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Bernanke Tries To Explain Why A Ponzi Scheme Is A Perfectly Acceptable System For Post Civil-War America, Fails

Tyler Durden's picture




 

The following exchange between Ben Bernanke and Senator Kirk is a must watch for everyone who wonders how Ben Bernanke justifies the fact that America is now an open Ponzi scheme. Kirk's question "in laymen's terms this is one part of the government lending another part of the government money, which would not let to long term confidence once the American people understood the basics a little bit better" relates to the open monetization that the Fed does each and every day at least until the end of June. What Kirk did not ask is what happens when the American people realize just how truly preposterous the Ponzi is, and that all the interest "paid" by the Treasury to the Fed ends up being remitted as cash right back to the Treasury as revenue in essence incentivizing the Treasury to spend and borrow more in order to earn more! This is the most circular Weimarian nightmare scenario imaginable, and we can only hope that "the American people" understand this as soon as possible. As to Bernanke's surprise that the US had a currency without any Federal debt to back it up (yes, it is possible to live within one's means, even for a central bank) can we remind the Chairman that the gold on the Fed's balance sheet, all eight tungsten thousand tons of it, is actually Marked to Market to almost $300 billion, and can by definition be used as a pledge to any liability, such as a currency or excess reserves. But oh yes, how could we forget, using just gold as an asset would never afford us the kind of adamantium price stability that we have seen in recent times. Plus how on earth could one infinitely dilute the dollar if the Fed's balance sheet was limited by actual "assets" that do not require Hewlett Packard tech support every now and then.

 

 

h/t m33t3r

 

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Wed, 03/09/2011 - 17:57 | 1034224 bankrupt JPM bu...
bankrupt JPM buy silver's picture

I feel better now, gold bless chairsatan

 

www.silvergoldsilver.blogspot.com

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:05 | 1034246 Michael
Michael's picture

If we abolish the Federal Reserve Corporation, The federal government can borrow money from itself at 0% interest and pay no fees to Wall Street. Real Winning!

Form now on if everyone on ZH refers to the Fed as the "Federal Reserve Corporation", we will raise public awareness with these three simple words and the public will learn to hate them more.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:08 | 1034258 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 We need a wealthy person to buy blocks of TV time and repeat this and other true statements over and over and over; if our enemies can create consensus; we can at least copy their methods.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:20 | 1034304 Michael
Michael's picture

I'm honored by your response IQ 145, perception is reality. I'm only 125, well that's what they tell me.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:33 | 1034362 WSMassiv
WSMassiv's picture

IQ does not factor in knowledge, and experience my man... its just a number of a test score, and if you practice taking IQ tests you will score much higher.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:02 | 1034441 razorthin
razorthin's picture

Indeed.  I practiced until I scored 164.  Throw in a valedictbullshit and Summa cum my drawers.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:04 | 1034451 Michael
Michael's picture

My dad was in Mensa at 160+.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:15 | 1034478 william the bastard
william the bastard's picture

My Dad had a 3 handicap at 75.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:19 | 1034496 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

All IQ scores are inherently suspect.

Genius is often more powerful in its intellect than any scope measured (or even conceived of) by the "IQ" test's creators.

Also, the Q stands for "quotient". You divide by your age. One's IQ, over the years, falls drastically and never rises.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:35 | 1034538 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

Finally, I have the answer! Is why i keep getting dumber & dumber.....

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:21 | 1034670 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

You are not alone.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:13 | 1034798 caconhma
caconhma's picture

My suggestions to save America and regain its independence:

- The US government declares a bankruptcy and negotiates to pay no more than 10-20 cents on a $1

- The US government terminates the Federal Reserve Bank Corp. (FEDC) operational charter in America

- The US Treasury becomes responsible for and takes over operations previously conducted by FEDC

- The Glass-Steagall act is reinstated

- Banking executives responsible for the latest meltdown are prosecuted

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 22:19 | 1034962 clymer
clymer's picture

this site couldn't be more brilliant. Sacrilege, how'd you pull this off? Simple layout, always pertinent content, and just enough openness combined with savvy posters to weed out the shills, either via down-mod and public humiliation, or because they don't understand enough about the world to post a cogent message.

 

Thanks ZH

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 22:43 | 1035041 chopper read
chopper read's picture

+1776

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:31 | 1035255 Michael
Michael's picture

The collective intelligence always wins the debate with the special interests. No need for moderation on ZH. A side benefit of being a freeman's blog is we are self policing.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:20 | 1035468 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

 

My dad had an 8th grade education from 1945 and he was smarter than all you sonsabitches.  That includes me.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:23 | 1035485 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

Probably true. My grandfather could add things up like lightning in his head, where my generation stumbles and falls.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 03:00 | 1035818 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Rocky,

My Dad will be 90 this year. He went through the Great Depression. He taught me everything I know about gold and silver.

Got it Bitchez?

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:27 | 1035504 Michael
Michael's picture

It's that word "corporation" that gets peoples attention. By proxy at least, the FR is a defacto corporation.

Who owns and controls the Federal Reserve

http://www.usagold.com/federalreserve.html

Beautiful diagram of ownership here;

OWNERSHIP OF THE FEDERAL RESERVE

http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml

There's plenty of Gold in Fort Knox to back a new currency. We can have a new monetary system up and running in 60 days.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:04 | 1035722 Michael
Michael's picture

Food for thought; I know it's cut and paste from web research, but very interesting for the nubes.

"The Depository Trust & Clearing Corporation is the biggest Bank in the World that you have probably never heard it. They happen to be the registered owners of 99% of all paper (stocks, bonds, securities, etc.). Scary, but true. And they have a perfectly good reason for it - with electronic trading, it is impossible to make timely changes to registered ownership of the paper.

The DTCC retains registered ownership while you as the peasant investor have the designation of beneficiary of the instruments. More on all of that below. First, lets see what the DTCC has to say about itself:

DTCC, through its subsidiaries, provides clearing, settlement and information services for equities, corporate and municipal bonds, government and mortgage-backed securities, money market instruments and over-the-counter derivatives. In addition, DTCC is a leading processor of mutual funds and insurance transactions, linking funds and carriers with their distribution networks.

DTCC's depository provides custody and asset servicing for 3.5 million securities issues from the United States and 110 other countries and territories, valued at $40 trillion. In 2007, DTCC settled more than $1.86 quadrillion in securities transactions.

DTCC operates through six subsidiaries - each of which serves a specific segment and risk profile within the securities industry:

National Securities Clearing Corporation (NSCC)

The Depository Trust Company (DTC)

Fixed Income Clearing Corporation (FICC)

DTCC Deriv/SERV LLC

DTCC Solutions LLC

EuroCCP Ltd.

DTCC's customer base extends to thousands of companies within the global financial services industry. DTCC serves brokers, dealers, institutional investors, banks, trust companies, mutual fund companies, insurance carriers, hedge funds and other financial intermediaries - either directly or through correspondent relationships. Increasingly, DTCC's customers operate both in the U.S. and overseas, where DTCC continues to provide them with services.

In the U.S., DTCC provides critical services to the markets for U.S. Government and mortgage-backed securities, and to all U.S. equity marketplaces, including the New York Stock Exchange, The Nasdaq Stock Market, the American Stock Exchange, and regional U.S. markets, as well as electronic trading and communications networks (ECNs).

All services provided through the clearing corporations and depository are registered with and regulated by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). The depository is also a member of the U.S. Federal Reserve System and a limited purpose trust company under New York State banking law.

"DTC is 35.1% owned by the New York Stock Exchange on behalf of the Exchange's members. It is operated by a separate management and has an independent board of directors. It is a limited purpose trust company and is a unit of the Federal Reserve." -New York Stock Exchange, Inc.

The banks and brokers are merely custodians for their clients. By federal law (SEC), they cannot hold any assets in the customer's name. The assets must be held in the name of DTC's holding company, CEDE & Co. That's how DTC has more than $19 trillion dollars of assets in trust... or is it really in "trust" if the private Federal Reserve System is technically holding it in their "unknown" entity's name?

Obviously, if stock and bond certificates you've purchased aren't in your name, then the "holder" (the Federal Reserve System) could theoretically refuse to surrender them back to you under a "national emergency" according to the Trading with the Enemy Act (as amended).

Between the market crash and terrorism attacks, I don't think the powers that be will have too much trouble manufacturing more "national emergencies" with which to further erode our Constitutional Rights. Remember the Patriot Act? They have not even begun to use that on us yet.

And it appears President Clinton has paved the way for a Gulag Society with his 1994 Executive Order 12919 (which I will also examine in subsequent articles). Right now though, the DTCC:

Simply put, the Depository Trust Company absolutely controls every paper asset transaction in the United States as well as the majority of overseas transactions, and they now physically hold (as of April 1999) 99% of all stock and bond book-entrys in their street name, not the actual owner's names.

REGISTERED HOLDER- A Registered Holder literally possesses, owns, and holds, his stock or bond with his name appearing on the face of the certificate. The company that issued the certificate has registered the owner's (holder's) name on their official books. This is the safest way to own a paper asset. You literally possess the fully registered certificate and only you can transfer or sell it. By all Rights and definition of law, you are the owner. You have it, you hold it, you possess it, and you keep it. You have the complete control over it.

BENEFICIAL OWNER- A Beneficial Owner is nothing more than a beneficiary, "One who is entitled to the benefit of a contract"- A Dictionary of Law, 1893. All book-entry stocks and bonds you purchase make you the beneficial owner, not the registered holder. The owner of a book-entry stock or bond is the entity or name that it is registered under.

Even the name of the shadow company that is the agent of who knows, possibly the IMF according to this article: CEDE. Can you believe that. CEDE. I kills me.

CEDE- To surrender possession of, especially by treaty. See Synonyms at 'relinquish'." -American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, 3rd Edition of 1992.

And that is just the plan, just as soon as everything gets a little more chaotic in our once static lives. Living in an Empire at it's peak is like living in the eye of the hurricane - and if you lived your whole life there under the still, blue skies, you really have no idea what is heading your way.

It's quite obvious that the stock markets are going to 'crash and burn' at some future date and for some 'unknown' reason... The Great Depression is about to be repeated, and it will be as deliberate and manipulated as the first one that began with the stock market crash of 1929. We are, without a doubt, on the brink of the Mother of all economic Depressions.

Remember, this was penned in 2003. Pretty prophetic in light of this weeks news. So, how does your portfolio look now?

Your broker sends you a fancy accounting every month of your purported holdings, along with dividend and interest payments paid. The fact is, you only receive the benefit of ownership (interest and dividends) without holding title to your property. You are at the mercy of the registered owner, the DTC. If you don't believe this is true, then call your broker right now and ask them who's name is listed as the Registered Holder of your book-entry stocks and bonds. If you're lucky, the broker will tell you "why of course you're the Beneficial Owner", then you'll know the truth. He may emphasize to you that the stocks and bonds are being held in "safe keeping" for your own protection. This is broker language for "your stocks and bonds are held by the DTC in their street name as the creditor".

I tried it, and they don't like to talk about it. At all. I had the feeling they did not understand it completely either, but they swore it was only for expedience and nothing sinister. Fine. But why a private company, and why all the cloak and dagger mystery surrounding what is purported to be the most regulated, the most transparent of all industries? "

http://www.vnnforum.com/showthread.php?t=87292

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depository_Trust_%26_Clearing_Corporation

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:11 | 1035882 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

TYLER REALLY NEEDS TO FIX THIS RIGHT MARGIN SQUEEZE PROBLEM.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:16 | 1035885 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

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TYLER REALLY NEEDS TO FIX THIS RIGHT MARGIN SQUEEZE PROBLEM.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 19:56 | 1038704 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Buy a bigger monitor with higher res.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:10 | 1035881 Raphio
Raphio's picture

Thanks for the informative links.....

when is the last time fort knox was actually audited, though?

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 22:18 | 1034955 spudboy
spudboy's picture

That is incorrect. The mental age concept was originally developed by Alfred Binet, who developed the Stanford-Binet Intelligence test, which is still used (in much later versions) today. He specialized in working with the "feeble-minded". However, that concept is generally only applicable when testing children and those with mental handicaps, as a person generally attains a mature level of intellectual development at approximately age 16, although of course there are other intellectual traits such as good judgment and foresight which must be further cultivated in the mature adult.

When adults and even children are tested today, they are compared to the rest of the population at their precise age and then put into a percentile which corresponds to a standard score. For example, someone who scores at the 84th percentile compared to their same age group would score an IQ of 115.

Genius is certainly a very difficult concept to quantify. Nevertheless, to say that "all IQ scores are inherently suspect" is to be unaware of an IQ test's radical ability to predict speed of learning and even future earnings potential with a pretty high level of reliability. For further information, you may want to read "The Bell Curve" by Richard Hernstein & Charles Murray.

IQ is pretty stable between ages 12 and about 35, and even then it should not drop much as one ages, because one's peers are also experiencing a generally similar level of cognitive decrement. Many millions of dollars are invested annually by corporations who believe in the veracity of the concept of IQ, and thousands of studies attest to the validity of IQ tests.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:05 | 1035117 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

You might have beat me on the facts here, but I'm still right in spirit. As are you wrong.

Explaining myself here would take too long, so you can still go ahead and think I'm wrong, that I've "lost". Or call it a "draw" if you are feeling generous to me.

I still win though.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:48 | 1035572 Miss anthrope
Miss anthrope's picture

What was the prize being played for.... ?????

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:50 | 1035578 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

Just shout WINNING!!!

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:08 | 1035422 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 Langdon adult IQ test; take it now; and then bitch at me , bitchaez.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:23 | 1035464 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

the debate of IQ tests' validity always proves the validity of IQ tests

 

The best way to explain the different levels of IQ is in the amount of permutations one's brain will consider a thought. So inherently a lower IQ can not comprehend a higher IQ's path and the wisdom is in communicating the result in its lowest connection points instead of the long range of madness that lead the higher IQ past initial barriers of reason that prevent the lower IQ of reaching said result on their own.

 

 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:29 | 1035512 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

Sounds like something Bennie would say, if you questioned the validity of his IQ.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:52 | 1035567 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

wonderfully thought out retort..  I have absolutely no problem connecting the 2nd grade path you took

 

to perhaps awken you at all, IQ is just the engine.  IQ + Knowledge = Smart. So just because you have bias vs something you can't comprehend, rest easy that many smart people get that way with lesser IQ's but from learning well from others.  And many with high IQ's can get lost in their own muddy travels in worthless circles.

You can ignore how a watch works and just focus on what the watch tells you if all you care about is the time 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:38 | 1035687 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

No hard feelings.

I've seen plenty of people who knew they were really smart and had all this so-called credibility from things like IQ tests and so on to confirm it.

They still wind up believing false things and taking action that proves them wrong at the end of the day.

I yield the floor to you and retire from this conversation.

(still listening to you though if you want to say more)

Peace til next time.

edit: If you knew me better you wouldn't think I have anything but a high IQ.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:14 | 1035759 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

good night and may the burden of a high IQ also bring you headphones to shield you from automatically wasting energy figuring out others' outspoken simple dilemmas  

IQ is grossly misunderstood so I hope I shed some light to you or anyone here that high IQ in a vacuum is not smart anymore than a 5 yearold driving a sportscar is a good racer.

You seem to have met a few of those folks.  But I bet you didn't - they just thought they were.  For high IQ's tend to question themselves much more than anyone questions them.  Just like a great golfer thinks more about the shots he missed than any of the ones he makes.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:43 | 1035707 Milestones
Milestones's picture

Exactly. All I want is the time of day and some insist on building a clock for me.     Milestones

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:00 | 1035863 merehuman
merehuman's picture

its really a matter of conciousness.  Some think emotionally, some mentally, some not at all and a few let the lower instruments decide.  hurrah for the education we failed to get = how to be human and what being human is. Sorry to cut in, but I Q is  an incomplete  measurement.

But it may make your ass look bigger . 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:30 | 1035250 Quaderratic Probing
Quaderratic Probing's picture

I have a ponzi IQ, by printing infinite amount of numerators as in IQ2/age, IQ3/age I can become as hyper intelligent as I wish.....Hmmm maybe enough of this and I can be the Fed Chair too...

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:00 | 1035867 merehuman
merehuman's picture

no matter how smart you are , she will have you take out the garbage

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:10 | 1035431 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 False statement; the langdon adult IQ test; take it now; and then remain silent forever.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:17 | 1035760 Liquid Courage
Liquid Courage's picture

If I do, will I learn how to spell "unequivocally"? ;)

Sorry, couldn't resist. I have no idea what my IQ is, but I did score in the 99th percentile in the English Lang. section of our equivalent of your SATs, so I have an annoying habit of correcting everyone's grammar & spelling - no matter what their IQ might be!

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:31 | 1035517 MrSteve
MrSteve's picture

I resemble that remark!

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:19 | 1035891 Raphio
Raphio's picture

I'll reassemble that remark.......

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:21 | 1035892 Raphio
Raphio's picture

I'll reassemble that remark.......

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:25 | 1034513 Salvatore CFA
Salvatore CFA's picture

My dad flew missions against the NVA.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:32 | 1034529 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

My uncle was at the '68 Democratic Convention.

Yippie!

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:27 | 1034684 somethingelse
somethingelse's picture

penitenziagite!

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:55 | 1034744 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

My dad didn't do any of those things but he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:22 | 1034813 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

my dad didn't do any of that shit either, but did poison himself over-dsoing on vitamin tablets over the years - you wanna see a reaaallly ugly way to die? no bullshit. just a side note you'll never hear about anywhere

on a lighter note - my uncle was a professor at MIT (fat lot of good it ever did me....) he was also a Turk...er...uh...a Turkish-American. oh - and also married to my aunt

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:11 | 1035163 CitizenPete
CitizenPete's picture

My dad was in the anti-aircraft division of the Luftwaffa.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2ekYgGfTWY&NR=1

I think he worked in the feild offices and had missions like delivering the mail.   Not as cush a job as you may think.  The Russians didn't like the mail being delivered at the time.  

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:36 | 1035271 JethroBodien
JethroBodien's picture

My dad can beat up your dad!

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 03:16 | 1035837 malikai
malikai's picture

My dad is Kim Jung Il.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:24 | 1035896 Raphio
Raphio's picture

My Dad is Kim Jung Iller

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:22 | 1034502 equity_momo
equity_momo's picture

Im sure The Bernank is in Mensa too. Another failed metric to measure intelligence. Not quite as bad as spending thousands to become a brainwashed zombie Ivy Leaguer though. Unless networking to earn $$ at any cost is your raisin d'etre.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:47 | 1035319 Windemup
Windemup's picture

My IQ beats my bowling score. Sadly though, not my golf score.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:00 | 1035383 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

false statement.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:07 | 1035410 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

false statement.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:54 | 1034892 spudboy
spudboy's picture

That's only partially true for crystalized intelligence, which accounts for your knowledge and experiences. Even then crystalized intelligence shows very strong heritable characteristics.

It's not true at all for fluid intelligence, which is your ability to analyze novel problems, independent of acquired knowledge.

For example, you can practice tasks that involve the usage of mental rotation and spatial imagery all you want, but you're not going to see much gain in your scores, and I could give you 10 different but well constructed IQ tests and you'd pretty much never score 10 points higher on any of these tests than your mean score. IQ tests available on the internet are a farce, I'm talking about real IQ tests.

IQ is a valid and oftentimes heritable construct, and not merely some modern theoretical abstraction.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:24 | 1035770 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

spudboy:

I forgot to say "thanks" for getting my facts straight.

no "your welcome" necessary. see you around.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:17 | 1035454 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 horseshit. you practice all you want than take the Langdon adult intelligence test; then we can talk. Everyone is sensitised on this issue; because what  changes between chimpanzees and humans is intelligence; and we all know this. College professors know that IQ is 90% of everything; but this information is not publishable because of the afro-american test scores. Average 90. The African test scores are much worse; this subject has been studied in detail as you can imagine; but your mass-media perception of it, without doing your homework; is equivalent to "global warming",  The brain washing works really well; if you want to know what IQ means, ask someone who has one; you'll be surprised.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:31 | 1035780 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

I swear to God, I'm going to pistol whip the next guy who says "Langdon IQ test":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbgOQf4NaG8

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 03:19 | 1035839 Rick64
Rick64's picture

Lol

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:03 | 1035871 merehuman
merehuman's picture

so thats why white men cant dance.lol

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:27 | 1035493 Michael
Michael's picture

deleted 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:44 | 1034363 gangland
gangland's picture

mine's 179, means absolutely not a damn thing, believe me it's the fucking curse of my life. Fucking useless.  Zagg corporation CEO went to the university of fucking pheonix fer crissake selling 3c pieces of cellophane for $30 a pop, that guy is a genius. I'd trade IQ for EQ right now.

disclosure: I'm long adamantium, short Zagg.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:46 | 1034403 Careless Whisper
Careless Whisper's picture

that adamantium has given a 32% annual return over the years. niiiiice.

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/comic_books_top_stocks_as_investment/

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:03 | 1034445 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

I love how that article cherry picks coins from 1970-1991.  

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:02 | 1034446 Michael
Michael's picture

Gold pressed latinum is the universal standard.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:03 | 1034450 gangland
gangland's picture

Nice, I had a lot of first editions; gave all of them away to my younger cousin when he was maybe 10.  He still has them to this day. Every time I see him he thanks me and can't believe I gave them to him, all plastic and backboard wrapped.  I don't regret it, his gratitude makes my day every time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secret_Wars

 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:21 | 1035471 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 On the contrary it means everything; it means you have the potential to turn your back on the contemporary culture and study plane geometry, until you develop a worship for the result of clear thinking; then you can throw away your TV and become a real "contrarian"; and able to make any amount of money you wish. Reality is not voted on; you and God make a majority.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:43 | 1034390 Careless Whisper
Careless Whisper's picture

doesn't this scheme violate a r.i.c.o statute?

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:30 | 1034695 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

damn!! somebody - quick - call old Eric over at Justice.....

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:04 | 1035400 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 I appreciate your response; it hasn't been easy living in "Amerika"; at one time I thought suidcide was the only answer. 125 is the average of state college professors; more importantly your response shows an understanding of where we are today.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 09:13 | 1036145 Meme Iamfurst
Meme Iamfurst's picture

Look at all the bull shit this IQ crap created...nothing to do with this article, nothing.  Single file words running down the page. 

Michael, get a life. I can't even read your BS anymore.

None of you have brought up any pertinent questions...like why has the Congress waited until the damn program is about to expire to ask any questions?

Where is the floor stomping Rand Paul?  Where is the right, the conservative voice of America, when you need them to pack together and discredit this dishonorable imbecile?  Where is Sara?  Where is Newt?  Where are the radio talking heads?  Where is the American Enterprise Institute?  Where is the Chamber of Commerce?  Why the hands off on this man?  Why the kid-glove treatment?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:49 | 1034416 deeznutz
deeznutz's picture

Ross Perot? He has a web site but needs to get back on TV to explain this shit.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:26 | 1035494 CD
CD's picture

There are unfortunately (but not coincidentally) very few with a) such financial resource and b) sufficient disregard for the wellbeing of themselves and families... But perhaps as FT and CNBC now source stories from ZH, we may be on the right path. And efforts like the one below might be first steps in the right direction

For a fascinating take on the origins and details of Comrade Ben's "real" Board of Governors (i.e. puppeteers), this is a fascinating documentary presentation. Claims, conclusions, accuracy, etc. not claimed, but fascinating historical detail -- prequel to "The Creature from Jekyll Island", if you will. Or a look at the previous versions of the Matrix:

http://urokomovie.com/movie/watch1.html

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:14 | 1034272 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Yeah, somehow I don't think that currency will be worth a continental by the time a crisis arrives.

Gold standard, please.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:36 | 1034371 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

 

I don't think you papers take into account the derivative markets ( securitization ) It's over 1 quadrillion - Many traders around the world use this market for hedging.


Why speculators shun euro sovereign debt

You might think that grubby bond dealers and treacherous Anglo-Saxon hedge fund short-sellers would be rooting around in the markets for “peripheral” European sovereign debt. With a summit of the euro area leaders called for March 11, surely there would be all sorts of opportunities for profitable speculation on the backs of, say, the Greeks or Portuguese? Well, not really. I know a lot of those bond dealers and hedgies, and most of them are watching the European leaders and think-tankers on television screens with the sound off. Occasionally they grunt at some moves on the screen, then turn away, as if it was some not-very-compelling fixed wresting match, which is close to the truth. They are not betting much, if any, money on the outcome.

Among the pointless obsessions of the euro area political leadership is a conviction that speculators must not be allowed to profit from the euro sovereign debt crisis. The euro politicos don’t seem to be open to the possibility that speculators are largely absent, let alone masterminding some Bond-villain-grade scheme. For example, much lawyer and adviser time seems to have gone into assuring that any restructuring of peripheral sovereign debt does not “trigger” an “event of default” for credit default swaps covering what we used to call country risk. This concern is all about hatred of a group that makes more money, even after considering tax-free allowances, and a desire to maintain appearances. Those are critical for the progress of eurocratic careers, and keeping the German public on-side.

The truth is that the outstanding net CDS volume on, for example, Greek sovereign risk is less than 2 per cent of the outstanding state debt. That’s less than ( $6bn on about $490bn, for the dollar denominated contracts. ) There is more liquidity in the dollar contracts, which, given the location of many hedge funds and relative lack of official hostility to the instrument, makes sense. Even so, the derivatives tail, far from wagging the dog, is really vestigial.

 

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/da21122c-4111-11e0-bf62-00144feabdc0,dwp_uuid=...

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:45 | 1034389 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Oh jeez, the derivatives market, and ridiculous Max Keiser like figures? The important number in derivatives is net notional, and you know it.

The figures for 2006 were (Dollars) 42% and (Euros) 28%, with an annual percentage decline in US Dollar denominated debt.

For how long will you attempt to move the goalposts?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:54 | 1034410 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

So you don't want to count securitization debt ? What ever ... So that debt does not count ? 20 trillion added in 5 years .... But your papers say foreign holding have been dropping .... The graph of foreign holding since 2000 looks like the side of Mount St. Helens ....

 

 In addition to the savings glut, another factor that contributed to the global appetite for U.S. debt obligations is that many of them were packaged into asset-backed securities (ABS) that investors and rating agencies believed had minimal default risk. MBS issued by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in that category, as were the AAA tranches of the private label ABS and collateralized debt obligations (CDOs) that were issued in vast amounts during the credit boom. As Chart 3 shows, the scale of this gross capital flow was immense. Between 2002 and 2007, gross foreign holdings of U.S. assets rose from less than $10 trillion to more than $20 trillion.

http://www.pimco.com/Pages/Global%20Perspectives%20July%202009%20Bark.as...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:57 | 1034430 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

No, let's recap our discussion (now spanning 3 threads):

First, you pointed out how lots of international companies and countries were raising debt denominated in US Dollars. I then showed you that the Euro in 2007 overtook the Dollar in foreign denominated debt instruments.

You then moved to point out that they were a minor issue in terms of the overall debt markets, which I then pointed out were not a home run for the US Dollar, considering its advantage is shrinking on an annual basis.

And now you see fit to include CDS and other hedging devices, which the conversation had NOTHING to do with originally. A credit default swap is NOT fucking debt, and you conveniently posted the SHOCKING Max Keiser inspired notional figures, despite knowing that net notional is what it's all about.

You've DELIBERATELY attempted to pollute our debate with disinformation, and cast the original question in doubt. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but there is no more of that. You are basically a paid troll, sent here to troll on behalf of those who pay your wages.

You have zero credibility. Now fuck off, shill.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:03 | 1034448 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

You can't talk to schmailes like that, he reads a lot of books.......

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:04 | 1034455 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

As do I.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:12 | 1034472 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture


You might think that grubby bond dealers and treacherous Anglo-Saxon hedge fund short-sellers would be rooting around in the markets for “peripheral” European sovereign debt. With a summit of the euro area leaders called for March 11, surely there would be all sorts of opportunities for profitable speculation on the backs of, say, the Greeks or Portuguese?

The truth is that the outstanding net CDS volume on, for example, Greek sovereign risk is less than 2 per cent of the outstanding state debt. That’s less than $6bn on about $490bn, for the dollar denominated contracts.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/da21122c-4111-11e0-bf62-00144feabdc0,dwp_uuid=...


Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:17 | 1034489 akak
akak's picture

Cut

Paste

Wipe

Flush

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:28 | 1034500 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

What’s the United States Worth? $1.4 Quadrillion

But there are pockets of optimism, including Robert Shiller’s luncheon speech about the potential benefits of continued financial innovation.

One of Shiller’s ideas is that the federal government should issue a new kind of security that would pay quarterly dividends based on the nation’s gross domestic product (GDP). More specifically, each security would entitle its owner to one-trillionth of America’s gross domestic product (GDP). These “Trills” would be perpetual, like common stock in a private company, and would be backed by the government’s full faith and credit.

I will leave to others to argue the pros and cons of Trills. What caught my attention was Shiller’s estimate of how much they would be worth. With GDP around $14 trillion, each Trill would pay about $14 in annual dividends this year. That dividend would then increase (or, of course, decrease) as the economy grows (or contracts) in the future.

Shiller’s own answer is $1,400. In other words, he thinks Trills would be priced with a yield of about 1%. Trill owners would be willing to accept that low yield because they would expect future economic growth to boost dividends–and, therefore, Trill values–in the future.

That figure feels a bit high to me, but not unreasonable. For example, you could justify a $1,400 per Trill valuation if you believe that nominal GDP growth will be 4 percent and that an appropriate discount rate would be 5 percent.

If you take Shiller’s estimate seriously, it is just a short step to placing a value on the U.S. economy as a whole. If one trillionth of the economy is worth $1,400, then the entire economy would be worth $1.4 quadrillion.

 

http://dmarron.com/2010/01/04/whats-the-united-states-worth-1-4-quadrill...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:35 | 1034535 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

It will be worth more clownbux than that once hyperinflation kicks in.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:43 | 1034554 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Hey as long as I can still buy food and gas with those clownbux, thats all thats needed in my book.

I really don't see hyperinflation, we would have seen it already, the implosion in credit happened over 2 years ago.

 

They talked about hyperinflation 8-10 years ago with all our off balance sheet obligations like social security, state pension obligations, all the number had been known by all the global economist ect ... The borrowing by the fed has been going on for years, big "O's" new budget, what numbers will it take to finally push us over the edge, that is my question.... ?The securitization market is over 1 quadrillion.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:25 | 1035495 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

 

I'm disappointed.  Where is your de rigueur quote from Krugman?

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:07 | 1035613 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 It's very unfortunate that "hyperinflation" has become the new buzz word on the internet. It actually has a definition, of course, and a meaning. Hyperinflation is, by its nature undpredictable. It is ultimately, a negative act of faith on the part of the beholden. ie. the currency users. Inlfation, on the other hand, is with us now, and barring a miracle will accelerate; hyper-inflation does not arise by any rational and predictable element of "ordinary inflation".

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:43 | 1034559 d00daa
d00daa's picture

Wow. A totally new paradigm. This time is truly different.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:49 | 1034574 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Spalding was even shocked • agast • floored.... By said talk.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:27 | 1035498 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

 

•••• Me too! •••••••

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 06:09 | 1035843 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Hey, shill. Call options are not equity, credit default swaps are not debt, the US is not worth 1 quadrillion Dollars (although she might soon be, with Bernanke pressing random buttons at his disposal).

100% Intellectually dishonest = 100% Spalding.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:29 | 1034524 Michael
Michael's picture

The ECB and to a greater extent Britain, are moving to trade derivatives OTC so we can see, well it would be a good idea.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:59 | 1034604 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

They also went after the hedge funds for using credit default swaps on the PIGS.

Betting on a downfall that can't be stopped, 27 countries under on exchange rate, not going to work long term ...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:10 | 1034467 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Point #1 you dragged our original conversation into another thread, not me.

Point #2 If derivatives are not debt obligations, why was the bailout of AIG needed.. ?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:17 | 1034483 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

Hey boy, you are so smart so what is the answer?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:19 | 1034491 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Let EscapeKey take the first crack, two really easy questions ....

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:21 | 1034497 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

You are smarter than I thought. Lets wait

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:27 | 1034504 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Did she fall asleep ?

The big anti Spalding rant, now ..... Hold it, hold it ....

Pin drop

 

The securitization market trillions of dollar denominated I.O.U's ... Thats right, someone is paying the piper if that bet goes sour, look at Lehman and AIG.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:39 | 1034547 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

Right. Like this is news? Try another trick

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:46 | 1034569 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

I'm not the one saying this is news.

I'm just pointing out this is all part of the global dollar denominated debt obligations .... EscapeKey grabbed some info from " questionable source " and attacked Spalding with this misinformation, she could dumb some Zero Hedgers down with that info -

 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 06:17 | 1035868 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

From questionable sources?

Oh, ok. Here are my sources again. Please state your thoughts with each individual one, and I'll make sure to forward your concerns to the appropriate institutions.

Furthermore, if you question the information out of the ECB or CEPR, then please explain how you on the other hand find information out of the FRS to be honest and trustworthy.

European Central Bank:
http://www.ecb.int/pub/pdf/scpwps/ecbwp947.pdf

TheCityUK:
http://www.astrid-online.it/Dossier--d1/EUROBONDS/the-city-UK_bond_markets_06_2010.pdf

Centre for European Policy Research:
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/document/activities/cont/200806/20080618ATT32194/20080618ATT32194EN.pdf

(Groningen/Munich) University paper on invoicing currencies:
http://www.eiit.org/WorkingPapers/Papers/TradePatterns/FREIT181.pdf

 

Btw - invoicing currencies are now in the court of the Euro. I can dig up more sources on this, if you want me to.

Now, what were your sources again?

Here's a final source on international security issuance. Note on page 7 how the role of the Dollar is slipping, and the Euro gaining? There is a pattern here; the Dollar is slipping as invoicing currency, on debt markets, and on overall security issues, but I doubt you're smart enough to spot it.

InterAmerican development bank:
http://www.iadb.org/res/publications/pubfiles/pubwp-611.pdf

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:48 | 1034570 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

No baby, nobody cares about Spalding except me. Randomly they answer your problems and questions but really I'm the one who likes to talk to you. Do you want to talk Friedman, Scholes or other jewish scolars who teach us how peacefuly part money and soul, money to them soul to you?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:53 | 1034578 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

So you don't like the Jews ?

I'm Irish, the white trash of Europe .... And some Native American mixed in, a mutt per say  ...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:58 | 1034602 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

I'm proud of you boy, with that heritage you can go higher than I thought. Just keep trying.....

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:04 | 1034613 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Not sure about that. I'll try my best.

 

I'll be happy when I can trade full time but that will take about two more years. I must come up with $100,000 before a few of my friends equal that and we start a fund. 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:25 | 1035844 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

No, off to bed. I live in the UK, have a profession, and need sleep. On my list of daily activities, debating with a 100% dishonest shill is pretty damn far down the list in terms of priority.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:27 | 1034515 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Don't you ever get tired of being bitch slapped around?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:32 | 1034526 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Did you see EscapeKey, I can't find her ..... The dog whistle is not working ....

 

I just knocked her argument out with a Anaconda Choke .... Next time I'll use a Triangle Choke ...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:39 | 1034546 Misean
Misean's picture

He doesn't know when he's beaten, this boy, he doesn't know when he's winning either. He doesn't have any sort of sensory apparatus.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:53 | 1034584 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

and you do?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:55 | 1034595 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

If I'm beaten why did she stop talking after she blasted me with misinformation. I just asked some really fucking easy questions. Now after her rant and my response, dead fucking silence .... She has no answers. Maybe its all the egg in her face ?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 22:38 | 1035012 jomama
jomama's picture

maybe it's your fail ass fucking avatar, a sticker i usually see on lowered chevy trucks with shitty tint jobs and some knucklehead wanna be thug driving?

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:22 | 1035845 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

"She"? Holy fucking shit, you're a retard. I already told you TWICE my avatar is hot - but incompetent - spy, Anna Chapman. Are you really incapable of remembering information given to you twice? Please just say yes so I can once and for all establish that your potential just doesn't warrant even an attempt to converse.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 22:56 | 1035082 BoeingSpaceliner797
BoeingSpaceliner797's picture

The bailout of AIG was not needed.  Just another way to steal a little bit more quickly.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:12 | 1035626 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 point one; so what? point two; the bailout of AIG was needed because it's un-supervised failure and crash-landing threatened the entire financial structure. Obviously. Whether or not the particular derivatives involved were or were not "debt obligations" is supremely irrelevant. There are many, many kinds of derivatives; the ones that AIG became "famous" for; were not realistic; they couldn't be paid; the creator of this problem is one of the un-sung heros of the era; living in extreme wealth and comfort in his English country manor house, he is never mentioned; and has no threat of legal action. A real genius; he knew what he was doing; taking care of number one. This information is readily available; it is not an opinion.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 07:04 | 1035985 BoeingSpaceliner797
BoeingSpaceliner797's picture

Apparently, it bears repeating:  the bailout of AIG was not needed.  It was just another way to steal a little bit more quickly.

While it may have been "wanted" by the insolvent, backdoor bailout recipients, the bailout of AIG was far from needed.  Much like any iteration of QE:  wanted by the few, not needed by the many.  Shameful and others have nailed it with (I summarize) "the world as we know it is a series of scams." 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:54 | 1035654 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Fellow ZH'ers, please: If you ever catch me saying something stupid to Escape Key, stop me before I start to piss him/her off.

Thanking you in advance...

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 07:31 | 1035850 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

What did I state which was wrong?

Please can someone explain how credit default swaps in fact ARE debt, and in the same breath, explain how call options in fact are equity.

Personally, I look forward to the research paper on this breakthrough academic achievement - I didn't realise I could own a house simply by buying insurance on it.

Btw - I'm male. My avatar is Anna Chapman. Just because she doesn't have her tits exposed doesn't mean she can't be attractive.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:31 | 1034693 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Would that be Mount St. Helens before, or after the eruption?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:57 | 1034425 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

Oh boy,

You're again at that game, don't worry about 6bln here and there, 2% of debt and other shit, this is just small part of big pile of shit. The pile smels and who cares if 2% of it is

more smelly.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:23 | 1034313 Duuude
Duuude's picture

NoNoNoNo

 

It is not a Federal anything.

 

It is the Bankers' Reserve owned and operated by the banks.

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:34 | 1034370 Michael
Michael's picture

The Federal Reserve Corporation, printed 2 trillion paper dollars in the past 3 years out of thin air and gives much of that money to it's subsidiary banks watering down the value of money in your wallet. This caused world food prices to rise which in turn caused riots an revolutions in other parts of the world and here at home.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:46 | 1034871 CU1981
CU1981's picture

FRC - I like it and will start using it in daily conversations .

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 11:14 | 1036490 Pope Clement
Pope Clement's picture

Nice Michael- a simple linguistic deprogramming tool to counter their effective nomenclature subterfuge. +1

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:26 | 1034326 eatthebanksters
eatthebanksters's picture

You want to stimulate the economy?  Instead of giving trillions to the banks who won't lend thus leading to the collapse of the markets (granted there is way to much debt out there, private and public), why not just hand out the cash to every American, let them buy, let them put the money in the banks.  The economy cranks up (consumerism flourishes under this program), the banks get cash and have bankable clients (as no one loses homes or gets foreclosed on ever again).  Come to think of it, why don't we just do this every year? ;-)

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:31 | 1034351 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

It would trigger instantaneous inflation.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:32 | 1034531 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

As oposed to systemic inflation caused by the banks buying up comodities with their windfall profits? In scenario #1 everyone benefits a bit and there is an opportunity for demand spurred growth (artificially caused leading to a bubble, but growth non the less) In scenario #2 (current scenario) bankers get fat bonuses and buy up the raw commodities causing consumer product prices to rise (only the bankers benefit). Scenario #1 distributes the wealth to the populace, scenario #2 distributes the debt to the populace. Of course, considering that 30% of all income in the US comes from wealth redristibution from the producer class to the consumer class (that includes banksters) we are pretty much doing it now.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:39 | 1034709 andybev01
andybev01's picture

$100.00 McValue meals...

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:36 | 1034537 goldsaver
goldsaver's picture

A better option would be a 100% Federal tax holiday for a year. I would not include re-distribution schemes were you pay in 2k and get back 6k ( making work pay, making pregnancy pay and making lousy life decisions pay tax credits). Let the producers keep their money since you are monetizing more money now that you are collecting anyway.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:59 | 1034601 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Cash handouts are being given to Joe Sixpack.

They are called food stamps.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:39 | 1034711 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Which is a cash handout to JP Morgue

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:07 | 1034392 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

longer view of same interview...he really gets up bernankes ass

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quTFCeMwJNY

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:46 | 1034872 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

son of a bitch!! LMFAO

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 23:57 | 1035299 Michael
Michael's picture

Thank You, thank you, thank you JQP.

If you watch this video with the Dead Elephant video on mute, you see how the establishment view the tea party.

Ron Paul & Peter DeFazio "Democrats & Republicans Are Afraid Of Being Called Soft On Defense"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzqwxmuu1DM

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 01:18 | 1035640 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 opinion shaping; consensus building; they aren't in touch with the public opinion. We need a champion to make it clear on TV that the public doesn't want or need any more foreign wars. The Swiss government is very well able to take care of itself; but its' defense forces only exist for the purpose of defense. What a concept!

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 18:45 | 1034398 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

Congratulations Michael,  again I didn't junk you. That is a good concept.

 

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:20 | 1034499 Michael
Michael's picture

Thanks. It's that word "corporation" that gets peoples attention. By proxy at least, the FR is a defacto corporation.

Who owns and controls the Federal Reserve

http://www.usagold.com/federalreserve.html

Beautiful diagram of ownership here;

OWNERSHIP OF THE FEDERAL RESERVE

http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:38 | 1034545 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

Good work, Mikey. I think you were the one that converted me to the site back in '09.

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 04:32 | 1035904 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

It's that word "corporation" that gets peoples attention

Good luck getting sheeple's attention on anything besides football (men) and Dancing With The Stars (women).

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 19:31 | 1034532 Revolution_star...
Revolution_starts_now's picture

"If we abolish the Federal Reserve Corporation, The federal government can borrow money from itself at 0% interest and pay no fees to Wall Street. Real Winning!"

That's the thing, you see we have worlds reserve currency. We got this thing and I mean it's F'n golden, I ain't gonna just give it away.

You see if we had tiger blood and Adonis DNA we would force the fed to buy every damn piece of government debt ( hell give them some more mortgages too), then we fold the Bernank like a lawn chair and DUH winning warlock style basin a eight-ball rock get'n a porn girl knob and poundin a few beers.

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:19 | 1034662 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

love the way you quote Blaggo (bloggo?) there. he's sure wormed his way into American psyche, hasn't he? am searching madly for something the boy epitomizes........ gotta be something.... oh! politics?

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 20:21 | 1034664 Michael
Michael's picture

The question is,

If we fold the Federal Reserve Corporation right now will they and their subsidiaries be left holding the bag of shit they bought or will the American people?

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 02:10 | 1035748 Milestones
Milestones's picture

We do not "fold" we destroy the Fed and subs and then default. 12 Air Craft Carriers should take care of the left over problems.      Milestones

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 05:16 | 1035917 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

World reserve currency suddenly worthless with no replacement. 

Any new currency put out by American govt is laughed at, not accepted by any nation, especially oil producing nations.

America can't buy anything on world markets, especially oil.

American economy collapses overnight.

China & Russia thoroughly pissed off at America defaulting on 1+ trillion debt they hold, China/Russia/India/Iran alliance see America crippled with no oil imports, decide now's the time, strike with everything they have, China's new anti-ship ballistic missles take out all 12 carriers, China / Russia / India nukes rain down turning most American cities to smoking craters, while other nations applaud the "great satan" imperialist world bully being taken down once and for all.

Yep, wonderful idea. 

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 11:51 | 1036623 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

well, imho, you got it only half right. they ain't gonna blow everything up, just walk in and colonize the goddamn turf that used to be called USA

Wed, 03/09/2011 - 21:11 | 1034778 caconhma
caconhma's picture

 delete

Thu, 03/10/2011 - 00:32 | 1035514 Homeland Security
Homeland Security's picture

...

 

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!