This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
Chart Of The Day: Jeff Bezos "Value Creation" Edition
Yesterday, we summarized all that was wrong in Amazon's worst quarter in history where apparently one can no longer "make up for negative profits with volume."
Here is another way of deconstructing Amazon's love-hate relationship with profitability: in all of its 20+ year history, Amazon has generated under $2 billion in Net Income. The offset? Jeff Bezos' net worth, which according to Bloomberg is about $30 billion (that was the number in April, when Bezos had lost a whopping $6.5 billion due to the collapse of AMZN, by now the number is surely far lower making Bezos the biggest billionaire loser in 2014). Still, for indicative purposes, the data is good enough.
In short: this is what Jeff Bezos' value creation looks like (one does wonders if Amazon has purposefully been a perennial "bottom-line loser" for decades simply to avoid paying taxes).
And as a bonus chart, this from the WSJ:
Inspired by @ReutersJamie
»
- 19663 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -
Reuters
Your Personal REUTERS Ticker
HERE
For #Ebola type Reuters Ebola http://tersee.com/#!q=Reuters+Ebola&t=text
For #stocks type Reuters stocks http://tersee.com/#!q=Reuters+stocks&t=text
etc..
Good cash-cow for Bezos, huh?
Here's the Post Office's missing profits. I hope he sends them a nice Christmas card. In the mail, of course!
.Gov will see AMZN as TBTF and send them a big bail out check like GM. Payday!!
.Gov will see AMZN as TBTF and send them a big bail out check like GM.
GM at least is(was?) a real company, amzn is just another enron.
Better than opening a bank
Black line in the chart could easily be Fed printing (M2), and the red line could easily be labor force participation. See..... all the charts look the same in a ponzi.
You look at that chart and you know why Bezos doesn't see where the problem is.
the new normal
Off topic but I have a funny feeling that something big will happen with Barclays on Monday. Watch this space.
Please tell as I have some money in Barclays ?
It's beyond amusing how you have PM's coming out to defend AMZN saying "So many people are against it, it has to be a buy". Basically, the intellectually flawed sentiment trade. Again. So what wins out? Do "peeps" buy it because "everybody is a hater" or do cold, hard numbers need to finally be paid attention to? IMO, as goes QE so goes the sentiment trade.
"or do cold, hard numbers need to finally be paid attention to?"
Notice how individual stocks are taking a beating - AMZN today, IBM the other day, and it goes on and on...many large companies with flat or down earnings...at some point the market will need to tend to 'cold, hard numbers' as we all know. But for now we labor on with a Bullard or Yellen quote here or there to chide us forward into the abyss.
You don't need no stink'n profits! This is the NEW ECONOMY man!
A good Example how the Elite takes care of thier own puppets
can coupon clipping be far behind?
Abby-someone
If you're not a Millenial, you know the alternate definition of what an Amazon is: A female super-warrior. If Bezos' company is in trouble, are female super-warriors, too?
It's more money than I've ever made, so good for him.
spoken like a true sheeple, I am surpirse for someone that reads/follow ZH
Part of the reason you've not made much money is guys like Jeff Bezos destroying industries you could have worked in, just so he can have his fake profitless shell company to loot.
Love that business plan. Run effectively a non-profit retail outfit, avoid making your customers pay state sales tax, and claim it's the genius of the internet that made it so popular. Horseshit. People buy there because it's cheap. The minute it loses it's price advantage (starts trying to make a profit), the revenues will collaspe.
Seems like that parabolic expense line will get harder to handle then an enron energy bet.
Amazon actually does offer quality as well as price. You have to look though.
It sucks that they cannot make money. I love the site. Crowdsource reviews, excellent customer service, and selection.
I could not imagine being stuck with having to buy something at a brick and mortar Lowes or HD again if it needed to be something decent.
That expense/income chart is awful and getting worse. Trainwreck if there ever was one. And their only way to save it is to nickle and dime people away from Netflix and iTunes for electronic content?
Never gonna happen.
pods
Have your lunch get eaten by a company that doesn't have to follow the Roberts rules for business. You will understand my chortleing glee. This is not schadenfreude. This is karma bitchez.
BTW. No offense to you pods. This is just my personal experience talking.
I can understand that. No offense taken at all.
It is like an old Ace Hardware that was by my house. Great place, helpful people (think 80's harware stores) and even a couple pet cats walking around.
It went under, and I can recall many times I needed something and figured I would just hit HD instead because it was on the way, had everything, etc.
I am definitely to blame. Amazon is easy. I can order something in 2 minutes, tops, if I want to. I do try to use places in niches (appliance parts, high end fishing gear) but I am guilty.
So no need to tip toe.
:)
pods
I used to work for amazon.
Its my understanding that amazon reinvests everything it gets back into the buisiness and not pay off shareholders and give dividends. IMO its better for the economy than share buybacks and dividends which only benefits a few wealthy at the top. They have pretty aggressive business practices though. "The everything store" is a very good read. I think its a very non-biased account of the company. Being inside the company and out that is my reading. They also have extreme customer focus. I can attest to that.
Aggressive re-investment of profit still is profit. Amazon doesn't have profit, but aggressively invests. They invest money raised through the sale of stock, and invest resources paid for by stock and other borrowing.
Classic Ponzi scheme, using new liabilities to pay off the old, with no ultimate plan or method of resolution.
Bezos net worth is not as high as it is because AMZN is not making profits - the good man is just not letting the profits to go to "waste" (or to share holders or god forbid the employees) by leaving it in the company. By the looks of the graph it "somehow" ends up in his pocket, but that is just my interpretation....
Like a commenter above said: The new normal....
Non-profit retail supported by market fiat injection. Call me crazy, but could it all just be by design, to destroy small business. They are in total control of the message and your mind. Up is down, and right is wrong, and the rabbit hole goes as deep as you are willing to look.
AMZN let the internet sales tax thingy progress forward. That's going to come back bite them bad. If you think they're hurting now, jusy wait when and if that passes thruy Congress.
I'm of the opinion that online taxation will be what saves them, as they will be the largest provider of tax calculating/collecting/disbursing services in the world for all other online retailers.
Remember, the reason it hasn't happened sooner is the magnitude of the problem. One thing Amazon has accomplished is scale.
Amazon has become a defacto agent of the state, collecting taxes near and far.
Isn't that what all corporations are, in the end?
You, sir, are brilliant.
The answer is: Fuck yeah, they are. Now try and tell that to those who seek to raise corporate taxes.
My drop in AMZN purchases coincided exactly with the sales tax, Jan. 2014. I'm still buying there, but with the Ebayer's that don't tax.
Use Tor or a VPN to make purchases "out of State" from where you live, therefore no tax. I make all my Amazon purchases from England. I get calls from Amex and Visa once in a while to verify my shit hasn't been ganked. Maybe it has, maybe it hasn't, but yes, it was me making the purchases. I flew to England, made some Amazon purchases, and flew back. Yes.
Wow, I had comletely forgotten that Amazon has been around since 1994. Interesting comparison: that was the year Bill Gates finally had an epiphany concerning the "passing fad" known as the internet.
Here's to his continued implosion
May he continue making his globalist political statements and lose everything
but but but... avoiding taxes is good, it's very very goooood... at least normally. Some of the dumber posters here cried and shit their pants when I suggested tax avoiding corps not be given federal contracts [paid for with taxpayer money - a point they missed, it seems]...
Why is it bad when Bezos does it?
Separately, there was a lot of concern and chatter in some circles when Bexos bought the WaPost
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Washington_Post
But he must have assured various interest groups that he wasn't looking to upset any applecarts. The publisher and editor are both of the tribe, with the editor, in particular, being a borderline moron.
p.s. when's the hitpiece on how amazon is "hurting brick and mortar publishers" - which is the angle those in the ADL/SPLC orbit are using to collterally attack Amazon.com for selling books The Tribe [and others] do not like - you know, a free market of ideas you can accept or reject as you please.... of course, you're welcome to 'Question Everything' except one thing, one aspect of ww2 - you go to jail for that. And truth, of course, is not a defense.
This part?
http://www.bestgore.com/holohoax/auschwitz-plaques-six-million-myth-revi...
Lesson learned. Be like Jeff. / be like trump. Be like ponzi.
Well, ponzi had the right idea but he forgot to transfer all the liability to someone else while banking the proceeds.
Anyone wanna buy some stock in a new company I'm setting up? We'll be mining the South Seas.
\that's funny right there don't care who you are.
They lost me when they started collecting sales tax
don't worry about bezos, he got plenty.
...and by profits you mean 'adjusted profits'...
Where's my damn drone to deliver my 1000 ct box of mint infused birch toothpicks?
It doesn't matter any more as long as shit can be marketed as art.
http://40.media.tumblr.com/4f6c90ac700b64393303dc76cd9974d6/tumblr_nbh81...
Yes but Bezos said when he started up Amazon that their business model was not conventional by any means. They did not use profit as has of their structure for building their business. That thought process gets in the way of never ending growth, holds back a new and smarter way of doing business.
So, now do you understand that profit does not matter! It's so simple, yet most folks just can not grasp it!
Surely you jest. Or have you been rereading you fast company mags from the 90's? Profits didn't matter to pets.com either.
Until they do.
dupe
My sarc detector was buzzing loudly after reading wmbz's post.
Yes, I have a dual profit plan:
1) 8 track taps.
2) Vinyl records.
Thinking differently gets in the way of never ending growth...
investing in digital original content is idiotic when I can pirate anything scripted/non-sports instantly.
I guess this is why I am not that great of an equity investor in consumer facing firms. I think every consumer is like me.
I.E. How does fb, goog make money when I block all ads and don't use social media accounts/sites.
or How does cable/netflix make money when I get all of my shit for free via torrent or go get a book in the library.
You're like me but I don't get books in the library, I just download a PDF of the book when I can or buy it used when I must have it.
Wow, a company that actually builds shit and hires people
That is perfect Tyler. Sadly, you could do the same chart for at least a thousand other CEOs and their stooges. Amerika!
That is the best graphic ever made. Hilarious.
That could also be a rough graphic of my schwantz b 4 Sofia Vergara took off her bra, and one right after.
That sheit just don't make no sense. How the hell is this company still in business? No shit. Can somebody explain it?
Companies that don't have to make a profit , sounds like Governments, sounds like cronyism , sounds like fascism.
The lesson here is...
If you are going to run an unprofitable company, make sure it is listed on one of the major stock exchanges.
...and create a lot of hype, and brainwash enough of your inner circle to think that the lack of 'profit' is due to 're-investment in the business'.
JEFF BEZOS HAS REALIZED MORE THROUGH STOCK SALES THAN AMAZON HAS EVER GENERATED IN NET INCOME. The "market" is simply being used to generate synthetic financial profits for the members of the Capital Committee and the Protection Racket. When people realize what was done in Q4 2012 and the hundreds of thousands of jobs it cost at other retailers because of the subsidy of an uneconomical business model solely to extract trading profits, they will want scalps...
Let's spreak realistically here, the majority will never get it.
No one ever forces one to buy a stock. Don't buy AMZN if you don't want to. But one has to admire people that get off their ass and create something. My guess is that many of the poeple who post their opinions are those that have never risked doing something creative. Amazon is a testament to the creative energy of a very talented man. It doesn't matter if the stock does not work. That's capitalism.
Please do tell, what exactly is 'creative' about Amazon? They're not an innovator, they lead in nothing. Practically every last thing they do is a rip-off of someone else. Or in the case of the alleged drones, complete bullshit.
Ummm...they developed the 1 click check out so you can save seconds!
Amazon is the new Matrix and Bezos is the new Morpheus...get used to it bitchezzz
Oh, and Honey Boo-Boo in 2016
What's the difference between Amazon and a Ponzi scheme?
Usually a Ponzi Scheme doesn't destroy value. It just redistributes it!
Amazon is better than ali-baba.
Some perspective is in order.
Accounting is so dishonest and incredible in the US that I cannot believe a thing posted in the finance sector.
But a lot of the stuff I buy, I buy from Amazon. How much of their fiscal woes would disappear if they were not a US company?
It is hard to see why Amazon has any fans when you consider how they abuse and exploit the brick and mortar stores that line streets throughout America. These are the stores that employ our family members, support little league teams in the community, and add value to our lives. These stores build or lease space, buy supplies from the other local businesses, and pay both sales and real-estate taxes.
Things are not all that great in my area regardless of the message from Yellen and the media. Part of the problem is that we as a nation are embracing polices that put big business ahead of the real job creators, that is small business which has always been the backbone of America. In fact it has gotten so bad that I could not sleep last night. I was haunted by fear and I found that all the reassurances by Janet Yellen and the Federal Reserve did not help.
Like the young boy in the movie years ago the spirits of those who once filled the world with life will not let me rest, in this case I'm haunted by dead businesses and not people. The article below concerns the cost and problems of buildings sitting vacant because of business failures. I have my finger on the pulse of small business and it is far from healthy.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/10/i-see-dead-businesses.html
Words like "evolving" are used to describe Amazon's business model, a better word might be undefined. Regardless Amazon rolls on. Pointing towards gaining synergy as they continue to buy companies, some unproven. The revenues from these companies add to their growth but still no profits exist. Does this growth mask a weakness at their core?
If they are indeed a distribution company their stock should be trading at around 18 times earnings. When you look for a P/E ratio on Amazon you find NA because the company makes no money. Another key weakness is that new competition can now cheaply and easily replicate the most profitable parts of Amazon and cherry pick much of their future potential. The bigger they are, the harder they fall, it is only a question of time. More on the subject of Amazon in the article below;
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2013/10/amazon-not-answer.html