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Arguments Regarding the Collapse of the World Trade Center Evaporate Upon Inspection
Preface: Bill Black writes today that Wall Street apologists say that calling for prosecution of Wall Street fraud is like saying the Twin Towers were brought down by controlled demolition.
Now that Bin Laden has been confirmed to be dead, it has been established that Saddam Hussein was not behind 9/11 (one of the main reasons for the Iraq war), and Iran
has been accused of having a hand in 9/11 - potentially forming the
basis for a war against Iran - it is time to revisit some important,
unanswered questions.
This essay does not argue that bombs brought down the Twin Towers or World Trade Building 7, even though many top structural engineers believe that is what happened, and people could easily have planted bombs in the trade centers without anyone noticing and without the conspiracy being discovered.
It simply addresses the frequent argument that fires caused the metal
to sag, which brought down the 3 buildings, and that the case is closed.
The Fires at the World Trade Centers Were NOT Very Hot
The
government agency in charge of the investigation of why three buildings
collapsed on 9/11 - the National Institute of Standards and Technology
(NIST) - says that paint tests indicated low steel temperatures -- 480 Fahrenheit -- "despite pre-collapse exposure to fire". NIST also said that microstructure tests showed no steel reached critical (half-strength) values of 600 Celsius (1112 degrees Fahrenheit) for any significant time.
Numerous top fire protection engineers have said that the fires in the World Trade Centers were not that hot. For example:
- A
mechanical engineer with 20 years experience as a Fire Protection
Engineer for the U.S. Departments of Energy, Defense, and Veterans
Affairs, who is a contributing Subject Matter Expert to the U.S.
Department of Energy Fire Protection Engineering Functional Area
Qualification Standard for Nuclear Facilities, a board member of the
Northern California - Nevada Chapter of the Society of Fire Protection
Engineers, currently serving as Fire Protection Engineer for the city of
San Jose, California, the 10th largest city in the United States
(Edward S. Munyak) says that the fires weren't big enough to bring down
Building 7:
- The
former head of NIST's Fire Science Division, who is
one of the world’s leading fire science researchers and
safety engineers, a Ph.D. in mechanical engineering
(Dr. James Quintiere), called
for an independent review of the World Trade Center
collapse investigation. "I would really like
to see someone else take a look at what they've done; both
structurally and from a fire point of view. ... I
think the official conclusion that NIST arrived at
[that fire and damage from the attacks brought down the buildings] is
questionable.
In addition, Thomas Eager, a
Professor of Materials Engineering and Engineering Systems at MIT and a
defender of the official story, concluded
that the temperatures in the Twin Towers never exceeded 800 Celsius
(1472 degrees Fahrenheit). Eager pointed out that, contrary to popular
belief, jet fuel from the planes did not increase the temperature of the fires.
Structural engineer Antonio Artha notes:
Fire and impact were insignificant in all three buildings.
Structural engineer Graham John Inman points out:
The fire on this building [World Trade Building 7] was small & localized therefore what is the cause?
Thermal
images also suggest that the temperature of the steel in the north
tower at the time of the fire was not much more than 250 degrees Fahrenheit (and see this).
The Argument Evaporates Upon Inspection
Defenders
of the "official" version of 9/11 say, in rebuttal, that the fires
didn't have to be that hot, because - while not hot enough to melt steel - they were hot enough to cause the metal to sag.
It
is irrelevant (and beyond the scope of this post) whether or not their
argument is correct. Specifically, since even defenders of official
story admit that the fires were not hot enough to melt steel, then it is
impossible to explain the huge quantify of molten steel which was
observed under Ground Zero for months after the attacks (see next
section, below).
Indeed, not only was structural steel somehow melted on 9/11, but it was EVAPORATED. Specifically, as the New York Times reports, an expert stated about World Trade Center building 7:
A
combination of an uncontrolled fire and the structural damage might
have been able to bring the building down, some engineers said. But
that would not explain steel members in the debris pile that appear to
have been PARTLY EVAPORATED in extraordinarily high temperatures.
(pay-per-view).
Note that evaporation means conversion from a liquid to a gas; so the steel beams in building 7 were subjected to temperatures high enough to melt and evaporate them.
It is simply impossible that fires from jet fuels and office materials could do that.
Molten Metal Under Ground Zero for MONTHS After Attacks
There was molten metal under ground zero for months after 9/11:
- The structural engineer responsible for the design of the WTC, described fires still burning and molten steel still running 21 days after the attacks (page 3)
- A structural engineer who worked for the Trade Center's original designer saw "streams of molten metal that leaked from the hot cores and flowed down broken walls inside the foundation hole." (pages 31-32)
- An engineer stated in the September 3, 2002 issue of The Structural Engineer, "They showed us many fascinating slides ranging from molten metal, which was still red hot weeks after the event."
- New York firefighters recalled in a documentary film, "heat so intense they encountered rivers of molten steel."
- A NY firefighter described molten steel flowing at ground zero, and said it was like a "foundry" or like "lava".
- A public health advisor who arrived at Ground Zero on September 12, said that "feeling the heat" and "seeing the molten steel" there reminded him of a volcano.
- An employee of New Jersey's Task Force One Urban Search and Rescue witnessed "Fires burn[ing and molten steel flow[ing] in the pile of ruins still settling beneath her feet."
- The head of a team of scientists studying the potential health effects of 9/11, reported, "Fires are still actively burning and the smoke is very intense. In some pockets now being uncovered, they are finding molten steel."
- According to a worker involved with the organizing of demolition, excavation and debris removal operations at ground zero, "Underground it was still so hot that molten metal dripped down the sides of the wall from Building 6."
- A reporter with rare access to the debris at ground zero "descended deep below street level to areas where underground fires still burned and steel flowed in molten streams."
- According to a member of New York Air National Guard's 109th Air Wing, who was at Ground Zero from September 22 to October 6, "One
fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the
towers' remains. Firemen sprayed water to cool the debris down but
the heat remained intense enough at the surface to melt their boots."
- A retired professor of physics and atmospheric science said "in
mid-October when they would pull out a steel beam, the lower part
would be glowing dull red, which indicates a temperature on the order
of 500 to 600 °C. And we know that people were turning over pieces of
concrete in December that would flash into fire--which requires about
300 °C. So the surface of the pile cooled rather rapidly, but the bulk
of the pile stayed hot all the way to December."
- A fireman stated that there were "oven" like conditions at the trade centers six weeks after 9/11.
- Firemen and hazardous materials experts also stated that, six weeks after 9/11, "There
are pieces of steel being pulled out [from as far as six stories
underground] that are still cherry red" and "the blaze is so 'far beyond
a normal fire' that it is nearly impossible to draw conclusions about
it based on other fires." (pay-per-view)
- A NY Department of Sanitation spokeswoman said "for
about two and a half months after the attacks, in addition to its
regular duties, NYDS played a major role in debris removal - everything
from molten steel beams to human remains...."
- New York mayor Rudy Giuliani said "They were standing on top of a cauldron. They were standing on top of fires 2,000 degrees that raged for a hundred days."
- As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O'Toole saw a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, "was dripping from the molten steel."
- A rescue worker "crawled through an opening and down crumpled stairwells to the subway five levels below ground. He remembers seeing in the darkness a distant, pinkish glow–molten metal dripping from a beam"
- See also witness statements at the beginning of this video.
The
fact that there was molten steel under ground zero for months after
9/11 is very odd, especially since firefighters sprayed millions of
gallons of water on the fires and applied high-tech fire retardants.
Specifically, 4 million gallons of water were dropped on Ground Zero within the first 10 days after September 11, according to the U.S. Department of Energy's Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratories:
The
spraying continued for months afterward (the 10 day period was simply
the timeframe in which the DOE was sampling). Enormous amounts of
water were hosed on Ground Zero continuously, day and night:
This photograph may capture a sense of how wet the ground became due to the constant spraying:
Moreover, the fires were sprayed with thousands of gallons of high tech fire-retardants.
It was not the collapses which caused steel to melt. Specifically, a professor emeritus of physics has proven that the collapses themselves could not have melted steel. And Brent Blanchard - a recognized expert in controlled demolition - stated in a telephone interview with physicist Steven Jonesv that he has witnessed hundreds of controlled demolitions, but has never seen molten metal at any of the demolition sites.
So how does NIST explain the molten metal? It denies its existence:
»
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Why does everyone assume the towers were targeted by humans? Transdimensional "anti-human" elements are most likely to blame. Ron Paul hinted at this when he said we "needed to hold a mirror up to the problem."
The nuke theory was debunked already - see this site. And read about Nikola Tesla as well. They had technology like this for a long time already.
http://www.drjudywood.com/
I spent a few minutes on this website. It refers to the issue of molten metal as "alleged molten metal", but the link to the alleged support for that position is a dead end.
http://www.drjudywood.com/articles/DEW/
debunked by whom? more professional trolls out there spreading disinformation on 911 than almost any other subject. see how many of the first responders are dying of cancer and will continue to die. they can't this one foreever.
Couldn't that also be an effect of the pulverized electronics and asbestos insulation?
In addition to requiring Africans to die in order to produce them, the chemicals in them are quite hazardous - are they not?
The asbestos albatross made this little bit of "Creative Destruction" essential for Mr. Silverstein and his band of crooked Land Grabbers.
Additionally, it facilitated increased trafficking of guns (and drugs), cleared Enron of wrongdoing in their looting of CALIFORNIA, enabled massive stock-jobbing, killed the anti-globalization movement, etc ...
911 was all good for economic growth, and a PR victory for Uncle Sam unlike anything done, ever.
It was a bonanza. It still is, which explains why USAma is still in the news.
Where's Zarqawi these days?
Good post GW.
Seems Obama is getting slammed from more than one direction. Black social activist and university professor Cornel West calls out Obama as being a part of the oligarchy and challenges Americans to rise up like people in Europe and the Middle East are doing. Read here:
http://redpillfactory.blogspot.com/2011/05/cornel-west-calls-out-obama.html
Cornell West = Al Sharpton.
They're to the Dems as Ron "John Birch Society" Paul is to the Grand Old Party.
you may not personally have the taste for Cornell's flavor, but if Okie-Doke Al had 1/4 of the cajones that West has, shit would come clean mighty quick.
Sharpton = Court Jester, West = Fool
big difference.
So Ron Paul is a Bircher huh? Figures. Who does he think he is with all that Constitution BS, and End The Fed nonsense? We don't want none of that!! /sarc
Such large number of molten support steel beams easily explains the collapse of the World Trade Center buildings.
So, how does science explain the existence of the molten metal? I like to know.
caco
"Such large number of molten support steel beams easily explains the collapse of the World Trade Center buildings."
Don't think anyone needs to argue that fire melts steel...I just don't understand how it collapsed them all perfectly?
I wonder what any demolition company would have proposed or bid to create a controlled demolition of WT Bldgs if it were a project...meaning, is there any firm out that say with full confidence they could have performed a controlled demolition of that size succesfully?
this was done in brooklyn 7/01 (watch the end for some foreshadow)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxGDRVuiX8Q
there had been at least one study comissioned prior to 9-11 to detail the costs of ridding the WTC towers of asbestos, it was found to be cost prohibitive. Why would (aside from obvious implications of that fact) someone decide to lease the building when faced with such an evironmental and safety impediment? knowledgable i am not, in search of truth i am (always).
there had been at least one study comissioned prior to 9-11 to detail the costs of ridding the WTC towers of asbestos, it was found to be cost prohibitive. Why would (aside from obvious implications of that fact) someone decide to lease the building when faced with such an evironmental and safety impediment? knowledgable i am not, in search of truth i am (always).
And don't forget the asbestos nexus of Cheney-Halliburton-Dresser-Bush-9/11
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/911review/2006/12/dear-m...
"Once the entire 9/11 charade was concluded, the Administration generally, and Cheney specifically, had every reason in the world to blame Iraq.
The Afghanistan mission could not provide Halliburton with enough
revenue to offset the massive asbestos liability claim. Iraq and Iran
are essential wars in order to provide cover for the infusion of the
billion of TAX DOLLARS necessary to both profit Halliburton for its
actual work AND cover the massive asbestos liability claims.
Now you know why Halliburton was awarded the contracts without
the need to bid for them. This was all prearranged."
how is Haliburton connected with the asbestos claims?
Halliburton acquired Dresser which had Bush ownership. Dresser had huge asbestos liability which was a draw on Halliburton's earnings until all those no bid contracts from the Afg-Raq invasion appeared.
Due diligence means nothing when you are plutocratic gangsters constantly changing the rules.
Have you ever seen any controlled demolition that collapsed from the top down?
Wow this looks exactly how the WTC collapsed
:-)
George just made someone look silly
Yes. All of them. The Demolition Contractors association once had a good web site showing how it is done and in great detail. The site was removed just after the WTC "collapse".
Some suggest that "particle beams" destroyed the towers - tuned to specificially disintegrate steel & concrete:
http://www.drjudywood.com/
Good point. And why has no one addressed the fact that Rumsfeld was found with a "quark gun" in his pocket just hours after the collapse?
Maybe his Quark gun went off and ZAPPED the missing $3 TRILLION
dollars into oblivion.
But who can worry about that missing $3 TRILLION dollars while
we're still hunting for Osama Bin Laden....er,....um...ok.
Uh, ok. WTF HAPPENED TO BEN BERNANKE'S MISSING POCKET
MONEY?!?!?!?!
Rumsfeld said that the $2.3 Trillion dollars was unaccounted for, not missing. There are several computer programs at the Pentagon that can't talk to each other, so the money was not able to be tracked. It doesn't mean it was missing.
This sounds very much like a CIA disinformation campaign, so we have to be very careful about the angles we take on this story. It is much easier to have everyone discount everything else when the "missing" money and the "missing" gold stories are proven to be false.
Much like Eisenhower and his militay-industrial complex ideas...because he had been visited by aliens in the White House.
There is no missing money and there is no missing gold. We should stick to the physics, as it is our strong suit.
P.S. Everyone, please listen to these tapes. It is very well worth the time.
http://obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com/2011/05/plot-thickens-debt-collector-obamas.html
thanks orly, hard for me to stomach the host so i couldn't listen to all of it, but that's a deep rabbit hole for sure...Fraudclosure Exhibit A.
somebody should have t-shirts made with just the SS# on it, nothing else.
No one has proved that the particle beams didn't come from WTC7. And that's why WTC7 had to be destroyed.
CIA and Mossad ran the event from WTC7, that's why it had to go down.
http://www.wtc7.net/background.html
Something went down at that command center. No doubt.
The Enron angle is an important one, too.
The more you dig, the more connections one finds. It's an incredible operation, really.
So many people have made so much loot.
I've always found it interesting that Enron execs had 34 meetings
@ the White House in the two months before their company collapsed
like Richard Simmons in a live volcano.
I guess being the #1 campaign contributor in GWB's Gubner and President
campaign has a few perks?
Ain't it great that Goldman Sachs is Obama's Enron?
Capitalism + Democracy = Pharaohs and Slaves, BITCHEZ!
I'll speculate flight 93 was headed for WTC 7 as well, seeing as it originated in Newark. CIA/CNN plant Peter Bergen started the "headed for the Capitol" meme after concocting some phony story about Special Forces beating that information out of one of Osama's gang members. Hogwash. A Canadian Norad fighter likely took it out, Rumsfeld admitted as much.
This shit is getting old. By this time either you're a dope, enlightened, or a traitor.
I've not heard about the Canadian fighter. Got a source?
Certainly-
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/shootdown.html
Not to mention the missing gold reserves
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/gold.html
Might have been some type of paper gold product. Lehman vault was missing PM's when it went bankrupt.
For which there has never been claimed a loss.
OK, so no insurance claims filed, for LBMA good delivery warehouses are generally insured for standard business practice liabilities, but none insure the PM's which they hold from theft, let alone an act of War or of God. Period.
So, if nothing was covered under insurance, somebody, somewhere who held rightful ownership to the missing (and yes, it is) gold held in the subbasement vault at the WTC should have likely have taken a monetary charge to earnings in the ensuing period. Not heard of anybody doing that now, have we? Hmmmmmm?
And, some time after the collapse, Mayor Giuliani was quoted as mentioning that the gold had been recovered. But.... The dollar figure he cited was way the fuck too small, the vault was not yet accessible, temperatures were too high (pools of steel, which melts at much higher remperatures than gold) there were pictures published of an empty vault taken prior to the destruction of the buildings that the gold had purportedly been taken physically prior thereto. For which the vaulting records (held offsite) were later conveniently missing (so no record of it being moved, or not, in all fairness) and the chap in charge of the records has disappeared.... nobody can find him. (Costa Rica or Giants Stadium with Jimmy Hoffa?)
Now, that all sounds like conspiracy theory crap. Which many believe it to be. So be it. But, but, but, with respect to the records, etc., nobody has been able to show otherwise... for anything. There's just been silence.
Aw shucks. These durned oddities and coincidences. And it all started with Rose Mary Wood's fat foot on the Dictaphone erase pedal in 1973?
Better than a Raymond Chandler Sam Spade novel.
The gold was in the basements of Building Four, not Seven. It was moved several days after the incidents, most likely back to Nova Scotia.
Hey, I'm looking at property in the DC suburbs. Can you give me any recommendations?
WTC 1&2 didn't collapse because of the fire, but floor truss failure due to faulty design and construction. but we couldn't say that officially (too much liability) so it took the NIST years to explain how the fires did it. The molten metal in the basement? How many offices had computer backup systems consisting of lead-acid batteries?
WTC7 is still very suspicious.
But the sayanim Jim Meigs and Chertoff's Israeli cousin said that the towers fell like a series of pancakes in Popular Mechanics!
"WTC 1&2 didn't collapse because of the fire, but floor truss failure due to faulty design and construction."
it seems this is the latest meme being pushed. have to admit, it's the most plausible one yet, as anyone who knows anything about NYC construction knows that no corner is left uncut when there's graft to be had.
however, if this is indeed the case, this would mean criminal negligence of the highest order. thus, anyone pushing this meme that does not also cry out for another investigation to get to the bottom of it reeks of intellectual dishonesty and moral cowardice.
We hate to disagree with such knowledgeable engineers such as you, but:
Had you bothered to check the website of the designers and builders of the WTC which did not "disappear" until a few days later; you would have seen the strongest most bomb and airplane proof structures on the planet.
The designer/architect himself said that there are not enough 707s flying to knock down my buildings. The buildings can absorb, with no structural damage, multiple hits by fully fuelled 707s travelling at maximum speed.
The shiny steel surfaces one sees as the buildings glossy surfaces are not relevant structural items.
The basic backbone of the WTC is the Battleship Grade 4 to 6 inch thick steel columns in the center of the structure. These can only be cut with military grade "Thermate" many pounds of which we have as evidence. (Thermate or more correctly, nano-thermate) was a constituent of all the dust which piled up in lower Manhattan.
The smaller building known as WTC6 was demolished by explosives long before any "airplanes" appeared. WTC 7 was obviously properly "demolished" by professional explosives / Thermate. The owner (in 2001) of the WTC increased the insurance coverage of each tower to $20 Billion (from $2 Billion a few months before) The owner, interviewed on "NPR" afterwards said that he spoke to the NYC Fire Chief that afternoon regarding building 7 and told the Fire Chief that it would be better to "pull it". You can see this interview in the NPR archives. His use of the phrase "pull it" is a tell for professional demolition. It is a phrase unknown to the public.
In the most telling manner the complete wreckage was removed ans sold abroad for scrap immediately; lest an investigation show the myriad Thermate cut channels in each steel beam. The other thing removed was the complete set of architectural documents which gave every structural detail of all the buildings.
Another interesting item was the exact location of the strike point of each aircraft. Check out who the tenants were on the floor above.
The airforce 747 "controller" aircraft is visible orbiting about 8 miles away in many home videos.
The "airplane" that made the small hole in the pentagon wall was never seen by anyone or any security camera of which the pentagon has more than a few.
We could go on for days but it is as obvious as the "demolition" of Joplin Mo. by tornadoes how it happened and by whom. The Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI) has a number of very interesting publications regarding the "tenants" and the targeting of the ONI itself in the pentagon.
There may be more "911s" as your people become more desperate.
And: There are thousands of "us" around the world who know who they are.
well said Confuchius. Welcome to the discussion. Desperation and 911s do seem to go together unfortunately
Well stated Confuchius.
Larry Silverstein is just one Zionista pig that made himself lots of blood money that day.
Get em Luke!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtPC0W4HII8
In reference to the pentagon attack, take a look at this surveillance video that catches the nose of the aircraft, it doesn't look like a commercial jet but more like a drone or missle.
Edit: I originally posted the wrong link. Sorry, Heres the right one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsWZHKIg3Cs
Do your homework- there were NO trusses in the WTC design. Check out the website ae911truth.org It is a page by architects and engineers that explain why the WTC did not fall due to a fire-induced gravitational collapse as was sold to the public by the media.
You can have your wacky theories, but you can't make up facts. The WTC design had trusses on every f*cking floor. They spanned the central core to the lattice outer shell. There are a mountain of pictures and videos of the buildings being constructed. So unless this conspiracy theory goes back to the late 1960's, your theory is full of crap. (Unless this was all some plot by LBJ?)