This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Bailout Recipient Banks Lending Drops For Sixth Consecutive Month

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It was just yesterday that Tim Geithner was lying that banks are constantly increasing lending to consumers. Well, yet another lie refuted. Banks, and not just any banks, but those receiving government bail outs and subsidies, continued constricting lending in July, with total average loan balance outstanding declining by $54 billion from $4,295 billion to $4,241 billion, a 1.3% decline, following a 1.1% decline in June.

As for the reason why loan originations in July declined a whopping 10% after posting a 12.7% increase in June, the government simply noted that this was due to "decreased demand from borrowers."

And so the circular lie continues: the government claims lending is increasing, when in fact, it is not, and when confronted with this fact, the government claims this is due to lack of interest. Furthermore, with retail sales reportedly higher, the consumer is allegedly spending more, with average wages declining, meaning consumer need to borrow to finance purchases, or else eat into their meager savings. Yet all this is occurring on the foreground of a rapidly increasing savings rate. So consumers are not borrowing, they are saving more, yet somehow sales are increasing: the lie is so circular that if there was a Kudlowbot, its head would explode trying to "spin" this null argument.

Last but not least, the primary politically correct reason for bailing out banks was to ensure that they can continue lending. So here are the numbers: $4,434.7 billion in loans outstanding in January, $4,241.4 billion in July: a 4.4% decline, which, all else being equal, would have to be offset by a comparable increase in the rate of savings. However, with wages declining and more and more people becoming unemployed, all else is anything but equal. At least bank CEOs get their precious bail out capital and golden parachute packages (ref: John Thain) as popular media outlets continue spinning lies and spewing factless propaganda.

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:44 | 70544 AN0NYM0US
AN0NYM0US's picture

" It was just yesterday that Tim Geithner was lying"

 

and in an earlier post from ZH the title

 

Someone Is Lying

 

 

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:49 | 70552 Pizza Delivery Man
Pizza Delivery Man's picture

No one is lying. This all based on racial tensions.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:55 | 70816 AndItsGone
AndItsGone's picture

False. I'm only criticizing Obama's white half.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:47 | 70887 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Very funny! I'm going to have to remember that one.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:35 | 70605 SV
SV's picture

"The great mass of people... will more easily fall victim to a big lie than to a small one." Mein Kampf, Vol 1, Chap. 3

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:50 | 70623 pivot
pivot's picture

ahahahahah - man-made global warming.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:35 | 70675 They steal from...
They steal from us everyday's picture

TURBO TAX TIMMY DON"T LIE!!!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:41 | 70903 Spartacus
Spartacus's picture

ANOTHER SHAMELESS MINISTER

“Unemployment still remains a real problem for families up and down the country,” Employment minister Jim Knight said on BBC News. “We’ve got to keep the support going and not be tempted to celebrate the recovery.”

The unemployment rate in the three months through July rose to 7.9 percent, the most since 1996, the statistics office said. That compares with the latest figures of 9.5 percent in the euro region, 9.7 percent in the U.S. and 5.7 percent in Japan.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:47 | 70550 Pizza Delivery Man
Pizza Delivery Man's picture

I'm trying to raise capital to flip some realestate in SD.

Anyone interested?

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:12 | 70570 reading
reading's picture

Would that be South Dakota or San Diego? 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:10 | 70645 Pizza Delivery Man
Pizza Delivery Man's picture

San Diego...of course

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:05 | 70744 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Can you get it rezoned as commercial property and then have it evaluated as such? Instant 40 percent gain mutha focker!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:10 | 70748 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Are you trying to lose money?

I am Chumbawamba.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:37 | 70767 MinnesotaNice
MinnesotaNice's picture

I'm kinda with Chumbawamba on this one... I don't think that the spread between the sale of a barebones home versus a remodeled home is great enough to make it worth your while... it used to be... but I think that housing is one big flea market right with very narrow spreads.  And with housing prices still falling... you may buy a house to flip right now... get the remodel done within 6 months... then find out it has fallen another 5-10% and lose your profit that way.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:20 | 70893 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

aside from the fact that after remodeling, you'll have to find a ready, willing, and able buyer... in an environment where such buyer cannot obtain financing because A. he's not credit worthy and/or B. the potential financing institution is scared shitless about loss reserves and is using the tarp/talf to bolster reserves to weather a regulator storm (at least at the regional bank level, since those banks will be sold for pennies on the dollar and simply funneled up to ensure the doctrine of mutually assured destruction is fortified).

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:21 | 70894 reading
reading's picture

Excellent, All in...

 

 

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 09:02 | 70913 Whizbang
Whizbang's picture

This is a perfect chance to use the FHA before they implode.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:41 | 70810 Printfaster
Printfaster's picture

First off I assume this is a joke, kind of because soliciting business here is well, kinda not sorta welcome.

If it isn't, my insight says that people are actually looking for crappier, unimproved properties to save on cash and down payment  so that they can have a project home to move in.  We did that during the real estate crash of the early 80s.  No way we wanted to buy some tarted up overpriced ego inflated property.

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:53 | 70555 Thurifer
Thurifer's picture

AEP mentioned this in the article TD linked to earlier. With the M1,M2,&M3 all declining, isn't this bullish for the dollar, no matter how much money they print? Or is this just the fabled "Ka" in "Ka-Boom"?

Forgive my ignorance but my degree is in theology not economics.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:24 | 70655 Steak
Steak's picture

I truly believe we are in the disinflationary "Ka" before an inflationary "boom".  One shred of actual good data out of the steaming pile before us will send this thing to the moon.  For now the dollar carry trade lives, or if that explanation doesn't float your boat then non-US issuance is higher than ever.  Either way the move has legs.

But if one thinks in cycles then this would be a mini-cycle of a much bigger one to come.  The fiatistas will/are now successful in reflating the bubble.  This mini-cycle will end with the inflation trade capitulating to the upside (mini boom). 

That will set off mondo-deflation that is the big KA.  After an indeterminate time in deflationary death spiral, when enough dollar denominated financial products dissappear, then we'll go full tilt Weimar and all paper wealth will go poof. 

Just one guy's opinion, ya know.

More on this idea from someone who knows more than I: http://news.kontentkonsult.com/2008/11/deflation-inflation-two-step-too....

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:18 | 70757 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

if your degree had been in economics you would be
beyond redemption to put it mildly....

you are correct that mx are slowing and possibly
declining....

this in general is bad for people and business
as it leads to less available capital if indeed
demand is there....the evidence suggests that
it is not...yet i also believe that the economy
is being squeezed by the oligarchs in a planned
depression...surely if you accept thet notion
of evil you can accept that scenario as plausible...

there are many stories about healthy businesses
going out of business because the banks won't
loan...

however, if credit is declining for valid
demand reasons, then the shrinkage in money
supply would be expected....and it could lead
to dollar strength - maybe...

printed money will be measured by at least one
of the m-series...so your statement is
confused about printing money but not
showing up in the money supply....

it may not circulate - i.e. is deposited in the
federal reserve where ~800b is sitting doing
absolutely nothing

there is a strong possibility that reductions
in circulating money supply could prop up the
dollar....but the other consideration is that
many countries are in the process of dropping
the dollar as a trade currency thus it may be a net wash...

as far as exchange rates, the dollar has been
dropping coincident with the drop in money
supply....so i am not sure that i buy the
argument...

i do not have an economics degree so caveat
emptor...

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:44 | 70803 TumblingDice
TumblingDice's picture

If your question is regarding relative bullishness and bearishness of dollar exchange rates, then it is bullish for the dollar if these money supply metrics are declining faster for the dollar than they are for other currencies. (...is the simple and crude answer) Of course market psychology and government policy of various world players play a big part as well. For example, if the money supply shrinks so much that it becomes evident that it is impossible for the US government to pay off its obligations since the amount of obligations takes on a much larger part of the total money supply, then it is also possible to have a run on the currency and that would obviously be bearish.

Now if you could indulge my curiosity for a second. In another thread someone mentioned that Lucifer and Satan were different things, that one was associated with light and the other was the Prince of Darkness. Is this true? If so, what distinguishes them from one another?

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 17:17 | 71608 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I think that was a reply from ProjectMayhem, where the distinction was Luciferianism, 'the idea that the Architect is superior to the Creator. The light of Lucifer -- old intelligent dude with the beard, "the Architect"' and Satanism, characterized as a fallen angel or demon. Thread - www.zerohedge.com/article/cftc-seeking-your-feedback

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 11:22 | 71072 Chumly
Chumly's picture

Thurifer:

The correlative econo-theological reference is Rev. 6:5-6.  Now, I'm no eschatologist but it is my speculation that the third seal (as well as 4,5,6 with the "boom" of 6 yet to come) are open, depending on whether you approach it from a linear or non-linear "time" perspective.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 11:22 | 71073 Chumly
Chumly's picture

Thurifer:

The correlative econo-theological reference is Rev. 6:5-6.  Now, I'm no eschatologist but it is my speculation that the third seal (as well as 4,5,6 with the "boom" of 6 yet to come) are open, depending on whether you approach it from a linear or non-linear "time" perspective.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:57 | 70557 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I just want to know is the S&P ever going to drop again? Or should I just put on a blindfold and dive into the long end like the rest of today's market "participants". Never have I felt so strongly about building & maintaining a position (short S&P) & yet so conflicted based on the constant move higher. I long since gave up on Sept selloff options, and now Oct's are looking perilous as well.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:13 | 70572 deadhead
deadhead's picture

70557...

Your opening question is easily answered: "Yes".

Further study of the historical trends of the spx or dow will help you overcome what seems to me some frustration, or confusion, or perhaps anxiety.  what is happening now has happened many times in the past 100 yrs or so. 

as an example, just 6 months ago people were panicking and saying "..I just want to know if the S&P is ever going to go up again?"

I hope this helps and I wish you good luck.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:47 | 70620 John Self
John Self's picture

and further to your point, the market had a similarly inexplicable amount of helium exactly two years ago.  Putting on the blinders and going with the flow would not have worked out so well then, just as that strategy never does.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:50 | 70725 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

You guys would normally be right, but when things are manipulated, history, waves, support, charts, trends, blah, blah, blah, don't mean fecal matter.

I am fascinated that folks think the market is manipulated/an out right lie, AND they seem to appeal to patterns that have happened in the past. Which is it?

Perhaps I misrepresent some of you, but this seems to me a more subtle form of the cool-aide drinking denial that goes on with otherwise really smart posters. The only stance that possibly works in a manipulated environment is if you think you know their logic. But we can't.

I took my ball and went home. Fuck them. (Is that rude to type? Okay fcuk them). And yet they can still get me by devaluing my dollar and fcuking with the price of gold.

No wonder someone wants to ki.....

Never mind. Me and my ball will just fcuking sulk here...

BASTARDS.

I don't want to be rich. I just want my family safe, with enough food to eat, safe place to lay their head. AND THEY HAVE TO FCUK WITH ME.

ASSWIPE BASTARDS. You know who you are. If you troll these sites, put yourself in my position. You are robbing me and I know it.

I say these words as a mother.  I don't have very far to reach down inside and find a world of pissed off.

I bet you even think it is funny.

Wait.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:14 | 70753 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Don't believe the tripe the gold bears are serving.  $1,000/oz is a passing fad...on the way to the moon.  They can't suppress they price forever (if in fact THEY are doing so).  1.3 billion Chinese don't lie.

Gold, guns, garden.

I am Chumbawamba.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:58 | 70808 agrotera
agrotera's picture

You said it chumbawamba!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:50 | 70772 loki
loki's picture

I agree!  I'm so fucking disgusted.  The manipulation of the markets is unbearable to me....  Despite finance folks railing about how you lose in going to cash, I am sick over having not gone to cash 100%.

 

My portfolio is mixed,  was about 1/2 long and 1/2 short (short RE)  now my % is 2/3 long and 1/3 short (my shorts are getting killed.) 

 

I wish the manipulation of our economy would stop.  I have no faith in this system anymore and wish the ass would just fall out so we can start off again with REAL numbers, REAL transactions and some TRUTH.

 

I don't see it happening.  It's starting to feel too Matrix-ish for me.   

 

[done ranting.]

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:52 | 70774 McLuvin
McLuvin's picture

Why would you take your ball and go home?  This is welfare for traders and I am in line everyday.  The only missteps I've made is when my hedges go against me and reduce my profits.  I have more 5 and 10 baggers than I've ever had, since in the past, I've always taken gains or gotten shaken out.  This is the first market that has allowed me to stay with certain positions until they are 10 baggers.  I have taken all my cost basis out when they were doubles and triples and have no reason to stop trading around these positions.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:36 | 70806 loki
loki's picture

Great for you!

So share your secret with the rest of us.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:26 | 70880 deadhead
deadhead's picture

"I am fascinated that folks think the market is manipulated/an out right lie, AND they seem to appeal to patterns that have happened in the past. Which is it?"

It is both.

Markets have always had varying degrees of manipulations and lies, some more severe than others. This time is not different, though the degree of manipulation is unquestionably higher than in the past. Ergo, patterns repeat. 

Take a look at a 100 yr chart of P/Es

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:51 | 70888 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Great comment. I agree, technicals, fundies, patterns, histroy... All have no meaning for small moves.

However - there is a definite end to this. Either they stop and the $ gets stronger. Or, the dollar faces outright collapse, in which case nations everywhere start to collapse.

There is no possibility of ad infinitum continuance.

~Oso

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 20:57 | 70558 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Savings rate i dropping, so that might be the missing parameter. Furthermore refis may provide the drones with some additional cash to buy stuff for.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:03 | 70560 agrotera
agrotera's picture

Here is a blast from the past, i know some of you ZH friends will remember my post from long ago:

 

In Feb, www.twincities.com published an article (link has expired, sorry) about a lunch lecture that the CEO of USBancorp gave in which he reported a few details about his dealings with hank and company.  He said that he and all TARP recipients were told that they should tell the public that the TARP money was for lending, but in fact they were NOT to use the money to lend; they were to use the money to buy smaller firms in order to be a part of the great Darwinian cleansing that was "necessary" at this time.

 

What i don't get is why that never made it to any other news.  I posted that damn article all over the place, sent to dozens of our elected officials, and apparently, no one capable of calling hank and ben out on this seems to think this is a problem.

 

Remember last fall, we had a tag team constant media blitz from hank and ben continuing to tell us how the banks had to be infused with money to keep liquidity flowing and lending possible...too bad they didn't tell the truth...more lies...in fact what we had, was money given to blackholebanks, aka toobigtofail bankheist bonanza.

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:32 | 70582 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

"Darwinian cleansing"....those sons of bitches. A true Darwinian cleansing would involve all the dinosaurs being wiped out by the changed environment, allowing the tiny mammals to take over.

And now we have rumbling about strengthening Basel II, feeding more little mammals into the maws of doomed dinosaurs. All with the blessing of Count Fedula. Great.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:54 | 70777 McLuvin
McLuvin's picture

I believe it is Intelligent Design cleansing.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 04:01 | 70856 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

Haha, you nailed it.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 11:35 | 71092 Chumly
Chumly's picture

Behe is a dumbass!!  Oh, pardon me, that's right - he's a professor of biochemistry at Lehigh.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:31 | 70585 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

That's standard operating procedure. Downturn are always gobble up competition periods. Always have been always will be. Darwinian cleansing is just "leet speak" for rigging the game against everyone and then playing I win.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:26 | 70653 agrotera
agrotera's picture

Darwinian cleansing is what survivors do...  but in this case, it was broken, failed, toobigtofail blackholebanks GIVEN MONEY to survive... [original TARP recipients at treasury ( GS, MS, C, MER (standing behind BAC)) with the rest thrown in even though they didn't need the money to make the public think that it was only one bank (C) that was in trouble and help it all seem legit.]

So, just like our friend in the earlier post quoting Mein Kampf, this was a very big lie to say that TARP was to keep lending flowing--it was to save failed entities, GS, MS, MER(with the sucker deal from BAC) and C, that then used the money to get bigger, and more 'systemically' important, in order to ensure that they will always get bailed out of their mistakes and their eventual bankruptcies....

Darwinian cleansing here is rigged totally, and we were all screwed by the biggest bailout heist of all time...and I am sure it wasn't the first, and unless we shut down the privately held federal reserve and it's machine in the legislature, we will never get relief.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:39 | 70683 TumblingDice
TumblingDice's picture

Unfortunately it looks like the true Darweninan clensing will not involve moving pieces of paper around.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:52 | 70727 JohnKing
JohnKing's picture

Kill the local banks and the economy along with it to create another crisis and do the nationalize heist. As the worm turns.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:49 | 70721 JohnKing
JohnKing's picture

Found a lot of references to that article:

 

Search For "extra cash to buy weaker banks..."

Those bastards!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 02:03 | 70819 agrotera
agrotera's picture

(nice picture by JohnKing!)

Thanks for finding the article referenced--it is still astonishing that no legal action is being taken to take back TARP with this admission from the CEO of USBancorp...we are drowning in corruption as a country.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 06:24 | 70868 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

You need to include a direct link to the article if we are to read it

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:04 | 70563 HEHEHE
HEHEHE's picture

You are hitting the nail on the head.  At the end of the day what the Fed has done by taking all the garbage assets off bank balance sheets and what the Federal government has done via  the TARP package is create a new bubble in INVESTMENT BANKER BONUSES. 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:33 | 70595 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

INVESTMENT BANKER BONUSES =

Ready for this?

The Last Supper 

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:53 | 70776 loki
loki's picture

Don't forget the biggest clusterfuck of all:   Suspension of mark to market!

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:08 | 70567 Terminal Frost
Terminal Frost's picture

Most banks are managing the balance sheet (read: decreasing assets via liquidation, demanded exit, runoff, etc) to control troubled loan exposure as well as avoid as much of the FDIC special assessment as possible. 

As for lending in general, it simply is a matter of supply and demand.  Both supply and demand suck at this time.  Fewer interested and creditworthy borrowers are in the market for credit right now.  Bad credits looking for a bailout are a dime a dozen.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:32 | 70592 assembler
assembler's picture

But this point is, Timmy told another tall one. This data refutes that.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:35 | 70588 D.O.D.
D.O.D.'s picture

And for an encore... WTF are we still listening to any of these people?!?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQ79Pt2GNJo

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:21 | 70796 matthylland
matthylland's picture

"The recession is technically over"

 

....or whatever he said to that extent today.

 

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 21:57 | 70633 zeta
zeta's picture

 

I think Tim Geithner thinks he can lie as many times as he wants,
do whatever he wants, as long as it'll paint the Wall street green.

It's no exaggeration, folks.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:20 | 70657 deadhead
deadhead's picture

Joe Biden is encouraging Geithner in this regard.

Joe realizes Tim is his best chance to avoid winning the Washington DC "foot in your mouth" award for 2009.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:33 | 70673 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

"The last duty of a central banker is to tell people the truth"

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:00 | 70780 bchbum
bchbum's picture

>> "The last duty of a central banker is to tell people the truth"

 

You do understand the difference between monetary and fiscal policy, right?  I mean, why would you pick the head of fiscal policy from a list of central bankers?  Should be illegal.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 03:39 | 70847 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

That quote is from the fed vice chairman Alan Blinder

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:19 | 70708 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Dont' forget the media. They are willing accomplices and take every chance to spin the story, which they consider to be a right vs left, Dem vs Rep conflict.
For now it is "The Dems are in charge so there are no problems" just as for the last 8 years it has been "Repubs are in charge, things are falling apart".
They are literally ignoring stories, averting their eyes in the belief that telling the facts will give aid and comfort to their ideological enemy. Amazing and disgusting.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:01 | 70637 monopoly
monopoly's picture

The question is when will the citizens truly see through all this crap and rise up in mass. Yes, we had a decent demonstration, but we need millions to march so the entire planet knows that we care and we do get mad and we do say "I am not going to take it anymore"

Until that happens the 3 stooges will continue to lie, advise how montary policy has saved the day and what a good job they are doing.

Thanks goodness for Shadow Stats. That is where you can find the truth, as here.

 

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 22:57 | 70697 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

In the book "The Great Crash" the final paragraph states:

...This is not because the instinct for self preservation in Wall Street is poorly developed.  On the contrary, it is probably normal and may be above.  But now, as throughout history, financial capacity and political perspicacity are inversely correlated.  Long-run salvation by men of business has never been highly regarded if it means disturbance of orderly life and convenience in the present.  So inaction will be advocated in the present even though it means deep trouble in the future.  Here at least equally with communism, lies the threat to capitalism.  It is what causes men who know things are going quite wrong to say things are fundamentally sound.

 

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:12 | 70704 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Perhaps the secret sauce is the maxing out of credit cards which the owners have no intent on repaying.

RE isn`t coming back any time soon. Companies are cutting staff/reducing capacity. Banks aren`t lending...but they are returning tarp. The path of least resistance, and for expediency`s sake, may be to create another stock market bubble. This time, however, Obama will advise us to buy enormous amounts of puts, perhaps the govt will buy them for us. We will be advised not to sell any equity. Instead, we will be allowed to use said portfolio as collateral to borrow an amount XX times(to be determined by Ben at each fed rate meeting so as not to stoke hyperinflation) for all of our consumption needs. Bots will continue to be employed/financed as required to ensure a steady rise in all markets(bonds, commodities, stocks etc) so as not to pop the bubble.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:17 | 70706 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

i hope this was not a news flash to anyone...
if geithner's lips are moving he is lying....

bob chapman has been saying for a long time that the reason for the crisis was to consolidate banking and it appears that the ceo of usb has confirmed that....

i honestly hope that a wild crowd lynches bernanke....

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:43 | 70714 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

How many of you bank with one of the TBTF banks? Isn't part of the problem that most people are too lazy/incovenienced to bank locally? These banks are TBTF because we made them so.

Tue, 09/15/2009 - 23:49 | 70723 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Why would they want to lend out the money and risk not getting pay back while is much better to just throw the money into the equity market that just keep going up? They can make money much faster throwing into SPX then lending out with meager interest rate plus the risk of most likely not get pay back... Government on the other hand is on the side of Banker, of course the would side with them and cover up all the bad sh**... This country is build on liars and robbers... the government is the biggest liar and robber of them all!

But then again, what we going to do about it? What CAN WE DO?! Are you going go on CNBC and show the above to public? Ya, you probably get throw out of the CNBC studio before you can even show up infront of camera...

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:18 | 70755 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Starve the beast.  Default on your credit cards.  Don't pay your taxes.  Don't be a douche.

I am Chumbawamba.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:46 | 70769 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Perhaps the secret sauce is the maxing out of credit cards which the owners have no intent on repaying.

RE isn`t coming back any time soon. Companies are cutting staff/reducing capacity. Banks aren`t lending...but they are returning tarp. The path of least resistance, and for expediency`s sake, may be to create another stock market bubble. This time, however, Obama will advise us to buy enormous amounts of puts, perhaps the govt will buy them for us. We will be advised not to sell any equity. Instead, we will be allowed to use said portfolio as collateral to borrow an amount XX times(to be determined by Ben at each fed rate meeting so as not to stoke hyperinflation) for all of our consumption needs. Bots will continue to be employed/financed as required to ensure a steady rise in all markets(bonds, commodities, stocks etc) so as not to pop the bubble.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 00:52 | 70775 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I just saw a nightmare and just woke up to let you guys know. I would like somebody to draw a cartoon out of it.

I saw Blankfien was nekkid and Geithner was on his knees sucking Blankfien's - you know... And Bernanke was in Rabbi's dress doing some prayer. And Obama was shining Blankfien's balls. I dont know how it all happened, but it was very disgusting...

ok.. good night.. Hopefully I wont see that dirty minimie blankfien..

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:00 | 70781 Gubbmint Cheese
Gubbmint Cheese's picture

from my stanpoint I don't think its wise to be short here - and I say this as someone who's been absolutely KILLED on my short postions since April. Why should you stay away? Because there is nothing rational about this market at all - its being propped up, manipulated, gunned, pushed and pulled up.. we all look at the live quotes every day.. you can SEE it - the market WANTS to go down and yet every morning sure as shit.. here comes the bid.. huge volume pulls it up - and then it levels off.

Shorting here makes total sense on paper - but not in the real world. If I could go back and undo my mistakes, I'd wait for the first cracks to show up - wait for the confirmed break.. then short big. But to try and time the top will only lead to heartache, heart burn, and a substantial increase in your alcohol consumption.

Being short sucks ass right now - at SOME point it won't.. but days like today (and I'm sure tomorrow) age a person dramatically.

I now understand why that old guy used to stand on his porch and scream at us kids to stop hanging around his neighborhood - he was probably short early too.

whatever you do.. long, short, neutral or cash... I hope you do well.

Cheese.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:34 | 70805 Howard_Beale
Howard_Beale's picture

Cheese,

So you've been shook out for months. Painful indeed and I feel for you. But IMHO this not a manipulated market, it is the true nature of a bear market rally. Whether it is POMO's or liquidity payoffs via HFT, it's still the same animal--we are just pissed it has lasted so long. Historically, this is not out of bounds or that much out of the ordinary after a massive decline. It does not mean that we are in a new bubble--let's just call it recess. Time for the kids to go out and play instead of dealing with the cold, hard realities out there. In any true bear market, these events have always existed. In the MSM they look at LTCM, we emerged, the Nasdaq--well, it has not emerged (much more like Japan) but the S&P and the DJIA went to new highs. Green sharts are everywhere, as they should be, because nothing goes down in a straight line. And don't be surprised if we get a fall selloff and the market rallies further--I will restate--history is only repeating itself. There is nothing really new here. Patience, Cheese. You will have your day.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:38 | 70807 capitalisa
capitalisa's picture

Not manipulated?  With talk like this? 

 USD maintains soft tone as dealers take notice of Greenspan's concern about debt limit and potential that Congress will hamper Fed's effort to fight inflation

- Former fed Chairman noted that lawmakers could hamper FED's efforts to rein in its monetary stimulus, and that inflation might “swamp” the bond market I laughed 'til I cried.
Wed, 09/16/2009 - 02:06 | 70820 TumblingDice
TumblingDice's picture

The markets have been manipulated since we've had markets.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 06:21 | 70867 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I agree and found this hugely funny myself. clear spin, or
alzheimers. I find it amazing that someone who's views have been so discredited gets media attention. same way I made me crazy towards the end of Bush's term they actually reported what he said. They do the same with Bernanke.
But this is how the mainstream media continues to manage
to get people to actually believe the fed works for us.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 02:19 | 70825 Gubbmint Cheese
Gubbmint Cheese's picture

thx for the note howard - dont' get me wrong, I know there's always been some sort of graft in the system. It's the kind that we are aware of, that bugs us.. but its always been there, silently sapping profits off the top. Whether its the 'buy recommendation' on a p.o.s. syndicate client, or the fancy new product to address all the investors demands (with huge fees built in) - we've all seen that side of the business.. but its been subtle.

The difference with this beast (imo) is that it is no longer subtle. We know GS is trading the crap out of everything. As Robo says, 'gunning every heavily shorted p.o.s. with half a pulse' (paraphrasing Robo.. too lazy to pull a real quote.. plz forgive me.. its late) - The gubbmint (not me) is buying MBS and UST's like a fat kid at the candy store with a five dollar bill in his hand. CNBC is almost hysterical in their bullishness.. and no headline is without at the very least a silver lining.

My point is - the lies are bigger, the bailouts are unprecedented, and the backroom deals are well beyond the scope of what used to be the financial industry. These are bigger stakes - which I guess is why everything is so much more in our face.

I know it will hit at some point and I will finally get these postions (and my sanity) back on side - its just a frustrating ride. I'm not a genius (by any stretch of the imagination).. but I'm also not a moron. I'm just a tad offended that the government is lying to me and assuming I'm some sort of American Idol watching, spray cheese eating retard who isn't a critical thinker and can't see the bull as it flies across the room...

once the poo hits the fan.. I can finally start shopping for those cheap stocks, houses and trips I've been waiting for.. :)

Nite all.

el Cheese-o

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 04:23 | 70858 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

@Howard, pull up a chart for AXP and check the rally from Sep 2001 to May 2002. Wonder if it will hold up as a 'historical informant' for the S&P.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:30 | 70884 deadhead
deadhead's picture

Howard....well said

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 12:42 | 71206 dza
dza's picture

POMO = manipulation. Other than that, market is not manipulated.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:06 | 70784 Comrade de Chaos
Comrade de Chaos's picture

Another sign of the growing confidence is here:

http://www.businessinsider.com/boeing-workers-vote-to-disband-union-2009-9

 

the confidence level in the growing economy is so high, the union workers disband their union because they don't fear of losing their jobs (sarc.)

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:24 | 70797 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I am the real Chumbawamba. Don't listen to imposters.

I am Chumbawamba!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:24 | 70798 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I am the real Chumbawamba. Don't listen to imposters.

I am Chumbawamba!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:24 | 70799 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I am the real Chumbawamba. Don't listen to imposters.

I am Chumbawamba!

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 01:43 | 70812 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Yeah, OK, I'll bite.

Long time lurker, first time commenter.

The rabid libertarians, market good, government bad, real free market will fix everything scared me from commenting (disclaimer - I am libertarian leaning, but believe that government does have limited role to play in control, testing and enforcement. Oh, and am not buying gold when it is so blatantly manipulated - like everything else - and is at an all time high).

Gods, but these "rabid libertarians" are morons.

Anyways, an interesting article on Lehman Bros for all of you saner people:

The Real Lesson of Lehman's Fall
Lehman Died So TARP and AIG Might Live

By MIKE WHITNEY

http://www.counterpunch.com/whitney09152009.html

Anyways number 2, yes, the market is insane, and not based on reality or even honest accounting ("mark to whatever you want, boss!") but there is no reason it will go down, at least in the near (1 year) term.

They can just print this money, or just do a better spreadsheet.

Because USA has the almighty $$$, which, although not pegged to gold, IS pegged to oil, the $$$ has advantages.
Also, America has the most powerful military for a reason... to dictate to the world our elite's terms.

China's economy is based on selling crap to Americans.
They don't dare to act against US interests, at least in the short term (again 1 year) because if there is a bonafide trade war, they lose... badly. USA regains some manufacturing (perhaps) or, better for the markets and DOW, manufacturers move to other, crappier countries.

Meanwhile China has revolution number 2, with millions of people laid off from factories, going back to their farms, which they forgot were sold to developers to build factories to produce crap to sell to America...

USA's elites have the world (and us, Americans) by the balls and they know it, as Obama has shown the Chinese and the world.

USA is the destination of all the crap world produces - plasma TV's, toys, plasticware, on and on.
If USA goes (as Depression 1.0 showed) so does the world.

Think on that.

Anyways, my alter ego on the net is americangoy.
Feel free to google me and leave me hate mail and / or advertisements to buy gold.

Sorry for being off topic and rambling a bit.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 03:01 | 70840 ptoemmes
ptoemmes's picture

Perhaps yout words "lie refuted" should be "lie exposed", but that's a nit and keep up the good refuting and exposing.

 

"... correct reason for bailing out banks was to ensure that they can continue lending..." - now that's a lie.

 

Pete

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 03:29 | 70845 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Tyler,
I love the site, but there are times when you prove to be so clueless it amazes me. I am a wall street bank with access to the discount window. My goal is to secure those funds for as long as I can very cheaply. Since Ben lets me do what ever I want with them I invest them in multiple assets. this keeps the economy cool so Ben does not cut off the funds, and when I am ready to get lending started again I now have all the prime assets in place (bought with your fed dollars) so I get excess return. This ensures max profit, this delays raising interest rates for as long as I am able to.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:10 | 70876 Sardonicus
Sardonicus's picture

Mortgage applications dropped.

Realtors lobbying to extend and increase first time buyer credit to $15000.

Soon perhaps they will propose giving a new clunker with American tires to every buyer of a house with an attached garage?

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:31 | 70885 deadhead
deadhead's picture

after the "cash for christmas" legislation gets slammed through.

 

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 07:26 | 70881 aus_punter
aus_punter's picture

BEING SHORT HERE IS JUST A FUCKING NIGHTMARE, HOWEVER, I DOUBT THERE WILL BE A CONFIRMATION TO GO WITH ..... IT'LL JUST GO.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:12 | 70889 HEHEHE
HEHEHE's picture

I am getting my @ss handed to me.  I am major short China right now, FXP and some individual stocks, given it is the biggest blown bubble.  It's painful to wait for the inevitable pop.  I've not seen markets this out of touch with reality since the tech bubble.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:25 | 70896 Sardonicus
Sardonicus's picture

Why the hell are you guys shorting this?

Why not just be a dip and buy the dips?  It is obvious that is all that works right now.  Short term dip buys.

For gawd's sake it takes a lot more guts to short this pig fart than to just buy something...anything.  Yes it will fracture somewhere...sometime, but you could be so broke by then you'll miss it even though you were correct.  It ain't all gonna go to hell in a single day.

Just trade what is there...not what you want to be there.  Take the plunge:  http://www.metacafe.com/watch/yt-wWKP_Eohol4/base_jumping_impressions/

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 08:59 | 70911 HEHEHE
HEHEHE's picture

Why am I short?  Because I have no debt and and am using money I don't need anytime soon and unlike most "investors" I am not buying with a margin account.  I can wait.  A deflationary debt unwind doesn't end in a couple years.  A decade maybe, but not two years.  Japan's been going for 17 years and continuously reaching new market lows.

Also, the whole inflationary babble is a bugaboo.  Yeah the US is printing $$$ left and right, but so is every government in the world.  There will be an inflationary impact but it's lessened dramtically when every other central bank in the world is doing the same thing.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 09:19 | 70904 FreddyInBangkok
FreddyInBangkok's picture

Given the mass brainpower here I’m a-mazed so little mention given to the yield curve,,, that thing with the big red knob in the middle. it's not hard. then change $SPX for $GOLD, $SILVER, GDX, $GOLD:$XSF, $XAU:$GOLD. all same result. especially $SILVER:$GOLD

all have about another ~20%  to run. Going through the top of the yield curve,, can stay high longer than we think which is why you shorts out there are getting shredded.

can someone isolate these yc tops back to the 1920s. anyone got access to detailed historical charts? nothing new here. come on you guys, I'm doing this from a beach hut by morse code through a clapped out Russian satellite. fortunately, lots of bitches to compensate the aggravation.

 

 


http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8251/1270.png

 

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 09:33 | 70919 FreddyInBangkok
FreddyInBangkok's picture

talking to a Hong Kong gold dealer today, gets her Krugerrand supply direct from a South African refiner. 10% markup but no problem with supply. Silver markup ~20% 1 oz Austrian coins face value 1.5 Euros, no VAT. Swiss bankers charge 17% VAT on all silvers.

Wed, 09/16/2009 - 17:40 | 71646 Peterepete
Peterepete's picture

Repeat after me:

I pledge alligance to Goldman Sachs and all its subordinate entities, and to the Republic that gave it birth one monolith under God with Liberty and malice towards none.

Fri, 02/25/2011 - 08:20 | 996468 george22
george22's picture

ANOTHER SHAMELESS MINISTER

“Unemployment still remains a real problem for families up and down the country,” Employment minister Jim Knight said on BBC News. “We’ve got to keep the support going and not be tempted to celebrate the recovery.”

The unemployment rate in the three months through July rose to 7.9 percent, the most since 1996, the statistics office said. That compares with the latest figures of 9.5 percent in the euro region, 9.7 percent in the U.S. and 5.7 percent in Japan.

womens ed hardy watches|117-101|1z0-047|sweetie bracelets

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!