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Al-Jazeera Confirms Iran Nuclear And Industrial Sites Crippled By Stuxnet, Time To Go Long Symantec?

Tyler Durden's picture




 

After last week's Stuxnet disclosures, it was only a matter of time before the viral sabotage was flushed into the open, with Iran confirming that it had been in fact attacked. As expected, Al-Jazeera has just confirmed that not only has Bushehr been infected, but so have numerous other industrial sites all over Iran. Yet despite the pervasive attack, "no damage or disruption of nuclear facilities has yet been reported, however." What is surprising is that Iran has made such a major media splash on the topic: one would assume that demonstrating such broad cyberdefensive weakness would not be in the country's favor...

More from Al-Jazeera:

Iran's nuclear agency is trying to combat a complex computer worm that has affected industrial sites throughout the country and is capable of taking over the control systems of power plants, Iranian media reports have said.

Experts from the Atomic Energy Organisation of Iran met this week to discuss how to remove the malicious computer code, or worm, the semi-official Isna news agency reported on Friday.

Isna said the malware had spread throughout Iran, but did not name specific sites affected.

Foreign media reports have speculated the worm was aimed at disrupting Iran's first nuclear power plant, which is to go online in October in the southern port city of Bushehr.

Speaking to Al Jazeera, Rik Ferguson, a senior security adviser at the computer security company Trend Micro, described the worm as "very sophisticated".

"It is designed both for information theft, looking for design documents and sending that information back to the controllers, and for disruptive purposes," he said.

"It can issue new commands or change commands used in manufacturing.

"It's difficult to say with any certainty who is behind it. There are multiple theories, and in all honesty, any of of them could be correct."

Perhaps now is a good time to buy some SYMC: after all, it will be somewhat difficult for Iran to go on an anti-virus program piracy raid mission with everyone focused on the country's troubles. And with Iran suddenly in dire need of legitimate virus protection to go with its extensive Win95-backed infrastructure, could the $12 billion anti-virus company suddenly be an LBO target for those who wish to capitalize on the sales surge of the Norton product suite?

 

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Sat, 09/25/2010 - 13:50 | 604366 Village Idiot
Village Idiot's picture

"one would assume that demonstrating such broad cyberdefensive weakness would not be in the country's favor..."

 

...PSYCHE!!   lol

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 07:47 | 605282 More Critical T...
More Critical Thinking Wanted's picture

Perhaps now is a good time to buy some SYMC

I'd like to offer a contrarian view here.

The technical truth is that antivirus vendors have no chance against attacks like this - today's anti-virus software is fundamentally feedback based, i.e. it only protects after a breach has been detected. It does not protect against the likes of Stuxnet, which used several zero-day (unknown before) vulnerabilities in Windows.

A smarter way to play this for any nation state (or, savvy investor) would be to go with an OS that has security designed in, not patched in after the fact.

Linux (and Android) would be a good example. For years Linux has been dominant in several critical infrastructure markets - such as webservers - still remote malware infections are a rare exception under Linux  - while the Windows based IIS webserver, despite being smaller in market-share, has a much higher malware rate.

I.e. it is not true that more widely used software is more vulnerable because it gets more attention from attackers. Properly designed software can be safer even if it has tens of millions of users. Good security does not dilute with more users - it becomes stronger.

Android (which is Linux based) has a similarly good security track record, and it's on tens of millions of phones, so it has become a prime target for attackers.

If all desktops were running Android we'd likely have a much lower malware infection rate - and the desktop wouldn't run so slow due to antivirus overhead either. (If you ever wondered why those Android phones are so snappy.)

Now it's not just a matter of convenience anymore, it's all a matter of national security as well. These markets are going to be interesting in the years to come.

To play this would be to go short SYMC (and MSFT), and go long Windows alternatives (GOOG, etc.). YMMV.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:46 | 605425 trav7777
trav7777's picture

Android?  WTF are you nuts?

Google is an infection and they are in bed with the State security apparatus.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 11:24 | 605478 More Critical T...
More Critical Thinking Wanted's picture

they are in bed with the State security apparatus.

So is Microsoft, so what's your point precisely?

If you dont trust Google, pick any of the other Android vendors (or Linux vendors). It's open source so there are other vendors you can choose from - while with Windows there's obviously only Microsoft you can choose. That lack of competition shows up in the absymal state of Windows security.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 21:28 | 606275 gruden
gruden's picture

You're right about Symantec.  I've seen it stand idly by while browser-based malware steps in and does its thing. 

 

However, your linux suggestion may not be very helpful.  The reason they're running on windows is because their Siemens controller apps were written for windows. 

 

Besides, I've done linux support in the past.  There were critical security patches being released every month that we had to apply to the linux servers.  While windows is a convenient target, the sophistication of this virus and the likelihood that it was state-backed means that the OS really isn't the issue.  If the Siemens industrial software was running on linux, they would've found a different set of vulnerabilities to use against it.  If you think linux is immune, you're fooling yourself.  Locked-down linux servers can get compromised too (yes, they can).

Mon, 09/27/2010 - 03:43 | 606691 More Critical T...
More Critical Thinking Wanted's picture

 

If you think linux is immune,

It's certainly not immune - so what I do is that I look at the track record of Windows and Linux based server software and check the malware infection stats. Linux wins hands down even in markets where Linux is the dominant force. (webservers, mailservers, etc.)

We obviously have no controlled experiment yet about Linux on the desktop - but Android is shaping up to be such an example: it's on tens of millions of devices today and is projected to be on 500 million devices by 2015. So far there's basically zero malware on Android - which is unheard of from a generic consumer platform so large and so widespread.

Interestingly, there's no antivirus software for Android at all because it makes no sense under its security design: unlike on Windows on Android there's no ambiguous vectors of information propagation that can both be virii or legit software or documents. An E-Mail attachment cannot contain malware or a legitimate executable code embedded in a .DOC file. Etc.

But yeah, when it comes to the future few things are certain so I dont claim this is what will happen.

It's an interesting proposition nevertheless if you look to make money on mismatches in long tail risks: that the downfall of Windows will be its lack of security design. (and security is not something you can design in after the fact - because Microsoft is a captive of its own compatibility requirements. It tried and failed to change the security model with Vista. So either the current security model of Windows will survive [together with antivirus software, etc.], or another platform will take over.)

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 13:49 | 604367 JimRogers
JimRogers's picture

DEAD007

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 13:49 | 604368 suteibu
suteibu's picture

Or perhaps they were using Norton and it failed to stop the worm.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:22 | 604441 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

norton = sewertech (sewertech = symantech)

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:42 | 604458 tom
tom's picture

As far as I understand stuxnet defeated every commercial anti-virus program. It was identified by a Belarusian cyber security company through some more exhaustive testing of an infected Iranian computer. I'm not sure if they were called in because of something suspicious or if it was a routine check.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 13:55 | 604373 Howard_Beale
Howard_Beale's picture

Tyler,

"As expected, Al-Quaeda has just confirmed that not only has Bushehr been infected, but so have numerous other industrial sites all over Iran."

I think you meant Al-Jazeera.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:39 | 604896 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

+1 on confusion on so many levels. - Ned

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 23:24 | 605049 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Ted says "Osama Obama."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APx2YJ-_jos

 

Obama Osama name Mixups Volume 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ID91mi5c0OQ

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 11:15 | 605471 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

bush approved the substitution

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 13:59 | 604393 francismarion
francismarion's picture

If this were true it would mean the complexion of the entire world has changed.

Whatever its unintended consequences, for the moment, peace seems closer.

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:05 | 604406 TobyJones
TobyJones's picture

I can't see how it would possibly be in Iran's interest to publicly state that they were attacked by Isreal.  I'm sure that they won't have any reason to respond.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 20:07 | 604788 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

I think it's relatively safe to assume that Iranian techies are working on something in reply, maybe that looks for Hebrew language pack versions of Windows?

And if they succeed, then we have us a black swan, because Israel already has nukes, don't they?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:14 | 604854 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

In other news, Ahmadinezad may be just another Israeli agent and he planted the virus himself.

After all, he was born in Israel. His rhetoric is a front.

http://israelinsider.net/profiles/blogs/oy-vay-ahmadinejad-was-born-a

I know power plants and the operators have overrides on all fail safe systems and can shut down over-speeding turbines, cooling water failures, overheating, valve activation/deactivation and many others. Most systems have redundancy and in nuclear double redundancy.

Barring sleeping on the job or incompetence, nothing like that can happen.

Nothing is what appears to be.  

Sell all stocks, buy physical gold, love your wife, hug your kids and sleep well.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 02:48 | 605199 foofoojin
foofoojin's picture

I know PLC programming and worked with the HART protocal and the Field Guide Protocal where those "fail safe sytems" are implemented. two wires and  $135 frequency shifting modem hooked up to a wireless usb device paired with a yogi antena and i OWN the power plant. water cools nuclear reactores. it take less then 20 packets of data to change f to c on that tempurature sensor. about 30 packets to change the range it sending back on. that range is sent back as a 4 to 20 mA signal.  what if i change the "too hot" signal of the reporting range so the device never tells the operator there a problem? 

do you know that mistubishi read only mode for there PLC is on the client side. the only reason it read only is because the software is told that. if i command a write to the plc with none defaut software. it writes. sure there a hard switch that make it read only. but guess what. noone over flips it on in case there an emergency and they need remote in cause the plant had a toxic spill.

are you aware that almost always defaut passwords are used cause if ther a problem they cant call the plant guy at 3 am and expect him to know 4 thousand passwords off the top of his head.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:27 | 605398 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

You don't have much time in U.S. nuclear units or CANDUs, so you?  Nor in large central station plants. Kinda' different from the IPP world. - Ned

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 09:11 | 605345 aldousd
aldousd's picture

Lol.. The Hebrew language pack? I'm pretty sure that you're underestimating the sophistication of people, Iranian or other, when they are sufficiently motivated. But it would be funny if that's what they actually did, agreed.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:07 | 604411 nevadan
nevadan's picture

Or perhaps another excuse for Iran to ratchet things up against Israel...

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 09:44 | 605362 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

LMAO... you're funny...  Unless that was sarcasm, that was the dumbest comment i've seen on here in at least a week..

Christ, even MSM doesn't take such an absurd approach to the subject..

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 13:10 | 605609 e1618978
e1618978's picture

It is in Iran's best interest to ratchet things up.  They want to keep things on the brink of war, since that is the only thing stopping the price of oil from dropping to $20/barrel, and Iran needs the price of oil to stay high (or go higher).

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 13:23 | 605624 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

what the fuck are you smoking.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 17:28 | 605948 e1618978
e1618978's picture

Oil storage is near an all time high, I think it is pretty clear that the price of oil would drop a lot without the threat of war with Iran.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 21:22 | 606271 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

Iran isn't the only one that would like higher oil prices.   fact is they haven't gone to war over it like some other countries. 

 

still calling bullshit

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:40 | 604898 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

swamp-fox: NO!

- Ned

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:04 | 604403 Amish Hacker
Amish Hacker's picture

The deployment of malware at this level of sophistication, where it takes over power plants and "industrial sites throughout the country," marks a very significant moment in the history of computer technology. Among other things, it will force us re-define what constitutes an act of war, and what would be an appropriate response.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:22 | 604436 Village Idiot
Village Idiot's picture

"Among other things, it will force us re-define what constitutes an act of war, and what would be an appropriate response."

 

More Battleships.

 

 

guess a sarc, win a prize

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:35 | 604668 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

More Battleships.   Only if they are bigger and have more guns than current battleships.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:52 | 604908 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

Not-an-

So I'm on a cot near Manifa Bay, like 2330 local and this god-hellashious sound-CRACK comes from out on the water. wtf???

Turn on the radio to local AFRadio and listen to Peter Jennings say "U.S. has just launched ..."

Yep, more Badgers, Big Mo, even Big Sticks--standoff a good thing.

- Ned

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 00:41 | 605123 Village Idiot
Village Idiot's picture

fire support.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:04 | 604404 samsara
samsara's picture

Hmmm remember the 5 transoceanic cables cut a couple years ago?  Imagine if as soon as they were broke,  500+ miles away another section was surgically cut, splice and routed to a black box.  When the Broken cable was fixed, they would never know of the black box existence.  Imagine tapping into a secure network communicaton....

Crazy stuff happening.

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:38 | 604451 knukles
knukles's picture

Ah, not far from the truth.  Just so happens that the USS Jimmy Carter was in the Med/Middle Eastern area at the same time that the cables there were damaged.  

And for those not aware of the capabilities of the "Jimmy" (God, what an embarrassment...I serve on the Jimmy.) look it up. 
Electroluxe Deluxe.

And shock of shocks, remember the brouhaha and outcry about the importance of the communications failures and how bloody marvelously, quickly, almost magically they were restored?!  Navy already did same in Pacific/Siberian area with the Russians years ago.  Public record.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:31 | 605404 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

"Blind Man's Bluff" -- I always wondered how Crowe came up with all of those ribbons. - Ned

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:33 | 604577 Bob
Bob's picture

I recall reading of an inventor whose attempted patent of a revolutionary underwater cable mending system was nixed by the DoD and his invention seized with meager compensation as a matter of "National Security." 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:38 | 604763 Bearster
Bearster's picture

When people who don't understand economics speculate about markets and gold, they lose money.

Whey they speculate about information assurance, they cause fear.

You can rest assured that technology to defeat so-called "man in the middle" attacks is well deployed, not to mention end-to-end encryption would not be breakable just because you inserted a black box into a cable.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 23:06 | 605028 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

There is a reason certain encryption algos are not exportable. Unless they were using their own homebrew, the "skeleton keys" are already likely in the posession of those who need to know. MD5? SHA1? Compromised. To move to new encryption and data integrity algos, require support by the equipment/software. Not to say they are not on top of it, but these are govt employees we are talking about.

Beyond that, everybody and every ideaology is up for sale to the highest bidder. The weakest link in every security chain, no matter how advanced, is the human link.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 00:19 | 605111 malek
malek's picture

That's pure paranoia.

Use longer key lengths, or apply Triple-DES, Twofish, and AES successively if you are afraid.

It is always a lot easier to infiltrate your endpoint device with a keylogger, or a camera, to get access to your information than breaking the cipher.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 09:20 | 605349 aldousd
aldousd's picture

Md5 is not an encryption algorithm. It's a hashin algorithm. "breaking" it amounts to finding a collision whereby two inputs hash to the same output. If you are using an md5 hashed password and you substitute a collision for the real password then you can "login" but this is not anything that would apply to encryption. For example, you cannot decrypt a stream of data with an md5 collision.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 05:40 | 605255 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Bearster - Two things:

o Attacks are not what the no-such does.

o Decription has been a problem of scale for a long long time.  Traffic is where it's at.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:06 | 604409 omer10
omer10's picture

could it be why markets rallies this week?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:18 | 604431 doomandbloom
doomandbloom's picture

anything to start a Iran Israel war.....if this fails...there will be something else...

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:22 | 604434 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

Um, isn't it kind of immoral to "cyber" attack a nuclear plant? Apart from damaging property and wasting people's time and money, fission reactions do have a tendency to get out of control if they aren't carefully managed.

It's all shits and giggles until you poison the atmosphere and give innocent civilians cancer.

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:51 | 604471 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

People who monopolize power and influence have to work incessantly screwing over everybody to keep it. It's kind of like the jesus plan. They let a couple people work it right like ghandi and martin luther king but for the most part they just find out who people trust and fuck them over.

Morality doesn't enter into the equation. Control and domination doesn't concern itself with the other guy.

Mon, 09/27/2010 - 16:12 | 608018 hbjork1
hbjork1's picture

I have to wonder about credibility of the claim that the "cyber" attack and not other factors was the cause of program disruption.  

If your are an upper level technocrat reporting to a "religious" hierarchy and you are failing in your “mission”, what better way to deflect criticism that a mysterious computer virus.  Maybe the virus could be real.  And if you are on the other side trying to slow progress, why not let the opposition hierarchy believe it.  Better to have them chasing ghosts that pushing forward real objectives. 

Consider the case biological weapons and other WMD in Iraq, one purported reason for that war in spite of reports by Hans Blix to the contrary.   Reality was that the despotic regime of Saddam Hussein had NO competent people at the top.  And even when despotic regimes have competent personnel (IE WWII Germany, Japan) they tend to force a crazy decision environment.

 

It happens here in less lethal ways.  In years 1960-61, classmate friend who was Army ROTC (and a ChE) was assigned to Rocky Mountain Arsenal in Colorado. A civilian contractor had been hired to dispose of aging containers of mustard gas (blister gas-post WWI).  The workers for this “lowest bidder” wore protective clothing while dumping the gas containers into chemical disposal tanks but so many had to go to the hospital with burns that the contractor defaulted.  They used RA troops to finish the job.  My friend, who was not directly involved, relayed the story of the large number of “wounded” in the hospital before the job was finished. Nasty stuff.   

 

Why?  The Army Commanders had no clue about what they were dealing with.  They picked the lowest bidder with no guidance and then assigned our troops to continue with the contractor’s procedures.

 

IMO, the Iranians are much, much better equipped to develop nuclear capability with out killing themselves than the Iraqis were to develop biological capability.  But work with fissionable materials is not something that can be clowned around with.  And then there is the delivery issue.

 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:20 | 604435 Hammurabi
Hammurabi's picture

TD over exageration, there is nothing mentioned about Iran nuclear sites is crippled, there is public and privat owend companys that use Siemens machinerys are crippled but not the nuclear sites. here is the original article from Aljazeera not Al-Qaeda writen in Arabic http://www.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/D28AFD15-AAA5-4CA0-8DF1-8B4749684521.htm?GoogleStatID=9

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:26 | 604447 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Sounds like an epic Israel fail. LOLZLMAO!1!!

An act of war if they can prove it, but proof that cyber warefare is 'not there' yet.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:27 | 604448 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

The Iran rhetoric says nothing about Israel being the perpetrator, at least not so far.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 19:27 | 606133 Cpl Hicks
Cpl Hicks's picture

all your machinerys are ours

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 23:29 | 606438 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

Zzzzzzzz...Wake me when it is a made-for-TV movie.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:41 | 604457 Hammurabi
Hammurabi's picture

that is true.they said Stuxnet is maid by foreign Gov.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 19:28 | 606134 Cpl Hicks
Cpl Hicks's picture

Hammurabi must have those 33 virgins on his mind

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:42 | 604459 Hammurabi
Hammurabi's picture

but they did not mention israel

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:29 | 604665 breezer1
Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:43 | 604462 doolittlegeorge
doolittlegeorge's picture

Israel is pretty darn small.  They do have a navy however.  Needless to say "the US is selling arms to everyone."  And of course "we have a peace process."  I don't recall Iran being invited.  The fact of the "peace process" of course is no accident.  Is it just a "prevention of war" process?  "There is an election in a few weeks."

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 05:45 | 605256 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

The "peace" talks are nothing but standard election time mis-direction - unfortunately.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:35 | 605408 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

and the "peace process" results in Yasser Arafat winning the Nobel Peace Prize!

what a process!

- Ned

Mon, 09/27/2010 - 16:24 | 608099 hbjork1
hbjork1's picture

About the same as giving Dr. Robert C. Merton the Nobel Prize for Economics. 

So much for Nobels.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:45 | 604464 Biff Malibu
Biff Malibu's picture

My own experience with several personal computers has been that having Norton Antivirus loaded is worse than having an actual virus on the computer.  It is such an extreme load on system resources that to do almost anything I would have to disable it.  It got to be the first thing I would do after boot would be to disable Norton...I am no where near the level of sophistication of others on here with computers however it seems to me that if someone has a very good script blocker on their browser that seems to knock out about 99% of the viruses...

 

And for my AMZN friends out there, I accidentally knocked my kindle off a ledge about 3 1/2 feet high and it fell to the ground.  The next morning when I picked it up off the ground the screen had been permanently damaged...Can't say much for the ruggedness of the product.

 

Biff

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:44 | 604620 Misstrial
Misstrial's picture

Eset is far more elegant than Norton.

European designed with U.S. support:

http://www.eset.com

~Misstrial

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:09 | 604849 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

If you have a ethernet router in your home/office, it probably has a hardware firewall, which is much better protection than the garbage that Microslut, et al foist upon the public.  Unfortunately, it cannot protect PCs from the id10t between the chair and keyboard, so stay vigilant on what you're clicking on (verify the URL of whatever you're gonna click on is indeed something useful).

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:21 | 604874 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

I am with you on that. 

I removed all such antivirusses from my old desktop and it is now 10x faster than the new one with the latest and faster chips. Amazing! 

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 00:29 | 605117 malek
malek's picture

A firewall, hardware or software, only helps against some external direct attacks.
In almost all cases, just using NAT in your router protects you as well against those.

If your computer has been compromised, e.g. by exploiting browser/flash/pdf security holes while you were surfing the web, your firewall helps you close to nothing, before and after the incident.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 16:47 | 605892 doggings
doggings's picture

funny Biff, me too, Norton uninstall, AVG free on.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:49 | 604469 Hammurabi
Hammurabi's picture

Peace, never going to be peace down there. humans in the M.E. are to racist we well never have peace there. God i hope i m wrong. Israel is super powerful country,

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:12 | 604855 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

According to the Old Testament, God him/herself led the Israelites from Egypt, yet Moses goes on a sabbatical up Mt. Sinai for awhile, and comes back to find everyone worshiping a Golden Calf.  People are indeed foolish!

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 09:56 | 605371 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Yeah, especially ones that believe invisible entities are controlling our lives and want us to worship them with prayer..

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:37 | 605411 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

worshiping golden ... hey wait!

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 14:59 | 604478 ncontrol
ncontrol's picture

This has got to be a complete joke.. Either this is made up or the Iranians are idiots.  There is no way a industrial operations computer network would be connected to the Internet.  These networks would be closed systems with no external access allowed, no wifi, and no just plugging a pc into a network port for Internet connectivity.

This is computer security 101.  Stuxnet would not find a way into the network unless it allowed external access over the Internet, or mobile PCs allowed to connect that were infected.  But who knows, maybe they have shit security, and allow employees to plug thumb drives into operation's computers.  If it is nuclear, I would be surprised if it wasn't locked down to the max.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:21 | 604510 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

downloaded via floppy disk.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:30 | 604666 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

heh, just how old are you bob? I say downloaded from an Iplod.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:14 | 604857 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

If Iran is STILL using Windows-95, then chances are their PCs STILL have floppy drives!  I have one that plugs into a USB port (just in case!)

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 23:32 | 605058 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

downloaded via floppy disk.

 

5 1/4 inch single sided.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:39 | 605414 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

I'll go you one better-8 inch!

(Hollerith card reader seldom touched a pc)

- Ned

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 00:17 | 605110 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Pardon me, I stand corrected. Floppy it is. Appy polly logies bob.

Regards 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:13 | 604748 Turtle49
Turtle49's picture

This sounds like a diversionary rehash, aka repeat, of a comment posted for the first Stuxnet report on ZeroHedge.  We already know that the Russian construction engineers used USB ports to connect their laptops to the equipment and that is how Stuxnet entered the system.  

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 05:52 | 605257 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Good point.  Just like the Diebold voting machines that were 'safe' becasue they were not on any network.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a8d_1194275446

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 13:41 | 605642 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

that link is not available in canada

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:00 | 604480 three chord sloth
three chord sloth's picture

Why assume it was Israel? They are far from the only nation who wants to see these reactors go away. The US, all of Europe, the Saudis... the list is long. Heck, the Russians who sold them many of their reactor systems might sabotage it -- they want the money from the sales but don't trust the Iranians either, and figured this way they get the best of both worlds.

I'm not even convinced it takes a nation to create this thing (like they keep claiming). All you really need is someone with a deep understanding of control systems, a Seimens system to practice on, a virus designer or two, and way to introduce it into the Iranian infrastructure. None of that seems to require the sponsorship of a nation.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:26 | 604601 Bob
Bob's picture

Yeah, I'm not buying this claim that it takes a team of 100 of the world's best several years to write this, either.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:54 | 604630 three chord sloth
three chord sloth's picture

If one of the designers was a Siemens system programmer himself he could've provided all of the requisite knowledge and the vector to get it directly into Bushehr itself. There's got to be a bunch of Germans who don't like Seimens selling these systems to Iran.

For all we know the only original infection could've been at Bushehr, and the spread of the virus was done accidentally by Iran's own internal spy agencies... you know they don't trust anyone and would definitely poke around inside their own nation's computers looking for signs of internal dissent.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:16 | 604861 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

From "The Stunt Man":  "Paranoia is like an STD in that it's spread by screwing your fellow man."  -- Peter O-Toole (close enough!)

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 23:44 | 606460 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

And then a series of miracles begin occurring, apparently on cue, so that media can portray the sitaution with maximum emotional impact.

Yes, uh, we're holding this press conference to unequivocally admit extreme vulnerabilities in our critical systems.  While it may seem foolish to disclose so clearly the effects we've suffered due to these vulnerabilities we actually have a different goal in mind.  We seek only a return phone call from Microsoft support.  Or Microsoft licensing if that is more appropriate.  Seriously, we'll pay for a license or two.  No really, we'll even pay for volume licensing if we have to.  Please call us back.  The Iranian Gov't

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:02 | 604482 Hammurabi
Hammurabi's picture

Ncontrol absolutly they think we are stupid, we had the embargo, now cyber attack to cripple Iran economy not the nuclear program

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:59 | 604493 francismarion
francismarion's picture

Hammurabi

You  see the complexity of the situation and you long as do many others for a solution.

Perhaps all that can be accomplished by the world's exertions for peace is prevention of holocaust.

If that is all that we may hope for, may this computer virus be a step in that direction. 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:13 | 604498 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Should've bought a Mac.  Time Machine works wonders.

Just sayin'.

Also, why the hell aren't these systems standalones?  Are the Iranians really that retarded?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:47 | 604531 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

" Are the Iranians really that retarded?" - Yes they are living in the Middle Ages still

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 23:45 | 605078 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Yes they are living in the Middle Ages still

Then an assertion about Iranian nukes would have to be a lie, right?

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 23:48 | 606470 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

* Really that retarded...

* Living in Middle Ages still...

and

* Likes to brag to entire world about both facts via global satellite TV network

Which of these does not fit?

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 13:44 | 605645 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

ever been to utah

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:50 | 604539 Miss Expectations
Miss Expectations's picture

 "Are the Iranians really that retarded?"

Alternatively, the Persians are sick and tired of their Islamic Republic.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 22:31 | 604811 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

"Alternatively, the Persians are sick and tired of their Islamic Republic."

Well, they tried to be democratic once already and look at how that panned out... what happened to Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh again? Oh, right. I'd bet they're still thanking the US for taking care of that for them... as you would expect.

Regards

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 03:36 | 605221 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Alternatively, the Persians are sick and tired of their Islamic Republic.

 

 

Correction: the Persians might be sick and tired of supporting interests naturally conflicting with US' interests.

Once they get those interests aligned with the US, it wont matter much if they are a democracy, a dictature or anything else.

If as a nation, they were a democracy still supporting their national interests, they would be in the same situation.

Being a democracy brings no ease from the US. Aligning the interests does.

See: Saudi Arabia. South Africa under Apartheid/democracy. And many others. 

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:02 | 605378 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Please, please, do not confuse the war mongering neo-cons on here with the facts.. You will upset them.. The name calling will start and you will end up being labeleda racist.. You will learn not to oppose Western aggression against brown people... Silly, Silly prole..  LOL

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 12:26 | 605554 francismarion
francismarion's picture

Wots of Iswaewis and Amewicans and Euwopeans are bwown, siwwy wabbit.

Wets go swaughtew some Finns.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:37 | 604522 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

 Israel isn't the only country in the Middle East that wants to put a stop to a nuclear powered Iran.

And some of those countries have very deep pockets.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 20:14 | 604798 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Do you think we could ask some of those countries with very deep pockets to have a go at stopping a nuclear armed (not just powered) Israel?

MB if we all said "pretty please"?

Regards

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 01:44 | 605155 RichardP
RichardP's picture

Why?

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 22:12 | 606341 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

If you really need to ask...

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:44 | 604526 Eric Cartman
Eric Cartman's picture

You know what they say... "If you wanna whack, get a Mac."

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:44 | 604529 Rogerwilco
Rogerwilco's picture

This was likey a multiple-year covert operation involving multiple intelligence services. The Israelis have been cracking and hacking for decades, hell, they invented the computer virus.

The real question now is what have the Chinese got up their sleeve?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 15:50 | 604540 Catullus
Catullus's picture

So why are we paying so much for the military industrial complex? Without firing a shot, the "threat" was neutralized.

If this prevented a war, all the better.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:01 | 604553 lolmaster
lolmaster's picture

Cmon Tyler this gives them another chance to "blame it on the Jews." But you wouldn't know anything about that huh?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:15 | 604583 jbc77
jbc77's picture

This Stuxnet crap could be serious. I found the following link after not much digging. Apparently, in one example Stuxnet was able to increase the pressure in an oil pipeline, which caused a massive pipeline explosion:

"By writing code to the PLC, Stuxnet can potentially control or alter how the system operates. A previous historic example includes a reported case of stolen code that impacted a pipeline. Code was secretly “Trojanized” to function properly and only some time after installation instruct the host system to increase the pipeline's pressure beyond its capacity. This resulted in a three kiloton explosion, about 1/5 the size of the Hiroshima bomb."

http://www.symantec.com/connect/blogs/stuxnet-introduces-first-known-roo...

 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:09 | 604652 samsara
samsara's picture

 

This Stuxnet crap could be serious. I found the following link after not much digging. Apparently, in one example Stuxnet was able to increase the pressure in an oil pipeline, which caused a massive pipeline explosion:

 

You mean like a Gas Pipeline explosion and blowing up a whole city block?  Hmmm,  is tit for tat going on here?

Naw.

 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:59 | 604687 Bob
Bob's picture

I see an IPO for Amish outdoing GOOG real soon!

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:31 | 604758 ChevronSky
ChevronSky's picture

Also from the Symantec Stuxnet blog:

 

Conclusion

Most security professionals that watch action movies where a skilled hacker holds an organization or even a country for ransom will simply dismiss it as fantasy. However, the case of Stuxnet easily reads as if it were the latest Hollywood blockbuster. This is the first publicly widespread threat that has shown a possibility of gaining control of industrial processes and placing that control in the wrong hands.  It also shows that in this interconnected world, IT security is more important than ever and that even the unthinkable must now be considered. 

While we don’t know who the attackers are yet, they did leave a clue. The project string “b:\myrtus\src\objfre_w2k_x86\i386\guava.pdb” appears in one of their drivers. Guava belongs to the myrtus plant family.  Why guava or myrtus?  Let the speculation begin.

Written by Patrick Fitzgerald and Eric Chien

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:19 | 604867 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

It was Dr. Evil in his secret Volcano lair.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 23:57 | 606484 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

placing that control in the wrong hands.  It also shows that in this interconnected world, IT security is more important than ever and that even the unthinkable must now be considered.

Point. Set. Match.  BOOGA-BOOGA-BOOGA!

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:41 | 604589 Bob
Bob's picture

"one would assume that demonstrating such broad cyberdefensive weakness would not be in the country's favor..." ???

Not really.  Let's face it, they would stand no chance of stopping the US (or Israel) from doing it if we wanted to.  At the same time, the world has little sympathy for either bullies (that would be US most days even without this) or cyber-saboteurs.  Recall how we felt when the story went out that China was attempting to hack our shit. 

Sounds like a real good move on Iran's part--whether they were actually victimized or not.  Think about it. 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:42 | 604616 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

only if symantec did the virus (again).

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:45 | 605424 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

singing:

"my mother makes cheap prophylactics,

she punctures their head with a pin,

my father does all the abortions,

my god how the money rolls in."

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:44 | 604618 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

I DON'T BELIEVE ANYTHING OF THIS!!!

ALL critical operations networks are all stand alone networks and never conected to the internet.

We even have this in our company where in case something bad like a worm or a virus where to cripple the network, we can erase all the stations and put a ghost on these in less then 4 hours. All the workable systems are copied avery 24h and stored for 2 years.

And as those computers like in the powerstations are eagle types for security reasons, restoring those only takes 5 to 12 minutes!

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:48 | 604623 Bob
Bob's picture

How many minutes to really screw something up?  And, the prevailing theory is a flash drive, though vendor hanky-panky seems equally possible (which is the reason the US makes even its own  chips on site for nuclear control systems.)

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 16:56 | 604634 RatherBFlying
RatherBFlying's picture

+1

 

This story is pure, sensationalized crap.

 

Hide under your bed everybody, a Windows worm is going to destroy the world.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:38 | 604672 Perseid.Rocks
Perseid.Rocks's picture

Windows rootkits are notoriously hard to detect, correct ? And as I recall, the most recent viruses and worms go to special efforts to remain undetected, as they get what they came for. I wonder how long this worm had infected these industrial sites before it was detected, and how many of those 'backups' contain worm larvae.. could be a year or more I suppose. Assuming they can even find all the places it hides (reverse engineering binary code, so much fun), removing it could be time-consuming.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:21 | 604870 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Stuxnet is NOT a worm, it's a virus.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:09 | 604746 SloSquez
SloSquez's picture

This isn't about a computer network, persay.  PLC's and particulary the one in question control things in the real world.  When you consider something as complicated and real time as a nuclear reactor, it would not take very long to screw something big up.  As a simple example, the PLC is programmed to limit a 25000 lb, 20" shaft's RPM's to 2000.  It also is monitoring the temperature of the bearings.  If the temperature begins to approach 200 deg. F, it turns on a chiller and opens a valve to increase oil flow to the bearing.  Now remove that set of instructions and replace with:  Remove RPM limits on the shaft and begin to increase the shaft to 10000 Rpm's, also turn off the lubrication system and chiller.  Get the idea?  Complete and catastrophic destruction of long lead items in probably 20 seconds - just a guess.

https://www.automation.siemens.com/mcms/process-control-systems/en/distributed-control-system-simatic-pcs-7/pages/distributed-control-system-simatic-pcs-7.aspx

 

 

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:48 | 605427 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

separate overspeed trip in any real installation--mechanical or well controlled segmented electronic trip. - Ned

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 23:25 | 605050 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

This is simpley inaccurate. Fuck power, we can do without that. How about food/water? First of all, you have to know there is a problem before you know to enact your BCDR plan. This virus is not popping up RPC errors like blaster. It is silent, directed, and very sophisticated.

Second, I have personally worked on SCADA type networks which are controlling PLC's connected to dams (yeah..those things that make lakes), water/ sewer pipes, Mac n Cheese squeezers, etc. Do they all run Siemens gear? No. But neither are they always properly air gapped from other networks. Every platform needs to be assessed in the era where usability and the rush to market are more important than data validation or OS hardening. My security team and I are playing Paul Revere here and it is a very long road to travel.

Third, delivery mechanism is USB...Sneakernet Bitchez.

How long before the creature returns for retribution on its creators, is all I am wondering? Not a matter of "if"....

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:00 | 604639 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

Is it possible that stuxnet (or something like it) could have had anything to do with the rig that blew up in the gulf?

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 20:39 | 604824 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Dick Cheney wishes (or more likely couldn't care less; but he thanks you anyway for another option to explore in the painting of Halliburton's complete exoneration with regards to the disaster).

I can hear it now,

"It appears that our concrete forms' construction for the well cap body was altered by unauthorized software commands during manufacture. Our people suspect stuxnet... I'd like to thank ZH and commentors  for sending the virulent virus viral; guiding our investigators as to what to fi... er, look for. "

Regards

Mon, 09/27/2010 - 00:08 | 606503 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

fucking virus signed off on paperwork too!  Amazing! 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:09 | 604650 Dagny Taggart
Dagny Taggart's picture

I don't know which freaks me out more, influenza bugs, bed bugs or now cyber bugs! I hate bugs of all types. The closest I wanna get to one is on the golf course.

Duh, except goldbugs, of course. I do love them.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:15 | 604655 nosuchthingask
nosuchthingask's picture

I really doubt they were infected. This is more of the same Psy-War. I worked before on Industrial Systems and 

although it's not easy to escape Microsoft Operating Systems because of Drivers

and some Industrial Software are only available to Windows, you ran these

system in a local LAN disconnected from the Internet and you don't allow 

Diskettes or USB Pens to connect. If you do, them it's a question of incompetence.

 

If the Isrealis really created this silly virus, maybe they will suffer from the same medicine.

 

I don't like the Zionist Colonialists (I Support Palestine and Iran any day) and I can write virus too to hit Israel. 

 

 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 17:46 | 604677 bergsten
bergsten's picture

Maybe the reactor doesn't work, and they're looking for an excuse?

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 18:12 | 604690 Shylockracy
Shylockracy's picture

Another Zionist dog and pony show. Supposing Israel did it, Siemens connived and Iran was using Windows, you may expect an extra impulse for state actors world-wide to adopt Linux, dump Windows, and finally dump the putrid dollar. Another blow to American credibility, thanks to our bestest syphilitic friends, the death cultists of Israel.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 18:39 | 604717 Incubus
Incubus's picture

Seriously... who runs anything of importance on a Microsoft OS?

If they seriously are using an MS OS, lol.  They deserve whatever they get.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 06:07 | 605262 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

you speak the truth Incubus and you already have one junk - amazing.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:55 | 605437 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

Incubus, I didn't junk you, but:

"Seriously... who runs anything of importance on a Microsoft OS?"

... er ... Honeywell, Emerson, Zeemans, Foxboro, Moore used to, Allen-Bradley, Rockwell Software, and the list goes on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umrp1tIBY8Q

So that is almost all of the power plants, refineries, and industrial facilities in the developed world.

- Ned

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 10:59 | 605444 trav7777
trav7777's picture

The ignorance around here is astonishing.

You guys speak without understanding the infection vector, why MS OS was used, or much of anything about the problem.

MS OSes were used because they have a nice, convenient set of drivers and interfaces to configure the PLCs.

The fucking reactor was NOT being run "on Windows."

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 18:36 | 604715 liberal sodomy
liberal sodomy's picture

I really hope dc, londonistan and isntreal are vaporized in my lifetime.

Hitler was right about everything.

"I don't see much future for the Americans. It's a decayed country. And they have their racial problem, and the problem of social of social inequalities . . . Everything about the behavior of American society reveals that it's half Judaized, and the other half negrified. How can one expect a State like that to hold together - a country where everything is built on the dollar?"
-Adolf Hitler

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:25 | 604727 Bob
Bob's picture

Isntreal--that's rather clever.  I hadn't seen that one before . . . but then I don't frequent the white supremacist blogs. 

I think you got lost on your way to a lynching, sodomite. 

Piss off

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 08:28 | 604744 francismarion
francismarion's picture

O.K., Lib Sod, I'll bite.

As others have noted you seem to be more interested in posing than in  proselytising, but the public expression of such abhorrent thoughts compels me to respond.

I'm dieing to know, is it worth it to you to see the destruction of Israel if it means the destruction of Cairo, Ankara, Damascus, Beirut and Tehran as well; and the attendant global nuclear fallout?

And if America is as Hitler describes it in your quote, 'half Judaized and half negrified', which half are you?

You devote London and DC to the flames. Surely there are a few others  you'd like to cinder as well. Would you care to name them?

I hope my questions warrant an answer.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:16 | 604860 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

You Sir, not only disgust me as a fellow human being.

 You are also deeply ignorant.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 11:03 | 605449 trav7777
trav7777's picture

what the fuck is he "ignorant" about?

Whether or not you find racism repugnant, I'm getting tired of seeing people who express racist beliefs referred to as "ignorant."  Ignorant of WHAT?  The epithet is a total non-sequitur.

The quote from Hitler did not express any genocidal sentiment.

Hitler was TOTALLY 100% right when he said "2+2=4."  I know straight off that saying that invokes cognitive dissonance, but assess the truth or falsity of the statement without regard to the identity of the speaker.  JFC, be LOGICAL.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 14:07 | 605532 francismarion
francismarion's picture

@7777

Hitler practiced genocide. It is reasonable to look for evidence of that in all his statements. On that basis it is logical to infer a 'genocidal sentiment' in this quote by Hitler. Hence you are illogical, 7777.

You are right about one thing though. There is no cognitive dissonance in your statement in my opinion. But it does show your willingness to play footsie with a raging genocidal  maniac and his patsies,  7777.

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 20:57 | 606179 Bob
Bob's picture

Indeed, if you have any doubts about where Lib Sod is coming from/where he stands, just click on his user name and hit the "track" button to check his posts, which you can do on an article-by- article basis via the "find" function on your browser menu bar under "edit." 

This guy, like a few others who pass through on a fairly regular basis,  is fanatically obsessed with posting material that often as not expresses a virulently anti-jewish bigotry.  It gets old reading his twisted desires on every thread that can be bent to an opportunity for him to again share them. 

Silently tolerating it seems to me to poorly represent this community in the name of some misguided notion of free speech/thought.  I don't like PC "censorship" any more than the most principled conservative, but this transcends the superficial--it's like saying nothing when your neighbor decides to "express himself" by building a showering fountain in his front yard . . . and hooks it up to the sewer line to supply the water, no accident, fully intentional. 

This guy, and others like him, also do not stumble in here and innocently find themselves the victims of small-minded intolerance or misunderstanding.  He's trying to stink the place up.  No accident, no misunderstanding, fully intentional. 

Sun, 09/26/2010 - 13:33 | 605636 citationneeded
citationneeded's picture

Ignorant of individual capacity.

 

Racism itself is a non-sequitur. Unless one believes that we are genetically predisposed to act a certain way becuase we have a certain set of genes that demarcate a race, then the inability to judge people INDIVIDUALLY is an ignorant viewpoint.

 

I know you really really want to deport the Jews, which you have mentioned in the past. But just becuase you hate some 'Zionist Cabal', how is that in any way an indication of my beliefs or capacities? JFC, be LOGICAL.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 18:41 | 604718 unbeing
unbeing's picture

"What is surprising is that Iran has made such a major media splash on the topic: one would assume that demonstrating such broad cyberdefensive weakness would not be in the country's favor..."

 

Seems to me that assumes a certain level of rationality that is not actually present. 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 18:43 | 604719 HungrySeagull
HungrySeagull's picture

Easy fix.

Toss all computers.

Hire thousands of workers to follow shouted commands of "Off, On" at all the control points.

 

Solves two issues at once. Unemployment and Technology problems.

 

Saves power too.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:39 | 604764 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

Bringing life to imagination.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 22:54 | 605000 Village Idiot
Village Idiot's picture

"Bringing life to imagination."

 

 

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 19:50 | 604774 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

False flag.

Sat, 09/25/2010 - 21:22 | 604873 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

Sorry chaps.

Stuxnet = Swine Flu.

Just excitable nonsense.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eUsSXXc8wU

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!