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Guest Post: US Citizens Now One Step Closer To Becoming Permanent Tax Slaves
Submitted by Simon Black of Sovereign Man
US Citizens Now One Step Closer To Becoming Permanent Tax Slaves
This week, the universally stupid brainchild of US Senators Chuck Schumer and Bob Casey known as the Ex-PATRIOT Act inched a bit closer towards becoming law.
‘Ex-PATRIOT’ is an absurd acronym that stands for “Expatriation Prevention by Abolishing Tax-Related Incentives for Offshore Tenancy”. I call it the Tax Slave Act… and it proposes three key provisions:
1) Individuals who are deemed, in the sole discretion of the US government, to have renounced US citizenship in order to avoid US taxes, will be permanently barred from re-entering the United States.
2) Such individuals will also be required to pay a 30% capital gains tax to the United States government on ALL future investment gains derived from the US. Currently, non-citizens who do not reside in the US pay no US capital gains tax.
3) These proposals are RETROACTIVE, and, if passed, would apply to anyone who renounced his/her citizenship within the last 10-years.
During a Sunday interview with ABC News, House Speaker John Boehner threw his support behind the bill… certainly a big step towards its eventual passage.
Let’s pause briefly for a little history lesson–
Dart Container Corporation was founded in 1960 by William F. Dart, the man who first perfected the design of styrofoam. Dart Container is today a multi-billion dollar family-owned company with thousands of employees and operations around the world.
In the early 1990s, brothers Kenneth and Robert Dart, heirs to the family fortune, renounced their US citizenship and became citizens of Belize and Ireland, and set up residency in the Cayman Islands.
Around the same time, several other wealthy Americans renounced citizenship, including Carnival Cruise Lines founder Ted Arison (who obtained Israeli citizenship), Campbell Soup heir John Dorrance (Irish citizenship), and fund manager Mark Mobius (German citizenship).
President Clinton was furious, and in 1996, he pushed Congress to pass a series of financial penalties for people who renounce citizenship. At the time, a ‘renunciant’ had to continue filing US tax returns for 10-years after renouncing.
Effectively, though, this penalty was a tax on worldwide income, not an exit tax on assets.
Fast forward to the mid-2000s, a time when the asset bubble was at its peak; the stock market was at its all-time high and real estate prices kept going up.
The Bush regime passed a series of changes to expatriation rules, dropping the income tax filing requirements in lieu of charging a one-time exit tax on assets.
In this way, the government was able to derive a much larger payment up front based on total assets rather than chasing around a former citizen for a piece of annual income.
In the years since the exit tax on assets was established, two things have happened:
1) The number of Americans renouncing US citizenship has risen steadily, from 235 people in 2008 to 1,780 last year (according to Schumer’s office).
2) The asset bubble has burst, and assets are worth much less than just a few years ago. As such, the government isn’t collecting as much revenue from the exit tax.
My sense is that the government has been watching the number of expatriates rise over the years, and simultaneously watching the value of the exit tax fall… and they’ve been looking for an excuse to make sweeping (i.e. retroactive) changes.
Eduardo Saverin is the perfect excuse. The Facebook co-founder’s recent renunciation of US citizenship has become a rallying cry for politicians to go back in time and steal money from former citizens retroactively…plus establish a larger base for future tax revenues.
This is a truly despicable thing to do considering that these former citizens followed the appropriate rules at the time, paid the tax, and moved on with their lives. Now Uncle Sam wants to go back in time to unilaterally change the deal, and expect everyone to abide even though they’re not even citizens anymore. The arrogance is overwhelming.
More importantly, this bill is also a major deterrent for people who are thinking about renouncing US citizenship today.
The passage of this law will undoubtedly cause many people who were considering expatriation to abandon the idea altogether as the thought of being permanently barred from entry is too much to bear.
It’s truly extraordinary that the Land of the Free has deteriorated to the point that the government must now resort to threats, coercion, and intimidation in order to keep its most productive citizens inside.
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Thats all most of us want, to be left alone.
Who the fuck made the usa military the international 911 number?
if we used a nuke on the next "call", i'm betting those 911 calls would drop off pretty damn abrupt like.
why do you think no one speed dials the Russians? They don't play games, that's why.
Wouldn't want to take a geiger counter into southern Iraq.
Who the fuck made the usa military the international 911 number?
The military-industrial-congressional-intel-media complex.
Become an American-trained doctor and every country in the world will take you and put you on the priorty list for immigration. Had a close friend who's a surgeon move to New Zealand after he had enough shit in the US. Wasn't difficult at all, he did have to take a salary haircut, but he works 40 hrs a week now.
They are not just after doctors in NZ. They are after all sorts of other professions as well. We did it and made the move a few years back. The process was pretty simple and easy. Life is pretty good now.
you got some of those Maori tats yet?
No not yet - but I about have an NZ passport. Even better.
James Cameron is joining you in NZ too. I doubt its just for fun.
It'd be interesting to see a report on the rich who all have escape plans, bugouts, doomsteads(multi million dollar ones) in foreign lands and islands.
That's where the issue is. You cannot escape IRS.
I only say one thing to the tax refugees, "do not ask for the US military to come save your ass or to keep the world safe for the well-to do."
They sure as shit dont do that now. Why the fuck would you even think the US gives a damn about citizens in a foreign nation?
Plus the Medicare tax that you paid for decades is wasted, since Medicare offers no overseas services.
I only say one thing to the tax refugees, "do not ask for the US military to come save your ass or to keep the world safe for the well-to do.
SURE! But the Feds have to give me my money back!!
If you are honest and have a bit of integrity, can you still sing "land of the free ?"
We are plumbing new depths of state control and fascism. The US is becoming the largest penal colony on the planet.
huh,huh,huhhh,hhuuuh,huh,hhuuuhh, he said penal, huh,huuuhuuh!
Definition of PENAL
1 : of, relating to, or involving punishment, penalties, or punitive institutions2 : liable to punishment <a penal offense>
3 : used as a place of confinement and punishment <a penal colony>
You may want to cut back on your porn a tad.
Or else move to a penile colony!
I can imagine in the near future people born in the USA will ask their parents, "why I was born in this country".
Everyone knows those on foodstamps are the most productive.
There is probably more effort involved in filling out the application for your SNAP card than inheriting 20 million.
You are an economic retard if you think effort and economic productivity have much in common. Sometimes a simple idea unleashes huge amounts of productivity with minimal physical effort
True and sometimes no productivity at all or action detrimental to overall productivity can be performed and yet still still produce tremendous economic gain atleast in the short term. You are an an economic retard if you believe all things that produce economic gain are ultimately productive.
At the risk of being labeled an economic retard, I would offer that productivity and value creation are not universally linked.
A washing machine works hard.
explodinghead, the problem with your wealth distribution crusade is that in your zest to punish a few aristocratic heirs, you actually end up shafting the VERY HARD WORKING UPPER MIDDLE CLASS who actually power this country. Raising the income tax for those over $250k and calling it "the millionaire's tax" is a classic example of this. The only people raising income taxes hurt are the ladder climbing professional class who live off a salary and are located in expensive metro areas with overpriced housing (because the schools in other areas are so shitty).
It's much harder becoming a doctor or an actuary than filling a SNAP card application.
+1 TKO
Your putting words in my mouth and your assumptions are way off base. I just find it interesting that people focus on the food stamp recipients as if they are a bigger part of the problem than the fascists that destroy the free market. In addition the fascists love food stamps and dependents of the state.
I don't disagree. EU is a good example of this. Once you feed the masses, shelter them, and give them a free shitty Sorbonne education and free pirated from America health care--all paid for by debt or the upper middle class and small business taxes--the aristocrats in Europe can do whatever they want. Gang rape? That's our culture!
What is your solution though? Raise income taxes? Then you'd just hasten the fascist state you abhore.
Well, pointing the finger at a second wrong doesn't' make a first wrong somehow cleansed of wrongness.
Dead-weight is dead-weight. Aristocracy that produces nothing but lives off the hard work and productivity of others = a bunch of losers that need to lose their handouts, and start engaging in behavior that is productive and not socially derelict by depending on others for your mere sustenance.
Bankers that do this with money and credit unbacked / created out of nothing, imbued with purchasing power at the expense of those already holding the same currency... Need to lose their handouts and get to work.
Lawyers who rely on absurd complexity need to stop charging troll bridge tolls on the productive just so they can be in business via arbitrarily complex tax codes, regulations, etc. (same for the rest of the legislated technocracy that would be out of a job the very second laws forcing people to buy their services expired...)
Etc. All the way down to the Snap Card Fuckers who start knocking out kids at age 14, dumping their inability to take care of themselves on society.
Cut them ALL OFF.
I wish I were smart enough to offer a solution that would be practical. Some people on this board say stop paying taxes..as if a w2 wage slave has a choice and as if they wouldn't make an example of me and leave my wife and baby destitute...call me a coward. Some days I actually hope for the Zombie apocolypse to just burn the system to the ground. Quite frankly if there were a collapse I am not afraid of the food stamp recipients nearly as much as the fascist's brown shirts.
Does this mean the IRS gets to operate like NATO on a UN charter? That would make sense. They need an incompetent group of criminals, set to expand exponentially with ObamaCare, armed with a fleet of drones in place to collect carbon & financial transaction taxes for the SDR bond market.
some reflections on this:
1. when a jew is writing up a law to punish another jew, this means things are quite screwed up
2. about a dozen years ago, i was applying for a US student visa. there was a question in the application form asking you whether you have renounced a US citizenship in order not to pay taxes.
3. what about the green card holders moving out of the US - will they be covered as well? for the income tax purposes, green card holders are treated in the same way as citizens, i believe.
#3.A - good idea. Will have to report that to the collective.
Back to the Future, forward in reverse, America the beautiful is stuffed into the hearse.
This law would be totally unconstitutional (assuming anyone we've elected has ever read or cares for our Constitution anymore.
Such law would clearly violate Article 1 Section 9 of the Constitution that Congress may not pass any ex post facto law.
These morons were doing the same BS several years ago when they tried to pass the retrocactive "tax" on all bankers whereby a 90% income tax would be paid on bonuses.
<sacrasm> oh, i am sure that either obama is going to veto it, or the supreme court will strike it down </sarcasm>
Tyranny is here!
What's the matter Simon, mother fuckers be cutting into your bottom line? Roosevetls can't truck no damn business with dat portfolio shaking.
Can't get new recruits for your Bolivian Utopia if they're frightening all those stodgy old boomers away by threating to dip into their nest eggs.
Government say "Yes we can". Time for Americans to say "No, we won't".
Ex post facto bitchez.
Unfortunately it is not ex post facto to designate a certain group of non citizens as not allowed entry into the united states
You are correct about that. But the retroactive tax stuff is blatantly ex-post facto.
I wonder if they have severability in the law?
They couldn't quite figure that one out with Obamacare.
we need every able bodied citizen to contribute to the 6 figure pensions of our "hero"(thanks B. Laden!) firefighters and cops and assorted bureaucratic leeches
dammit, it was just yesterday we had to get on someone's ass about blaspheming the Thin Blue Line. And here we are again. Don't you know they're the Only Ones keeping the wolves from your door, ingrate? /sarc off
US in 2021:
Passports issued on deposit of assets proportional to the wealth of the subject plus its share of the national debt, to be confiscated if the subject does not report back to the Homeland.
Alternativelly, the applicant may go through an interview process or leave a family member behind.
All subjects renouncing to the Homeland will be banned from setting foot on its soil again, even as a visitor ( aliens with allegiance to an ally of the Homeland ).
All government officials in the service of the Homeland are exempt from these measures.
Now, if they could just combine this law with indefinite detention, they'd really be onto something.
why not make a fence around the USA
To keep people out? Ohhhh I get it now, right, right.
It appears to be a Shovel Ready project....Hope you can believe in...Chicago Style
now that the supremes have declared corporations to be people, maybe we can apply the tax thingy to offshore corporation people as well
The gubbermint has no other choice than to lock the gates on rich expats. Otherwise, the active fraud depicted in the following link could not perpetuate.
http://www.wthr.com/video?clipId=7054149&autostart=true
Now shut up and eat your fucking peas. Putaz.
Who had the great idea to charge tax from illegal immigrants or to use a tax system to pay 'child benefit'.
Collecting child benefits from abroad is also widespread in Europe. It is even legal in some cases.
2 WOWS!! First the story itself and secondly they still do investigative journalism and stories on the news in Indiana? In any event good on the station and reporter
The IRS folks are way too busy handling more important matters. They mis-keyed an extra $80,000 into my 90+ year-old aunt's income and then started coming after her last week. The IRS auditor still hasn't gotten her taxes right even after she has pointed out their specific errors. Not too many years ago, the IRS mis-characterised some GSE principle return as interest income even though it was clearly designated.
Those guys need to be careful. She is pretty peppy and will not let them go until her payment is correct to the last penny.
They are fuckups and you have to pay attorneys to straighten them out when they screw up. I got a bank levy of the exact same amount I sold a house for (6 figures). With no tax bill or warning letters. Figure that one out. It took awhile and money to straighten out, with no apologies.
tax revolt is the only solution
STOP PAYING TAXES ALTOGETHER BY IMPLEMENTING BARTER
So does this mean that one can now legitimately renounce their citizenship because this country SUCKS DICK?
If they really like having you as a fellow citizen they can deny your application.
Another angle on the TAXMASTERS: http://townhall.com/columnists/chucknorris/2012/05/22/irs_gives_billions...
I knew a small business owner once who employed an illegal alien for a brief stint. The illegal had a green card and SS# although of course it wasn't him. My question is where do the taxes go that are paid by employers on behalf of these bogus SS#'s? Does the IRS know these numbers are bogus?
Yes, the IRS actually keeps track of this informaiton. I believe there is an accounting kept which shows that about $5 billion a year in SS taxes have been collected on bogus #'s in recent years.
If you obtain citizenship in another country then why even bother to file a US tax return if you have moved all your assets with you? Who cares what the US law says if you have a different citizenship? For that matter, who cares what the USG says about your US citizenship status.
Extradition treaties
There have to be places that don't have any.
I seem to remember Simon getting shit for reporting on this subject. Brazil comes to mind.
it wasn't the content he got shit for. It was mostly the delivery.
Venezuala, North Korea, Switzerland.
I'm guessing that there are a lot of places where tax evasion is not covered in extradiction treaties. Particularily if taxes are being paid in the host country.
Usually only if you are a citizen of that country will you be safe from extradition. A US citizen on the run can be brought back from damn near anywhere...kicking and screaming usually.
Happily, I am not a US citizen so I can read these post with a certain amount of guilt free amusement.
Because our benevolent government has various treaties with foreign governments allowing them to seize assets abroad. If you like Goldman's appendages, you'll love the IRS's.
"During a Sunday interview with ABC News, House Speaker John Boehner threw his support behind the bill… certainly a big step towards its eventual passage."
Boehner is a cunt. Fucking worthless Speaker of the House. That he would support anything coming out of Schumers' office is testimony to his own douche-baggery.
Typical Federal motherfuckers......
Oh, just keep it simple. If you renounce citizenship you are outside of the circle of trust. If you are not with us, you are against us. You are a terrorist. All you need to renounce is to provide a series of photos and a thermal signature, which will then be loaded into a predator drone, which will then be assigned to neutralize the threat (you).
In other words, don't call us, we'll call you. And you can certainly come back to the states, since those predators are already buzzing around here.
These proposals are RETROACTIVE, and, if passed, would apply to anyone who renounced his/her citizenship within the last 10-years....Too bad that did not apply to my 401k before Greenspan
"Currently, non-citizens who do not reside in the US pay no US capital gains tax."
Unless they choose to if the capital gain tax is higher in their country of residence, which is usually the case in Europe.
Either ZH has some very wealthy readers (i.e., those who could afford to move to another couontry and survive on just their unearned income) or a lot of people identify with a class of which they will never be a member.
First, Mr. Black makes his living appealing to U.S. Citizens looking for ways to avoid U.S. taxes. In other words, people who have benefited from being U.S. citizens but don't want to pay the associated costs. So, because he doesn't want to see his source of income disappear, he tells the rest of us that we should be "outraged" about Schumer's bill, even though every penny collected from wealthy ex-pats is a penny the U.S. Government won't have to borrow and, accordingly, a penny (plus interest) my children won't have to pay.
Second, protecting ex-Pats from taxes won't do anything to reduce our government's spending problem. They're ex-pats, which means they have run away from the fight. They have no desire or intention to keep our government from spending money. In fact, if any of them own defense, pharmaceutical or agricultural interests, they have every reason to lobby for MORE spending that the rest of us ZHers must pay for.
Third, true patriots are people like Ron Paul, not Eduardo Saverin. Paul has spent his life trying to get spending under control. I'm an optimist and believe the day will come when a majority of Americans finally get it. When that day comes, I'll be proud that I stayed in the fight and I certainly won't welcome any goddam cowards like Saverin and Mr. Black.
And I believe that one day each one of us will have our own personal unicorns and energy reactors that run off of unicorn shit. There will never be peak unicorn shit, bitchez.
You are probably right about the reactor and wrong about that it will run off of something and that everyone will have it. Only particular groups of people will have it and publicly will be known that such thing does not exist. It violates the human made/defined/understood "laws" of physics.
Of course the assumption with the above, is that the current unsustainable state of the system will survive in perpetuity, otherwise, most of you probably can imagine what sort of (dis)order will evolve out of the balancing transition.
Dead wrong. You missed the point entirely.
The point is the US - under idiot grandstanding assholes like Schumer and Casey, want to;
1) Change the deal on people who already left - which is akin to cheating. More like welching.
2) The money collected won't make even a tiny DENT in the government's debt. Moreover, IF the government spent money wisely (which THAT will never happen), they would not have to resort to this brand of crap.
3) Ex-pats, many of them, didn't "run away". They left for a better life. The ones you point out are minscule in number. Most likely.....1 or 2. I bet none.
3) Ex-patriots like Black are not "godam cowards". They were smart enough to realize this government was turning into a police-naziesqe state, and got out, tired of seeing their hard earned tax dollars spent UNWISELY.
"There are two types of people, the ones who leave us alone and let us live and the ones who will not leave us alone." - Chris Duane
Where do you think Simon sits on this scale?
Where do you think every congress critter sits on this scale?
Please put the tin foil hat back on. This stuff you are spewing is MSM and we are lossing our freedoms. It is that simple.
"In other words, people who have benefited from being U.S. citizens but don't want to pay the associated costs."
What benefit?
Maybe you should check the amount of normal US citizen leaving abroad having a normal job....
Maybe they all should repatriate as for sure there is enough jobs for them in the US....
And by the way, ask some US citizen leaving abroad how "easy" it is to have a bank account where they are living for the daily expenses.
No bank wants them anymore, too scared!
Mr. Saverin is actually investing in startup companies as well, you know how many restrictions there are on investments from US Citizens from the IRS?
Don't get me wrong. If one lives in one country and uses the infrastructure of it he should pay taxes, but there are US Citizens that where born abroad and never lived in the US.... why the hell should they pay taxes in the US?
It's time to save money and to stop criminalizing people that always paid the taxes.
I mean, I shouldnt care at all, I've never even been to the US... but it will harm the US economy more than the benefits.
Maybe you should check the amount of normal US citizen leaving abroad having a normal job....
Maybe they all should repatriate as for sure there is enough jobs for them in the US....
And by the way, ask some US citizen leaving abroad how "easy" it is to have a bank account where they are living for the daily expenses.
No bank wants them anymore, too scared!
Mr. Saverin is actually investing in startup companies as well, you know how many restrictions there are on investments from US Citizens from the IRS?
Don't get me wrong. If one lives in one country and uses the infrastructure of it he should pay taxes, but there are US Citizens that where born abroad and never lived in the US.... why the hell should they pay taxes in the US?
It's time to save money and to stop criminalizing people that always paid the taxes.
I mean, I shouldnt care at all, I've never even been to the US... but it will harm the US economy more than the benefits.
The Visogoths are starting to look rather appealing.
There is a loophole with US Permanent Residents soon to be covered :)
ooops, policy change. First, stop project of building fence on southern border to keep latinos fron entering the USA. Second, IMMEDIATELY CONSTRUCT IRON CURTAIN around the USofA and all financial transaction must be routed through US Treasury.
Given my Eastern European experience the wall is not needed. THey can seize passports and keep them. If they deem that you will not return from your trip abroad then they can deny giving you the passport.
Are there still countries that are offering political asylum ?
The US Gov could send a few invoices over to Japan and Europe for the free ride they get from US military protection.
Or just BRING THE TROOPS HOME, 67 years after the war ended!
One last thought.
FACEBOOK led to this - for if Saverin didn't make the jump, this hump Schumer wouldn't have pulled the trigger on this bill.
Oh, the lying fuckfaced prick can say what he wants. Bottom line is this douche bill will pass, as spineless members of CONgress will rally behind it. Retroactive makes it fucking disgraceful.
One more reason to HATE FACEBOOK.
"...and they’ve been looking for an excuse to make sweeping (i.e. retroactive) changes."
This is a red herring, not that the rest of the piece is not valid, but this particular argument is invalid. Laws cannot be made retroactive in the USA under our constitution, that is called and ex post facto law and is specifically prohibited by the constitution. The laws that can be enforced against you are only those that were in effect at the time of the infraction. For example, if a government at any level decides to crack down on something, say DUI's or distracted driving, and they initiate prosecutions or increase penalties for that "crime" they cannot apply new sentencing or arrests for things done before the law took effect, which cannot ever be in the past, it must always be in the future or present. Tax law and government regulations are no different.
Article 1 Section 9 LIMITS ON CONGRESS Clause 3
No bill of attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.
That is all it says, no ambiguity, no exceptions, nothing to fudge. And the next section prohibits states from the same actions.
Dead wrong.
They already do it. Ask any sex offender, who crime was committed before October of 2004. The Feds went back 20 years and reigned in people - some whose crime was peeing off a dock - to register, and barred them from living a certain number of feet from a school, playground, or daycare.
I know of one man whose "crime" was exactly that. Committed this ghastly thing back in 1991 ( a neighbor kid saw him do it...ran to Mom...Mom hated the guy...bang...police were called). Pleaded guilty and got probation. Had to register - but back then..so what. On comes Jessica Lunsford, and then the cunt John Walsh, with his Adam Walsh Act.
BaBoom. This man's life was ruined all over again.
So please...they are already doing it. "Society" went right along - because, you know, they're sex offenders - they're all bad. (which is a fucking joke)
The fucked up irony? The douchebag that got the Act passed? Mark Foley? HE got caught texting and emailing underaged Congressional pages. He was released.
The constitution does not allow ex post facto laws, I did not say they do not do unconstitutional bullshit from time to time, they do, and the laws you refer to would be found unconstitutional if some deep pocket ACLU type organization fought on your friend behalf, unfortunately NOBODY in his right mind is going to go to bat for a sex offender, even if the offense was taking a leak. By the way, I knew a guy in California who had the same thing happen but it was a cop that saw him. Lifetime registration with cops as a sex offender, photo on the internet list of neighborhood pervs and all.
One could argue that all three strikes laws are in effect an ex post facto law. I mean if you had three minor crimes on your record, and maybe some are of the variety you used as an example, none serious enough to land you in hard time up at the state facility, but because of those crimes years later you get life for a minor offense, that is in effect changing the consequences of an act far in the future, and that is at the very heart of the meaning of ex post facto. That clause exists because in the British system during colonial times the parliament had the authority to pass ANY law under the Parliamentary Supremacy Doctrine (Acts of Union 1707). They could and did make actions criminally punishable after the fact. It was so unjust that our founders made it absolutely out of the question here reasoning it was better to let an evil doer go free than to give that much power to congress.
The constitution says no ex post facto but some court rulings have the "effect" of an ex post facto law. Wiki says this... A law may have an ex post facto effect without being technically ex post facto. For example, when a law repeals a previous law, the repealed legislation no longer applies to the situations it once did, even if such situations arose before the law was repealed.
For example, don't ask don't tell. If a guy was punished for coming out in the service even though it was clear DADT's days were numbered once the repeal was enacted it essentially voids his "crime."
This is also what Wiki says:
An ex post facto law (from the Latin for "from after the action" or "after the fact") or retroactive law is a law that retroactively changes the legal consequences (or status) of actions committed or relationships that existed prior to the enactment of the law. In reference to criminal law, it may criminalize actions that were legal when committed; or it may aggravate a crime by bringing it into a more severe category than it was in at the time it was committed; or it may change or increase the punishment prescribed for a crime, such as by adding new penalties or extending terms; or it may alter the rules of evidence in order to make conviction for a crime more likely than it would have been at the time of the action for which a defendant is prosecuted. Conversely, a form of ex post facto law commonly known as an amnesty law may decriminalize certain acts or alleviate possible punishments (for example by replacing the death sentence with lifelong imprisonment) retroactively. Such laws are also known by the Latin term In mitius.
You buddy with the sex offense conviction is a perfect example of what the government cannot do in law under this clause of the constitution. If he had millions of dollars he could afford justice. Unfortunately he also pleaded guilty to what was even then a sex offense. Still, how many of us plead guilty to minor crap in order to get the lower sentence? What if you plead guilty to a DUI and 10 years later they have a crusade against drunk drivers passing a law permanently revoking drivers licenses for anybody ever found guilty? Well, that would patently be an ex post facto law even if it were a presidential order, a bureaucratic regulation, or a state administrative action.
But, and this is really important, George Bush might have been dumber than a bag of hammers but he nailed it when he said the constitution is nothing but a goddamned piece of paper. One by one every clause, every idea behind that goddamned piece of paper is being shredded, from fiat money to NDAA. And there is no way to restore it by peaceful means now that congress is owned lock stock and barrel by industry and K Street. Leaving you and I with three sickening options, learn to get along with it as it is, take up arms and change it by force, or leave permanently. One is horrific, hard to imagine, two has a very high probability of getting you killed and failing in the end anyway, and three is not really a solution just an escape. Geographic solutions rarely work.
I hear you boil.....
This guy has done nothing but be a model citizen too.
But as he says, "there is no incentive to do better." I can never redeem myself - in the eyes of the law."
Which sucks. No true "justice" at all.
Interesting factoid?
He belongs to several support groups.
They montiored the bullshit "To Catch a Predator" series that aired on NBullshitC.
Of the 130 men arreested/entrapped on the show, 126 were NOT a registered sex offender. I was stunned when I learned that.
The lesson (that nobody got?). The ones to watch are the ones NOT on the list!
My question is, with so many on the list, and for so many pseudo-crimes, who are the real dangerous ones?
(Answer? NO one knows....and that's exactly what TPTB want it - everyone in constant fear)
they used to say "Love It or Leave It", well I guess you better love it, or else
Nah...they just changed the motto to "Love it or Leave it...we'll tax you regardless".
Paraphrase New Hampshire's motto:
Love it or Die!
The IRS is the Banksters collection agency not the governments. They got that hardwired to go directly into the FED and then out to the Morgue and GS. It never stops off at the social security perscription drug payments office. They should make it legal to sign up to fight wars against people that are taking over the US. Those were the good old days.
Brazil is a non-extradition nation, right?
For Brazilian citizens, not Americans on the lam.
Freedom ain't fr--oh shit. I got lost in 10 years ago.
You fucking dumbfucks brought it on yourselves. EAT YO PEAS.
John Boehner is a boner. I would like the political elite to ask why people are leaving first and then attempt a resolution. There is only so long that you can keep slaves, eventually they will revolt.
This will be a boon for non-extradition countries.
Congress better hurry up. Facebook is headed towards zero sometime next week.
Greatest country in the world:
Come here illegally, get the goodies, come and go as you please.
Be here legally and you will not be allowed to leave.
Don't forget to salute that flag on July 4th; those 50 stars now represent our banking and corporate masters who have bought and paid for nearly every politician and judge in the land to ensure your serfdom and obescience.
The Supine Court has ruled that your property can be confiscated to increase tax revenues in a collusion between government and corporations.
The Supine Court has defined corporations as "individuals" who have "free speech" rights, including funding political campaigns.
And now Congress is working to make certain you cannot escape the hegemony of the Kleptoligarchy.
Fuck yea!
I'm truly amazed at how elected representatives in most countries can continually, year after year, do the exact opposite of what is in the best interests of the country and those they govern, yet the people continue to elect them. You reap what you sow you ignorant bastards.
The hubris of these government control freaks is staggering. They're trying every conceivable method to push us into a direct confrotation so they can impose the police state...which they're beta testing yet again in Chicago. Shitstains, the lot of them.
Chicago beta-test alright...
Corralling some hippies is one thing.
Try doing that shit around the perimeter of the WHOLE CITY. Those TSA (back-ups) pussies wouldn't last a night on the South or West sides.
I would rather they pass this one and set the precedent. Then we can retroactively tax all US congressman, senators, and past presidents 100% of their past and present income. Kick them where it hurts!
"'And all the world knows that no successful system builds a wall to keep its people in and freedom out - and the wall of shame dividing Berlin is a symbol of Communist failure". JFK
I appears that Schumer wants to errect an economic wall. This always happens when socialism fails. Schumer plagiarized this policy from Hitler and Stalin.
This is an odd way to foster long term growth and creativity which we need badly.
I am all for the 3% increase in taxes for the very rich because those were no tax cuts but tax spending. Those cuts were not made by any proportional decrease in spending so they should be brought back.
But this is taking it too too far. This law will tax people unilaterally based on an arbitary conclusion and too for people who are out of the country and denying them the right to visit their homeland.
And seeing the way things have been going if a Wall Street banker suddenly decides to become a citizen of Isles of Mann, the US government might arbitarily decide he was not doing to avoid US taxes. But if you and me do it they might squeeze us of the last penny.
Why wouldn't retroactive taxation be an ex post facto law?
I don't understand how it would be different.
BTW....was there a involuntary cleansing of avitars that happened recently?
People like "Cheesy Chuck" Schumer do not believe in the Constitution. Most people in Congress have never even read it. They pass laws that they know to be unconstitutional, knowing that it will take a long time and a lot of effort before it gets in front of the Supreme Court.
On the issue of ex post facto laws, the Supreme Court ruled that it only applies to criminal law. Since the tax code is civil law (and voluntary!), ex post facto laws may not apply.
Last I heard they put people in jail for not paying their taxes.
I'm telling you we need a minimum height requirement for congress. It's always these fucking little big men that stir up trouble, trying to inflate their poisoned egos above 5' 9".
Shumer, Weiner, Emmanual, Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Napoleon. All hunch backed little fucking Rumplestiltskin sour on life meddling fucking dwarves.
Death to the Lollipop Guild!
Yeah! I really miss all the giggly tits and thong therapy! Maybe the girlfriends and wives discovered ZH.
Next thing is a real estate tax on your burial plot.
No escape, even by death.
Maybe Iran or Cuba will have provocateurs at the Olympics to help the American athletes defect to their free country.
Just another reason to make savings in gold. Buy it as discretely as possible and keep tight lipped. Pretty hard to tax or confiscate something that is truly private.Holding securities of any sort is just becoming more bother than any potential gains warrant.
It is a very sad state though that one has to go through this or similar measures to protect their wealth.
i'm kinda wondering if this is going to apply to illegal aliens living in the U.S. for five or more years going back to s. america?
earleflorida 2452143
i'm kinda wondering if this is going to apply to illegal aliens living in the U.S. for five or more years going back to s. america?
Comment:
Here are some details that may answer your question. Since it is yet to be fully released, changes may occur but here is what is thought. Publicaly, it has already been stated that individuals that are fleeing the US to avoid taxes would be barred from re-entry.
"any ex-pat with either a net worth of over $2 million, or an average income tax liability of at least $148,000 over the last five years, “will be presumed to have renounced their citizenship for tax avoidance purposes.” The ex-pat will have to demonstrate to the IRS that this is not the case if it is not. If there is a “legitimate reason” for that person living outside the U.S. no penalties will apply. But if the IRS finds that someone gave up their passport for tax purposes, they will impose a tax on that individual’s investment gains “no matter where he or she resides.”
Source: http://techcrunch.com/2012/05/17/schumer-and-caseys-ex-patriot-act-detai...
@Maxilopez, this is not funny.
People see the steady erosion of liberty and freedom, the move toward dictatorship like has happened in countless other places in history. I hope you are trolling but it is people who espouse those views, the busybodies, the ones who think because they work for the government regulating others they are smarter than everone else, the insecure and small minded selfish individuals who form the backbone of the snitches. These will be happy to lick the boots of the police state dictators in exchange for some minor favors and social "recognition" that will make them feel more important...
I also like the fact that US Customs has slapped a $5.00 entry fee on Canadians entering the US- 5 bucks like a third world country.
Lets say 1700 people leave a yr for 10 yrs (which is not even close to the 10yr numbers- very high) each paid 1m in taxes a yr X 10 yrs= 1.7b this is nothing. Its like 1% of California's GDP or 10 california municipal landscapers wages.
This is just silly like doing a LBO and checking to see if the target rents or owns their office plants to cut costs.
Such a pretty country that had potential, America has gone full fucking retard.
Tax slaves because of ex patriot act. I got news for ya. Already a tax slave without the law. If anything, this article should be about why government doesn't work and its failed policies and moron politicians that try to buy votes with pointless laws that are tied to the latest headline.
How is this not ex post facto?
Let’s also go after the off-shore corporations. The US will collect orders-of-magnitude more in taxes.
To put this piece in pperspective one must understand that the IRS is as effective collecting taxes as the Mexican governement is fighting the Zetas.
So one must have
a) lots of money to buy an appointment as ambassador
b) a country that wants to appoint multiple persons as ambassadors or employees of the ambassador to the US or..
c) if you can't get Belize to appoint you as ambassador or employee of, then you must find another country to do so - of which I do not think there are enough countries for that purpose - which takes you back to point a (havng enough money to buy yourself an appointment because money talks even if Belize already has an ambassador to the US)
But that would be pointless for the majority of us as it would then be cheaper just to pay the taxes
And finally, the IRS is effective in manipulating the public with fear and as a tool by government to go after individuals out of favor with the government.
I'd really like to unfuck myself from my social security number. Truly.
4000 years ago people had no option but work all their life for food and kept slave with shackled to their ankles. Nothing is changed. Today we have SSN.
Fuck you, Chuck Shumer!
As in most legislation, I'm all for threshholds. The little guy, the small businesses, they get exempted. The looters, the high rollers, the financial players, they get slammed. Small is beautiful when it comes to a sustainable economy. Anything we can do to give advantage to small players is a good thing.
I expect citizenship applications to drop SUBSTANTIALLY.
It's hard not to laugh at this shit...unless, of course, you're an American who wants to get off this merry-go-round. Then it kind of sucks.
its difficult to get citizenship in usa from obama and holder unless you are a somali pirate or egyptian islamist, but very easy to just enter illegally then receive driving license, medical care and education, police cannot stop you or they will be sued by holder and go to jail, etc. And after acorn verifies you have been voting democrat illegally for five years then you can apply for amnesty and your 14 children born in usa are already citizens anyway so you can live with them on a visa at worst. this is what my friends in usa tell me, anyway.
The treaty of Hidalgo Guatalupe precluded "exit taxes" on Mexican elitists cashing out of America. It would be interesting to see some wealthy ex-pat try to ram an equal protection clause or NAFTA treaty claim down the government's throat to evade any "exit taxes".
I'm guessing those telephone book sized trade treaties guarantee all kinds of "rights" to foreign investors like Ed Saverin that captive domestic citizens don't have.
From Wikipedia: " ex post facto laws are expressly forbidden by the United States Constitution". Just sayen.
When has a little rag like the Constitution ever been followed by this administration anyway?
schumer and his nazi ilk are ravenous totalitarian beast cunts
Family Motto: Better dead than a slave.
One step closer??? It sounds more like it's already too late!
Can we one day turn the tables to "clawback" our taxes?
"Reichsfluchtsteuer" anyone? Or are we rather talking about a renewed version of the "Dego-Abgabe"?
I thought I had an exit to the old country but they won't take me now.
at its most basic level, the decision to expatriate is a personal one made by the individual. It is not the leaving or the taxes that threatens the us government it is the act of people making individucal decisions that is so unsettling to them.
off subject, a bit, I find it amusing that the usa marshall service, the people who come to get us tax fugatives abroad, was originally formed to capture runaway slaveswho crossed state lines.
HA, who is worried about being banned from re-entering the US? Just change your name to Jose and come back anytime you want. Especially in sancutary cities. Come back for free healthcare in any ER.
Hell you can even VOTE! they don't even check ID's at the freakin voting booth.
The vast majority of people renouncing citizenship are not American born citizens, most are people that took US citizenship as a convenience in order to live/work here, many are Canadians and Mexicans and other foreigners that got dual citizenship via marriage and kept it as long as it was convenient to do so, but now they made their bundle, or have a pension, got divorced/widowed, and can live cheaper in a place that uses their old language. So they prefer to dump the US citizenship as a tax avoidence scheme and there is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with that. Only a moron does not take advantage of the tax breaks in the law. Those native born that seek to dump citizenship are fools, the day will come when they will wish they had not. But, I say let them, if their loyalty to the USA was traded that cheap then we are better off with them gone.
Please extoll the many benefits of U.S. citizenship here for us all to take into consideration.
1. full of illiterate illegal aliens
2. full of violent criminals
3. run by corrupt politicians, crooked bankers, and Israel
4. most militarily aggressive nation in the world today, one which still registers all young men (our sons) for the draft, should our sons need to go die for those identified in point 3
5. I can go on, but I'll let you reposte sir
Unfortunately we're to the point where we might enjoy ANY rich prick, especially one not satified with his existing loop holes and exeptions, accountants, entities, GETS IT IN THE ASS! Ha Ha!!! Keep talking about cutting old geezer's social security, not honoring actual commitments, promises. See how much we care when we already have a hot poker up our own asses. What do we care about yours? Dear potentially ex-pat Richy Rich....bwaa haa haa haa. Don't look for compassion here. 20 minutes waterboarding for each ex-pat... include all companies also. Wait... get the guillotine! Off with their heads... chop 'em off!!!!
the usa is not the only country claiming the right to tax world wide income. japan does as well. thus the usa and japan tax treaty has both a protocol as well as a technical notes to the protocol. together these run up to about 150 pages. full reaming privileges are reserved even after the treaty, which is titled: CONVENTION BETWEEN THE GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND THE GOVERNMENT OF JAPAN FOR THE AVOIDANCE OF DOUBLE TAXATION AND THE PREVENTION OF FISCAL EVASION WITH RESPECT TO TAXES ON INCOME.
given that both govts are guilty of fiscal evasion on such a grand scale, one would hope that the treaty would provide guidance for loyal, patriotic citizens to learn how to do likewise. sadly, the various treaty, protocols, and technical notes are more akin to that famous document To Serve Man.