This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
Ray Dalio On Whether The Current "Hopeless, Mob-Rule Deleveraging " Can Lead To The Ascent Of Another "Hitler"
Yesterday we presented the complete must watch Ray Dalio interview and transcript from his Charlie Rose appearance in which he explained how, in his increasingly skeptical view, we are now "out of ammunition" as there are "no more tools in the toolkit." Today, he layers on top of this rather bleak macroeconomic perspective some very disturbing observations, specifically, what the realization of the dead end situation facing monetary and discal authorities means when confronted with a violent (metaphorically) deleveraging, and a violent (quite literal) social mood. In an FT op-ed he writes; "We are in the midst of a deleveraging, we are nearly out of ammunition and we are at each other’s throats. Being in a deleveraging and nearly out of ammunition is a very difficult position to be in. But, being at each other’s throats is our biggest problem." Needless to say this won't be the first time we have found ourselves in such a predicament: one very vivid example from history beckons: "Frustrations increase, the established ways of doing things come under attack and frustrations over the ineffectiveness of government creates the perceived need for someone to gain control of the mess. Plato spoke of this dynamic. It was the reason Hitler was elected in 1933."
Does Dalio predict the advent of another "Hitler" - hardly... But the risks are there, especially since none of the banks have learned any lessons from the past, and no preventative measures have been taken to avoid a repeat of 2008, only this time the entire population is already on edge: "Mobs are at the doors of bankers and others in the financial system, screaming to politicians to put these people in jail while the vote-seeking politicians are fanning the flames rather than reminding people that the legal system is the way these people should be judged. Since banks are levered about 15 to 1, it doesn’t take much of a debt problem to cause them solvency problems, and since in deleveragings debt problems are big, there is significant risk banks will run out of equity again and the fury against them will intensify. For these reasons risks to the global banking system are much greater than normal."
This lucid explanation of reality from the biggest hedge fund manager in the world explains precisely why the status-quo coopted media continues to retrench itself in lies and propaganda: in attempting to avoid panic and the realization that the entire system is now hollow, the lies will literally continue until morale improves. Only this time it won't, because the people (at least those that wish to be), can and will be far more educated than ever before in history. And the fear that reality (and associated discontent) will spread like wildfire, is why the status quo continues to retrench day after day, terrified of what happens if it loses control over that last bastion of "stability" - the stock market, which explains the relentless drive against logic and reason, ever higher, to mask the complete collapse of reality's facade just behind the surface.
Unfortunately this inability to deal with the interplay of Dalio's three core forces: deleveraging - social frustrations - and a policy cul-de-sac, is precisely why we are and have been so pessimistic on the final resolution to the prevalent problems occupying modern society.
We wish we could share Dalio's optimism...
If we calm down and work together to properly manage this difficult situation – for example, if we can properly distribute both the austerity and the increased efforts that are required to manage our debt burdens – we can get through this deleveraging without great pain. If we can’t, we may experience an economic, social and political collapse.
...but unfortunately we can't. Only when it is far too late will the status quo finally deem it worthwhile to engage with the "99%" on an equal and equitable footing. By then, however, not even the Dow at 36,000 will give anyone any more illusions that things are even remotely "normal."
But then again, a violent end, and subsequent reset, is nothing new in history: every declining civilization has gone through the same terminal death rattle, only to result in a systematic rebirth. This time around it won't be any different.
From Ray Dalio, in the Financial Times:
Risk on the rise as political leaders give in to mob rule
We are in the midst of a deleveraging, we are nearly out of ammunition and we are at each other’s throats. Being in a deleveraging and nearly out of ammunition is a very difficult position to be in. But, being at each other’s throats is our biggest problem.
Our character and our political and social systems are now being tested in ways that have typically been tested in past deleveragings. In deleveragings bad economic conditions typically lead to emotional reactions, social and political fragmentation, poor decision-making and increased conflict. When this occurs in democracies, the checks and balance system, which is intended to yield the best decisions for the whole, can stand in the way of thoughtful leadership and lead to ineffective “mob” rule. This dynamic can lead to a self-reinforcing downward spiral.
Frustrations increase, the established ways of doing things come under attack and frustrations over the ineffectiveness of government creates the perceived need for someone to gain control of the mess. Plato spoke of this dynamic. It was the reason Hitler was elected in 1933.
In our opinion these types of risks are now emerging and should be taken into consideration when trying to figure out what may lie ahead. Rather than trying to resolve disagreements through thoughtful discourse, people are now trying to grab power to beat and suppress their opponents. Tensions between the rich and the poor, capitalists and socialists, those in and out of power and different factions in each group are now intensifying in a manner that is classic in deleveragings. Politicians who are fighting for power in a political year are fanning the flames and are increasingly willing to do risky things (like shutting down the government) in pursuit of their missions and popular support.
This growing populism will have important implications for monetary, fiscal and trade policies and will significantly increase risks of a markets downturn and a global depression.
Regarding monetary policy, the mob is at the gates of the Federal Reserve and wants to grab control while those on the inside are in disagreement about what should be done. Fed chairman Ben Bernanke and those who helped him save the country from depression are now under siege. These challenges are being faced in different forms by most central banks at the same time as they are nearly out of ammunition – i.e., their capacities to ease are very limited because they cannot stimulate private credit creation and because they cannot get money in the hands of people who will spend it. For these reasons there is greater risk that central banks cannot save us as they have always saved us in the past.
The battle between the left that wants to tax the rich more and the right that wants to cut entitlement spending is at a fierce stalemate that is likely to intensify in more scary ways. As a result, fiscal policy is unlikely to be supportive to economic growth.
With high unemployment and growing anger, the “mob” is blaming the foreigners who “took their jobs,” especially the Chinese who they say are “manipulating” their currency to “compete unfairly”. And since politicians want popular support, they are navigating this issue to gain political benefit (e.g., to put the US President in the position of having to choose between the political suicide of vetoing Senator Charles Schumer’s currency bill and clashing with China) rather than to approach this difficult issue calmly and analytically. Trade flows and capital flows are increasingly being looked at by all sides as possible weapons in an economic war. As a result, the risks of bad surprises in trade and capital flows are heightened.
Mobs are at the doors of bankers and others in the financial system, screaming to politicians to put these people in jail while the vote-seeking politicians are fanning the flames rather than reminding people that the legal system is the way these people should be judged. Since banks are levered about 15 to 1, it doesn’t take much of a debt problem to cause them solvency problems, and since in deleveragings debt problems are big, there is significant risk banks will run out of equity again and the fury against them will intensify. For these reasons risks to the global banking system are much greater than normal.
While we hope that most people and their leaders will approach these difficult challenges calmly and collectively, we would not be meeting our fiduciary responsibilities if we bet on this happening without clear evidence of it. We are not alone in having and expressing our concerns in what has come to be known as “risk-on” and “risk-off” market movements.
If we calm down and work together to properly manage this difficult situation – for example, if we can properly distribute both the austerity and the increased efforts that are required to manage our debt burdens – we can get through this deleveraging without great pain. If we can’t, we may experience an economic, social and political collapse.
Ray Dalio is founder of Bridgewater Associates
»
- 27935 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -
Are you referring to the gangbanging ex Gov. of Calif. - the Schwarzenegger? He's big. He's got an accent. And he looks like a Nazi. Calling central casting. And guess who helped make him Governor - our old friends the Rothschilds.
Too old and obviously not born in America.
Didn't stop Obama did it? Photoshopped his birth certificate and step and fetch it is still in office.
then he will crap in public and everyone will wonder at it's richness and aroma. and dog himself will bark thusly, woof. And all shall be forgiven or destroyed by no one can remember which, ad infinitum.
the e-trade baby?
HPDrifter... "a handsome young man will come forward. he will be smart and witty and have a way about him. he will be a good speaker and will move the crowds. he will offer apparent solutions to problems that cannot be solved. he will be the man of sin spoken of in the book of Revelations."
..................................................
1) Does not have to be handsome, just not ugly (for approval of the women)
2) Does not have to be smart or witty, just an above average intelligence and very, very cunning
3) Must be an OUTSTANDING ORATOR that speaks with a heart felt conviction that he REALLY BELIEVES.
4) Will offer unconventional solutions that will solve problems that seem unsolvable to hide bound bankers/pols of today. The solutions offered may cause the deaths of millions or billions of people so he also needs to be a sociopath.
If you don't understand the attributes that Hitler possessed before he went nuts then you know nothing of Hitler and how he moved the masses in Germany. Try Shirer's 'The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich'... then you will understand as much as someone can that wasn't there at the time.
About your revelations bs... take it to church or wherever.
Dr. Emil Puhl (August 28, 1889 – 1962) was a Nazi economist and banking official during World War II. He was director and vice-president of Germany's Reichsbank during World War II and also served as a director for the Bank for International Settlements (BIS) at Basel (Switzerland). He was instrumental in moving Nazi gold during the war.
Banking with Hitler...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_Kp-1n5S-w
The BIS was founded in 1930 by Governor of The Bank of England, Montague Norman and his German colleague Hjalmar Schacht, who later became Adolf Hitler’s finance minister.
Nice, AH, very nice. Also consult: Guido Preparata, CONJURING HITLER. It was Schacht, incidentally, who beat down the 1922-23 hyperinflation in Germany.
We're already there...fascism light.
#1 reason: too many people in the USA, we're Planet Earth's 3rd largest nation (duh-oh)
#2 reason: too much involvement worldwide as the 'Top Cop'
The great tragedy of the 9/11/2001 debacle — in which thousands of Americans lost their lives in a cynical stratagem designed to increase the bloody profits of the weapons makers — was a failure to see how this evil pattern of treason from within was actually the design template of American political behavior throughout the 20th century.
First, by covert financial assistance followed by widespread aspersion and calculated provocation, we create our desired enemy, always with the ultimate aim of reaping fabulous profits from the sale of weapons and the theft of resources down the line.
1933:
Allen Dulles becomes a director of the Nazi Schroeder Bank, a position he holds until 1944. The Schroeder Bank is intimately involved in financing Adolf Hitler.
Members of the Schroeder family are involved in many other aspects of the Hitler Project with the Dulles bothers, including the Hamburg-Amerika Line and the Thyssen steel trust which provides the Nazi war machine with most of its steel, builds the Bismarck in contravention of the Treaty of Versailles, builds the rail lines to Auschwitz and Treblinka and provides all the steel used by Nazi armaments makers, Flick and Krupp.
Adolf Hitler is invited to the Schroeder Bank by a group of industrialists who agree to give Hitler money in return for a pledge to break the trade union movement in Germany.
Present at the meeting are, inevitably, Schroeder board members John Foster Dulles and Allen Dulles. Allen Dulles is Schroeder's general counsel. The Schroeder Bank is keen to help Hitler gain power following the Nazi Party's defeat in the German elections of 1932.
When asked by a reporter for the Detroit News why he keeps a life-sized portrait of Henry Ford in his office, Adolf Hitler replies, “I regard Henry Ford as my inspiration.”
Irenee Dupont, whose anti-Semitism puts him in the same league as the Dulles brothers, Henry Ford and Adolf Hitler, begins financing fascist groups in the U.S.
The best known is the American Liberty League (ALL), a pro-Nazi organization dedicated to whipping up hatred of blacks and Jews and love of Hitler.
Dupont provides half a million dollars in the first year alone to ALL which has a lavish thirty-one-room office in New York City, branches in twenty-six colleges and fifteen subsidiary organizations throughout the U.S. which distribute fifty million copies of pro-Nazi pamphlets.
Among the largest contributors of cash to ALL is the "cream" of the American corporate world including J. Howard Pew (Sun Oil), Walter Chrysler (Chrysler), William Farish (Standard Oil), Howard Heinz (Heinz Foods), Andrew Mellon (Mellon Bank, Gulf Oil, Alcoa), H.F. Pitcairn (Pittsburgh Glass), Alfred P. Sloan (General Motors) and senior exectives of Phillips Petroleum, U.S. Steel, First National Bank, General Foods, Grace National Bank, Morgan Partners, Central Hanover Bank and Trust, Westinghouse, JC Penny and B&O Railroad.
Mind if I throw a Bush on the fire?
http://www.jfkmurdersolved.com/bush.htm
Prescott Bush (father of George) made his fortune by financing the war effort of Adolph Hitler together with his banking partners and fellow "bonesmen" Averell and Roland Harriman. Prescott was stripped of his holdings in the Union Banking Corporation in 1942 under the "Trading with the Enemy Act". "On March 19, 1934, Prescott Bush handed Averell Harriman a copy of that day's New York Times. The Polish government was applying to take over Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation and Upper Silesian Coal and Steel Company from "German and American interests" because of rampant "mismanagement, excessive borrowing, fictitious bookkeeping and gambling in securities." The Polish government required the owners of the company, which accounted for over 45% of Poland's steel production, to pay at least its full share of back taxes. Bush and Harriman would eventually hire attorney John Foster Dulles to help cover up any improprieties that might arise under investigative scrutiny." Source: "Heir to the Holocaust" by Toby Rogers: http://www.clamormagazine.org/issues/14/feature3.shtml John Foster Dulles was the brother of Allen Dulles, the later CIA director, who was the architect - together with Vice President Richard Nixon and George Bush - of the Bay of Pigs invasion to overthrow Fidel Castro's Cuba. Allen Dulles was fired by President Kennedy because of the fiasco of the Bay of Pigs. Yet Allen Dulles was appointed by Lyndon Johnson to serve on the Warren Commission to "investigate" JFK's death.Plaigarism Checker: http://mtwsfh.blogspot.com/2008/10/1933-1934-dust-bowl-gangsters-in.html
great site, thanks for the link
Oops
And yet, DP, we still joined up with Plutocrat England + Red Russia, and destroyed Germany...and with it Western Civilization. Just look at the ruins. All around. And the Jews triumphant. Your facts are correct, but this is the LESSER power you are describing.
For a seriously informed look at the comaprison and contrasts between the post 20's Germany and present, I recommend Shirer's The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. (A quick read of some 1143 pages.)
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?an=shirer&sts=t&tn=rise+an...
Ya, gonna' be required preparation for next summer.
- Ned
to FunkyMonkeyBoy
I agree with you 100%. Just look at who is running Wall Street, basically the Blankfeins of this world. Jews are again running the show and are also creating havoc. For some reason, i fear a new Hitler will evolve once again. Financial weapons of mass destruction have originated on Wall Street but i fear world Jewry will be blamed once again, just by the mere fact that the guys runnibg the investment banks are jews. In Europe ( i am european) hatred towards jews has already started. What will it take for the rebirth of another Hitler. Not much! As the masses of the nations are already pissed and want blood!
The NPD party in Germany for example is basically a Nazi party.
and NAZI is "National Socialist", don't cha' know. - Ned
A lot of the old European Leaders would always tell me that if Hitler lived a few more years he would have gotten rid of a lot more of the private banking regime. The Bush family is still pissed off because they weren't able to be dictators of the US government in the 1930's. SS#'s within the same time frame, good God. The bankers are still irritated because they haven't made everyone in the US land tenants rather than owners, just like in the Kings England (direct quote from American Baker Magazine 1883).
I would like to have the right to directly vote on every issue. A representative dependent on the other party than who he is to represent has an inherent conflict of interest. Ron Paul is the least corrupted presidential candidate, but our constitution is unrecognized.
The next Hitler, in American politics, the man who comes up with the solution that is chosen is usually with the same party that created the chaos in the first place. Too bad we couldn't vote on our American Czars comrades. I vote for Charlie Manson for oversight of all internal government affairs. Maybe the government and their masters will stop doing anything and then us good citizens can clean up the mess as we always have to.
By the way, does anybody know what did Roman Polanski do to make himself such a high CIA target?
Polanski a high CIA target? Didn't know he was on their 'most wanted' list. He has made some great films; 'China Town' being my favorite 'American' film. IF he is wanted by the CIA it could be because he knows too much about too many.
He was/is? wanted for sex with a minor, 13 yr old girl, in the US. He was married to Sharon Tate at the time of her murder by Manson and groupies.
"In 1977, after a photo shoot in Los Angeles, Polanski was arrested for the sexual abuse of a 13-year-old girl and pleaded guilty to the charge of unlawful sex with a minor.[7] To avoid sentencing, Polanski fled to his home in London, eventually settling in France. In September 2009, he was arrested by Swiss police at the request of U.S. authorities, which also asked for his extradition.[8][9][10] The Swiss rejected that request, and instead released him from custody, declaring him a "free man."[
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Polanski
"And the 'love/emotion' some U.S. citizens have shown for obama is utterly sickening...
The dumb-ass' who cry with joy why their hear Obama speak, well..."
There ya go, FunkyMonkeyBoy.
There's the dynamic that puts a "hitler" (read: Dictatorship) into power.
You missed that we've already displayed early but pronounced readiness.
"Rise of another Hitler? Are you f**king joking!!"
Dr. Norman Finkelstein is my favorite truther! Nice youtube search term.
Thank you from China!
You are heading in the right direction FunkBoy. However, Obama is not in charge and never was...so if you think he is calling the shots you are sadly mistaken. However, we as contracted citizens to corporate USA can hold him liable...but good luck with that scenario. Ever try and sue your employer with zero verifiable evidence to get a complaint filed?
The only thing that matters is....WHO IS PLAYING THE FUCKING GAME!!
Do you pay taxes? If so, then STFU! You are complicit in hundreds of international crimes against humanity.
Do you bank at the TBTFs? If so, you have shown your allegiance to those you condemn.
Do you shop at the big name stores? Do you own an I-phone? If so, you have shown your allegiance to fascism.
Do you invest or gamble in the markets? If so, you are an idiot and will eventually be wiped out.
So blame whomever you choose....Obama, the jews, Hitler....BUT its your fault more so than these puppets.
This charade of a government and its foreign policy could be shut down in a day and forever. But people are too busy masturbating to their wealth, cars, bitches, alcohol, TV, fast food and ego. Therefore, they talk the talk but do not walk the talk.
That's my rant which never changes in context. YOU people need to get a clue....and soon.
FunkyMonkeyBoy, that's a very young-looking photo of Alex Jones you got there.
The clowns in charge will never admit to being out of ammunition as long as the printing press still runs.
Printing presses are so middle ages, with electronic deposit and the internet they can keep this up until the electric grid fails.
Complete dictatorial powers is what Obama dreams about.
I think it gives us all a woodie. Who wouldn't want to be king of the world?
If I were king of the world, I would most likely emulate the leadership style of Mel Brooks.
(Oh, piss boy...)
Two comments
1st: We should only be so lucky
2nd: Hitler was supported by the Zionist regime because he agreed to transfer Jews to Palestine with their assets. Hitler faked them out, seized the levers of power, and stopped exporting Jews to the Holyland (probably stopped paying his Bonds too). In any case - no - Hitler cant happen because the Jews wont make the mistake of allowing another Hitler to come to power.
Maybe in Iran
we have this conditioned responose that when the name hitler is uttered we immediately are supposed think evil and monster. most people don't take the time to really dig and study revisionist history on the subject. to the victor goes the spoils and to the victor also goes the ability to write the history as they see fit............
Thank you, HPD. It really disgusts me to see otherwise smart people start fizzing & foaming like Pavlov's dogs everytime the myth of Adolph Hitler is invoked.
the situation in ww2 europe was much more complex than most people realize...........and most of what people think they know , it is simply not true.......hey i used to go for it myself. all of these lies that were planted and continue to be planted. but now, i know better. the subject is not my area for the most part, but , as time goes by, i must include it, since so much of what has happened to us, is a direct result of what happened in ww2 europe etc............people have to open their minds. a shut mind is not a learning tool. truth is truth. it cannot be changed or dressed up to appeal to our own personal desires or viewpoints. it is truth. many people have their sacred cows. that is something that any truth seeker simply cannot abide by. if something is true, then it is true, no matter what we think about it.....no matter whose ox gets gored..........it always will be truth.........
HPDrifter, I Dog...
We should never forget that fear of change is right up there with fear of death on the scale of things people fear most.
Posters here continue to rant about change and believe that the problem is education...or the lack of education.
The problem is much deeper. The problem is intelligence...rather, lack of intelligence. This is a 'third rail' subject and will cause no end of gnashing of teeth but the facts are the facts. No way is a person with low intelligence ever going to compete with one with high intelligence in the so called professional fields...or, the scammers for that matter. Smart scammers are always going to get over on the less intelligent.
Intelligence cannot be taught. It is like speed in a track athelete, speed cannot be taught. Education of people is helpful as is training for the track athelete, but a lack of intelligence cannot be overcome by education any more than training can make a slow athelete fast. If all people were of equal intelligence this world would be very different. Use your intelligence...think about it.
Just like Pavlov's dogs, they have been trained (conditioned). These are highly trained sheep we're dealing with here ... with degrees in sheepishness (and student loans)!
Are you suggesting Hitler was NOT evil and monster?
Really?
sschu
Yes, I am suggesting that.
So what was he and what are the sources for your info?
sschu
This is the only one you need. After that, everything else falls into place.
Holocaust Denial proves Hitler was not a monster?
I guess my visit to Dachau really didn't happen, Stalingrad was just a picnic, my father didn't take the big boat there and the Poles started the entire affair in Sept 1939.
Anti-Semitism is alive and well and has no bounds. I cannot believe Tyler lets this crap on his site.
sschu
I have no problem with Holocaust revision but Hitler wasn't a nice guy. He was a dictator. He was never elected and failed to win the popular vote with a whopping 30%. He led a coup d'etat and took power for himself and before he did he used his puppet Hidenburg to enact this little decree after he had the Reichstag burned down days before the parliamentary elections.
§ 1. Articles 114, 115, 117, 118, 123, 124 and 153 of the Constitution of the German Reich are suspended until further notice. It is therefore permissible to restrict the rights of personal freedom [habeas corpus], freedom of opinion, including the freedom of the press, the freedom to organize and assemble, the privacy of postal, telegraphic and telephonic communications. Warrants for House searches, orders for confiscations as well as restrictions on property, are also permissible beyond the legal limits otherwise prescribed.
Hitler was a demagogue and a tyrant. How do you admire such a manipulative piece of shit? Tyrants deserve no respect and neither do oligarchs. Both are illegitimate. Have some sense instead of falling for 1930s propaganda.
So if Hitler had been elected, what he did would have been ok?
Wow, you sure like this democracy stuff.
I think the problem when describing Hitler as 'a monster' is that he's not very different from many of the so-called 'leaders' that plundered their way across the globe throughout history. Yes, he had a particular bee in his bonnet about Jews... and Slavs... and homos... and communists... and Gypsies...
The nazis, with their industrialisation of murder, brought in a slight new twist to the theme of slaughtering people, but there was nothing unique about Hitler. These scum have been ordering the murder of 'enemy' men, women, and children since the dawn of time.... and their moral automaton followers have been doing their bidding with barely a murmur of dissent.
My understanding is that Stalin killed more people, so Hitler doesn't even win on numbers.
BigJim...
"These scum have been ordering the murder of 'enemy' men, women, and children since the dawn of time.... and their moral automaton followers have been doing their bidding with barely a murmur of dissent."
Your message is correct but many in your audience are the 'moral automatons'... they simply have not figured it out yet... and most of them never will.
They are preoccupied with red/blue, christian/moslem/jew, jets/raiders, et al... Hell, they don't even know they have already been 'divided and conquered'.
I'm sure Ted Bundy was a great guy when he wasn't, you know, serial killing.
That's about the dumbest thing I have read.
"The death of one man is a tragedy, the death of millions is a statistic"
J Stalin
Redcorona the angry masses will select a new radical leader regardless of Jew money and power. When the "power grid" blacks out, the people with power & money will be afraid in their own homes even if they are armed and have security guards. They will shiver in their own homes while caressing their USD$ cash for the last time!
Do you really think the powerbrokers care about the powergrid? It may be anarchy down here at ground zero, but the skies will be filled with drones. What kind of sloppy plutocrats do you think we're dealing with here? Well cheers to your optimism, but I am afraid your vision of a liberating great depression does not jive with jewish eschatology.
Redcorona...
" What kind of sloppy plutocrats do you think we're dealing with here?"
The same plutocrats that ordered the 'Bay of Pigs' invasion of Cuba?
The same plutocrats that ordered the failed murder attempt of FDR?
The same plutocrats that allowed the formation of the Fed?
Hey man, these azz hats are not infallible. They fuck up like everyone else. They attempt to present the facade of infallibility... but, it's just a facade.
Jews and Zionists are very different. Learn to make the distinction, thanks.
Do you think Hitler gave a shit about that distinction or was he just saying put them both in the train wagons for auschwitz
I though Hitler stopped exporting Jews when England decided that "Isreal" (well what was Isreal before it actualy existed) was full and couldn't take anymore people?
The zionists helped bring Hitler to power. He was the method to drive the Jews out of Europe and into Palestine to create an empire for the Jews. They made up the holocaust since the prophecy was that six million would have to die for Israel to come into being. Not 6 million and one and not 5,999,999 mind you. I figure they want to destroy America, incarcerate and murder a lot of Americans and pass them off as Jews, and then claim reparations. They sucked Germany dry with all these still living holocaust survivors and they need a new patsy.
It is a well-known rule dating back to the Internet Flame Wars of the 80's, that as soon as Hitler and the Nazis are invoked, the thread is over.
Godwin's Law.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
yep, but most folks around here don't understand UUNET Flame-Warz. - Ned
Agreed, this thread was over before it began. We could just as easily end up with another Napoleon, or another Lenin, or another Casto, or another Khomeini. What comes after revolution is unpredictable. Be careful what you wish for.
Plato? Oh you mean that guy who said ' only the ruling class should have the right to lie'. Plato knew what idiots the democratic system creates--- the mob. Read his Republic.
Removed.
http://www.rudemacedon.ca/kaminski/1031-axis.html
the axis of evil.............
Try Bernays' Propaganda ... ditto.
The current protests are all about the crushing weight of The Corporate Welfare State that America has become. We the taxpayers support the full weight of supposedly private enterprises: financial institutions that would fail without daily Fed meddling, oil companies like Exxon (still tax subsidized to make a profit from you so you can get taxed again at the pump), the military-industrial complex (running wars as a business at $200 billion/year is what happens after a decade and "mission accomplished", F22s and F35s costing billions can't even be used), prison-industrial complex (7 million under correctional supervision) and even multi-nationals which export jobs.
There's no room for competition and free-enterprise when well-connected cronies get favorable treatment and protection. Worse, it's the failed enterprises that got the best sweetheart deals. Capitalism as it was practiced is dead.
You left out Solyndra, Tesla Motors, Sunpower & the Finnish car maker Fisker...just sayin...if we're gonna air it out lets air it all out.
Why did the "gestapo" raid Gibson guitar and not their competitors?
Surely we can all agree on the fact that it has already become a type of fascism and leave it at that...the way forward is much more complex as everyone then has to leave their comfort zone.
They can leave it on their own terms now, or at 2a.m. some dark night in the future; but they will be leaving it.
Agreed. It's always easy to go down the slippery slope, much harder to climb back out. I call it fascism-light, without the jackboots. But that may be coming
Fair enough...see you on the line...somewhere ;-)
I had not heard Tesla Motors was involved in any scandal. Would you care to enlighten me?
Elon Musk is a crony capitalist of the first order...Google is your friend ;-)
Amen bro. We are THERE ALREADY !
TSA agents can stop people carrying 8 silver coins, demand where they got them ,what their value is, what their political affiliation is.
WTF !?!?!?!? TSA can make RANDOM stops on highways here in TN of law abiding citizens. Do we need to show them our papers, mein comrade?
Obama can start war by executive order, kill U.S. citizens without any review, spy on anyone anytime anywhere without probable cause, and run trillion dollar deficits funded by the Federal Reserve's ability to print money. What is he not doing that people should fear in the future?
The thing is, you can remove the word Obama and substitute his title in your discourse to realize this problem isn't limited to Obama. Anyone who becomes POTUS has all these "tools" waiting for his sweaty little hands.
And so could and DID Mr. George W. Bush. Obama learned from a master or war, murder and communism.
Hopey the Clown is a dumbass and didn't learn shit from Bush. He's just taking orders and dancing on puppet strings. He's not the Messiah and he's not the Devil. He's too stupid to be either one. He's just a puppet.
So which of Obamugabe's 40+ czars told you that? Remind me again when Congress approved military action in Libya? When did W sue a state for trying to protect citizens from armed foreign invaders? When did Bush take over a company and power fuck hundreds of years of contract law? When did Bushg take over a sixth of the economy against the will of the people? Please, remind us all.
"If we calm down and work together to properly manage this difficult situation – for example, if we can properly distribute both the austerity and the increased efforts that are required to manage our debt burdens – we can get through this deleveraging without great pain. If we can’t, we may experience an economic, social and political collapse."
That's difficult to accomplish when the government is run by oligarchs that refuse to share the burden. Anyway we are not the weakest so I look for the unraveling to start in Spain or Italy. Germany is key as it was ast time but this time the Russians are stable instead of fresh off a revolution and the Germans can't possibly be as aggressive as last time. That said the prognosis for Spain and Italy look similar. Strong leadership.
He never mentions throwing the banksters who committed fraud into jail. He never mentions breaking up the TBTF banks that are crushing the economy. He never mentions addressing the wealth inequality that is the catalyst of the status quo that is killing the economy.
No. His solution is distributing pain to the working class in a measured way.
What a useless article.
The market would have allocated the pain in proportion to an individuals or organization's financial involvement in the stupidity.
But no.....oligarchs play by different rules, where we the little people make up their losses so they can maintain their position over us.
Thought the same thing. "Distributing austerity" (equally) my ass.
Why should there be equal distribution, when there is non-egalitarian failure and responsibility? What's the problem with letting the big banks fail, while securing depositor accounts? It's not like there will be no banks left to continue where the failures died.
That is not to say that i'm against a "controlled collapse".... i favour it, but there is no way to get rid of the poison, than via some kind of collapse of the failures - and deservedly so.
Sure, apply all kinds of tricks, apply all kinds of gov interference... BUT do it with the consistent goal of disarming the big failures while protecting agents not involved in the irresponsible gambling. If that means some (stealth-)tax burden, and spending cuts, then so be it.... but ONLY to the extend necessary to achieve the previously mentioned goal.
I'm aware that this will not fix the parasitary economic structure.... that will need entirely different measures.... and especially CHANGES rather than just braindead stimulus and axing, that never ever changes anything under the sun.
indeed,... and fed' chairman ben bernanke and those who helped him save the country from depression are now under siege -
what is this guy? an understudy to 'josepf goebbels' -
charlie rose is a moron and pbs has been a propaganda tool for a couple years now, since what's his name took control -
i love it when there's blood in the streets?
buy_buy_ buy_
midtowng wrote: Vote up!21
Vote down! 0
"He never mentions throwing the banksters who committed fraud into jail. He never mentions breaking up the TBTF banks that are crushing the economy. He never mentions addressing the wealth inequality that is the catalyst of the status quo that is killing the economy.
No. His solution is distributing pain to the working class in a measured way.
What a useless article."
Exactly!
Dalio performance on Rose: major league unimpressive self-satisfied repititious blather And how many billions of fail to delivers on the dark and devious road to billionaireship?
So obviously the solution is to cut social spending to the bone and beyond, right?
Yes.
It makes the lower classes more motivated to work rather than remain idle.
The problem, as the last Tsar found out, is that once the lower class realize they have nothing to lose but a life of desperation their motivation turns to rage against the machine.
The same fire keeps buring those in power over and over and yet they all beleive they are made of asbestos.
exactly.
The only reason they wouldn't have anything is if it was being stolen from them, as the Tsar did.
Cut social spending to the bone? Yes, but also cut taxes and regulations to the bone. Don't interfere in people's lives or business decisions beyond the enforcement of simple rules (don't kill, assault, steal or commit fraud).
I'd add two more basic rules, that are neccessary for the premises of a free market to be implementable at all.... but i guess that's too much to ask in kleptocracy land, and it wouldn't exactly land me bonus points from the ZH crowd (hint: It has to do with the "easy entry" and "no monopolies" premises of free markets. And no, i do not believe in it happening "automagically" - yet, i also do not think that it requires complex regulation or massive gov powers - just some smart info so that people can coordinate it themselves. Oh damn, now i hinted at it anyways - should have kept my mouth shut until i get a better opportunity).
I'm pretty sure the last Tsar found out the same thing that Hitler found out. The Jews are masters of propaganda.
Their veiled propaganda is currently flooding the internet.
Comments like this (@midtwong) really don't contribute much to the discussion. Develop a credible long-term plan which the politicians cannot work around (We can't cut yet, we're almost in recession) and start the process to getb to a balance budget. I would have thought that most intelligent observers recognise that this will involve re-structuring of entitlement programs (Cuts yes, but not "To the bone" as you so eloquently put it) AND tax increases.
Why tax increases?
Cut the military in half and we still spend more than anyone else.
bbbbut, what about the terrorist? Won't they win?
.
But if the government ever attempted balancing the budget the needed issuance of new debt could not be achieved privately with the leverage that the private sector has.
We need to expand debt at a positive rate, YOY, or things get bad.
Everything else is a mere sideshow. That is why we have not paid a nickel on the national debt principal in about 40 years.
pods
No, the solution is to keep paying for fisting education to 10 year olds. After all, we are only $15,000,000,000,000 in debt at just the federal level alone. We can make that up in a weekend, right?
"Risk on the rise as political leaders give in to mob rule."
Democracy IS mob rule, dressed up in a sports coat.
"Thoughtful leadership?" Is this guy 'effin joking? And using the "legal system" to deal with crooked bankers? The legal system is what permits them fractional lend, to lever up to infinity, to mark assets to fantasy, to perform accounting shell games and move debt from the "liabilities" to the "assets" column, after they call their local SEC representative to get the A-okay. And when they are guilty of violating the "law," the SEC staffers are too busy on Pornotube to give a damn.
"Fed chairman Ben Bernanke and those who helped him save the country from depression are now under siege."
I should have stopped reading right there, but I guess I love watching a trainwreck to the very end.
This guy just wants to protect his wealth, and the system that makes him his wealth. ZH needs to stop posting this guy's vacuous, agenda-driven mumblings.
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I thought I was the only one to see this guy as a con! Calm, Calm, Calm ad noseum ( stroking some bimbo's head all the while).
Crock of shit--. sorry bout that. Milestones
Ray Dalio = Leo lite?
Absolutely.
LULZ when the shtf talking won't save ya. forget adolf, i'm looking for vlad the impaler.
come on buzz. didn't you read the man's article? we are supposed to calmly work this out........:)
We will calmly work it out:
Several of the woodcut from the German pamphlets of the late 15th and early 16th centuries show Vlad feasting in a forest of stakes and their grisly burdens outside Bra?ov, while a nearby executioner cuts apart other victims...
he has my vote
Again with Hitler. Always with the Hitler.
Globalization isn't just about labor and resources - it is also about expectations. The Internet has opened up the world - and "common" people are much less willing to suffer endlessly to enrich a few - as we see from the Arab spring to the OWS. The world is slowly but surely becoming more transparent - much to the dismay of TPTB. The standard of living will fall globally for many years - but may result in more people having access to quality food, education and health care.
yep , here it is 70 years later and the subject of ww2 and hitler come up. man , what a deal...
Hitler was the first mass media dictator, he casts a long shadow. wwII was the last global hot war, it made quite an impression.
You are sweet but not even i am that idealistic.
The world is becoming more transparent. And what exactly has changed? Is the government in Syria not killing hundreds of it own citizens daily? Are babies not being raped in the Congo? Are 4 year olds not been raped and killed in Somalia? Has Darfur changed in the last decade. Did the US not embrace torture over the last decade?
The Allied government new about the concentration camps in 1943. They did nothing. They knew about Pol Pot and what he was doing in Cambodia by 1977. They did nothing.
The Patriot Act was transparent. It got passed and get extended every time it come up.
The standard of living for 90% of people will fall. There will be more barriers to access for education and healthcare. Look at what inflation is doing to both those things in the US. BARRIER TO ACCESS. They will keep food as cheap as possible for as long as possible because hungrey people do revolt.
They are attempting to generate a soft landing for living standards of the majority of people in the western world. My guess is they fail, but i do not have a crystal ball.
Eventually the people of the world will realize that we dont have any beef with any other people, and we will not fight each other for the gains and profits of the various TPTB. Instead we may unite internationally against all the various TPTB.
DID THE AVERAGE RUSSIAN AND AMERICAN HAVE A GRIPE AGAINST EACH OTHER? OF COURSE NOT. IT WAS OUR GOVERNMENTS AND OUR ELITES ON BOTH SIDES WHO NEEDED CONFLICT FOR THEIR VARIOUS AGENDAS.
I admire your optimism.
pods
Yeah, tell that to those imposing Sharia law. I bet it goes over really well.
This guy may be smart, but he's an idiot. Dow at 10,000,000 wouldn't give comfort to the average person. Investing is dead. That shit is for computer programmers, moneychangers, the occasional over-confident OCD sufferer, and the dying baby boomers. Nobody gives a fuck in the real world.
The Chinese? I live in a place where unemployment is a bare bare minimum of 20%. In some areas I'm certain it is well over 60%. People here don't ever talk about the Chinese stealing their jobs. And currency manipulation?! I fart in your general direction you dimwit. Maybe on some level they believe that the Mexicans or Chinese are stealing jobs, but all I ever hear about is the bankers and politicians. They are the ones that have their throats exposed to the anger of the masses. The only people that talk about the foreigners stealing jobs are political ads and other similar bullshit.
Hear here.
Years ago when everybody was overjoyed, ebullient over their stock portfolios going up forever, alongside their home appreciation, such did in fact matter, and significantly.
Now, having been wiped out in the stock markets (and who cares whose decisions were right or wrong) with home prices falling, real disposable incomes collapsing and folks all about unemployed, kids moving in back home, the Bernak and his cohorts are FUCKING INSANE thinking that gooseing the stock market is going to have any reaction other than plain down right FUCKING ANGER at the FUCKS IN WALL STREET.
That's not me.... that's the reality of the world, the populace out there.
My opinion for the sake of this comment matters not.
The general populace are not as plugged in as many of us here at ZH and assorted sundry news media, but they are MAD, ILL TEMPERED and ON THE FUCKING EDGE.
STOCKS GOING UP DOES NAUGHT FOR THE WORLD'S ECONOMIC WELL BEING ANY MORE. WAKE THE FUCK UP! GROW THE FUCK UP!
as a computer programmer i resent being lumped together with the moneychangers... lol.
It'll be worse. The United States will dissolve, and there will be 6-8 big territories, that was formerly the United States. So 6 dictators. California will be separated into Cali-North, and Cali-South.
10. And it's already been done...
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Council_of_Governors
Don't try explaining that or any of this for that matter to your "normie" friends. They'll look at you like you're a fuck nut... and all such might entail... accuse you of believing in UFOs, little green men, HAARP Chemtrails, being aConspiracy Theorist, report you to the whoever.....
Believe me... the voice of experience.
I've tried.
A point for our side... ever notice how "conspiracy theories" turn out to be conveniently real after all?
most of the world is sleep-walking, you can't reason with the sleeping it only interupts their dreams and makes them irritable.
I gave up long ago, you can't save a world bent on suicide, so just try to find a seat with a view and enjoy the show.
Television is the perfect narcotic, a circus in every home and a synthetic life style to aspire to if you only buy the right products and do the things like we do, and beleive the things like we do.
Fill the empty hours with illusions until you are old and weak and then it doesn't matter anymore.
yes i believe so. the balkanization of the united states is in the best interest of the hommies in the city of london, no doubt.
Didn't a Russian leader predict this very scenario?
yes, the worst thing about it is that i'm going to be grouped in with fackers from chicago. http://online.wsj.com/article_email/SB123051100709638419-lMyQjAxMDI5MzEw...
It's WAY premature to be calling "total chaos" in Europe. Greece clearly is approaching a "point of no return" so what actions occur in Europe over the course of the next few days and weeks will redound onto the United States. To date however it's hard to say "what Europe wants" at this point...other than to do as Zero Hedge wishes and "tell Tim Geithner to go to hell." Of course having done that already we've now arrived at the "now what?" moment. Frankly i don't think anyone knows. Netflix is obviously a cautionary tale in what were in called in the 90's "violent bull market corrections." Overlay some type of massive credit event involving the entirety of the European Union and obviously that type of "bull market correction" will impact the United States but more importantly involve it as well. This is truly "uncharted territory" as this crisis involves sovereign sensibilities and also historical...realities...as well. It is appropriate and necessary for Treasury Secretary Geithner to arrogate to himself a role. More important the President...if Senator John McCain is to be believed and I do...needs to open up an immediate dialogue with Congress about the various "situations" now suddenly propping up "over there" which can no longer be papered over by a feckless and indeed reckless media.
The American Nazi Party has endorsed the OWS movement.
the american nazi party is run by the fbi and the adl. it is cointelpro all the way. always has been. always will be. now why do you suppose that is?
And Stormfront, the evilist of all the evil Nazi websites, is based in West Palm Beach, Florida, America's hotbed of Nazism.
LOL.
I did some digging around the Communist Party USA, Socialist Party, Young Commie League, etc websites last week. All support OWS and talk about how they are using the movement to further their ideologies.
They also like french fries, naked women and pick up trucks...whats your point?
I like french fries and pick ups, but.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2ewsEKVJVA
(Gotta watch it all..... )
Now that was really funny...
Update. David Duke has thrown his support behind OWS.
http://moelane.com/2011/10/24/rsrh-david-duke-endorses-ows-and-hates-the-gop/
They also endorse the brand of ketchup I use, I think they have a product placement campaign, the CIA gives them a big discount on their media buys.
A maniac leader like Hitler can be eliminated with one tiny ball of lead. The dispersed mass of predators now in charge is infinitely more difficult to eradicate. But eradicate we must. And for once, the anger is focused on the correct place, the people in government, the people in central banks and pseudo-central-banks (IMF, WorldBank, etc), and the people in large financial institutions.
Almost every single individual in these fictitious entities should be hung, for treason, for mass-theft, for mass-fraud, for lobbying and bribing governments to write statutes and regulations that overtly violate individual rights. The appropriate solution is a huge hanging party, in which virtually zero politicians or banksters remain alive. Then return to gold coins as money and continue the business of living life on planet earth without "leaders". No more leaders!
WHERE CAN WE CONTRIBUTE TO YOUR PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN?
IF WE MAKE LARGE ENOUGH CONTRIBUTIONS CAN WE EACH GET OUR OWN POLITICIAN OR OLIGARCH AND PUT THEM IN A SHOOTING GALLERY FOR OUR PERSONAL ENJOYMENT?
Yes. If elected, I pledge to let people shoot everyone we can round up from the existing predators-that-be and predator-class. That's a great idea, actually. But we still need to hang their bodies from lampposts so generation after generation never forgets what predatory behavior leads to... eventually. If only.
Get ready!
Here is my interview CNBC after Rick Santelli:
http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000052988
The charts are here: http://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com/
is that you sankeeyes? are you tony?
great interview there. nailed it. the
misrepresentation of inflation is an attempt
to justify systemic stealing by the banksters.
if they had to recognize the destructive economic
result of their emergency method of money creation the
effort would need be aborted and they would have
to face reality. not in their play book as no
amount of creative thought can turn systemic stealing
into a viable monetary policy. the jig is up.
The solution to all this mess is to make me as rich as possible. I will only accept your gold.
Westport, such a comfortable and peaceful place. Hey Ray you are a reasonable man and a logical thinker, were it that our culture were still framed in such a way. But alas we have left that world and moved onto the furious cauldron of denial, blame, distrust, hate, and tyranny. You call for an orderly response with a sense of shared burden. Ain’t going to happen, this culture this land is too divided. Those who preached identity politics have succeeded. There is no more one America and there cannot be a common solution.
There never was one america. As some one pointed out here on ZH, america is a dream and you can't kill a dream. It can only die by killing the dreamers.
apologies for the use of this space... but.
.
the politicians are ambitious remedial front
persons for the ones that pay them. who pays
the politicians? if you look it up it is the banks.
who pays the banks? that would be the fed, when
the business model of compounding debt and leverage
fails the fed eats the fraud and the banks get back to work
stealing money. what is the fed? it is none other than the
central authority that consists of the big banks and primary
dealers of securities, privately owned by international
financiers ( the mysterious terrorists in the war on terror ).
.
have you seen money as debt? renaissance 2.0, damen vrable.
.
the root problem is the creation of money as debt to be paid back
with interest. this simple inequality demands expansion and growth
of credit, increasingly as time goes by. unfortunately, we do not
inhabit an environment with infinite quantity / capacity of all resources
that would sustain the extension of infinite credit. so, the expansion
will, must be followed by contraction and the associated degradation.
the fact that the financial sector saw fit to ignore reality and leverage up
on securities composed of junk, bad promises, fraud and lies will not
alter the outcome. all of it in the dna of fiat currency, legal tender (law 1913,
federal reserve act- crime). legal tender created out of debt and lending
at interest, propagated through the fractional reserve system; this system
is fatally flawed and we are witnessing the degrading end.
we see the fruits of usury everywhere. it is the end of something.
and it is evident
everywhere. social interactions, media reporting, misinformation, education,
etc. here in a state of revolution ....... more links.. me tired
.
Renaissance 2.0: Lesson 1 - Revisiting American History - Financial Empire
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l37RhdFGVsM
.
Money As Debt-Full Length Documentary
http://geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/2011/10/money-as-debt-full-leng...
.
The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936#
.
but it is not banks or government or dem/repubs, or libs/conservs.
it is owners versus the world (humanity). all the banks/govt etc ..
are hired help for the owners, paid with fiat money made out of nothing
but bad promises buried in legal small print. what a scam, the root of evil.
.
Monday, October 24, 2011
David Icke on Occupy Wall Street Movement
http://geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/2011/10/david-icke-on-occupy-wa...
.
i mean, if we are to be honest. if not then we can
make up any shit we like and sell it at a discount to
the sucker of last resort, the government. let them
beat the people into debt enslavement and incarceration.
p
why keep on bringing up Adolf Hitler and 1933
when you got much more extreme criminals right here right now ?
after all, should we not have learned at least something from History, by Now ?
Last night I saw a little toddler run over in a market-place in China.
The little body just lay there, while everyone just passed by,
no-one stopped to help.
Total fear, ignorance and moral corruption right there !
Witnessed by us all via remote control.
what is the value of Life right now ?
anywhere ?
Don't talk endlessly about fucking Hitler,
unless you want to cover up or make excuses
for worse crimes you are ignoring or are complicit in right now !
wr;)
Let's not get tooo stoic Mr. Biggest hedgefund in the world.
Check your position homeboy.
Your business (in it's current form) relies on the status-quo and the perception in which you view it.
Take away from this is basically WE'RE FUCKED. That's a reasonable assumption.
we have a version of hitler already
its known as The Obamanation
In a post-apocalyptic world, who needs bankers, politicians, or lawyers? Everything will be fine, that is, after all hell breaks loose and our entire social order is reversed. Please riot peacefully and try not to disturb the neighbors. Thanks in advance.
".....screaming to politicians to put these people in jail while the vote-seeking politicians are fanning the flames rather than reminding people that the legal system is the way these people should be judged."
ONLY IF IT IS APPLIED!
It would seem that some are "above the law."
(What a douchebag this guy is. What's worse than douchebag, I am at a loss for words on this one.)
A triple dog douchebag?
A broken, systemically corrupt government with no wherewithal (including desire -- that's where it starts, right?) juxtaposed with an increasingly aware and frightened population is the perfect recipe for collapse, somewhere along the way co-opted by individual(s) promising relief from pain -- even simply the pain of uncertainty.
Anyone who goes "pffft" about such an environment for "Hitler II" is being optimistic.
And I didn't even have to mention a broken economy.