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Well you buy what's working, right? Don't fight the Fed? Oh wait...
BTC just hit $670...
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Tyler, thats not what is happening, STFU. :) It's just the usual precious metal slamdowns until JP Morgan starts buying/taking delivery next month.
How many people here would actually trade 1 ounce of physical gold for 2 bitcoins today?
Are any PM dealers accepting bitcoin?
GoldSilverBitcoin.com wants 2.31 BTC for a 1 oz gold eagle. Not recommending, just answering your post.
RE: Are any PM dealers accepting bitcoin?
https://coinabul.com/index.php/
DO NOT DEAL WITH COINABUL.COM. THEY ARE A SCAM.
I have used amagimetals.com for several months without any issues.
I would. Gold and silver are crippled by the comex, LBMA, SEC, Fed, US Treasury collective price supression scheme. Are aware of this? Guess what, it is not going away. BTC exists because gold and silver will never be allowed to function as sound money. You can hold onto your emotional attachement to gold denying the reality of the situation right in front of your face or you can realize BTC is what you are really looking for.
"Guess what, it is not going away"
I call bullshit John. You don't know what you are talking about. Those institutioins are in the process of disintegrating.
Quit shilling and pimping for Bitcoin. We get it. You apparently don't understand the role of gold as an essential CB asset. Fuck off with your nonsense.
I have been a holder and advocate of gold and silver for many years now. I am fully aware of why gold and silver are sound money. I have also taken the time to educate mysel on BTC. And I have concluded BTC is as good or better sound money than both gold and silver.
"You don't know what you are talking about."
Ok, I take that challenge. So, without using profanity or becoming emotional because your belief structure is being threatened, prove to me BTC is not sound money.
"prove to me BTC is not sound money." - unplug your computer. Next.
If you have a pen and a piece of paper you can write down the unique series of numbers and letters in each BTC key you own. You have proven nothing other than your ignorance of BTC.
"You have proven nothing other than your ignorance of BTC."
It's become a popular pastime/tradition in the echo chamber, programming present new and future ZHers to be left behind as their "mentors" have.
Bitcoin threads: Where veteran ZHers shit their diapers.
LOL. I was refuting your gold and silver arguments, which are complete nonsense.
So you are a "holder and advocate"? Really now? When all you do is consistently bash PM's here, why should we believe anything you have to say about them?
Where have I bashed PMs? I hold more PMs than I do BTC. I hold a diversified portfolio of all major denationalized money both metallic and digital. You are behaving just like the fiat-bugs. They fear gold because it is superior to government fiat money. It is an emotion based belief. You fear BTC because it may be superior to gold and silver. It is an emotion based belief.
If you wish to continue to hold onto that emotion based belief and call me names, down vote me, hey great, I hope it feels good. in the meantime my diversified portfolio of denationalized money is increasing in value by >10% every day. Why? Because instead of holding onto past beliefs ignoring new data I have embraced new data and adapted my beliefs. BTC is not your enemy, it is your ally. If you hate it just because it threatens gold you might as well be a fiat-bug, that is exactly what they are!
So I see you cannot prove BTC is not sound money. I assumed as much. You have likely done zero research into the details of BTC to arrive at your current fear based belief regarding it.
"BTC exists because gold and silver will never be allowed to function as sound money"
LOL. Unreal. You wrote it, not me.
And please spare me your psycho babble on what "I believe". I have only questioned taking physical delivery of Bitcoin. It is loaded with risk. Of course, you won't touch that issue with a ten foot pole.
Pull up a chart of gold or silver since QE began five years ago. Are they functioning as sound money? Yes, I wrote it because it is true. If your response is to laugh, you will continue to lose out on understanding how BTC can help you protect your wealth.
I am happy to discuss any aspect of BTC with you. I have done considerable research on BTC over the last two eyars. Please explain to me these risks fo taking physical delivery of BTC you speak of.
You're arguing with someone that doesn't have a clue what they're talking about with regards to BTC.
It's a ZH tradition in Bitcoin comments sections.
Can either of you stay on point to what I said? I'm not surprised, as none of you Bitcoin supporters will ever take delivery right? (even though you all love humping it as digital and physical currency)
https://www.casascius.com/TandC.aspx
Who loves "humping" it as a physical currency? Not me and who cares anyway, it's utterly irrelevant in the scheme of things. I think you're confusing the notion of BTC being tangible as far as some are concerned, with "physical" regardless of casascius coins. You should be more worried about how much purchasing power you are losing and have lost than with rhetorical circular arguments.
Holding BTC in coin form is simply impractical, not necessary and a significant liability now compared to the increased security of holding them digitally when done properly.
Bitcoin doesn't conform to your concept of "holding" because one doesn't need hold it to own it and, if done properly, it's much safer to "hold" digitally or on paper wallets than if one has physical coins.
Most coins aside from those used for active trading are taken delivery of.
Something tells me you'll never understand anyway really...
Well, if you followed the threads here lately, you would know that many people said Bitcoin is both. And I agree with you, it clearly is not. Bitcoins are not only impractical to hold, they are not reliable in physical form. That was my point.
my gold & silver are ballast.
They're not crippled by anything other than the laws of physics.
BTC is electronic, easily snooped, easily stopped, easily erased. That's the worst possible outcome. I can avoid all of it by avoiding BTC COMPLETELY.
Gold & silver never stopped functioning as sound money but only the central banks & industrialists have had sound money the last 100 years.
Altrady traded 8oz physical gold a few weeks back, bought Bitcoin, now worth over 16oz, tax free also as Canadian govt has 'wait and see' approach to Bitcoin
That's awesom man, great job...you took a risk and you won very nicely. In my opinion, I think it would be wise now to take some of those winnings and flip them back into phyzz silver and load up the truck! You will have seriously increased your physical ounces. Then play the Bitcoin game with the rest of the "Casino" money you won on your bet. Best of both right there! ;-) Cheers!!!
A better approach may be to not talk about your moves. Hate for you to implicate yourself by your own digital hand. That being said good luck and congrats.
There was a guy on here several years back bragging in almost every thread about how he maxed out his credit cards and lines of credit to buy gold and then file bankruptcy to get rid of the debt.
I personally could care less - fuck the banks - but the level of hubris in that line of thinking and posting online made me wonder if it was bullshit or he stopped posting because of bankruptcy fraud.
There was a woman who killed her husband up here (central upstate NY) by lacing his margarita with anti-freeze. And she didn't get caught until a couple years later after she moved to Florida and told a friend, who then called the police to report what her "friend" had just told her.
Keep your fucking mouth shut - loose lips sink ships.
Years ago (here) I'd argued that while I do NOT like the banks etc. that I didn't no feel that it would do business with anyone post-collapse/restructuring who intentionally planned to NOT carry through with a contract. I would like that in the future people are a bit more ethical, but, clearly, humans are humans... still, my position stands (if I am aware that you are a known contract breaker then I would not do business with you).
In the "country" the phrase is: Shoot, Shovel and Shutup...
I don't think it's actually bankruptcy fraud if you lost your metals & document that along the way. Boating accidents are so tragic.
On top of that credit cards are unsecured credit, there's no collateral they can sue for, cash value only. Can't seize a thing.
lol at your backhanded compliments... looks more like the PM market is the real corrupt casino right?
Sell all that junk metal and really protect your wealth!
Actually, if you trade the BTC for Fiat currency of any kind you are subject to capital gains tax. If you execute a barter transaction with BTC to PMs directly it is a taxable event under Canadian tax law.
Congrats on the profits but CRA are the last people I would want to pull one over on personally.
I suggest you read the government's guidance on digital currencies if you haven't because their stance is not at all wait and see by any stretch if one's BTC interacts with CAD$ or other "negotiable instruments".
Oh look, another all-time high for BTC... $1K/BTC on BTC-C within 24 hours at this rate...
And according to the IRS ALL transactions are taxable/reportable.
The question (in the US) would be whether NSA/IRS could determine you were transacting with Bitcoins. If so and you don't report it AND they are hell-bent on crushing Bitcoins then no matter how small of a target you are you serve their purpose of holding you up to the crowds.
and if they decide you are they'll decide the real dollar-value (you aren't allowed to choose) and tax you on that price they picked.
It could be an apple for a banana & if they decide either/both were 5000$ that's what you pay tax on.
they're criminal frauds.
Ya, it's called fraud.
No one could accurately say what is the dollar-value for a thing which is not dollars but the market but they'll claim only they know the value & will pick whatever number they want.
It's less honest & more criminal than the "black" market.
With btc jumping so high I wouldn't be surprised to see an 80% drop within a week perhaps a second 80% drop in another week. That's how these fiat bubbles pop - it's a mania.
good luck to bag-holders...
not in a million years.
It is foolish to think that the major central banks of the world will stand by while independent currencies like bitcoin reach sustainable adoption rates among merchants and consumers.
As I have mentioned before, the early adopters of bitcoin are exactly the kinds of people the statists would love to punish for their independence. It is best to be prepared for serious challenges to the stability of electronic currencies once it appears they are on the verge of real legitimacy.
It is foolish to think that the 7bn people of the world will stand by while fiat currencies like USD and JPY get printed to death throwing everyone but the elite into poverty.
There, fixed it for ya.
The overwhelming majority of humans on this planet care very little about "currencies;" as a matter of fact, I'd figure that there's quite a large number that do straight barter.
And when there's zero hope for a bunch of humans to transact w/Bitcoins, let alone have had any wealth in which to acquire them, well, WTF even bring up 7 billion?
Fact: 750 MILLION humans living in India live on $0.50/day. That's 3 1/2 times the entire population of the US. I assure you that these people have no awareness of Bitcoin or even care. With PMs they probably know, but likewise, don't give a crap because it's not even a possible play for them.
I'm sorry...But isn't that a great rotation from "paper" gold and "paper" silver into Bitcoin? Are those charts tracking actual physical gold and silver that are being sold in order to buy bitcoins?
I mean, don't get me wrong...I hope people really are selling or shorting the paper ETF's and buying Bitcoin instead. It's putting excellent downward pressure on physical gold and silver which I want to scoop up for as little fiat Benny the Clown Bucks as possible.
Nothing against Bitcoin...I hope it drives all fiat into the dustbin of history, and I hope it causes a total crash of all paper metal markets as well. Then we'll finally free the physical from the criminal manipulation of the cartel.
I'm still hoping for a 19.xx handle on silver today or sometime this week or into December. Bring it on bitchez...I'll be backing up the truck yet again to add to my stack.
Until an average guy can get more than 5 lines into an article about Bitcoin (without going cross-eyed) there will be no great rotation.
Want to trade some worthless fiat for Bitcoin, you say? "Sure, it's easy!" "All you have to do, is: Configure your browser, blah blah blah encrypt to your hard, soft and dark wallet blah blah blah, don't forget to add HTML.net when you download blah blah blah and wipe your drives with your usb blah blah....
Until I can buy Bitcoin, as easily as I can buy 1/4 oz Maples....
I'll be waiting on the side-lines with my shoe-box full of red fifties :)
BITCHEZ!
Coinbase.com. Like I said, the architecture for commerce is being built as we speak.
I posted a rant months ago about what a pain in the ass getting into this was. Then I discovered that many places had been working to make it easier. Coinbase was one of those places. You are certainly not going to day trade there, but for timely, decent transactions without huge fees...it works.
Now, I expect that the IRS is watching that closely. They will want to see my records in the spring. I have no doubt about that. We are not going to get rich without giving the Black Panthers in DC their cut.
Red Fitties? That's counterfeit!
Malarkey.
Tyler is TROLLING, LOLOLOL
No lineup to sell my gold at the Vancouver Bullion Exchange this morning. Quiet.
Lineup 8 people deep at the Bitcoin ATM. Didnt see one transaction below $1000. After a few people the machine started choking, Bitcoiniac guy says "its full" and opens the machine to clean out the cash. Guy leaves with bulky backpack...
Here Bull, chase the red cape!
That's why Peter Schiff call Bitcoin a bubble. He's in gold. However. Nobody knows how much Gold there is. But Bitcoin is limited and can only get less once all are mined....
Ah yes. And of course, Peter Schiff could not possibily get himself some bitcoin if he thought they were good deal.
This post is neither for or against bitcoin, gold, silver, fiat, or whatever. It is a post that's, "just sayin'", with sarcasm to try and make a point.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/18/bitcoin-senate-hearings-regulation
:) also current Markec Cap of Gold is.............> 6.5 Trillion USD... And Bitcoin...Just over 7Billion. Approx 1/1000 of Gold. Try to stay to proportions when discussing Bitcoin. Its nothing in macro terms ...yet
Thanks for the perspective!
The problem with Bitcoin is that anybody knowing a little bit of programming and cryptography CAN create their own Bitcoin type of money, like LiteCoin and others etc. Once Paypal or Google decides to create their own version of PayPal Coin or Google coin , Bitcoin will become another MySpace.
The thing is one can create Bitcoin type of money easily , not like gold or silver which are not replaceable.
Suggest you wait for Google coins then, btw they already tried. But its just another voucher. BTC is not replacable, and its _transferrable_ all over the world in minutes/hours. Try that with gold. Germany has asked for its Gold from US, think they got it yet?
I don't WANT to try that.
Having immediately transferrable gold is a bad thing, a security risk.
Having it heavy to move & hard to locate is the benefit of gold NOT a down side.
Exactly. This is why bitcoin has nothing on gpg/pgp.
It is not money. It is the ability to digitally sign, securely, any note, so that no one can duplicate the note & the value.
The note itself, no matter how many copies, signifies ONE originator with ONE unique content.
if that content is a promise for x ounces of silver, gold, etc., and IF that party is trusted THEN that unique note has value.
No matter how many duplicates are made of the note all copies signify ONE originator and ONE message.
If the content or the originator have no value the NOTE has no value and that's FINE.
bitcoin doesn't work that way.
Also since keys can be invalidated permanently, and because one newer dated & signed message can invalidate any others by its own content, it also can do something bitcoin can't.
Next headline: China dumping gold for Bitcoin!
Reminds me of the Rothschild Waterloo bond trade.
Not sure what all the fuss against bitcoin is about. When I signed up with ZH, they were pimping BTC at $16. Can't believe I didn't buy at least two or three. D@mn.
And when they are $5000 you will be kicking yourself for not buying when...
You're dreaming. btc will be $5 before it's 5000
This looks like the tech bubble and it was nothing but mob mentality also.
Now we know why Blythe is out of commodities.
Stackers Suck!
(yeah I am just kicking you when you are down)
I've made 160% in about month on Bitcoin. I am moving it into gold and silver as it moves down.
What I do not understand is why isn't everyone doing that?
Fear, greed? Who gives a shit. I am doing this to make money so that I do not have to go back to a corporate job.
This week, it is working pretty well.
it's a high-risk ponzi fraud at this point.
It's the fiat exchanges, not the btc protocol or network.
It's not worth the risk. I'm better off being in cash & silver, add gold for real security, than to risk a cash loss of 80% in one hour and have nothing to work with.
if you make the move NOW to gold & silver you'll be OK. If you wait a week you'll be bankrupt.
80% in an hour?
After cashing out my original investment, I am playing with house money. And adding to my PM holdings EVERY day.
I don't care if it's a ponzi. I don't agree that it is. But I don't care.
Not caring if it's a ponzi is the #1 reason to be sure it's a Ponzi.
Glad you got away with winnings. Someone won't. Stay out of it now and you're safe. It's that easy.
I hope it is not true.
If fiat-chasing suckers truly have left bullion behind to chase bitcoin then the Fed has won & will never lose.
It means people are so stupid they'll chase something worse than a penny-stock most assuredly controlled by the Fed (who can bring enough dollars to buy all bitcoins EASILY) to keep people out of gold.
The harder people buy bitcoins with fiat that could go to gold or silver, the harder the Fed can kick everyone in the balls with inflation & doesn't need to try as hard with the naked short COMEX contracts for silver & gold.
If you're one of the dumb fucks helping the Fed do this, you're poisoning the well we all drink from.
It's amazing to still see many on ZH, one of the alleged cutting edge financial sites on the entire internet, shitting their diapers and spitting-up in public in these Bitcoin threads.
Going to sit down with a beer and c-span coverage of the Senate hearings in a few. We could be over four figures or at single digits by the end of the week but what a ride.
The Authority generally takes a dim view of cutting edge mediums of exchange that they do not profit from nor control. For some reason I just can't see this ending up all rainbows and unicorns. Could be, but there is a history of behavior out there that contradicts "all is well" future for bitcoin. I hope I'm wrong but I'd be shocked if bitcoin doesn't wind up covered with red dots as the crosshairs from the scopes are being adjusted.
Oh I agree, anything is possible. Either this thing will go down like a lead zeppelin or most of the world's population will work their entire lives to save the equivalent of one Bitcoin. How do we know that "The Authority" isn't clandestinely behind this thing somehow to one degree or another? It most certainly will not remain a fringe, "pirate" currency.
To zero or to many zeros.
"Oh I agree, anything is possible."
That's what I say. And then I follow it with: "But I deal in probabilities." Bitcoin has way too many reasons to piss off TPTB, and while I like that, I also note that that is the primary reason why it'll get crushed.
The Fed has finally found a way to smash down gold and silver without overtly doing anything. Useful tool. Once gold price objectives have been met, the political hammer will be used to smash bitcoin. Nah that would just be some stupid consipiracy theory that is totally out of the realm of possibility. Now back to wearing my tin foil hat!
They'll smack down PMs, but not to zero because THEY own PMs. I suppose when Central Banks start acquiring Bitcoins then I'll admit that Bitcoins have "arrived." Either outcome isn't all that attractive... unless, that is, one is just look to make a quick buck rather than establish a stable future.
Hey, "Tyler", why won't you do the same with stocks, everything else: "it's up, it has be worth it" - BTFATH, right?
What happens when a government decides to turn out the lights on the internet using the "kill switch" authority? The 21st century version of bank closings. Or perhaps a "natural" electical grid disaster. How do you get to your bitcoins in a no internet, no electricity scenario?
ZH has gone full retard on Bitcoin!
Uninformed anti-BTC gold bugs are the new fiat-bugs. How ironic, you guys have become the very people you claim to oppose.
dot-com bubble missed you, son....
And what's it like to be totally dependent on TPTB's network (knowing FULL well that the NSA has a bug everywhere)? Oh, the irony... "to be free from, um..."
Folks put up all their personal shit on the Internet. Now it'll be their wealth... What is reality when everything's virtual...
I don't have a bitcoin, I do hold metals. My view of bitcoin (which is worth just that, a view) is that it's all great until an EMP or solar flare of whatever drops the power (yeah, I've seen too much Revolution). Same with fiat, except a flame is all it takes.
Physical on the other hand, is impervious to a loss of power, and no matter how hot it gets, is still valuable whether it's a lump or a coin.
Just my take on things.
EMP risk is way overblown: I went through a bunch of discussions on a survivalists' forum (ar15.com I believe it was) and was surprised they'd managed to dismiss the risk.
BUT... plain old electrical outages aren't far-fetched. AND, it's highly unlikely that most folks will set themselves up to receive Bitcoins (demographics, teaching old dogs new tricks... and then just plain old poor folks [who number in the 4+ billion]).
Congressional acceptance of Bitcoin is one way to put more pressure on gold and silver. It would legitimize BC as an alternative to holding physical metal. As with the ETF's (which are lying about having actual gold and silver backing) the purpose would be to syphon investment dollars away from the precious metals physical market and so take the pressure off LME / Comex / GS /JPM
Good thinking.
Always watch what they DO... (THE game is stacking- best time to buy is when shit is low- drive it low and scoop it up.)
BTC new all-time highs on Bitstamp, VirtEx, etc. on firm but favorable commentary in front of government. The Chinese (BTC-C at US$818 at this moment) never cared about any Senate hearing in the first place.
BTC
I posted this on this page earlier today but it’s been erased. Very weird. I’ll post it again.
I cannot avoid but to think that BTC is just a distraction/set up aimed at herding investors away from physical gold. BTC is like a shining light attracting those of us who hate TPTB and want to establish a honest monetary system. When the time will be ripe, TPTB will snap its finger and outlaw BTC with the flick of a pen writing a new set of laws. And those who invested their hard earned savings into BTC will lose everything and TPTB will have succeeded at 2 things: 1) millions of dollars will have been invested away from physical gold for a prolonged period of time, 2) Those who oppose the Money Masters will be taken to the cleaner and loose everything.
When I see China’s, Russia’s and so many other central banks hoarding gold, it tells me that at one point in the future, gold will shine again.
I don’t hate BTC. I think that the concept is great. But I can’t help but think that a lot of people will end up being hurt by it at some point in the future. And I hate to think that the Money Masters are actively using BTC to divert investors’ money away from real physical gold and silver.
Or maybe gold was the distraction.
Look at 1980. TPTB only needed to hide in gold for a little while. Then they refinanced into 15% treasuries and gold fell for the next 20 years.
Maybe they are going to hide someplace else this time.
And when it's your own wealth, well... what are you going to do? You will NEVER be able to out-guess THEM. Seems that TPTB have held PMs quite steadily, perhaps shifting some, but it's always a touchstone.
Looks like sheep ready to be sheared.
The Russians didn't sell Alaska, they leased it. They lost the note and their repo dept was not powerful enough to reposess Alaska.
possession is 9/10ths of the law.
You gotta ask yourself: When gold withdraws its bid on the USD, will you care if your BTC is worth $1 million?
For the record, BTC breaks US$1000 on BTC-C.
BubbleCoin
as a dumbass, i havent really figured out this whole BTC exchange thing, which i would love to have explained to me how i set all this stuff up and mine them, or buy them. I still buy (some) gold, but mostly silver each month. I, for one, love to see anything that puts pressure on FRNs. I also like to imagine that the rise of bitcoin is similar to what gold and silver would do were they not massively manipulated. i do not like to see 'bitcoin bugs' and 'gold bugs' argueing back and forth all the time. cant we all just agree that either is better than FRNs and all get along?