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Marc Faber To America: "Listen You Lazy Bugger, You Need To Tighten Your Belts, You Need To Work More For Lower Salaries"
Once again, the latest fire and brimstone sermon by Marc Faber is absolutely spot on, starting and ending with his "policy" recommendation for what the US needs: "I will tell you what the US needs. The US needs a Lee Kwan Yew who stands in front of the US and tells them, listen you lazy bugger, now you have to tighten your belts, you have to save more, work more for lower salaries and only through that will we get out of the current dilemma that essentially prevents the economy from growing." No money printing, no extensive protests, no excuses. Of course, this would have to accompany a global overhaul of the system, something Zero Hedge has been advocating since day one, as it is impossible to reform this broken system from within: "The problem i have with the investment universe is that i find it difficult to envision how the US and western Europe can return to healthy sustainable growth without a complete purge of the financial system and some type of catalyst. Something that restores some measure of social cohesion among people; it could be hyperinflation, a complete credit market collapse, widespread sovereign defaults, civil strife, major military confrontation.” Alas, in that he is also correct, and as we said back in early 2010, when the current episode of extend and pretend ends and the can kicking exercise finally fails, next up is war.
It is refreshing to see that Marc is a reader of Zero Hedge, and specifically the post that we consider one of the most important of the year, namely that from BSC, which laid out in black on white what the next steps will be:
I tell what you to do. I think a flat tax on everybody would be actually a good measure and i think to reduce the regulatory environment in the US. We have expansionary fiscal and monetary policies. But we have restrictive regulatory policies. And it curtails any initiative by the small businessmen., and the large businessmen, he doesn't employ and invest capital in the US, he does he that in China or somewhere else in the world where the regulatory environment is more favorable. If you look at net investments in the US, it's gone down for the last 20 years, and it's now negative. In other words, basically the capital stock of America is not being replenished. It's being replenished somewhere else. And at the same time, the policies of the Keynesians have always encouraged spending. “We're not going to get out of recession by saving. Spend, Spend, Spend.” That is wrong. The lack of savings is the problem of the United States.
Faber on volatility and liquidity:
i think the volatility arises because we have the Nasdaq bubble and then we had the housing bubble and the stock market bubble and then a commodities bubble and usually when the bubble bursts like off the 29 or after the late '60s you have a period of very high volatility for about 10 to 15 years before the markets settle down and then reignite the uptrend. As far the dollar is concerned, the reason i'm actually quite positive is that global liquidity, despite of the fact that the ECB and the European governments will flood the market with liquidity to pay the sales out, that global liquidity is tightening. And whenever global liquidity is tightening, it's bad for asset prices but good for the US dollar as was the case in 2008.
On what the true target of #OccupyWallStreet, whose otherwise noble intentions are unfortunately being abused by higher powers, should be:
Basically we have the Keynesians and the Democrats and I'm not saying that all democrats are equal, but they want interventions and we have far too many interventions in the western world where the share of the total economy that goes to government and is government- sponsored has grown. And that essentially makes it very difficult for the western world to grow substantially. As to that huge level of debts, i don't see how the western world, including the US, japan, and Western Europe can actually grow. They're going to stagnate. And when you have stagnation over a longer period of time, people start to ask questions and then they go after minorities. And Wall Street is a minority – they are a minority and anyone else would have done the same. They use the system. But they didn't create the system. The system was created by the lobbyists and by Washington. So they should actually go to Washington and also occupy the Federal Reserve on the way.
Finally, his conclusion is once again spot on: Wall Street's growth is merely a smokescreen for something far more insiduous and something repeatedly covered by Bill Buckler and other more insightful strategists: namely the infinite growth of central planning and the government apparatus. Wall Street's monstrous increase is merely a smokescreen by government to allow it to operate in its shadows and to pocket the benefits of the most mutated symbiotic relationship in the history of the world.
The problem is, governments in the western world -- and I'm not singling out the US -- they have grown like a cancer. And now they protect themselves to stay in power and they have a variety of alliances, like, for instance Mr. Obama he has no clue, but when he sees the protesters in Wall Street he immediately says yes, yes, yes that’s a good idea so he can target the minority so can buy a few more votes. And of course the well to do people want to protect what they worked for and also what they're paying for because as you know in the US roughly 50% of the people don't pay federal income tax. So actually to say that the rich have not contributed anything is actually wrong.
The conclusion is that any systemic reset should not target just Wall Street: it should focus first and foremost on what is most broken in US society: its "government."
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Hey Marc, get off your old fat ass and get a real job,too!
It's not money in politics that is the total problem. It is the elected is not maintening FUCKING LAW AND ORDER.
There are laws in this country that are getting bought off. And who would exactly monitor the money in politics???? THere ain't one moralist critter in the whole fucking bunch. We are guaranteed screwed.
http://www.truthwinds.com/siterun_data/history/zionism/news.php?q=8c55b8c7a1af41a70e0e2a89d1410fd3
Getting money out of politics? A simple solution? That's about as simple as getting intercourse out of prostitution. Why not state you have no solution.
That won't do it anymore.
You're going to have to figure out how to deal with the better part of 60 million unemployables and their families. You could be talking 40% of the population -- some might even go as high as 50%.
u r 120% right!
Agree with Marc. Americans will need to work harder and earn less, thanks to globalization.
Sure, let the push riksha's....
Limit capitalisme a bit. Let every big company have a maximum of employees, make sure they aren't able to squash every little guy who tries to start a bizz of his own.
You just don't get it. What happens if that large company produces cheaper and better goods than someone smaller? The world doesn't run on an "everybody gets a trophy" mentality. Try to deny this and eventually you get fucked.... gee, like now.
You assume a new "bizz" is worthy of surviving. Just because I make what I think is the world's best fucking toaster strudel doesn't mean everyone else has to subsidize my crappy business.
I know you're going to argue with this, but generally Monopolies cannot exist for long without SOME kind of gov't protection/racketeering and/or illegal activity. THAT's where gov't can be useful; enforcing the law objectively and staying the fuck out of all other business not explicitly given to it.
You might be a nice person, but it's people like you with great ideas on how to regulate everything that eventually kills the horse you're riding on.
Thanks to the Fed, each and every day I work for less than the day before.
Thanks to the Federal Reserve and the Federal gov't and everyone else that is screwing the average person because they are getting their share of the spoils.
Why do Americanos still think they are better and more privileged than anyone else? I don't get it. Since WWII, they have lived beyond their means.
Reminds me of a story. Once upon a time, there were plenty of kids (foreigners) invited to a party after winning the big game (WWII) but the kids got drunk (on guaranteed debt). The night seemed like it would last forever, but little did the kids know that the drinks were getting watered down with cheaper booze over time (cheaper $ollars). As the dance music slowed, the partygoers (creditors) got up and left, leaving the host (U$A) with a true disaster to clean up.
The moral of the story is to never host a party unless you have a plan for cleaning it up afterwards. Unfortunately, in this case, there was no plan and the kids were grounded for life (serfdom). Peace.
No, the problem is the government REGULATING every-fucking-thing. I come from a family of nurses. Nurses used to be trained in a hospitals and that was enough; then you needed a vocational certificate for an LPN or a two year degree for an RN - within the last decade the state is demanding a B.S. in nursing just to run IV's and pass drugs; I am sure the college bubble plays a huge part in this. Anyway, my job of 15 years was much nursing and prepping specimens for lab. I was fortunate I was employed by 'non-for-profit' that happened to be a clinical campus for both the university and community college. I attended as many medical students presentations as possible and also observed/took mental notes as I assisted physicians, Nurse Practitioners and RN's. My problem? It's not a lack of the ability to learn and I know this because at the age of 17, after a year of private classical/jazz/blues piano lessons, I was tested on spot to take a college level music theory class and I answered 100% of the questions AND I answered the ones that my 'peers,' who had been studying since grade school, missed. Plain and Simple: I hate paying to sit in a classroom with sheeple who lack critical thinking skills while listening to some indoctrinated half-wit tell me something I can read in a book myself or already learned 'on the job.' Not only that, 90% of the shit you learn you don't use. Nurses push pills and document, document, document in charts. I need a license and a four year degree for that? Come on. I looked into challenging the regents BUT I still have to pay class fees to be eligible to take the tests for 'credit' and the licensing test fees after that. The only thing I am saving is time. I don't even have the option to just flat out pay and challenge the boards for a license. They're thugs. I did go to college with a major in Chemical Engineering/Bio-chem/Mathematics...my professor gave me a nickname, 'Bob.' My classmates called me 'curve killer' and 'professor's pet.' I dropped out because I got pregnant with my first child and it was 'high risk.' I decided not to go back because I was bored and frustrated that my capacity to learn was at a faster rate than the class was moving. Seriously, I had to take prep-physics because I didnt't take it in high school. They spent three weeks on finding the volume and area of different geometric shapes AND then spent another two weeks on significant digits and sciencific notation. 80% of the class was nursing students. I was doing all my lab work for chemistry in scientic notation AND programmed my calculator to graph first and second rate reaction equations. Come the fuck on! The class covered what I learned in 8th grade science! I am not the type to look for an 'easy A,' I want to learn period. I refuse to pay an inferior to tell me about something they read when I can just read it myself. Why can't I just prove myself at the boards? Skills come from experience and I had those from being 'on the job.' It's much more complicated than "The reasons no one provides jobs in US is simply b/c people have too few skills and yet ask for too high a salary. In other words: Darwinism at work."
It hasn't anything to do with Darwinism of any kind. I bet you haven't even read Origin of Species OR Beak of the Finch. TWAT.
Many skilled people can't find jobs because they've been outsourced overseas OR the smart ones who have taught themselves haven't/can't afford to pay the dues to the club. I don't mind proving myself or paying for taking the boards and licensing as I understand there are costs for administering test and licensing agency, but having to go to college to do it seems to me to be illogical and a complete waste of my time and money... unless it's to have access to let's say....experience in a certain type of lab that has an electron microscope or some other cool toy.
Bottomline from my perspective: With the increased taxes on my slightly-more-than-before income that goes to private bankers who fund the US terrorist acts in sovereign nations that I'd have to pay in addition to being a slave to my student debt, I'd end up right where I was before with more accountability to answer to the state about my professional activities and more responsibility with the same amount of pay. Why bother? There's no benefit for me or my country since it'll all go to the central bankers.
I learned more useful information from zero hedge; youtubers like sgt.bull, peter schiff, celente and the silver futurist;blogs like TF metals the SLA ;and The Keiser Report in the last year than the micro economic class I took in college 10 years ago...and I PAID for the class! What a fucking waste of time and money! US schools don't 'teach' anymore; they indoctrinate.
Are you high right now. Does your computer smell like doritos?
Nope; But, I was this morning when I was talking my 11 mile walk while listening to Hugh Laurie's new album.
I was thinking about the 'truth' as I see it. Perhaps, I can share it with you someday. I have a friend who is a professor of philosphy at the university in my hometown. I want to share my ideas with him before I start writing them and publishing them.
No, I don't like the smell of doritos- or even the taste for that matter- and I was helping my children do their homework while I was wrting.
Most people who 'get high' aren't fucking idiots. Case In point: http://marijuana-uses.com/mr-x/
I miss you, Dr. Sagan.
Of course, without a shitload of pointless regulations, nine-tenths of our 'legal eagles' would have to actually produce something for a living.
No wonder you dislike her post.
LOL; I know! My friend spent a score of thousands of dollars and has waited 5 years for resolution to the financial part of his divorce and he has gotten nowhere. He can't even get the order enforced. He had the two best lawyers in town! Seriously? $300/hr to read a fucking letter? and then charge for 10 minutes to read a letter that takes two minutes? and charge 20 minutes for a minute of dictating into a recorder a response that is typed up by some paralegal or secretary getting $15/hr at best? Ha.
###
Nice post.
Umm...careful Blano - there's barbed wire on them posts.
Great observation about how regulations can muck up a profession's accessibility. Unfortunately, it's not only the jerks in government doing the regulating of professions. I was lucky enough to leave the USAF in 1973 and convince one of the major computer companies that I knew how to program. All I'd done is read a book or two about COBOL programming, but by the time they figured out I was less than truthful it was too late, because I got really good at programming. 38 years later I finally was retired. There is no way I could pull off a similar stunt nowadays, what with all the certifications from Microsoft, Cisco, Oracle, etc. Like Ganja Jane, I got in at a time where ability counted more than a certificate, and got out when, almost literally, they turned the lights off where I last worked.
I've been blessed. My salary as a programmer increased over 10-fold from start to finish. So did the cost of a Dodge. Or a Ferrari, for that matter, unless, of course, one measures in ounces of silver.
As a parting shot at everyone young and employed, keep working! Work harder! I need you to fund my Social Security checks once I start collecting!
I can't remember if I intended to be sarcastic with that last bit or not.
You remind me of the Jordan, the Girl from Real Genius who doesn't sleep and is working on all sorts of crazy ideas.
Ya, and if our very own Jack Meoff got in front of the Chinese politiburo and told them to quit making all the shitty crap that falls apart for .99 and/or is lead contaminated we might have reality too.
Look, everybody likes to point the finger to tell somebody else what needs to get done so everything's honky dory.
I got a better question.....
"Why don't you do the low-paying shitty conditions work asshole if it's so much fun?"
The reason nobody is providing jobs in the US is precisely because the system is broken. It's more profitable in terms of both COGS and tax to manufacture outside the US. IMHO there are two alternatives to address this. Firstly, protectionism. Second, a major overhaul of the system. The first is easier in terms of "Can kicking" and appears to be the one favored by Congress.
"The reasons no one provides jobs in US is simply b/c people have too few skills and yet ask for too high a salary."
dlmaniac, take Darwin and work it.
Pppppfffffbbbbbbbbttttt!!!!!!!!!!
He was asking about the name of Marc's chick in Quebec's French Language (Quebecois)
Ma Blonde = My girlfriend, ...that I sleep with.
The hair color has nothing to do with it, as it is used for any hair color girl.
Ma blonde, meaning my girlfriend, wife, mistress...
I've always preferred 'paramour.'
;-)
He used the term blonde.
no, blonde. Its blonde in french. Means girlfriend or blond girl.
blon-de, as in:
Auprès de ma blonde
Qu'il fait bon, fait bon, fait bon
Auprès de ma blonde,
Qu'il fait bon dormir.
I just spent a few days with a Singaporean friend. He insisted that all stories of "big brother" in singapore were urban legends. Social engineering works.
Which is WHY the majority of Americans are fat and dumbed down. Bad diet, literal, figurative and meta-phoric.
If Lee Kuan WHO? came to America today, he too would Plug in, use Thumb, Pig out!
ORI
The Perversion of Language
The best censor is self censorship.
ZH please institute an IQ cut-off so that we may rid ourselves of this moron from Poonjab already.
There is a big difference between Lee and our leaders, he actually cared about his country. He was essentially a dictator, but he didn't plunder the country like Suharto, Sukarno, Marcos, ect.. and he planned for the future.
The closest thing to the mythical benevolent dictator the modern world has seen.
The problem with benevolent dictators is... they usually i) don't exist, and ii) assume their eldest son will be just as benevolent to 'his' people.
Singapore Inc is doing splendidly.
Singaporeans have had to deal with stagnant real wages, 40% increase in population in 10 years, and inflated public housing costs.
Furthermore, the pension fund equivalent is pushing out withdrawal dates further and further, not to mention the virtual zero and effectively negative rates for savings.
The wealth gap has only increased and taxation is transitioning to a progressively fee based model - ie regressive, while headline rates on higher incomes are pared back.
The country is a damn well run company, its employees arent doing anywhere near as well, mgmt though is doing swimmingly.
inflated public housing costs.
Inflated housing costs? HDB (housing board) sells flats well below market value on the condition they don't rent it out and stay in the home at least 5yrs. The locals are allowed to use their CPF (retirement fund) to purchase the flats. The new ones are very nice and many of the older ones have been upgraded. You are right about wages being stagnant, but they get pretty good benefits including 14 days of sick leave which they use like vacation time (only a doctors excuse is needed and they have social healthcare so its cheap to visit the doctor). As far as the CPF, its better that they at least get what they put into rather than the 401k in the U.S. that is invested in the stockmarket which has lost value plus the defvaluation of the dollar. The country relies on foreign investment which explains why they try to keep wages down also they have to compete with the surrounding countries low labor. Not saying I agree with everything they do but at least I can see the reasons behind it, and IMO they have a very well run government as long as you don't oppose it.
Oh Regional Indian,
No up or down here, but your comment does go to the heart of the matter. If most ZHers think most Americans are fat and dumbed down, then fine. But on the road to libertarian paradise, what becomes of them? F*ck them? Fine, too. But I think most of you don't really think of all the consequences of a society that conforms to your desires. Maybe because it's so unlikely is the reason ZHers can blow off steam and not think too hard about the consequences. And, as I have said before, who wants to be Midas Mulligan? Society would be easier without the good for nothings, but admit it most of you would not be as wealthy because such society would be simpler.
Americans are going on a strict diet and over the long run it will be the best thing for their health and wealth.
For the short term though, it's gonna' be hell. Withdrawals from the multitude of addictions ain't going to be a pretty sight. And Americans, of all people, with their massive dependencies to almost any mind candy that keeps them pleasantly sedate in denial, always seem to have just enough credit to pay for that next Fix.
It's going to be the biggest weight lost clinic ever put on in the history of the world and nobody will be immune from its infectious residue.
Marc needs to shut his fat Swiss face!
Perhaps he should lead by example and charge less US$ for his overrated newsletters in which he's predicting the end of the Dollar!
Oh, but then he would have to tighten HIS belt and order less cheap Thai hookers and ladyboys!
The market decides these things. You can attempt to hunt down Faber's subscribers and make your own pitch to them if you really want to make his income conform to your wishes.
I think what caber is saying co es down to this--if you go to hire an American to write code for you for a website (skilled labor) it will cost you 75 an hour for somebody decent. If you go to odesk and hire an Indian or a phillipino, it will cost you $10 an hour. And the Indian guy, who lives in a fucking shack somewhere and can barely afford shoes, will likely be better and more motivated than the American. It's like your mom used to say--you think you've got it tough? Try living india. There are only couple of ways around that problem---debase currency, continue exploiting somehow, or lower quality of life here in e states. Sucks? Yup. But we've been exporting that suckage for a long long time. It's just coming back around a bit now
What do we need?
Other posts or sidebars on this current page have the answer.
Jobs. As in Steve Jobs.
It's a once in lifetime opportunity to live during these times and share space with one of the truly great iconic, business people in America Someone who created world class products that everyone in the world felt compelled to buy.
We need a country filled with Steve Jobs wannabes.
Visionaries who thrive on sweating in a garage, focused on 'making it' on their own, not hampered with meager funding. Cocky enough to take "a leap of faith", trusting that they were building the coolest shit that the world has ever seen.
Don't let the death of Steve Jobs get lost in the noise of these bad times.
His spirit is the guiding light for how to fix what ails this country.
Never give up, Never surrender. Trust your instincts.
are you what they call, an apple fanboy?
No. I would rather watch a bunch of dorks, using apple products, bought by their parents, bitch about how unfair the world is.
Grow a pair.
The average American Joe needs to stop putting extra notches on his belt before he can start tightening it.
Durden,
Who killed Nic Lenoir?
Leo too. nvmd
Dollar will be a good trade on the long side... until it isn't
End The Fed Bitchez!
dollar going down and market going up...so sell all you want the dollar your gonna get in the a...!!
Being way early in a trade is usually indistinguishable from being dead wrong. Your timing is a problem--dollar up market down while Europe pukes out all the poison. Starts tomorrow thanks to steaming alcoa turd. Cheers
Right on.
THE ROOT OF OUR SOCIAL, ECONOMIC, MILITARISTIC WOW'S IS AN EVIL MONETARY SYSTEM. EVERYTHING ELSE IS A SYMPTOM OR AN ACTION THAT SUPPORTS IT. AT THE HEART OF THIS SYSTEM ARE THE CENTRAL BANKS (THE FED), THEIR DISHONEST MONETARY POLICIES AND THOSE WHO CONTROL IT. AS SUCH, POLICIES, LAWS AND THE CAPTURE OF REGULATORS ARE FOR THEIR BENEFIT. AN ACCOUNT OF THE PEOPLE HAS NO PLACE IN IT. INDEED, IF THE PEOPLE WERE ITS PRIMARY CONCERN, THE WORLD WOULD BE MORE FREE, LESS VIOLENT AND MORE PROSPEROUS; PROVIDING INDISPUTABLE PROOF OF MAN'S EVOLUTION, BEYOND THAT OF TECHNICAL INNOVATION AND EMPTY SOPHISTICATION .
"The game is rigged man. We like them little bitches on a chess board." - The Wire
These are not failures of capitalism but a failure of the people to defend our rights against those who want control us. This not a question of party loyalty or left or right. It is a question of right and wrong. It is fundamental principle of freedom, justice and humanity, a tenet of truth, law and legal right which has been tampered with, and down-trod!
OccupyWallStreet is missing a crucial part in the fight to restore our constitutional democracy. In their first public statement there is no mention of Ending the Fed. see below
The Kids Art Alright. But Don't Get Fooled Again
OccupyWallStreet's Young People are the tip of the spear in America's awakening. They are demonstrating what is our birth right. We The People must take up our Patriotic Duty and demand the restoration of The Rule of Law, Our Constitutional Democracy, Free Market Capitalism and FIRST a Sovereign, Honest Monetary System. It is the only path to true and lasting change!... Wall Streets crimes and Washington's complicity make them legitimate targets... They are however, the minions for a larger more evil construct. That is a monetary system that demands constant growth of debt and war. And that criminal enterprise is controlled by the central banks THE FED and those behind them.
[Please see our critique of OccupyWallStreet's First Public Statement in the link below.]
OccupyWallStreet: The Kids Are Alright! - Click to view link
Rape of The Republic
Our nation was founded on the principle that government's one legitimate function is the protection of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness (private property). This principle is in peril. For those charged with protecting us have been captured by an evil monetary construct that drives their greed and lust for power.
RAPE OF THE REPUBLIC Click to view link
Here's something else you might find interesting.
Graphic: Financial World Dominated By A Few Deep Pockets
END THE FED
Visit: Inflection Point
Saw this earlier, what can you say really, Faber get's it. The only new thing he had to say was that Obama would tap into Occupy Wall St which is another prediction he got right if you look at Bloombergs front page...
.
Faber is by far one of the best analyst.
indeed at the end of 2010 he said that treasuries would rally hard- check. Said the dollar would rally- check. Called for a 15% correction in equities- check. Said Asia would slow down emphasizing China- check. Said that gold would decline and that he would buy on the dip- check. Predicted QE2 and said the FED would wait before launching QE3- check. Of course his best call of all nailing the rock bottom of equities back in March 2009, those that went long had the opportunity to double their money.
Yeah, I would say betting against his advice is not a wise decision.
BB you gotta admit he didn't look like himself though...
He didn't have enough time to explain himself, especially towards the end. I have heard plenty of other interviews where he has said, "I have a very low opinion of bankers. Wallstreet gets money free of charge, I think that working class and small business people should instead get preferential treatment."
It is true that Faber has 'tightrope walked' between the inflation/deflation camps pretty well...He has called many awesome mkt. turns over the last few years...He appears to be telegraphing deflation in the short-medium timeframe....I never thought we would see it but the USD might get a bid higher after all...Question is...Does Gold stay on the mountain with the dollar or is it more negative correlation time with the USD vs. Gold
Yeah--I think caber has nailed it again. Logical progression--dollar up while Europe really eats it. Pms equities down. More printing once things really go to shit (s&p 910-980) slow stabilization, dollar falls, market up, inflation...hyperinflaiton
I always thought Bernanke would make people beg for QEIII...That's what I'm looking at too...Equities might get hammered for a while...This would make sense with the S&P's 10% gain the last two weeks...Just pushing it up a bit before the gap down for a month or two...Gold is (as usual) tough to call...Silver in the low to mid 20's? Hard to imagine but it is possible...Man! Monster boxes for 10 G's again...well if it happens... so be it!!!!
Marc has all the typical characteristics of a charlatan!
Never commiting, always leaving the door open for a quick retreat, long USD one day, short USD the other, occasionally making some bold statements so that he'll get the media attention in order to continue to join the parade of talking faces on CNBC.
Oh yeah, on top of that he always wears a stupid pink tie and has a ponytail on the back of his balding scalp.
@Bokkenrijder
Exactly, it was only 24 months ago MF was saying it was a 'high probability prediction' that there would be a toal economic collapse, Now he's talking around that prediction with a dollar rally and some possible tough times ahead etc.
No one can call the collapse with any certainty. I've watched scores of Faber videos and have found him to be incredibly consistent. He hates fiat and respects intiative and work. Saying Americans will have to work harder for less is a description of reality, not his wish.
At least when he speaks, its truth, or has some reasoning to it.
I've been saying for decades that 99% of the populace are overpaid for their efforts, feeble as they are.
HUGE bubble in salaries for a very long time.
And where are the largest salaries again?
EXACTLY. Sure hope faber & all the other brain-surgeons figure out a way to make top 1% take a FUCKIN' PAY CUT. Cuts to be made from bottom to top based on PRODUCTION & VALUE-ADDED to civilization on a PROPRTIONAL per-dollar-of-pay. On that scale, McD flipper takes a 5% cut, Jamie & LLLLoyd 80%, most .gov's 50%. All these fuckin' wizards & their brilliant "solutions" aimed at the "Americans". Nice try, come back with something meaningful next time.
Go back to an 81% or 91% tax rate for all income over $1M pa, and put an annual 2.5% wealth tax on every dollar of assets held over $5M.
More taxes will not fix anything.
But apparently lower wages will??????
Yeah thats been the line for the last 30 years, look how well most Americans have done from it.
I wasn't supporting the statement that wages need to be lower, merely that handing our corrupt government more money, REGARDLESS OF ITS SOURCE, is an inherently flawed idea.
Yeah, OK, I can't fault your logic there.
It has always been a spending problem, not a revenue problem.
You could allow them to take 90% from everyone and they would whine its not enough.
There is already a wealth tax. Unfortunately, not progressive.
Inflation taxes every dollar you do or don't have.
you'll have to hold both your hands out, instead of your usual one
Brilliant plan - if you want to turn the U.S. into Bangladesh. Here's a question for you, what would the rich do if your plan was enacted? Would they (A) sit and take it, pasively giving away all their wealth to the government for the privilege of living in your collectivist utopia or (B) move all of their wealth outside the U.S. as fast as they could? Countries all over the world would line up to welcome the wealth of the people your plan would drive away.
Correct, and it is the same flawed attitude that some of the OWS protesters have. Instead of recognizing that it is the system and its controllers (Fed and Federal Gov't) that are the core problem, they go after the opportunists who take advantage of that system. You can hate them and they may be convenient targets, but they didn't create this system. Which makes their proposed solution of higher taxation, which is merely handing countless billions more over to the same corrupt government, even more appallingly myopic.
Don't hate the player, hate the game.
This.
"They didn't create the system" Excuse me!! Are you telling me a corrupt government came before the $$$ did?? It was probably a "mutual admiration society". Amoral behavior comes from the minds involved, not the circumstances. Sorry that absolution won't fly. MIlestones
I see. You like being held hostage by these banksters and financiers do you?
"Unless you drop your wages to India and China levels we will move all your jobs overseas".
"Unless you drop your taxes to Cayman Island and Belize levels we will move all our wealth overseas".
You want to support a global race to the bottom?
Here's something to understand: all the wealth which has already gone is gone. That's why 46M Americans are on food stamps.
Who in your statement actually benefits from higher taxation, though? The unemployed won't get jobs from it, small business owners, entrepreneurs, and the upper middle class will just continue their exodus. The government can put every single person to work digging ditches but none of their "jobs" programs will actually create capital. Do you just want every remaining part of what made the U.S. great to die with no hope for a recovery?
The majority of their wealth is ownership of domestic assets they can't take with them (assuming for a moment a return to a more progressive system of taxation would be accompanied by a return to more capital controls as well). The real danger is brain drain, not wealth drain.
Well, what I wrote would still crash the stock market, bond market, and commercial real estate market. If you think we could sail along without those ...
The kind of brains that are good at figuring out how to game the system to get a lot of reward without producing something of value to the average person - better off without.
Yes, and then those countries would almost all take their money away. Europe generally has very high income tax rates on high income and many countries have wealth tax as well. Where else are they going to go - China? Sure you can trust your friendly Communist Party leader to not demand some 'loans'. South America ? How long till your paying off a ransom. True there are small countries/islands that look safe now but governments change real quick in most of them and by leaving they are probably losing their access to continued wealth generation which costs them more than the tax would. A doctor making 1 million US is going to be lucky to make 100K anywhere else after a big struggle to get licensed at all. They are not going to leave. Hedge fund managers/traders leave? Excellent! They are not helping the country and they create huge risks that the average person suffers from later. Who's going to invest with them when they have to rely on a government that makes less money than the financier to enforce the law?
According to the IRS the infamous 1%...starts at around 380k...just sayin.
Yes. In reality I think we all know that its the top half of the top 1% which is where the real money is.
So really the placards at OWS should read "We Are The 99.5%? ;-)
Lol @ anyone who thinks the government actually collected 91% of someone's paycheck back in the day...
Check out the IRS income tax rates for around 1956-1962.
Check out the IRS corporate tax today. Let me know if they actually collect that, mmmkay?
Exactly.
Its a pass through that equates to higher prices for the consumer. Every penny of a higher corporate tax adds that penny to the price of a good or service that the end user (consumer) will pay.
Dasa Sloofoot,
you don't get it. with all the deductions back in the 50s, no one paid these rates.
@Clinteastwood: Agreed, that's what im saying. The other poster is the one that thinks the JP Morgans of the world paid 90% of their paycheck to the govn't. It's romanticizing over a time that never existed.
Well Clint, I bet the top 1% of households still paid a greater percentage of their income in taxes. Corporations sure did. But please post link to show that the 1% have a higher federal tax burden than back then. It would be enlightening.
i've got a better idea. you post a link proving your assertion that corporations and the top 1% paid more of the tax burden back then.
and while you're at it tell us how much we in the middle class need to worry about hanging onto our wallets the moment we give the government the right to "tax the rich."
In the article I read my preferred solution:
FLAT TAX
Max return
Min hassle
Ask the East Europeans
All taxation is theft. If you want to see an improvement in the economy let regular folks compete to provide the services which we now overpay government to perform.
End taxation and there'd be much more money available for investment in useful goods and services as no one would willing pay for an army that occupies the world with a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the planet a dozen times over. All the money that sustains the empire would be funneled into productive rather than destructive purposes.
A lot of the Eastern Europeans got mortgages in Swiss Francs and then let their own currency depreciate a couple hundred percent - not astute financial planners.
if inflation was not being used as a tool to rob wealth, rising salaries would not be an issue... in relative terms, most salaries/wages have been declining in the US.
Correct. Since the 70s the avg person's purchasing power has been diminishing. Now it takes 2 incomes to go broke anyway. No more defined benefits pensions, etc.
"now you have to tighten your belts, you have to save more, work more for lower salaries and only through that will we get out of the current dilemma that essentially prevents the economy from growing."
How can the avg person 'save' more if they are asked to work more for *less* money? And who can work more with a U-6 unemp.rate of 22+%? What about bad debt writeoffs? This is the 800 lb gorilla in the room. Let's have the shareholders of f---d up FIRE companies face the music and tighten their belts (around their necks). We could "austerity" ourselves to death, literally, with 100% taxes on the avg schmucks and it still wouldn't handle the debt situation.
So, when do we get to the open calls of killing off old folks (who'd use Medicare/SSI) and the poor (who use food stamps, low taxes)? Gotta get my bug-out bag packed pretty soon.
Used to be good job came with almost free health care. Now the cost of that eats up most people's potential to save and the annual increase in that cost is more than most people's incomes increase (not that they increase at all for most of the country). It's also pretty hard to get excited about saving when interest rates are zero and stock market returns are also zero. Unless you were smart/lucky enough to save in gold which almost no one did.
I c 7 negs by folks that are surely overpaid.
Most of you are at the productivity level of what used to be a pushcart vendor selling apples in the street, and getting paid like you were a brain surgeon.
Brain surgeons make about $350,000. Which of the awe-inspiring tools in your mental arsenal did you use to determine this is what most Americans or ZH make? The reflexive smartass remark with no supporting facts one? Happen to inherit money? Productivity has gone up 3%/year almost every year. The resulting increase in wealth went to banker ruling class not average American who makes less in real terms now than decades ago.
Salaries are not too high. They are too low, and are held down by the cost of regulatory compliance, and bureaucratic idiocy destroying the capital that should allow any given worker to be somewhere between two and twenty times as productive as they are now. Low wages are for unskilled workers who have no capital with which to leverage their efforts. A man with a shovel digs five times as quickly as a man with only his hands. A man with a backhoe digs thousands of times faster. Similar with production. A man might be able to build a car by himself from parts in a few months, yet an assembly line produces a car with only a few man-hours of labor.
The bubble is in regulation, which has driven the capital abroad.
China might not have as many regulations but they do have a couple big ones. Like if the local Communist Party official decides to impose special fees on you or needs a 'loan' or decides to just confiscate your whole factory - there isn't much you can do about even. Even legally, the government owns all the land. Not that legality matters. Another hidden cost is that if your business is based on technology, it's pretty much a sure thing that all that technology is going out the door to a fully owned Chinese company as soon as you invent it and that in ten years a new competitor will be trying to steal most of your customers and probably suceeding. But this doesn't matter to US ruling class. Export jobs to China = short term pop in profits/stock price, exercise options, retire, company goes broke 10 years later.
Don't forget the Fed's devaluation of the greenback....that is why $20/hr doesn't feel like enough!
ron paul/marc faber 2012
+ 1/2
- 1/2
Ain't never gonna happen. The Axis of the Righteous will wage WWIII before they admit default.
Damn straight. Hedge accordingly.
How about those paper pushing fucknuts, who add NO REAL VALUE to the economy, work harder for less? What a fucking douchebag. Let the whole thing crash, at least then we can find out right quick just who's labor is really worth a shit. Got Physical and like-minded neighbors? You better.
could not agree more on the 'who's labor is really worth a shit" we will find out
don't we already know whose labor is worth a shit? Survey the OWS protestors and find out what their skills are. Not education, skills.
They should be working a lot harder for free making small rocks out of big rocks.
V for Vendetta?
A broken government? In MY U.S.???
I think he needs to spend a few years on the assembly line, then maybe he'll figure it out.
Belogical,
I hope you'll expand on your thoughts...very keen to hear more.
Apparently, individuals who have made a nice market niche for themselves and can find scads of people who willingly pay them for expertise should give all that up and look for a minimum wage job.
That way there can be one more unemployed line worker and the people who happily paid for Faber's services in financial matters can just go screw themselves. Who in the hell do they think they are trying to protect their wealth anyway?
God bless Marc Faber, seriously.
Sell your house and buy silver before everyone else does.
Faber is absitively right about the impotence of a democratic republic: What we need is a benevolent dictator.
And of course that can't happen. So, now what?
A gradual and sometimes dizzying descent into the ninth ring of hell.
I never actually gave up on the system, because I never actually believed it would work.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy:_The_God_That_Failed
I recently read sombody's idea which thru my filters came out as:
"What we need is a King who, if he does not treat us well, we will kill."
Simplistic, but appealing.
-The Late, Great George Carlin
The anthropological investigation of this system in reality and myth is the theme of Sir James Frazer's "The Golden Bough."
Throw in a debt jubilee and you can sign me up.
A debt jubilee would make the possible acquisition of future credit problematic. In other words there can't be a sweeping debt jubilee if individuals and businesses alike want to keep financing day to day expenses on a credit card. Reigning in such behavior would be a good thing but the baby would go out with the bath water and loans for legitimate purposes would be hard to come by as well.
Debt is bad. People should be discouraged from going into debt with high rates.
So a jubilee sounds about right to me.
Growth should be funded with profits. Funding growth with debt puts our society's capital and our future in the hands of the unproven and the unworthy. Little wonder the financial world is collapsing.
I don't need no stinkin' jubilee, I've been debt free for over a decade. No big screen TV, no cable, used car, etc.
Now suppose there were to be a jubilee. Who would command that it happen? Who would be liable? What would happen to people who need to borrow for legitamate business, educational or medical reasons? Could qualified borrowers in need of funds get loans from creditors if, for example, a government edict instituting a jubilee were hanging over their heads?
The only way a jubilee is compatible with voluntary choices and a free market is if the creditor grants it.
the problem is not efficiency...
Convergence, Space Travel, & a Living God
So, everything you need for charge is embedded in the dc system, and you have learned that you must go backward (consumer retardation) before travelling forward, to load the spring. You are not going to be exploiting oil, planet to planet. You don’t know what you are going to find out there, but physics is physics. Learn to adapt accordingly.
Always challenge root assumptions, from the horizon edge back, with algebraic reduction, improving your understanding of physics as you go. What is your speed relative to a particular event horizon? What is your speed relative to the universe? Don’t fight gravity; employ it, by swimming in and out the black hole, doping it as you go, to get the required propulsion off the horizon.
You NEVER have a resource problem. You have already proven that the scarcity economy, largely prevailing in the eyes of the masses over thousands of years, with its closed system, win-lose mentality controlling corporate “thinking” is false. The problem is psychology, which is a system, not an individual, phenomenon. Individuals fall into the distribution (thrown in).
The majority, gravity, act on historical voices in their heads, reinforcing past behaviors in present applications. Separate those voices to reveal their bipolar nature, which replaces productivity with make-work reduction, ultimately resulting in fear of the unknown, anxiety, which feeds consumption in a positive feedback loop. The voice required to quiet the social mind, so it can think, springs from the eye, dramatically increasing productivity, in equilibrium.
The problem/solution is providing children (adult behavior is derivative) with the space / freedom / opportunity to pursue democracy within reason, at equilibrium. Those presenting a false façade will not get their way until they give up control, to reveal their true selves. Currency inventory is a measure of anxiety, lack of adaptive skill. What is the relationship between domestic and foreign-held money supply, aggregate monies, and inventory levers?
Boys are suspended from school for not being as passive as girls, the process is magnified by socio-economic circumstance, and the outcome is drop-outs, unplanned pregnancies, and prison – government demand. Systematically aggregating passive aggressive individual behavior results in State physical aggression, and breaking up homes to build government subsidized McMansions bankrupts the economy. Surprise, surprise.
In a real marriage, participants learn to cede control/ adapt to God / the unknown, to remove anxiety (algebraic reduction of the positive feedback meter effect – the dc boys always miss that one), and selectively become part of the wave.
In a civil marriage contract, the parties compete within for control, under rigid terms and conditions, to acquire property, and each will feel out of control when not in control themselves, until one enslaves the other and both are locked in prisoners’ dilemma without a key, to be consumed by gravity from the queue. Corporate “thinks” it is exploiting the latter by transferring wealth from their future generations to the present, enslaving all the participating entities to History. No trust, no flexibility, no ability to adapt and re-sync gears.
Current runs in opposition to currency. The snapshot nature of the wave depends upon participation. Do not trade your children’s independence for the false promise of security notes. Expand your mind beyond the double-minded behavior surrounding it. Adjust your rents and pay to hide individual productivity (e) and expose central planning (p) to grow your middle class (-,N,+).
Control is an illusion of perception propagated by the willfully ignorant. The intelligent investor is always free to effectively transform the economy (it’s a question of price discovery). The ignorant consumer sees the product as something-for-nothing, and the bullies fight for chairs on the Titanic, attempting to control it. In the consumption half-cycle, the cure is the disease. There is no plan; there is 7 billion people making decisions, on a planet of relatively enumerable organisms, which is but a tiny dot in the universe.
You could do nothing but study God, the unknown, and barely scratch the surface of time. Don’t worry about the unintended consequences of leveraging the speed of light. Life is much more complicated and there is much more out there than you can possibly imagine. You are limited only by your assumptions. Never allow the false assumptions of others to stand between you and God.
Money as free speech; what moron thought that one up? Count on the herd to sell you out. Pray though your works and let the talkers talk. Gravity is nothing but a false assumption surrounded by rigid behavior.
I know you tried to use allot of big words to seem like you know what you are talking about, and I really do hate to completely blow your cover... BUT...
Democracy by definition is a form of government. What you were trying to talk about is called an economic system which is two completely different discussions.
Only because that's how our universities divide it up today. One hundred years ago the subject of political-economics was still broadly in discussion.
The reason being that they drive each another hand in hand, and should actually be considered the subject of political-socio-economics.
Seriously, on a blog if you can't make your point(s) in 100 words or less, don't bother. I tried to read your post but after the 2nd paragraph I just couldn't keep going because whatever point you had was lost in piles of "blah, blah, blah"
What did you take, shrooms or acid?
"Not surprisingly, the money questions are topmost on county officials’ minds. Without the constitutional amendment Brown proposed, they worry that the money the state has dedicated to this year’s realignment will not keep pace with their responsibilities. “We’ve watched the state play Lucy-with-the-football way too many times,” says Valerie Brown, a Democratic county supervisor in Sonoma County. “They tell us there’ll be money coming to support us doing things differently, then the next thing the money’s not there, the caseload has increased, and we’re in a world of hurt again.”
social services or government unions? oh, they are stealing from each other and themselves.
YAY! Saw Mr. Faber on swiss TV the other day - absolutely great guy.
American have been trained to want instant gratification. The reptiliian part of their brains has beeen overwhelmed by this stimulus. So they must consume now in the face of ostensible want-scarcity.
Look @ the way they edit mass media, and commercials. quick cuts. loud. shock & awe. logical fallacies
It's a cultural mood that will be hard to change.
Very good observation... Unfortunately, less than 5% realize how much of a problem this really is..
Uhh, I thought we evolved from monkeys? Now we're reptiles too? I'm still trying to relate to a cave man with mixed results...You might be thinking too hard DormRoom... Let's simplify, people are in general slothlike and selfish. Hedge accordingly.
People are still watching commercials? Isn't that what TIVO/ DVRs are for?
I remember when cable TV was sold to folks by telling them there would be no commercials......
How many people know that all of the digital channels are free, you can grab them out of the sky, with a Radio Shack attenna? People pay big bucks every month for television they can get for free.
Rabbit ears rock. I can't believe that I used to spend $62/mo. to watch TV.
The reptilian part of my brain wants a juicy cricket and a warm spot in the sun.
" now you have to tighten your belts, you have to save more, work more for lower salaries and only through that will we get out of the current dilemma that essentially prevents the economy from growing."
Fuck you Faber. You think the barely living wages of most Americans is what the current dilemma is? Huh. I thought the current dilemma was about criminals stealing shit. Why don't we start by arresting and trying the criminals and see where we are before we go after Joe Six Pack's salary.
Yeah, it is fucked up. The gov't borrows money for 30 years to inflate the economy so the rich can get richer and when it is time to pay the bill, heck, there just aint enough rich people to pay it so the common man working for a living is told he is too affluant. What a world.