This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
Flight MH-17 Black Box Reveals "Massive Explosive Decompression"
While it was already reported that the black boxes of flight MH 17 were supposedly not tempered with, despite early propaganda attempts via planted YouTube clips to claim otherwise (clips which have since disappeared replaced by other propaganda), the question of what the data recovery team operating in London would find was unanswered, until earlier today when CBS reported that "unreleased data" from a black box retrieved from the wreckage of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 in Ukraine show findings consistent with the plane's fuselage being hit multiple times by shrapnel from a missile explosion.
"It did what it was designed to do," a European air safety official told CBS News, "bring down airplanes."
The official described the finding as "massive explosive decompression."
Of course none of this is surprising, and has been widely known from the beginning: it was also widely known that the black box would provide no additional information on the $64K question: whose missile was it, and was it a missile launched from the ground or an air-to-air missile fired by a fighter jet.
Perhaps a better question is who is leaking the "unreleased data" and what propaganda is it meant to achieve in what is, as we said a week ago, nothing but a propaganda war on both sides.
As for the real questions the "released" black box data should reveal, they remain as follows:
i) why was the plane diverted from its traditional flight path; and
ii) what was said between the pilots and air traffic control in the minutes before the crash.
Recall that the Ukraine secret service confiscated the ATC conversation logs a week ago, and the fate of said conversations has been unknown ever since, something that Malaysian Airlines revealed to the public promptly after its other, just as infamous plane anomaly, flight MH 370 disappeared forever from radar.
»
- 75523 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -
1) The rebels shot down an An-26 three days before.
2) Each Buk launcher has it's own basic radar targeting (although maybe not as sophisticated as the integrated system of an entire unit would be)
It's these two facts that make a deliberate attempt to bait a trap possible. Without them it would almost certainly be an accident where a missile launched at an Su-25 simply missed and locked on to an airliner.
You have confused a shot at a plane at low altitude in order to take off or land and a shot at an airliner at cruising altitude like MH17.
MANPADS can hit the former, not the later.
"so questioning the official narrative of events is a mental disorder in your opinion?"
9/11 -> WMD -> Niger -> Yellowcake -> Valerie Plame.
What's not to believe?
The best of ziobonics
I donno, I kinda is. Running tricks on dumbasses is what life is about.
Mohammad was a Jew. Allah is a Jew. Gabriel is a Jew. Ishmael was a Jew.
Are you jewish?
There's another way to look at this:
Dear less-fit humans. How does it feel to be SO stupid as to fall for the same scams over and over and over for generations? Why don't you worthless losers just fess-up that you're genetically inferior, and kill yourselves and your worthless DNA bling.
Survival of the fittest, BITCHZZZZ!!!
NotRealAmerican
In Soviet it was a clear sign of mental disorder not to believe in the government.
Replace with an other government, and presto. Funny how thing tend to go around.
Gaza slaughter is up now to 1000+, happy yet or do you need more?
Maybe you and Jumbotroll can fly together to Israel and kill some more?!
(I think air and sea ports in Gaza are closed for the duration)
I don't know who shot down the plane, but one thing is pretty sure, Putin (the KGB asshole) had fuck all to do with it, so start looking somewhere else, how about the ATC recordings?
Can you ask the Nazis/Mafiosos in Kiev for them pls.
The mysterious shadowing Ukrainian fighter jet proposed by the Russian side has a double purpose. No, it didn't shoot the civilian flight down... nobody would believe it, so they don't insist on it (only zh lowly trolls). What you'll hear next is the admission that, yes, the "rebels" did fire the missile and the target was the fighter jet but it "mistakenly" took the passenger jet down. That way they avoid the responsibility as a terrorist/war act, as it was "not intentional".
As I've pointed out at least twice, the problem with this otherwise most coherent theory so far is that there is no reason to believe the rebels' air defense capabilities were sufficient to accomplish this. The Buk battalion would have to have been quite close to the flight path of the Ukrainian jet given its limited effective range without central radar which the rebels do not possess. This makes the airliner's course change much more interesting. It all had to be very very close to (or inside) the rebel controlled territory, or their very limited air defense would never have detected anything at all and the whole western media narrative would be absurd on its face.
If the course change was not ordered by the airline itself (which is very unlikely and should be easy to confirm), it is the smoking gun.
without central radar which the rebels do not possess
The system needs three units/cars to work: the command, the launch unit and the radar. It is very unlikely that they had access to two but not the third. I don't think that the system can operate without its own radar or, if not available, without access to any other data link. *IF* they didn't have the radar they must have had access to a data link.
If the Russians can prove that there was an Ukrainian fighter anywhere near the passenger jet (they said they have this data), it is not difficult to assume that this data could also be fed to the rebels system in case they didn't have their radar operating.
In the end, despite all the smoke and mirrors, I expect the Russian rebels to admit the "mistake" and offer an apology. It is a matter of who to blame: operator incompetence or system inability to differentiate a target (or abort). Maybe both.
All Ukrainan fighters were shot down flying at low altitudes using infrared-guided missiles that autonomously lock to the target.
The rebels have probably also SA-9 missiles, able to hit up to 5000 mt., but effectively launching a BUK, that is a radar-guided missile, hitting a target at 11 Km. if far beyond the rebels' capacity. It should have been a lucky hit, as probable as winning the lottery.
It is much more probable that the Ukrainans did it. I estimate 10% the rebels, 90% the Ukrainans. The issue is that, if the culprits are the rebels, they aimed to an Ukrainan aircraft, and hit by error a civil aircraft that should not have been there. If the culprits are the Ukrainans, most probably it is not an error, but a crime in cold blood.
The rebels shot down an An-26 at above MANPAD altitude three days before MH17. That's when some airlines diverted.
So far Kiev has released a video supposedly of a Buk system crossing the border into Russia, some still pictures of a supposed Russian Buk on Ukrainian territory, and an audio tape of rebels supposedly taking credit for shooting down the airliner. The video was actually shot in a government-held town 300km from the border; the "Russian" Buk has Ukrainian Army markings; and the audio tape was spliced together from unrelated recordings and created the day before MH-17 was shot down.
Everything, all the evidence, released by Kiev to date has been proven faked.
The Ukrainian government is sure acting guilty. I think it's 100% they did it, planned it in advance, and the U.S. government participated in it. The shootdown was precisely timed so that a U.S. surveillance satellite was directly overhead, and a U.S. ship was in the Black Sea to communicate with the satellite. As for the plane's change of route, it appears to have changed course while still over Poland - another country possibly involved.
"Everything, all the evidence, released by Kiev to date has been proven faked".
By who, a bunch of internet Nancy Drew's? You've just chosen to believe what you want to believe. Nothing has been proven yet.
You're correct, flights do get diverted all of the time... Just generally not over HOT war zones.
Not only a war zone, but an area with no civilian radar coverage.
For as many terrible things the CIA has done over the years, the rise in "don't trust the MSM" sentiment is perfectly concurrent with the rise of Russian state media propaganda. 10 years ago, the Russians simply didn't have the myriad English-language news services they have now.
Now, I'm not saying the Russians or their rebels actually brought the plane down, but I WOULD like to illustrate that many Americans critical of America now fancy themselves smart, edgy, "free" thinkers simply as a result of buying into Russian propaganda.
Propaganda is still propaganda, folks.
And they are experts at it and have been doing it for years. Propaganda and even dis-information from Russia has been making it's way into US and western culture for decades.
Spot on comment!
.... and the USA with its totally Zionist controlled MSM would never engage in any sort of propaganda on its sheeple would it?
If this is an example of the quality of the sock puppetry I am getting for my tax dollars, I want my money back.
The men in black, ISIS, have a lot of nice Ford F-150's and Abe's Toyota HiLux, I think you are into something.
just a question here, but could a bomb being detonated inside the airplane also account for massive explosive decompression?
I mean we are accepting it as fact that the plane was shot down, yet no evidence has been presented to establish that as such.
how can the who and why be established when we don't yet even know the how?
one thing is clear though, Washington has hit peak warmongering idiots looking to get a lot of people killed.
Only if the bomb is very large or is multiple explosives as one smallish bomb would result in a big hole blown out of the fuselage or the aircraft breaking up into large pieces as with Lockerbie and Flight 800.
Maybe someone "tempered" with the black box?
It could have been "the Jews", or "Poppy Busch"
you keep forgetting to mention "Darth Cheney"
silly boy
Speaking of TWA Flight 800 isn't it time to drag out the same animation team to show what really happened?
Yes. Any kind of explosion around the general vicinity of the airplane would cause a "massive decompression" if it was big enough to blast through the side of the plane. There was a flight that had full oxygen containers stored incorrectly in its hull. They exploded. There was a spike in the air pressure recorded on the plane's flight data which coincided with the explosion.
Basically a bomb, a missile, or any other type of explosive apparatus would have registered as a spike in the air pressure surrounding the data recorder followed by decompression.
Pictures of pieces of the cockpit, fuselage, and wings show piercing inward of shrapnel from a ground-to-air missile hit.
http://theaviationist.com/2014/07/24/mh-17-puncture-marks/
There are better angles to that pic. Some of those holes look like they are pushed out not in.
http://i.imgur.com/jwlle5I.jpg
Is that a naked guy and gal in the white car?!?
How do you know it was sam and not aam? I have downvoted you fro propaganda, hence.
In response to ebwothen:
The article at the link which you have given in your post appears to have been removes. I only get a "the aviationist" website page with this info.
Is the url wrong or have the website page been removed ?
It's already been determined they've found shrapenel damage (consistent with a missle attack) on the skin of the aircraft.
http://time.com/3032691/investigators-examine-shrapnel-like-holes-in-mh1...
mossad runs the security at that dutch airport.
bomb is the most simple option.
these zionist cunts been pullin the same stunt off for decades
this story changes so fast, I can't even make a credible comment
Seperatists with a weapon they should not have control over. IMO
They should be looking for empty wine bottles in the rocket launcher(s).
Someone was whooping it up till they realized they screwed the pooch.
'jimstonefreelance' has done interesting reporting on MH 17. He elaborates on early reports from rebels who stated that the bodies were stinkers and bloodless. http://www.jimstonefreelance.com/
No thinking person can accept anything released by the United Kingdom team supposedly investigating black box records. Why? Well, the UK is simply Washington DC on the Thames. Whatever the White House and CIA team tells the UK to find, the UK will find. Nobody is there looking over their shoulders, or will be allowed a dual track investigation. Nope, it is the honest UK team behind locked doors with gunmen guarding the facility. They have days and weeks to produce any result that Washington wants.
Ukraine is shelling a city of a million people with multiple rocket launchers, un-guided rockets. Nobdy believes Kiev does anything without their masters in Washington DC giving the orders. So Obama has signed off on clear war crimes. 19 people blown up this moring in one city alone. Kiev is prepared to do this on orders. The UK is no different. They will release whatever best serves the propaganda war for the USAS side.
I'de like to hear anyone who believes this is going to be a free, fair and open investigation to explain why they believe that, and how we in the public can know this will be the case.
It's clear a missiles knocked the plane down. Was it air to air or was it surface to air. The body of the plane should make that clear, very clear. The difference in damage would be clear at first sight. Either way, "who benefits" by this plane coming down?" "Who sent it over the war zone?" "Who ordered it right over Donetsk and the souther battle field?" "Who ordered it to deop altitude right over the air warfare battle zone?" "Who let it anywhere near a place everyone knew was a zone of anti aircraft warfare?" Even if a rebel missile did it, these other questions are damning on their own. "What was Ukraine's jet fighter doing in the flight zone of the Air Liners?" Evidence given weeks ago revealed that Kiev's bombers used Air Liners as cover both before and after a bombing run. The Youtube videos of witnesses were up over a months ago detailing this tatic. I read and watched this evidence at the time and wondered why international air authorities were not acting on these claims. At the time this Air Craft was shot down, Two Kiev's bombers were in it's near vicinity. Witness statements were recorded at the time, all saying two Ukie jets were up there with the Air Liner.
So Kiev is blameless, and the UK will reveal the truth? Sure, We really are that stupid.
The only value of the CVR is the cockpit/ATC conversation before the attack. After the moment of the attack, it's most likely everyone on board (including the pilots) was rendered unconscious or instantly killed by the force of the blast, deceleration and/or explosive decompression.
The FDR will certainly show more detailed flight parameters including decent rate, pressurization, etc...
I really don't know what more they expect to learn from either device...
Probable Cause: The aircraft was attacked by a surface (or air) to air missile.
Consider the black boxes a useful as Lois Lerner's hard drives.
Since the globalists are attempting to take over the world from out of London can't there be a revolution agaist England or something like that. Supposedly it was done in the past.
What is the composition of the recovery team? Are there technicians from Russia, China or other countries non belonging to NATO, ASEAN or the like?
If all technicians belong to Western countries, and are nominated by the PTB, the recorders can be easily tampered with, and whatever comes out, serious doubts will remain.
Everyone relax about the team composition. Russia made copies. The box has a data port.
Here is an EXACT & meticulous examination of the MH17 flight path ... from the Russian military.
... rather than just the laughable Facebook/Twitter & MSM "proof" .
Short summary :
Here is the Video in Russian with German subtitles :
# The weather was overcast, and MH-17 was flying above the clouds. Without radar, the rebels would have had to see the plane to shoot at it with a Buk. It became visible only after it descended in altitude, and then was visible for only 70 seconds or so before it was out of range.
REVREX is that like an Acronym for something?
Sadly it seems, you are Neither Revered, a Reverend or a Rex (king), at least here, where people give Respect, Reverence, or Kingship (like Dr Engali) to those deserving
It is an anagram of Err, Vex. Which is pretty much what he tries to do.
That would suggest the missile didn't hit. The explosion breached, plane was lost by decompression. Who knows..
Antiaircraft missiles are not designed to hit the target but to explode as close as possible and cause enough secondary damage to bring it down.
Thats why thy are called missiles and not hitilles! For real!
A BUK missile explodes in the vicinity of an aircraft, sending rods (I think) to actually hit it.
I read that the remains of the cockpit show evidence of this.
Small air to air missiles carry small rods packed around the explosive war head. The large BUK missile carries a different and larger form of shrapnel around it's war head. The two types make different patterns on the skin of an sircarft hit by it. That is why I say a simple look at the plane wreckage should confirm in minutes what type of missile hit it.
Different marks of missiles carry different warhead designs. Early Aim9 Sidewinder air to airs like the 9G had rods packed around the explosive, later marks like the 9L had a blast/frag not rod warhead. You are right that the qwreakage should reveal the damage mechanism, but it isnt simple to allocate schrapnel to a missile as often the same warhead components can be fitted to different missiles. It may take skilled investigators to identify the schrapnel in the wreakage debris.
Different marks of missiles carry different warhead designs. Early Aim9 Sidewinder air to airs like the 9G had rods packed around the explosive, later marks like the 9L had a blast/frag not rod warhead. You are right that the qwreakage should reveal the damage mechanism, but it isnt simple to allocate schrapnel to a missile as often the same warhead components can be fitted to different missiles. It may take skilled investigators to identify the schrapnel in the wreakage debris.
So we come back to the same question. What drone took it out at 33,000(plus/Minus) altitude?
http://theaviationist.com/2014/07/24/mh-17-puncture-marks/
SAMs aren't designed to hit. They're designed to get close and then explode firing shrapnel everywhere - which is what the wreckage looks like.
We won't ever know who actually shot it down, though many of us can guess, but Israel and their DC US bulldog are responsible.
Cookies anyone?!
No thanks...
https://www.ghostery.com/en/download
Don't forget to backup with:
https://www.abine.com
Wnks. Hope your doing well.
Yep..thanks LB... ;-)
Lifeboatwithducktape. What a blast from the past. Shhhh, be quiet. winks.
and exactly what does the debris field
reveal?
now that we know that truth, full spin ahead
US Intelligence: Russia Didn’t Do It
By Paul Craig Roberts
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article39222.htm
Nothing from that black box can be concluded for certain until it proves once and for all that Putin himself pulled the trigger. Only at that point will no further question be tolerated.
Putin was busy elsewhere throwing babies from icubators,raping nuns,making
soap, and lampshades from human skin.
Oh wait , that was the Kaiser according to western newspapers in 1914.
If it ain't broke, don't rewrite it.
putin was head of the kgb!!! they were commies (i think). kgb is really bad, bad guys. (sarc).
i will never forget taking a taxi very late one night in nyc when one of the first of the wave of middle east taxi drivers came.
(1991)
he said '10 years ago - if somebody had told you the head of the cia who had never before been elected to office, would become the president of the united states, you would have laughed. now look'.
but of course - the kgb and cia are different.
what i mean to say is - you guys can't have it both ways? or maybe you can. you decide. i already have.
Case for a Bomb
"In 2009, Umar Mutallab, a mentally defective young African student whose banking family has close CIA/Mossad ties, was arrested in Detroit.
"He had a bomb in his underwear. Mutallab was sitting in a VIP First Class seat on a plane that took off from Schipol Airport in Amsterdam, where ill-fated MH17 took off also. Mutallab arrived from Lagos without a passport or visa or even ticket. He was escorted through Schipol, around border control by former Mossad agents working for ICTS, the Israeli company that runs security at that and many other airports.
"He was then put on a plane for the US, walked around more security, no ticket, no passport, no visa, no luggage, unwashed, incoherent and put in a $20,000 seat by “a man in a suit.” Detroit attorney Kurt Haskell and his wife saw it all and went to the authorities. This is their statement, made just prior to the trial of Mutallab in Detroit:
“With jury selection set to begin in the Underwear Bomber Trial set to begin tomorrow, I’ve spent the evening reminiscing about Christmas Day 2009 and the 21 months since. The Underwear Bomber attack has fundamentally changed my life. Not in the way most would think, but it has destroyed any faith I’ve had in the U.S. Government, the media and this country as a whole. To say that I believe the government is corrupt and the media is complicit doesn’t fully explain my beliefs. Not only have I come to those conclusions, but I’ve witnessed that an ordinary person who sees something important can be silenced despite his efforts to spread the truth. Such is the Underwear Bomber case. I can do nothing but laugh at the TSA’s new policy of ‘If you see something say something.’ That is exactly what I did, and not only did the US Government not want to hear what I had to say, but it actively lied about it, attempted to get me to change my story, and hid, by withholding (secret government) evidence or putting a protective order on the evidence and nearly everything that would support my eyewitness account.”
What we can prove, beyond doubt, is that security at Schipol Airport places bombs on planes. Moreover, what is not seen, certainly not on satellite which could show this very clearly, is how widespread the wreckage is from MH17.
Everyone has seen photos of huge sections of the plane, pristine and uncharred. There is never context for where these are but simply photos showing them “un-adjacent” to the crash scene, as though they had floated down from 33,000 feet as a result of a large internal explosion.
This is not how a BUK system works. A BUK tracks a radio signal put out by an aircraft engine. Every jet engine is a type of radio transmitter and missiles are attuned to these frequencies. They fly near the engine where a proximity fuse detects the plane. The missile explodes sending 70 pounds in this case, of steel ball bearings into the engine, fuel lines and hydraulic controls. This engine will stop, a fire will erupt and the plane will lose control and fall to earth in one piece.
In most cases, the tail section breaks off at impact and suffers less damage but is found close by. In the case of the plane that is said to have hit the Pentagon on 9/11, there was no tail section or wings or luggage or passengers, in fact no wreckage at all,"
When a plane blows up like this, one of the easiest things to determine is whether the explosion came from the inside or outside.
And I would assume that they will be able to tell if it was popped more than once and by what. The jig is up. Of course CIA et al. will do a Sgt. Schultz.
Best bet is one hit by an A-to-A missile and a second one by an S-to-A. Should all be identifiable.
"In most cases, the tail section breaks off at impact and suffers less damage but is found close by. In the case of the plane that is said to have hit the Pentagon on 9/11, there was no tail section or wings or luggage or passengers, in fact no wreckage at all,"
An interesting fiction.
http://www.911myths.com/index.php/American_Airlines_Flight_77
DebrisVideo
A worker examines plane debris
Photos
I felt sorry for you RevRex, so I UpVoted you for saying "Cowardly Pussies."
BTW, it is Poppy "Bush."
The other "Busch" makes beer, although some claim it is beer for cowardly pussies.
No, they don't, actually.
They sold out a few years back to the European conglomerate Inbev.
The State Department Zombies have not arrived yet. Don't they clock in till late on Saturdays? Wake up boys, the topic needs influencing.
Last night I read a nice report on how Israel has 4,000 posters busy working social media sites to get the pro Israel posts onto all sites where the topic of massacre in Gaza is going on. These are official paid posters. Secondary programs at universities and schools offer scholarships to those who put in a certain amount of hours on blogs, discussion boards, comments sections and social media, posting pro Israel posts and attacking or diverting anyone exposing Israeli crimes.
Every nation currently has spy agencies and their supporters doing the same thing. Not saying it is right but it is being done. You think the NSA is not using this technique?
Do you actually believe that the most intelligent, computer savvy, chess masters of the universe, the Russians are not doing the same? How else could they counter all of the CIA/MOSSAD sponsored crimes happening in the Ukraine as we speak?
If it were not for the active use of the Internet by pro Russian AstroTurfer's some people would believe the lie that pro-Russian freedom fighters had something to do with deaths of 298 innocent civilians on flight MH17.
We must consult the Black Box (Cube). It knows all
https://hollywoodtvsubliminals.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/black-cube-of...
The black cubes can't balance on a corner below the equator?
Absolutely
I have a small blog and I get spam every other day coming from an Ip at Berkley. Several such as foghornleghorn, Guiseppe Bo Beppe, whitesnakehunter eagle, Salvatore and other names arise from the same place, somewhere between the admin building and the bike path at Berkely. The gist is mostly defending the catholic church and the jesuits.
Berkeley. It's not too difficult, 8 letters
#figureitout (1)
This may be leaked information but it isn't really new news. There's already been enough photos published of fuselage and wing sections to see they're peppered with shrapnel holes from a missile hit.
I believe there was also some evidence that the right-hand engine was hit in the rear by a missile causing the plane to veer to the left before another proximity missile did the shrapnel damage. Meaning it was probably hit by two missiles, the first one air-to-air (from the Ukie SU-25 jet that was trailing it) and the second one probably surface-to-air from the ground.
But as we can see in the CBS article, the Dutch - after bitterly complaining about the slowness of locals to deal with the corpses - are in no hurry themselves to get to the crash site:
Can't disagree with the black box now can we? that would b rayciss.
http://aanirfan.blogspot.de/2014/07/mh17-ukraine-and-gaza.html
The downing of MH17 'was a failed false flag event.'
MH17: US-Kiev cover-up of failed false flag operation. - 21stcenturywire.com
1. Malaysian Airlines say that Ukrainian Air Traffic Control ordered MH17 off of its original flight path and into the war zone.
Israelis are murdering children in Ukraine.
In addition, Kolomoisky has relied on the help of ex-Israel Defense Force (IDF) ever since he helped oust Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych in February.
The tragedy of the shoot down of MH17, or any other false flag, is that those who suffer – and those who complain – have no knowledge how to make men accountable for the evil they do.
In fact, there may be only a handful of men on this planet who have this knowledge. And, I think I can safely say that, most – maybe all – of them learned all, or part, of it from my website, books or experience.
Make men accountable for their evil… only I have this knowledge… big words, aren’t they? And, yet, no one challenges me.
Until men learn lessons I recovered from old law and history books, men only pretend reason or justice; and more men, women and children must die (an introduction).
All for the sake of ignorance… or, is it apathy?
Still waiting for the loud cries from the West that Ukraine turn over the missing ATC tapes now that the black boxes have been turned over and examined.
Either Putin has made another blunder or is waiting to make a skillful chess move. He should not have turned over both recorders. The Russians should have had the other recorder downloaded while observed by a multinational team of observers and all parties given copies of the data on the spot.
The current investigators can and will release the data bits and pieces that supports their propaganda. Other data will be withheld or deleted. Or simply falsified.
And massive explosive decompression is consistent with many events not just missle fragments. And, if a missle, it could be from an air to air missle launched by the Ukran military jet that was trailing the airliner. And as has been discussed the surface to air missle was to finish the take down due to the plane turning and flying in a new direction instead of just going down.
"He should not have turned over both recorders."
On the contrary, it was the best of possible moves.
Imagine you've just been handed a black box with an unbroken chain of custody....
By the guy you've already accused of the crime!
Now what do you do?
The clear implication is they don't need the black box to make their case.
and even if that's not true, you still have to proceed as if it were!
Game
Set
Match
so, what's for lunch?
Putin never had the recorders. The rebels collected them and turned them over to the international investigators in Donetsk.
A better question is "who gives a phuck." The Russians have already said they don't care about the dead Dutch or Malaysians and now they're openly shelling Ukrainians across an internationally recognized border without cause or provocation.
In short "at War, committing atrocities against Civilians and darn proud of it!"
He and Netanyahu should both be sent to Nuremberg for trial and hanging.
Be happy that it's Putin and not Netanyahu leading Russia.
Oh, I get it, you're a nazi.
When the vet says he is disabled, he is not kidding.
"He and Netanyahu should both be sent to Nuremberg for trial and hanging."
I think you meant to say for hanging and trial.
Massive Explosive Decompression sounds like what happened in the toilet this morning after those 6 pints and a large platter of chili cheese fries! Yum!
I thought somebody sectioned you
At the Russian press conference beginning of this week it was said that (all Moskow time)
at 5.20pm the plane changed flight course to 300 degrees and lost speed dramatically,
at 5.21pm the plan was roughly above stall speed
at 5.23pm the plane crashed.
With a shoot down first hand you wont have these flight patterns. So the million dollar question is what happened before the plane was shoot down?
Will we ever hear the truth?
RH engine was hit by a missile.
With a shoot down first hand you wont have these flight patterns.
You are completely making this up. You have no idea what the flight pattern should have been of a passenger jet hit by this missile.
One of several explanations floating around goes like this:
MH17 was initially hit by a small AA missile which knocked out one of the engines. It did a 180 and started looking for a place to do an emergency landing. As it descended, it was hit by a second, SA missile. This versiion has both missiles fired by UA forces.
I have no idea, really, so you can take that with a block of salt.
...or the simpler explanation is that a civilian aircraft, hit my a miltary missile designed to take down hardened military hardware, was hit in an engine and did not break apart for a few moments. The structural damage was not survivable, and the plane broke apart moments later.
For what its worth, here is an interesting version of MH17 events written by the Commie A-holes at Global Research:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/mh17-verdict-real-evidence-points-to-us-kiev-cover-up-of-failed-false-flag/5393317
Okay, you did not ask for it but here is my best guess...
The Russian supported rebels did it, BUT there is proof that they were tricked into doing it by mistake. The US was part of the process of tricking them. The US has proof the Ruskies did it, but inside that proof is also proof that they were lured to do it by Kiev and the US. Putin is asking the US, who had their satellite in place for the event, to cough up that proof because Putin knows that all this activity was recorded. US won't cough it up.
1. They have this tech where the passenger plane can be made to register as if it is a military cargo plane (is it called spoofing?). This is real, it exists, they have been playing with it this year earlier, it has been in the news. Fighters have also been flying behind passenger planes, diving down to bomb, and then taking cover again behind the passenger planes. That last point is not something official, but eyewitness testimony from a young female rebel. She seemed credible. Both of these items could be possible reasons for the rebels to fire mistakenly.
2. The plane is rerouted against the pilot's wishes. He is reassured by being told that he will be escorted by Kiev fighter planes. Later they went and pulled all the communications recordings and shut down that Spanish traffic controller who was twittering about the reroute and the pilot's protests. He seems to have disappeared from the scene. All this to cover up that the rerouting had occurred.
3. They do in fact escort the plane with the fighters, but then do the spoofing tech (make the passenger plane register as cargo) and break away before the plane gets fired upon. Both fighter planes do not need to be in on the "plot." They just have to be trusted to do as instructed.
4. The Russian supported rebels, who have recently shot down other cargo planes, think they have shot another one. They even say so when it happens in recorded communications (who leaked those so quickly?). There is a facebook or some other kind of post about it too. Their conversations and posts are pulled when they figure out a fuck up has happened till they know what is going on and how to proceed next. Not the most honorable behavior, but certainly understandable as a standard procedure from the higher ups. The communications at that time appeared to be surprise and regret at the shooting.
6. As I said earlier, Kiev seizes the communications from the control tower. This is such a red flag.
7. US too fast, moves to seize the story line and accuse the rebels. Why do this so fast when you don't have all the facts and may have to recant when you are wrong later? My only answer is because they know they did it because they tricked them into it.
8. US too fast, tells Russia they should "man up" and admit the mistake. Why, because they know it was a mistake because they were tricked into it by Kiev, with the support of US tech.
Notice Russia did not accuse immediately and took time to put together a response. Putin went to church to buy that time for his analysts. Also, unlike the US, they needed time to catch up with the evidence and not accuse willy nilly.
I think it is possible Obama does not know. Not that he is so innocent and nice, just simply he is not in charge. Someone else is running this show, not him. If I am right about that, that should scare us more than this event.
Let's recap:
1) The USA are god-like geniuses and can get anyone to do anything and
2) Everyone else is a moron
This is one of the many mistakes theories like yours make.
Everyone else is not so malleable - you assume near omniscience on the part of the USA, but NO ONE ELSE can do the same and everyone else can be manipulated?
Basically you assume that the USA is God and everyone else on the planet is an idiot.
Ah, but there are holes in this, things are not going as planned and the Russians are competent to defend themselves.
To say this a different way, the USA is not God-like (they are not getting away with it after all [if I was right]), they are arrogant enough or desperate enough to think it could work.
The USA is running out of energy options. They need Ukraine under their control. Russia wants it for similar reasons but they are not so desperate as we are. Kiev was losing and they tried a Hail Mary pass for a win, or at least to give the Kiev fighters another chance to get control of the situation.
All is fair in love and war?
There are holes in this...
does a dildo qualify as love instrument and does fracking in Ukraine qualify as casus belli for war?
As holes make me think gruyere cheese. (I won't suggest other alternatives, as all those girls from Mehico cross the frontier and could be picked up as cheesy meat loaf alternatives).
Don't get sidetracked between "race to bottom" plays between TWO imperial minded constructs.
This whole game is about energy and its controlled by TWO corrupt empires of the West and Near East.
Neither power structure deserves to survive in its present form.
I'm not sure who is downvoting you, but your analysis sums it up pretty well.
In my opinion, it was either the rebels, as you described, mistakenly thinking they are shooting down a military plane (as they are not plugged in to the civil aviation grid), or it was a cynical false flag completely done by some of the various forces representing Kiev (and its current sponsors and alternates), careflully calculated to make the crash end up on rebel turf.
Since the Kiev groups are already shelling civilian neighborhoods, making a half million or so refugees and killing scores of civilians, they probably wouldn't mind knocking down a civilian aircraft.
not that everyone else is an idiot (you idiot), but that western europe is so beholden via the FED printing machine.
come on leraconteur - the major european countries - including holland and it's (LOSSES) can't get it together to put together a team and - recover bodies and start an investigation?
why do you think that is? because big daddy - the pimp master has told them not to. think about why
1 - they are so weak they can't do anything?
2 - if they weren't pussies and did do something, WHAT might they find out?
damn. it really is stupid.
yeah - holland. weep. weep. send your 40 unarmed investigators. how many other of your neighbor countries offered to help?
QED. The USA is an omnipotent entity and everyone else is an idiot.
Did Europe not get it together during the Yugoslavian or Ukrainian Civil Wars because big daddy told them; or is it simply that Europeans have never been able to take collective, decisive action as a group?
You assume, as I pointed out, omniscience and omnipotence on the part of the USA and mewling idiocy on the part of everyone else.
Occam's Razor suggests a simple explanation - so which is simpler?
Omnipotence or a pro-Russian Ukrainian faction shot down an aircraft?
I think that's likely to be close to the gist of it. I think it's possible the Kiev oligarchs were deliberately using airliners as bait but also possible it was accidental with Kiev jets were using airliners as cover i.e. "don't shoot at us or your missile might lock onto to the airliner's much bigger radar signature" but it went wrong.
mscreant - your best post ever. and obama doesn't know - he doesn't want to. he's still afraid of the bullets in his head, because he - KNOWS - more than any of us who he himself really is. (a plant. a decoy). if he doesn't know - he can't say anything wrong.
and that's the deal. whoever is running the cia (really running the cia) did all of exactly what you say. bush senior could have done all of this, but that's 30 years ago. do any of us have any idea who can be planning this stuff.? bush 2 is too stupid, doesn't care (he really isn't that bad a person, i know you will all disagree, when in power, sure, he let cheney and rumsfeld and his dad's friend kill millions, but it wasn't what he wanted to be doing). cheney? not sure....
scary - and !!! points to putin for not falling in line and allowing www3 to start.
Wouldn't a bomb on the plane also create an explosive decompression?
The pictures of the wreckage show shrapnel holes from the outside consistent with a SAM.
OR an AA missile.
Metalurgy of the shrapnel could be conclusive. Totally different alloys are used for
their manufacture.
"The official described the finding as "massive explosive decompression."
That pretty much covers everything from cargo door failure (early DC-10s), to fuselage roof failure ( Hawaiian Airlines sytle), to Briefcase bomb (ala "AirPort"-1969), to a missle shootdown (TWA700), to colliding with an UFO...
Noise... nothing more...
Or, a repeat crime by the folks who gave us the underwear bomber: http://www.veteranstoday.com/2014/07/25/mh17-and-americas-deceitful-game/
Cue state dept sociopaths saying that they can tell it was fired by rebels from the sound it made in 3..2...1
questions without answers; its like what Winston Churchill said :
Russia is a riddle wrapped up in a mystery that is an enigma. But perhaps there is a key : that key is russian national interest.
What Churchill DID not say is that generalisations are TWO edged swords; they expose the postulator (he who advocates the principle) as much as the postulant (the designated candidate).
Now taking that maxim to its alternate (reversed) conclusion : Pax Americana today is a riddle ...
All those who play the GREAT GAME are protagonists of this double language since time immemorial, as demonstrated by rise of Pericles's Athens and the invention of Hegemony in the West (as cut and paste of Persian invasion mantra of Marathonian fame, by Imperial Athens, provoking a knee jerk resistance by rival, militarist, isolationist, reactionary Sparta).
Just a reminder : When Pax Britannica demised in the fall out of 1945 Armageddon, in devastated, fascist Europe, the leaders of yester Western World, the Brits, took two major imperial decisions to pave the way for their designated successors : Pax Americana, winners of D Day and saviors of Britain, "special relationship" anglo cousins-- baton passing, which spawned Reagan-Thatcher neo-con ideology thirty five years later.
1° They made sure that Imperial India would be divided into TWO rival religious factions : India and Pakistan in 1947 to ensure that the divide and rule principle of the Great Game would maintain instability in that "jewel" of the British Raj.
It spawned the ISI-Taliban dystopia-- in US "planned obsolescence " military aid destroyed surrogate Pakistan (from 1956 onwards) and isolated key nation India from west for 40 years.
2° They enacted the Balfour Doctrine in Palestine, by creating a divide and ruin Israel State as new Templar excroissance. To ensure that the OIL PATCH and the SUEZ CANAL, both vital assets of the past Empire, would be preserved as follow on to Sykes-Picot Agreement of WW1 fall out.
It spawned the current ME dystopia of Iron Dome apartheid fame.
FRD's hand shake with Saud and the Ghawar oil discovery did the rest from 1960 onwards.
It explains the genesis of the current Pax Americana power and resources time line.
What the silk and spice routes were for ancient Crusaders, the Oil patch has now become for the new Imperialists of the West.
Oil had already been found in Iraq/Iran/Kuwait/Baku fame in the 30s, before Saud became Mecca of Oil patch...
The west is repeating its Crusader/ Alexandrian/Trojan War time line of past.
Will history repeat with western dominance continuing or is it time for Oriental payback reversing the Trojan War heritage?
After all, The Crusades (or more appropriately its commercial partners Venice and Genoa) brought back the knowledge tree from the Arabs to the West in spite of losing the Crusader War.
Inversion is very much a human trait.
My understanding is that the pilot was "cleared direct" to his next navigation point after avoiding weather. This is a very common ATC procedure; the pilot is under no compunction at all to comply if he thinks it is unsafe.
The only reason you hear Anything about the shoot down on ZH is so you can bash the US. Don't worry Putin has the scoop. and He will release it at the same time the repubicants present an alternative to ACA.
What could be better for a massive propaganda campaign in that the answers are all in a little black box, and when they are revealed all will be known.
But, the Ukraine crisis was never about answers. From its CIA-directed mobs on the streets of Kiev to today’s US headlines, the object has always been Putin.
The decadence of the West, financed by the decadence of fiat money for a socialist one-world state, is confronting a wall of principle in Putin’s Russia – values vs. “freedom.” For Putin’s Administration has been hammering together the values for which civilization fought and on which it was built, the very values that the West has lost.
Therefore Putin is a danger to the neocons’ power base and must be brought down; and given that Ukraine is on Russia’s borders, Ukraine “is a prelude to chaos and the breakdown of order in Russia itself.”
Putin understands this. In his address to NATO in Bucharest in 2008, says Emmanuel Ratisbonne, Putin “had read the Neoconservative plan to turn Ukraine into another Yugoslavia by establishing a state of common ethnic identity.”
In his address, writes Ratisbonne, “he pointed out that 17 million citizens, mostly in eastern Ukraine, were ethnic Russians.”
“So he described events in Kosovo. He stated clearly that if NATO were going to pursue establishing Kosovo as a state because of common ethnic identity, then something similar might happen in Ukraine.
“Ukraine is a nation, like Yugoslavia, that was cobbled together. He also stated that 90 percent of the citizens of Crimea were ethnic Russians.
“Introducing the possibility of NATO base in Ukraine would be precipitous, to say the least.”
Therefore, continued Ratisbonne in Culture Wars’ July/August issue just out: “I think we can safely say that it is the United States and not Russia that is leading the world into the deteriorating situation that it currently finds itself.”
And how are they doing it?
The warmongering neocons pretend to be “incapable of making the distinction between the Russia of 2000 to 2014 and the Russia of 1920 to 1990. That is to say as a modern state that is trying to stabilize herself after 70 years of communism and 10 years of Western looting under the guise of democratic freedom and Russia as a communist state….
“All the neocons can do is repeat empty maxims like, we have to spread freedom wherever we can, and Russia is not free.”
Never do they point out that “by 1999, Russia was on the verge of civil war, caused by the competing oligarchs (mostly Jewish) that then dominated the country” or that “Ukrainians suffered in the 1990s under the IMF regime that left their economy in shambles.”
Instead, says Ratisbonne, using issues like the rock band Pussy Riot that got thrown into jail because it committed blasphemous acts in an Orthodox Church in Russia (it now turns out it was promoted by Westerners interested in this kind of agit-prop to spread chaos in Russian society), the neocons, faced with the choice between freedom and values and choosing “freedom” began pushing the mantra that Putin was against freedom.
But what kind of "freedom"?
The debate and answer took place, writes Ratisboone, “at the beginning of the anti-communist crusade. The question was posed to Bertrand Russell whether secularists should join with Catholics to fight communism. In the opening years of the crusade, Russell’s answer was no. Catholics cannot be trusted. They are ultimately opposed to freedom.
“And what did Russell understand as freedom? Freedom for Russell was sexual liberation, homosexual marriage, birth control, eugenics, the widespread distribution of drugs, and using all of the above-behaviors as mechanisms for social and political control.”
And, asks Ratisbonne, “Who in the case of the Ukrainian crisis, is on the side of values?
Answer: Putin. “Russia would oppose Bertrand Russell’s program of gay marriage, abortion, contraception, eugenics…
“Putin is at least trying to operate within a moral framework that respects just-war theory and international law. He is trying to restore Russia to a semblance of political and economic order that is not defined by cut-throat economics and oligarchic looting and exploitation for Western interests."
The neocons, on the other hand, who hold sway on the American mind, advocate both…
And thus the West’s anti-Putin propaganda. And the neocons’ effort to convince the world that Putin is the world’s greatest problem, that Putin is a man of violence, and that the crisis in Ukraine can only be resolved if Putin stands down.
In short, Putin must be taken down by the US as the only superpower in the world that can teach Putin a lesson, to make way for the neocons’ one-world Socialist State.
Is there anyone else in the world, apart from Putin, who is capable of resisting the empire of chaos? What about China? What about India? Do they have any leaders with vision, integrity and sufficient power to challenge the masters chaos?
They're all resisting. It's just they want Putin standing in the front row taking the heat.
What makes Putin strong is that he is a Russian patriot. Even American critics admit that he gives the appearance of doing what he does for the betterment of Russia. And the Russian people back him, because he is out front for them. It's the kind of leadership that Robert E. Lee had when his troops admired him so much that they would do whatever he said. It’s the kind of leadership that America has been denied.
Through it all, it must be remembered that the standards of the Russian church never changed during the Bolshevik occupation; Russia has been maligned because her image was taken over by the communists and their mouthpieces.
Leadership is important but it’s not a leader that turns back an onslaught of greed and tyranny. The leader needs support from his people; when citizens have a true interest and desire for a better life, common freedom and a permanent healthy society for succeeding generations, they work en masse to support a leader who will help give them what they want.
Because of the purchase of politicians in America by the tyrants, American citizens are powerless to force their leaders to deliver this improved society. But in Russia today, the higher standards being brought in by Putin have brought incredible support (more than 80% in polls) for Russians supporting their leaders.
Unfortunately, the same is not true in China, for example, because their current leader is actually narrowing the power structure to where he may be China’s strongest individual leader since Mao. And what’s worse, this leadership overrides any freedom movements and potential representative government for the future of not only the Chinese but the world.
As to India, the disconnect between the people and the leaders is substantial and the superpower status is not there.
In short, Putin, IMO, is the only leader with the people-power to confront Washington's warmongers and socialist power, which translates into troops, tanks, and planes as well as nuclear weapons for the NWO.
Thank you JR
Spit in your beard.
What about the Russian Apartment Bombings perpetrated by the FSB?
What about refugee massacres and kill squads in Grozny.
His list of massacres and cover-ups is longer than Darth Cheney's.
Putin is a scumbag. The amount of goodwill towards him is unbelievable.
Interesting theory, but this is the real reason:
http://www.thenewamerican.com/economy/item/18462-russia-china-deals-anot...
http://rt.com/op-edge/161944-china-russia-currencies-dollar/
Just ask Saddam, Ghaddafi....
Until this past Monday, the downing of Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 on July 17th, 2014, was a potential game changer for global geopolitics and the New Cold War. However, a funny thing happened on the way to the Kremlin…
MH17 Verdict: Real Evidence Points to US-Kiev Cover-up of Failed False Flaghttp://21stcenturywire.com/2014/07/25/mh17-verdict-real-evidence-points-...
Serious stuff, tony. Thanks!
Much of this extensive report is so critical to how this operation could have and may have been carried out. These two paragraphs alone are dynamite:
Small Rebel Target Window
Much has been made by the US and its media of MH17 being shot down and crashing in “the rebel-held area”, but few are aware of just how small the said area actually is. The Ukrainian military had already isolated the rebel area which Kiev and Washington insist a rebel-controlled BUK SAM missile battery had fired on the passenger jet. The actual size of this rebel-held patch is only 50 miles wide, with MH17 approaching on a southeastern route over Horlivka, the frontline of this rebel-held zone, towards Snezhnoye (Snizhne). Cruising at 580 mph (933 kmph), MH17 would have only been visible for a very short time – just over 1 minute (if Kiev had not ordered MH17 to alter its course and altitude then it would not have been visible at all), from the vantage point of the alleged rebel firing position. According the Jane’s Defense, the alleged culprit – an SA-11 (NATO code name) or ‘BUK’ missile system, requires 5 minutes set-up active targeting, followed by an additional 22 seconds ‘reaction time’ for target acquisition and firing. As the MH17 was only visible for 70 seconds above this rebel-held area surrounding Grabovo, unless the alleged rebel firing position was specifically tracking MH17 long before it entered the rebel-held airspace and could distinguish it from other military civilian aircraft also in the general vicinity, Washington’s theory and Kiev’s accusation – that rebels shot down this aircraft becomes even weaker.
Considering these factors, the probability increases greatly that targeting MH17 would have had to be premeditated far in advance of the 70 seconds it was visible above this particular rebel-held area.
And the proof that we landed on the moon is in the 5000+ Apollo pictures /s
shorter article: plane go boom
The plane was hit. At a certain point in the crinkled & damaged plane certain passengers would have been hurt, yet still aware. The tumblers may have noticed one another as they rained down to Earth.
I also like the ‘Allied Signal’ name drop.
But the photo looks propagandaish.
Tyler Durden: [pointing at an emergency instruction manual on a plane] You know why they put oxygen masks on planes?
Narrator: So you can breathe.
Tyler Durden: Oxygen gets you high. In a catastrophic emergency, you're taking giant panicked breaths. Suddenly you become euphoric, docile. You accept your fate. It's all right here. Emergency water landing - 600 miles an hour. Blank faces, calm as Hindu cows.
Narrator: That's, um... That's an interesting theory.
To much Oxygen causes panic, ilregular heart rate so you die of a heart attack before you crash into the water at 600mph.
No calm blank faces, omg im having a heart attack, splat.
Doesn't that make you feel better.
Now helium on the other hand...
Their eyeballs would have froze.
It is actually a good thing that several countries and organizations have pieces of this data pie. It makes it less likely that any of them will be able to manipulate their portion of the data for fear of being called on it. Of course, it also means less chance that any unfavorable data will ever be released - and given the blackout of any real information, it becomes more likely that the Ukies did it. This 'unreleased' data really tells us nothing solid, and is easy to guess. Anyone with actual knowledge of the voice recordings would release the real scoop - so this is probably not legit.
We need to see that data.
When did the engine fail.
What altitude and time stamps did data start to fail. What data and when.
Times and Altitudes need to be known. One missile (unlikely) multi-explosions and where and when, again.
That data will tell everything, from lights shutting off, to fuel and oil.
Was it a Battery of missles or just one sidewinder. The data will tell how many and how big.
That will narrow things down a bit.
"What use is propaganda when people have already stopped paying attention?"
Back in the day, we had "duck and cover." Anyone remember that? It was absurd on the face of it, so what was it for?
To convince the USSR that we could control our population to the degree that they would not revolt in the face of nuclear war. More specifically, that we were prepared to launch a first strike and would accept the damage to our own nation as a matter of course.
This placed the USSR in the position of having to allocate far more resources to their military than was neccesary for simple deterrence, including the building of a very expensive bomber and submarine fleet.
Jump ahead to the 60's and you have Kennedy talking up a "missile gap" as if Mutual Assured Destruction wasn't already a fact. What was that, if not more of the same?
The basic goal was to prevent a recovering USSR (WWII) from developing its civilian economy to the point where its people would be content with communist rule (*). It didn't hurt the MIC either. The one Eisenhower warned us about, if you recall.
(*) for insight into why this was imperative, study the reforms made under Krushchev, and the subsequent recidivism of the Brezhnev regime.
With or without the cold war tactics, communism never had a chance.
Nancy Pelosi - "The shoot down is Bush's fault!"
In 2001 a stray soviet-era missile shot down an airliner over the Black Sea.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siberia_Airlines_Flight_1812
"the S-200 missile overshot its target drone—which had been destroyed successfully by an S-300fired at the same time—and instead of self-destructing, locked in on the passenger plane 150 miles further away and exploded as a ball of shrapnel shells 50 feet over the plane"
"Ukraine reportedly banned the testing of Buk, S-300 and similar missile systems for a period of 7 years following this incident"
#
Su-25 can carry "Omul" ECM pods to try and confuse enemy missiles by creating ghost radar targets as shown in the manufacturer's video on youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxxst0fEYxk
#
So regardless of the politics airliners shouldn't be flying over conflicts where there are high altitude SAMs and military jets using ECM to confuse missiles.
Have the editors taken the day off? or they just can't keep up?
here is an alternate senario:
MH370 remotecontrolled to the maldives, after flying at 45,000 feet to knock out everyone on board. refuels, flys to diego garcia.
bodies packed on ice for months.
plane is loaded back up, flown to ukrainian airspace from God knows where.
Ukranian figher jets are launched to find out where this stray plane came from.
ground based missile blows airplane and one of the Ukranian fighter jets out of the sky.
No.
+1 for creativity
Alternative xyz is the mh370 plane full of decomposing bodies has bomb onboard.
Said bomb explodes it takes out one of the two Ukranian jets flying nearby.
No.
what is your explanation for the uki jet shot down?
Shot down by the same weapon that shot the plane, shot down by another BUK both of which were shooting at the planes, or one plane shot the other one down...
http://ria.ru/world/20140725/1017459906.html
As reported by one of the law enforcement agencies of Ukraine, the commander of the 156th air defense missile regiment was ordered to carry out training of the combat crews to provide the cover for the ground troops group in the suburbs of Donetsk.
On the day of the disaster, Ukrainian air defense units of the armed forces conducted training and deactivated the lock systems of the missiles, an emergency situation which could be the cause of the tragedy with Boeing, told a source in one of the law enforcement agencies in Ukraine.
"On July 17, the commander of the 156th anti-aircraft missile regiment was ordered to carry the training of the combat crews to provide the cover for the ground troops in the suburbs of Donetsk - deploy battalions, use real targets and perform the whole algorithm of tracking and destruction of the targets by using a missile SAM" Buk-M1".
According to him, despite the fact that the battery commanders were given the keys to unlock the missiles, a real missile 9M38M1 launch was not allowed.
"To participate in a training session, the Dnipropetrovsk airbase Kulbakino 229 Brigade Combat Aviation in Nikolayev sent two Su-25. Their task was to conduct aerial reconnaissance and identify targets within a concentration of the ATO group west of Donetsk" - said the source .
"When one of the SU-25 came into the detection zone of the SAM "Buk", it was followed by the battery located near the settlement Zaroschenskoe. Apparently, it was a tragic accident when the Malaysian Boeing flight route crossed the one of the Su-25, despite the difference in heights, they were matched and merged on the screen at one major point that was fatal to the civil aircraft - at the moment of convergence targets at one azimuth the tracking system automatically concentrates on the one which is the biggest, "- he said.
The source could not explain the reason for the unauthorized missile launch. "This issue is investigated by the SBU, which at about half nine in the evening arrested the battery commander with the whole crew," - he said.
------------------------------------------------
I think the investigation will blame Russian vodka for unauthorized launches. Obama will immediately sanction Stoli.
Very plausible. This is really the best case for Ukraine - conclude their investigation, admit it was their own BUK, claim it was an accident, and blame Russia for creating the conditions for it to happen.
There was a change in the flight path, claiming without evidence that it was to “avoid thunderstorms in southern Ukraine”.
The change in the flight path for Malaysian airlines MH17 on July 17
It takes MH17 over the war zone, namely Donetsk and Lugansk.
MH17 was diverted from the normal South Easterly route over the sea of Azov to a path over the Donetsk oblast.
Netherlands air traffic control change the mh17 route before departure...
To avoid that bad weather before mention on the paragraph..
DIS-INFORMATION...is well and alive...GOOD LUCK!..
How come no one has asked the most obvious question.
If the plane was shot down by a missle, there has to be fragments of the missle somewhere. Find the fragments of the missle, and you will have the answer to all of the questions.
I'm no military expert, but I'm guessing that fragments from a Surface to Air missle are very much different than an Air to Air missle.
That's what all those people should be looking for.
Great idea.
My only question is this hypothetical: if the shoot down had been a Russian civilian aircraft and it occurred on USA controlled territory and they refused access to the area for over a week would the Russians trust the evidence given to them?
The crash site has been compromised. Any physical evidence has been compromised.
Almost like those in control of the area wanted it this way.
I am glad to see that the proposition I put up a number of days ago to the effect that the rebels were baited is now gaining currency. I think I was the first to do so.
The underlying problem however goes far deeper. The nations who are alert to the fact that Russia has no involvement are not swallowing the BS. However, for the other nations which have either been blackmailed, bribed or bullied into following the US line, it simply provides the means by which these nations can maintain their own people's support for supporting the US position.