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Charting JPM's Historical Holdings Of SLV

Tyler Durden's picture


As an attempt to refute the previously disclosed plunge in speculative positions, some have made the claim that it is really retail holders causing the spike in silver via such synthetic CDOs as SLV. While this argument is beyond laughable (although there is some credibility to the claim that there is a feedback loop to ETF buys leading to underlying gains and vice versa, although we expect SLV's silver holdings disclosed tomorrow to once again gain thus ending the selling cycle) and we look forward to debunking it thoroughly when the latest 13F is released sometime on Friday, we did want to point out something just as amusing: the holdings of JPM compared to the price of SLV (incidentally, JPM is the third largest holder of SLV with 5.1 million shares, just behind BofA with 6.8 million shares and Morgan Stanley with 7.2 million). Which begs these questions three: retail or really institutional buying was the primary force behind the move in SLV? Was this merely a case of uber-leveraged tail wagging the dog (since CFTC indicates there was nothing at all bubbly about non-commercial spec contracts)? And, three, if so, why...



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Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:11 | 1257919 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture

Physical Bitchez!!!

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:17 | 1257944 TheTmfreak
TheTmfreak's picture


Where is the 357 with multiple reloads ready to go?


You know because I'm afraid for my life.....

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:37 | 1257987 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

This is why they had to pay legions of idiots like MethMan $2USD/hr to troll on sites like ZH to try and scare people into selling their PMs.  It didn't work, and they are now shitting their panties.


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 02:07 | 1258232 Michael
Michael's picture

I seem to arrive to the party late these days. This is in response to the Iran Bin Laden story posted earlier. I put it here so someone may read it.

"Bin Laden “was used in the same way that 9/11 was used to mobilize the emotions and feelings of the American people in order to go to a war that had to be justified through a narrative that Bush junior created and Cheney created about the world of terrorism.” — Dr. Steve R. Pieczenik

With the (at least second) death of Usama bin Laden now creating a tsunami of feelings and frothy nationalism, millions of people are finding a sense of emotional closure, some stitches to help seal the wound, the fear and confusion of 9-11-2001.

But something is very wrong with the administration’s slip-sliding story of midnight heroics executing the bad guy behind 9-11, then disposing of his body so no one could verify the alleged DNA match and saying “Just trust us” – as though many people do.

Surface irregularities

The photo of President Obama and a roomful of his advisers apparently watching the operation go down (recorded by helmet-cams worn by the SEALS) turns out to be a picture of them watching … something else.  Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta acknowledged that the helmet-cams were not on during the operation, and were off for 25 minutes (others say 35) after the SEALS entered the compound.

And that million-dollar mansion in which bin Laden lived?  Well, no.  Property records showed that the land was worth $48,000 when it was purchased in stages in 2004 and 2005, according to the Associated Press.[i]

Initially, the story was presented as a vicious firefight against an armed compound, where bin Laden used his wife as a human shield, firing at the invaders from behind her.  Now it seems that bin Laden was not armed, was not using anyone as a shield, and was in his pajamas when shot.[ii]

Salon’s Glenn Greenwald cut to the chase in his May 3rd column: “In bin Laden killing, media – as usual – regurgitates false Government claims”:

“Yesterday [May 2, 2011], it was widely reported that bin Laden “resisted” his capture and “engaged in a firefight” with U.S. forces….  It was also repeatedly claimed that bin Laden used a woman — his wife — as a human shield to protect himself, and that she was killed as a result. That image — of a cowardly though violent-to-the-end bin Laden — framed virtually every media narrative of the event all over the globe. And it came from many government officials, principally Obama’s top counter-terrorism adviser, John Brennan.”
All major media dutifully reported this made-for-movie story.  But by the next day it was obvious that almost all of the key dramatic elements in the story were completely false: fictions for the masses, facts be damned. Greenwald:

“No matter how many times this happens — from Jessica Lynch’s heroic firefight against Iraqi captors to Pat Tillman’s death at the hands of Evil Al Qaeda fighters — it never changes: the narrative is set forever by first-day government falsehoods uncritically amplified by establishment media outlets, which endure no matter how definitively they are disproven in subsequent days.” [iii]

This is the psychology of the “Big Lie”: we tend to swallow wildly exaggerated stories more than little lies, because we assume that others would not use that degree of dishonesty.  It’s playing to car-crash journalism, and our love of a simple and pure story of vengeance by the Good Guys over The Forces of Evil.  We love good theater.

Who benefits from this Kabuki Theater story? Well, when Obama met for a chat with firefighters from Engine 54 in lower Manhattan, he assured them – and, through the media, the rest of us: “You’re always going to have a president and an administration who’s got your back.”[iv]

Deeper misdirection

If this shifting story were no more than politics as usual in a propaganda-driven world, we could swallow it – at least as well as we’ve swallowed the earlier untrue and manipulative stories about Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman.  But there are enough stories from then-reputable sources indicating that the bin Laden kill story’s Big Lie goes much deeper: frighteningly deeper. These more disturbing stories indicate that Usama bin Laden was not even connected to the events of 9-11, let alone their “mastermind” — and that he died in 2001.

Usama bin Laden is a red herring
On November 13, 2002, just fourteen months after 9-11, a blogger contributed this to Buzzflash (

For your amusement and future reference, here’s what Bush has said about bin Laden at various points in time, depending on how he was trying to spin things:
“The most important thing is for us to find Usama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him.”
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01
“I want justice…There’s an old poster out West, as I recall, that said, ‘Wanted: Dead or Alive,’”
- G.W. Bush, 9/17/01, UPI
“…Secondly, he is not escaping us. This is a guy, who, three months ago, was in control of a county [sic]. Now he’s maybe in control of a cave. He’s on the run. Listen, a while ago I said to the American people, our objective is more than bin Laden. But one of the things for certain is we’re going to get him running and keep him running, and bring him to justice. And that’s what’s happening. He’s on the run, if he’s running at all. So we don’t know whether he’s in cave with the door shut, or a cave with the door open — we just don’t know….” – GW Bush, remarks in an open meeting with the Press Travel Pool at Bush’s “ranch” in Crawford TX, 12/28/01, as reported on the official White House site.
“I don’t know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don’t care. It’s not that important. It’s not our priority. I am truly not that concerned about him.”
- G.W. Bush, responding to a question about bin Laden’s whereabouts, 3/13/02 (The New American, 4/8/02) [v]
This last quote was the statement – made just two and a half months after Bush swore to find bin Laden and bring him to justice – showing that even GW Bush didn’t consider Usama bin Laden an essential part of the story for which our soldiers – and perhaps millions of citizens in Arab countries – have shed so much blood and so many life-altering injuries.

Usama bin Laden cannot be connected to 9-11
What did Usama himself say about 9-11? In a Sept. 28, 2001 interview with the Pakistani newspaper Ummat, bin Laden is reported to have said:

“I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people. Such a practice is forbidden even in the course of a battle.”[vi]

FBI admits they have no evidence connecting bin Laden to 9-11

According to the FBI “Wanted” page[vii]: “Usama Bin Laden is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. These attacks killed over 200 people. In addition, Bin Laden is a suspect in other terrorist attacks throughout the world.”[viii]
When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on the FBI’s web page, Rex Tomb, the FBI’s chief of investigative publicity, is reported to have said, “The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11.”[ix]

In fact, FBI Director Robert Mueller and Vice President Dick Cheney both admit there is no evidence linking bin Laden to 9-11.  On March 29, 2006, on The Tony Snow Show, Vice President Dick Cheney stated: “We’ve never made the case, or argued the case, that somehow Osama Bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming.”[x]

At the end of their Top Ten list, the FBI notes that bin Laden “is left-handed and walks with a cane.”

This last comment is important because there are reports of the CIA creating fake bin Laden videos – at least one with a right-handed actor looking to be 80-100 lbs. fatter, and with a much fatter nose, than Usama bin Laden — which have been embarrassingly easy to spot as fake.

Former CIA Officials Admit To Faking Bin Laden Video

Steve Watson, PrisonPlanet,Tuesday, May 25th, 2010:
“Two former CIA officials have admitted to creating a fake video in which intelligence officers dressed up as Usama Bin Laden and his cronies in an effort to defame the terrorist leader throughout the Middle East.
“The details are outlined in a Washington Post article by investigative reporter and former Army Intelligence case officer Jeff Stein.”[xi][xii]
Could the CIA group of “dark skinned actors” have been behind the infamous December 2001 “Fat nosed” Bin Laden video, that was magically found in a house in Jalalabad after anti-Taliban forces moved in?

The tape featured a fat Usama laughing and joking about how he’d carried out 9/11. The video was also mistranslated in order to manipulate viewer opinion and featured “Bin Laden” praising two of the hijackers, only he got their names wrong. This Usama wrote with his right hand (the real Usama was, as the FBI site noted, left-handed). The actor playing Fat Usama in the December 2001 staged video, also wore gold rings: a practice totally in opposition to the Muslim faith.

Despite the fact that the man in the video looks nothing like Bin Laden and is right-handed, the CIA stood by it and declared it to be the official “9/11 confession video”.[xiii][xiv]

Bin Laden died in late 2001

– A Google search for “bin Laden died in 2001” brought up 31 pages of stories.  Here are a few representative stories from mainstream sources, including one that may – if true — be a “smoking gun” from a top government insider:

1.         “Usama bin Laden has died a peaceful death due to an untreated lung complication, the Pakistan Observer reported, citing a Taliban leader who allegedly attended the funeral of the Al Qaeda leader.
“The Coalition troops are engaged in a mad search operation but they would never be able to fulfill their cherished goal of getting Usama alive or dead,” the source said.
Bin Laden, according to the source, was suffering from a serious lung complication and succumbed to the disease in mid-December 2001, in the vicinity of the Tora Bora mountains. The source claimed that bin Laden was laid to rest honorably in his last abode and his grave was made as per his Wahabi belief.
About 30 close associates of bin Laden in Al Qaeda, including his most trusted and personal bodyguards, his family members and some “Taliban friends,” attended the funeral rites. A volley of bullets was also fired to pay final tribute to the “great leader.” December 26, 2001.[xv]

2.         Translation of Funeral Article in Egyptian Paper: al-Wafd, Wednesday, December 26, 2001 Vol. 15 No. 4633

Islamabad — A prominent official in the Afghan Taliban movement announced yesterday the death of Usama bin Laden, the chief of al-Qa’da organization, stating that bin Laden suffered serious complications in the lungs and died a natural and quiet death. The official, who asked to remain anonymous, stated to The Observer of Pakistan that he had himself attended the funeral of bin Laden and saw his face prior to burial in Tora Bora 10 days ago. He mentioned that 30 of al-Qa’da fighters attended the burial as well as members of his family and some friends from the Taliban. In the farewell ceremony to his final rest guns were fired in the air. The official stated that it is difficult to pinpoint the burial location of bin Laden because according to the Wahhabi tradition no mark is left by the grave. He stressed that it is unlikely that the American forces would ever uncover any traces of bin Laden.[xvi]

3.         “Usama bin Laden is dead. The news first came from sources in Afghanistan and Pakistan almost six months ago: the fugitive died in December [2001] and was buried in the mountains of southeast Afghanistan. Pakistan’s former president, Gen. Pervez Musharraf, echoed the information. The remnants of Usama’s gang, however, have mostly stayed silent, either to keep Usama’s ghost alive or because they have no means of communication.
“With an ego the size of Mount Everest, Usama bin Laden would not have, could not have, remained silent for so long if he were still alive. He always liked to take credit even for things he had nothing to do with. Would he remain silent for nine months and not trumpet his own survival?”[xvii]

4.         “The Bin Laden Scam is One of the Most Shameful Acts Ever Perpetrated…”
By Gordon Duff, Veterans Today, December 5, 2009

“Conservative commentator, former Marine Colonel Bob Pappas has been saying for years that bin Laden died at Tora Bora and that Senator Kerry’s claim that bin Laden escaped with Bush help was a lie. Now we know that Pappas was correct. The embarrassment of having Secretary of State Clinton talk about bin Laden in Pakistan was horrific. He has been dead since December 13, 2001 and now, finally, everyone, Obama, McChrystal, Cheney, everyone who isn’t nuts is finally saying what they have known for years.

“We know this: Bin Laden always denied any ties to 9/11 and, in fact, has never been charged in relation to 9/11. He not only denied involvement, but had done so, while alive, 4 times and had vigorously condemned those who were involved in the attack.

“This is on the public record, public in every free country except ours. We, instead, showed films made by paid actors, made up to look somewhat similar to bin Laden, actors who contradicted bin Laden’s very public statements, actors pretending to be bin Laden long after bin Laden’s death.”[xviii]

5.         Top Government Insider: Bin Laden Died in 2001, 9/11 A False Flag

The most recent (4 May 2011) story is – if true – perhaps the most damning and explosive, from a man who was appointed to sensitive and influential positions in the Secretary of State and Defense departments by five presidents going back to Richard Nixon. This story deserves an extended citation (link to full story at the end):

“Top US government insider Dr. Steve R. Pieczenik, a man who held numerous different influential positions under three different Presidents and still works with the Defense Department, shockingly told The Alex Jones Show yesterday that Usama Bin Laden died in 2001 and that he was prepared to testify in front of a grand jury how a top general told him directly that 9/11 was a false flag inside job.

“Pieczenik cannot be dismissed as a “conspiracy theorist”. He served as the Deputy Assistant Secretary of State under three different administrations, Nixon, Ford and Carter, while also working under Reagan and Bush senior, and still works as a consultant for the Department of Defense. A former US Navy Captain, Pieczenik achieved two prestigious Harry C. Solomon Awards at the Harvard Medical School as he simultaneously completed a PhD at MIT.

“Recruited by Lawrence Eagleburger as Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Management, Pieczenik went on to develop, “the basic tenets for psychological warfare, counter terrorism, strategy and tactics for transcultural negotiations for the US State Department, military and intelligence communities and other agencies of the US Government,” while also developing foundational strategies for hostage rescue that were later employed around the world.

“Pieczenik also served as a senior policy planner under Secretaries Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance, George Schultz and James Baker and worked on George W. Bush’s election campaign against Al Gore. His record underscores the fact that he is one of the most deeply connected men in intelligence circles over the past three decades plus.

“The character of Jack Ryan, who appears in many Tom Clancy novels and was also played by Harrison Ford in the popular 1992 movie Patriot Games, is also based on Steve Pieczenik.

“Back in April 2002, over nine years ago, Pieczenik told the Alex Jones Show that Bin Laden had already been “dead for months,” and that the government was waiting for the most politically expedient time to roll out his corpse. Pieczenik would be in a position to know, having personally met Bin Laden and worked with him during the proxy war against the Soviets in Afghanistan back in the early 80′s.

“Pieczenik said that Usama Bin Laden died in 2001, “Not because special forces had killed him, but because as a physician I had known that the CIA physicians had treated him and it was on the intelligence roster that he had marfan syndrome,” adding that the US government knew Bin Laden was dead before they invaded Afghanistan.”

Marfan syndrome is a degenerative genetic disease for which there is no permanent cure. The illness severely shortens the life span of the sufferer.

“He died of marfan syndrome, Bush junior knew about it, the intelligence community knew about it,” said Pieczenik, noting how CIA physicians had visited Bin Laden in July 2001 at the American Hospital in Dubai.

“He was already very sick from marfan syndrome and he was already dying, so nobody had to kill him,” added Pieczenik, stating that Bin Laden died shortly after 9/11 in his Tora Bora cave complex.

“Pieczenik explained that he was not a liberal, a conservative or a tea party member, merely an American who is deeply concerned about the direction in which his country is heading.”

(The website Above Top Secret is now running the story of a nearly complete media blackout relating to Dr. Pieczenik’s story.)[xix]

Most of this information is known to Fox News, The New York Times, The Washington Post and the administrations of both the GW Bush and Obama.  If the subject were less emotional and complex, hoardes of reporters would already have torn the official version to shreds.  But the way Obama’s administration packaged and released the stories was meant to – and did – plunge all of us into the fiery picture of bloody heroics in the made-for-movie saga of a continuing fight for Good against Evil.  The high temperature of the story directs us toward uncritical acceptance, along with admiration and gratitude for the courage of both our Navy SEALS and – not incidentally – President Obama.

With our leaders operating within the supercharged atmosphere inside the Beltway, they live in a setting of secrecy conducive to creating True Believers.  The danger of such closed circles was perhaps put best by Albert Speer, who was the only Nazi to confess, then to write clearly and forcefully just how the process worked.  This is not meant to compare our government with the Nazis – just to say the presence of so much secrecy easily traps the key players inside a hall of mirrors:

In normal circumstances, people who turn their backs on reality are soon set straight by the mockery and criticism of those around them, which makes them aware they have lost credibility.  In the Third Reich there were no such correctives, especially for those who belonged to the upper stratum.  On the contrary, every self-deception was multiplied as in a hall of distorting mirrors, becoming a repeatedly confirmed picture of a fantastical dream world, which no longer bore any relationship to the grim outside world.  In those mirrors I could see nothing but my own face reproduced many times over.[xx]

Our whole country is now engulfed by an incendiary story that reeks of dangerous propaganda.  It’s time we stopped shouting “Fire!” and began shouting “Theater!”'

Long Live Alex Jones!



Tue, 05/10/2011 - 02:42 | 1258252 Arroneous
Arroneous's picture

I understand that this is a bit of a conspiratorial site.   I get that to certain degrees, but come on.  I read zerohedge religiously and actually read the Times to offset the thought bias.  But what the hell are you trying to say here.  I mean really.  You go against what I think this site stands for.  You have a bunch of pseudo facts to tell you that the govt is lying to you about bin laden.  Do I believe them?  No.  Do I believe one second of the bs you are spitting?  NO  Stick to some facts.  


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:19 | 1258397 captcorona
captcorona's picture

Umm..The ZeroHedge Article is about JPM and SLV...You are commenting on a comment...Hello???

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 14:14 | 1259825 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

arrone & capt:  this site stands for free speech, dialogue, & fighting for same & self;  ideas, learning.  it's ok. 

we all hijack a thread once in a while.  michael is prob the reigning champ, and here he is comin on strong as a junk magnet, too! 


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:17 | 1258398 captcorona
captcorona's picture

Umm..The ZeroHedge Article is about JPM and SLV...You are commenting on a comment...Hello???

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:23 | 1258402 captcorona
captcorona's picture

BTW..I would never use Alex Jones or prison planet as a source in a serious conversation...

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 09:51 | 1258910 Bartanist
Bartanist's picture

Most people would not use Alex Jones as a source.

However, that does not mean that it is not true or that Alex Jones does not use credible sources... but you did not indicate that there was any evidence that what was presented was not factual information or that the conclusions drawn are wrong.

Most people prefer to give away their right to think to others and so they are blind to the truth and subjects of those in "authority/power" who then think for them. The unfortunate thing about that is the primary goal of those in power is to stay in power whatever it takes. And while that is an assumption, by virtue of that alone it would make them an un-credible source of information.

Looking at the evidence and my assumed motivations of those involved, it is most likely factual. However, two thoughts:

a) Dr. Steven R. Pieczenik .. I have listened to the guy and he sounds credible, however Pieczenik -- Peace-nik (like a 60s term, man... just irony?)

b) If our government must have an external threat and OBL is dead, what will the new threat be? Just randome terrorists, in a fight impossible to win? China? Bankers? Globalists? ... in a massiver reversal to appease the masses?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 02:43 | 1258254 Arroneous
Arroneous's picture

I understand that this is a bit of a conspiratorial site.   I get that to certain degrees, but come on.  I read zerohedge religiously and actually read the Times to offset the thought bias.  But what the hell are you trying to say here.  I mean really.  You go against what I think this site stands for.  You have a bunch of pseudo facts to tell you that the govt is lying to you about bin laden.  Do I believe them?  No.  Do I believe one second of the bs you are spitting?  NO  Stick to some facts.  


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 04:17 | 1258310 Dismal Scientist
Dismal Scientist's picture

Don't waste your breath. The poster is a nutjob, like all too many on this site nowadays. This will be my last comment, simply can't be ar*ed to follow the threads anymore.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 04:21 | 1258311 Michael
Michael's picture

Only 10% of the sheeple believe the government story about Bin Laden.

Poll Reveals Most Mistrust Bin Laden Assassination Story                                                                                                                                                                                             10 Facts That Prove The Bin Laden Fable Is a Contrived Hoax

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:30 | 1258412 clymer
clymer's picture

While I would agree that posting an entire article in the comments (as opposed to a link) may be in poor taste - anyone who actually believes the mind-crime spewed out by all of main stream media is truly delusional.


While occasionally a little over the top, Alex Jones' show is a must-listen, when he has on guests like Dr. Steve Pieczenik, Dr. Paul Craig Roberts, Catherine Austin Fitts, and many others. These are insiders - patriots who have served at the highest levels of U.S. government, through different administrations.


You detractors can throw out words to marginalize disseminators of this info - but never do we see you countering the information itself with counter-facts.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 05:16 | 1258352 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Anyone else ever see John Carpenter's movie, The Keep?

Remember what unloosed it all?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 05:38 | 1258362 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

An asshole with green hair that hijacked threads?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:04 | 1258382 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

It would appear that you did not see this movie because my observation is exactly on point.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:27 | 1258407 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

Lighten up.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 11:46 | 1259363 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

I forget it was something like bricks with upside down crosses on them.

Fri, 05/13/2011 - 00:52 | 1270834 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

A large cross of silver. The Nazi's soldiers' excitement as they pried it out of the wall ("Silver, SILVER!") was inexplicable to me at the time. Now I understand.

Oh, and in doing so, they created a hole into a huge space on the other side of the wall that theretofore had contained some pretty spooky entity. I am sure someone smarter and better educated in the classics than me could come up with some very apropos symbolism.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 10:46 | 1259111 cloudydays
cloudydays's picture

John Carpenter's the Keep?

F. Paul Wilson novel the Keep, published 1981, movie 1983 directed by Michael Mann.

Is there one I missed? Have seen this one, yes.

Mon, 05/16/2011 - 22:03 | 1281552 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Looked it up. You're right. I have no idea why I thought John Carpenter was responsible.

Mon, 05/16/2011 - 22:09 | 1281555 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

What is going on? Every post gets duplicated.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:44 | 1258409 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture


point of order: you wanna post that in one of the many Osamas Bin Shot threads here at ZH rather than a Silver thread?

i junked ya for poor targeting before pulling the trigger (see US military drones for similar behaviour)

...interesting read nevertheless

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 09:24 | 1258816 Kopfjager
Kopfjager's picture

THEN GET OUT OF YOUR MOM'S BASEMENT, PICK UP A WEAPON AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT COWARD!  Until then, you're just an internet warrior.  Go back to bed.  

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:18 | 1258400 Sathington Willougby
Sathington Willougby's picture

Did I see Andrew Bynum walk through there?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 13:24 | 1259675 FIAT_FixItAgainTony
FIAT_FixItAgainTony's picture

nice to see reality.  thanks for posting the link guy.

i hope americans are happy for supporting corporate.  yeah, we really fell asleep at the wheel !

have to say a few things about the video that come to mind.

1 - no breaking and entering.

2 - no weapons drawn.

3 - no senseless damage or destruction.

4 - no one was hurt physically.

5 - no one died.

was it right to do that to a store owner?  no.

i say corporate has forced the hand upon us.

when people are forced into desperate situations they do desperate things.

at least they were peaceful in their acquisitions.

i surely hope folks realize that here in america corporates ran out mom & pop shops.  then consider that actually assisted to unemploy part of the town, offset by a few hired by big box mart.  other factors cause further unemployment in that same town.  when corporate sales drop for too long at a location, corporate will fold up the big box marts.  then were do you buy your stuff?

i advise all at zh to consider these "first 3 steps to fixing america":

a) turn off television, probably zh'ers many have already done this.

b) read the Constitution, it's a short read, it not a novel.

c) refuse services at the barrel of a gun.

then the fun begins.

the rabbit hole runs deep so use silver to reflect the light down inside the hole so you can seek the truth as you go deeper in.

bottom line is deep down inside we know we are all connected by the fact people know right from wrong.  those who cannot "play well with others" need their own place to be with others of their ilk.  those of us who play well with others will hit the restart button and THIS time try not to fall asleep at the wheel.

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:16 | 1257932 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Because they know Silver is going only one way. The beach ball is free and will not take many more smackdowns.



Tue, 05/10/2011 - 01:21 | 1258187 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

@ Mulder

We will see more of these activities on video when more and more peole loose their jobs. 

The politicians and the FED already have blood in their hands, allowing the house market to form a bubble. No way out now.

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:22 | 1257950 FischerBlack
FischerBlack's picture

Since volume in SLV has been increasing over the same time period, it would be very odd not to see ever larger SLV positions at the ibanks involved in creating/redeeming units.

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:24 | 1257954 Math Man
Math Man's picture

It is never just one or the other. 

65 million+ shares were added to SLV during the run. 

Only makes sense that some of them wound up in institutional hands.

Both retail and institutional money share the blame here.

And today's spike in SLV ounces was short covering... 

It is also of note that those banks are all APs and broker dealers...  Given the high demand, they may have been holding inventory and hedging in the futures market.  Only makes sense that more inventory is held as demand moves up. 

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:28 | 1257964 dryam
dryam's picture

Seriously, who pays you to try to spew as much misinformation as you can on ZH?  Is it one of the TBTF's or is it the Fed/government?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:38 | 1258416 clymer
clymer's picture

Maybe in his twisted logic, he views junks as pre-65 mercury dimes and is trying to expand his hoard to save up enough for a 6 day vacation package at a turkish bath house?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 08:04 | 1258547 HardwoodAg
HardwoodAg's picture

Winged Liberty (Mercury)1916-1945

Roosevelt (90% Silver) 1946-1964

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 13:38 | 1259713 FIAT_FixItAgainTony
FIAT_FixItAgainTony's picture

keep a roll of mercury dimes on my desk, i like to look at 'em !

always carry an ASE dollar with me when i go out.  it reminds me of THE FACT that I AM worth more than the federal government with that one simple coin in my pocket. 

there is the real reason any PM's are dissuaded to the general public because wealthy peasants are not desired.

silver bitchez !

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:41 | 1258007 augie
augie's picture

It is insulting to compare a retail investor(s) to an institution like JPM. they are not even the same leuge, nay the same Sport in terms of their ability to influence a market.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 09:52 | 1258928 Kopfjager
Kopfjager's picture

Who would junk that?  Of course institutions have more influence than retail investors.  That's why you buy the fucking dip!  

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:20 | 1258086 Math Man
Math Man's picture

I'm not a big fan of FOFOA, but the silver article is a must read:

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:28 | 1258094 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

That article is flawed. The author is faking reality with his "narrative". Another paid shill trying to shake physical out of peoples hands. Ain't gonna happen. The fact that you are so adamant in your intent is a clear giveaway you are plain and simply a lying brown nosing lackey to TPTB.

"I'm only trying to help you guys!"

Just listen to yourself. You are pathetic. It's REALLY sad.


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:53 | 1258144 Math Man
Math Man's picture

Yep.  Everybody who disagrees is paid shill. 

Open your mind a little...  you've all been had.  But it is not too late to get out.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 01:17 | 1258182 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

How about you open your mouth? I don't want to miss from this far away.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 03:12 | 1258272 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

Math Man is an Illuminati prince...

...who has nothing else he would really rather do in the world than troll ZH from his daddy's palace...

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:37 | 1258418 clymer
clymer's picture

your welcome very much for greedily accepting my junk

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 03:19 | 1258274 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

I didnt mind the article at fofoa. It was just another point of view.. The fofoa blog makes it clear what its stance on the future of gold vs silver so there should be no surprises there. I think the stuff there is generally well thought out.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 04:22 | 1258316 Fred C Dobbs
Fred C Dobbs's picture

Why would someone with no interest in owning precious metals be reading fofoa? 

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 05:48 | 1258368 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

FOFOA prefers gold over silver during fiat's endgame, so what; due to the silver supply/demand imbalance, lagging mine start-up, Asian demand, JPM's short position etc, silver could still see 10x appreciation over the next couple of years even before hyperinflation and the dollar crash, so just ride it up and start to change some silver for gold if the GSR drops below 10 or 5.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:40 | 1258420 clymer
clymer's picture

because his interest is in detracting others from having an interest in precious metals

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 07:53 | 1258511 Math Man
Math Man's picture

Because it is important to read ALL sides of an argument before making a trade.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 13:44 | 1259728 FIAT_FixItAgainTony
FIAT_FixItAgainTony's picture

try telling the "read ALL sides" to a judge in today's banker-owned courts.

banking runs it all, especially the markets, but there are ways to end it.

real wealth is one.  knowledge is another.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 16:43 | 1260489 knowless
knowless's picture

I believe his style is called "concern trolling", attempting to build anxiety in people so as to dissuade them from following their convictions. Concern trolls can often be confused by outside observers (or themself) as attempting to enlighten others, this is a popular trolling technique in discussions involving physical actions, as the concern troll can destabilise his target while seeming rational.

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:27 | 1257957 Ecoman11
Ecoman11's picture

I still have suspicion that Bank of America and ScotiaMocatta have some unfinished "physical loans" business to resolve. It was posted here in 2006

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:25 | 1257963 White.Star.Line
White.Star.Line's picture

The White Star Line does not appreciate all the negative waves crashing on the JPM shores. We would not exist if not for the wonderful humanitarian Sir Morgan,and his sweet bosses the Red Shield Clan.
The world would not exist today without them.
Nothing would exist without their wonderful guiding hand.

Well, peace might exist.
Of course the American Indians would still exist.
The Buffalo would still exist.
The Redwood Trees would still exist.

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:26 | 1257965 Missiondweller
Missiondweller's picture

Well, if they're offsetting their shorts with SLV they must believe its backed by phusical silver.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:58 | 1258122 OldTrooper
OldTrooper's picture

Maybe they got added as an additional insured on an AIG policy - and it's rated AAA...what could go wrong?  Don't worry, we're covered.  We have a contract!

(For the record, I have no idea what this crap is rated nor whether any insurer covers any risk associated with it.)

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:27 | 1257968 AldoHux_IV
AldoHux_IV's picture

Manipulate the market both ways: bang it high and get momentum chasers/HFT's/algo's to come in to drive prices then hammer it during thinly traded globex markets which will create the algos to go the other way thus snow balling an avalanche of sell orders into the latecomers coupled with pricing out the smaller specs along the way so the market can only be moved around with big boys and try to scare the retail crowd with shock and awe into thinking twice about buying and holding silver thereby creating a market you can have for yourself as it is smaller in size and can influence other important commodity markets.

JPM and the other conspirators along with the crimex want to be the market instead of cornering it.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:06 | 1258060 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:58 | 1258160 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Nicely put. Quite a racket they have going isn't it? With the SEC and CFTC in their hip pocket, they can't lose no matter who they clip. 


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 03:33 | 1258284 PhattyBuoy
PhattyBuoy's picture

"thereby creating a market you can have for yourself"

I wonder how much physical ended up in the Morgue's brand new vault in the last 2 weeks ... ?

Sat, 05/14/2011 - 01:46 | 1273842 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

The real stuff? I dunno, but you can bet they are praying it's enough to make it through June...

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:27 | 1257971 Gyro Gearloose
Gyro Gearloose's picture

As always, Tyler picks the perfect description..."amusing".

And of course only "retail" can be evil speculators, never institutional buyers which only do the work of God. 


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:05 | 1258061 Quadlet
Quadlet's picture


Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:36 | 1257976 Blorf
Blorf's picture

Is it so hard to believe that their goal is to steal billions of dollars a few pennies at a time with the arb?  That is basically the entire "banking" industry these days, HFT to front run the general public, arbitraging commodities/stocks into ETFs and coordinating in house trading with analyst propaganda.

Can you run a graph charting percent of SLV shares held by JPM over time?  They would need to keep some percentage to run their arbitrage. 

Stealing billions of dollars through the arbitrage mechanism is reason enough to be mad, why insist that there is a huge permanent short?  (I don't doubt they shorted the crap out of it last week, and are busy covering).  Is it plausible that they perform periodic short selling raids to generate disconnects between the price of SLV and silver and profit accordingly, and then just cover the shorts?

I assume the higher the volatility, the more money they make with the arbitrage.  Any experts in high tech theft here?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:27 | 1258099 Missiondweller
Missiondweller's picture

I don't know why you'd get junked for saying that. Its entirely possible.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 08:17 | 1258266 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Arbs are a tree in the forest, nothing more.

Their goal is to prevent the level of currency depreciation from becoming widely known.  If the amount of currency depreciation is known then the natural rate of inflation can be calculated.  If interest rates rise to even a 0% real rate, then the mythical quadrillion dollar interest & F/X derivatives meltdown becomes becomes an ugly reality, unless the BIS, of all people, can deliver some miracle through notional value offsetting.  The interests on the the other side of a Comex PM position aren't JPM et al., they are the central bankers and their ability to print fiat freely.  There is money to be made on the paper contracts, but unless one is long and standing for delivery, they are, by definition, scalping for their Master's table scraps, and will never be capable of defeating their Masters at the paper game.  Hence- you can't print silver

Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:39 | 1258003 Ecoman11
Ecoman11's picture

The spot price is irrelavent now. Follow the physical demand. posted from!/Silver_Watchdog


Mon, 05/09/2011 - 23:42 | 1258010 White.Star.Line
White.Star.Line's picture

Keep buying the SLV BITCHEZZZZZ, and all other paper promises.

If you can't retrieve it, feel it, see it, and watch it sparkle in the moonlight, it doesn't exist.
And you won't exist either, very soon.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:01 | 1258053 RobotTrader
RobotTrader's picture

It's not really that complicated.

SLV has now become the favorite Lotto Ball to be played on the NYSE at the moment.

All the guys who shorted it late are probably going to get blown out on another spike.

Then the CARTEL will machine gun it back down again.

Basically, what is going to happen is that too many Algo/Igor/Robo players will waste too much time batting that thing back and forth.

And after being stuck in a trading range the rest of the summer, these Speculative Locuts will just get worn out from the volatility and finally leave SLV and find some other casino table to play.

You never know which item is going to be the next hot ticket......

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 01:03 | 1258166 White.Star.Line
White.Star.Line's picture

Wow! What a complicated "non-complicated" answer! Get your head out of the paper/computerized financial technostratosphere, and WAKE UP!

Begging for a seat on the Titanic Lifeboat, BITCHEZZ, without something tangible "IN YOUR HAND", I promise will lead you to an icy bottomless sea.

By the Way
Some of the richest men on this planet did not make the lifeboat assignments in 1912, even while bribing the lifeboat attendants(and "coincidently were extremely against" the proposed legislation that would create the Federal Reserve Central Bank for the United States)

That legislation was passed the following year, after they drowned.

You know, I still think about those tough Irish bastards that broke through the chains barring third class from the upper decks, rose to the top and then went down with the ship.
They fought through those icy waters for hours before they died.
Now THAT was the real FIGHT CLUB.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 02:14 | 1258237 PY-129-20
PY-129-20's picture

Even on the sinking Titanic, Robo would have used his time to do a little shopping for some nice girl he had in mind...

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:13 | 1258075 adonisdemilo
adonisdemilo's picture

@math man

there's contrarianism and there's just plain stupidity

what makes you think you can influence anybody here with your bullshit script

don't you get the feeling you're wasting your time?



Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:04 | 1258386 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

I saw this on Seeking Alpha this morning, and it gave me a good laugh:

"There are a variety of bad movie sequel names still available to the Fed that they can employ for this summer's upcoming QEIII blockbuster thriller. Here are some suggestions:

QEIII: I Want to Fiat!
QEIII: The Hyperinflationary Quickening
QEIII: 2 Fast, 2 Fiat
QEIII: Beyond Fiat
QEIII: I'll Always Know What You Did Last Summer......Bernanke
QEIII: Fiat Territory
QEIII: The Cradle of Fiat
QEIII: The Quest For Monetization
QEIII: Back to Tha Debasement
QEIII: Dark Fiat"

Gee, I wonder what the inevitable QE3 will do to the price of silver?  No QE3 means deflation, tax revenues will plummet, repayment of debt will not be possible - and we know how the banking cartel hates to get stiffed on it's debt.  I'm betting they'll opt for the more debt friendly devaluation and inflation and pray hyperinflation doesn't happen. 


Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:07 | 1258388 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

Oh, and I thought I'd add a few things about silver which make it the best investment over the next couple of years:


1. Total worldwide investment in silver last year was a tiny $5.6 billion. This is less than 2% of the market cap of Apple. Unlike the tech and housing booms which were largely confined to American investors, and were in the tens of TRILLIONS of dollars, silver is known and available to investors and even non-investors worldwide. In 1980, not a single investor in places like China, Russia, Vietnam could even buy an ounce of silver, and many current big players such as India were much poorer then.


2. There currently is a supply deficit of over 300,000,000 ozs per year. Industrial demand was up 20% last year. Investment demand (tiny though it was) was up 40%. Mine supply increased by a tiny 2.5%. Very little mine supply is coming onstream this year. A little more will come onstream over the next 2-3 years, the bulk of it in 5-10 years. Finding a deposit and building a mine are not quite as simple as adding another shift at GM. Government supplies are dwindling, and you can only sell the family silveware once.

Here is a description of the scrap that came onto the market in Jan and Feb of 1980, at the height of the last bubble:

"In January and February alone, an estimated 16,000,000 ounces of silver coins and an additional 6,000,000 ounces of scrap silver had come onto the market. With the price of silver now dropping, some of those small sellers and small investors began complaining to the CFTC about the exchange restrictions..."

22 million ozs in two months works out to 132 Mozs annualized, it doesn't even cover half of the supply deficit we are facing now, and as I said, you can only sell the family silver once, and we are not getting reports from any dealers being innundated with scrap supply this time, in fact the opposite seems to be happening, and most have faced a wave of buyers with this correction.

3. Here is a apt description on the growing industrial uses of silver:

Silver has the highest electrical and thermal conductivity of all metals. Every computer, server, monitor, cell phone and switch must have silver. Lasers, satellites, solar panels, high-tech weaponry (tomahawk cruise missiles contain 500 oz) and robotics, all require silver. Digital technology and telecommunications need silver. There's silver in every TV, washing machine, wall switch and refrigerator. Conductors, switches, contacts and fuses use silver because it does not corrode or cause overheating and fires. Silver is used heavily in photography and in prints. Batteries are now manufactured with silver alloys. Lead-free silver solder is used heavily for joining materials and producing leak-tight joints. Silver is also widely used in silk-screened circuit paths, membrane switches, electrically heated automobile windows, and adhesives.
Silver achieves the most brilliant polish of any metal and has the highest reflectivity of light of all the metals, allowing it to be used in mirrors and in coatings for glass, cellophane or metals. Double layers of silver on glass reflects away 95% of the hot rays of the sun. Silver has a variety of uses in pharmaceuticals as silver kills bacteria. Hospitals use silver coated devices in surgery to eliminate contamination and infection. Skin care products now use colloidal silver as it has been found to be a healing agent and disinfectant. Silver sulfadiazine is the most powerful compound for burn treatment. Catheters impregnated with silver eliminate bacteria. Silver is increasingly being tapped for water purification, silver ions used in pools and spas. To prevent growth of germs and fungus on surfaces silver ions are used in paints and coatings.




Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:28 | 1258404 mrgneiss
mrgneiss's picture

This is why the "5$ to dig it out of the ground argument is such a joke, not to mention the fact there are thousands of companies out there that make huge margins, such as Microsoft and Apple:


There are hundreds of millions spent on exploration, all of which must be recouped by the sale of silver eventually:

It is estimated that out of 1000 properties prospected, for an average cost of $50,000 each, maybe 50 will make it to the advanced exploration stage.

Out of 50 properties that undergo advanced exploration, maybe one or two will make it into production. Average cost of advanced exploration is about $5 million.

The cost to build a mine these days ranges from the very small at about $100 million to the very large at about $3 billion, let's use $500 million.  Don't forget the reclamation bond which these days is at least $100 million.

So, before a single ounce of silver is taken from the ground, we have these expenses which must be covered eventually by the sale of silver:

1000 x $50,000 = $50,000,000 (prospecting)

50 x $5,000,000 = $250,000,000 (advanced exploration)

1 x $500,000,000 = $500,000,000 (mine P & E, infrastructure, reclamation bond)

Total = $800,000,000

So please remind trolls the next time they bring up what is costs to mine an ounce of silver, the variable costs, that there are other fixed and incurred costs that must be covered by the sale of silver as well.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 08:50 | 1258522 dehdhed
dehdhed's picture

post deleted

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:28 | 1258096 BillyTheBlade
BillyTheBlade's picture

only about 22 responses? I would think there would be more.  this seems pretty important/telling to me.  either they believe silver will be more valuable in the future or they want to prop up the paper SLV.... who knows...







go physical!

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:33 | 1258106 BillyTheBlade
BillyTheBlade's picture

that is physical gold, silver, copper and lead, if you know what i mean.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:36 | 1258107 DeltaFunctionToronto
DeltaFunctionToronto's picture

Round and round and round we go, where it stops, (nobody) knows.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:35 | 1258111 frippy
frippy's picture

Maybe the fucksticks at the CFTC can look into it?



Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:36 | 1258113 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

I've been trying to open the SLV prospectus as a PDF, no quick view or HTML option, and all I'm getting is file error.

Probably my machine.  Although as an added bonus I did have a Netflix pop up ad lurking on my desktop...

Can anyone tell me the date of redemption for closure of the fund ?  Does it wind down on a specific date?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:39 | 1258119 adonisdemilo
adonisdemilo's picture

@math man

OK i read it, big deal, just somebody else's opinion

i read many pros and cons

then i make a decision

i read you

my decision,  IGNORE, HE'S A SHILL 

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 05:33 | 1258360 Quintus
Quintus's picture

'Mathman' is just one in a long line of virtually identical cookie-cutter posters who all appear on here purporting to be motivated by nothing more than a Noble and Public-Spirited sense of duty to 'Save the poor innocents here from being taken in and duped by the evil metals shills'.

If I had an ounce of silver for every time one of these characters spouted the 'I'm only trying to help other people' line I'd need a fucking truck to move my metal.  I guess it's the only semi-plausible excuse they can come up with for spending all their time reading and posting about an investment class that they claim no interest in and purportedly believe to be a scam.

For some reason, they assume that they, and only they, are big and smart enough to look at the market honestly and deduce what is going on.  Well guess what Mathman (and all your other personalities/aliases) we're all big boys and girls here.  Thanks for the offer of help, but we'll be fine on our own thanks.

I suggest you focus your attention on something else, maybe something that you actually want to invest in?

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 00:53 | 1258143 suckerfishzilla
suckerfishzilla's picture

I would rather be in the SLA than SLV. 

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 01:06 | 1258168 White.Star.Line
White.Star.Line's picture

Wow! What a complicated "non-complicated" answer! Get your head out of the paper/computerized financial technostratosphere, and WAKE UP!

Begging for a seat on the Titanic Lifeboat, BITCHEZZ, without something tangible "IN YOUR HAND", I promise will lead you to an icy bottomless sea.

By the Way
Some of the richest men on this planet did not make the lifeboat assignments in 1912, even while bribing the lifeboat attendants(and "coincidently were extremely against" the proposed legislation that would create the Federal Reserve Central Bank for the United States)

That legislation was passed the following year, after they drowned.

You know, I still think about those tough Irish bastards that broke through the chains barring third class from the upper decks, rose to the top and then went down with the ship.
They fought through those icy waters for hours before they died.
Now THAT was the real FIGHT CLUB

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 04:30 | 1258320 css1971
css1971's picture

Huh? It looks like JPM are following the famous "Buy high, sell low" trading strategy.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:45 | 1258422 DarAdder
DarAdder's picture

OT: Fellow ZH'ers. BullionVault have run out of buffer stock in their London silver warehouse. The metal is trading way above spot. I just sold my holding for more than $41 per ounce. I will buy back in a few days when BullionVault take delivery of fresh silver and get their bots working again. If you have a BV silver account, take a look.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 06:57 | 1258431 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

I have physical, like many posters on here. I'm not selling, not at $8 a troy ounce, not at $18, not at $38, not at $118. I purchased to ride out the storm.

So, JPM, TPTB, please knock down the price lower. I like $18 at this point to buy, as the premiums at the last fake dip made it not a dip.

Also, please knock gold down to the sub $900 range so I can stock up. I can't buy so much as I like at these prices.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 07:57 | 1258524 r101958
r101958's picture

Perhaps the reason is more along the lines of 'If you can't beat them, join them'. Haven't these guys taken losses over the past year playing the short game? So, take the price down a nice chunk, buy the contracts, and start counting the profits. Instead of losses. The 'correction' 'happened' at the start of the month. This could mean a nice profit in PM's during the month of May for the TBTF's.

Tue, 05/10/2011 - 14:43 | 1259958 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

well, they sure don't have the phys in their crimex vault!  last few times we've had the data up:  zero (0) reg. oz. in the crimex warehouse.

does this include the london branch, in the citi, LBMA, where they trade forwards & give the fixing?  prob. not.

the ETF's were designed for institutional traders to play PM Derby. 

they play freaking hardball.

the wwbanksterz have taken over the globe, at public expense, no less.

almost every single article and piece on zH is about this fact, in one way or another. 

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!