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After Nearly Two Years Of Searching, TrimTabs Still Can't Figure Out Who Is Buying Stocks
A year after Charles Biderman's provocative post first appeared on Zero Hedge, in which he asked just who is doing all the buying of stocks as the money was obviously not coming from retail investors (and came up with one very notable suggestion), today Maria Bartiromo invited the TrimTabs head once again (conveniently in CNBC's lowest rated show, during Christmas Eve eve, at a time when perhaps 5 people would be watching) in an interview which disclosed that after more than a year of searching, Biderman still has no idea who actually buying. In response to Bartiromo's question if the retail investor, who left after the flash crash (thank you SEC), Biderman responds what every Zero Hedger has known for 33 weeks: "Retail investors are not coming back to the US. Those investors that are investing are buying global equities and are buying commodities. We are seeing lots money going into commodity ETF funds: gold, silver..." and the even more unpleasant summation: "individuals have been selling, companies are net selling, insider selling and new offerings are swamping any buyback and any cash M&A activity since QE 2 was announced. Pension funds and hedge funds don't really have that much cash to invest. So what nobody's asking is what happens when QE 2 stops: if the only buyer is the Fed, and the Fed stops buying, I don't know what is going to happen...When I was on your show a year ago I was saying the same thing: we can't figure out who is doing the buying it has to be the government, and people said I was nuts. Now the government is admitting it is rigging the market." Cue Bartiromo jaw dropping.
As for the simple math of where the money is actually going:
"Money flows come out of income, take home pay of everybody plus money that came from real estate is down about $1 trillion a year. It peaked in the 3rd quarter of 2008, at $7 trillion, that's take home pay for everybody who pays taxes plus the money that came from real estate. It has now bottomed at $5.9 trillion. We are still down $1.1 trillion in money that people have to spend each year, that 16%. And some of the money that is leaving equity markets we think is going to pay bills."
Much more CNBC non-grata truthiness in the full clip, in which Biderman suggest what Zero Hedge readers realized over a month ago, that in June QE3 will likely have at least a partial municipal bond focus.
Update: Charles has just sent in the following addendum to his CNBC appearance:
Due to time constraints, what I didn’t get to address on CNBC today is what will happen after the Fed is either successful or not successful with QE2. The Fed is rigging the market by digitally creating money that is used to buy financial institutions assets — currently Treasuries, last year all kinds of toxic waste. What will happen when the Fed stops buying assets?
What the Fed is hoping is that QE2 actually works and the economy starts growing at 3+%. If that happens, unlikely as it is, then the Fed will end its QE activities. But for the stock market, if the only source of buying power, the Fed, withdraws its support, the market is likely to plunge to well below fair value. At that point perhaps some new source of money , i.e., China, et al will be able to buy US assets on the cheap.
The Fed is legally mandated to manage the economy, not the stock market. If the Fed’s QE is successful and the trickle down impact of higher equities creates a sustainable recovery, the Fed will gladly sacrifice the stock market to its legal mandate to manage the economy.
A more likely outcome is that while stocks will be higher by the end of QE2, economic growth will not be sustainable without government aid. That would then require additional QE. Stock prices could then keep rising for a while. At some unknowable now moment in time, unless the economy starts to grow again, no amount of QE can work forever in keeping the current stock market bubble from bursting.
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#4) There's a reason they are in cash- wealth preservation for future generations. I seriously doubt they are buying anything in December 2010.
This Trust was established by Henry Phipps for his family, and expanded to serve other families. Against the trend of "Rich People Giving Away Their Money", which pitifully continues today with Gates, Buffay, & Zuckerberg (who doesn't have it in the bank yet), its a tribute that they still have a cashpile to speculate about.
Where's that money actually go? If & ever, Non-profit corporations are ever investigated, come to Florida, Pablo Honey, all condo associations are registered as non-profits. That means that thievery goes untaxed, but that's a whole 'nuther story.
RoBo you are right arm ever other way! Great obs always, Onward thru the Fog!
Solid/comprehensive list .
Also , given that we are mere days away from Christmas , how about some more pictures of busty females ? Preferably in santa hats .
Your value to this forum is in providing entertainment. Post T&A pics.
of all the buyers how many taxpayers?
of all the buyers how many willing to purchase
treasuries?
Robot, priceless.
ps, took that long USD/CHF trade just > 0.95 yesterday. Merry Christmas.
The FED may have difficulty explaing the benefits of $100 OIL to the average American, but the upshot for the FED is that in 3 weeks when Oil trades at the 100 mark the average American will have already forgotten the November's $75.
Sounds about right...
You must have had a wet dream after you wrote point number 9.. but the end result is the same.. you just made a mess and someone has to clean it up.
I hope you realize the equity: # of sellers = # of buyers always holds. You don't have enough sellers listed and certainly left off insiders. For example in NFLX over 40% of their total shares (~1.2M) have been sold in the last 6 months while over 56% of all shares held by institutions have been sold in the same time frame (source: Yahoo finance). Yet the price is up about 75% in the same time frame. And the short interest is actually up in the last month (currently 32.4% of float), so not much covering/buying back going on. Pick almost any other high flyer, e.g. CMG, has 21% of all insider shares sold in the last six months, while institutions own 15% fewer shares than 6 months ago, yet the price has increased dramatically. And for CMG the short fraction of float is staying nearly invariant.
My explanation: the prices the fake, fake, fake. Just like paper profits/losses are fake, fake, fake! Just like that fact that in a bank run there's not enough cash/ liquidity to cover any massive attempt to cash out of equities. The prices, like housing prices, are a psychological crutch giving the illusion of wealth, to stimulate "animal spirits".
I hope you realize that your phrasing of the statement "# of sellers = # of buyers" is completely erroneous.
If there are 10 people selling 100 shares each of XYZ, and one buyer purchasing 1000 shares of XYZ, then the number of sellers is TEN TIMES the number of buyers.
The statement should be phrased "equity is # of shares sold = # of shares purchased."
Big difference between pieces of paper (or rather, electronic bits) and living human beings.
All your prospective buyers make sense logically. Now, what evidence do you have to back up your assertions? IOW, your laundry list of prospective buyes fits (logically) with the price action we see, but if the buyers you list were actually as strong as you suggest ("swamped"), esp. against your strawman (Joe 6-pack), we should see prices moving up very strongly. And this seems to be the riddle Trim Tabs is trying to unravel with actual data, as against mere conjecture. Evidence, Robo, to support your claims, please?
I confess, it was me.
"So what nobody's asking is what happens when QE 2 stops: if the only buyer is the Fed, and the Fed stops buying, I don't know what is going to happen."
Good question indeed.
Heh Heh Heh! Fed buying all the stocks, treasuries, munis, and chevy volts. Yeah, this will end well!
Just you wait!
Won't be long now.... the Cass Sunstein Equity and Whateverthefuckelsewedecide Security Proxy Voting Agency.
Gonna end Famously, Fabulously, Brilliantly, Fred Astair and Ginger Rogers Muscial Style.
+1. Twas the night before the night before Christmas, apparently. It's a wonderful life!
Because the answer is obvious. When QE2 stops, QE3 begins. The FED will never stop buying.
Well, I agree that QE3 is already a done deal. Bernake has painted himself into a corner and has no other option.
As far as stocks go, I'm not so certain. I think he'd sacrifice stocks to drive people to bonds in a heartbeat, if rates got too high.
They have done both and they will continue to do both. Stop thinking the FED has to decide between one or another (of anything). With a printing press, they can have their cake and eat it too.
Sorry, I have to disagree. The current situation strikes me as slipping out of their supposed control (or the illusion of it). Stocks are so-so, rates are rising, and PM (especially silver) has handed the Bankers heads back to them on a silver platter. And then there's Real Estate starting to collapse again, along with Muni defaults on the horizon.
The printing press only works as long as the Bond Market lets it. When Credit is restricted (even more), then the game is over. And no printing press is going to help you with that one.
How can money constantly be created, with the excuse 0.00% rates don't COST anything?
REPAYMENT, BITCHEZ !!
until the dollar is worthless.
In the immortal words of D. Tepper 9/24/10, "Balls To The Wall!"
Unfortunately, If you have ever experienced a head-on car crash, that's what happens and it is VERY painful for males, unless you have an airbag for testicles.
Tepper: http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232/?video=1598913851&play=1
Wow just accept the market rigging and then commenting how it's up and that's good...
It's called "double-think" for a reason.
We're sending you back to the Peoples' Education Center for Moral Purity until you get it right.
...
I meant to say that it's great that the market is up and it's wonderful that the Federal Reserve is using it's infinite wisdom to boost the market. I'm sure a chocolate ration increase is soon to.
With some rocket bombs to make you thankful.
What a noob. Gravity is what happens. Basic Newtonian non-relativistic physical constants FTW. Okay now ask me a really hard one. I'm hot today.
The Gravititational Pull is coincided with a levitating floor. When there is a collective cohesive decline in global currency, anything priced it in it will go up.
Spoon boy: Do not try and analyze the market. That's impossible. Instead... only try to realize the truth.
Neo: What truth?
Spoon boy: There is no market.
Neo: There is no market?
Spoon boy: Then you'll see, that it is not the market that moves, it is only The Bernank.
A few years ago I was wondering how the gang was going spin the real recovery.
It really sucks to see you guys whining like this.
I thought you would have more grace. Maybe a long term accurate prediction of when the wheels will come off the wagon for good. You seems to have a reasonably amount of intelligence, but you tend to think too much in the now.
Bernank outsmarted you and performed a great confidence game, one for the history books.
Well.....I'm afraid arguing with you would be like trying to explain the color blue to someone who has been blind from birth.....and I ain't no Rocky Dennis!
As far as "long-term predictions" go.....how long can shit float when there's an asshole underneath it holding it up??? Nobody really knows for sure!
T.E.I.N. everyone!
The Exalted Inuit Nomad?
+10 for creativity..but what else would a financial doomsday prophet say?
The Exalted Inuit Nomad = The End is Now
Works for me.
The Bernank Was Wrong
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QpD64GUoXw
Plesase someone make an updated version of this.
Warning! Listening to The Bernank for too long can be painful.
"..it has to be the government"
One has to wonder given the number of articles on how this isn't a stock pickers market since US stocks seem to all be diverging to a Beta of 1. The most obvious answer would be massive index buying by the Fed.
QE to infinity.
Print, print, and print somemore.
Distort every market.
Treasuries, FX, muni's, the stock market, and the metals markets.
The day of reckoning is getting closer and closer.
Is the zero hedge community the only place these things get an airing?
Thank you TD!
Trying to warn people that inflation is going to get really bad and that the
magnitude of the underlying problems is so sever that nothing can stop this
trainwreck.
PM's and prayer!
The Plunge Protection Team on extended deployment...ah, but of course. The PPT is the stuff of legend.
...And agreed: gravity is most certainly a bitch.
Maria not looking too good, time for her to host an italian cooking show...
Yup.
http://www.ciaoitalia.com/
Yeah, Maria looks like Janet Neapolitano these days.
Nobody's buying my gold juniors goddammit! Don't they think I want the cash or something?
No, as I keep saying the 'money' is going to bonds, mostly of the government variety, whether it be US or increasingly Swiss, Canadian, Australian etc. Why do you think these currencies are appreciating against the USD? There was a report a couple of days ago that there is a 'shortage' of Australian government debt, yet issuance has tripled in the last 2 years!
Some 'money' is going to gold too.
Don't you just love it when those mortgage-holding suckers are paying your coupons? :)
Yeah, I'm earning my 6% on my cash, and I am hedging against systemic risk with Silver.
Used to be a doomer, but then I got smart and decided to play the middle.
Oh God this validates everything I've been saying and thinking since 09! The stock market is 'boeing' used to recap corporate America on the sly and on the cheap. Much cheaper than if they wrote bonds. Of course secondaries are swamping any buybacks (thank you, TrimTabs). And despite being dilutional the price rarely drops in response. Magic? I don't think so.
You see, we're at a point in uncharted territory where even cheap liquidity at near zero rates was not enough to plug the giant holes not just in balance sheets but in funding for ongoing operations, especially considering the depressed levels of demand in the economy! That's one of the key secrets to understand: March 09 was engineered because not only was there insolvency in most of the S&P500, but there would have been even more massive layoffs, shutdowns, and of course defaults. Many of the shiniest of US companies (I'm looking your way, GE!) needed tons of monthly cash just to roll their massive debt. And in addition to that they needed cash just to meet payroll and open the doors in the morning because business was frozen and the cost structure of operations was geared to 2007 peak-bubble expense levels. Not to mention paying dividends to keep up appearances and not spook away huge amounts of nervous foreign capital that American corps need to buy their debt and keep the stock market from crashing (and the Fed needs too ).
So the buyer of last resort is in fact the buyer of only and first resort (a quip from Tyler). Here's a further point: the Fed hoped in 09 that recaping and fixing the balance sheets to allow "massive cash on the balance sheets" would suffice to restart M&A and allow enough time for general demand to pick up. They were wrong. Demand has not returned and is not coming back any time soon. But it's worse than that: the explicit policies of the Fed and monetarists in Washington since the 1970s has ben to build massive overcapacity in the general economy to offset inflationary pressures. Well, they're paying for that now that demand levels are in the cellar and housing is still deflating. Corporations will not use the cash they have to hire or for big Capex. They understand their markets. And if the QE spigot gets turned off we'd be right back to March 09 in a hurry.
+
This would assume that their policies were trying to help the average joe, when in reality every piece of legislation and every financial policy has been for the purpose of transferring power to the federal government.
you mean the elite that are running the federal government (along with most other things)
I am a newbie... I work in the business but I'm a software guy. This is all fascinating stuff.
I am stuck on fundamental definition stuff. It seems to me that if the 'OPEN' part of POMO meant open info to us (the public) , all of the rest would take care of itself naturally. The secrecy makes all of this sound cloak-and-dagger. Why? I know the answer I think... but WHY?
They have to invent new ways to say they are printing money.
If TrimTabs can't figure it out, there is not anyone posting here who can either. Perhaps Ron Paul can pull back the curtains a little. As for WHY? It's all about recapitalizing the banks... at any price, and at any social deficit. No other reason needed.
"uncharted territory" you said it - in corruption, debt, resource exhaustion, consolidation and other things
Cheap liquidity is All they have left. Protect yourself.
The market is not priced in terms of inflows/outflows (supply/demand).
The FED probably doesn't even bother anymore rigging in terms of actually putting money in the market. Why not control the exchange, hence can alter prices at will
I've been buying and selling a bit. Riding the trend. I'm into coal, oil, and ag right now. Just this and that, in and out. I've stopped buying silver gold and palladium due to the price rise over the past year.
Can I haz pomo now please?
Every other post talks about money flowing out of equities. Yet for every dollar flowing out there is a dollar flowing in, for every seller their is a buyer. All that is really happening is the price that buyers and sellers agree on is changing. Why is the "money flowing" myth so hard to kill on this site?
Yup, for every dollar flowing out there is a shiny brand new made up digital dollar flowing in. Noted.
You don't get it. The point here is not so much the price of stocks and what is making them rise in the absence of demand.
The point is that the Fed's policy is short circuiting supply/demand and price discovery mechanisms of the market. And that has a larger spillover effect in the general economy which I and others here believe is actually providing an insurmountable obstacle to growth in the real economy and future economic stability.
You can think of it as the junkie is addicted to liquidity and can never get back to health without drastic therapy. But it's actually a whole lot worse. The Fed has resurrected corpses of the last economy (AIG anybody) like Dr Frankenstein and these are costly errors in that they prevent new growth opportunities for young/new entrants. The cancer is not being resected and instead is being encouraged to grow. It can kill the patient and the longer it saps what's left of vitality, the harder it will be to change course.
++
Yep,
There's one other important detail to remember, propping up stocks isn't just a really stupid, counterproductive idea, it's the law.
(2) to ensure that such authority and such facilities are used in a manner that—(A) protects home values, college funds, retirement accounts, and life savings; (B) preserves homeownership and promotes jobs and economic growth; (C) maximizes overall returns to the taxpayers of the United States; and (D) provides public accountability for the exercise of such authority. http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/12/usc_sec_12_00005201----000-.html
well said
...Market Zombification...they are up and, well kind of walking, but there is something not quite right....Ben is hoping for a Hollywood ending to his nightmare....
@Bonz
Read it again:
Who are the buyers? Who?
Zero-Hedge rules!
Everyone's looking for the retail buyer...but I would say the retail investor is a contrarian indicator, not an indicator of market strength.
Citi has to be part of the smoking gun to this issue.
On Dec 7th (think of Buffet's Economic Pearl Harbor) the government sold 2.4 billion shares at $4.35 for a net of $10.5 billion.
Since then (and after a S&P re-balancing), the stock has risen to about $4.70 with more than 29 billion shares outstanding. With a market cap (MKTCP) of $126b, a whopping 57% is held by other than institutions and insiders. The MKTCP of GS is $86b.
At $7, Citi would far surpass Berkshire which stands at $198b and challenge Microsoft for 3rd largest.
You don't need to examine the entire market to see who's funding the market, all you need is to see who owns Citi.
Like Saudis and Indians?
Bartiromo looks more and more like someone's uncle with each passing year. That Janet Napolitano haircut does not help.
It's obvious from the sniffling while cutting away from her that Maria has a cold today.
And that's not a haircut -- her hair is simply pulled back.
I think she's still got her smokin' hotness!
Now LEAVE MARIA ALONE...!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmvkRoEowc
Go ahead and harvest the rotton decaying crustacions from her dried up wrinkled twat, that is if it hasn't sealed up already.... Huh?
If you continue to hold back your feelings, you might get an ulcer. Tell us what you really think.
I have a super advanced degree in Comparative Physical Anthropology from...well, lets not go there, huh? but anyway, I have examined the crusty things you refer to, and they are not modern crustaceans, but ancient fragments of Trilobites from the Early Cambrian period. Modern science has no idea how they came to be there, but...despite their age, they taste pretty much like soft shell crabs.
Congrats, I now pass on the torch to you, for saying and responding with something more idiotic and moronic than my initial post. Please take good care of her.
I always go for the extremes...even in Italians.
Endangered species ALWAYS taste better.
Good point.....
Many became so because they taste better.
http://www.glumbert.com/media/genescott
Well, its Christmas eve eve, so what better time than a nice Christmas message from the dear departed Dr. Gene Scott, oh the memories....
Yup, retail dumping US stocks and gobbling up commodities & international equity.
This is great news, because as we all know, retail is always the "smart" money, right?
This is great for gold & silver, right?
BTW, poor Maria has a cold today. But she's still hot! Oo-fah....
I trimmed HER hedge once - just a small, inconspicuous racing stripe that blended well with her abdomen fat.
QE3 will be singing a new tune:
"California here I come"
Does Bitemeromo use a black Sharpie on her eyes or was she punched out in a CNBS message pep rally?
She sucks my monkey ass.
Just love Maria Fartaroma's unbiased journalistic brilliance.
MB looks like she got run over by a truck.
I apologize for cyber stalking you tonite. How many more times can I reply to you before you have me arrested?
10 times
OK, nine to go.
ROFL...Touchez. Niceley played.
Ok, 8 to go...
Wow! What a revelatory interview!
Greeting ZHers from Aruba. Spending the holidays here with my fiancé and find that much liquor and turquoise water are about the only thing that can distract me from the daily ponzi propaganda scam in that which was known formally as " The Market".
Anyway if I recall Biederman said claimed the Fed was buying the markets months ago but shortly after went bullish even knowing that the Fed was the only buyer through their proxies.
The answer is nobody is selling or nobody that can make an impact on the market because the big banks have an agreement with Ben not to sell. So if it is true Ben owns enough with the banks of the ETF SPY and copper which is an excellent compass for market direction they simply sit back and let the algos do the buying to artificially inflate the prices. It is literally no different that anti trust price fixing. They can absorb any and all selling because the big banks obviously comprise 63% if all US GDP as Simon Johnson points out and we basically have the result...and that is a market without shorts, 80% converted longs and a never before seen effort to mark up stocks on record low volume to pretend the corner has turned for the economy.
We all know it cannot last and inevitably people will be buying the dip all the way back to Dow 7000 since Ben can never back out of these markets. It will end in tears but who knows when but much like we have a false consumer economy with have the same in the financial markets.
Rates+metals+gas prices+ commodity costs without jobs will eventually force a new reality to what the traders have become so accustomed to but much like nobody saw it coming in 2008 the same will be true when it arrives here and all thise service jobs newly accrued and hanging by a string will vaporize making Lehman look tame an the 700k in job losses.
The worst thing the Fed coil have done is lull along with Washington the populace into thinking that nothing is wrong in the economy and they did.
There will be no help this time because there cannot be so imagine a bottom for a market housing or financial where no Fed intervention has any effect. Diminishing returns and swifter, larger and more dangerous bubbles.
Anyway Merry Christmas ZH
A little diversion.
Cubana de Aviación
http://www.cubana.cu/home/
Excellent low cost healthcare, local currency; US Dollars, excellent food, warm welcome to Americans, rich culture.
Retirement?
Please, please do not take this the wrong way. You are in Aruba with your fiance. Throw the fucking computer into the light blue water, and go snorkling (either way). Sorry.
while in Aruba beware of dissappearing .
Merry Christmas to you, John McCloy. well put.
check out the tranquilo
She has always got that million waiting from Playboy. She will always eat cake.
She better hurry on that Playboy thing...as her ass looks like it has massive hail damage...but, I understand that Hef's boys can make the moon look like a granite countertop.
LMFAO ROTFL - Photoshop "Moon Surface Texture to Granite" feature. Where is William Banzai when you need him!?
I think Willie is off on Flickr examining the surface textures of aged Italian cheeses to find just the right surface incongruities to describe - in art - the epidermal facade of Maria's buttocks.
Yes, but everyone knows that a dimpled ass moves twice as fast as a non dimpled ass provided the same force is applied...
Spin is important too.
It is a known fact that a girl with a dimpled ass has to try harder.
They will continue to throw trillions at it. Market collapses-pension funds collapse... pension funds collapse- cities collapse.... cities collapse and then states collapse. Domino therory.....
Bartiromo wasn't even listening to what he was saying. She has a set of questions to ask no matter the guest, no matter the subject, no matter the sentiment.
It could have gone like this....
Biderman: We follow the NASA Blogs and it appears certain that tomorrow at 3pm an asteroid the size of your butt, Maria, is going to strike somewhere near Keokuk, Iowa and instantly wipe out every last living thing on this doomed planet.
Maria: Yea, yea, Charles. I see, I see. So how should the small retail investor play that? What sectors do you see benefiting from that scenario as we move in oh eleven?
Exactly
+1
Deviate from the script and you get massive thigh sweat.
exactly, she asked him questions twice on things he had already covered.
It's like when my wife said to me "Your not listing to me!" and I replied: "I am listing to you!, What did you say?" and then caught a punch in the arm while driving down the road.
Or...would you put new money into this market environment?
+1
"an asteroid the size of your butt"
Yeah, Maria was looking kind of rough there. Wounder if she went partying last night?
I promised not to tell...but, well, does massive amounts of Cristal, a five star hotel, and a bed that smells like mushrooms in the wee hours mean anything to ya?
growth = speculation = misallocation =
buy silver
You appear out of "focus" there my fine fellow. (ibid: http://www.zerohedge.com/article/fofoa-golds-focal-point-or-silver-money-too)
Out of the nine, Pick the gold star not one of the eight circles. (Like everyone of the people I tested has to date.)
focus? i'm blind ! ... both us? but what about this?
http://maxkeiser.com/2010/12/23/jackie-o-silver-vigilante-visits-nyc/
.
http://maxkeiser.com/2010/12/23/kr106-keiser-report-markets-finance-scandal/
looks like mawia, former sheepshead bay otb clerk, recently swallowed sue herrera.
The mile high tub.
Swallowing SH is a task a tyrannosaurus would find daunting:)
Hey barney baby, how about giving me some of your hot action tonight. I put on my special hat for you, you know the one that you like so much...
I don't want to be anal here, but can you describe the brim in detail and the smell of the crown?
Waiter, he'll have what she's not.
now yaw just bean fweekin pwepostuwuss.
So -- the 90% of the retail trade that always loses money is buying PM ETFs and divesting of US equities. Man it is hard to be a contrarian these days
Poor Maria. I know from experience that when she gets stressed, the insides of her thighs sweat like a fat astronaut in a heat box. This guy smiled at her like a friendly kindergarten teacher as he slid the dagger deep into her capitalist heart. I figure a producer had to come over after that segment and swab off her chair. No more corporate jets and mile-high escapades for you, my Italian beauty. Life is so fucking unfair.
Now this is the funniest fucking thing I've read all day. Thank you.
+1
Your welcome, VS.
So was Trim Tabs remark really CYA-speak for ..... "we think the PTB are using 'public' money to save their ponzi scheme.
And at the bottom of this we find the fed. Why am I not surprised.
Born a hundred years ago with a tried & true formula ...BUY OFF CONGRESS
The fed is different from any entity short of god. For the fed (and god I imagine if
he/she spits out his/her gum and concentrates) can create the worlds reserve currency from thin air... and do so "UNAUDITED". Magic word that.
Whoa... powerful juju.
So the fed (or god) can levitate US Stock Markets.
But not forever. Perhaps not even till the end of 2011.
One wrong move will make the flash crash look like a Trade at the bid.
Markets will be closed for days and open down 20-40%. Some issues might never open with a bid. Merry Xmas
I think them those there breakers kick in before a drop like that, ay?
yeah right..
Note to VeloSpade..
.. no happy w/o Lord Jesus..
.. no holidays w/o Lord Jesus..
.. no Salvation w/o Lord Jesus..
.. no FUN w/o Lord Jesus..
dont take my word for it.. hear it from the mouths of ATHEISTS themselves.. hehe
http://www.youtube.com/amgineco
Have a merry non denominational Festive Season. Please do not return unless you can leave your religious views out of these threads.
and.......with all due respect.....that goofy avatar ain't gonna help your cause. Having said that, I'm with Dismal. Peace, brother
QEn POMO a Go Go! BTFDYFI. There I said it. Is there any one of those seven words that you do not understand? The Amerikan economy: It's like every fiat lovin, McDonalds eating, Chevy drivin, military suportin, Amerikan dropping to their knees to give Lloyd Blankfein a knob job.
Jesus......so if I like Fords I can avoid that knee-drop-knob-job thing?
Interesting thread. Seeing how people react to Maria says that the hot anchor = ratings success is true. Which I find strange in a world where pornography is everywhere. You can walk out (in the summer anyway) and find far more dangled, fair flesh than you could shake a stick at. Yet, the boyz here are still in-fat-you-ate-it. Strange.
But on topic, it is not merely an American phenom. Everywhere, hot dollars are doing th ebidding of who-ever it is is puling levers. Iindia's stock market is gyrating higher while it is well known that IT companies are completely at the mercy of their three largest markets (US, EU, Oz) and could come a cropper anytime. Yes, "retail" investors provide some froth, but in terms of numbers, it's all institutional, all the time.
Makes sense, now that most easy money has been looted, that the game will move towards an eventual cannibalization game. After all, in a dog-eat-dog capitalist world, there is only one top dog.
The stock market.
What a joke.
Have an insightful start to 2011. You/we will need all our wits, gathered. The rest is just dis-traction.
Why in the world would you like to be dis-tracted? Slippery slope? Only with a good pair of skiis for me.
Be well.
ORI
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com
I think our Maria worship is borne of sarcasm and lives on sadism.
With a grain "I really really want her" too Aristar, ne?
I can smell it! From all the way here in In Dia.
ORI
Nah...I talk a lot, but I am too old for that kind of business....or at least my wife tells me I am.
;-) Mind games Aris.
ORI
Not really....my true love is Sarah Palin:)
same to you.
http://maxkeiser.com/2010/12/23/ted-butler-for-all-those-who-watched-the-historic-cftc-meeting-december-16th-on-position-limits-no-your-eyes-didn%e2%80%99t-deceive-you-%e2%80%93-the-meeting-ended-strangely-and-abruptly/
.
Ted Butler Commentary
December 21, 2010
"..
I have to speculate on what I think the CFTC will find when they examine JPMorgan’s swap book. Mine is not a new speculation, but one I had written about before in many article, starting more than 7 years ago. When the CFTC opens JPMorgan’s swap book, I believe they will find it littered with Chinese names. Here’s an article from a year ago that also contains links to earlier articles on this theme http://news.silverseek.com/TedButler/1252075929.php
JPMorgan must have some reason to justify the big concentrated COMEX silver short position. If they claim that they are long silver OTC swap positions as an offset to their COMEX short position, it becomes critical that the CFTC inquire who is holding the short side of the OTC silver swaps. My belief is that it will be Chinese interests on the short side of the swap. Such a finding will lead the CFTC to conclude that it is really China holding the concentrated silver short position and they are using JPMorgan and the CME Group as their dupes to carry out the silver manipulation. This wouldn’t absolve JPMorgan or the CME for enabling China to manipulate silver, but actually make it worse. A foreign super power and clear rival to US national interests being aided and abetted in the serious market crime of manipulation in the price of a vital world commodity by leading US financial firms is almost too outrageous to contemplate. Yet that is exactly what I think has occurred."
.
Read it yesterday, shocking but not surprising.
It's the Chinese/Arab Axis soon to make mince-meat of pretenders.
ORI
Oh where or where has my buttheadcat gone. Oh where oh where can he be?
Thanks so much TD for being all over this. You were right and never doubted. This is big stuff and most people are just unaware and it's black box to them. Clearly, even the "so-called" experts are clueless, or complicit, about what the hell is going on.
It's been said that the banking cartels will always win because they're smarter than everybody else and they control the government. But it's not about IQ, it's about access to the truth. Thanks for continuing to give us what we need.
The big issue of our time is whether self government can survive self-aware institutionalized sociopathy.
(d)
Sorry sir, you can't say people were at a threshold of $7T and now down to $5.9T and that they "had" to spend at the $7T rate. Had to?
This man should know better that that. Bubbles are over inflated hence bubble. At 16% down, maybe, just maybe, we're where we should be... Even if the air to sustain the balloon is placated by the Fed.
I have a question. The federal reserve buys $1b in bonds from jpm,does the federal reserve increase jpm's reserve account at the fed by $1b? This would then allow jpm to have $9b of more funds to buy equities(a 10% reserve requirement). I would like someone to clarify this for me.
i don't know but i'd bet they could lend 9 b to some entity
that could do that and i'd bet they could borrow 9 b from
that same entity and then they could do that. ?
REPUBLICAN,
Sorry, cash is cash. Sure some banks could have
simply sold bonds on the market but that is
only true if there is an effective enough Bid. Do you
think the Banks could sell a cool Trillion n Treasuries on
the open market and not depress the price? There are
always going to be conversion costs, especially if
the banks were to collectively sell Treasuries.
I want to point out that since QE2
began, bond yields have INCREASED. What does
that say?
You have to be mindful of what we are talking about.
We are not talking about BOX OREOS.. we are talking
about Credit--- which inherently involves Confidence.
We are talking about Markets which involve Human
Actors: you cannot adapt this binary view that
converting bonds into cash is just an "accounting gimmick."
Ultimately all participants in any Market will make
decisions in their own self interest. The Banks care
about the Banks, not the US GOV. And same with
everyone else holding Treasuries, except the Fed.
And if Treasuries far fall enough, they will sell
them.
Why would they not? These are nations we are
talking about, not wishful thinkers. They are
professionals who will sell not sit and hope
some Politician will fix the debt problem.
People may be naive, but the collective Markets
are not. Any adjustments by the Fed to unwind
its position is going to cause serious CONCERN
in the Treasury Market. Its not so simple as
savings to checking. Cash is immediate liquidity
which can be used to escape by banks in a Crisis.
Treasuries must first be converted to Cash then
used to escape. Not exactly ideal when you
consider the PROBLEM is IN treasuries. Cash is the
medium of escape, not Treasuries. QE2 is the
fabric of the parachute. Okay, thats a little far!
All else said I agree with you that
the relationship to stock prices suggested in
the interview has NOT been demonstrated...
/edit blank space removed