Juncker: "Dutch 'NO' Vote Will Lead To A Big Continental Crisis"
Submitted by Taco Denkers of Gefira
Juncker: ‘Dutch “NO” will result in big continental crisis’
In April the Dutch people will vote on the European-Ukraine association treaty. In an interview with the NRC, a Dutch leading newspaper, Juncker warned the Dutch voters a “NO” will lead to a big continental crisis. “Russia and anti European movements will profit from a Dutch No, the Dutch has to vote yes for reasons not related to the treaty, the Dutch should act like an European strategist” according to Mr Juncker.
Even the Dutch leader of the most pro European party, Mr Pechtold, was shocked by the warning, fearing it will have an avert affect on the Dutch voters.
The Dutch government introduced a consulting referendum in 2015, the Dutch law claimed democratic improvements while in reality it was constructed to prevent a referendum from ever happening. Dutch people who want a consultative referendum are obliged to collect 300.000 paper signatures. On average it takes an hour to collect one valid signature, the Dutch authorities were absolutely convinced that no one will ever manage to collect that many signatures.
Paradoxically an organization was created by Dutch authorities to facilitate a Dutch referendum, knowing that its principal never want to see a referendum happening. For this reason they do not accept the use of the Dutch digital authentication system (DigID), a system introduced by the Dutch authorities to communicate digitally with the Dutch authorities.
Unfortunately for the Dutch lawmakers a Dutch blog figured out how to collect “real” signatures digitally. People literally has to draw their “real” signature on the PC, using a drawing canvas in their electronic form. They were able to collect about 300.000 signatures, while the Dutch mainstream media completely ignoring this watershed moment.
The first Referendum under the new law is going to be against the Ukraine association treaty. The organization sees the European association treaty with Ukraine as provoking unnecessary violent tension in Europe. The EU was established to promote stability and peace within Europe, however with the treaty they are neglecting the founding principals.
The Europe association treaty and NATO’s involvement in Ukraine resulted in
- Violent riots in Kiev
- Expulsion of the Ukraine government
- Annexation of the Crimea
- War in eastern Ukraine
- Possible enlargement of the EU without the consultation of the EU citizen
- Flow of money to a country that is still ruled by corrupt oligarchs
- European-NATO encroaching into former Soviet Republics
As the Netherlands head the EU presidency, the Dutch will go to the ballot box to vote against the European Ukraine association treaty. Brussels’ elite already knows that there is resentment against the enlargement of the European Union, it is however new that the referendum also includes NATO policies.
(14 votes)
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GOOD !!!! Why aren't there more people from EU countries taking a stand??!!
The results won't count. All a NO vote will do is kick the bill back to the Dutch parliament and force them to go through the motions of reconsideration. There's no reason to expect any real second thoughts.
This isn't Crimea, where Russian troops are there to see to it the people's sovereignty is respected.
Get your twisted facts corrected.
I'm afraid he is correct.
That would be partially true a few years ago, but the political climate is changing rapidly. Ignoring "the will of the people" isn't going to fly quite as easily as a few years ago. They're hip to the con. They might try it, but a shitstorm will ensue for sure.
This is not a binding referendum.
Also its not true the MSM ignored this.
So do your homework before you write an article Taco Denkers of Gefira
They can't sell another "fuck you plebs!" before the next election because of Wilders.
Bullshit. Dutch MSM ignored it for a long time, especially in the starting period of getting the first initial 10,000 signatures which is required before the real challenge of getting the 300k signatures could actually start. When it started in earnest, there was again crickets from MSM, apart from some attempts to ridicule it. Only when it became clear that geenpeil actually might make it to 300k, the articles condemning such frivolous attempts at corrupting democracy started to become more frequent. It has been comedy gold, from start to finish. Geenpeil did a magnificent job, and the masterstroke was to give very infrequent updates on how far they were, keeping the pressure on, only to come out at the final day with the end score of 430k signatures.
The despair of the establishment is hilarious. They keep on fretting out the point that the association treaty is NOT an automatic step towards eu membership, only to be splashed down by no other than Poroshenko himself who proclaimed, the treaty in his porky fists, that this was a monumental step for his country, now that the EU membership in the future was a given. Then there were some grumpy commentators/think tank idiots who proudly stated that the only thing a reasonable dutchman could do, is not to go vote in this referendum, making it fail because of the minimum treshold participation of 30%. The establishment now starts to realise that boycotting the referendum might be a very very risky strategy - if all those in favour stay home and the 30% treshold is met (likely I think), the outcome will be even more devastating. We in NL arein for an exciting few months, and the vote could go both ways, also depending on events, dear boy, events. If Putin has an ace in his sleeve regarding MH17, implicating Ukraine or oligarch Kolomoisky, the perfect time to play it is coming near. But other geopolitical events putting pressure or blame on Russia might swing the vote the other way, so exciting times ahead.
I don't hold any illusions on what the Dutch government will do in the end. It is indeed a non-binding referendum, and the train has left the station (treaty is more or less already in effect now). But it will add another blow to the credibility of mainstream dutch political parties, and that is the most that could be made from this situation. And a pleasure to see happening in slow motion :)
Hoping for a similar referendum on TTIP, although it's not clear yet if that would be possible
I couldn't believe my eyes today, when I saw Jucker weighing in, and very telling indeed that even Europhile Pechtold had a cringing moment about it. The advisors to the European Commission must be so completely detached from the ordinary people to suggest this to him, that I am now hoping that Schulz and Guy Verhofstad are next in line to tell the dutch what to do- that would seal the referendum outcome to a No so loud that Brussels will tremble
Goed geschreven Silvarouvres. Thanks.
Well written Silvarouvres. Thanks.
Another EU scam in the making, followed by the skinning of the wider populace.
Typical EU "democracy" at work.
You bunch of lying, coniving bastards
Get an American vote machine company and their software to count the votes. Problem solved.
We already said no a long time ago mr. Juncker. Guess we have to tattoo it on your forehead so you can look at it every morning.
The Jew will not be happy here. The Jew went to great effort and expense (of American tax dollars) to voerthrow the elected government of Ukraine and replace it with neonazis who hate the Russia allied with Iran the mortal enemy of Likud and Greater Israel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHL_lSlETq8
Very interested who downrated this as every word was carefully chosen to be undeniably true and verified. You can be a Jew who sucks off Netanyahu but you shold not downrate factual content.
Go ahead, Dutch people !
You KNOW that you have to vote NO since that cunt, juncker, ask you to vote yes.
Whether the European vassals agree or not, the American elite wants Cold War II to continue. The Ukraine is a trophy better than most, so it will be added to the shelf. The Dutch may get sent back to the polls again and again, or they might pull a UK and just write up the results they want. Either way, the poodle farm formerly known as Europe will get in line.
whenever I see a comment containing the word "vassal" I question if the author understands the meaning of the world. which I would exchange to ally, anyway
about the article. lots of bollocks
"The Europe association treaty and NATO’s involvement in Ukraine resulted in
the association treaty is about economics, through a club of sovereigns called EU. NATO is a different club of sovereigns, with a different membership
1. in those "violent riots" in Kiev... well, lots of them were, particularly at the beginning, peaceful demonstrations, weren't they?
2. is the author suggesting that the EU managed to get the President of Ukraine to flee? the same EU which in Victoria Nuland's phone call was told to fuck itself?
3., 4., 5. and 6. are in the same ballpark of idiocy
7. is the one I find most interesting. I was originally fully against both NATO and EU extensions to the former Soviet Satellites, btw
then I had to witness how the US and the UK pushed, hard. For NATO enlargement. And started to twist arms left and right to offer EU membership as a carrot
now we have a country like Poland that is fully for US-led NATO, fully against Russia... and EU-skeptic
and we have another country like the UK that is for US-led NATO, against Russia... and EU-skeptic
at what point do need more evidence that the two clubs aren't the same? or do you have some kind of mental shield that prevents your head to explode from all the incoherencies that this propaganda has?
three countries that head a hard NATO stance versus Russia: the US, the UK and Poland
countries that head an anti-EU stance: the UK, Poland, Hungary and... Russia. the last... mostly through shallow propaganda, and actually Russia has the least problems with the EU as such. the whole project of the EurAsian Union is after all a carbon copy of the EU, including a carbon copy of the EUR. a carbon copy with a caveat: a Russian hegemony in those affairs
the US itself has expressed that it's interest in the UK is contingent on the UK staying in the EU, and acting as a gateway to it
which mirrors the interest of the UK in staying in the EU... for the markets. not as peer, mind
patience. a lot of patience is needed in those times of shallow propaganda and imperial push
------
P.S. how the Dutch have their referenda is a Dutch internal national affair.
Remember Greece.
Talking to the Dutch and treating them like Greeks.
Most people don't get the concept, 'Them today, you tomorrow.'
Junker - isn't he the guy who said "when it becomes serious you have to lie?"
If the self-interested, cynical, EU elites and bankers want you to vote "Yes" - then its a clear sign to absolutely vote "NO!"
I think that there will be less than 30% of voters to turn up, so the outcome will be 'irrelevant'.
The Dutch government is doing everything to make it as difficult as possible to vote: to 'save' money they reduce places to vote, so people have to go further away to vote. You have to say that you want to take part in the referendum first, the Dutch government and TV hardly talk about the referendum, etc...
Hang that BASTARD Juncker before April!
Sounds like North Carolina.
Are we talking 'bout the same Dutchy who handed over the Black Boxes to the Rotten British?
No problem. Greek people voted that they do not want more austerity. One week later they got even more austerity.
Voting is for keeping people busy, not for deciding things.
The association of the Ukraine with Europe is the very least thing Europe needs. Unfortunately our politicians are dedicated to continue the EU ponzi scheme by integrating countries which do not deserve the integration, such as Albania, Turkey and of course Ukraine. There is only a slim hope that the Dutch electorate is prudent enough to vote against the treaty which will bring with it additional political instability and enormous expenses for Europe. Every true european citizen should be against the treaty.
Trapped forever... on the Poodle Farm.
You gotta love it.
Even if they do vote against they'll be asked to vote again. And again. Until such time as they get the right result.
Jews want WWIII in Europe and Ukraine will be the flashpoint, say no to the jews and their plans of White Genocide.
Jews want WWIII in Europe and Ukraine will be the flashpoint, say no to the jews and their plans of White Genocide.
Junker just loves to break the concept of Democracy telling the Dutch they should vote some way that may be detrimental too them. The Dutch should vote yes or no at the individual level and wether it benefits them or not.
Not because some politician tells you they should when it may be detrimental too them.
Point in question is the USA demanding the UK stays in the EU with threats while the UK citizen is hammered through mass immigration - yeah 300k last year, fuck it I want out as do many others because you are not living this shit like the Germans really liked having all those sexual assaults also. Now if the Dutch ever vote for me to suffer, I vote we nuke Amsterdam, that's fair. As for the USA forced to stay in the EU because we tell you too, then choosing Putin and Russia seems fairly reasonable.
Democracy is a joke ain't it! Fuck Democracy we need mob rule when the mob is the majority we get Democracy.
Hi, willl not read everything, but comment on place a general comment Thank you ZH for paying attention to matters in this small country. I currently stay in this country. The problem is that the Ukraine is almost member of the EU. Second at the end of 2015 the fucking minster of the Ukraine said no matter what the result fo the referendum would be, we will be almost member. Politicians in the netherladns said this that he was exaggerating. At the start of 2016, what happend. Indeed the fuckers became almost member of the EU.
P.S. I do not know how translate 'almost member' adequatly.
I am sorry for the difficult English. In order to back up the claims made above please read the following or use google translate:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2015/11/premier_oekraine_oekraine_w...
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2015/11/poroshenko.html
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2015/12/nee_ga_weg.html
P.S. I had some wine, hence the difficulty with the English.
P.S.S. I like to use P.S.
Juncker once said "if it gets serious you need to lie". And something like "European treaties should not be obstructed by democratic processes". His interference and fear mongering in the referendum is scandalous but his threats will work like a red rag on a bull.
This referendum thing in NL is interesting. After years of trying to block it (especially by the party that has Liberty in its agronym) a consultative referendum was adopted by parliament. Consultative is the word that is key here. Cause the government can ignore the outcome of the referendum. The current government though has pledged to respect the outcome of this referendum but the current government are also big liars.
Anyway, they put obstacles such as collecting 300,000 signatures and how to collect them as the article writes. But a citizens iniative with the help of a popular blog managed to collect well over 400,000 signatures. So the authorities had to agree with organizing the referendum. But now they are trying to sabotage it. They limit the mount of money available that people can tap into for campaigning and they limit the number of polling stations, claiming that there is no need for many since people don't show up at referendum (last one was in 2005 when 62% of Dutch voters overwhelmingly voted againt the EU constitution) which is a lie because more people show up at referendums than at normal elections. Authorities complain it costs a lot of money to organize a referendum. That comes from the same government that waste billions on failed high speed trains project and the failed JSF to mention a few things. And hey, isn't democracy worth something? The turnout needs to be over 30% for the referendum to be valid.
Now, the mentioned citizen's initiative and the blog have called on the OCSE to send observers (...). The OCSE contacted the government and the government agreed. But the organizations also called not only for observers on the day itself but also to monitor the process leading up to the referendum. That request is still pending. Remember, OSCE observers are usually sent to banana republics....
This referendum is about a few things. It is about the association treaty with Ukraine (still not ratified by Dutch parliament but some aspects already being implemented....) but it is also about the Dutch people showing their discontent with the NL government and with the EU. Polls show that well over 30% of the voters will show up and will vote against the referendum despite the government's efforts to sabotage the vote.
Hopefully this will be the restart of the Dutch 'Hollanditis' of the 80s. After that people became fat, spoiled and complacent. Time to get of our buts and reclaim democracy. In Europe we need a referendum system like the Swiss have. Real democracy is about direct people participation.