Saudi Arabia Or Iran? It's Time For Obama To Choose
“It’s not as if you have an Iranian alternative. And if you have no alternative, your best choice is to stop complaining about the Saudis.”
That’s a quote from a “senior Gulf Arab official” who spoke to The New York Times about Washington's position on the sectarian strife playing out across the Mid-East.
As a refresher, an already volatile situation took a decisive turn for the worst over the weekend when Saudi Arabia executed Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr, sparking outrage across the Shiite community.
The turmoil couldn’t have come at a worse time for Washington.
The White House is desperate to salvage the narrative in Syria where Russia’s intervention has, i) highlighted America’s shortcomings in the “war” on ISIS and ii) laid bare the fact that the Sunni extremists the Western world generally identifies with terrorism are being armed and funded by a number of state sponsors, including Saudi Arabia.
Meanwhile, the Obama administration is anxious to ensure that the implementation of the Iran nuclear deal goes smoothly. If the Iranians were to back out at the last minute, it would be a major blow to the President’s legacy during his last year in office.
As we put it on Sunday after Riyadh cut diplomatic ties with Iran in the wake of attacks on the Saudi embassy, “the Obama administration will have to make a choice: stick with the Saudis in order to preserve the prevailing Mid-East order and ensure that the ‘special’ relationship between Washington and Riyadh isn't damaged, or finally take the plunge and side with the Iranians with whom the administration is desperate to establish a cordial relationship after years of mutual distrust and hostility." Here’s The Times echoing our assessment:
The United States has usually looked the other way or issued carefully calibrated warnings in human rights reports as the Saudi royal family cracked down on dissent and free speech and allowed its elite to fund Islamic extremists. In return, Saudi Arabia became America’s most dependable filling station, a regular supplier of intelligence, and a valuable counterweight to Iran.
For years it was oil that provided the glue for a relationship between two nations that share few common values.
But the political upheaval in the Middle East and the American perception that the Saudis are critical to stability in the region continue to hold together an increasingly fractious marriage. So when Saudi Arabia executed 47 people, including Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr, the dissident cleric, on Saturday, beheading many of them in a style that most Americans associate with the Islamic State rather than a close American partner, the administration’s efforts to explain the relationship became more strained than ever.
In 2011, Saudi leaders berated President Obama and his aides for failing to support President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt during the Arab Spring, fearing Mr. Obama might do the same thing if the uprisings spread to the kingdom.
The nuclear deal with Iran only fueled the Saudi sense that the United States was rethinking the fundamental relationship — and Saudi officials, on visits to Washington, openly questioned whether they could rely on their American ally
So ever since that accord was reached in July, the Obama administration has been offering reassurance.
When Mr. Kerry warned the Saudis against executing Sheikh Nimr, a Saudi-born Shiite cleric who directly challenged the royal family, he was ignored. “This is a concern that we raised with the Saudis in advance,” Josh Earnest, the White House press secretary, acknowledged Monday. He said the execution has “precipitated the kinds of consequences that we were concerned about.”
The fundamental question is this: has preserving the relationship with the Saudis become more trouble than it's worth for the US? And if so, is it finally time for Washington to reimagine its Mid-East policy by doing the previously unthinkable and siding with Tehran over Riyadh?
For some, like Politico's Stephen Kinzer, the answer is "yes." Below, find excerpts from Kinzer's latest.
* * *
From "The United States Shouldn’t Choose Saudi Arabia Over Iran"
Only two Muslim powers remain standing in the Middle East, and suddenly they are on the brink of war. Our old friend, Saudi Arabia, carried out one of its routine mass beheadings last week, and among the victims was a revered Shiite cleric. Our longtime enemy, Iran, which is the heartland of Shiite Islam, was outraged. Furious Iranians burned the Saudi Embassy in Tehran. The next day, Saudi Arabia broke diplomatic relations with Iran
The United States should do everything possible to avoid choosing sides in an intensifying proxy war between the dominant Shiite and Sunni powers in the Middle East. Though history tells us we should tilt toward Saudi Arabia, our old ally, if we look toward the future, Iran is the more logical partner. The reasons are simple: Iran’s security interests are closer to ours than Saudi Arabia’s are.
taking Saudi Arabia’s side would be a disaster. True, militarily the two appear pitifully mismatched. Saudi Arabia is among the world’s best armed states. It has spent vast sums to buy the world’s most advanced war-fighting systems, most of them from the United States. Iran, by contrast, has been under heavy sanctions for decades. Its army is not much better equipped than it was during the Iran-Iraq War 30 years ago.
The confrontation becomes equalized, however, when motivation is factored into the equation. Saudis are notorious for their aversion to sacrifice. They hire foreigners to do most of the kingdom’s daily labor. Few Saudi men would dream of risking their lives for their country. For its war in Yemen, Saudi Arabia has recruited hundreds of mercenaries from Colombia. The Saudis have enough air power to devastate almost any country on earth. Wars are won on the ground, though, and there Saudi Arabia is pitifully weak.
The Iranians are different. If they believe their faith is under threat, they will pour onto battlefields even if they have to fight with slingshots. That difference in patriotic fervor makes sense. Saudi Arabia has existed for 83 years, Iran for more than 2,500.
Saudi Arabia’s decision to provoke this crisis was aimed at least in part at forcing the United States to take sides. Supporting Saudi Arabia over Iran, however, would be a way of harming our own interests.
Why does Iran make more long-term sense as a partner? Countries should fulfill two qualifications to become U.S. partners. Their interests should roughly coincide with ours, and their societies should look something like our own. On both counts, Iran comes out ahead.
Iran and the United States are bound above all by their shared loathing of Sunni terror groups. In addition, Iran is closely tied to large Shiite populations in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon and Bahrain. It can influence those populations in ways no one else can. If it is brought into regional security arrangements, it will have a greater interest in stability—partly because that would increase its own influence in the region.
By almost any standard, Iranian society is far closer to ours than Saudi society. Years of religious rule have made Iranians highly secular. The call to prayer is almost never heard in Iran. In Saudi Arabia, by contrast, it dominates life, and all shops must close during designated prayer breaks. Iranian women are highly dynamic and run many businesses. Saudi women may not even drive or travel without a man’s permission. The 9/11 attacks were planned and carried out mainly by Saudis; Tehran was the only capital in the Muslim world where people gathered spontaneously after the attacks for a candlelight vigil in sympathy with the victims.
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Images from candlelight vigils in Iran held on the evening of September 11, 2001 to mourn the Americans killed in 9/11:
(15 votes)
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911 was no more than one small aspect of the greater darkness that is consuming the planet.
Humans are by definition rebellious slaves.
And something too odd... Too complex... Too unbelievable is driving all of us to the slaughter house.
This has nothing to do with sides except as it relates to the creative or hive aspects of the human tragedy.
To understand more clearly the driving forces behind the global stage one needs to look beyond this reality.
Fuck it. It's not our business.
The NeoCons have made it your business.
Dancing Israelis "We are not your problem. The Palestinians are your problem"
Which is interesting as the attackers were actually Saudis. Still these Ayrabs are all the same, right?
Why is it presented as having only those two choices? Is that for us (seeded) or the planners? Either way we must get out of this brain locked restricted concept.
an easy choice if Ziocons and their $ weren't involved
Haha love the pics" this ain't no party, this ain't no disco, this ain't no foolin around"
and Iran gots more Gold than those royal Saudi fucks...
and more than this sociopathic banker controlled government as well....
just ask our other "ally" - T U R K E Y!
Deek he already made that decision. It is with Iran. Open your fucking eyes
The United States should do everything possible to avoid choosing sides in an intensifying proxy war between the dominant Shiite and Sunni powers in the Middle East.
Yes. It should. All US military interference in the Middle East and miliary aid to the region's governments (including to Israel, who has her God and the Samson Option, has learned how to teach Arabs manners far better than Uncle Sugar has, and can take care of herself, thank you) needs to end.
But that's not what will happen. Wall Street need oil at USD40 or below to prevent a financial crisis that will make 2008 look like a brawl in a kindergarten. Expect DC to prop up the House of Saud at almost any cost in money and blood.
Obama better make the best decision here because if he sides with Iran it could be the end of petro dollar or USD as global reserve. Saudi Arabia is OPEC and what they say when it comes to oil goes for the world. Russia and China couldn't be so happy to kill the USD.
Perhaps this is the true intention of Obama anyway to kill the USD and the US to become a third world republic.
Perhaps!
Did you miss the memo? Please send Mr. Soros your corrected email address.
Soros will have half the Euros and Yen in the world by shorting the petrodollar.
Not his choice Dumb Ass. It's Valerie Jarrett's Choice. I can tell you whithout a doubt it won't be the Saudi's. Which I absolutely fucking hate by the way...
"Saudis are notorious for their aversion to sacrifice."
That is what decades of Swedish whores, gold palaces and Hypocrisy writ-large $buys you...
It is insane to believe the President Of The United States has a choice to make.
The POTUS can only make a decision and hope that the Nation Of Israel will find it acceptable.
Otherwise the United States Of America can look forward to years of endless petitions, bills, amendments, Congressional Investigations, Books, Movies, Documentaries, Lies, deceptions, and false flag operations to ensure endless war and racial religious strife until ultimately (even if it takes years) the Israeli position is implemented.
The solution is America for Americans just like Israel for Jews.
It isn’t that what is good for the Jews is good for America. We should only tolerate for ourselves as a nation what the Jews tolerate for themselves as a nation and for the same reason.
UNITY!
To paraphrase Israeli firster Vicki Nuland - 'Fuck the state of Israel'.
If we start seeing news items about how SA was behind 9/11 we'll know which diretion the U.S. is moving.
I made the same kind of comment a few days ago, we will overtly whip out the 9/11 Arab connection when it suits us to screw the Arabs.
That is why is has been under wraps, in case we ever need to blackmail the Saudis.
Remember those 'extra' pages from the 911 ommission report.
Always ask yourself
What would Ron Paul do?
And it s almost sure you got the right answer
We should not be partners with either one. No need to read this article.
Valerie Jarrett will tell Obama what his decision is. Don't bet against Iran since she's Iranian.
Don't make me laugh my slippers. She as Iranian as John McCain is Panamanian.
Her heritage is Chicago politics/crime family.
Maybe let them fight for our love? If we scorn SA, I wonder if they'd unleash Sunni hounds stateside. I wouldn't rule it out.
if we look toward the future, Iran is the more logical partner. The reasons are simple: Iran’s security interests are closer to ours than Saudi Arabia’s are."
I think Iran has more oil left than the Saudis. Iran it is!
Iran should not trust JEWSA. Iran should rather plan with Russia and China for a nuclear first strike on JEWSA.
"Saudi Arabia Or Iran? It's Time For Obama To Choose"
Obola doesn't really have a choice: it's Iran. Whatever faults Iran and its mullahs have, Saudi is run by evil, sub-human savages with an appalling human rights record. The Saud royals should be treated like the animals they are.
You're right about Obama not having a choice and the evil doers running Saudi Arabia. But the US foreign policy establishment and mainstream 'journalism' supports the Saudis and that's that.
True.
If American foreign policy and its obedient MSM is a supertanker, how long to turn them around now we know they're going in the wrong direction?
Name a decision that has gone against the Israelis since 9/11. Against the security state? Every court decision, every law is finally passed no matter how resoundingly it was rejected initially, etc.
They have in place a police state's entire apparatus and are bringing along the police and judges and prosecutors step by step into the new order of things, the new ways of power.
We are watching it happen, step by step, when 9/11 FF laid out the entire path for all to see. Everything we see is a stepping stone to gulags, and it has to be in the nature of the act and the people who did that act.
Cite me a reverse trend, please. If it weren't for Putin organizing the other world leaders in opposition, I think the coup here in the US would have been accomplished. Syria is a key, and Israeli-Neocons are losing there and the political power of the story based on 9/11 is being lost as more people understand the 'terrorism' has entirely been intelligence agencies running FFs around the world.
Trump is neocon, I see no hints otherwise. There was a lot of pro-Trump sentiment on patriot threats I read this AM based on things like "Trump is in Real Estate, he will understand Westerner's problems". No kidding, hopium reigns.
You're forgetting the Petrodollar in all of this. It doesn't matter how scum the Saudis are, they are key in keeping the dollar alive.
We've been supporting the Saudis since the 70s. We've fought their battles for them. It will continue until the Petrodollar is dead, nothing else matters.
Petro d'Allah era now comes to its end.
It is clinical brain dead patient kept alive on machines, feeding tubes - time to plug off.
There are those persistent rumours about Ghawar having well and truly peaked (well over 50% water cut). If true and production costs rise, that will fire a v/damaging blow to the USD as GRC. Sometime later, it's goodnight Saudi.
And it may explain in part why the Saudi dogs are trying to interfere in Yemen which has some more oil.
NOTA
"True, militarily the two appear pitifully mismatched. Saudi Arabia is among the world’s best armed states. It has spent vast sums to buy the world’s most advanced war-fighting systems, most of them from the United States. Iran, by contrast, has been under heavy sanctions for decades. Its army is not much better equipped than it was during the Iran-Iraq War 30 years ago."
I see an arms deal in the works!
Other nugs:
This is Israeli-Likhud Greater Israel vs the world's interests. That Jewish Nationalism, Zionism insanity is bad for Jews, as I tell my many Jewish friends. More than a few agree with me, Russians least of all, I believe.
World public opinion on things Israeli are very different outside of Israeli-Zionist circles. However, quite a lot of the world's MSM is owned by people sharing those interests. And otoh, they are losing control of the agenda and something has to be done, we can't allow Israeli-Neocon treasonous criminals to run our nation, military and foreign policy. Very dangerous for us ordinary citizens, think what happened to the average German or French or Russian citizen when the Nazi Party or Communisty Part got control of those countries or ones adjacent.
This can't turn out well unless we make it turn out well. Way past time to start that.
Unfortunately, it is not up to Obama. Military/foreign policy ties with the Saudis are long and deep. The same ties, with which the the USG once had with Iran, are long gone. Furthermore, Iran supports Hezbollah, the Lebanese militia and political group that drove the Israelis out of (its 18-year occupation of) Lebanon and held Israel off in the 2006 war. Netanyahuies cannot stomach anything less than total defeat of an adversary. We know how tight Israeli-US ties are. If Israel sides with the Saudis (and it does surreptitiously), much of the USG - especially Congress - will also, not to mention mainstream 'journalism'.
It dosesn't matter what Obama wants at this lame duck point.
All of the candidates seeking his job are busiliy currying favor from the Israeil's who always decide in such matters. So like it or not, the USA will support the maniacs now running Arabia.
He will vote "Present" like he did in the Senate.
I say stay the fuck out of it. We haven't done a damn thing right in the Middle East in my lifetime (60 years) and picking a side in this dog fight will result in even more fuck-uppery.
Do you think Netanyahu will give the US any choice? The man who got 27 standing ovations in his speech before Congress?
Did you not understand that was obesience?
AIPAC is power, Mossad power, Zionist Likhud criminal power with strong and deep ties through US society and business and government. The Israeli-Neocons are the leading power in the world at the moment, which is why Putin and friends are so very important to us here in the US.
I don't need him to be an angel, tho every bit helps.
We have been occupied by a foreign power. This is how it was when the Normans took over England, suddenly Rahm Emmanuel is buying political power and running major political fiefdoms, local boys pushed into the background. Did you notice, btw, how Rahm's attempt to buy the Democrats for AIPAC didn't quite work, as his candidates lost a lot and thus the Republican majority? Win/win for AIPAC and Israel.
We have been occupied by a foreign power.
Just walk away and don't look back at that black hole.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPY5P0TaC4k
The US has been zugzwanged - Iran versus Saudi Arabia!
A little late but still timely:
You better watch out.You better not cry.
Better not pout.
I'm telling you why.
Vladimir is coming to town.
He's making a list*,
And checking it twice;
Gonna find out
Who's naughty and nice.
Vladimir is coming to town.
He sees you when you're sleeping.
He knows when you're awake.
He knows if you've been bad or good.
So be good for goodness sake!
O! You better watch out!
You better not cry.
Better not pout, I'm telling you why.
Vladimir is coming to town.
Vladimir is coming to town.
* - The list being those who deal in oil with ISIS.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-01-03/who-was-the-cleric-saudis-executed-and-why-his-death-matters
"Tensions between Iran, Saudi Arabia plummet to 3-decade low" Como? What does that even mean? Wouldn't tensions be high?
There is no lesser of these two evils! They're both just EVIL!
Above statement if speaking of Saudi Arabia and Israel is truth.
Better idea. Choose Persia and help the Iranians throw off the Islamic Theocracy entirely. A secular state, with massive resources and a very similar culture would go a long way to calming the region. Or, thrusting it into the type of turmoil that allows a united front of superpower nations to step in and put boot to ass.