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Al-Jazeera Releases "The Palestine Papers": Thousands Of Documents Detailing A Decade Of Secret Israeli Palestinian Negotiations

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Al-Jazeera has released thousands of previously classified documents
which due to their content will likely bring the already sensitive
situation in the Middle East to a boil once again. While the document
progenitor could well be Wikileaks, the TV network refuses to disclose
the source: "Because of the sensitive nature of these documents, Al
Jazeera will not
reveal the source(s) or detail how they came into our possession. We
have taken great care over an extended period of time to assure
ourselves of their authenticity." As for what is contained: "The
material is voluminous and detailed; it provides an unprecedented
look inside the continuing negotiations involving high-level American,
Israeli, and Palestinian Authority officials." Apparently, the
disclosure is so sensitive that the ISP of the Palestinian authority has
just blocked the Aljazeera site containing the early releases. We look
forward to reading the documents as they are released between January 23
and 26. Judging by the prompt retaliation they will be worth the read:
according to the Palestinian Authority, Al-Jazeera has just declared was
on Palestinians, which intuitively makes little sense.

From Al-Jazeera:

Over the last several months, Al Jazeera has been given unhindered access to the largest-ever leak of confidential documents related to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. There are nearly 1,700 files, thousands of pages of diplomatic correspondence detailing the inner workings of the Israeli-Palestinian peace process. These documents – memos, e-mails, maps, minutes from private meetings, accounts of high level exchanges, strategy papers and even power point presentations – date from 1999 to 2010.

The material is voluminous and detailed; it provides an unprecedented look inside the continuing negotiations involving high-level American, Israeli, and Palestinian Authority officials.

Al Jazeera will release the documents between January 23-26th, 2011. They will reveal new details about:

    * the Palestinian Authority’s willingness to concede illegal Israeli settlements in East Jerusalem, and to be “creative” about the status of the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount;
    * the compromises the Palestinian Authority was prepared to make on refugees and the right of return;
    * details of the PA’s security cooperation with Israel;
    * and private exchanges between Palestinian and American negotiators in late 2009, when the Goldstone Report was being discussed at the United Nations.

Because of the sensitive nature of these documents, Al Jazeera will not reveal the source(s) or detail how they came into our possession. We have taken great care over an extended period of time to assure ourselves of their authenticity.

We believe this material will prove to be of inestimable value to journalists, scholars, historians, policymakers and the general public.

We know that some of what is presented here will prove controversial, but it is our intention to inform, not harm, to spark debate and reflection – not dampen it. Our readers and viewers will note that we have provided a comments section in which to express opinions. In keeping with our editorial policies, we reserve the right to excise comments that we deem inappropriate, but all civil voices will be heard, all opinions respected.

We present these papers as a service to our viewers and readers as a reflection of our fundamental belief – that public debate and public policies grow, flourish and endure when given air and light.

The 4 coincident releases are the following:

And here is the official response by the PA as described by Jerusalem Post:

PA: Al-Jazeera has declared war on Palestinians

A senior Palestinian Authority official in Ramallah on Sunday strongly condemned the Al-Jazeera TV network for publishing hundreds of documents concerning the peace talks between Palestinians and Israelis.

"Al-Jazeera has declared war on the Palestinians," the official told The Jerusalem Post. "This station serves the interests of the enemies of the Palestinians."

Asked if the PA was now considering measures against Al-Jazeera, the official said he did not see how a TV station that "incites" against the Palestinians would be able to continue operating in the West Bank. However, he said that PA President Mahmoud Abbas, who is currently in Cairo, would decided on the PA's response to the exposure of the documents in the coming hours.

In his first response to the documents that were revealed by Al-Jazeera, Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas said that he did not know how the TV network had obtained secret documents.

"We don't hide anything from our Arab brothers," Abbas told editors of Egyptian newspapers in Cairo. "We have been briefing our Arab brothers about all our activities with the Israelis and Americans."

PLO Chief Negotiator Saeb Erekat denied that the PA had agreed to make far-reaching concessions on Jerusalem.

Erekat criticized Al-Jazeera for reporting about the documents. “This is a theater,” he said. “This is part of a campaign targeting President Mahmoud Abbas and the PA at a time when we are going to the UN Security Council regarding the settlements.”

Erekat confirmed, however, that the Palestinians and Israelis had talked about land swaps in Jerusalem and the West Bank. “Yes, we talked about land swaps,” he told Al-Jazeera. “Olmert presented us with a map about the land swap. The swap is part of international law.”

Erekat said that Abbas, like his predecessor Yasser Arafat, refused to make far-reaching territorial concessions to Israel in Jerusalem. “East Jerusalem is the capital of the Palestinian state,” he stated. “All of east Jerusalem.”

Erekat also strongly denied that former PA Prime Minister Ahmed Qurei [Abu Ala] had agreed to give up parts of Sheikh Jarrah, in east Jerusalem, to Israel. He also denied that the PA had voiced opposition to giving Jordan any role in east Jerusalem.

“We are now facing a battle with [Prime Minister] Binyamin Netanyahu and we are facing threats and pressures,” Erekat complained. “I don’t know where these documents came from and I would like to know who gave them to Al-Jazeera.”

Erekat also denied that the PA had agreed to recognize Israel as a Jewish state. He said that when he was asked by Israel to accept this demand, he replied that it was tantamount to asking a Palestinian to join the Zionist movement.

Abdel Bari Atwan, editor of the London-based Al-Quds Al-Arabi newspaper, responded angrily: “Who gave the PLO the right to make concessions on Jerusalem? The PLO does not represent the Palestinians.”

Atwan said it was outrageous that four Palestinian offcials were negotiating on behalf of all Palestinians and making concessions without being authorized to do so. He named the officials as Saeb Erekat, Salam Fayyad, Mahmoud Abbas and Yasser Abed Rabbo.

 

 

 

 

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Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:20 | 897668 ReallySparky
ReallySparky's picture

This should be an interesting week.  I never thought that as an American, I would be relying on Al-Jazeera for ground breaking, investigative reporting.  It will be fun to watch our MSM comment, dis-credit and blah, blah, blah this new revelation.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:54 | 897710 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Let's flashback to 1991.  Just imagine telling somebody then that, "20 years from now we will have to turn to Pravda and an Arab news organization called Al Jazeera if we want to know what is really going on."  They would have sent you to Hazeltine or Bellevue.

Do Krugman and Friedman still work for The New York Times?  Yep, Al Jazeera looks better every day. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:00 | 897792 Dont Taze Me Bro
Dont Taze Me Bro's picture

People in 1991 had the same problem we do now. They knew the problem, but couldn't stop their own degradation. Imagine 20 years from now in 2031, someone looks back and says, damn, can you imagine telling someone in 2011 that in 20 years, America will be one giant 3rd world country, with 50% unemployment rate, etc, where the goal of an average young person is to emigrate to another country, what would they say?

Krugman and Friedman are smart. I bet they already have their second passports ready. They can bailout when the going gets tough.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:49 | 897861 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

The cross-border flows will grow proportionally to unemployment. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:08 | 898144 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

The borders will be sealed in direct proportion to unemployment. 

ORI

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/01/21/accidental-lives/

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:13 | 898147 Dont Taze Me Bro
Dont Taze Me Bro's picture

ORLY?

"Over a million immigrants land U.S. jobs in 2008-10"
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE70J37P20110120

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:10 | 897971 JR
JR's picture

The Krugmans and the Friedmans are smart? They’ve scorched earth and burned the bridges everywhere they’ve been; just who will have them now?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:19 | 898053 Segestan
Segestan's picture

Want to know you're future? Look no further than the crap the boomers get...not saying boomers were right or wrong , but it won't matter.... enjoy.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:59 | 898033 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

you knew Al-J was something when our government tried to take them out

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:53 | 897783 Salinger
Salinger's picture

AJ is what CNN could have been or perhaps once was, notwithstanding the medium is the message and AJ is as controlled as the three network musketeers in America along with the aforementioned and the other cable prop networks

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:32 | 897911 Bob
Bob's picture

Can't wait for the US to issue a fatwa to take care of this.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:35 | 898068 nevadan
nevadan's picture

Here is another take on the situation,

debkafile reveals that the documents were sold to the TV network by a disgruntled Palestinian staffer fired from the PA's NFU-Negotiating Support Team. They were used to depict  Abbas and Ereket as willing to betray Palestinian national interests, Israel as offering nothing in return for Palestinian concessions and America as unfairly advocating Israel's case throughout.
debkafile: The "expose" was clearly motivated by the urge to settle internal scores within the Arab camp and 
among rival Palestinian factions.
The presentation of a decade of negotiations is flawed on four counts: ...

http://www.debka.com/article/20582/



Mon, 01/24/2011 - 13:54 | 899223 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Right.  That's the crazy zionist version of the story (which, incidentally, and uncharacteristically for DF, isn't too far off the mark).

For the more nuanced version, The Angry Arab fills in the details:

http://angryarab.blogspot.com

PA has acted as the political stooge and enforcement goons for the zionists since Oslo.

I am Chumbawamba.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:19 | 897669 Mercury
Mercury's picture

The over/under is 500 comments

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:43 | 897695 farragut
farragut's picture

I declare was on you!

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:38 | 897841 bania
bania's picture

make was not war

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:46 | 897859 tmosley
tmosley's picture

I accidently a war.  Is this bad?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:54 | 897871 Alienated Serf
Alienated Serf's picture

was not was

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:15 | 898181 Moonrajah
Moonrajah's picture

Was was wasly-like?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:57 | 898196 Problem Is
Problem Is's picture

He meant I declare wuss on you...

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:03 | 897725 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

"The over/under is 500 comments"

I think everybody is too busy watching Caleb Hainey try to do his Joe Montana impersonation.  I think the Bears could use Tony Montana as their QB right now.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:28 | 897999 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

I will put twenty.on under.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:29 | 897679 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

Does anybody actually gives a fuck about that region anymore?

I sure don't.

Just support the trend: Give them free diesel and waterproof matches and let them selfcombust.

 

NOW WHAT ABOUT THAT CACAO PRICE INCREASE THAT IS COMMING?!

ANY UPDATES ON THAT TOPIC?!

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:37 | 897686 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Why should the USA keep giving aid and weapons to Israel? Can't they deal with their own problems?

All it does is make the other countries mad at the US. We should be neutral and just buy their oil, everyone will be happy.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:57 | 897712 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I believe there is this thing called "the military industrial complex" that would disagree with you.  Plus, I believe Israel has a couple ties into the higher levels of the United States government.  It seems that there is a lot of moolah to be made by talking peace in the Mideast but encouraging war.  Just think how much money some segments of our population could make if/when Israel attacks Iran. 

Making bombs is a lot more profitable than making bon-bons.  Ask any Belgian.  Sudden Debt, quit looking at your wang and let us know. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:44 | 897773 Arkadaba
Arkadaba's picture

A view on Afghan reconstruction projects compared to what is happening in the States:

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/01/22-0

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:24 | 897745 HellFish
HellFish's picture

What a stunning comment on your personal value system.

Has it occurred to you there is an intrinsic good to supporting the only Democracy in the region?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:35 | 897755 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

"Has it occurred to you there is an intrinsic good to supporting the only Democracy in the region?"

 

Bwahahahaha.  Do you do standup in your spare time?  Did you really write "intrinsic good"?  Oh, that is some good humor.  My stomach hurts. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:38 | 897840 Rick64
Rick64's picture

Lol

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:09 | 897890 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Hellfish.... Did your mother have any children that lived?.. Because a country is a "democracy" they shrink from controversy?.. You, sir, are an idiot..

Are you the lost love child of Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity and Anne Coulter's threesome??

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 03:20 | 898211 DollarMenu
DollarMenu's picture

There's got to be some squid in there too.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 07:46 | 898310 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Anne Coulter is actually pretty funny, so I'm going to guess no.  If Hellfish were her son his comment would have at least displayed some wit.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:33 | 897756 Terminus C
Terminus C's picture

I guess Turkey is not in the region...

Also... wow, really... intrinsic good?

You must not know too much about the situation other than what the MSM feeds you.  There is no intrinsic good in allowing (nay, enabling) one group of people to completely oppress another.  Yes, I get the whole suicide bomber/terrorist schtick but really, read some history, examine the multitude of perspectives involved in this situation before spewing "intrinsic good".

 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:37 | 897763 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Oh, don't be silly.  Pay no attention to the King David Hotel or the Irgun.  Revisionist history is my favorite history since it's already been revised and I don't have to think. 

 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:14 | 897894 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Was it Napoleon that said "History is a set of lies agreed upon"

Hmmm.. I wonder what a group of people could get away with if they had control of the majority of Western Mainstream News outlets... Ohhh yeah.. never mind..

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:40 | 897920 Bob
Bob's picture

No, no--imagine if the "mainstream" media were completely owned by mega-corps! 

Literally. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:48 | 897933 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Good point...  Them too !!

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:39 | 897766 Arkadaba
Arkadaba's picture

You are correct, Hamas was democratically elected

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:40 | 897769 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

So were Hillary, Pelosi and Obama.  That democracy thing sure seems to favor crooks, villains and idiots and especially villainous idiot crooks. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:53 | 897781 duncecap rack
duncecap rack's picture

How is it Dubya and Cheney didn't make your list? I sense a bias.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:55 | 897785 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I've moved on and tried to get those buttholes out of my mind.  We still suffer with Hill, Nan and O.  To show I'm not biased I will also throw in Boehner and McConnell.  What a couple of blowjobs they are. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 06:53 | 897873 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Deleted as dumb post.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:54 | 897945 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

regarding w and dick's election: they lost by a million votes. but on a brighter note probably saved us (and al) a presidential assassination, er, accident and president joe lieberman.  that's got to be worth something.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:33 | 897826 web dizajn
web dizajn's picture

it's not democracy if I don't like it

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:40 | 898338 GDE
GDE's picture

Have you ever noticed that islamists come to power everytime there are free elections in a muslim state ?

Democraty is an European political concept and to this day there was never any democraty in muslim countries. They all turn into an islamic republic or a military laical regime cause that's the only ways to run countries like these.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 10:04 | 898444 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

It could be because the people want them.  Think of the Christian nutters that could run this country if ever there were "free" elections.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:22 | 897814 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Israel is a religious state run country. There is no democracy. Would anyone of any other religious belief be allowed to run the country or hold office?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:47 | 898076 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

Israel is a religious state run country.

Israel is NOT a "religious state run country". Israel is STUPIDITY state country, because King David COULD NOT OBTAIN a citizenship of modern Israel, because according to the modern Israel "law"  he is not ..... a jew (!?). This is not about "religion", this is about a monopoly of rabbis in Israel. There is nothing common with judaism of Aaron (older brother of Moses).

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:06 | 898176 Antipodeus
Antipodeus's picture

The Vatican?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:16 | 898182 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

The Vatican?

Vatican is not really an independent state, it is not even a city. Besides, it has a kind of Constitution:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_Law_of_Vatican_City_State

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Vatican_City_State

Instead, modern Israel (still) does not have a Constitution.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:43 | 898318 GDE
GDE's picture

Palestine is a muslim state country. There is no democraty there either and they should take some lessons from Israel in that matter.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:48 | 897862 trav7777
trav7777's picture

an apartheid state is a "democracy" now?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:58 | 897950 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

good point.  they don't let the conquered vote.  they just exploit and oppress them.  imo israel's policies and not neonazis are the most dangerous legacy of hitler.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:12 | 898319 GDE
GDE's picture

Since islam condemnes non muslims to slavery or death, apartheid with a muslim state is a sane decision.

By the way, did you know muslims never granted the same rights to christians and jews but that Israel gave full rights and citizenship to the muslims living in its territories ?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 09:31 | 898385 Bob
Bob's picture

Quite a contradiction with the commentor immediately above you.  Too bad, given that this would seem such a fundamental issue that is entirely a matter of fact rather than interpretation. 

Do you have a link to a source that can settle this?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 13:40 | 899172 A Proud Canadian
A Proud Canadian's picture

They also "granted" Palistinians some White Phosphorous artillery in the midst of the most concentrated civilian populations in the world.  Pigs

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:01 | 898087 Confused
Confused's picture

You didn't.....did you? 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:34 | 897760 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Why should the USA keep giving aid and weapons to Israel? Can't they deal with their own problems?"

Why do the Arab's & Persians keep giving aid to Hezbollah and other terrorist organizations? Can't they deal with their own problems?

"All it does is make the other countries mad at the US. We should be neutral and just buy their oil, everyone will be happy."

You haven't seen some of Obama's gifts from the Saudis? ;-)


Ruby and diamond jewelry set

consisting of a pair of earrings,

a ring, a bracelet, and a necklace.

Rec’d—6/03/2009.

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/154926.pdf

Sweet...LOL.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:50 | 897938 SRV - ES339
SRV - ES339's picture

what a waste of bandwidth

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:08 | 898038 nmewn
nmewn's picture

What a waste of oxygen.

Please tell me you haven't bred any little skin-heads to follow along in your hoof prints. I've seen you little punks before...takes four or five on one because your fucking pussies.

You don't see how stupid Gandhi's remark is in light of Saudi gift giving because your just as fucking inbred as he is.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:48 | 898078 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Dude.  Those are gifts of state and there is nothing unusual about any of it.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/tokens_and_treasures/gifts_of_state.html

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 05:41 | 898289 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Finally, someone with some sanity I can relate to.

On one level yes...but how does Gandhi (above) saying..."All it does is make the other countries mad at the US."...square with those "other countries" (that are supposed to be mad at the US) giving the US diamonds & rubies? 

Furthermore, if the end of the Keynesian world is nigh and those diamonds & rubies (and all the rest of it) are the property of the US, as a taxpayer to the US, I want it all auctioned off to the highest bidder for debt reduction instead of stuck in a box somewhere in the Smithsonian.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 06:59 | 898303 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

Finally, someone with some sanity I can relate to.

That can only mean he's talking crap.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 07:30 | 898307 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Banging on joos may be a popular pastime in Europe & the ME but it's not a source of entertainment universally SD.

Everyone needs a boogeyman that psychologically allows them to look over their own shortcomings as individuals...if it's not blacks, it's Mexicans, if not Mexicans it's Asians...eventually it all rotates back around. People have short memories. Palestinians tried to overthrow Jordan, were slaughtered and thrown out of the country. Was this Palestinian land too?...Jordanian land?

The West Bank was given so they could be somewhat autonomous. Why did the Egyptians close their border with the WB until some peace niks hired a ship to bring in supplies? Why did they not allow dockage in the Sinai? Do Egyptians (and by extension, the rest of the Arab world) enjoy watching Palestinians suffer?

They use them like pawns in their little game with Israel...it's disgusting.

Everyone (all of us) chasing each other around as the corrupt fucks up top who don't give a shit about race, religion, morality or culture...nothing but greed & power...take off out the back door with the silverware.

Whatever SD. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 09:26 | 898382 Bob
Bob's picture

+100

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 16:34 | 899887 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Thanks Bob...it needs to be said.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 17:45 | 900136 Bob
Bob's picture

Yes it does.  BTW, I thought I was your favorite athiest/socialist!  What's up with that?

Yeah, you never said it, but we've been through alot . . .

Thanks for fighting the good fight, nmewn. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 19:30 | 900603 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Yeah, you never said it, but we've been through alot . . ."

;-)

Sometimes I swing wild...yeah we rolled around a little...maybe I thought you were not as big a liberal as I consider myself to be...LOL.

It's interesting how political parties roles can change over time...for another thread maybe.

"Thanks for fighting the good fight, nmewn."

Thanks for your recognizing it for what it is...I'm not Jewish...I detest lies & the vermin who peddle them.

Take care my brother. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 10:11 | 898460 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Give me a reason why I should give two squirts of piss about "Race, Religion, or Culture?"

All three of those ideas are used to divide people so the rulers have an easier time ruling.

Morality on the other hand, I suspect you don't *really* know what that word means.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 11:37 | 898739 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Well...if it isn't my favorite atheist/socialist...what took you so long?...LOL...where's that lunatic geopol?, you guys got him battin clean up today? ;-)

"Give me a reason why I should give two squirts of piss about "Race, Religion, or Culture?"

I don't wish and don't intend to force anyone to "give two squirts of piss" about anything.

For someone to have a sense of identity (of how they came to be where they are in the present) of belonging and promoting something larger than themselves for the good of one and all and pride in self & family is something uniquely personal to the individual. No one can force that...not forever at least.

While communists & socialists are more about making little statist droids and tearing peoples identities apart, I'm more about tearing statist droids apart and building peoples identities up to better equip them for liberty and individual choice.

You and your nutcase brethren should try it sometime...maybe scale back the negativity...you'll give yourself ulcers...have a bottle of wine, eat some cheese, catch some rays or sumpin. 

SeeYa

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 12:55 | 899013 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

Avoidance.

Your way is the best way, isn't it?  It is perfectly acceptable for you to be the tick sucking on the dog's ass, because your culture says so...

I was busy this weekend... I have a life.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 16:33 | 899882 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Avoidance of what?...I got better things to do as well.

You said nothing...you refuted nothing...you dismiss...you are the one who avoids.

You said nothing of the border closings between the WB & Egypt and why it was shut down. Nothing of why the aid ship was not allowed to dock on the Sinai & bring supplies in through that same border crossing.

Nothing of Jordanians slaughtering Palestitnians & driving them out for trying to steal their country so your saying (by your silence) they had no valid claim?  Wait, nope, can't do that...and why not, pan?

You say nothing of the Arabs & Persians using the Palestinians as a dagger to torment Israelis & Palestinian youth alike. How many young Palestinian's need to die for your bloodlust? Does this make you feel better or worse as a person?

You said nothing of the ridiculous claim of Gandhi who started all this shit...that they, (oil producing countries) are mad at the US for our alliance with Israel but give diamonds & rubies to that same government.

Yes...and if they really get pissed, I mean really super duper slobbering foot stoppin mad pissed, they do what...exactly? Pimp their women? Free oil?...what?

And the funniest fucking line of all...joos invented terrorism...ROTFLMAO!!!

Avoidance?!?!...I'm writing to Capn Avoidance right now!...you avoided everything I said.

Why did you avoid it?...because it's true, all of it...but avoiding it will not make it untrue...it's just the tactic the left uses always in regard to uncomfortable truths...truths that don't fit into their preconcieved notions & agendas.

You are the ones (leftists/elitists/statists/socialists) who bring misery to millions and keep the boot of tyranny on the people with your centrally planned societies, dreams of monarchy and dictatorships, keeping the shit stirred up so we stay at each others throats.

I hope, truly hope, that that guilt will eat you fuckers from the inside out...but I know it can never be, you're all pathological liars and can rationalize just about anything, even kids strapping bombs on themselves and walking into pizza parlors and city buses because they were raised that way...raised on hatred...promoted by you and those like you.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 23:12 | 901421 Rick64
Rick64's picture

 Egypt has been under the U.S.'s thumb for a while so they are not likely to buck the U.S.. As for the other ME countries, they would risk getting labelled as a terrorist country, possible embargoes, sanctions, cutting of aid, ect.. Naturally these wouldn't appear as the result of helping the Palestinians, but would appear to develope naturally over time so as not to be linked. Of course those countries understand how these things work.

  How do you think such extreme hatred developed? Just because the Palestinians don't like the Jewish religion or race? Thats like saying they hate western powers for their freedom, just ridiculous. They hate us because of our foreign policy and devious ways of dealing with other countries in that region. Palestinians are full of hatred because they were pushed into an ever decreasing area that they inhabited before the influx of Jews, and then being treated as second class citizens. The decades of increasing suppression and the other things I mentioned bred this deep hatred. For example take the embargo which Israel imposed on them. At face value you would think this is fair, but many of the items they withheld were not bomb making materials (cosmetics, jam, many others just can't remember) this is why the flotilla didn't want to go through Israeli customs. None of this is discussed in the media. Why?

  The Israelis did bomb the King David Hotel in retaliation for the British intelligence raiding and confiscating radical Irgun material. Some of the men of this group became prime ministers of Israel. Do some research into how Israel came about. As for their right to be there according to the bible, well they did write it.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 07:48 | 901982 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I enjoy history...it gives one perspective.

The Egyptian border crossing was closed because of weapons/contraband smuggling. The ship was denied dockage (by the Egyptians) on the Sinai. The Jordanians did in fact evict & slaughter the Palestinians for trying to take over their country.

As you say, look it up.

The Jews & Arabs have been in this area for the recorded history of man. This property dispute will be an issue long after we are gone.

If you choose to start your point of begining at the end of WWII...well, there's not much more that needs to be said.

There will be other opportunities to discuss.

Tue, 01/25/2011 - 12:06 | 902781 Rick64
Rick64's picture

The Egyptian border crossing was closed because of weapons/contraband smuggling. The ship was denied dockage (by the Egyptians) on the Sinai. The Jordanians did in fact evict & slaughter the Palestinians for trying to take over their country.

 These are the reasons at face value. Behind every story is the real story, but as you say there will be other opportunities.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:42 | 898088 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

Why do the Arab's & Persians keep giving aid to Hezbollah and other terrorist organizations? Can't they deal with their own problems?

Did You say "terrorist"? "Terrorism" was invented by jewish socialist and (mostly) jewish communists. The first PUBLIC documents about terrorism was ... the "Resolutions of 1-st and 2-nd Congress of Communist Party of the USSR". Responsible for terrorism in Communist Party oficially was .. J.Stalin (He also was "good" during so-called Tiflis bank robbery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1907_Tiflis_bank_robbery ).

This point of first CPSU decisions is still classified (they site only "2. Resolution on terrorism. Excluded from the official publication."), but there are referencies to it in many documents, including .... the first page of the official collection of documents of the Communist Party of USSR. There are numerous later socialistic decisions on so-oficially-called "Red terror" during the Civil War in Russia etc.

When I say terrorism is "jewish" invention, I have to add that technically jewish communists are ... not kosher jews. Regardless of this fact the famous "kosher" jews (for example banker Rothschild, the boulevard in Tel Aviv is renamed in his honour http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rothschild_Boulevard) supported several jewish communists, for example Trozky.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:13 | 898179 Antipodeus
Antipodeus's picture

"Terrorism" as a tactic is NEITHER a Jewish, nor a recent phenomena.  Your prejudices are showing. AGAIN.

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:31 | 898187 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

"Terrorism" as a tactic is NEITHER a Jewish, nor a recent phenomena.  Your prejudices are showing. AGAIN.

Oh, really? Try to suit me. Please. Start with the help of wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_terrorism

"Although the Reign of Terror was imposed by the French government, in modern times "terrorism" usually refers to the killing of people by non-government political activists for political reasons, often as a public statement. This meaning originated with Russian radicals in the 1870s. Sergey Nechayev, who founded People's Retribution (???????? ????????) in 1869, described himself as a "terrorist".[12] German anarchist writer Johann Most helped popularize the modern sense of the word by dispensing "advice for terrorists" in the 1880s.[13]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Most

"In 1873, Most wrote a summary of Karl Marx's Das Kapital. [12] At Liebknecht's request, Marx and Friedrich Engels made some corrections to Most's text for a second edition published in 1876, despite the fact that the pair did not believe the pamphlet represented a satisfactory summary of Marx's work. [12]"

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 10:14 | 898469 pan-the-ist
pan-the-ist's picture

You have a very short view of history friend.  Sun Tzu wrote about asymmetrical warfare (irregular.)  Labeling it "terror" is an attempt to legitimize the state as a-priori in your thoughts.  Your conditioning is showing.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 06:09 | 898296 nmewn
nmewn's picture

This is my statement;

"Why do the Arab's & Persians keep giving aid to Hezbollah and other terrorist organizations? Can't they deal with their own problems?"

This begins your impossible leap of faith statement;

"Did You say "terrorist"? "Terrorism" was invented by jewish socialist and (mostly) jewish communists."

No, it wasn't. 

Terrorism is violence >>>purposely<<< comitted on civilians to achieve an objective...political or otherwise.

It was not "invented" by joos or communists, to say so is to call Genghis Kahn a joo and Marx or Lenin weren't even a gleam in their pappy's eye in his time.

Try again on that bit of tripe.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:06 | 898141 pods
pods's picture

And to think that all AIPAC gave Obama was a job.

pods

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:38 | 897839 zen0
zen0's picture

USA gives aid and weapons to Egypt and others. For a price.Can't

Egypt and Tunisia and Jordan and Lebanon deal with their own problems?

 

 

 

 

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:38 | 898336 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Disingenuous zen0.  Why does Amerika give $2b+ every year to the Egyptian dictator? 

For what purpose? 

On who's behalf?

I think you can work it out.  Why not humor us with your response?  Your reasoning?  Thank you. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:36 | 897685 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

The reaction of Hamas should prove interesting...to say the least.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:10 | 897731 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

This will likely prove beyond all doubt that Hamas is the legitimate voice of the Palestinian people and that Abbas is nothing but an Israel/US appointed puppet. It will be the end of him. No wonder he's so pissed about the release of these documents. Expect him to flee the country shortly and the PA discredited and disbanded.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:30 | 897747 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I think I saw Abbas on Hudson Street, heading into the White Horse Tavern.  He'll be okay. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:54 | 897782 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

maybe he got hooked up with a room at the Riverview?

(oh god...just the thought of that place makes me want to take a shower)

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:57 | 897789 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I think he got hooked up with a young tranny on Christopher Street over by the PATH station. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:01 | 897793 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Oops.  It looks like I screwed up.  It wasn't a young tranny.  It was actually Erin Burnett.  That's an unpleasant thought.  I hope Abbas brought the red ball gag with him. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:45 | 897928 Dr. Gonzo
Dr. Gonzo's picture

That was my take too. Abbas always came off as puppet like to me. They don't have any gold for him to steal when he has to flee but I'm sure part of his deal included lots of dollars and Euros in foreign bank accounts for situations like this. I bet he won't last much longer after this incident. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:11 | 898096 GoldmanSux
GoldmanSux's picture

Hamas is the legitimate voice of the Palestinian people..

Are you serious? Hamas are fascists, and Fatah are mafiosi. You disagree with either, and you'll have a bullet in the back of your head. What a fucking crap comment.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:15 | 898324 GDE
GDE's picture

Hamas are terrorists who expan islam with terror.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:52 | 898344 GDE
GDE's picture

It's funny cause all the comments which tells another story on the not so poor Palestinians, the not so democratic Hamas and muslim countries are flagged as junk by some posters on ZH. Truth hurts doesn't it ?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:46 | 897701 DisparityFlux
DisparityFlux's picture

Hey Salem, do you have your AK-47 cleaned and loaded?  We are going to have a public debate.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:59 | 897717 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

A kind word and a gun goes a lot further than just a kind word.  I believe I heard that while watching The Untouchables. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 03:04 | 898204 Problem Is
Problem Is's picture

With extended clips and the home reloader...

This could go into overtime boys...

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:59 | 897714 Arius
Arius's picture

let the games begin...we got a good seat over here at ZH

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 18:59 | 897718 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

the world should never trust Israel

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:04 | 897726 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

You had me at "the world should never trust". 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:13 | 897734 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

I'd like to take this opportunity to "un-junk" you given the likelihood you are gonna be junked into oblivion for daring to say a true word about Israel.

Let the junking commence!

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:18 | 897898 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Bwaaaa Haaaa.. This isn't Yahoo Finance.. Dickweed..  You will get more junks than he will..

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:22 | 897987 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

Why do most of us americans overlook.the obvious? Genetic eastern europeans claiming to be descendants of david pushing out native peoples in the middle east for a homeland. Why does western collective guilt over the jewish genocide mean that the palestinians have to pay for.it? Apparently we were all too.antijewish to give them a homeland here. Its not like they take up much space or eat a lot.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:06 | 898037 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

It would take a book to answer your questions.. Those books have been written and promptly discredited for being racist.. go figure..

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:13 | 898099 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

... western collective guilt over the jewish genocide...

The jewish rabbis can not explain genocide. All jewish forums are full of questions "Where was God during genocide" or "I can not beleive in God, allowed genocide". They simply dont know.

I can tell You: genocide was a punishment for a ... jewish socialism. Jews invented it, and jewish authorities did not reject it, did not reject the communists' authorities. Take the punishment.

The ameriKan people is about to repeat the fate of jews. You support racist state of Israel. Take the punishment. Dont tell You were not warned.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:35 | 898162 Client 9
Client 9's picture

What will be your punishment for your tragic hatred?

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:47 | 898167 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

What will be your punishment for your tragic hatred?

Explanation of some events and hidden connections is my job.

Try to stop me.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:25 | 898184 Antipodeus
Antipodeus's picture

The Jews have been persecuted since at least the time of Alexander the Great, and the MAIN reason they've been persecuted is that they have consistently REFUSED to worship at the temple of SECULAR/TEMPORAL power.  Dr (B)lame's prejudices are, predictably, showing once again.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 02:49 | 898190 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

Did you say "persecuted"? And where was God (the owner of Holy Land)? Maybe he was asleep?

And please tell us, when and where was THAT OPEN AND PUBLIC court "God vs. Jews"? I am talking about the verdict to send all jews into GALUT from Judea for 2000 years. (There SHOULD be a court, God cannot just simply send jews without any direct, open and public explanation, wtitten in scriptures). I did not get an answer for this simple question from any jew or rabbi.

I am even ready to pay you for that priceless answer. (I got 2 dollars left).

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 04:31 | 898279 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

Antipodeus did not respond. He does not know. He did not even try. And .... he does not want my last 2 dollars.... Definitely he is not a jew.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:10 | 897970 zen0
zen0's picture

first one has to know a true word about Israel before bleating into the internets.

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:16 | 898101 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

You mean this one? (with hunreds referencies)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Israel

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:14 | 897736 destiny
destiny's picture

+1  and...it does nt

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:57 | 898352 GDE
GDE's picture

The world should never trust islam or any organization or country related to islam cause lying is a normal and even holly behavior for the Quran and for Mohamet. It's called Taqiyya.

http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Lying_for_Islam_%28taqiyya%29

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:01 | 897722 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Can't Benny just print up a shitload of dollars and pay them all to forget that this ever happened?  We all know how he loves to print.  And we all know how the people involved in the "Mideast Peace Process", ahem, love to enrich themselves.  When will they quit calling it a "peace process"?  I suppose when we quit calling massive counterfeiting of our money "quantitative easing". 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:30 | 897749 SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

Julian is prioritizing, this ranks above BAC. Constipation sucks.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:32 | 897754 doomandbloom
doomandbloom's picture

they need a good plumber to plug all these leaks?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:39 | 897765 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Anybody know G. Gordon Liddy's phone number?  Or is he in Vegas getting a lap dance? 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:39 | 897767 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

Here we go again. Media is being paid to pitch another story. Let's look at the 2001 attempt. NGO's are hungry to find critter's to shell out new monies for the ministry of propaganda.

Israel spies on the USA part 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWpWc_suPWo


Shit, I'm not supposed to remember this attempt to herd the feeble mind.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 19:41 | 897770 whatz that smell
whatz that smell's picture

if anybody here believes any of this bullshit you deserve the boofoo the injuns and the semites enjoy.

stockholm syndrome, bitchez.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:19 | 897809 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Not sure why the PA thinks this is a "declaration of war".  It proves how willing they have been to negotiate, and how totally unreasonable the Israelis have been through this whole process.

As usual, blame the ones with the power.  Lots of people don't want to do that.  It is more convenient blame it on the brown people and pretend that they hate us for our "freedom".

Funny part is, I used to get riled up at this kind of stuff, but the events of the last year have made that region seem totally irrelevant.  Am I the only one who is experiencing a profound case of "I don't give a fuck?"  Maybe its just because no babies are being run over with armored bulldozers at the moment.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:25 | 897818 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

I'm indifferent too. Let Israel be independent without US aid. If they succeed in peace, great, otherwise. Who cares?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:32 | 897825 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I believe you are overlooking the intrinsic good in all of this. 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 21:00 | 897880 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Which is?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:15 | 897977 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

Yeah i want to know too.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:05 | 898108 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

I'm indifferent too. Let Israel be independent without US aid. If they succeed in peace, great, otherwise. Who cares?

Bu-ha-ha! You are so naive....

When USA just started Iraq's war, some israelitos without any sign of hesitation  asked each other on web-forums: "Why are these young american boys HAVE TO DIE FOR US? Really, is there another way of defence of Israel?"

Need links?

Israel' jews - openly and with great proud  - think that the USA is really in their pocket.

And ... I think they are right.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:44 | 897854 zen0
zen0's picture

Not sure why the PA thinks this is a "declaration of war".

They don't. Mid-east bluster only. If someone in the Mid East speaks, the only trick is to find out where the lie lies.

 

 

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:51 | 897869 trav7777
trav7777's picture

I'm not sure why they said that either.

I will bet that the information as it's disclosed will paint them as anything but having been reasonable.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:14 | 897975 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

I think this will make the pa sound too reasonable. It looks like the pa will give up the right of return and overlook.that small bit of ethnic cleansing. That will end pa leadership.and immediately cause the palestinian people to turn toward hamas.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:21 | 898105 attst487
attst487's picture

They said that because the common Palestinian people would never compromise their capitol. This may be an attempt to incite a revolution amongst the Palestinians. They will riot and try to overthrow the PA, and Israel will come in and "clean up" just when the revolution is in full swing. Divide and conquer.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:27 | 898064 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Same here. My Give-a-damn meter is broken. Left/Right WTF-ever.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 20:34 | 897830 zen0
zen0's picture

Hama will enjoy this hoping to delegitimize the PA further. Could be a hamas operative in  the PA. Good for them. Keep Israel's enemies at each other's throats as Jerusalem continues to be a stumbling block for globalist fantasies.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:11 | 897968 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

KILL ALL ZIONIST JEWS! Win valuable prizes and coupons at participating merchandisers everywhere! Limited time offer. One entry per household. Other terms and conditions may apply.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:37 | 898120 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

As of today's morning, from the God's point of view - all modern americans are so-called kosher jews.

You are ruled by jews, your financial system is ruled by jewish mafia, your law is definitely talmudised, you are supporting modern Israel, you build the factories of world computer idolatry in Holy Land (Intel's fabs).

Therefore dont be surprised by the punishment. These punishments can have various forms: from economic and financial meltdown to asteroid.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:20 | 897983 tony bonn
tony bonn's picture

sounds like some folks don't want peace in the middle east...could the halliburton-carlyle group-rockefeller-dupont-rothschild-lockheed axis of evil want war?

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:37 | 898006 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

Hey now dont get.me wrong. I was only teasing about the jew killing prizes and coupons. They dont really exist. Just made it up. I of course welcome.our jewish overlords. They are such a small group of people yet they hold disproportionate influence in banking media entertainment.and usa politics. They even bribe our politicians with our own money we give to israel. Any group that smart must be the master race and i am your loyal cattle (goyim). Do with me as you.wish my lords because even in your most venerated books it is clear that your lives are worth more than mine and any of us other cattle. We are not worthy!

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 22:44 | 898013 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

If there is a kid at school.that everyone hates is it possible that the kid is unlikeable? Or does it mean every other kid just hates him for no reason. Actually its more complicated. This obnoxious kid that everyone else hates has a big retarded.friend who will beat you up if you criticise the kid.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:12 | 898044 JR
JR's picture

A former top CIA counter-terrorism official said after several hours of reading the "The Palestinian Papers": The Palestinian negotiators “would make a good-faith effort to meet the expectations of the ‘international community’ and hope against all hope that the Americans, once [they were] armed with credible assurances which Palestinian actions would supply, might finally honor their own objective national interests to produce some measure of justice for the Palestinians, a chance for stability in the region and a counter-narrative to the one propounded by al-Qaeda and its sympathizers in the Muslim world.” 


Robert Grenier, who retired from the CIA in 2006, explains in an article published by Al-Jazeera that the Israelis benefit from the status quo.  Palestinian negotiators “persist in the face of the Americans’ blatant advocacy on behalf of the Israelis, refusing to cave in to consistent American pressure designed to force the Palestinians to compensate for Israeli inflexibility with ever greater concessions of their own.”

Said Grenier, “In the face of Israeli condescension, obfuscation, and endless legalistic pettifogging they continually push back, insisting on application of relevant international law, despite the Israelis’ obvious contempt for their international obligations.”

Grenier’s point is that the Palestinian negotiators tried to come up with something for their people by giving more and more concessions to the Israelis in hopes for peace, but the Israelis would always say no. And this was a British-funded process.  In the last negotiations, Grenier says they were hoping that if they came up with something, anything, even tracking down so-called terrorists and hauling them in to make it look as if they were a peace loving people, it would be enough to satisfy the Israelis. That, too, failed.

Grenier's article, “Risks for Peace,” is sympathetic with these negotiators, suggesting that they thought if they gave lots and lot of concessions, the U.S. would supply some justice. 

The existence of this one-sided course within our Congress, our financial establishment and every important corner of the executive branch of our government has cost the American people nothing less than their sacred honor and this nation’s former stature in the world.

It is clear “justice” can no longer be expected or delivered by an Israeli-directed United States government.

A brave patriot, Grenier.

Sun, 01/23/2011 - 23:24 | 898057 Dan The Man
Dan The Man's picture

Peace in Palestine would not serve Amerikan interests.  Israel is the only stable democracy in the region. (well...Egypt's getting there) and they were conceived in war.  Amerika is bound to support them no matter what....And they know that!  So bring it on! Tehran will be a mushroom cloud eventually, too. 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:32 | 898118 JR
JR's picture

Israel wants land, Palestinian land... all of it...and their resources.  The Israelis love what we are doing.  They are very happy with the way things are going.  They have no intention of ever coming to an agreement with the Palestinians.  And they can do this because of the United States.  You can blame this on the United States, too.

As for being a democracy, Israel is a socialist state, as Jews from Ayn Rand to Netanyahu have stated.  Here are the details in excerpted form:

ISRAEL; A SOCIALIST SPARTA | Socialism is dead everywhere – except Israel  | Justin Raimondo | April 29, 2002 (excerpts)

It is surely among the most ludicrous ironies of history that, having defeated two forms of socialism in the past 50 or so years – one on the battlefield, and the other in the hearts of men – the US is now supporting, single-handedly, one of the last socialist regimes on earth…

We are often told that the moral superiority of Israel is inherent in its democratic form of government. But there's a slight problem: in a democracy you can vote yourself a guaranteed annual income at somebody else's expense, and, in Israel's case, that somebody boils down to you, the American taxpayer.

Thanks to you, the American taxpayer, the socialist ideal didn't die with the collapse of the old Soviet Empire. You are paying for Israeli socialism, including for the provocative settlements the purpose of which is only to create a pretext for war. You are footing the bill for those American-provided tanks rolling over Ramallah and an army outfitted with the best weapons US tax dollars can buy…

Israel was conceived in the minds of its original founders and supporters as an explicitly socialist state. The very idea of private property was anathema to the founders of the state of Israel, who were socialists almost to a man. However, the early success of the Zionist project demonstrated, not the superiority of socialism over capitalism, but quite the opposite. As Alvin Rabushka points out, prior to independence, virtually all investment in the country was private, involving the purchase of land by private individuals and the dispensing of private funds raised by the Zionist organizations abroad. But it wasn't just ideology that prompted the still-birth of the Israeli private sector. After independence, private capital investments in Israel contracted to no more than 15 percent of the total between 1948 and 1990. The reason: German reparations…

Instead of being used to build the infrastructure so sorely needed by the infant economy, however, Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion handed the dough over to the Jewish Labor Organization, the Histadrut, which established a network of state-owned enterprises. No private company or individual was allowed title or access to their own piece of personal "compensation." Instead, in accordance with their socialist ideology, the funds were administered by "the workers" – that is, by their alleged representatives in the Histadrut and the various political parties, who appointed the boards of directors and allocated the cash…

Created by German reparations, Israeli socialism quickly strangled any emerging free markets, and, over the long stretch of the Israeli Labor Party's unbroken rule, "a system of almost total identity between political and economic power" – as Israeli economist Yair Aharoni describes it – was created that persists to this day…

In a wonderful article by Zev Golan, associate director of the Institute for Advanced Strategic and Political Studies (IASPS) in Jerusalem, the key to understanding the Israeli economy is contained in a single axiom:

"An entire country is on the dole. The huge amount of foreign aid that comes in props up a bankrupt socialist system and prevents Israel's private sector from making any real progress. Those in power live off the money of others and live for it…

http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j042902.html

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 03:08 | 898155 DrLamer
DrLamer's picture

True. There is a huge (sided) opposition in modern Israel, consisting of .... russian jews. They all were so amazed, when they came into The Holy Land and ... have met .... socialism AGAIN!

Even "president" Bill Clinton in his recent speech in Israel has admitted that (without explanation why russkie jews are opposing socialism in Israel).

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-09-23/world/middle.east.bill.clinton_1_yisr...

(Sorry, comrades amerikans, I cannot call "President" a person, who was raped and humiliated by a ... jewish girl.)

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 08:30 | 898328 GDE
GDE's picture

Historically, Arabs stole the Middle East lands to Jews and Christians and that land you call Paslestine was only occupated by a bunch of Bedouins and Jews living as dhimmis. There was nothing there before Israel. Native "Palestinians" don't exist. They're all Jordanians or Irakies and citizens of others muslims states.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhimmi

 

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 11:50 | 898781 JR
JR's picture

The Balfour Declaration, a letter from British Foreign Secretary Arthur James Balfour to Lord Rothschild, made public the British support of a Jewish homeland in Palestine after years of negotiation.

The 1917 letter led the League of Nations to entrust the United Kingdom with the Palestine Mandate in 1922.  

From Margaret MacMillan’s book, “Paris 1919” :

“The Balfour Declaration had promised such protection for what it called ‘the existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine,’ a curious formulation when Palestinian Arabs, most of them Muslim but including some Christians, made up about four-fifths of a population of 700,000.  It also reflected a tendency on the part of both the world’s statesmen and Zionist leaders to see Palestine as somehow empty. ‘If the Zionists do not go there,’ said Sir Mark Sykes firmly, ‘some one will, nature abhors a vacuum.’  A British Zionist is supposed to have coined the phrase ‘The land without people—for the people without land.’”

Balfour, in 1925, on his first visit to Palestine since the Jews were established there, “was touched by the reception he received throughout Palestine from Jews but failed to notice the Arabs in mourning and the shops closed in protest.  His private secretary destroyed the hundreds of angry telegrams he received from Arabs before he could see them.  When he and his party moved on to Syria to do some sight seeing, the French authorities mounted a guard around him, much to his annoyance.  In Damascus, his hotel was surrounded by an excited crowd of 6000 Arabs. As the paving stones started to fly, and the French cavalry fired back, Balfour watched bemused.  A young Arab attached to his party tried to explain why there was such opposition to Zionism.  Balfour merely replied that he found the results of his experiment, ‘Extraordinarily interesting.'

“He sailed back to Europe on the Sphinx.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:00 | 898086 Hedge Jobs
Hedge Jobs's picture

its about time we got some more israel posts! No doubt plenty of others here on ZH have been longing to post about their love and admiration of this law abiding, democratic and unfairly victimized state. A beacon of peace and justice for others to look up to. Such a thoughtful and unselfish people with the utmost respect for human rights and international law. I cant think of a better example anywhere on earth where people tolerate and respect each others differences as much as the jews of isreal do.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:57 | 898134 JR
JR's picture

And humble...

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:04 | 898090 brodix
brodix's picture

What joker filled all the fire extinguishers with gasoline, Dammit!!!

It should be noted that polytheists invented democracy and monotheism mostly served to legitimize the divine right of kings. IF there is a spiritual absolute, it would be the essence from which we rise, not an ideal from which we fell:

The Second Coming

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer; 
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold; 
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world, 
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned; 
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity. 
Surely some revelation is at hand; 
Surely the Second Coming is at hand. 
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in the sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man, 
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun, 
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds. 
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle, 
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

W.B.Yeats
Mon, 01/24/2011 - 00:46 | 898128 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

"Al-Jazeera has just declared was on Palestinians, which intuitively makes little sense."

this shows little awareness of the author of the palestinian issue

many palestinians  view the PA as pawns of the west. Even some who might vote for the PA believe this but vote for them thinking appeasemnent of the west/israel will give their war weary people peace

the reason why hamas has won the democratic votes recently is because the US/Isreal has done so little by way of token compromise that might convince palesitians that a vote for the PA will in any way raise them from their dog-shit under israeli's boot existence

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:05 | 898139 pods
pods's picture

.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 01:38 | 898164 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

We may be the big retarded friend of that obnoxious mean kid that everyone hates, but that retard is slowly wising up to how contemptuously we are treated. The final straw was stealing military secrets and giving it to russians in exchange for increased jewish emigration. Now only.the.fundamentalists hoping.for.a second coming of jesus support israel. The evidence of ethnic cleansing.is clear and irrefutable to those willing to keep an open mind. All of the removals were sad, but haifa was a vibrant palestinian city. It was too big to bulldoze so the israelis just pushed the palestinians out. You should look at the pictures of haifa pre 1947. There is incontrovertible proof of ethnic cleansing. How do pro zionists defend it? Apartheid.south africa was israels important ally because birds of a feather flock together.

Mon, 01/24/2011 - 21:06 | 900968 Suisse
Suisse's picture

Why are people from the Arabian Peninsula squatting in the homeland of the Israelites? A two-state solution will most likely come about eventually.

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