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As BitCoin Touches $400 The Senate Starts Seeking Answers... As Does The Fed
Moments ago BitCoin hit $395, and will likely cross $400 in the immediate future (the chart looks a little less scary in log scale).
So as more and more pile into the electronic currency, some due to ideological reasons, some simply to chase momentum, some out of disappointment with the manipulated gold price looking to park their savings in an alternative, non-fiat based currency, which a year ago traded 40 times lower, the attention of the government is finally starting to shift to what has been the best performing asset class in the past year, outperforming even the infamous Caracas stock market.
Which means one thing: Congressional hearings.
The U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs will meet on Nov. 18 “to explore potential promises and risks related to virtual currency for the federal government and society at large,” it said in a statement today.
The hearing, titled “Beyond Silk Road: Potential Risks, Threats, and Promises of Virtual Currencies,” will invite witnesses to testify about the challenges facing law enforcement and regulatory agencies, and include views from “non-governmental entities who can discuss the promises of virtual currency for the American and global economies.”
“Bitcoin is obviously getting a lot of attention from the federal
government on the regulatory side,” Nicholas Colas, an analyst at ConvergEx Group, said in an interview. “Given the involvement of the currency in illegal activities, that is entirely warranted. I expect these hearings to be largely informational, which is good for Bitcoin.”
“The architecture of the system is elegant from a computer-science perspective, but hard for a non-tech person to understand,” Colas said. “Getting industry professionals to close this gap will be very helpful.”
Or not. Because the only thing the government does when its interest is piqued by something, anything, especially things that have to be looked in log-scale, is to promptly regulate it and then tax it, not necessarily in that order. Just how it will achieve this with Bitcoin remains unclear but one thing is certain: it will try.
Especially, now that even the Fed is looking at BitCoin when a few days ago the Chicago Fed issued 'Bitcoin: A primer" in which the Fed states quite simply:
So far, the uses of bitcoin as a medium of exchange appear limited, particularly if one excludes illegal activities. It has been used as a means to transfer funds outside of traditional and regulated channels and, presumably, as a speculative investment opportunity. People bet on bitcoin because it may develop into a full-fledged currency. Some of bitcoin’s features make it less convenient than existing currencies and payment systems, particularly for those who have no strong desire to avoid them in the first place. Nor does it truly embody what Hayek and others in the “Austrian School of Economics” proposed. Should bitcoin become widely accepted, it is unlikely that it will remain free of government intervention, if only because the governance of the bitcoin code and network is opaque and vulnerable.
Finally, while the Fed may be late to the game, the ECB has already made its feelings on BitCoin well-known long ago: recall from over a year ago: "The ECB Explains What A Ponzi Scheme Is; Awkward Silence Follows" in which the European central banks didn't mince its words: BitCoin is nothing but a ponzi scheme to the central bank tasked with preserving the viability of an entire insolvent continent, and a a currency which unlike BitCoin would never survive absent regulatory intervention.
So while the electronic currency is soaring exponentially as it goes through its appreciation golden age, will the one thing that can finally end the dream of BitCoin holders arrive soon: when the government, and existing monetary authorities, start taking it seriously.
Full Chicago Fed paper on BitCoin
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LOL, the world is searching for better Reserve currency.
Canary in the coal mine.
When everyone loose faith in the US dollar the Fed is done.
Mrs Debt-fire and the 12 PhD stooge economist can print all they want, burying the US dollar further.
All federal employees should be paid in bit coins because every now and then [on rare occasions] they do a bit of work...
All Federistas should be paid in bank reserve entries or Obamacare premium vouchers only.
Bitcoin is proof there's sucker born every second. The second it's regulated it will drop like a rock. It can and will be regulated through transaction reporting, and GPS sensors on transaction reporting devices. ( point of transaction devices and atms ect..)
I am calling PEAK STUPIDITY few weeks from now! lol
Regulation=Legitimacy
It will go up when the masses arrive.
And it will go up when it goes underground.
And it will go up when BTCs are stolen/lost. Demand>Supply
People would not use a potentially evaporating currency for very long. Faith>Demand.
Transaction reporting is already built into the protocol (duh!). Reporting devices are any computer with an internet connection. This is already released and running worldwide. They can dictate all they want but it will just get ignored all over the world.
Hubris comes before the bigger fall; know your enemy:
http://www.technologyreview.com/view/521521/bitcoin-vulnerability-could-allow-malicious-miners-to-seize-control/
Yeah, the "selfish miner" dilema discovered using game theory is being looked into. The end result of which would be centralization of mining power which is against Bitcoin ideals but not necessarily the end of the world.
use your brains. Bitcoin is just another manipulation/diversion against gold by powerz. AGAINST GOLD WHICH PRINTERS HATE SO MUCH. How come nobody tracks USD which were used to buy bitcoins? ha ha ha so you pay thousands of USD to get something even less tangible than papers itself? ha ha ha something tells me there will a lot of bitcoin "talk" in "media" soon ha ha ha
Because it is a real hassle exchanging gold for goods and services quickly over great distances. Bitcoin, from the ground up, is intangible. That's the main point which sets it apart from gold and silver and gives it special properties that gold and silver do not have.
You are not the first person to think Bitcoin is/was/could be a scam. Bitcoin has consistently proven itself since it began and is here for the long haul.
the fed can print USD and buy all bitcoins
What do you think would happen with the price if they tried?
two sides to that transaction... and one of them would have to WANT/ACCEPT $USD.
suckers accepting $USD for payment will become harder and harder to find in the future, IMO.
Some will say that no one is willing to accept $USD for the bitcoins.
The reality is that these clearing houses like MTGox make it incredibly difficult for people to cash out and get $USD in exchange for their bitcoins.
The $USD flows in, it never flows out. If it did, this little demonstration of how greedy and easily fooled internet libertarians are would end sooner rather than later.
That would drive the price of Bitcoin through the roof, making all the early adopters rich enough to buy all the PMs the banks are secretly chasing.
No, I don't think they'll do that.
They don't need to buy them. They can just keep confiscating them.
Well, I dont understand zou guys.
Bitcoin is a great idea, and no digital money has come so far. Its a nice bet against the dollar, since strangely see the dollar rising.
It doesnt hurt to have an account with a few Bitcoins in it.
Nobody knows where it will go from here... or did you guys invest in Stratasys and DDD a few years ago ... guess not ... but you should have
Bitcoin pushing is at an all time high right now.
I`ve seen it mentioned multiple times in my newsfeeds.
Maybe those massive early insiders are trying hype it to cash out some of their "investment". Who knows.
Of course they are. But you see they will cash out and they will regret it within 6 months. FED print 20 MCAPS of Bitcoin every month
All it will take is one of the big holders of bitcoins to decide to get out while the getting is good, and all this comes to an end. The markets for bitcoin are tiny and there's no way they could survive a big fish cashing out.
on one post you say no one can get money out of exchange but then this post you say easy to cash out... you are a total toolface
Anyone with a brain and a bunch of bitcoins would use several of the exchanges to move the large amount of coins. As i'm sure you know, people with a lot of money don't have to follow the same rules that you and I do.
bitcoin @345. So much for $400. Sucks to be anyone who bought in at the peak.
Xeno's too busy strumming the pink canoe to formulate any cogent thoughts. Par for the course, as usual.
This is interesting. I am starting to sense fear amongst the writers here. Just as we can see in various US media. "This just cant be true" "It cant work" "It must be fraud" "Its dangerous" etc etc. Isee a lot of fear right now. Rightly so. The US dollar is on the brink of losing all trust. Nobody can trust a currency that is printed and reprinted by the Billions every month.
Federal Reserver Print More than 20 MCaps of Bitcoin every month". Think about that!
Buy the fear. Sell the euphoria. I see no euphoria in the hearts of all these ZH BTC haters.
"Hate all they want, so long as they pay their taxes."
-A Haig.
I still laugh when I think about Haig trying to assume command while Reagan was in surgery. Posterchild the Neocan AssClown Circus Brigade.
An associate of mine frequents strip clubs. He became so well known at local clubs that he started getting special treatment. One time he asked a girl during a private dance if he could have her panties after she got off work. She obliged. He started getting other dancer's panties and started selling them. After he started getting money for them, he even paid some of the strippers for their panties.
This gives me an idea. A new currency, Dirty Vegas Stripper Panties. There is a lot of legwork involved in mining the panties, giving them value. I'll even mark each panty with a hologram for authenticity. Since I'll have the master hologram, which can't be copied or reproduced, only my Dirty Vegas Stripper Panties will be acceptable as a medium of exchange. They are also easy to transport across borders and can be shipped by mail. You can also purchase an encrypted digital photo of a panty for exchange purposes, which will be linked to a physical panty stored in my vault. Giving digital DVSP a store of physical value.
At first the exchange value was $15 per panty, but then someone offered $30 for a single panty. News got out that somebody made a 100% profit in one transaction and interest in Dirty Vegas Stripper Panties exploded. Within days people were paying hundreds for one. With that kind of interest stores started accepting Dirty Vegas Stripper Panties for goods.
In an amazing turn of events I also created the first Dirty Vegas Stripper Panty ATM. Strippers could deposit panties for cash, with biometric security to make sure the depositor was really a Vegas stripper, and individuals could trade dollars for panties 24/7.
Sounds just like Bitcoin. In fact Dirty Vegas Stripper Panties are better because they are backed by a tangible commodity like gold.
uhhhh........
glad to see you got your order of Xanax in the mail
See kids? This is what happens when you drink and blog.
Hmmm....doesn't pass the sniff test.
@adr - always doesn't reason
Your dirty-old-man currency has a problem, of course. If someone decides to undercut you and get some cheap panties, have any old woman wear them - who would be the wiser?
Anyway, as you've demonstrated time and time again, critical thinking isn't your forte. Maybe you should try politics, I hear they take anyone who can fit into a suit.
Let bitcoin float freely against other currencies, and see what it does? No country, army, natural resources ect...Thats how to Legitimize bitcoin.
How to short bitcoins (if you really must) - Quartz
privacy+utility > gov't+military+resources
bitcoin is proving this right now.
Sorry, I don't get it, are you implying the BTC exchanges are faking their data?
Bitcoin is now officially the biggest threat to national security since the cuban missile crisis, they would be fools to ignore it.
Gold and Silver is up there to, but only if you are looking to transfer inter-generational wealth and avoid taxation.
Totally disagree.
If bitcoin was legit, TPTB would have put the kibosh on it already.
Bitcoin was created by TPTB... period.
Even if bitcoin goes to $1 million, I'll stick with PMs. The 5000+ year track record makes it a no-brainer.
i dont think so man, what I think is that Bitcoin wont last, but it doesn't need to last.
All it has to do is last long enough to make people consider it as an alternative.
Once it does that.
You already planted the seed in peoples minds that , hey "we can have an alternatve" that idea is more dangerous than gold/silver/bitcoins... w.e the Idea that "you have choices" you never want that to enter the minds of you slaves.
No better way for the corrupt nimrods of DC to declare their utter irrelevance than to hold hearings on Bitcoin, a technology and an idea which they can neither regulate nor capture. Keep playing your idiotic games, asswipes... the world is moving on without you.
http://www.howtoacceptbitcoin.com/2012/10/low-risk-international-payment...
By the way, stackers, nobody is suggesting that BTC can replace your PMs as a store of value!! (I had some silver myself before the tragic boating accident). It can, however, utterly short circuit the central banking strangle hold on power and the endless wars we are suffering in large part due to our dependence on inflationary central wank fiat. Sometime read a good history of money and understand the difficulties and limitations of metal as a circulating medium. A great deal of the history of money invoves the epic and endless difficulties with coin. Then came fiat...
BTC is an evolution. It's voluntaryist, uninflatable, fiat. It has the power to eventually render idiots like Bernanke absolutely fucking irrelevent, as well as make it much more difficult and dangerous for governments to finance wars (that would be a good thing).
Because we didn't have any wars when the world was using gold as money?
You really think the inflation comes from fiat? No it comes from CREDIT CREATION. Whether you create credit on top of gold, paper or bitcoin is totally irrelevant. Let There Be Bubbles!
To stabilise the world's monetary systems, creation of credit without full, 100% currency backing (gold,paper or bitcoin) has to be treated as the fraud it is.
Military actions of all kinds are wildly expensive. Funding warfare with hard currency is much more difficult and self limiting than a situation where funds can be legislated into existence. I never alluded to a golden time when there was no war, Yo.
Banks creating credit on a sane reserve ratio may be inflationary to an extent but may also be the difference between a regional economy mired in depression and one which is experiencing economic growth and vigorous activity. Banking activity is like digitalis, in low doses it's good for the heart and circulation but take too much and it's deadly poison.
Although central bankers have become masters of the broad grey area and of truly artful alliterative misdirection, bank credit in context of a healthy economy is different from pure legislative fiat (like say Assignats); inflationary spirals caused by legislative fiat almost always end in disaster - the war tie in comes because nothing tempts gratuitous war like access to legislative fiat money... It's crack for the slovenly, greedy, imbecilic drunks who gravitate to legislatures.
Lending at "full, 100% currency backing" isn't really credit creation so much as it is simple usury, and ultimately won't do much in terms of economic activity. Fractional reserve credit creation is both stimulating and deadly and as such needs to be kept on a very, very short leash. Most economists and policy makers seemed to understand this up until ,oh, about 1913 or so. Anyhow, as a society we're probably stuck with it for the near term at least, because it does indeed spur innovation, investment and forward motion within an economy.
Point is, by being decentralized, BTC should be less susceptable to legislative shenanigans of all kinds. Honest money + equitable law/sanctity of contracts = peace and prosperity for all honest actors-- and the long line of Barack Hussein Obama's, Clintons, Bushes and other assorted shitheals and criminals are back to hustling and pimping in the backstreets and gutters where they belong.
@Husk-Erzulie
Finally a PM holder who "gets it". All we ever get on these threads are a bunch of "well by gumption, if I canna hold it, and I canna see it, its no good goldarnit'" types that apparently were '49-ers panning for flakes in the stream somewhere.
This is the point.
Use precious metals AND bitcoin as the double-barreled "fuck you" to the corrupt banking system. Those zombie banker fucks certainly deserve it.
The government is acting just like gangsters do when someone invades their turf.
They doth protest too much. How big is the bitcoin market? A few million at best? Even at tens of millions how is it a threat to a money market of over 100 trillion?
The only way it could be a threat is in its structure. What is so threatening about the bitcoin structure that has the managers of a 100 trillion dollar market taking notice?
About 12 million out there...
http://blockchain.info/charts/total-bitcoins
thats the dutch population, or is it belgian? Its in between.
They all loved gold in the old days. They still love diamonds.
But this thing could be tulips.
12m x $400 = approx $5bn market
So basically we have a dog trying to bite its leg off because a flea just landed there
A flea carrying within it a dis-ease that can kill the dog.
Some might say that is a clever dog, so keenly detecting such a difficult to spot threat and taking action. But in hindsight the dog just ingested a disease ridden insect that is soon to lay it's massive load of eggs inside the dog. Lol.
How big was Liberty coin?! And they sat on it and them like a 800 lbs. gorilla on a chihuahua.
The criminals of government ARE the original gangsters; "Submit and pay, or die."
But that is the entire point of BitCoin - there is no BitCoin Corp to sue, nobody to prosecute. It is pure peer-to-peer, completely decentralized. Governments can attack exchanges, but that will benefit the exhanges that operate in friendlier jurisdictions.
So this is really interesting because politicians are becoming under pressure because of their support of bankers. And, banks are losing control. The dollar is being debased. Stocks have limited bribery potential of US Politicians by the FED.
So BitCoin offers politicians an escape from a dying criminal FED entrapment program that they have been under for 20 years (noticebly). And with NSA the politicians also are aware that their crimes have been recorded.
BitCoin is the first clear opportunity for the Washington D.C. politicians to escape from the confines of a dying FED and take control on their own.
Long live the revolution.
There will be another crash (problem).
Someone sensitive or high profile will lose a bunch - widows, orphans, etc. People will be outraged and there will be MSM nightly news stories about it (reaction).
The CME will offer futures on BTC as a way to "improve market liquidity" and offer "hedging solutions." This means the Great Eye has control over the paper market. (solution)
Hilarity ensues, including daily 10am smackdowns. Whee! Blythe will lie and deny, but there you have it. Seize Mars told ya.
Soon we'll see Bitcoin 401k and IRA's
LOL!
Soon?
http://blogs.marketwatch.com/thetell/2013/11/08/secondmarkets-bitcoin-in...
Fuck Bitcoin
And hurray for Tyler bringing us a Bitcoin article every day for about 2 weeks. It's not just gonna go away into a corner and die, folks.
Bitcoin articles generate a lot of traffic to the site because all the bitcoiners swarm out of their dark corners to pump their scheme. There are links to this article on several of the big bitcoin forums.
@Xenobator
Actually, it generates a storm of people who have to debunk your latest pussy-twiddling theory as to why Bitcoin can't possibly work. You really gotta lay off that, you'll wear yourself out.
i feel a bit better with the solid shiny stuff.
so.. who will start tracking the bitcoin/Au/Ag indices ?????
Bitcoin is a proxy for lack of confidence in the US dollar, and the related Fed connivances on behalf of the largest banks. That's who they serve, that's who buys Congress, and that's why they are all grumpy bunnies about this Bitcoin thing.
If Jon Corzine can make your private segregated cash trading account go away, then some greasy-haired Cheetos-inhaling pizza-stained 16-year-old technomutt can make your bitcoins go away--from the comfort and privacy of his mom's basement.
The fud propaganda grows by the minute
No guns they said, you could shoot your eye out they said. Just because you are too inept to properly use the tool doesn't mean everyone else is.
:):) Many of you write about Bitcoin as if it was a US phenomena. You are about to realise that US is nothing when it comes to Bicoin.
Bingo.
the rest of the world will legitimize bitcoin, not americans.
China already has! Chinese government is actively encouraging its citizens to purchase bitcoins. This will only hasten the demise of the Jew controlled debt instrument known as the FRN. why do you think bitcoin doubled in past week. I billion Chinese and only 12 million bitcoin. do the math
This is creepy...
http://blockchain.info
http://blockchain.info/popular-addresses
8 out of top 10 ..... https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/SatoshiDICE
My favorite #8 on the list ... http://blockchain.info/address/1Fi57hAqyYYwaQVdA7a9qSKfiukBbt31G3 ... "Public Note: Hi! My name is Preet Bharara and I'm homeless Indian junkie. I'm accepting donations to buy crack for me and my ugly wife. Please help me. Thank you."
LMFFO
Bitcoin is at least entertaining regardless of what one thinks about it.
That website gives a realtime and historical view of the blockchain. Every Bitcoin "full node" has a copy of it and is independently verifying each transaction. The main take-away is that Bitcoin is decentralized and does not/needs not trust any individual Bitcoin user. Visa, Comex and your bank has a similar system but it is all done behind closed doors. An issue is dis-associating yourself from those random looking addresses and governements doing the opposite. There are tools to aid anonymity and more are coming in the future.
At 10 times todays Market cap Bitcoin would be 40 B.
At 100 times todays Market cap it would be 400B.
Today according to FED the USD eq is about 1200 B.
Why is United States scared?
It's not the amount, it's the idea.
NaiLib you're comparing oranges to an apple equivalent and calling them apples.
I understand your lifetimely conditioned value point perspective; even so surely you must see that the real hyperstory here is the ability to purchase forty (count 'em: 40!) more times the apples with them oranges y0y
What makes it more valuable than gold, ease of exchange,will also be its downfall as the governments can easily shut it down. excellent idea but get out now.
Pigs get slaughtered
The government always wins
> The government always wins
That's because the government has always had the monopoly on the issuing of currency. That monopoly is over, ergo the government doesn't always win anymore.
I will suggest that no , it is NOT , NOT the government that has the monopoly on issuing this country's money. The owners of the Federal Reserve Bank have that monopoly , but need the force and effect of the government's resources to maintain it. They are partners in the scam and use the IRS as a sword to discourage the population from questioning the validity of their partnership and monopoly. In 1913 there were suggestions that the creation of the Fed as well as the IRS were ILLEGAL acts that undermined the intent of OUR CONSTITUTION. The Constitution does not belong to the Legislative Branch , nor the Executive Branch , nor the Judicial Branch of our government.
Govt cant shut down what they dont understand
well said.
Pigs get fed. Hogs get slaughtered.
What is btc backed by?
Near instant transmission of value without a third party for pennies. That can be had with nothing else in the world except for Bitcoin. That's what makes it of practical value.
Bitcoin is many things, which is why people looking at it as just BitBux will always be lost. Bitcoin is its own self-contained banking system, peer-to-peer payment processor, public ledger, cryptosignature device and triple-entry accounting system. It's about to take over like the web took over. The network effect is still something that most people seem to have a hard time grasping.
Anonymity...A concept that governments just don't care much for...
Another often-overlooked advantage of BTC is that payments are irrevocable. Those of you who accept payment via credit cards and PayPal know what i'm talking about - there is no such thing as a "chargeback".
Demand
The same thing that backs the dollar. Hope, faith, and a little pyramid power.
privacy & utility.
Synthetic scarcity which is more than you can say about Janet.
Bankster tears.
physical computers doing work.
a somewhat foreign concept to government.
What is paper money? Who makes it 'printing machines', thus
ban the machines?
Physical? ok, less than 5% of 'money' is physical,
If it were only true that BTC were backed by MATH or CRYPTOGRAPHY, but the sad fact BTC is managed by
MT-COX a subsiary of bernie madoff.
Focusing on the means of making a bit-coin, and ignoring the man behind the curtain running the exchange will be its
downfall.
> "Should bitcoin become widely accepted, it is unlikely that it will remain free of government intervention, if only because the governance of the bitcoin code and network is opaque and vulnerable."
Should Bitcoin become widely accepted, that would mean that the power of the Fed and its bought-and-paid-for-in-FRNs government will be diminishing.
With or without Bitcoin, central banks are fucked. Bitcoin will just be the small hammer blow that knocks over the rotten edifice of the banks.
Should 'bernanke bucks' fly out of my arse, I will buy
every zero-head a beer.
BTC will be dead within a year, but only because of the
exchange system,
Long live bitcoin 2.0, free of humans and exchanges ( mt-cx clones ).
bitcoin 2.0, will be 100% free, and without delay, and without arbitrage, and without 'criminal' management.
Within 10 years these shall be forever-known as "shitcoin"...
Yep, at least with tulips, you had a flower to look at while broke ass, but only then if you took some effort to plant it:)
If you read the book (grand popular delusions), you would know that the majority of tulip bulbs that were traded, were rotten an incapable of germinating.
Oops, double post.
While I admire the spirit of the BitCoin experiment I think you are being a bit optimistic. I give BC 2 years tops until TPTB shut it down, whether by subterfuge (ala Silk Road) or outright attack. People forget that the BitCoin system is entirely reliant on unfettered interent access which is the NSA's playground.
I could see value in a short-term play to ride irrational exuberance, but the BC bubble is or will be manipulated and pop spectacularly. Gold and silver are susceptible to manipulation as well but at least can't disappear into the ether.
Its a chicken and egg problem, BTC users don't want
government control,
But without gubmint over-sight the 'exchanges' (mt-cox) will rob the users blind,
BTC will die,... but it will die because of HUMAN GREED.
BITCOIN 2.0, will come from GNU geeks who hate the fucking exchange system
The gubmint can be eliminated with VPN's, pirate dread was only caught because the bitch, gave an unkown his real gmail, fucking stupid as GOOGLE is a NSA spinoff, and tracks your every movement, thus in most likely hood, pirate-dread was either DUMB or a PLANT.
If you don't want to use an exchange, then don't. Sounds like you just have an axe to grind re Mt Gox.
Shitcoin (noun) used as in, "Shit! I should have bought some coin when I had the chance."
They manipulate the precious metals, freak out over virtual currency, yet refuse to fix the problem but will rebuild after the collapse.
Meantime, I expect a return of the barter system when they ban the virtuals.
Bit coin IS sound money:
http://knowmadiclife.com/blog/2013/4/3/is-bit-coin-sound-money
And it meets Mises' theorem of money regression:
http://knowmadiclife.com/blog/2013/10/4/bitcoin-lives-to-die-another-day...
Can the Fed's stop bitcoin? Maybe. Will they bring mass awareness on the part of the sheeple of the criminal global cartel of central banks in the process? YES.
Hold on a sec...
On the one hand, Menger would argue that Bitcoin are a “present good” and therefore are a form of money while Mises would argue that because of their heritage and virtual nature that they are not real money.
http://tradewithdave.com/?p=12274
http://tradewithdave.com/?p=12379
http://tradewithdave.com/?p=12962
Virtual Currency? Y'mean the same stuff the Fed wires to international banksters?
$40 for a transaction,
But if you loose 10% on withdrawl, then its essential just like the bankster system,
What is wanted is 100% free, and no haircut, ...EVER
Why is Taylor quoting the Mt. Gox exchange?
There is a $40-$45 differential between that one & the other three (i.e., those only hit $350-$360)....
MTGox consistently inflates the price by delaying sell orders. They also make it incredibly difficult for American bitcoin traders to cash out of the system.
Easy to put $ in, hard to get it out. Ponzi scheme 101.
You can "cash out" of Bitcoin instantly. It is just MTGox places a limit on the amount you can transfer out per day. It's no different from banks. They normally let you transfer only up to a certain amount per day.
There should be MORE exchanges,
And NO banks don't limit your redemption, that is only
at an ATM machine, but given BTC is ran by the faceless
MT-COX with no accountability ...
Yes, its almost like MT-COX is already owned by GOLD-MAN
sacks, ...bid/ask ( huge differential aka arbitrage pig trough ), delay, madoff redemption limit,
All tells that there needs to be a REAL fucking virtual currency with NO exchange, and no humans involved, with dynamic bid/ask, and no fucking delay, and no limit in
withdrawal.
Everything about BTC smells good, until you smell their
'exchange' system,...
Ran by MATH my ass, its RAN by MADOFF 2.0
Sounds to me like Mt Gox simply isn't interested in trying to accomodate speculators. This being ZH, most of the posters to this thread are viewing BTC as a speculative vehicle, but just because someone runs an exchange, doesn't mean they've volunteered to be your casino.
What Xeno-bator is trying to say is Mt. Gox is bumbling along - and largely this is due to the systems they have to interface, as well as the CEO being a newbie to running a business like this.
There are other exchanges, and most people have moved on, which is precisely why they aren't in the top volume figures anymore.
The real mistake this pussy-twiddling avatar shill makes is associating the failures of one exchange with the ENTIRE market, but I guess when you're chaining non-stop orgasms together you tend to miss the real details.
That's the RUB, eh? :)
If you can't beat em.... regulate em I always say - Uncle Sam
If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
Let me guess, it's Time to naked short entire year of bitcoin mining! (in a Single Trade)
That would be great! APR on bitcoin loans would go up to a trillion percent.
Yes, when the relevance and legitimacy of governments come into question, they tend to become concerned...
Yep, time to buy a 3D printer with my Bitcoins...
One thing is for certain, Bitcoin won't go down without a good fucking fight.
If you are looking for something(s) WRONG, here's a lot of BIG ones:
http://patrick.net/forum/?p=1230886
Yes and Ricardian contracts where in the receipt IS the transaction and triple-entry accounting (ala Yuji Ijiri) wherein you have a debt, a credit and a prebit are expressed in the blockchain. When's the last time you saw a capitalist entrepreneur outside of the "money as a technology" realm as expressed by The Economist Magazine.
www.tradewithdave.com
http://mises.org/daily/6580/Monsantos-Friends-in-High-Places
BTC has had a very nice run up recently, looking a bit parabolic - probably going to get a bit of retracement and some consolidation. I'd say it looks like a short term top about now - might be a good time to lock the move in, and rebuy later.
Then again, it might start another leg - or just plateau - who can know these things. Mt Gox bids are a bit thin, haven't looked further than that.
The eugenics control freak crowd do not like and will not tolerate competition.
I'm hanging my dwindling supply of USDs.
When it ALL goes "Bye Bye", will you be able to wipe your a$$ with a Bitcoin?
Dude, have you never seen that photo of the sign outside a Zimbabwe public toilet, _expressly_ _forbidding_ patrons to wipe their ass with Zimbabwe dollars?
Of course if this were any other asset like a house, equities, USD or any other ZH non-liked asset, ZH would be trumpeting about the parabolic demise of the thing.
you new here? the tylers finally called uncle on rise of btc
If the price keeps going up in large jumps over a very short period of time ( even with massive balance sheet expansion by the central banks), surely that means that its' previous prices were not efficiently derived, since, with an asset in limited quantity ( ie bitcoin), then if the asset quantity is not expanding at the same pace as the rise in demand, then the ratio of the quantity of the asset (to demand) is mis-specified and there should have been more of it created relative to rising demand..
Or am I missing something here? If I am missing something please explain, without crap troll comments..
Bitcoins are created at a constant rate no matter what. If the demand rises above that then the price goes up.
Bitcoins are created when they are 'mined', e.g. when
somebody run's the software to create them,
On the other hand when they're bought and SOLD they go
through an 'auction process' ( mt-cox ), ... and thus this is where you will get fucked, at auction, where humans
Get there +10% bid/ask differential
BTC is money, and its very divisible. The price movements reflect new investors into the BTC market, and old investors gaining some trust and adding some more capital. When BTC achieves complete market saturation, then we will have a far better idea about the true value of the currency.
Because BTC is highly divisible, then anyone can own some of it - and there is not a shortage - it will simply move to a higher exchange price to reflect the increase of demand. I can't really understand what your point is - but if you are concerned about the volatility, then its simply a very liquid and desirable asset becoming available to new markets. It is no doubt going to have very high levels of volatility - this is the market doing exactly what it should be doing, trying to discover the true value of BTC. The infrastructure to trade BTC is new, BTC itself is new, there is obviously a lot of uncertainty about its value - so it will be volatile - watching the movements of BTC is a lesson in free market capitalism, and also of the way information moves on the internet.
A concern with bitcoin is that it will be competing with bitcoin 2 and 3 and 4. It is like saying AOL has the only website on the planet. I am not going to crap on someone elses "not dollars". But the potential competition in crypto currency is endless. I hope it goes to 1 million. I'd rather have gold and silver. That is just me.
Then who will do the currency exchange for our INFINITE
virtual currency's, .. you know there will be delay and arbitrage, and then there will be 5% to 10% haircuts
for 'exchange',
Its always the same fucking shit, .. just different crooks,
We already have this its called 'western union', the biggest
way to fuck poor stupid people on the planet.
What's needed is a cheap way to 'wire money', PAYPAL had it a few years ago, but the US GOVERNMENT shut it down, when they made it impossible to import money to your PAYPAL outside of a credit-card.
As long as there are roads there will be tolls, long ago
3COM wanted to apply a 'tax' on INTERNET IP packets, ...
certainly virtual currency's will be taxed to fucking shit, once they go mainstream, then once again, we'll have to look in dark places to find a cheap and easy way to transfer money.
It seems your understanding of bitcoin is extremely limited if not ill informed. Some of the long existing financial problems you are presenting are the exact things bitcoin solves. Do some more research and I think you might come to a different conclusion.
I'm still scratching my head at the irrational exhuberance over BTC...
Its thinly traded so it goes up, and then that also makes it can down big in panic, because it doesn't have broad support.
The thing is it is for GEEKs, there can never be broad
support, as the average village idiot doesn't have the ability to turn on a computer, let alone 'mine virtual
currency',
I downloaded the SW a few years ago and it ran for hours
, I think most don't have a fast enough computer, nor the
geek smarts to fuck with it,...
Somebody smart will develop a bitcoin-2.0, that is fast,easy to use, ...
Also having these exchange like mt-cox, which essentially
is a 'middle-man', where common criminal can set himself up
as an 'admin'.
In a pure world, if it really were 100% math,.. that would be fine, but in the real world, there will be servers, and they will be managed by 'MADOFFS'.
In all history of mankind 1 in the hand has bested 2 in the bush.
Tuplip Mania and BITCOIN are 100% retread.
Croesus: I'm still scratching my ass & ballsack over BTC. I have Seek'd help from Seek another long time member here and he's been very informative. Basically, it won't work for me. That's the short story.
Looks like Bitcoin is going to reach a permanently high plateau.
They'll shut down the internet before they let bitcoin succeed too much further. They'll call it terrorism and blame the TEA party or some other BS.
Cool, bring it. It is a good day to die.
but, but, NASDAQ!
*full diclosure: I got out of the US years and years ago.
An imaginary coin is pretty much valued at the price of gold 10 years ago.
This is nuts.
its hysteria.
It's just modern technology, a culmination of ideas and tech that wasn't possible before. Learn more about it or don't, but in the future don't say you wish somebody had told you about it earlier...
ok, assume btc is successful. But would it reduce the control of the government on the money supply ? (or am I wrong in assuming that NSA or DoE, for that matter, has less computing power than a bunch of startup companies ?)
It's not about how much computing power you have today it's about your capacity to produce computing power in the future. In that regard China wins hands down.
Never underestimate NSA's computing power. Rumor is they're close to be able to brute-force attack AES. SHA-256 is in the same ballpark, so they are probably able to compute block at any precision required, and fast enough to put every other miner out of business. Now, do they the effort is worth it ?
Oh thank you, ECB, for telling us that bitcoin is certainly a ponzi scheme but your fiat currency that you print out of thin air isn't.
Good to know they are looking out for everyone like that. Truly a trustworth bunch of bankers if I ever saw one.
We, The People of Earth, say "Fuck You" Banksters!!
This is one time we will NOT hear "If you like your BTC you cna keep your BTC."
So far the use of the 'internet' seems 'minimal', especially if one excludes PORN,
Well that is the real issue isn't it?
The 'black market' is what the USD is all about on the INTL market, the US hates competition.
But in reality any moron can create a synthetic currency on the internet...
There will be BITCOIN 2.0, and paradigm will be
1.) fastest
2.) cheapest
3.) first
If your any of the 3 you get rich, if your all of the 3, then you get super rich, bitcoin is just the Lotus-123 of our time,
MT Cox or any admin can just as well create phony insider currency, as a phony ETF 'GLD' gold paper market, ... nothing is real except buried bullets, and gun's. Properly sealed with cosmoline.
***
The real angle here is what in the fuck are the BITCOIN founders BUYING with their LOOT?? My guess it is GOLD, and land in safe-havens. The simple fact is with bit-coin there are far too many supporters,...
Also its now parabolic, which means a correction, the last correction was 70%,... should happen any day, ... but dead-cat bounces backed by nothing, ... more power to you, ... I would prefer CHF,SGD,and CNY.