Pizza And Assault Rifles: Inside The Occupied Oregon Wildlife Refuge
When last we checked in on Ammon Bundy and his band of “patriots”, Harney County Sheriff David Ward was getting fed up with the group’s occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.
“It is time for you to leave our community, go home to your families, and end this peacefully,” Ward said on Tuesday.
But Ammon Bundy and the handful of armed militiamen holed up at the remote, snowy federal outpost have no such plans. The “Citizens for Constitutional Freedom” (as they now call themselves) are in it for the long haul and have pledged, at various times since “seizing” the office last Saturday, to remain in the building “for years.”
While it’s not entirely clear what Bundy wants, the group’s professed goal is to “"restore the rights to people so they can use the land and resources.” Here’s a bit of helpful color from Terry Andersen, the William A. Dunn Distinguished Senior Fellow at the Property and Environment Research Center and the John and Jean DeNault Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution (from a New York Times op-ed):
Their goal harkens back the “Sagebrush Rebellion” of the 1970s, though their tactics are more draconian. Then the rebels called for more local control of federal lands, if not outright transfer of title to those lands to the states, and such solutions are still worth considering.
The impetus for the Oregon occupation is the imprisonment of a father and son for setting fire to federal lands to control invasive species moving to private lands and to help prevent wildfires, a huge land management problem in the West.
Living in the mountains south of Bozeman, Mont., I feel their pain because every summer I fight spotted knapweed, an invasive plant spread from my national forest neighbors, and I fear that wildfire will spread from the unmanaged federal land.
The second cause is “multiple conflicts over multiple uses.” At the time of the Sagebrush Rebellion the list of multiple uses that federal land agencies were to manage was huge. It is growing exponentially.
Western ranchers, loggers, farmers and, yes, even government bureaucrats with their feet on the ground could provide the stewardship sought by the rebels in Oregon. Now that armed confrontation has brought attention to their cause, we need to consider policies that will devolve management to lower levels of government and get the incentives right for encouraging environmental and fiscal responsibility
And here's a bit more from Salon:
The Bundys have been up in arms about where their cattle can and can’t roam, and their father, Cliven, owes more than $1 million in grazing fees. And the Hammonds are being punished for setting fire to public land. If you live in some other part of the country—in, say, a bustling East Coast city—what do ranching restrictions and arson have to do with you? The short answer: The land use regulations that the occupiers of the Malheur Refuge are fighting go far beyond where cattle can roam. How we use our land determines what comes out of it in the form of extracted resources, which then affects so much else, from what kind of air we breathe to how many earthquakes we experience–not to mention our changing climate. It would not be a stretch to say that caring about land use means caring about the fate of our planet.
In his “Wilderness Letter,” Wallace Stegner wrote that we need to preserve wilderness “even if we never once in ten years set foot in it.” Wild lands, according to Stegner, are important “simply as an idea.” But land use is about much more than what land we preserve as wilderness, or even what land we set aside for recreation and enjoyment. While wilderness is indeed valuable, there is plenty of non-wilderness public land whose fate matters just as much.
The Sagebrush Rebels argue that this federal land should’ve belonged to the states to begin with, according to a clause under the Doctrine of the Equality of States, which says new states enter the union “on an equal footing with the original States in all respects whatever.” Several Western states were required to disclaim their sovereignty over unappropriated lands when they became states, and the Sagebrush Rebels have never gotten over it. This is why they continue to demand the “return” of federal land to the states—though that would necessitate the land once having belonged to the states, and it never really did.
Ok, so Bundy, like his father, has become something of a folk hero among states' rights advocates and he's essentially hijacked the Hammond brush fire case and transformed it into a justification for the armed occupation of a federal building.
Of course it's probably occurred to Bundy - if not to every member of the Citizens for Constitutional Freedom - that the US government couldn't legislate its way out of a wet paper bag let alone fruitfully revisit a grand debate on land use and state's rights. That is, Washington is mired in partisan bickering that's created the worst Congressional gridlock in recent memory which means that even if someone cared to address Bundy's concerns, they couldn't.
But Bundy is apparently ready to wait around in the woods until something happens. "There is a time to go home. We recognize that. We don't feel it's quite time yet," he said on Wednesday. "We feel like we need to make sure that the Hammonds are out of prison, or well on their way. We need to make sure that there is some teeth in these land transfers, and also that those who have committed crimes ... those are exposed as well."
In the meantime, Reuters got an inside look at life inside occupied bird sanctuary. Here are some excerpts from their account:
The doorknob rattled. Two of the men occupying a federal biologist's office in a stand-off over land rights hopped from their chairs and swung rifles toward the locked door.
There was no knock - the established procedure for gaining entry to the nerve center of the siege mounted by brothers Ammon and Ryan Bundy at this eastern Oregon nature center.
The Bundys’ body guard stood in silent alert but heard no voices from the snowy darkness outside.
"Should we approach the door or not?" Ryan asked, creeping toward a window.
On Tuesday, for the first time, they allowed two reporters to join them inside their refuge for a night marked by long discussions and moments of hair-trigger tension.
As the two Reuters’ reporters arrived just after nightfall, the occupiers were moving into a state of high alert. The groups’ head of security, a man known as Buddha, had been out of touch since driving off-site hours earlier. Amid efforts to locate him, the Bundys talked at length about what had brought them into this wilderness--and what it would take for them to leave.
"When we can say, 'OK, now we can go home,' would be when the people of Harney County are secure enough and confident enough that they can continue to manage their own land and their own rights and resources without our aid, " Ryan Bundy said. "And we intend to turn this facility into a facility that will aid that process."
The brothers have taken over the cozy and cluttered office of Linda Sue Beck, a biologist and civil servant they have come to view as a symbol the federal government. They said they would allow Beck to come to gather her personal belongings. But they don’t want her to return to work.
“She’s not here working for the people,” declared Ryan Bundy, the more outspoken of the brothers. “She’s not benefitting America. She’s part of what’s destroying America.”
Yes, Linda is "part of what's destroying America." Behold, the face of government oppression:
And while we doubt that Linda will be stopping by to "gather her personal belongings," Bundy says the group is expecting visitors soon. On Tuesday Bundy said that based on information he received from an unnamed source, the FBI has obtained five arrest warrants, and is "gathering their equipment and their goons" at a local high school. "They were planning on coming in and raiding the refuge," he added.
As Reuters goes on to note, there are times when the group questions themselves. “When is it enough to put yourself and other people’s lives on the line? Is it justified? Maybe in the end we’ll look at each other and say, ‘What are we doing?’”
Yes, "maybe." But until then, many of the men suggest that if push comes to shove, they're prepared to die for Bundy and his cause. On that note, we'll close with a quote from Wes Kjar, a 31-year-old oil rig worker who's convinced the FBI is set to storm the building:
“I’m not saying I want to die. I want to surrender. But I want to surrender on the right terms.”
The full clip is below:
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They didn't burn them alive because Koresh was mad, they burned them alive because Koresh failed to pay a tax, I recall, $40, or was it $200?
But perhaps the thing that should be remembered is that they BURNED THEM ALIVE!! Children, women, men, all burned alive. Land of the free. Don't mess with Texas.
Koresh's infamous "I am Jesus" sound bite played over and over again turned out to be my first reality dose of what out of context editing is.
The red pill didn't hit until years later when I saw the grainy australian interview the clip had been lifted from. The quote had been a sarcastic retort to a question he thought was foolish. It was a just a joke. but the msm played it as prima facie evidence he was a madman, and anything the gov decided to do about him was justified.
I've never hear anybody - liberal or otherwise - support the fire-bombing of the Davidians. That was complete jack-booted bullshit.
One story was that Clintons were aiming to throw Janet Reno under the bus for that one but she said she would take down the real boss of that operation: Hillary.
idiots........
Hey guys inside the compound, please reply below so we can see what your ZH user names are.
I would bet that MillionDollarBonus_ is not one of them.
If this is organized resistance, God save us.
Unorganized resistance is better anyway.
Tryants can't co-cop or infiltrate unorganized resistance.
Direct resistance is suicide unless the military stands down which it won't. These idiots are just setting the stage for a ramping up of oppression.
It does appear that resistance is futile. Even many who agree the Hammonds got hosed, govt. is too big, etc. show the fortitude to type nasty things about anybody that does resist.
Oh well.
Chunga, remember the Occupy protests? there were literally thousands of people out there but the weather and outfits like 350 org and Move On co-opted it and then it fizzled.
It's very disappointing. Resistance doesn't happen very often, and when it does it gets diffused from all angles.
I just checked out move on's twitter feed. They are mobilizing to push gun control. By them (and the green whacko's) co-opting Occupy, the banks got away with the frauds. We know that banks cashed in on global warming too.
At Delta, we have a saying... don't get mad, get even.
And armed standoffs tend to end one way: fire. History shows it's not arson if the FBI does it.
Authorities are learning how to integrate climate change with tactics: In hot, dry, Waco, wait for a windy day, shoot in an incendiary grenade projectile, and let nature burn up the occupiers and their children. In freezing cold, cut power to their heat and lights, let snow block access roads, cut phone and social network contact with supporters, and let nature freeze and starve them to death.
The "ramping up of oppression" is going to happen REGARDLESS. Where the hell you been? You just get to the United States on some boat or cross the border?
Wait until you see what happens when Uncle Fraud has complete gun control. Every single last incident from the Muslims will be used as justification for more gun control. Every single last incident that has nothing to do with Muslims will be used as justification. Why hell, I expect Obola to cry several more times before his term is over.
Right. So not acting/ protesting because Obummer's gonna come down hard on guns is just a bullshit argument. The DC establishment at the behest of their bankster owners will come down hard on the 2nd Amendment regardless.
COINTELPRO can't infiltrate a group of 1.
They can if you have multiple personalities.
Me and Myself agrees, but I don't.
Meanwhile back at the Ranch..........
People need to study the French Resistance from WWII. The goal wasn't to stand toe to toe with the military, it was to bleed them dry and cause them to run out of resources. If these guys were smart they would have torched the building and left instead of standing around making some idiotic "statement". Burn. Watch Gov spend 5 million inefficiently rebuilding, repeat. I bet they run out of money before you run out of matches.
As an aside, what kind of bumblefuck uses a tricked-out Ruger Mini-14 instead of a real AR?
Reinhart Ghelen told his operatives to study the methods used by the POLISH resistance to the Nazis.
The Polish resistance targeted those who physically did the torture sessions for assassination.
Never even knew about this guy. Looks like I have some reading to do. Thanks!
I'm thinking they're more of a 'controlled opposition' rather than an organised resistance.
Looks like photos I have from hunting with my uncles all those years ago, less a bunch of empty beer cans.
I give Bundy credit for one thing and one thing only, recognizing that the Federal government is politically WEAK because of all the moral hazard they have unleashed.
Case in point, Free John Corzine!!!
Oh yeah, nevermind fuckers, now JUMP!!
Might help if they had the campaigning pic of Corzine & the Big B or kissy kissy w/Hitlery posted with big block letters "Free Corzine."
I am still smiling from when they set loose the cattle in Utah. That's one huge step up from an application for a permit to gather. They mentioned that repeatedly at the last incident too. All of these protesters that beg for a permit so that they can be confined a mile away from whatever political event don't even know what civil disobedience means.
“The federal government has way overstepped its bounds,” Tyler Shillig said. “For them to try to corral me in a 20-by-40 free speech zone is inexcusable.”
All the Right Wingers thought that the Free Spoech Corral was a peachy-keen idea when loyal, patriotic citizens wanted to protest G.W. Bush's illegal wars. Hypocrites, one and all.
22 weeks not long enough to comment - shut up and just read for a year or so
No we didn't. it was wrong then. its wrong now
And if you thought it was so wrong then, why didn't your savior abolish them?
In fact, there is no better recruiting tool for conservatives than giving liberals a soap box and letting them just be themselves.
That OWS idiot taking a crap on a police car lost them middle america with one photograph. I would swear the guy was a provocateur, but I don't think even undercover gov agents can look that filthy.
You got your right wingers, your left wingers and your Libertarians. Not the same thing. Try to figure it out. Libertarians support Constitutional government. The Constitution enshrines Free Speech.
c'mon you guys. they rape women and hate jews and fags. it is obvious. hate them. hate them, now! they are crazy!!!!!!!
Getting real tired of the ZeroHedge Web page BOMBING OUT. This has to be the worst site on the Web for people to try to type in messages. Bad scripts, constant foul-ups. This Web page is a mess.
Sure looks like Bundy is a media manipulator. Today he says that he will walk away if there is a compromise deal. Not exactly the same story he was pitching 5 days ago. These guys look like master manipulators of the media, not much more. They really ought to know - the Federal Government does not cut deals with Insurrectionists, or any armed groups (except for Taliban holding US soldiers who defected).
Why does Bundy deserve a deal? The BLM offers grazing at 10-15% of the fees for private land. That is already a heack of a deal.
Bundy better walk away soon ... because when the Feds stake out the place seriously and the Oregon National Guard shows up ... there won't be any more room for talking.
As for the Feds ... it looks like they have become a lot more sophisticated. They have mounted a major Info War against Bundy. Public opinion is overwhelmingly against the "militants", and this can't be a complete accident. The Fed Info War has been a highly successful tactic, without a drop of blood being spilled. If Bundy gives up, it;s likely that the Feds will draw a strong conclusion that the Info War gives a big payoff. And apparently it does.
It's not obvious what this incident has proved. Bundy's arguments don't make much sense. And the Fed got the opportunity to refine its tactics.
And not much else.
Definitely. But then again, the "info wars" won't mean shit when food and heating oil cannot be delivered to those colder states.
Winter is coming motherfuckers.
I'm absolutely shocked at the number of groups sending petitions around for these clowns to be labled as "terrorists." These folks may be many things, but "terrorist" ain't one of them.
make sense next time and try reading the facts instead of the spin. all deals are compromises. this is called civil dispbedience, a right gaurenteed by the constitution. no .gov permission is needed. the conflict is not about the cost of grazing fees. why should the bundies have to pay to grze on their own land?
.gov is losing the info war. all the bundies have is a hodgepodge of alt media. .gov owns all the mainstream media and all the politicians yet all they can muster is a faux "everyone believes" sentiment they post themselves.
the points being made are clear to anyone with more than a puddle for intellect.
try again.
Occupy Wall Street was not armed. I don't think guns and civil disobedience go together.
occupy wall street failed to do anything except sell ads for the networks. in all the history of man violence gets results. even ghandi relied on violence.
FWIW, The Black Panthers made a pretty big splash when they took to the courtroom steps while armed. Can anybody remember if anyone called the Panthers terrorists back then?
You'll also notice that Occupy, despite millions of supporters across multiple citites, acomplished 0% of their goals.
When they became infiltrated with move on and the environmental movement the media turned their focus intentionally to their cause and of course the hippies/stoners/UC agents that were embedded with them. They in part helped the justice dept run the clock out on the statute of limitation for fraud. The environmental movement was financed by renewable concerns that were also leveraging oil/gas and minersl rights ala stalking horse. This also concerned banks that were involved in carbon credits fraud.
"....Washington is mired in partisan bickering that's created the worst Congressional gridlock in recent memory which means that even if someone cared to address Bundy's concerns, they couldn't...."
No point reading beyond that. There is NO gridlock in DC.
Endless spending & debt: bipartisan agreement in favor
TPP: bipartison agreement in favor
Common Core: bipartisan agreement in favor
Growing Police/Surveillance state: bipartisan agreement in favor
Endless Undeclared Wars: bipartisan agreement in favor
Open Borders: bipartisan agreement in favor
Syrian Refugees we have no ability to vet: bipartisan agreement in favor
Bailouts for Banks: bipartisan agreement in favor
Export-Import bank to finance overseas customers of big businesses: bipartisan agreement in favor
There is no gridlock in DC, just corruption and treachery.
"There is no gridlock in DC, just corruption and treachery."
There is no gridlock in DC, just Criminality and treachery.
There, fixed it for you. There is absolutely NO more so called "Corruption." Just straight up, in your face open Criminality.
Yeah but abortion and gay marriage....../sarc
Nope those are also supported in a bipartisan way. Do you really think the GOP would ever want abortion to stop? How else can they rile up their base while not addressing the spending, war, and surveillance state? No, these guys love to pretend they are "doing something" when the plan wsa to sell out and give up from the get-go.
Looks like nothing but a bunch of gay business to me. They are all misguided, fantasy-chasing fudge packers. Good thing they aren't a group of teenaged black kids pulling this silly stunt, or they would be bullet-riddled corpses by now.
And all that phoney Jesus crap, and nonsense praying...hilarious. What a colossal collection of straight up losers.
exactly.
http://mashable.com/2016/01/07/bundyeroticfanfic-hashtag-tweets/?utm_cid...
Staring across the campfire at Dwight, Ammon's thoughts began to race. He leaned over and whispered in Dwight's ear, " Let's go see if you've got the constitution for THIS", he said, his steamy breath escaping into the night, one hand clutching his trusty AR and the other one holding his Rusty Crotch.