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Bin Had
Preface: You can either
dismiss all of the allegations in the first part of this post as nutty
conspiracy theories, or decide that they are real and that I am using
parody. Your choice. Either way, it is clear that we've been had ...
Forget that Bin Laden likely received CIA training and support in fighting against the Russians in Afghanistan. See this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this and this.
Forget the allegations by France's oldest and second-largest newspaper that a CIA agent met with Bin Laden two months before 9/11, and the claim by a former FBI translator that Bin Laden worked with the CIA right up until 9/11.
Forget that 9/11 was entirely foreseeable, and that government more or less heard the 9/11 hijackers' plans from their own mouths.
Forget that Dick Cheney was in charge of all counter-terrorism exercises, activities and responses on 9/11 (see this Department of State announcement, this Department of State announcement, this CNN article and this essay), and that:
- In the 70's - Cheney and Rumsfeld were
instrumental in generating fake intelligence exaggerating the Soviet
threat in order to undermine coexistence between the U.S. and Soviet
Union, which conveniently justified huge amounts of cold war spending (and see this)
- According to former high-level intelligence officer Melvin Goodman, Cheney orchestrated phony intelligence for the Congress in order to get an endorsement for covert arms shipments to anti-government forces in Angola
- Cheney
and Rumsfeld (and many other high-level officials in the Bush
Administration) were prominent members of a thinktank which called for a
new American empire well before 9/11, and lamented that, without
a "catastrophic and catalyzing event — like a new Pearl Harbor",
transformation of America into an empire would be very slow.
Forget that governments from around the world admit that they carry out false flag terrorism to justify their political goal.
Finally, forget that the U.S. could easily have captured Bin Laden in 2001 or 2007, but chose not to do so.
Bin Had
Ignoring the above, it is still obvious that we've been had.
Specifically, only 5 hours after the 9/11 attacks, Donald Rumsfeld said "my interest is to hit Saddam". He also said "Go massive . . . Sweep it all up. Things related and not."
And at 2:40 p.m. on September 11th, in a memorandum of discussions
between top administration officials, several lines below the
statement "judge whether good enough [to] hit S.H. [that is, Saddam
Hussein] at same time", is the statement "Hard to get a good case."
In other words, top officials knew that there wasn't a good case
that Hussein was behind 9/11, but they wanted to use the 9/11 attacks
as an excuse to justify war with Iraq anyway.
Moreover, "Ten days after the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, President
Bush was told in a highly classified briefing that the U.S.
intelligence community had no evidence linking the Iraqi regime of
Saddam Hussein to the [9/11] attacks and that there was scant credible
evidence that Iraq had any significant collaborative ties with Al
Qaeda".
And a Defense Intelligence Terrorism Summary issued in February 2002 by the United States Defense Intelligence Agency cast significant doubt on the possibility of a Saddam Hussein-al-Qaeda conspiracy.
And yet Bush, Cheney and other top administration officials claimed repeatedly for years that Saddam was behind 9/11. See this analysis. Indeed, Bush administration officials apparently swore in a lawsuit that Saddam was behind 9/11.
Moreover, President Bush's March 18, 2003 letter to Congress authorizing the use of force against Iraq, includes the following paragraph:
(2)
acting pursuant to the Constitution and Public Law 107-243 is
consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take
the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist
organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons
who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks
that occurred on September 11, 2001.
Therefore, the
Bush administration expressly justified the Iraq war to Congress by
representing that Iraq planned, authorized, committed, or aided the
9/11 attacks. See this.
Moreover, the torture program which Cheney created was specifically aimed
at producing false confessions in an attempt to link Iraq and 9/11: er,
the type of torture used since 9/11 was a special type of torture specifically aimed at creating false confessions:
- One
of the Main Sources for the 9/11 Commission Report was Tortured
Until He Agreed to Sign a Confession that He Was NOT EVEN ALLOWED
TO READ
- 9/11
Mastermind: "During ... My Interrogation I Gave A Lot Of False
Information In Order To Satisfy What I Believed The Interrogators
Wished To Hear"
And see this.
As American historian, investigative journalist and policy analyst Gareth Porter writes this week:
Cheney and Rumsfeld were determined not to allow a focus on bin Laden
to interfere with their plan for a U.S. invasion of Iraq to
overthrow the Saddam Hussein regime.
It's not just Iraq.
Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair says that Dick Cheney's vision of policy towards the Middle East after 9/11 was to re-draw the map.
Porter writes in the Asia Times:
Feith's book, War and Decision, released last month, provides excerpts of the paper Rumsfeld sent to President George W Bush on September 30, 2001, calling for the administration to focus not on taking down Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda network but on the aim of establishing "new regimes" in a series of states [including Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Sudan, Somalia and Lebanon ]
There are some bad guys out there, but their importance has been greatly exaggerated to justify America's imperial ambitions. No wonder former U.S. National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski told the Senate that the war on terror is "a mythical historical narrative".
Bin Laden might have been a bad guy ... but the way his life and death have been used have been dishonest.
»
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May 6, 2011
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http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact
"....the torture program which Cheney created was specifically aimed at producing false confessions in an attempt to link Iraq and 9/11:"
Torture always yeilds information. It's a well known fact amongst those that study the technicals, that the resultant information has zero correlation with the truth and a strong correlation with what the torturer wants to hear. Torture continues as a tool for gathering information as long as humans are inclined to self-indulgence.
"....the torture program which Cheney created was specifically aimed at producing false confessions in an attempt to link Iraq and 9/11:"
Yet none of the "false confessions" yielded from those interrogations was ever used as justification of the Iraq War. they make up any lies they want to start a warkill, just like the Spanish American War, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Iraq and now Libya.
What kind of information does dragging an unarmed "terrorist mastermind" outside and shooting him in the head yield? What kind of information does immediately dumping his body in the ocean yield?
Conclusion: NO Govt. can be trusted to tell anything like the Truth!
No wonder former U.S. National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski told the Senate that the war on terror is "a mythical historical narrative".
You should immediately inform the smartest man in the world, Mein Obama, so that he can disband Homeland Security and pull the troops out of the Muslim countries. Also let him know that he just ordered the fake assassination of a bunch of innocent people and turn himself in for murder. If you know that it's all fake, I'm sure Mein Obama knows that it's all a fraud. Yet he ordered the assassination anyway.
I would enjoy seeing sun tzu give you a "bow-tie" with your g-string. I understand that just before blacking out, people can experience clarity.
Another one, outraged by waterboarding but perfectly fine with having an unarmed man dragged outside and executed in front of his wife and daughter without a trial.
I thought he was already dead and all that.
Some folks need to get a story and stick with it.
I personally think OBL was long dead and has been used as a boogeyman by the Bush and Obama administrations to continue the wars and chip away at civil liberties.
Most of the public sheeple, like GW, believe that OBL was recently assassinated on Obama's orders. Going by GW's line of reasoning, GW should demand that Obama be imprisoned for murder.
"Some folks need to get a story and stick with it."
Exactly my point. Waterboarding is evil and illegal, but dragging an unarmed man outside and shooting him in the head in front of his wife and daughter is okay?
Sheeple dreams...
Do you mean to say that cia knew at least since 2005 that bin laden where bin laden was settling, in Abbottabad?
...and have been watching-listening-learning ever since?
and only after Wikileaks had the data that obl's prime couriers had been followed since 2005...
...were they forced to tell the President?
...bec if they didn't announce to the Pres "we just found him!", then the Pres would learn from other sources that obl's location had been known for years?
OBL "knew" he was immune to capture...how else to explain the circumstances. Kinda double- crossed.
GWB likely knew. I do not think current Pres was told immed upon assuming office...the cia could make much hay until timing the discovery was convenient. Had to shooot him bec that was part of the "just found out" cover...and obl knew way, way too much abt intel games KSA-USA-England.
Interesting thoughts. This makes more sense to me than all the other BS floating around.
all Presidential candidates bend the knee and kiss the ring of the Likudniks. All of them.....game , set, match.......complete takeover of our government is now complete. deep capture is now in full effect.
http://www.realzionistnews.com/?p=633
Oh, I almost forgot.
Although the CIA may have met with bin Laden shortly before 9/11, who's to say they knew his plans any more than the Czechs or Poles knew Hitler's intentions; and they never met with ObL afterward!
Maybe, but Neville new and gave a wink and nod to Hitler with the promise of leaving the UK alone. That was the crime. Plus Czecks and Poles could've had two years warning and done nothing to stop Hitler. Big difference.
The Czech fortifications were first class and the Germans wanted no part of them. Neville gave 'em away. A lot of the Panzers used early in WWII were actually Czech designs produced at the Skoda armament works.
Some of the Panzers were Czech. The main German tanks were the Panzer II & III during the 1938-1941 timeframe. There was no way for the Czech to win because they were outnumbered 12 to 1 and surrounded.
Gotta go dig out some stuff, but the Czech t-35 was superior to PzII.
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/panzerkampfwagen-35t.htm
They "confiscated" 219 of t-35's which was instrumental in outfitting new Panzer divisions for the Polish campaign.
The t-38s
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/panzerkampfwagen-38t.htm
were superior to the Pz II and the early versions of the Pz III. This was a design stolen wholesale from the Czechs.
At the time of the Munich conference, there were maybe 90 PzIII's in operation.
The German Army wanted no part of an invasion of Czechoslovakia in 1938.
Almost everything was superior to the Panzer II. It had a 20mm canon as the main armament. The Panzer III looked nothing like the Czech T-35 or T-38. The Panzer III was superior to the T-38. The T-38 was old style with bolted on armor instead of welding. I don't think they copied it. They look nothing alike. Even the suspensions are different. The T-38 was used until late 1941 and maybe early 1942. The Panzer III was still effective in 1943 and saw action until 1944. I've been a WWII and tank buff since I was 10 years old.
Of course Hitler didn't want to fight the Czechs if he could take them peacefully. Look at a map of Europe in 1938 and you'll see why the Czech had no chance. The Czech were almost completely surrounded by Germany-Austria. The Hungarians to the south were German allies. The Czechs had no air cover, so the Stukas would have pounded any fortifications into dust. All the Germans had to do was find a weak point and perform their pincer movement.
Good exchange, we are at the point of quibbling, but I will add, take a look at the topography (and forts) the Germans would have had to deal with in going after Cz. By being gifted Cz., they effectively outflanked the Poles. The rest is history, or so they say.
George,
Respectfully, you're forgetting about all of the problems with Iraq that President Clinton had. It was considered CW in the intelligence and defense community the suspicion that Saddam was trying to get even by assymetrical means since he hadn't been able to do so directly.
And given the "evolution" of the administrations story this last week, people speaking out of turn (pardon the cliche) I find it unsurprising that Rumsfeld would have openly fingered Saddam as being involved in the 9/11 attacks, if even tangentially.
And I'm not sure of your source, but I myself have seen Rumsfeld speak several times this week and say directly that "enhanced interrogation" contributed to the intel that led us to Sunday's SEAL raid.
Also, there's a NYTimes piece today that refutes Col. Hunt's assertion that Bin Laden was "in their sights" in 2007:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/06/world/asia/06binladen.html?pagewanted=all
So it's hard to say who is correct; while I respect Col Hunt, he may be voicing more of his opinion that concrete fact.
Perhaps all of these things, back to the cold war, are contrivances as you assert. But as I recall, and from my own experieces, they were widely believed based on the best intelligence at the time. It's easy in hindsight to believe the Soviets put up little better than a good front, but it was not so apparent at the time.
And as a final note, I'd only point out that all of my bretheren in the Naval aviation community, and all special forces operators, underwent "enhanced interrogations" as part of our SERE training regimen; indeed, I won't go into gory details, but we were subjected to worse than the field manual allowed for. Granted, we could choose to leave at any time, which would forfeit our shot at becoming rated for combat operation as well, and we knew a priori it was only for a finite interval and not indefinite incarceration. But the things that were alleged to have been done in but a few of these instances pales beside what has been inflicted by our adversaries; often posted on youtube and such for the world to see...
Enhanced interrogations should be extremely rare, but available to the chief executive in case the circumstances call for it. For although human rights are universal, it is part of the societal compact that sometimes the rights of one needs to be infringed upon for the good of the many. Just like capital criminals surrender all their rights and lose their freedom for life, and are sometimes executed, so too in conflicts between nations, and with transnational assymetric terror organizations, it is necessary to resort to extreme measures to avoid disaster to a far greater number of folks.
In short, while many say it was immoral to subject folks like KSM to enhanced interrogation techniques, it would have been even more immoral to not do so and subject US civilians to the results of their surely deadly plans.
Even though we disagree, your post is thought provoking as always,
My regards
I agree enhanced interogations should be used in extremely rare circumstances. In all honesty, I would authorize their use right now on George Bush, Dick Cheney, Netanyahu, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Richard pearle, Larry Silversten to find out what they knew about 911. Also --the heads of the New York Times, washington post, CBS, NBC, Fox)to find out why they covered it up)- I'll also throw in the Wall Street, Goldman sachs crowd.
This is clearly a matter of national security. We have a right to know if our government has been hijacked by treasonous forces - or if they have committed mass murder in carrying out a false flag operation.
Mr. Bob, I appreciate your civil tone, and your implicit acknowledgement that you are or were in one of the defense or intelligence services (am I reading that right? I greatly respect the gentlemen in the military and intelligence services - many of whom have more courage in a single toe than the chickenhawk civillian leaders have in their whole bodies!)
Respectfully, sir, SERE was bastardized and changed in order to illicit false confessions. For example:
So we have the two main Air Force insiders concerning the genesis of the torture program confirming - with original notes - that the whole purpose of the torture program was to extract false confessions.
That's a valid point George, that the "resistance" part of our training was as much to avoid being exploited for propaganda purposes as providing information; it was a stated aim...
Being a NAVAIR "use-ta-bee", (F-14 pilot), I never meat Kearns; we had separate programs. But I will not dispute nor cannot directly refute his opinion, but only note that there are varying opinions on the subject.
Because the facts are that KSM and others never gave up info on ObL's courier under enhanced interrogation, but at a later time, perhaps after some level of Stockholm effect set in.
My Regards
Wow you quoted aseveral paragraphs and ended with a false and totally unsupported conclusion. Where in the article does it say
"the whole purpose of the torture program was to extract false confessions."
Did you intentionally lie or are you mistakenly interpreting something from the article?
Also, when will you write an article damning Obama for ordering the Navy SEALs to illegally enter a sovereign state and to execute unarmed men in front of their families? If you are outraged by waterboarding of alleged terrorists, then you must have very strong opinions on assassinations.
And drone attacks on people >>>without a trial<<<...but I digress ;-)
you do realize the drones will come here one day very soon? afghanistan and iraq are just a warm up for the big prize, us...........
I can't wait to see them dancing with the stars.
Rush & ZH; now, there's a looking glass.
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/05/04/gordon-duff-on-the-rocks-the-dea...
.
GORDON DUFF: “ON THE ROCKS,” THE RE-DEATH OF BIN LADEN’S FROZEN CORPSE (Multiple confirmations with BBC/VT PODCAST)
May 4, 2011 posted by Gordon Duff
..
..
There has been little out of Washington DC since the “world domination” cabal, PNAC (Project for a New American Century) or the Brzezinski “World Chessboard” counterparts outlined the need for a “Pearl Harbour scale” event with a “cardboard cutout” boogeyman to act as backdrop for re-engineering the face of the planet. After the “event,” we would see the seizure of Central Asia’s hydrocarbon resources, the collapse of the world’s monetary systems and a political upheaval to spread across the world that would leave every political institution in every country vulnerable to the dictates of an unseen “globalist” hand."
..
..
"Let’s not let facts get in the way.
First of all, for those of you who don’t know it, bin Laden had nothing to do with 9/11, was charged with nothing about it. Secondly, the criminal charges against bin Laden were not backed by any evidence, not enough for an honest indictment."
...
Nice Blindman. Also very insightful:
JAMES PETRAS : The Assassination of bin Laden — Its Use and Abuse
http://mycatbirdseat.com/2011/05/james-petras-the-assassination-of-bin-l...
yes and here it is ten years later and we still argue about this stuff. it is all so crystal clear, yet so many still believe the official stories about all of this. its a damn shame and a curse upon this land.......
i repost here though you probably already read this.
.
by TerraHertz
on Sun, 05/08/2011 - 08:54
#1252694
On the 'Bin Laden Tapes'
The ONLY valid 'post-911 Bin Laden tape' was the one that appeared in Oct 2001, in which Bin Laden denied responsibility for 911, pointed out that Islam forbids the killing of innocents, and advises Americans to look within their own country for the perpetrators. The US govt suppressed that one.
There were many 'Bin Laden' videos after that, but they all (even though I seem to recall a very early one was of a genuine looking, very sick and gaunt Bin Laden) contained either gloating or indirect admissions of guilt, and were all hailed and openly pushed by the govt. If any of them *were* Osama, I'd guess that by then it had been put to him that if he wanted to ever see inside a hospital again, he'd read the dammed script given to him.
Here's the transcript of the one genuine denial:
http://www.public-action.com/911/oblintrv.html
Bin Laden: AUTHENTIC INTERVIEW (includes full text)
by Carol A. Valentine
Curator, Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum
http://www.Public-Action.com
Copyright, October, 2001
http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=433
http://viewzone2.com/osamax.html
Not many people know that, after September 11, 2001, Osama bin Laden issued a statement on tape that he had nothing to do with the attacks on America and that such actions were against the teachings of Islam. Americans were prevented from accessing this information because we were told that Osama could possibly have an embedded "secret code" in the tape that would alert other terrorists cells to "activate" and target other American cities.
Here is the transcript of what you were not allowed to hear from Osama binLaden's own mouth:
" I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks. ... The American system is totally in control of the Jews, whose first priority is Israel, not the United States."
See http://everist.org/archives/links/!_Osama_Bin_Laden_links.txt
reply
flag as junk (1)
Our fearless ToTUS not only singlehandedly made the decision himself. He also led the hands-on training for the team that performed the operation.
Does anyone really believe that he played as much golf as reported? where are the photos? No way, he was doing top secret training for the Team 6.
Exactly.
His cover is president, the real president is Biden, Obama's real name is Bond, Barry Bond...I read it on Prison Planet so I know it must be true, right under a similar Zbigniew Brzezinski story from 2007 ;-)
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2007/060207falseflag.htm
Zbig is a tri-lat...lion & tigers & bears, oh my...LOL.
Ok GW, we know all this. Now we need to GET AHEAD of what the new empire will do next. And make some money
Russia invades georgia and then the new empire sinks oil from 140 to 35 to punish Russia. Shit like that.
GW can't write on the current and future because to do so he would have to badmouth his Messiah. Notice how all of his articles are about how bad America WAS pre-Obama.
A few weeks ago, he was torn apart by the waterboarding of suspected terrorists. Now he's fine with having the President order the summary execution of people in other countries. In his mind, being waterboarded under Bush's orders is worse than being dragged outside and shot in the head in front of your wife and daughter under Obama's orders.
You sure got a faggy lookin' picture.
Not that I got anything against fags, some o' my best friends are fags.
Well, maybe not. Maybe just acquaintances.
But I did smoke 'em back in the 60s.
He didn't explicitly deny it, so he must be a fag (not that there's anything wrong with it.)
Glorifying the nude male body-especially the lower extremities -the organs of the excretory functions seem to be a common trait of fags - (not that there's anything wrong with that)
Condemning all that is politically incorrect seems to be a common trait of fags. (not that there's anything wrong with it.)
i complained about the big tit avatars (not cos i'm a fag, not that there's anything wrong with it)
but because i knew not far behind it would be guys cocks or crotches.
and this guys posted so much its made me feel a bit nauseous.
lets keep it respectable , for the sake of the curious if not the children.
I believe you mean "nauseated", but I get the point.
Your being "nauseous" would mean that you make others sick.
Goddam, my grammar has been corrected by someone who just said
'You sure got a faggy lookin' picture.'
Yeah. I used to think I was a Renaissance Man but merely discovered that I'm unfocused.
Listen dude, you brought up the faggy picture and i and many others are grateful for that.
i would have done it to but my grammar aint good and i might have insulted someone.
You've perhaps made ZH a safer place where people will think of the damage they are doing b4 they put up a body part as an avatar.... don't ever forget that.
I still smoke em. They're getting expensive though.
oil from 140 to 35..
in diluted, overleveraged US Dollars?
you know there's a problem when oil is trading gradually lower but gas prices keep going up and you have shortages.
hint: fewer and fewer PRODUCERS accept the diluted US paper
GW.... good work, I don't doubt for a moment your thesis and the conclusions. OBL is/was a side show. Just follow the oil....
And here's the self avowed socialist who left his countrymen behind to seek his fame & fortune in America of all places.
Excellent!
Why don't you just go fuck yourself...
Can't debate the facts with me, can you.
You asshats confuse socialism, communism, fascism and corporatism. Your standard rebuttal can be expressed as "If I don't understand it, it must be wrong." Hell, there are few here that even confuse feudalism.
Do you even own a passport? Ever venture out from the county you were born in? Why don't you go get yourself a plate of grits...
ROTFLMAO!!!
I debated you and won you half assed fuckin statist/socialist pig.
"Do you even own a passport?"
Why yes I do...got it in the 80's...did you ever have some clever point you were trying to make in this line of obsessive questioning Heinrich?...along with your obssesion with what my wages are?...never found out did you? ;-)
"Ever venture out from the county you were born in?"
Yes I have...Canada, for one.
"Why don't you go get yourself a plate of grits..."
LOL...lemme guess, Don Rickles in Kellys Heroes?...you knew you heard the Americana somewhere, you just couldn't remember right?...this is the only thing for free you will get from me...enjoy it asshole.
A trip down memory lane...
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/more-americans-think-america-depression-growing#comment-1219241