. so-called dollar? If you don't like the concept, just pass. Sheesh.
when did BTC become BC?
Since I became a 66 year old doddering fool.
ha!!
+100 Rocky At any point in time historically, free human beings were using a variety of things as money, cows in Africa, sea shells in the Pacific, gold and silver in .... etc. etc. Why the hell should any of us be upset with those who wish to use BTC as a meduim of exchange?
Now arguing about its investment value... proceed.
Did I say I'm "against" Bitcoin? No. I just think gold is a more reliable bet.
Point taken. I think it was more your denigration of anyone else's use of BTC that set me off. I'm sensitive you know. I just don't see either BTC (or gold for that matter) as a "bet". That's the current Wall Street philosophy, and see where it's gotten us.
A fine case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend eh?
BTFATH.. 12 hours after BTFD... either way you are still going to get rich.
http://shitco.in/2013/11/09/btfath/
Diversification.
Cartel bankers' next bubble investment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Max Keiser tweet: We are waiting to hear about a new MAJOR Bitcoin player news tomorrow... could boost price guidance.
Take your bitcoin profits now
jb
...in WHAT? Paper fiat "dollars"? Firewood? Gold?
ObamaCare premiums..........
Tide! (for the whitest whites and thus the ironiest? ironies)
Legit question.
Silver, if you can find an exchange system. When one unit an electronic currency is exchanging for a greater value than one ounce of silver you know that bitcoin is in a bubble or silver in being supressed by 2 thousand percent...
I prefer to hold the silver.
jb
Many places to buy PMs online with Bitcoins
Heres one..
https://www.goldsilverbitcoin.com/
Im sure many bigger cos. will begin to accept them
Not to advertise, but http://www.amagimetals.com/ takes bitcoin as payment. It's a great time to convert!
**
"Nicholas Colas, an analyst at ConvergEx Group, said in an interview. “Given the involvement of the currency in illegal activities, that is entirely warranted."
Hey Nick, Drug Cartel bosses dont have $Millions of $100 "Bitcoins" stuffed in rooms of their villa's all around the world...
Given the involvement of the currency in illegal activities....
If illegal activities were the criterion, the first currency to kill would be dollars.
Roubles are problably an ass-hair behind in 2nd place.
When I first glanced at your post, I thought it said, "Nicholas Cagesaid...."
I was going to finish the sentence, "...why am I not in this movie."
But it wasn't Cage. I have no idea who this Colas guy is.
he accepted bitcoins in Lord of War.... true story
"I'll be taking these Huggies...."
good luckmtrying to regulate bitcoin :)
All it will take is a digital bitcoin competitor that gets shiny endorsements from the government and corporate establishment. Perhaps one that offers "rewards" such as airmiles, and that's the end of the fairytale. What makes bitcoin different from the early stages of social media when Facebook was brand spanking new?
Right... because trust in gov't and corporations is just soooo strong right now. Folks are just flocking to those gov't-sanctioned solutions for everything.
And if you're comparing BC to Facebook, then you may well be beyond all hope/help.
All government cares about is confidence. They will not let it be undermined by nuisances such as bitcoin and gold. They will keep the game going as long as possible....or pull the plug on the internet (they likely do have a kill switch...and good luck getting a withdrawal).
Gov't can't conjure/will confidence... it is earned or eroded. TPTB can't wave their magic wand and declare 'full confidence' in their currency or anything else. And in case you haven't noticed, confidence in gov't at all levels is eroding rapidly... so in a sense you are betting against the trend, IMO.
I agree that they will TRY to keep the game going, but the duration/end of the game is not under their control... not even close.
An internet kill switch would be a bummer, but it isn't an effective tool of control/confidence... such a move would 1) backfire (horribly), and 2) ultimately fail, as the US gov't has VERY limited jurisdiction in a globallized society.
Hey! Those corporations make all the things you store your bitcoins on...oh...wait.
Ahh yes, I remember back when google single handedly invented and patented "math and numbers" back in 1998. Silly me, what was I thinking.
Sure, because you've got a cleanroom and gated oxide deposition equipment just laying around.
Apparently, you weren't thinking.
You must have misread my comment, see the part about "math and numbers"? That is where a bitcoin is both created and stored. I happen to have a large stack of 8.5"x11" paper just laying around over here that seems to retain any numbers I write onto it. I also tried rubbing my friends iphone against the numbers on the paper and it didn't appear that the silicon chips inside the phone could change anything I wrote down on the paper. Perhaps I am doing it wrong?
I just wrote down a really big number on a piece of paper, does that mean I'm rich now? No, it means that your analogy doesn't hold water.
Sorry if I assumed your understanding of bitcoin was as good as I thought it was. You seemed to be shooting down some of the FUD in here. Anyways, that wasn't an analogy so it doesn't have to hold any water. My point was that bitcoins are not reliant on computing technology and all it's possible failings. Bitcoin is reliant upon math that can be verified by humans with no machines necessary.
To clarify my example, again not an analogy but a real example, I can pick up a dice and roll out my own random private key and record it onto a piece of paper. I am not rich yet but I have just created a valid bitcoin address that anyone else can now send me money to. All without any possible risk of outside influence. That is until the NSA gets that pesky gravity gun working and can affect the outcome of my dice rolls remotely, haha.
Perhaps one that offers "rewards" such as airmiles, and that's the end of the fairytale.
They'd have to give away airplanes, not airmiles, to get people to leave bitcoin. Even then, you'd have a centralized system which is what bitcoiners originally wanted to get away from.
Where is the donate in bitcoin button on zerohedge?
Hey Tyler, don't dismiss bitcoin as a medium of recieving donations. Then you can exchange it again for gold, if you will... but it is easier donating in bitcoin than it is in gold!
Unless you prefer GLD of course...
Btichez!
A number of us have been asking for that feature for a while.
In reality all Tyler has to do is publish an address somewhere, since donations don't buy any special features, there's no need to connect them to accounts.
Why not send your check directly to ABC Media?
I should have clarified -- all he needs to do is publish a bitcoin address. The point was to donate in bitcoin.
Agreed, that would be a welcomed addition.
bitcoin: great for money laundering for weapons, drugs, human trafficking - all those moral activities we aspire toward
None of those happen with dollars. None.
As usual, another moron putting the blame on the tool rather than the user.......
Then BC will be perfect for the CIA/NSA.
Idiot.
another wanna-be "gangsta", upset people are encroaching on "his turf".
fuck you. we will not be controlled by people like you or the ones wearing the boots you lick, dickhead.