• Leo Kolivakis
    07/30/2010 - 17:29
    In the first quarter, the US economy grew by 3.7%, revised up from an originally reported 2.7% increase. But growth estimates all the way back to the start of 2007 were revised lower. Moreover, the level of real GDP in Q1 was revised down by $100 billion. Does this mean the secular bull market in bonds will continue? And are Treasuries the "last diversifier left"?
  • Vitaliy Katsenelson
    07/30/2010 - 13:51
    The Japanese economy operates on the assumption, soon to be proved false, that the government will always be able to borrow at low interest rates. As internal demand evaporates, the government will have to start hawking its debt outside Japan — in a more realistic world, where interest rates are a lot higher.
  • Phoenix Capital Research
    07/30/2010 - 09:55
    Dear Mr. President, You don’t know me, but I was one of the millions of Americans who voted for you in the last election. I have since been fairly critical of your Presidency largely because I, like many others, feel betrayed by the policies you have enacted upon winning said election.

93% Of Icelanders Reject "Icesave" Bill In Historic Referendum

Tyler Durden's picture




Another European country is about to be cut to junk by the rating agencies, after a whopping 93% of Iceland voters turned down the ironically named Icesave bill in a historic referendum, which would have saddled citizens with an additional $16k in debt to compensate the UK and Holland with a $5.3 billion note for the failure of Landsbanki. The vote failure, which has already prompted Fitch to downgrade the country to junk, and is now sure to see Moody's and S&P follow suit, has left many to believe that a government crisis is now imminent. Another implication is that an IMF-led loan is now in limbo, demonstrating that the international bailout watchdog is truly powerless when the people of the bailout recipient nation want to have nothing to do with the international rescue circuit.

What is amusing is that the disconnect between what governments think their people want and what people actually want has become unprecedented:

The Icesave deal passed through parliament with a 33 to 30 vote majority. Grimsson blocked it after receiving a petition from a quarter of the population urging him to do so. The government has said it’s determined any new deal must have broader political backing to avoid meeting a similar fate.


Icelanders used the referendum to express their outrage at being asked to take on the obligations of bankers who allowed the island’s financial system to create a debt burden more than 10 times the size of the economy.


The nation’s three biggest banks, which were placed under state control in October 2008, had enjoyed a decade of market freedoms following the government’s privatizations through the end of the 1990s and the beginning of this decade.


“This referendum is very peculiar and without any parallel in Iceland’s history,” said Gunnar Helgi Kristinsson, a professor of political science at the University of Iceland, in an interview.

And in Iceland, the people not only don't care about what the IMF or the UK think, but they are certainly making their opnioins against the executives of the failed bank felt, in a way that Americans only wish they could.

“Ordinary people, farmers and fishermen, taxpayers, doctors, nurses, teachers, are being asked to shoulder through their taxes a burden that was created by irresponsible greedy bankers,” said President Olafur R. Grimsson, whose rejection of the bill resulted in the plebiscite, in a Bloomberg Television interview on March 5.

 

Protesters have gathered every week, with regular numbers swelling to about 2,000, according to police estimates. The last time the island saw demonstrations on a similar scale was before the government of former Prime Minister Geir Haarde was toppled.


Icelanders have thrown red paint over house facades and cars of key employees at the failed banks, Kaupthing Bank hf, Landsbanki and Glitnir Bank hf, to vent their anger. The government has appointed a special commission to investigate financial malpractice and has identified more than 20 cases that will result in prosecution.

In the meantime, Iceland, which as recently as 2007 used to be one of the richest countries on a per capita basis, is seeing the net wealth of its citizens sublimate.

The island’s economy shrank an annual 9.1 percent in the fourth quarter of last year, the statistics office said on March 5, and contracted 6.5 percent in 2009 as a whole.


Household debt with major credit institutions has doubled in the past five years and reached about 1.8 trillion kronur ($14 billion) in 2009, compared with the island’s $12 billion gross domestic product, according to the central bank. Icelanders, the world’s fifth-richest per capita as recently as 2007, ended 2009 18 percent poorer and will see their disposable incomes decline a further 10 percent this year, the central bank estimates.


Grimsson, who has described his decision to put the depositor bill to a referendum as the “pinnacle of democracy,” says he’s not concerned about the economic fallout of his decision.

At this point we will take the opportunity to remind readers once again that the biggest fan of the Iceland experiment was none other than the worst and most full of methane Fed board member in the history of the US Central Bank, Fred "Iceman Napoleon" Mishkin, who not surprisingly has made cheerleader-central CNBC his newest media forum, as he conducts yet another monetary calamity lemming cascade off the cliffs, this time not of Reikjavic, but first of Dover, and then of D.C. (the analogy would be more appropriate if D.C. actually had any cliffs as opposed to 50% underwater housing, and an administration full of hyperinflated hot air).

 

 


Mishkin Iceland -

5
Your rating: None Average: 5 (16 votes)



by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 20:46
#256518

What will this do to the FX market on Sunday?

by Careless Whisper
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:52
#256567

I dunno, but Hank Paulson said the unemployment ra ra rate will go to 150% if they don't pa pa pay back the ba ba banks.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:23
#256692

@careless whisper. hahahaha. laughing at your co co comment. i know hank paulson is a crappy public speaker but you want to know my theory? i think hammering hank's public displays of excessive stu stu stuttering is all a contrived act to convince the public he is harmless even though he is close to being the devil reincarnate. in private conversations with his friends, i bet that hank paulson ne ne never ever stutters.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 02:11
#256723

What like why does a guy who grew up in CT boarding schools sound like a Texan? Or why when there is no teleprompter does Obama say absolutely nothing with as many confusing words as possible?

by Problem Is
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 20:59
#257336

"What like why does a guy who grew up in CT boarding schools sound like a Texan?"

Because he was a cheerleader at his all male prep school while busy flunking classes... I have a picture...

by Dr. Richard Head
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:09
#256810

p-p-pl-pl-plus te-t-t-ttenn.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:10
#256878

Mark-to-model accounting would icesave the banks and then nobody would have to pay. Somebody wasn't thinking.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:34
#256920

Stuttering is directly proportional to stress.

by dnarby
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:36
#256922

Stuttering is directly proportional to stress.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:09
#256903

Hank "Jimmy" Paulson: "Hey Ti ti ti Timmy. Why don't you bailout AIG for Gu gu gu Goldman?"

Tim "Timmy" Geithner: "Timmy? Timmy. Timmy!"

Ben "Cartman" Bernanke: "Yeah! That's a great idea. I'm glad I thought of that."

(The Fed's rendition of South Park)

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:14
#256585

so what is the argument in favor of saddling ordinary people for the failure of a private bank?

other than the bankers happy to be paid.

by faustian bargain
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:55
#256675

The argument is in favor of default and start over with a real currency, no bailouts or moral hazard, and 'you get what you pay for' government services.

by SWRichmond
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:38
#256816

Damned radicals!

by doublethink
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:29
#256838

 

Damned Angelenos!

 

Los Angeles Fires First Shot In California's War On Banks, As Cities Seek To Wrangle Out Of Swaps

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/los-angels-fires-first-shot-in-war-on-ban...

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:57
#256806

Well, don't you understand? If they could only borrow at 3.6% like Germany, their world would be all good.

by masterinchancery
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:56
#256826

None--bravo Icelanders! Perhaps the new land of the free, home of the brave.

by Cistercian
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:51
#256894

 The argument is that the morts must pay all losses..and the banks must keep all profits.At some point I am hoping people will understand that the BIG banks are actually operated by super-villains.And that they should be treated accordingly.

 Treated like the evil greed addled criminal scum they are.

 

by hedgeless_horseman
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:52
#256627

How many little-teeny ceramic tiles had to come off the shuttle before the whole thing burnt up?

by ElvisDog
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:33
#256695

Just one actually. There was an impact cavity in one tile on the wing leading edge. It caused a heating  spike that burnt through the aluminum sub-structure like a blow torch.

by hedgeless_horseman
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 13:47
#256991

Uh oh.  I count at least two so far on this mission.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:45
#257146

Brilliant analogy.

by gold_tracker
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 18:10
#258371

That's a great analogy. A sad one for sure, but would appear rather applicable. 

by GoldSilverDoc
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:07
#256642

Could it be that finally a nation will choose the right path? Can the citizens of Iceland choose a non-governmentally controlled currency, and immediately change the course of all of history? 
 
Imagine - "Iceland Declares Krona Worthless, Converts To Gold" 
"Iceland Gold Krona Begins Circulation On May 1" 
"Enormous Boom Seen In Iceland Since Announcement" 
"Iceland Repeals All Property And Income Taxes; Declares Open For International Business" 
"IBM Announces Relocation Of Worldwide Headquarters To Reykjavik" 
"Huge Immigration Backlog In Iceland" 
"Capital Pours Into New Icelandic Banks; Banks Promise 100% Gold Reserve" 
.... 
 
One can dream....

by faustian bargain
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:56
#256676

If they did that, I would have to seriously consider learning Icelandic (or whatever their crazy language is called).

by Frank Owen
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:01
#256678

How about... over the last few weeks they've been converting their money into another currency knowing that the financial terrorists would be coming to give them a beating for not doing as they're told. They come, beat the shit out of the Krona, and then the citizens of Iceland laugh as they look at their bloodied krona and pull out another currency, convert it to worthless kronas and pay of all their mortgages and debts. Then declare the krona dead, and start off fully owning what is theirs instead of being peasants on the king's land. Fantasy?

by Rick64
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 01:07
#256706

Or they could short the krona and then announce they aren't paying the debt.

by A Man without Q...
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 03:58
#256740

The lunacy is that mortgage and car loan debts have been converted into a Euro notional (at a historic rate), so they don't have this option.  The thing about the Icelandic banking crash is that no money has been destroyed in the round.  The Icelandic banks paid stupidly high rates on their current accounts (bizarrely depositors failed to grasp the possibility that higher return implies higher risk) then leveraged to the max and paid way too much money to buy crappy overseas assets.  The flow of funds was little guy lends money to Iceland that pays far to much to the big guys for worthless assets.  Iceland was no more than a pass through.  But now, the little guys in Iceland need to pay back the little guys in the UK and Netherlands.  

It's a combination of the worst bits of capitalism and the worst bits of socialism.

by Zippyin Annapolis
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:36
#256771

Good summary of the situation

 

-- However once the British navy finishes off the Argentines over that latest Falklands oil dust up I might want to spend a little more time looking over horizon South toward their 2 Imperial tormentors: the UK and Netherlands.

 

At the end of the day the dutch will drop this passive/ agrressive and destructuve stance but never ever count the Brits out--they invented Imperialism.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:02
#256757

Frank Owen, Iceland has done close to what you depicted.

Iceland did well for this crisis.

Iceland is located on the outskirts of a consumption sink (Europe) with the known consequences of availability of goods in Iceland.

To counter that, they implemented carry trade which allowed them to grow a lot richer and benefited their society as a whole.

As they knew this would have to end, they designed an exit plan: borrowing from themselves to constitute a basket of currencies (mainly USD, EURO, YEN), this when the Krona was strong against the other currencies.

With that, they have been able to clean a part of their Krona denominated debt when they devalued it as they offered debtors holding debts in a devaluated Krona to be paid back with the reserve basket of currencies.

Icelandic people pocketed the difference(which was invested in real wealth) and now it is trapped in Iceland.

Iceland did very well with the cards hand they had.

More impressively, while this process is nothing new, they seem to be on verge to get away with it. This will have a deep impact on the international scene as some much poorer countries were punished very severely (national resources being privatized stuff like that) for trying a similar scheme to Iceland.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:47
#257150

HOw do the kids say it? Epic fai? Powned?

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 03:40
#257539

I dont know but I will certainly not qualify the icelandic case as a failure. Greed has grown so sharp nowaday that any kind of investment is felt as a loss.

What Iceland is going to pay back is straws compared to what they already pocketed in.

Like those firms which know that going against this pecular law might earn them a sizeable profit while earning them a fine.

Yes, they do have to pay a 1 million fine but in the meanwhile, they gain five millions.

The situation would be better if they did not have to pay that fine. That's the greedy's position. Others think that well, having to pay a 1 million fine to be able to pocket four millions is still better than not having to pay that 1 million and not pocketing that four million.

by jesus
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:03
#256681

you goldbugs are hilarious

 

by faustian bargain
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:36
#256697

you cynics are pathetic.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 03:16
#256737

Gold isn't the answer, but neither is transferring private debt to the public account. Iceland is giving suggesting a very different path to an economic takedown of Europe.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 07:01
#256775

I can understand why silver might make you a little uneasy...but gold?

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:27
#256880

Do you know anything about silver fundamentals? Silver has more upside. 

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:01
#256899

I was going for a Jesus joke.
(I agree with you.)

by WaterWings
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:34
#256919

+30

by merehuman
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 15:52
#257105

Up on silver=real money, cant fold it, but a 10 oz bar feels like 500 bucks, no its better than that. It doesnt compare.I admit it , i am enamored of it. All my life i got paid in dollars and was always aware it was nothing but paper. A transitional tool and a measurement of value. Part of that value was time invested as well as labor.

The more we value(love) ourselves the more we treasure time. As we age time ranks higher in importance. And no time is more important than now.

I venture that silver as well as time are undervalued.

 

by Mr Lennon Hendrix
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:52
#257157

4 stars to that!  Time is of the essence!

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:44
#256819

They would be declared as financial terrorists and be invaded.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 18:15
#257237

LOL! I thought that said IceSLAVE.

by alexdg
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:45
#256820

They would be declared financial terrorists and be invaded, "for their own good".

by Careless Whisper
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:40
#256852

They already have been declared regular terrorists by Britain. You see, my friends, these anti-terror laws have many uses.

http://www2.journalnow.com/content/2008/nov/02/iceland-joins-british-ter...

 

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:35
#256885

This "terrorism" thing is so way out of control. The sick part is that so many people still salivate everytime the terrorism bell is rung. 

I check under my bed, in the closet, and even under the hood of the car everyday to make sure that terrorists aren't hiding there, ready to pounce and rain doom on me for the sole reason that they hate my freedoms. 

I'm on guard. Ever vigilant against the political boogeyman. 

by Mr Lennon Hendrix
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 13:14
#256953

Someone is going to do it.  The US wants to be the first, but they will not back currentsea until the total demise of the doelarr.  You know what I want...State Banks backed with gold/silver/hemp/etc.  I could totally see Iceland going for the jugular now though.  One CAN dream!

by merehuman
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:07
#257119

I understand they had a country wide referendum, chances we have that are ?%

I feel like a farm animal! Duped, disgusted and impoveraged and homeless, a sheep asleep at the wheel of life. This is us!

I am better of than many of my neighbors who really dont want to admit how things are and are slow to prepare.

Not until the dollar actually gets devalued will they believe, and then of course , its too late 

 

 

by Harbourcity
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 20:52
#256524

Can we get a vote like that in Canada?

 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:01
#256530

Would love it.

by SWRichmond
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:07
#256534

Getting one in the U.S. would require legislators and/or chief executives that actually represent the people and not the goddamned banks and the MIC.  In other words, not a snowball's chance in hell.  Instead, we get TARP.

Governments are hungry for money and are looking for ways to tap into it.  If we could verify this: http://frontpage.americandaughter.com/?p=2453

Tonight, a correspondent who has just come home from a Tea Party Townhall Meeting in Salado, Texas with US Representative John Carter (R-Round Rock) issued the warning. She said, “Representative Carter informed the crowd that talk has been bandied about Congress to appropriate every state’s pension plans into the bankrupt Social Security System.” She is absolutely 100% sure that she understood him correctly.

 


by trav7777
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:37
#256608

TARP was 300:1 against, by most reports.

I wrote all my senators and Congressidiots and told them that a vote for this was a death sentence to their career, but I did put in a caveat that if the purpose of TARP was not to bail out banks but to liquify the PDs so that Treasury could roll the 2010 issuance, that they should make this public and clear and that they had no choice but to vote for it.

But if they put TARP to a referendum, it'd have failed miserably.  And, let's not forget that GOP members of the House with some brave Demoncraps voted it down.  TARP only passed because the Senate attached that shit to another existing bill.  Don't fking ask me how the Senate, which is Constitutionally NOT empowered with this type of spending and bill origination authority, was allowed to do that.

Basically, the billionaire house of congress passed this by themselves.  And, let's not forget which party was in control of it at that time.  People try to lay TARP on Busch, but in fact it was the other party that did whatever it took to cozy up with the scumbag GOP oligarchs and make this happen.

by dark pools of soros
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 01:51
#256719

yup - those 12 votes only cost about another $130 billion....  the south wanted a nice slice of the pie upfront

by RatherBFlying
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:37
#256795

I'm sure my Senator just cowers in the corner: "Oh NO! Another sternly worded email from a constituent! I just peed my pants!"

The lesson Icelanders have taught us is that phone calls and faxes and emails are a waste of time. Maybe pouring a little red paint "over house facades and cars of key employees" makes a difference after all.

by Dr. Richard Head
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:20
#256813

Our now retiring Republican Senator George Voinovich voted for the TARP and current Democrat Senator Sherrod Brown voted for it as well.  According to the NY Times, as well as our local Plain Dealer in Cleveland, Senator Sherrod Brown, Democrat of Ohio, said he had been getting 2,000 e-mail messages and telephone calls a day, roughly 95 percent opposed. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/25/business/25voices.html

I would believe that Sen. Voinovich received the same feedback.  The problem is Capital Hill said damn the people, run the printing press.  With Boobus Americanus now fixated on whatever happens to be on the idiot box, many of Boobus now forgets his outrage.  Had a vote been put forth for the US at that time, the results would have been simliar to Iceland. 

Now that the FED is getting more power to conduct more business behind close doors, I fear that the ongoing bailout of the bubble barons will not see the light of day for Boobus to be reminded as to why exactly he should be angry and to whom that anger belongs. 

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 14:25
#257019

You should have written your representatives. That's what Amerika is all about!

Wait. I did, and the bastards voted for it anyways. Then sent me a form letter explaining why I am such an idiot. 

by Harbourcity
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 18:27
#257248

All I got was a form email.

They didn't even waste a stamp on me :(.

 

by 35Pete
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 09:04
#257654

At least they still had the courtesy to explain to you why they are really smart and you're not. 

by Frank Owen
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:11
#256638

It's only after we've lost everything that we're free to do anything.

SWRichmond:  In other words, not a snowball's chance in hell.

Come-on, I know you don't mean that. If you meant it you wouldn't be so passionate about what the Tea-Party started out out as. People are complacent because the cover-up "is working" (look at the dow, things are fine!), but as we all know it can't last forever and then people are going to have to face the ugly truth like Iceland has been. Things are just starting, and I bet more and more politicians and financial terrorists are starting to get insomnia worrying about what happens when the illusion falls apart. Seeing Iceland's population collectively reach into their pockets and pull out a great big huge finger and say fuck-you is great, and I think people in Greece, England, the States and other countries will hopefully follow suit, but not until it is really bad. Disaster Capitalism has left the 3rd world countries and moved on... but the people who are going to soon be affected will be much more harder to screw because they have been sold the lie for so long. Where's Howard Beale... should be along soon.. lol

Only after disaster can we be resurrected.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:22
#256794

I am surprised how successful the MSM was in making Sarah Palin the chief tea partier. Is there an easier way to discredit a movement?

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:40
#256886

Exactly. And Sarah is such an idiot that she doesn't even realize that she's an idiot. She thinks that she's really smart, and their lies the problem. 

Boobus right-wingus Amerikanus thinks she's smart too. So Mooselini and her video sheep think that they're doing the nation a favor when all they've done is completely destroy a legitimate grass roots movement by showing up. 

 

by SWRichmond
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:37
#256925

And Sarah is such an idiot that she doesn't even realize that she's an idiot.

That is why they call them "useful idiots".

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 22:51
#257399

Dangerously stupid..just like Dubya. She goes after her "opponent" with all the maturity and grace of a Jr. High scorned cheerleader. Seriously--I cant ever remember seeing a public official with Palin's level of immaturity, it is truly staggering.

The Tea party folks must be cut from the same cloth, or they never would have let that REEETARD near their campaign. Talk about the kiss of death!!

Note to the TEABAGGERS--If you want to be taken seriously, Sarah Palin as spokesperson should have been last on your list. You would have had better luck with Gary Coleman in a pink tu tu.

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 04:49
#257554

are all you people braindead?

maybe we should elect McCain or Romney in 2012? or maybe Reelect Obama? yay 4 more years!

wtf are you people thinking?

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 12:06
#257831

You can't find anyone better than Palin to represent the teaparty?

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:02
#256531

Can we get a vote like that in the USA ? - the free-est and great-est country in the world ?

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:32
#256770

I'm not sure the U.S. is the freest. If "freedom" equals lack of rules, then any 3rd world failed state will do. But if freedom has to do with people having power over politicians and the state apparatus, then a country like Switzerland is miles ahead of the U.S.

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:44
#256891

Any nation that openly declares that it can assassinate its citizens, without due process, without trial, on the notion that one or more of its operatives thinks they're a terrorist, is NOT a free country. 

We live in a police state. As Doug Casey put it, America as a nation no longer exists. All that's left is the United States and it's just another fucking country. 

And if the Iceland situation is the new litmus test for "terrorism", then what does THAT tell you? 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:04
#256533

Who cares about Moody's & S&P ratings ? The way I see it, Icelanders are the winners and let the Brits & Dutch go get their money someplace else - maybe BB ?

by Nout Wellink
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 04:13
#256744

We, the Dutch, have sent the bill to Bernanke. He promised us the money back. Just a new billion number in the computer et voila, it's done.

by BorisTheBlade
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 04:42
#256747

Who cares about Moody's & S&P ratings

good point, S&P and Moody's ratings are pieces of junk themselves already.

by ptoemmes
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:13
#256535

Mish has some interesting quotes from Iceland's PM and FM.

"

Political leaders have already moved on and are trying to negotiate a new deal with the U.K. and the Dutch, making the bill in today’s vote “obsolete,” Prime Minister Johanna Sigurdardottir said on March 4.

"It's of utmost importance that we don't over-interpret whatever message comes out of this. We want to be perfectly clear that a "no" vote does not mean we are refusing to pay," Finance Minister Steingrimur Sigfusson told reporters.

"

Mish's blog post here: http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2010/03/iceland-rejects-icesa...

Pete

by 35Pete
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:00
#256574

I hope they hang the parliament from lampposts in the streets if they override the 93% referendum. 

Enough is enough. People are sick of being ruled. 

by Harbourcity
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:15
#256586

Although Iceland will experience hard times, I would give up everything I own to be free.  I doubt any politians or bankers can make the same statement.

by 35Pete
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:17
#256587

When in the course of human events....

I'd rather be impoverished and free than what we are now. 

Unfortunately, about 90% of the public have an addiction to materialism and entitlement. 

by Mad Max
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:45
#256622

Impoverished and free vs. impoverished and not free.

That 90% doesn't realize it, but they're almost certain to be poor either way.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 05:59
#256756

Amen to that brother. Amen to that.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:32
#256796

Speaking for an Icelander - I'd rather be poor but I'd be none the richer by giving a yes vote for the mobsters !!

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:37
#256698

More anti-populist claptrap red hearings
from Mike Shedfield.
Without the referendum there would not
have been ANY negociations in the first
place. Now that it passed the banksters
have to start all over from ZERO.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:07
#256536

Have not felt happier in days and weeks - the feeling equals that of a 100 point one day drop on the S&P500 !!

by Fritz
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:08
#256537

Iceland - 1, UK/Holland - 0

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:08
#256538

way to go Iceland. f*ck those bankers!

by digalert
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:16
#256539

Let's see here, were the US voters mostly in favor of TARP bailout nation? I don't think so, but they did it anyway.

by Careless Whisper
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:23
#256544

capitalism is alive and well.

by Hondo
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:23
#256545

Way to go Iceland....tell them to stck it

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:28
#256548

wow interesting development iceland is yrs ahead of other counries will we be seeing this again and again?

by Mr Lennon Hendrix
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:30
#256551

The US is going to need a lot of red paint.

by perchprism
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:49
#256557

"...surely you don't mean to include the church?"

Ghostrider (High Plains Drifter):  "I mean especially the church".

 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:06
#256641

+100

by THE DORK OF CORK
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:39
#256556

I salute the Icelanders they are made of stern stuff

My countrymen have failed the test yet there is still hope

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3rrZ07Pig0

 

by Gimp
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:43
#256558

We could only dream of such a vote in the U.S. but it will never happen as the bankstas own the poltical hacks in DC.

Way to go Iceland, somehow I have a feeling the government bureaucrats will still work out a payment scheme behind closed doors and stick the burden to the people regardless.

No one survives the Spanish Inquistion!

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:45
#256561

I believe that the forces that rule this world ($$$) are trying to pull a quick one !!

They let a small country default its debt. What Iceland owns or the wealth they can produce is pocket change for the big boys anyways

People will praise it. "yeah...brave Icelanders!!!!!!"

They plunge the country in such a terrible crisis to the point where the whole nation have to beg on the streets.

The whole world's media news send their cameras to Iceland. " See what happens when people rules!!!!"

VOILA !!!! Joe six pack will think twice before questioning the "experts"

by moneymutt
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:17
#256588

I do believe money elite would prefer Iceland take their IMF medicine and not default but rather stay in debtors prison...no doubt they set Iceland up as a test case but Iceland's populism may stand in the way..

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:37
#256799

I will willingly send some of my post-tax dollars to an Icelander. Countries have defaulted before and it did not make the people any less unhappier.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 17:00
#257163

One interesting thought on Iceland, is what % of their food is locally produced?

I believe much of it is imported, and that will be tough to maintain if the currency is worthless. Was it the ideal test case?

I applaud their bravery, but how will they eat?

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 06:44
#257618

Probably they'll eat more fish, but they may have to fight for those fish with UK... again:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cod_Wars

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:48
#256565

I doon't understand why Canada doesn't annex Iceland and pay that bill. Chump change for a whole country. We can forcibly resettle the Icelanders in Gimli MB and they'll be happy and we'll have a toe in Europe.

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:17
#256762

Empire building, eh? Yeah, that worked well for us. Not to mention that it's immoral. 

by 35Pete
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:48
#256566

I'm proud of the Icelanic people. They shouldn't have to go in the hock for their criminal banking syndicate. 

Why can't we Amerikans grow a pair like them? 

by Fish Gone Bad
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:54
#256572

This is such terrific bad news.  Dow 36,000 on Monday.

by 35Pete
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:02
#256578

LMAO!!!

Yep. On any shitty news watch the S&P to gap up 6%. 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 21:58
#256573

Its not the bankers there sticking it to its the British public. All those who lost money in ice save only to have the British tax payer foot the bill. Iceland should pay their debts or have a battalion of royal marines landing on their fair shore!

by moneymutt
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:11
#256582

did some one make a promise to Brits, did Iceland have a FDIC? did Britain?...and why should average citizen be responsible to average British citizen for the acts of a bank they did not control?

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:51
#256774

Yes. When a bank in one EEA country operates in another EEA country through a branch it remains regulated ('passported') and under the deposit compensation scheme (FDIC-equivalent) of the home country. This was to prevent banks being regulated 15 times over if they wanted to operate across Europe, which would discourage the free movement of goods and services.

When the Icelandic banks collapsed the Icelandic government announced that their deposit compensation scheme would only compensate Icelanders. This was in direct contradiction to the assurances they made when signing the treaties to get access to European markets. The debt only relates to the part of deposits they were supposed to cover via the compensation scheme, not to all the deposits.

On the other hand, it was always clear that Icelandic government didn't have enough money to meet their treaty obligation...

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:15
#256802

The British and Dutch depositors were compensated through each country’s bank deposit guarantee schemes after Icesave collapsed in October 2008 and the two governments are now seeking to reclaim the money from Iceland.

and

Ms Sigurdardóttir said Iceland was the victim of “faulty regulation” in the European Union, having been bound as a member of the European Economic Area to rules on cross-border bank deposit guarantees that were not designed to cope with systemic collapse of an entire banking system. She said Iceland had never accepted its legal obligation to provide a sovereign guarantee to repay the money, but had agreed to do so in order to resolve the dispute.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/2551a7e6-2937-11df-972b-00144feabdc0.html

The "FDIC" like deposit insurance scheme was covered by the UK & Dutch systems, as required.  What the UK & Dutch governments are attempting is to get the citizens of Iceland to pay 100% of all UK & Dutch citizens deposits, not just the insurable limit.  In this the citizens of Iceland have already paid their just debts.  That is the citizens of Iceland and other European nations not involved with the failed management and regulation of these institutions and their cross border relationships.   Makes me wonder who benefited from the collapse of these Icelandic institutions, when were these financial positions taken and if these payouts have been considered in the present negotiations?  After all, a fair presumption is that the member institutions of the Dutch & UK central banks were most likely major market makers in creating and moving these and like products.

If the Brits did show up in force and bring war to a nation that has avoided that for hundreds of years I would volunteer to defend Iceland and put the experiences from my years of military service to work. After all, it wouldn't be the first time my family traded rounds with the red coats.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:06
#256831

Did you read the article you quoted?

"The British and Dutch depositors were compensated through each country’s bank deposit guarantee schemes after Icesave collapsed in October 2008 and the two governments are now seeking to reclaim the money from Iceland."

It's the money from the bank deposit guarantee schemes that UK and NL are seeking, not the whole deposit. It was not SUPPOSED to be covered by the UK and Dutch schemes because Landsbanki was "passported" in and was supposed to be under the Icelandic scheme still. The UK and Dutch schemes made ex-gratia payments because the Icelandic government repudiated the treaty commitment. That's why the UK government seized Landsbanki assets using the terrorism legislation - as security for the ex-gratia payments it had made because Iceland couldn't/wouldn't.

Iceland's argument is that the collapse of all banks is kind of a "force majeur" situation which nullifies the government responsibility to pay out the compensation.

I still think that according to the letter of the treaties Iceland is liable for this money, but I can also see the practical difficulties for them in doing so.

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:22
#256835

I stand corrected and ammend my comment.

The "FDIC" like deposit insurance scheme was covered by the UK & Dutch systems.  In this the citizens of Iceland have already paid their just debts in that they never signed onto the treaty obligation for cross border deposits and that there was and is woefully inadequate regulatory enforcement by European authorities relating to cross border banking.  (Sounds like the failures to properly enforce with respect to Greece and other Euro area nations and their apparent fudging of their books to look proper being played out in a different arena)  That is the citizens of Iceland and other European nations not involved with the failed management and regulation of these institutions and their cross border relationships.   Makes me wonder who benefited from the collapse of these Icelandic institutions, when were these financial positions taken and if these payouts have been considered in the present negotiations?  After all, a fair presumption is that the member institutions of the Dutch & UK central banks were most likely major market makers in creating and moving these and like products.

by hedgeless_horseman
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:56
#256600

With greater return comes greater risk.  Iceland's taxpayers didn't force Brits to chase yield. 

Plus, I think those too few Royal Marines of yours are going to be a bit busy in Afghanistan, Iraq, soon The Falklands, and very possibly up 'round Belfast.  Plus, with a big chunk of the Nation of Islam setting up shop in every shithole suburb of England, it looks like Bjork won't be facing any Redcoats on her beachfront for the foreseeable future.

 

by caconhma
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:32
#256603

"have a battalion of royal marines landing on their fair shore!"

I wish you get a cancer and rotten to hell.

As for fuckin Brits they will be bankrupt shortly. Should Chinese stuff every single brit?

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:24
#256764

I 2nd that. 

by Mad Max
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:47
#256624

To use the internet idiom, FFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey, sucks to be the British taxpayer.  Also sucks to be the taxpayer almost anywhere else.  For the UK and Netherlands to try and extort this bill is adding insult to injury, and is the sort of thing that tends to lead to extremely violent wars 5-20 years down the road.  Ever heard of the WWI reparations and Weimar Republic?

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:12
#256648

"Its not the bankers there sticking it to its the British public. All those who lost money in ice save only to have the British tax payer foot the bill. Iceland should pay their debts or have a battalion of royal marines landing on their fair shore!"

Your Government stuck it to you a long time ago.

You're just to stupid to see it.

"..battalion of royal marines landing on their fair shore.."

Prick. Is that your answer to everything?

by boiow
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 04:50
#256748

caveat emptor, i'm british and i think good luck to the icelanders. we have somehow got to reign in our elite in the uk. but part of me thinks its too corrupt to change without a miracle.

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:30
#256767

+1. Good man. Empire building didn't work for you, isn't working for us (US) and again, is immoral as hell. 

Man should not prey on his fellow man. Your private citizens accepted risk, that risk manifested itself. Boo hoo. They can move out of their castles and estates and into an economy flat in Liverpool. It's called risk/reward. 

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:37
#256772

Well i think you will find its more the people who live in council flats in Liverpool who had what savings they did in icesave, not the rich elite (which there arnt exactly mainy left of in the UK unless you count the Russians and Arabs!. This is not your typical case of the government bailing out banking tycoons, they were bailing out every day people, who will pay for it them selves from there taxes.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 20:52
#257333

Then why has your British govt given sanctuary to the execs from Glitnir and Landesbaanki? Those are the men responsible, yet they are staying in London (luxuriously) without a care of being extradited. Who is creating the criminality and who is protecting it?

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:30
#256768

This is all rich coming from the americans who basically took on Britannia's legacy of raping and pillaging to the extreme!

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:12
#256901

Uhh, some of us are doing our damndest to change that. Problem is that we have an extremely powerful ruling class that's intentionally wrecked our education system, making it impossible for the average citizen to think (all issues are emotions based here)  produced exceptionally effective bread and circuses, and are becoming more brazen against opposition domestically by the day. 

Don't paint us all with a broad brush. We know our military has been used as brigands around the world to pillage, plunder, loot, and exploit. 

What most Americans today still won't admit is that we've had it so well because we've stolen from everyone else. And just now they're bitching because that theft is turning more inwards towards them. 

We know that "in our name", societies have been destabilized, governments overthrown, and lives destroyed for the benefit of the few. 

And we know that this is going to end badly for us. That doesn't mean that we still can't try to do the right thing. Not all of us are apathetic. Some of us have a tough time looking at ourselves in the mirror knowing what has been done "in our name". 

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 05:58
#256755

They didn't fair too well at Lexington or Dunkirk.
And they were an empire back then.

Good luck with that.

by moneymutt
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:09
#256581

No matter what, they are screwed, best to default and get it over with, or bu austere for decades...

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:12
#256584

Go Iceland!

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:18
#256589

I'm willing to sell nearly every Goldman Sachs employee and ex-employee (with a few exceptions for those who've seen the light and mended their ways or just pushed a broom at the squid) into slavery to help fix things.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:21
#256593

20 prosecutions is 20 more than we will see here. Fucking banker locusts.. Obama will keep his Jew puppet masters safe and make sure the teet of the nation keeps their bellies full of the milk and honey from a good day trading the market... And never losing.

by dnarby
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:54
#256933

OK, time to dial down the stupidity...  Most of the bankers are WASPs.

by MsCreant
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 18:42
#257254

Why does race come into it for people here? This crew is too smart for that. I believe in free speech, but WTF? Not all Greeks or Jews or WASPS or any other group is all X. Over generalization is bad logic that will more often than not lead to bad conclusions.

Not all of Obama's puppetmasters are Jewish, or Muslim, or communist, or bankers.

Puppetmasters of the world unite!

by Mr Lennon Hendrix
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 20:00
#257306

The Illuminati consist of all the tribes of the world.  Originally, it was done this way to consolidate power in Europe.  Now that the world is a "global village" (thanks Hill), they have accepted into the ranks certain "races".  The House of Saud are best buds with the Bushes.  The Bin Ladin's own a third of the Carlyle group; the other proprietary owners are the Bushes and Sarkozys.  David Rockefeller said that religion is a thing of the past; in other words, they do not care what you worship, as long as you abide by their rules.  Their rule is MONEY.  This rule gives them power.  The upper echelon is mostly white however.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:22
#256594

>Icelanders have thrown red paint over house facades and cars of key employees at the failed banks<

Excellent idea. Let's not forget their jets and yachts.

by 10044
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:26
#256597

by Mr Lennon Hendrix
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:30
#256662

plus plus

by SWRichmond
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:52
#256673

China must strengthen its currency, internalize its markets and build its middle class.  Now we will see that capital flows towards a strong currency, and increasingly so towards a strengthening currency.  And when China begins attracting capital with a slowly rising currency, from where will the insatiable capital borrowing needs of the U.S. be met?  This is slow starvation for the U.S.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:30
#256602

Bravo Iceland!!

STOP the fraud, STOP the endless looting---Let the chips fall where they MAY.

The world needs to learn from your example!

by trav7777
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:40
#256612

Go Iceland!

I recall the great days of 2008 when shorts were making money hand over fist on throwing darts at the Wall St journal stock pages for puts to buy and the sheer candor coming out of the leader of Iceland was spectacular.

I mean, it was basic reality.  Instead we got "Mission Accomplished" and "strong economy" and the recession is a state of mind and whining.  Everyone should read that national statement in Iceland when they went into default. 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:42
#256614

this is hilarious. The Icelanders lived rich for 10 years, enjoying the fat tax benefits of being a hedge fund. Now it time to pay the piper and suddenly its all 'freedom.' I love it. Just like the 'poor' Greeks. If you want to play the game of high finance, you have to be prepared to lose. Not pull a Goldman Sacs and once the going gets tough get your marbles and walk away. O well. Hope they enjoy eating whale meat and sheep for the next...long fucking time.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:13
#256651

This comment is about as accurate as saying that the workers in Greenwich, CT's restaurants are the beneficiaries of Goldman Sachs' thieving.

by Frank Owen
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:17
#256653

Not pull a Goldman Sacs and once the going gets tough get your marbles and walk away.

What? Goldman walks away with their's and everyone else's marbles. Pay attention to the game.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:20
#256689

Iceland taxpayers != Iceland banks

Why should the Iceland taxpayers pay for the Iceland banks' foibles?
Why should the US taxpayers pay for the US banks' foibles?
Why should the UK taxpayers pay for the UK banks' foibles?
Etc.

If you haven't figured it out yet, this is all about taxpayers versus politicians + financial institutions + those dependent on transfer payments.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:10
#256832

Goldman Sachs needs to be tried at the Hague.

Crimes against humanity.

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:30
#256839

Too bad those judges are most likely share holders or have their money managed by them.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:42
#256615

Please double check your facts on the IMF.

Last I checked, the IMF declared that the vote's outcome would have no impact whatsoever on whether they'd continue to finance Iceland. Considering that Strauss-Kahn is at its head, I'd be hard convinced that they didn't mean it.

Fact is, the only people who are saying the IMF will do otherwise are, duh, the UK and Dutch governments. It's just pathetic that ZH is peddling that IMF loans are at stake.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:43
#256616

Please double check your facts on the IMF.

Last I checked, the IMF declared that the vote's outcome would have no impact whatsoever on whether they'd continue to finance Iceland. Considering that Strauss-Kahn is at its head, I'd be hard convinced that they didn't mean it.

Fact is, the only people who are saying the IMF will do otherwise are, duh, the UK and Dutch governments. It's just pathetic that ZH is peddling that IMF loans are at stake.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:43
#256618

Please double check your facts on the IMF.

Last I checked, the IMF declared that the vote's outcome would have no impact whatsoever on whether they'd continue to finance Iceland. Considering that Strauss-Kahn is at its head, I'd be hard convinced that they didn't mean it.

Fact is, the only people who are saying the IMF will do otherwise are, duh, the UK and Dutch governments. It's just pathetic that ZH is peddling that IMF loans are at stake.

by Mad Max
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:44
#256620

Kudos to Iceland.

And weekly protests of 2000 people in a nation of 320,000?  That would be equivalent to weekly protests of TWO MILLION people in the US.  Oh, one can dream.

by hayleecomet
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:54
#256631

we need to get it together

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 22:41
#257393

WHY are American's so spineless?? I just dont underestand how you can watch these Banksters and the FED pull of the biggest heist of taxpayer dollars in history, and just sit there-??

What is going on with that?

by Stranger
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:44
#256621

Punish the failures!

by hayleecomet
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:52
#256628

+1000 to the people of Iceland for focusing and getting their message through loud and clear.  Our "tea party" has become so fragmented I don't even know what they stand for, especially since Palin has become their mascot.

In our defense, the message was loud and clear about TARP and they did what they wanted anyway.  Not to mention the litany of other assistance programs made available....TAF,PPIF,TALF,CPFF,PPIF,TIT,TOOT,TRAP,TAINT....if you know what I mean.

 

by doublethink
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 22:55
#256632

 

"[Any] bailout watchdog is truly powerless when the people of the bailout recipient nation want to have nothing to do with the...rescue circuit."

 

The good people of Iceland have performed an action which has repercussions for the fate of Greece (and for the PIGS and STUPIDS as well). We in the States tried to express the same sentiment by the avalanche of calls to Congress in the lead up to TARP. That is to say, Americans too were willing to sacrifice a near-term economic disaster so as to avoid the bailout of the banks.

 

Political leaders throughout Europe will be contemplating this earthquake in Iceland as will our own. There will not be another US bailout without the good people of America demanding a vote similar to Iceland's. After all, taxation without representation goes to the very core of our democracy. Anything less would be perceived by all the people as treason.

 

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:35
#256844

We have been getting taxed without representation ever since the federal reserve seized the power to appropriate.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:17
#256654

Thank you people of Iceland. You are truly beautiful and brave. We will follow in your footsteps here in America.
Economic justice is for all, not for just the privileged.
TARP is CRAP.

by chindit13
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:21
#256656

Ignorance of reality is no excuse.  What I mean is, folks who put their savings in the banks of a country that had bank assets 10X the country's GDP should be selected out by Darwinian Socialism.  Sorry Brits.  A fool and his money, and all that.  It's more than your average stout drinker, though.  Lots of UK municipalities put funds into Icelandic banks.  Poof!

Perhaps I am ignorant of the facts, but I do not think the average Icelander had anything to do with what their bankers did, thus it is understandable and fair that they should vote against paying.  What should be done immediately is to claw back every last krona any bank executive received since the beginning of the debacle.  Clearly they did not earn them, so take the house, the car, the bank account, pull the braces off their propagated gene pools' teeth...everything.

After that, I'm willing to buy the air tickets for a gaggle of Icelanders to come to the US and teach the population how to "Just Say No" to bankers and their political apparachiks.

 

by Gussiefink-nottle
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 03:37
#256738

There was a time when most investment houses were unlimited liability partnerships. If your bets went wrong not only was your job on the line, but also your personal assets and through the quaint concept of joint and several liability, the personal assets of all your partners. The men who ran the investment houses in those far off days were giants compared to the unbelievably rapacious termites who are now in charge. Most of them had served during World War II in the military and had seen friends and comrades killed. Whilst I am sure there were many exceptions, on balance they were less concerned with personal enrichment and more focused on providing the sort of service to their clients for which their investment houses had originally been established.

 

We do still have joint and several liability but nowadays that liability falls on the shoulders of the taxpayers whose consent was never sought. Iceland has shown that when they are asked, they are not keen to become unwitting partners for losses incurred at the casino.

 

 

by chindit13
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 06:16
#256763

Nice piece of writing.  I'll have to seek out your comments in the future.

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:50
#256861

Frederic Bastiat spoke about the rule of law being subordinated by those that desired to legitimatize plunder. It is indeed tragic that property rights have been subordinated by "lawful" plunder at the hands of those who have no other objective than multi million dollar federally guaranteed Wall Street minimum wage welfare payments and food stamp meals and "entertainment" in the thousands at a crack all for making markets in national & regional stability for fun & profit. 

Excellent writing Gussiefink-nottle.  +1

by Quackking
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:21
#256657

Sublimate: Turn from solid to gas without passing through a liquid phase.

 

Excellent work, Tyler.

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:25
#256660

Going out to buy some red paint tomorrow.

by perchprism
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 14:31
#257026

 

Me too.  It'd be interesting to see the judicious application of red paint become popular here in the U.S.

 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:27
#256661

Hooray! Another country is going to default on its debt! Next, maybe the US will follow suit. Because we all know how much ZH wants that to happen, right?

by 35Pete
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 18:47
#257259

Hey Summer's Eve...

Quit being a asshat. Reporting shitty news doesn't mean that anyone wants shitty news. What we do want is the truth, which we're not getting in the lame stream media. 

 

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:32
#256663

Does this mean that they are on double-secret probation now?

by Roy Bush
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:33
#256664

Congrats to the people of Iceland!!!!

by Anonymous
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:37
#256669

Obviously they weren't using Diebold electronic voting machines...

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:38
#256848

heh.  Or having their votes routed through a private firm first..

by Fix It Again Timmy
on Sat, 03/06/2010 - 23:40
#256671

So, this is what happens when you don't use Diebold electronic voting machines?  How gauche is that?

by Chaz
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:02
#256680

Bravo Iceland.

Whoever mismanaged this bank should be stripped of all his assets... all of them.  There's only one reason this bank went belly up: someone mismanaged it.

I wouldn't care what the consequences are for defaulting... you're screwed one way or another regardless of what path you take when you're in that deep.

by Clinteastwood
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:30
#256694

When they come for you saying you must pay your fair share of the US debt, just tell them no thank you very much, I never got to vote on any of this, stick it in your ear.

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 02:33
#257519

Should the last word have an R prior to the letters EAR ??
I should remind you that the debt is far bigger than the collective American orifice can take without major rupture.
If you do your sums on it you will understand that the last one out must turn off the lights. True democracy means never having to say "whatever dude"

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:34
#256696

Not excellent work, but poor research.

The referendum was pointless anyway because the compensation of the Dutch and British savers in 'Icesave' has meanwhile been renegotiated. The revised terms are more favourable for Iceland and may well be passed by parliament and not vetoed by the president.

You Americans must be losing quite a lot of money in Europe if you always read only half of the story.

by faustian bargain
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:41
#256699

You have failed to convince me that you know any more than anyone else here.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 00:54
#256701

So: How much did you lose, exactly, placing your money in an online bank in a foreign country?

by Tethys
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 01:25
#256711

 

Iceland’s leaders are trying to negotiate a new deal with the U.K. and the Dutch, making the bill in yesterday’s vote “obsolete,” Sigurdardottir said on March 4.

“The results of the Icesave referendum are an internal matter for Iceland,” said acting Dutch Finance Minister Jan Kees de Jager in a statement posted on the Internet last night. He said he is “disappointed” that the agreement hasn’t yet come into effect.

Perhaps you missed the key phrases "trying to negotiate" and "he is 'disappointed' that the agreement hasn't yet come into effect".

Maybe we can read just fine.  And maybe some of us even know how to see through propaganda.  The media here is pitching this as no big deal:

 

But the referendum was more symbolic than substantive, and the Icelandic government hastened to make clear that Iceland would still pay back the money, albeit on different terms from the ones rejected.

“We want to be perfectly clear that a ‘no’ vote does not mean we are refusing to pay,” Finance Minister Steingrimur Sigfusson said. “We will honor our obligations. To maintain anything else is highly dangerous for the economy of this country.”

(from http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/07/world/europe/07iceland.html)

because you don't want the 'people' getting any ideas that you can 'just say no' to bankers.  But if you read further: 

But the vote has been overtaken by events, the government said: the deal at issue in the referendum is no longer the deal that is currently on the table in international negotiations.

Key phrase being "on the table".  So maybe it is a little premature to say the referendum was pointless.  My guess is that if they don't pass something, Iceland will be 'made an example of'.

 

 

by DaveyJones
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 01:28
#256710

Good Interview with Birgitta Jonsdottir of "the movement" in Iceland on Max Keiser in January. All about the public rejecting the private debt and the underlying illegality of it all. Guess the icelandic bankers are hiding in london somewhere. We need leaders like this with an ethical spine and an ounce of courage.  "it's time for the people of the world to revolt against these bankers"

 http://maxkeiser.com/2010/01/14/kr08-the-keiser-report-markets-finance-scandal/   (at 14 mins)

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:56
#256867

Thank you DJ.  Right on time.  I couldn't remember where I had seen that and I failed to properly bookmark it.

by dumpster
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 02:08
#256722

china will step in ,, fund a nice sea port,,

or russia,, the east meets the west ,, touche'

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 04:12
#256743

sorry but it seems only 33% of the vote has been counted...they will manage to change teh remaining votes in their favour...

93% of 33% votes...

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 05:55
#256753

I was a UK customer of Icesave and got my money back from the Financial Services Authority. At the time I was totally dumb in financial matters and my reason for opening a SAVINGS account was that it was covered by the FSA compensation scheme. I would not have opened one if it wasn't covered by that scheme.

The interest rate paid was about 0.5% more than other accounts but remember back then that there were a number of institutions offering 5% + interest on internet savings accounts. To me 0.5% more than others did not ring alarm bells but then what did I know?

I have undergone an education of sorts in financial matters
since that time through following this site and others and I agree with what the Icelanders are doing as I firmly believe that ultimately the UK government is to blame for the fiasco (not withstanding the prime culpability of the Icelandic banksters)

The EU had passed legislation that allowed financial institutions easy access to fellow member states and this resulted in Icesave opening up in the UK. The FSA have claimed that the EU legislation tied there hands when it came to looking into the affairs of a foreign bank even though it was operating in the UK.

So:

1) If the FSA could not treat Icesave the same as any other UK bank why the hell were they allowed to operate in the UK?
2) Why didn't the FSA apprach the government with their concerns if they felt they hands were tied due to EU legislation?
3) If the UK were not members of the EU this would never have happened (in the UK at least).

by Hulk
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:33
#256918

You obviously were not completely dumb anon,
you made sure your money was in an insured account. Many folks and businesses on this side of the pond lost beaucoup bucks by being
over the insurance limits when the likes of
IndyMac failed, before the $250k limit was
put in place and now extended until Dec 31, 2013
This has been an education for all us, thanks
for recounting your experience...

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 15:08
#257060

The *bankers* are to blame--not the governments or the citizens. I am mystified why the bankers that made these extremely risky bets with other people's money aren't prosecuted globally.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 07:17
#256779

I guess people want freedom and not debt slavery afterall. Imagine that.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:09
#256788

If I were an IceSLAVE, I'd start mailing fish to Holland and the UK and to the IMF. I'd also try to find a way to abolish the central bank.

by Miles Kendig
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:58
#256871

Fish are valuable.  Send the fish heads.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 08:46
#256803

Icelanders made my weekend - dont know what the eventual outcome will be though !!

by alexdg
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 09:49
#256823

Too bad this won't make the news, but all those rumors on how the EU is coming up with a brand new help package will make great headlines. Until they get dismissed by Angela Merkl the next day for the thousandth time.

by Frank Owen
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 13:23
#256961

But it did make the news - Zero Hedge is the news. Pulitzer Prize worthy content.

by bugs_
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:04
#256830

He got to say "sublimate".

Yes way to go Icelanders!

"Fire from Ice". 

"Let it burn" is the only solution.  People
cannot carry the burden the state is asking
them to shoulder.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 10:55
#256866

There is another solution. Repatriate most of the wealth stolen from sovereign nations by the banking cartels that bankrupted those nations via military and resultant economic enslavement.

http://funy1.blogspot.com/2010/03/even-sun-eventually-flares-on-usurious.html

It requires the end of usury and instituting a banking system with very low interest rates such as the one controlled by the state of North Dakota.

http://www.prorev.com/2009/03/how-north-dakotas-banking-system-could.html

by Fix It Again Timmy
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:27
#256881

This is all about 5 billion dollars? Hell, Ben and Timmy wouldn't even bother to bend over to pick up that miniscule sum!

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:42
#256890

Well Iceland has a population of 1/1000 of America excatly so this equals 5 trillion $ to USA.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:31
#256883

bravo iceland. there is still strength in the world; or perhaps this is a harbinger of things to come.

by torabora
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 11:42
#256889

Why don't the English and Dutch invade the place and enslave their women?

by SWRichmond
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 13:04
#256946

Guide these aged steps, my servants, forth before the house; support your fellow-slave, your queen of yore, ye maids of Troy. Take hold upon my aged hand, support me, guide me, lift me up; and I will lean upon your bended arm as on a staff and quicken my halting footsteps onwards. O dazzling light of Zeus! O gloom of night! why am I thus scared by fearful visions of the night? O earth, dread queen, mother of dreams that flit on sable wings! I am seeking to avert the vision of the night, the sight of horror which I saw so clearly in my dreams touching my son, who is safe in Thrace, and Polyxena my daughter dear. Ye gods of this land! preserve my son, the last and only anchor of my house, now settled in Thrace, the land of snow, safe in the keeping of his father's friend. Some fresh disaster is in store, a new strain of sorrow will be added to our woe. Such ceaseless thrills of terror never wrung my heart before. Oh! where, ye Trojan maidens, can I find inspired Helenus or Cassandra, that they may read me my dream? For I saw a dappled hind mangled by a wolf's bloody fangs, torn from my knees by force in piteous wise. And this too filled me with affright; o'er the summit of his tomb appeared Achilles' phantom, and for his guerdon he would have one of the luckless maids of Troy.

by Mad Max
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 15:16
#257069

Ironically, all three countries were to a great extent on the "doing" end of that concept a millennium ago.  If we could just get Norway and Denmark involved then this could be the all-Norse financial war.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 12:29
#256917

Tora Tora Bora, Their women are the most baeutiful on the planet, alas their bankers not so much.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 15:09
#257062

WAY TO GO ICELAND! I will be visiting your country for the first time because of your stance against this shit they are trying to pull against the population of your country who were not party to any of the shit pulled. I will come and spend my dollars before they are completely worthless.

by BlackBeard
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:26
#257133

Cash economy bitches.  That's how you hurt the cunts the most.

by 3ringmike
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 16:47
#257149

To bad about giving up your guns. You might have found them useful in the coming days

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 19:18
#257282

Yes, way to go iceland. Stick it t the man.

by Anonymous
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 20:31
#257318

I find it amusing to see how many people here are willing to take stand without actually having enough information to achieve an objective opinion. I am puzzled by reactions that seem to indicate that international communities are money hungry institutions, and should not bitch and moan about Iceland saying no to every single agreement so far. Yet, the whole reason for the need of such an agreement is because an Iceland bank was build on this whole money hungry principal to begin with. It is the same freaking reason why Icelandic people voted "no"; it would cost them too much money.

What I mostly read here is people saying that it is okay to make money, live in health and wealth for years, decades, and when it's time to take responsibility,... it is perfectly fine to only take partial responsibility,.. or none at all. It's okay to steal and not do time when you're caught. You have to be totally retarded to think the Icelandic people are victims, and that it's okay for millions of tax payers in the UK and the Netherlands to pay for something Iceland has benefited from for years and years.

In the end, not paying back 100% (and 100% is more below the line when you take inflation into account) is not acceptable. Iceland more than deserve its Junk Status,.. it also should be rewarded with a full boycott from the international community. Iceland was one of the richest countries on the planet for decades, I'm pretty sure they can get used to live with a little more modesty and less wealth. This is a matter about not being willing to take responsibility. If 93% reject another agreement it means that 93% are willing to face international results because they're afraid their little Icelandic wallet might look less full. What about the wallet of the millions of British and Dutch tax payers? Let them just pay for and Iceland mess? Very realistic.

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 03:36
#257538

Hey old son they owe 20,000 euros per man women and child and they just said we can't pay'
If your an American, the sad news is you owe 6 x more and your on the hook for it. Now what are you going to do. Your going to wake up one day in a land you don't own, in a house you don't own and without a voice to cry foul ball. How that will feel I can only guess. Maybe a bit like Alice in Wonderland.
I can only wonder at the Roman Empire and the peoples thoughts as they found out - no ones got your back your on your LOANsome. Personally I think if you scream at the top of your lungs from a High building they will think you a terrorist and shoot you dead. That would be a Win Win situation for all. But In reality you and 325 million decent freedom loving Americans need to grow some testicles and stand up and say " I mad, I am Mad as hell and I'm not going to take It any more" Maybe Network was your Nadir and then you turned off the Video and went to sleep in your Simmons fluffy bed. Sad really = reality is not the ending you hoped for or expected

by Anonymous
on Tue, 03/09/2010 - 07:46
#259001

That made no sense at all. It didn't even scratch the surface of "sense". And apart from that, I am not American, so your whole incoherent rambling holds no ground. So put your history, Wonderland and terrorists back into your little trick bag and start getting some facts before you speak. After that, feel free to play with your testicles.

Basically things can be broken down very simple; If a government fucks up, it is responsible. The people that voted that government into power, are DIRECTLY responsible for the actions of that government. They trust their government with big discussions and choices. If that government fails, the people are still responsible. The fact that the result of unfortunate events might be dramatic for some families, does not mean that the country as a whole can walk away from this, just because someone said that EVERY Icelandic person has a debt of 20.000 Euros. That is simply twisting facts in order to win national and international sympathy. It's a shame many people are pathetic enough to fall for that.

It's nice to be sympathetic,.. but this is about taking responsibility. Iceland has profited from the financial sector for a long time, and so has its population. You don't think they became one of the wealthiest countries on the planet by selling fish, do you??

If I am going to stand up for myself and say something,.. I am going to scream that I am not going to take it anymore,.. from these Icelandic robbers that took my hard earned tax money. But then I guess I would be just as bad as some Icelandic inhabitants I guess,.. I would be looking at my own wallet instead of what is right or wrong. Iceland is biting itself in the ass right now. Let's hope they like fish over there,... seems like it's going to be on the menu for a long time. Business is not likely to target Iceland when it keeps portraying unreliability and instability.

by Anonymous
on Mon, 03/08/2010 - 03:48
#257540

Hey old son they owe 20,000 euros per man women and child and they just said we can't pay'
If your an American, the sad news is you owe 6 x more and your on the hook for it. Now what are you going to do. Your going to wake up one day in a land you don't own, in a house you don't own and without a voice to cry foul ball. How that will feel I can only guess. Maybe a bit like Alice in Wonderland.
I can only wonder at the Roman Empire and the peoples thoughts as they found out - no ones got your back your on your LOANsome. Personally I think if you scream at the top of your lungs from a High building they will think you a terrorist and shoot you dead. That would be a Win Win situation for all. But In reality you and 325 million decent freedom loving Americans need to grow some testicles and stand up and say " I mad, I am Mad as hell and I'm not going to take It any more" Maybe Network was your Nadir and then you turned off the Video and went to sleep in your Simmons fluffy bed. Sad really = reality is not the ending you hoped for or expected

by Trifecta Man
on Sun, 03/07/2010 - 21:13
#257346

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