This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
Russia vs Ukraine: The Infographic
Curious how Ukraine, which with its population of 44 million and size of 603,628 square km makes it the largest single country entirely in Europe, stacks up against Russia? The following infographic should answer some questions regarding the (im)balance of power.
And as a follow up, here is a map showing the location of the various sites of the Russian Navy in the Crimea. These will be the first sites to see a surge in Russian troop presence.
H/t @MrHalimi, @seanrussiablog
»
- 64480 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -
Seems like an excellent time to cut thehell out our defense budget...
Exactly, make the world safe from the world's aggressor.
Should have happen in 1990 and the lives of millions of innocents would have been spared.
Do not forget that probably a little less than half of Ukraine is made up of Russians and other ethnic minorities who don't want to be under Ukrainian neo nazi rule. Expect the Ukrainian army to get sabotaged from within, also to lose considerable amounts of its manpower.
It seems the Neo Nazis have more guns than the other Ukrainian parties.
Hitler started small, but most people joined in when Hitler got power.
We haven't heard a lot from or about the Ukraine military, or recently from the police. There is no doubt a great deal going on there behind the curtain. This is one of those moments where what the military personnel of every rank think and feel will matter very much.
Also, the anti-coup public and political factions - including the unions and Russian speakers, Jews and Eastern Orthodox churches - in Western Ukraine are undoubtedly mobilizing - and in grave peril. CIA operatives on the ground are no doubt having a field day organizing in Western Ukraine. Events on the ground have taken on a life of their own, and Putin's power to steer them is limited.
Putin's actions no doubt have all this in view, and he can be expected to play his hand cautiously while he feels it might provoke a negative reaction from the as-yet uncommitted, decisively when needed and if possible to prevent NATO invasion or crushing of Russia's allies. Unless we know what's going on behind the curtain we may not see it coming.
Clearly Lavrov hasn't decided what to say about this, or rather, he's been instructed to hold his peace, for now, or, he already said all that he felt was needed to be said, so buttoned it..
Ah, such an admirable quality in a Secretary of State, sorry, I meant, Foreign Minister.
Maybe there is oil or something else of value. But actually there needn't be a reason. The US should invade. It's tradition.
I should upvote that, but then I should downvote that, too.
Fuck me.
Ukraine has quite a bit of power behind its punch. No wonder that Ukrainian boxer who works for the US wants to fight, a military adventure could end up being very expensive for Russia. A few thousand dead Ukrainians is probably a small price to pay in their view.
No, it doesn't. Apart from being bankrupt, ALL their hardware is Russian made. I'm ready to bet that it's also in terrible disrepair. Reminds me of Saddam's great army, impressive on paper but shitty on the ground...
Military might is not the argument here; Its economic and its geopolitical; aka if Russia has the higher geopolitical ground than Pax Americana/EU then it has MORE LEVERAGE with people, those who fight in the streets.
In this day and age, its people's ire that changes things; from Tahrir square to Maidan square and Putin knows it. Especially with world wide instantaneous Media Internet coverage.
Military might without people support is the wrong strategy of USSR days and Putin will avoid that.
If the people's ire erupts in Eastern Ukraine he walks in and watches his own followers "out Kiev" Kiev Maidan frolicks.
Obama and Mutti know that. Here we are in FIRST WORLD cities. This is not third world and the populations of EU/USA will not understand why NATO moves in if places like Kharkov decide to go the "other way"; whatever the Kiev leaders may say.
The West is now hoisted on its own Maidan petard logic.
And Putin can smile as "saviour of the russian loving Ukrainian poeple"...watch this develop.
Its an unassailable urgument as it has the West by its own short hairs for "manipulating" popular uprisings in the ME or elsewhere to SUIT their own divide and rule political agenda (The Sunni-Shia false divide etc. etc. etc.).
Putin is now calling the bluff of that recurrent Pax Americana play; with a subservient EU looking on; in ME/ UKraine today. As an ex-KGB operative he can be as Machiavellian as the West as he is a despot by instinct.
@ falak pema
Excellent`e !!!
:-)) mr. burns it UP...
Question, is it really just a bluff by Obama?
Sometimes the bluff is pretended weakness.
If Obama is the puppet,
what do the puppet masters want?
NeoCons wish to defeat Russia and rule the whole world.
@ Lost Word :
It ain't over and here is my opinion (I'm sticking my neck out when I say this...but I will) ...
What is THE COMPROMISE that Putin will propose down the road to Obammy and Mutti; once he has rubbed their collective noses in the dirt and then has to come up with a POSITIVE solution which is beyond their current reach?
Here is my take on this :
1° Putin knows that Yanukovitch is a dead horse; nobody will accept him back as Ukrainian Potus.
2° Mutti and Obammy know that the current "they who flung dung on Yanu at Maidan" crowd, a bunch of manipulated Nuland front men are UNACCEPTABLE to Putin and Russian Hubris.
3° Putin will ALSO want, as per the 1994 agreement on independent Ukraine, that the territorial UNITY of Ukraine be guaranteed by both WEST and Russia; AKA NO DIVIDE and RULE of Ukraine by the West.
So what's the solution that satisfies these THREE premises.
EASY, for anybody who knows recent Ukrainian HISTORY : Who is acceptable to the West AND to PUTIN to achieve this ?
Wait for it...... it'll take your breath away : YULIA TIMOSHENKO.
The lady who signed the originAL gas deal between new Ukraine and new ELstine Russia that Putin inherited; and made a HUGE killing out of it. MRS GAS UKRAINE herself. The lady who is as rich as Yanukovitch !
THATS THE SOLUTION THAT PUTIN WILL PROPOSE TO THE WEST WHEN THE DUST SETTLES IN CURRENT UNREST.
And he knows that THAT is an offer the West CAN'T afford to refuse. 'Cos SHE is both Orange revolution and EU compatible as well as being Putin Russia Oligarchy compatible.
Wowiee. What a victory for world Oligarchy that would be.
One Ukraine, that principle of surrogate buffer state, soothes Putin's ruffled feathers, saves the face of "reformist" West/MUtti/EU and allows Russian gas to transit in a UNITED Ukraine under the shadow of Putin's benevolent Russia !
And Obammy and EU will buy that as an acceptable solution of REALPOLITIK fait accompli.
Machiavellian compromise and OLIGARCHY triumphs once again.
Move on sheeple. Tough shit for you young generation of Maidan who thought TRUE FREEDOM (like your young Tahrir Square counterparts or the "Occupy Wall street" Utopists in NY ).
The people lose and the Oligarchy wins once again.
Oligarchy Titanic continues its global voyage until the next MEGA STORM...Costa Concordia on the seas.
Yeah, that is very plausible...
It all depends if the "militant" Ukrainians accept Yulia...
It is still a short term solution as Yulia has failed before; therefore it really is nothing but a band-aid....
With the UK gov whining about this Russian movement, what would it do in a similar situation?
Well we already know what Britain did regarding the Falklands.
And we know what it's doing in Gibralter.
William Hague should change his underpants from hypocrisy to honesty.
I've got room for female refugees between the ages of 16 and 28.
http://www.wikihow.com/Meet-Russian-and-Ukrainian-Women
You'd better be in the Deep South, son, that doesn't fly on the coasts.
Shirley, you jest...
Europe will help them out with a bailout and some debt.....and then gas lines were cut to Europe. Game Over.
Sometimes the Blackmail gets a black-eye in return.
The very first act of the western-backed insurrectionists which represent a small percentage of the population and have managed to overthrow the government was to attempt rob Russian speakers in Ukraine of their language.
This denial by the Bandera nazi [sic] extremists and the illegitimate power in Kiev of a basic human rights for a huge percentage of the population runs contrary to international law and the European Convention of Human Rights to which Ukraine is a signatory.
According to the United Nations General Assembly Declaration of Principles of International Law and under the terms of the United Nations Charter, effectively the Russia population have a right to secede from Ukraine. In an interview with the Voice of Russia Harvard Professor Francis Boyle says that there is no real government in Ukraine right now, and called it a gang of neo-Nazis, fascists and rightist thugs. There is clear cut discrimination against Russians in Ukraine with public demands in Kiev that Russians be killed. According to Professor Boyle what happened in Kiev was a playbook coup d’état by the CIA. Victoria Nuland, the Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs, working with the US Ambassador, were instrumental in carrying out the coup d’état, as it has been proven they were working with “the brown shirts”: Svoboda, the right sector, the Bandera Nazis and skinheads .
http://www.globalresearch.ca/ukraine-was-a-playbook-cia-coup-detat/53712...
Spot on. Obummer & the gubbermint are still butthurt over Snowden's Russian asylum. The timing of all this with the Sochi games was no coincidence.
ZATO (I like it - first read it here today) has an amazing ability to work with the most repugnant elements to advance its agenda. Beheading/heart-eating Al Qaeda allies in Syria? Friends! Anti-semitic neonazis in Ukraine? Friends! Bandaras may think they're using the West. Guess they've never heard of others who tried same, like Gaddafi, Hussein and Noriega...
What if the Ukrainian military decides it's in their best interest, not to show up? That way, they get a Russian uniform and stay on the payroll.
Saw some rumors to the effect that parts of the Ukrainian military had already aligned with Russia. The newly installed zato puppet regime may be pretty short lived.
Out of date: Gold and FX reserves were $17.8bn at end of Jan, now down to an estimated $14.9bn. It is estimated that Ukraine is going to have to find $10 bn to pay loans in 2014.
Russia can hit Ukraine hard, not least, for example, were it (which it might) to announce next week that it was going to stop importing Ukrainian pork, because of the outbreak of African swine fever in.
Out of the chaos, we divide.
"A TRADE ban on lacy lingerie has Russian consumers and their neighbours with their knickers in a twist.
The ban will outlaw any underwear containing less than 6 per cent cotton from being imported, made, or sold in Russia, Belarus and Kazakhstan. And it has struck a chord in societies where La Perla and Victoria's Secret are panty paradises compared to Soviet-era cotton underwear, which was often about as flattering and shapely as drapery."
http://www.news.com.au/finance/business/trade-ban-has-russias-knickers-i...
That'll teach 'em!
Read more at http://www.ryot.org/lacy-panties-banned-russia/572777#V7kyzvqWJUDb9VFa.99I always thought of Kiev as an important Russian city; pretty sure the Russians feel the same way.
Why Western Ukraine wants to become a vassal of Brussels and compete with Greece and Spain for indebtedness to EU Oligarchs I do not understand.
Here in the "democracy" of the U.S.S.A. we are "free" to be spied on by our military, have our doors kicked in by the police, be taxed for health "insurance" that is nothing but tribute to the corporatocracy, and live under a more dishonest and diabolical crony capitalist kleptoligarchy.
Western Ukraine has switched hands many times in the past, but from my understanding they feel (a lot) closer to Poland than Russia. A large portion of the region has traditionally been a part of Poland. When the Russians came in it was accompanied with persecution and oppression.
I would agree with your hypothesis except I read this:
http://www.amazon.com/Savage-Continent-Europe-Aftermath-World/dp/1250033...
The Poles and Ukrainians have no love for each other. Probably for the reasons you cite. Disputed lands. Same as it ever was.
I would say that any putative disputes between Poles and Ukrainians are long in the past and essentially dead, while those between RUSSIA and Ukraine are very much alive and ongoing. Remember, most Russians still refuse to accept or acknowledge Ukrainians as a separate ethnicity, as reflected in their insulting references to Ukraine as "The Ukraine". as if that nation were just a region (and inherent part) of Russian.
Russian arrogance toward Ukraine, and Russian pretensions of ownership of Ukraine, are just as real and widespread as was the traditional and historic German arrogance and imperialism towards Poland, Czechia, the Baltic States and other Eastern European nations.
And I will say it again here: I grow increasingly disgusted with the implicitly, and now more explicitly, pro-Russian and especially pro-Putin opinions stated here on ZH. That is not to say that I support the EU and its infiltration into Ukraine in any way, but I am apparently in the minority here who sees that Putin is just as much (if not more so) a thug and an imperialist towards Ukraine as is anyone in the EU and NATO. So many of you rightly deride and mock the American sheeple falling for the dead-end "red team/blue team" bipartisan bullshit, yet here so many of you are falling for the same exact kind of false dichotomy regarding the ongoing situation in Ukraine.
Akak,
Agree wholeheartedly. If I were in Ukraine, I'd rather take my chances with the EU now, than have to deal with Putin and his armor. I understand that tyranny sucks from whatever quarter it comes and I enjoy his antics of humiliating the poser-in-chief. The country he seems to want to recreate was as evil as they come, there is no denying that.
This thread reminds the wise that we do not know enough about what is going on there to get too deeply involved. For those Ukrainians who want freedom, you will have to fight for it. I wish them well.
I don't like the EU and I wouldn't trust the US right now for much. That doesn't mean that Putin's Russia is to be admired. F' him too.
"Taras Bulba" is one helluva tale.
Exactly. In 1943 (not so long ago - plenty of people remember this time) more than 150 thousands Poles have been killed by Ukrainian nazis - UON - UPA. "Svoboda" and "Red sector" are their successors. See last discussion between Tichnobok and Jarosh - their leaders having very big infulence in new government:
http://www.rusfact.ru/node/18392
English version:
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=pl&i...
Volyn slaugter is still the fact (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres_of_Poles_in_Volhynia_and_Eastern_...) that Ukraine never apoligized for -they deny such fact in history... What more - they placed everywhere the monuments of Bandera - idealogical leader of UON-UPA...
quoted partial excerpts: (written cable by ambassador w. averall harriman via soviet union [u.s. russian translator charles bohlen] ~4/6/45)
"we must clearly recognize that the soviet program is the establishment of totalitarianism , ending personal liberty and democracy as we know and respect it.
roosevelt had undergone a profound change in outlook. stalin was not a man of his word.
still he had refused to give up trying to work with the russians. in a last message to stalin sent the day of his death, roosevelt said that in the future there must be no more mistrust between them, no more such 'minor misunderstandings'as over the german surrender issue. (before passing the message to stalin, harriman had urged the deletion of the word 'minor,' but roosevelt refused.) to churchill that same day he wrote: 'i would minimize the general soviet problem as much as possible, because these problems, in one form or another, seem to arise every day, and most of them straighten out...he only added: 'we must be firm, however,and our course thus far is correct.'
harriman told truman that russian control in poland or romania meant not just influence over foreign policy, but use of secret police and an end to freedom of speech. what they were face with, harriman said, using a phrase truman would not forget, was a 'barbarian invasion' of europe.
american policy must be reconsidered. any illusion that the soviet union was likely to act in accordance with the excepted principles in international affairs should be abandoned. he was not pessimistic, harriman insisted. he believed workable relations with russia were possible, with concessions on both sides.
truman said he understood that 100 percent cooperation from stalin was unattainable. he would be happy with 85 percent.
molotov (* 2nd in command behind stalin sent to the san fran conference [united nations], because stalin refused to go, period) was due in washington in two days. truman said that if the polish issue were not settled as agreed upon in yalta, then the senate would likely reject american participation in the united nations, and that he would tell this to molotov 'in words of one syllables.'
harriman told the president how relieved he was, 'that we see eye to eye."'
end quote!
Ps. please note that truman basically told molotov when they met exactly what he had told harriman. molotov fet insulted, yet truman felt justice was served and that america was not to be look upon so lightly. some of fdr's administration and big-time generals were afraid he had gone to-over-the-top, but truman had few words... and when he spoke best you listen. (eisenhower, patton, and bradley, etel)
thankyou tyler
Hey, simple solution, move to Russia you shithead.
Enjoy being a banker's slave?
Enjoy being a conspiracy nut?
Yeah - the N.S.A. really isn't violating the 4th amendment, and the Supine court didn't just rule that police can enter your home without a warrant, and corrupt banks are not robbing the public treasury with the help of the FED and complicit corrupt politicians on both sides of the aisle - is that it?
Or an excutive branch acting regularly outside its constitutional given powers. Forcing insurance on people or forcing a tax fine on them. Etc, Etc.......
All these people, while I understand their views, I feel are idiots. Seriously, be willing to bet the don't even know how the government was formed, powers enstilled, and the purpose of these rules.....
"They must govern to existing constitution. In a constitutional republic, executive, legislative, and judicial powers can be separated into distinct branches. That a constitution exists that limits the government's power makes the state constitutional."
Unfortunately, all the financial, economic and political 'conspiracy theories' have all been proven true.
The last unproven 'conspiracy theory' is the lizard aliens running things. If true, I hope they can live in a highly radioactive envirnoment. We can't.
I'm not sure it was aliens. Just "lizards"... people who are dominated by the early base functions of the brain.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triune_brain
AKA sociopaths.
No name calling dickheads!
Your unfounded patriotism is quaint, and I understand; I was once in the cave entranced by the shadows.
Nice! The Allegory of the Cave:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dlmsULpgjI
You have a problem with that?
;-)
Ukranians and Russians are culturally and linguistically distinct. I work closely with both.
What can I say. Historically they have been close allies. The guys I work with respect each other and work well together. There wasn't an enormous problem... Until fucking Victoria fucking... fucking Nuland shoved her neocon fucking nose in. Now, who the fuck knows.
Was there problems in Ukraine politically? Yup, corruption and crime are rife in the government, but you know, that was an internal matter for Ukranians to deal with.
guns and butter.
Friday February 28 9:00am
http://archive.wbai.org/#ankor22
.
Ukraine and the “Politics of Anti-Semitism”: The West Upholds Neo-Nazi Repression of Ukraine’s Jewish Community
By Prof Michel Chossudovsky
Global Research, February 26, 2014
.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/ukraine-and-the-politics-of-anti-semitism-w...
Too much trouble in the world. World needs only two super powers. no more no less.
Obama is setting up the board to play "Pidgeon Chess" on again.
Have you heard the latest piece of fucktard news? Now Turkey also wants to get involved in the Crimean claiming some sort of links with the region. FULL RETARD MODE ON AFTERBURNER.
Emerging Markets choose a sugar daddy.
All the huge fiat debts must be financed and paid !
Since they won't pay up...its time to choose sides and hookup with a sugar daddy (wit bigun's).
After this midde-game and everyone is "protected"...time for global reset....4...3...2....1
Will Philippines and Viet Nam go China or US ?
If nothing happens then when the bill comes due you get Puerto Rico.
ottoman empire
Seems pretty straight forward. Let the regions of Ukraine that want to be Russian puppets go that way and the regions that want to be under the Pan European Jack Boot go that way. Its a lose - lose situation for everyone involved.
you're being fed a false dichotomy designed to divide, and so are Ukranians. But you're absolutely correct in concluding that either scenario being presented results in a great loss for Ukranians. Ask yourself who benefits regardless of the outcome of those two choices.
I know it's entirely optimistic, but IMO it's early days and the cossacks might yet surprise everyone, down a quart of vodka, and make up their own minds
(admittedly step one of that sequence wouldn't be too much of a surprise)
most important...how will this impact the porn market?
the usa ptb have no (perceived) moral high ground anymore. none. the world knows that they are nothing but a bunch of exploitative assholes who would pimp their own mother for a buck. anything they say is bullshit. fuck those crony maggots.
McCain (the destiny you seek lies in Europe) speaks after stoking the anti Russian putsch in the Ukraine:
U.S. Senator John McCain (R-AZ) today released the following statement on Russia’s military intervention in Ukraine:
“I am deeply concerned that Russia’s ongoing military intervention in Crimea may soon expand to eastern Ukraine. Yesterday, President Obama said that Russia would face ‘costs’ if it intervened militarily in Ukraine. It is now essential for the President to articulate exactly what those costs will be and to take steps urgently to impose them.
“Russia’s use of force in Ukraine is unfolding in clear violation of Russia’s own commitments to respect Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, including under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum. None of us should be under any illusion about what President Putin is capable of doing in Ukraine, especially now that he has requested, and the Russian Duma has approved, the deployment of Russian troops, not just in Crimea but in the country of Ukraine.
“Every moment that the United States and our allies fail to respond sends the signal to President Putin that he can be even more ambitious and aggressive in his military intervention in Ukraine. There is a range of serious options at our disposal at this time without the use of military force. I call on President Obama to rally our European and NATO allies to make clear what costs Russia will face for its aggression and to impose those consequences without further delay.”
http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/press-releases?ID=e638967f...
" I call on President Obama to rally our European and NATO allies to make clear what costs Russia will face for its aggression and to impose those consequences without further delay.”
you don't have any eu allies and nato is your shell game. wake up. mccain is such an a**hole why spend any time listening to this turncoat.
and what will the other fruit`cake... lindsey graham have to say, once the military cuts, cross the great state of n.carolina...
whoa is me[ow?]???
I call on McCain to shut his pie hole.
Meanwhile in another very stable, productive and happy part of the world...
"the men were wearing uniforms when they stormed the railway station"
Knife-wielding men attack train station in Chinahttp://www.cbsnews.com/news/deadly-knife-attack-at-china-train-station/
Ukraine and Peter Schiff: Recovery Fantasy, Dollar Crash Below 80.00 And Gold "Wall of Worry".
Peter Schiff is discussing the very weak economic data released this week, Gold market's "Wall of Worry" in mass media and Gold stocks potential. We will add to the discussion the main development for us this week. It is the situation in Ukraine, which came almost out of nowhere for a lot of investors and now threatens the stability in Europe at least and has caused the major decline in US Dollar below the very important level of 80.00.Obama can have his own war finally after the few unsuccessful attempts with YouTube evidence in Syria. We do hope that it will be only Financial War and we can see the first rounds of it this week. Initially US Dollar went up on the escalation of the situation in Ukraine - as any potential military action in the world is supposed to be positive for the U.S. Military Complex, but on Friday with major headlines from Moscow about Ukraine Dollar has dived decisively below 80.00 to the 79.78 close.After these U.S. actions in Ukraine considered as an insult by the Kremlinthe least you can expect is selling of the US Treasuries by Russia and, maybe, already accelerating of selling by China as well . They have been already smelling the rat about the USTs Game Of Musical Chairs for a long time. It is just too personal. None of these two countries - or it will be better say leaders - would like to be liberated next in any circumstances.
The big difference with Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Syria is that all those countries can not be compared to Russia and China even close. These two countries have means to make life very messy for everybody involved and U.S. has managed to be involved with both. It is getting very fast very hot in Ukraine with Russia and you can imaging who is orchestrating China - Japan confrontation as well. It is not the way to make friends and find the new buyers for U.S. Debt or even retain the old ones. Are those people who write the teleprompter for Obama just went totally crazy? We do not think so. Unfortunately the friends are lost long time along the way with ongoing US Treasury sales by Russia and China and diversification out of US Dollar. Now we are witnessing the very dangerous play with the last asset left in U.S. from Super Power stage - its Military Complex. There is nothing to match it in the open confrontation, but if we will be all lucky to exclude mutual nuclear distraction, we can expect a lot of asymmetrical steps from the Rising Powers. Ongoing Financial War can now be considered to be escalating to the dramatically new levels. Gold was managed to the downside to hide the ongoing disaster at least for the weekend. The opening of Gold market in Asia on Sunday evening will be very interesting with the ongoing escalation in Ukraine and reported authorisation by the Russian Upper House of Parliament the use of military force in Crimea to insure "stability in the region". http://sufiy.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/ukraine-and-peter-schiff-recovery.ht...
Christiane Amanpour having a hissy fit on CNN.
She has steam coming out of her ears:
"How dare the Russians do this, they have no right, they are breaking U.N. conventions! Russia will be outside international law! Everyone needs to take a step back and use diplomacy!"
ROFLMAO!!! Armchair diplomat pretending to be a journalist.
Hey Christiane, is Obama and the U.S. droning Women and Children in Pakistan against International law?
How about U.S. CIA and Black Ops helping Hezbollah and other radical Jihadist's to perform a coup in Syria?
Fucktwat.
reminds me of the preacher who, at the end of his sunday sermon, exclaimed: god dammit i left my cigarettes at the whorehouse!
Edit: CIA helping Al-Qaeda to perfom a coup in Syria.
Hezbollah (and Iran+Russia+China) on the side of President Bashar Al-Assad.
You are correct - Al Qaeda - thanks.
pepe escobar does a nice make?up job on amanpour @
http://atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/CEN-05-280214.html
I used to like her but now her makeup would have to include a bottle of tequila, for me.
Obama can't get Obongo out of the mud hut, or Tututsi out of the Ghetto, how could he even attempt to get Putin(rocks) out of the Ukraine.
"but he (Putin) definitely does not want it to join the EU or Nato."
neither the EU or NATO want the Ukes (remember Georgia??). western Uk is a failed state. the east will band with Russia. the IMF isn't going to lend them any cash and neither is the EU, Barry will have to do it. lol. Putin just has to wait as it all falls apart and with a little luck he may be able to bag the neo-Nazis in the bargain.
Obama can't get Obongo out of the mud hut, or Tututsi out of the Ghetto, how could he even attempt to get Putin(rocks) out of the Ukraine.
ENOUGH WITH THIS PROPAGANDA ALREADY... HALF OF UKRAINE DOES NOT CONSIDER THE NEW POWER LEGITAMITE. http://rt.com/news/donetsk-kharkov-ukraine-protest-365/
Quoting the Russia Times?
Rt is more unbiased than anything we have in the states. Sad, but true.
Is "Legitamite" the new competitor to Vegemite?
"Half the salt and twice the amount of used motor oil!"
ENOUGH WITH THIS PROPAGANDA ALREADY... HALF OF UKRAINE DOES NOT CONSIDER THE NEW POWER LEGITAMITE. http://rt.com/news/donetsk-kharkov-ukraine-protest-365/
half and half? that's really a close one.
all they need to do now is convince one person to change sides and then that "half" would build a democratic majority.
All Russian imports flow through Europe. It is doubtful that Russia will aggravate the Germans enough to fire up an old East German born Chancellor.
Zero Hedgers, there is a reason why China and Russia are wanna be super powers. Geography limits their actions. Must be able to control the trade routes.
Is this any different than Iraq when our wannabe cowboy who imitated a President decided to invade that country due to the "incontrovertible evidence" that there were weapons of mass destruction? Only to be shown what a pompous ass and liar he was. So, they start a war. Not a good idea but we start wars all the time and they are contained. As long as Michele, eh, I mean President Obama, keeps playing golf and does not say anything, it will remain a local conflict. If she demands, oh sorry, if He makes demands, then it could escalate. But for now, let us hope he and she just keep wasting our tax payer dollars with trips on Air Force One, vacations with all the "kids" and continue spending money we will never have.
Who wants war? That's your enemy.
dup
"One crucial stat missing from this graph. How many nuclear war heads each? Note that this is the FIRST TIME in history that the forces of one nuclear power have invaded the territory of another nuclear power. The stakes here are high - and the consequences of overreaction/miscalucation by one side or another are inconceivable. Make no mistake - something wicked this way comes...."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_and_Ukraine
Ukraine has no nukes.
What? No, Ukraine will likely be divided up and Russia will gain Crimea. I doubt there will be much fight about that fact. The stakes are not high for me as I have no stake in Ukraine. Russians do not care about Western Ukraine. I had to ask what would become of Western Ukraine. Russians say they do not care. Putin is a prick.
Hey Putin, why did all of your breedable aged women leave if you were so awesome? How does that work? Ukranian women did the same thing.
Looks we have turned into UkraineHedge here. It looks like Putin is making his play. Some Russians are calling him the new Hitler. Some 140,000 eastern Ukrainians are flooding into Russia right now and my Mother-in-law is concerned because she lives in the region and owns property there. It sounds like Crimea is going be annexed.
I asked about Western Ukraine and I was told "Fuck them, they can have their chickens and goats and go with the Poles. All industry is in the East of Ukraine." One thing I had not heard is that at least some of this fight club had to do with language. Apparently, their was a ban on the use of Russian language in Ukraine and this is what set the Russians off at least from a general populace point of view. I was told that Ukranian language is a bullshit made up language. Really? As long as anyone can understand what my raised middle finger means then I don't see a problem.
The other thing I was told/asked is "What is the US or EU going to do about it?" Indeed. I said that we should do nothing. "That's right." I was told. There was some pretty bold Russian talk about their military prowess, shock troops and equipment so I asked if the Russians remembered the "Winter War" with Finland? Most of them seem not to remember. My son is named in honor of Simo Hayha. I slipped that by the Russian Mrs. M when I chose the name for my son. Too late now. Ukranians do remember the Great Famine as well.
I advised to be very careful. I have plenty of surplus ammunition but I have never seen large quantities of anything come out of Ukraine and when you do see it, it is expensive. That means they likely kept most of it and who knows where it is?
Bulgaria is likely next on Putin's slate. My Aunt-in-Law has no heat in her flat as of yesterday and it is not because she couldn't pay. I believe that some ZH servers are located in Bulgaria as well. The original ZH Tyler knows there could be problems.
Predictions of 'false flag' events in Ukraine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rq5uOe7kzkI
Marvellous work by the chess player: the Russians are exactly where 'americans' want them to be.
That showdown will do wonders when it is time to cast a vote (as Russia has no other choice but to accept that outcome), no doubt that ukrainian voters will give some knee jerking reactions. As Putin was caught by surprise by the 'american' negro in Washington, it is doubtful the russian side even fields a viable candidate to the incoming election.
And then, 'americans' will use the legitimacy of the popular vote (WeThePeople), the same legitimacy they denied to the other guy, the fleeing one, to install a trojan horse on the russian borders.
'Americans' love to picture themselves as fearless conquerors. It might explain why they picture Putin so out of tone. Because 'american' ways have no changed since 1776,July,4th. So their game is known. Apparently, even when given the modus operandi, a mastermind like Putin fails to play something else but the 'american' game.
LOL. I happen to be good at conjunctions and syntax. A native English speaker you are.:-) Dobrya ootra. What about the "citizenism" part? You are out of practice.
http://homment.com/ukraine-klitschko
Newsticker Ukraine
Latest Videos Ukraine
Interesting... now do one for "United States and Iraq". Or "United States and Afghanistan". Or "United States and Grenada". Or "United States and Vietnam".
Folks who bleat that Russia's decision to intervene to prevent a US-backed coup in a country on its own border is hors jeu because of an assymmetry in economic and military power, need to be forced to acknowledge the same comparison regarding the US invasion of Iraq (300m vs 20m - the equivalent of an NFL offensive tackle kicking the fuck out of a toddler).
As an anarchist, I sincerely hope that the parasitic cunts who live in palaces (like the one at 1600 Penn Ave in DC) find a way to kill each other off without doing too much damage to the citizenry - but the brute fact is that these vermin are prepared to set the world ablaze for no other reason than to avert the attention of the bottom half of the Bell Curve from the fact that they are going backwards in purchasing-power terms (a process that has been taking place since Eisenhower).