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Guest Post: The Trouble with Rand Paul
Submitted by John Aziz of Azizonomics,
Rand Paul just endorsed a man who is deeply hostile to human liberty.
Perhaps that’s Rand’s idea of playing politics? Come to the table, strike a deal, get what you can. Trouble is, it’s tough striking a good deal when the guy on the other side of the table believes that the government should be allowed to claim — without having to produce any evidence whatsoever — that certain people are terrorists, and therefore should be detained indefinitely without any kind of due process.
That’s textbook tyranny.
Yes, I would have [signed the NDAA]. And I do believe that it is appropriate to have in our nation the capacity to detain people who are threats to this country, who are members of al Qaeda. Look, you have every right in this country to protest and to express your views on a wide range of issues but you don’t have a right to join a group that has killed Americans, and has declared war against America. That’s treason. In this country we have a right to take those people and put them in jail. If I were president I would not abuse this power. But people who join al Qaeda are not entitled to rights of due process under our normal legal code. They are entitled instead to be treated as enemy combatants.
Mitt Romney
Except, if the government had any evidence they were really members of al-Qaeda and engaged in a war against America they could be charged with offenses under current laws and tried in front of a jury of their peers. As was proven when Judge Katherine Forrest struck down the indefinite detention provision of the NDAA as unconstitutional, the real detention targets are people like the ones who brought the case — writers, investigative journalist and whistleblowers: people like Chris Hedges, Noam Chomsky, Daniel Ellsberg, Jennifer Bolen, and Birgitta Jonsdottir.
Rand Paul might have done some good work trying to filibuster the Patriot Act, but endorsing Mitt Romney goes beyond the pale. The NDAA is Romney’s most egregious transgression against liberty, but not far behind are his desire to start a war against Iran, to increase military spending, to start a trade war with China and his belief that corporations are people.
I know I will never agree with any politician on every single dimension of every single issue, and that to some extent politics will always involve compromise. Certainly, I disagree with Ron Paul on some issues. But Mitt Romney’s stances on these issues seem much, much, much closer to Barack Obama than they do to Ron Paul. In fact, he might as well have endorsed Obama for President.
And the Ron Paul supporters are noticing: Rand has probably burnt most bridges to his Father’s supporters now. His Facebook page has seen a huge outpouring of fury:
Just lost a lot of faith in a man I otherwise adored.
You suck Rand! Traitor!
That’s why this country is doomed! Even the person you trust is a sell-out. I’m done with politics, people deserve what they get. Let the country run itself to the ground, and still people will not understand what freedom and self-responsibility is about. People want big gov’t, big brother every step of the way. Well, they got it. The rest of us, might as well try to move to another country or find an island and move there.
I knew I’d never vote for Mitt… Now I know I’ll never vote for Rand.
He has fully sold out to the bankers
Endorsing Romney is tantamount to an utter sell-out of conservative principles.
Did George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison try to compromise with King George? Or — when it became obvious that they were facing tyranny — did they stand up for the principles of liberty?
I have always been uncomfortable with the children of politicians becoming politicians. Every anointed child feels like a step away from meritocracy. Dynasties are dangerous, because the dynasty itself comes to be more important than the qualities of the politicians. Who would Rand Paul be if he wasn’t Ron Paul’s son? Just another neocon. Neocons often have a few “unfashionable” libertarian or constitutionalist sympathies; look at Charles Krauthammer. But — unlike Ron Paul — the neocon never has the spine to do much about their libertarian or constitutionalist sympathies. They just ride on the establishment steamroller, into foreign occupations, empire building, corporate welfare, and banking bailouts. Into Iraq, and soon into Iran.
Rand Paul just got on the steamroller.
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That "meh" chick is gross. She's got a bigger adam's apple than I do.
' You seen the adam's apple on Ellen de Generes?
LABOR
A couple tickets to the Ark / bunker that the Pauls would otherwise be shut out of.
Unfortunately for them, holing up in a bunker doesn't usually turn out well.
The deal is his dad doesn't go on the 'combatants' list
The deal was Gold... or Lead.
They usually choose Gold.
veep? Romney knows he has zero cred with conservatives.
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/23167982
I found this gem thanks to people on the Justin Amash board
this apple didn't fall from the Ron Paul tree
Why is everyone so shocked? Lke you never heard of a guy inheriting a business or something (or in this case, absolute credibility) from his old man and subsequently running it into the ground? Father and son have different agendas.
I guess that was the only way to get a ticket of safety for when the world explodes.
He sold out to be allowed into the bunkers.
Coward little chicken shit prick.
As if your vote really matters. It is already decided who will be dictator. Your mind is being messed with and they are doing a great job building you up, and tearing you down. Dividing the masses and glossing over the real issues. I will vote, but only with the knowledge that the outcome is already decided. Turn off the TV, tune into alternative media. Pray for discernment on everything, and don't place any man above yourself. We are all pretty flawed. You do not get into the Paul's position without paying the piper. This is the stark sad reality of today.
Just a comment on the Rand Paul endorsement of Romney.
We do not know the pressures that have been brought to bear. The calilber of the enemies of the free people of the world is large and they have no scruples, no mercy and no justice.
If they can see our heros brought low, it is to their advantage and will serve them well. That someone breaks under the kind of pressure that they can exert is to be expected.
Ron Paul has opposed them and has started a large National movement to challenge the status quo . If our leaders fall, or do not live up to expectations, do not lose hope. If they do so because they are threatened and they are just trying to do the best they can, we cannot blame them. They are only human and love their families. They have put themselves and their loved ones in harms way to help us.
What we must not do, is sacrifice our principles, when no such pressure has been brought to bear upon us. We must still stay true to what we know is right, and just. We must still try to elect those to office who will fight for us as much as they can.
We must grow a movement so large and vast and diverse, that no one can stop us, and from which no tyrant can hide. A movement which will restore liberty and the rule of law in this country.
If some of our leaders fall in battle, in one way or another, we must move on. We must be relentless. We must do what they cannot, for in their hearts, I am sure that is what they are hoping and they cannot do it all, alone.
One day, when our leaders are threatened they will be surrounded by an army so vast that no one will be able to touch them. Until then, keep organizing, keep educating, keep active and stay strong.
Our day will come, and those who attack our heros and bring them low will see their own downfall.
I love how people are SHOCKED to learn that Rand sold out to the bankers. Guy took millions in donations from Big Oil.
When it comes to matching principles, or intelligence, of his father...... the Apple DEFINITELY did not fall far from the tree.
SM - did you mean to say the Apple did fall far from the tree? That would be more consistent with what it seemed you were getting at...
You mean YOU wouldn't take donations from Big Oil or Big Anybody (or Little Oil)? Give me a break.
I would take donations but then I'd tell them : "you suckers, you are not the boss of me!!"
After all, donations are not implying a contract that has to be fulfilled or something.
Why arent more politicians doing it my way??
thus ONE reason for TERM LIMITS
I'm taking donations. Don't care if you are big oil, big pharma, pr just big in the ass. I think TD will welcome donations too. But kiss my ass if you want anything.
Intelligence of his father? Oh yes, to be a qualified Doctor of Medicine, he must a moron.
You, on the other hand, must be really intelligent.
Near dead fish flopping on the beach. That is the state of the Republic.
Big Oil. Is that like big failed green energy companies?
Should make for an interesting Father's Day at the Paul establishment.
don't they just talk at each other and not really listen to anything the other is saying, anyway? thought that was their "way" as it were.
You (and other posters) sound like high school gals in the hallways. Tiy "know" the relationship between the Pauls. You "know" Rand was a bad guy all the time (but of course never said anything). You know he was part of some wacky assassination conspiracy, Suddenly ZHers knwe all along he was a tool of the bankers. So effing juvenile.
Rand is the same guy he always was except he endorsed Mitt. It's odd that the article quoted the Found Fathers who were compromisers of the first degree. ZH fans will ALWAYS end up disappointed because someone is bound to have an idea that varies from one of the Tyers and sadly, if Tyler said the world was flat, the posters would rush to agree.
interesting to whom? His children, or his Dad?
Rand Paul has become an embarrassment and a liability to his father.
outside the clique, Ron Paul is himself now a liability in the manner you speak.
Not only should people who target and kill innocent folks be tortured for any scrap of useful information, afterwards they should be summarily shot and their bodies returned to their place(s) of birth inside an iron cage to rot in the sun in the public square.
Does that apply to killers who fly the drones, too?
No, no, you misunderstand.
Anyone kill^H^H^H^H shot^H^H^H retired by a drone was a terrorist to start with.
See, the drones are with us good people.
SkyNet is always watching. America and th world is so much like a combo off The Matrix, T3 and The Truman Show.
Indeed. But i like to think of it as the unholy union of 1984 and A brave new world.
Panopticon.
As bad as the movie was I see the future like Demolition Man, or think that's how they see it. Totally agree with you Freddie.
So Mr. "Throw Out Your TVs, You Islamo-Kenyaphiles" is a fan of banal Hollywood fare. Who wooda thunk?
I can see a human who thinks she's an android asking another drone, "Have you ever retired an android by mistake?"
thank you, finally someone explained the movie to me!
Escape,
not for long...they have given it to the good Chinese, via the good Iranians.
http://the-diplomat.com/2011/12/24/how-downed-u-s-drone-helps-china/
Is there an intent to kill innocents on the part of the drone operators?
That's the dirty part of war, some use terrorism as a tactic. Maybe if we don't kill innocents with drones, they won't feel the need for revenge.
Maybe if we just bowed down to Allah all our freedoms would be preserved
What freedoms?
The freedom to spout whatever defamatory thing you like about the US government, our society and leaders and do so with utter impunity. Try saying some of the nutty things (conspiracies, plots, inside info,savage denigrations, etc) in some other nation and see how long it takes.
All those going on and on about what slaves we are are so blind they never realize that only in the US can they whine 24/7 without worry. The intellectual dishonesty out here is incredible.
It's a matter of perspective. Consider it a level of tolerance, where even the slightest amount of pressure inflicted upon someone who has never had any pain inflicted on them would be excrutiating. The same holds true here. The slightest impedence upon our rights is considered to be an unthinkable act. So, stop being dishonest with yourself about what reality is to different regions of the world. In America.. don't fuck with my rights.. don't even so much as think about it as even that would raise the hair on my ass. Got it?
Still cant see the forest for the trees huh Dave?
hasbara trolls don't care about the truth. I have no fear of Allah. But I certainly fear the talmudic war god, aka satan.
No my view is clear: The reason Libertarianism cant work (sadly) is that with everyone walking around exercising their liberties a certain fringe (like many on this thread) would do little to protect innocent people from force or violence, or would do so in a way as to not discourage it. Extreme Liberty must be defended with extreme punishment for lawbreakers.
In my Libertarian society people would be free to engage in any type of activity provided it did not infringe on the rights of others. Government would exist solely to protect the population and run courts of law. And law breakers in this polite society would be punished harshly indeed (Singapore style, work gangs, executions.)
Extremism in the defense of Liberty is not a vice.
lol. You open with a classic "omg something irrational is going to destroy us, like a flying saucer invation, except Muslim," then follow it up with a "Actually, my dearest Sir, my principles could not be more crystal clear, allow me to elucidate etc." lol
Dude, get the bat out of your belfry before you sit down to the typewriter. writing 101
Nice.
And who said anything about Libertarianism?
Quit trying. These folks live to whine they are slaves yet never notice they babble this BS without worry of recrimination. Only in the US can you denounce it for being a slave state and no one cares. ZHers are like the Left - they denounce all Presidents. the Founders, politicians (except RP and that's only a matter of time), institutions and history.
As I said, they live in some alternate universe where reality is conspiracy and any event is blamed on evil bankers or the 1%. If Tyler suddenly discovered Mitt was a good guy you'd get the usual "Yeah, what I thought the whole time". The real sheeple are those who blindly follow the particular Tyler of the day regardless of content.
That's not what they want.
Sorry, I like my dogs too much for that. Plus I'm too busy to keep taking off my shoes.
Allah, YHWH, Yahweh, Yehova, Jehovah are all the same Abrahamic fantasy entity. It's just the spelling and pronunciation that changes a little over the millenia.
Would those freedoms they hate us for be the ones that would be preserved?
Well maybe if you tortured them they would tell you, no?
pods
"Is there an intent to kill innocents on the part of the drone operators?"
They intentionally operate the drones knowing full well there's a big chance they'll kill innocents. If I take a shortcut with my car over a city square with no intention of killing innocents but happen to hit some of them on the way, would you think I'm perfectly moral?
But DC would stink to high heaven if we were to do that Dave.
pods
Ok, I accuse you of those things. Come here so I can summarily (ie without trial) torture and shoot you to death.
you're leaving the country anyway, asshole.
good riddance
What? I'd be happy to help you rid the US of accused terrorists with no proof or trial before I go.
LVD looks like your countrymen would rather see you go than Mos, look at the arrows.
You are probably a dual citizen anyway. So I don't even know who your countrymen are
I wish I had a time machine so I could transport myself back to the moment of your birth...and drown you.
are you his mom?
Politicians are nothing but STDs against liberty.
WHEN WILL YOU MORONS REALIZE... THE PROBLEM WAS NEVER THE STRONG OR THE INTELLIGENT. IT WAS ALWAYS THE WEAKNESS. IT WAS ALWAYS THE SLAVES. IT WAS ALWAYS THE MUPPETS. WIPE OUT THE MUPPETS, REMOVE THEIR POWER...
hate to be a spelling nazi, but it's "morans"
get a brain
I know you. You're no Nazi, you're Alexandre Dumbass.
BTW I used to drink beers with the Morans. They were from Ireland. Sharp dudes.
as of today, the Liberty movement is offically co-opted.
Don't think so. Rand wasn't liberty movement.
The first rule of Liberty Movement is, there is no Liberty Movement.
Hilarious, Potlatch. One of the funniest comments I've seen on here in a while. It's good to have a sense of humor in such depressing times. Thanks. That's a true act of rebellion.
He does forward a lot of 'Campaign for Liberty' emails.
Last week I opted out of all my spam emails from Rand et all. Got tiresome hearing about how Obama will do this, etc.
Guess I just got lucky?
pods
as of today, the Liberty movement is offically co-opted.
Not quite yet -- all that has happened so far is Rand has come out of the Neo-Con closet. You will know it's game over when Ron Paul gets to the convention and tells his delegates to support Romney, after getting some useless platform concessions and a featured speaking slot in prime time.
Even then, it's not over. It's just starting.
Never be led by people, be led by ideas...
You are the resistance!
You've been studying English...or your wife is writing for you again.
That happened after 2008. Ever hear of the Campaign for Liberty (C$L)?
Sadly, he has realized, to get elected, you have to pamper the morons.
You can't educate people that our current path is unsustainable and expect to get elected, as remaining militantly ignorant is by far the easier choice.
“Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.” ? George Carlin
I prefer Mr. Carlin's thoughts on voting,
“I don't vote. Two reasons. First of all it's meaningless; this country was bought and sold a long time ago. The shit they shovel around every 4 years *pfff* doesn't mean a fucking thing. Secondly, I believe if you vote, you have no right to complain. People like to twist that around – they say, 'If you don't vote, you have no right to complain', but where's the logic in that? If you vote and you elect dishonest, incompetent people into office who screw everything up, you are responsible for what they have done. You caused the problem; you voted them in; you have no right to complain. I, on the other hand, who did not vote, who in fact did not even leave the house on election day, am in no way responsible for what these people have done and have every right to complain about the mess you created that I had nothing to do with.”http://thinkexist.com/quotation/i-don-t-vote-two-reasons-first-of-all-it...
Ignorance is popular because it's easy to learn
If the Paul's negotiated a Jim Grant FedChair, a Jim Rogers TreasSec, Bruce Fein AG & Napolitano SCOTUS nod, I'll be easy on Rand. If not, I'm campaigning for Gary Johnson.
I don't like Romney but maybe he will pick Rand as VP. This sucks but anything i sbetter than the islamist. These POS oligarch/banksters give us no choice.
On anoither subjust - the Snorgtees ad with the girl in the panties is a nice diversion. The Obama voters here want pictures of blokes.
you still think that obama is a muslim? after all the destruction he as furthered in Muslim countries against innocent Muslim peasants... wake up man.
You still think that any misanthrope would care about your confession?
GFY.
vote for Rand and hate Islam, wank to Snorgtees - that's yer "choices" and that's yer plan, that's yer world. . .
What if he picked Rand as his Secretary of Interior? Could leverage it as a "pro drill baby drill" move.
We are just sussing out how much a muppet you are.
I hate this whole "Anyone but Obama" meme. I swear, Satan himself could put on a Brooks Brothers suit and an American flag tie and there would be a stampede to back him. If the alternative to Obama is no different than Obama, how does that change the situation?
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. ~Albert Einstein
I feel for people who think that US politics, and the party system, isn't just an extension of the governments manipulation and management of market forces. <shrug> yay whoever, I guess. Some people just do not feel cool unless they waving a pompom. Go for it, I guess.
CO, right on! Clearly the answer is to not vote, in droves.
+1 because you made me laugh.
The answer is not to "not vote in droves". That's what America is already doing. Just slightly over half of all eligible voters do bother to vote. It could be that Americans are too easily distracted by shiny things like iGadgets and Dancing with the American Idols, but maybe, just maybe, it could be that America isn't fielding any candidates that have better principles than the average turnip. It could even be some mixture of the two, I dunno.
But dammit, there's got to be a better way than this:
Presidential Election 2012
Please pick one of the following:
A) Evil
B) Son of Evil
I can't tell (sorry), but I hope that you don't misunderstand: I'm serious, not sarcastic.
Instead, all of the disaffected voters should gather and protest for None of the Above on election day.
Not voting is the only honorable thing I can see to do. If a great many of us did this, it might (might) send a message to the world.
I don't know too much about this group, and perhaps there are several others like it, but this is a good idea, I think, having NOTA on ballots.
Oh damn, I thought that was some perfectly placed sarcasm, that's why I laughed. I appreciate good sarcasm, even when it's directed at me.
What you say makes sense, only think of this: how will the people whom we are boycotting with our votes know which of us are boycotters and which of us are just lazy people easily distracted by shiny things? There are two ways that I see: the first is to vote, but to vote only write-in candidates, which I was planning on doing anyway. The second is to stage some sort of protest movement, which wouldn't work because ZH is populated by people who work for a living and don't have time to occupy a public park or something like that.
What do we tell our bosses it takes to vote? An hour? Or some do it after work? Spend whatever time you would spend voting marching around with a shirt that says None of the Above, or wear such a shirt to the polls (to make it visible to everyone) when you do your write-in. Or something like that. Just an idea. The energy needs to go somewhere visible, though, that shows that a bunch of us have lost faith in the system. Doing something in protest on that day, though, seems to be a crucual element of my suggestion.
Obama is not an Islamist.
He is a banker puppet.
Freddie, get off the sleeping pills. Do not operate heavy machinery while on them.
Looked at a bit differently, is this a Trojan Horse strategy, where he really is abiding by the principles of Ron Paul within and can then implement them should he be seated as one of the most powerful people in the world?
Would be interesting to see what's really going on.
trust me, its alright. its not earth-shattering, but its decent.
How do you think he got his name? as in: Best part of him Ran down his daddy's leg.
Didn't gunnery Sgt. Hartman say something similar to another guy from Texas?
He was obviously named in honor of Ayn. And she is rolling over in her grave tonight.
Hell...if you can't beat'em join'em
Here's someone going against the grain.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nt_oVKFKj5k
If you can't join them, beat them!
Well, Rand Paul is not Ron Paul just as Jane Fonda is not Henry Fonda (not the best example, but...).
Just as Motorhead is not Motörhead...
stick to 3 chord blues plz
you mean the 4 bar blues...?
African or European?
African, preferably Malian.
they know their guitars.
D i s a p p o i n t e d !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O1hM-k3aUY
WTF
I m not American but I learned a lot from the
wise words of Ron Paul,to watch his son turn
over to the dark side hurts,but...........
I beleive the bankers were just thrown under the bus. Romney can't beat Obummer without the "Paul's" support. Romney gets elected and ends the FED. I'll be watching the USD and financials for confirmation.
Are you serious?
TheMittens is a banker.
Romney gets elected and ends the Fed? Holy shit I've heard it all now. Tell you what. If Romney ends the Fed, I will shave my head with a cheese grater and eat a cat turd. The odds are better that I'll hook up with Jennifer Anniston tonight.
Now why the fuck would you want to hook up with Jennifer Anniston?
I've met more stable people in the psych wards doing H&I meetings.
How ya' doin' Dawg.
Hope all's well.
Did the old misplaced expectations thingamejig the other day. After having shot some nice mid 80's went out to a group grope 2 BB/4 made some serious stroke contributions to a second place but shot a demented high 90s.
Sigh.
Another lesson learned.
Again.
:)
Jennifer Anniston is the bomb diggity, so yeah, I think I could deal with her issues.
Good to see you Knuksie. I understand the golf thing. She's a fickle mistress. One day you shoot 74 and think you found the secret, then two weeks later you (I) go out and shoot 92 last Sunday. Fucking game. I hate to love it. So I'm playing tomorrow morning, and as I drive to the course, plotting out the shots I'm going to hit, I will try to keep my expectations to a minimum and focus on my gratitude for being alive and blessed to have the ability and means to play a Saturday morning round of golf. Celebrated 9 years on Wednesday. Beautiful thing. A miracle.
Cheers to you, my brother!
Oh, shit, I said the "b" word. Guess I'm on the list now.
Jennifer is on my bucket list too; face, lips, eyes, smile, ass.
She only has to be semi-sane, passionate, and horny for a night, not marry me ;-)
gotta wonder what Jennifer's list of requirements looks like. . .
WTF?
Dude, Romney is being FUNDED by the TBTF who were bailed out by the Fed. There is as much chance of Romney ending the Fed as there is a chance that the Euro will not implode.
note to moderators: please make it easy for people like this to create accounts. we get bored, and this helps. thnx
one does not simply walk into 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Pliny the Embryonic. Why Ron? What happened to him?
I'll take Rand's side on this.
First off, endorsement of Romney doesn't mean he endorses every single position the guy takes. This is a calculated position that Romney will do less damage to the nation than the current incumbent (anyone want to argue on that point?)
Second, the detention issue is a difficult one, and I don't think the line is as clear as many here think it is. How would a President lead a major internal conflict - the American Civil War comes to mind - without the ability to detain citizens who are clearly threats to the state? Using the civil justice system? Lincoln would have had half the country employed as judges just to bring cases against the other half of the country.
Obviously, there needs to be more judicial review than there currently is; and as such, I am not a supporter of the current detantion policies. But the assertion that Americans who are involved in fomenting violence against the state and their fellow citizens are due full process of law in each and every circumstance imaginable simply does not follow.
Ask Washington what approach he took when the bootleg whiskey distillers stopped paying their taxes.
ah so you are not frightened of your government and our loss of rights and freedoms....i think due process of law is what we should get. who is formenting violence? the media lies about everything.
-1
LOL. Romney is far worse than King George. Wake up...
Nice post & I agree.
And by the way, I am a huge Ron P. fan and was a supporter long before it was cool to be one.... His father's approach will never work--as far as getting the whole party on board and getting a nomination, it's too blunt.... Rand is using the trojan horse virus strategy.
"What Rand Paul’s Romney endorsement meansYes, Romney formally secured the Republican nod late last month. And, yes, as a Republican it’s assumed that Paul was with Romney as opposed to President Obama or even Libertarian nominee Gary Johnson.
But, remember that this is Rand Paul, the scion to the political legacy of his father, Texas Rep. Ron Paul. The Pauls have built a political base entirely independent of the Republican party and that’s why Rand’s endorsement is intriguing — for two reasons.
Before we get to that, let’s look at what Rand Paul said on Thursday night on Sean Hannity’s show:
“My first choice had always been my father. I campaigned for him when I was 11-years-old. He’s still my first pick, but now that the nominating process is over, tonight I’m happy to announce that I’m going to be supporting Gov. Mitt Romney.”
It might not be exactly the endorsement Romney might have wanted — two thirds of it was spent pumping up Ron Paul with the Romney endorsement as an afterthought — but it is genuinely important to have Rand Paul on the record in support of Romney.
As we have seen over the last few months, the Paul forces have the very real ability to not only disrupt the choosing of delegates to the Republican National Convention but also influence (and change) the leadership at various state parties around the country.
Does Rand Paul endorsing Romney mean that the Paul acolytes will immediately cease and desist in their efforts to have their views heard? No. But more so than most people who support a politician, the Paul folks listen to Ron/Rand and follow their wishes.
Rand’s endorsement then — when coupled with Ron’s email to supporters earlier this week urging politeness at the national convention — are a net win for Romney because they virtually ensure that there won’t be a genuine insurrection led by supporters of Paul at the convention. (Expect Romney to give Rand/Ron speaking slots at the convention too in hopes of throwing a sop to the Paul acolytes and push the theme of inclusion and big-tented-ness.)
The second way Rand Paul’s endorsement matters is as it relates to the Kentucky Senator’s own future national prospects.
It’s an open secret in Washington that Rand Paul wants to — and will — run for president either in 2016 or 2020. In the spring of 2011, in fact, Rand Paul speculated that he might run in 2012 if his father decided against a bid.
To do that and have a genuine chance at winning, Rand Paul can’t have the Republican establishment in open revolt against him. He knows that. His dad knows that. (It’s why we still believe Ron Paul won’t pursue a third party bid this fall.)
In making clear that he is publicly behind Romney, Rand Paul is sending a very clear signal: I’m a good soldier for the GOP.
Make no mistake: The Republican party establishment will never embrace Rand Paul as one of their own — nor would he want them to. But, it is possible that Paul playing the role of loyal Republican in the 2012 election could well neutralize some of the fears the party regulars have about the prospects of him carrying their standard at some point down the line.
The lesson? Sometimes — actually almost always — in politics there’s more than meets the eye."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/what-rand-pauls-romney-endorsement-means/2012/06/08/gJQAWSTtNV_blog.html
The Problem with that theory, I see, is the blow out For Obama in 2008. People Wanted Change and the Masses turned out in support thinking he would fullfill his promises. Our Society was and still is at a dangerous cross roads; No different than the beginnings of the civil war and the election of Abe. People will not stand for another lie or another four more years of ineffective leadership, I'm afraid. So this stunt for whatever reason was a gross miscalculation of the emotions about to explode in a few months.
Nobody's going to explode away from their hi-def TVs, especially during college football season, unless I'llbombya's folks stoke some kind of race riots. Sorry.
They won't have any electric power, HD TV or house. By that time many more will be jobless, homeless, without welfare and very angry. Civil war is coming.
Or you could watch this on that corporatist stooge Rand Paul. It's about all anyone should need to see, from his own lips. How anyone could vote for a creep like this is beyond me.
Not to mention that he appears in every sense to be a neocon....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iRtwMubLM4
NDAA is heinous legislation. The slippery slope of the President deciding which citizens are enemies can lead to a fascist state, where, as the author suggests, "the real detention targets are people like the ones who brought the case — writers, investigative journalist and whistleblowers: people like Chris Hedges, Noam Chomsky, Daniel Ellsberg, Jennifer Bolen, and Birgitta Jonsdottir." I am much more worried about abuse of power than internal conflict. Internal conflict should be dealt with in a way that addresses problems, not one which tries to make it disappear.
Lead to a fascist state?
Lead to?
Wake up.
No doubt we are headed there. They just haven't had a chance to use the NDAA to its fullest potential against ordinary Americans. Yet.
No doubt we are headed there?
Wake up and smell the Gulag man.
The president decides nothing.
He just nods his head to whatever he's told.
Poon - the issue of detention is NOT difficult at all. Even ignoring the fact that 911 was a lot of concocted bullshit (aka: controlled demolition), there is a larger issue. Even if the US was crawling with terrorists, I would much rather take my chances and get "blown up" by an alleged terrorist, as opposed to having everyone's Constitutional freedoms stripped away by allowing the goonsquuad to detain only based on "suspicion," so I might feel a little "safer." Do you love freedom? Where are your balls? To misquote Patrick Henry, "Give me shrapnel, or give me death."
I would put it right back to you, however: at the Battle of Agincourt, do you *really* believe it was the English longbows that were decisive? I mean USE COMMON SENSE.
Poon, your entire post sucks except the finish, yet the finish is a very good point indeed.
"This is a calculated position that Romney will do less damage to the nation than the current incumbent (anyone want to argue on that point?)"
I'LL DO IT
If Romney becomes President then every property in the entire United States will instantly become property of Goldman Sachs in a single night and everyone saying otherwise will be branded Al Qaeda, rounded up, shot on sight or put in prison for life with no court date EVER.
Clear enough, dumb-fuck?
With corporations as PEOPLE then Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan will be FULLY able to arm themselves with the best military hardware AT ALL TIMES to use on civilians AT ANY TIME, as per the 2nd amendment.
FIGURING IT OUT YET, FUCKWIT?
That amendment is for PEOPLE, which Romney says corporations ARE.
ok, so your whole argument is formented on the American Civil WAR.
Have we DECLARED war against Al Qeda, the Libyans, the Syrians, the Taliban, the drug cartels etc? or was it an 'executive order'? If we are at war, bring the declaration before congress and let the people decide, not a 'tribunal' by the 'king' who decides who lives or dies, who's free or not.
And pray tell who is a 'threat to the state'? Are these 'militants' in some remote country a threat to the 'state'? what about those who seek to throw out the incumbants in government? Are they a 'threat to the state'? Who makes the decision that this 'threat' exists?
All these people we kill are ALWAYS mentioned in the MSM even as SUSPECTED 'militants'. And note, that a 'militant' is ANY male between 18 and 40 or something like that. So when they bomb a fucking wedding party, the groom all of a sudden becomes a 'militant', and we wonder why the numbers of terrorists GROW? http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57448041/afghanistan-officials-claim-nato-air-strike-kills-women-kids-at-wedding-party/ http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jul/11/afghanistan.usa
Maybe we should firstly STOP our wars that INCREASE the number of 'militants/insurgents/terrorists'. THEN we can figure out whether we really would employ 'half the country' as judges to bring cases against the 150 million terrorists you seem to indicate are attacking us .There just aren't that many terrorists out there. You are still more likely to die in a swimming pool than by a terrorist. Fuck, as a military soldier, you're more likely to die by YOUR OWN HAND, rather than an 'insurgent'.
http://www.disinfo.com/2011/02/for-second-straight-year-military-suicides-outnumber-combat-deaths/
We have become the very monster we were supposedly trying to destroy. If Osama Bin Laden had said "I wish to remove all the liberties from Americans, and they will VOTE for it and PLEAD for the removal of their liberties" we would have laughed at him.
Too bad he's won.
Mr. Poon,
You said: "Blah..blah...(compromise principles, equivocate, bullshit)...blah...blah..."
That is exactly the problem; get a clue.
Fuck Rand Paul
Anyone supporting Mitt Romney is either delusional or just plain stupid. Much like the Obama supporters in 2008.
Personally, I find him to be a despicable human being.
Hahahahahahahah....you called Robot a human being!
he's a Nexus-7 Series replicant. The Tyrell Industry is nervous, but hopeful.
"Beep-boop...beep-beep-boop!"
(he might need a battery change mid-election)
"I know it was you Fredo, you broke my heart. You broke my heart!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=FcFlp6kl508