Complete Transcript Of Assange Guardian Livechat (And Possibly His Last Pre-Arrest)

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Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:54 | 776065 Mr Lennon Hendrix
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This brings into question what does it mean to be an Australian citizen - does that mean anything at all? Or are we all to be treated like David Hicks at the first possible opportunity merely so that Australian politicians and diplomats can be invited to the best US embassy cocktail parties.

This is a good question, yet rhetorical.  I will answer it anyway.  Julian is an Australian, and he should definately be allowed to return there. 

No questions about the bank leak release?

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:24 | 776180 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Citizenship = voluntary slavery, damn if it was possible to live without a passport I'd throw away mine in a second

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:53 | 776284 tmosley
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How is citizenship voluntary?  You can't renounce it unless you get citizenship somewhere else.  We are all just slaves (at least in name), free only to change masters (sometimes).

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:38 | 776426 Shylockracy
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If you are already despondent about citizenship, make sure you do NOT read the following book. It may cause severe depression.

Besatzungsrecht im wiedervereinten Deutschland: Abbauprobleme und Restbestände.
Dr. Michael Rensmann

2002, Nomos Verlagsges.MBH + Co. ISBN: 3789078832

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 00:22 | 777561 caconhma
caconhma's picture

Back in 1938, the chief of the Soviet KGB in Europe defected to the USA. His name was Orlov. He was a 3-star KGB general.

FBI found about his defection many years later after he revealed it after Stalin's death. His new name was Borg, and he moved to Cleveland, OH.

KGB was very good assassinating people from ordinary defectors to heads of sates.

Orlov/Borg knew that. So, he wrote a letter to Stalin offering a deal: if my and my family lives are safe, I keep my mouth shut. Stalin accepted the deal.

After Stalin's death, he revealed himself. He even testified in front of the USA Congress but he never revealed any info about Soviet spies in the USA  or in Europe.

He knew the entire KGB spy-net in the USA including all nuclear spies as well as the famous Cambridge 5 in England. But FBI and MI6 never got anything.

He called Stalin a "bloody butcher" but he kept his part of the deal even after Stalin's death.

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 06:52 | 777885 bank guy in Brussels
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The Aussie gov't is under the US thumb, like Canada's.

Wikileaks ambiguities, from the web -

- Board members of Wikileaks from CIA-entities, including ones tied to CIA-Google contracts and funding, and to CIA's front NGO 'National Endowment for Democracy'

- Thrust of Wikileaks revelations supporting US war initiatives against Iran and for military intervention against Pakistan

- Israeli Prime Minister happy about Wikileaks in effect supporting war in Middle East, and Julian Assange praises the Israeli Prime Minister

- Wikileaks has something like € 1 million in bank, € 200,000 annual budget, supposedly from small 'donations' via PayPal, ha! not likely, bigger sweetheart funding likely behind it

- Wikileaks website doesn't reflect million-in-assets organisation, many have done much more with much less

- One of Wikileaks site names registered by Jimmy Wales founder of Wikipedia, notorious CIA-agent disinfo site (proven in Wired news etc.), Wales himself part of CIA-linked CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) major US gov't policy tool for oligarchs & establishment

- Wikileaks has unusual super good access to corporate media, NY Times and UK Guardian, both shills - mouthpieces for US and UK governments and establishment, media with fake 'progressive' image but refusing to carry much anti-gov't reporting, however nice open door for Wikileaks

- One of Julian Assange's lawyers is also lawyer for US Associated Press, giant US-gov't linked corporate media agency, owned by major US media owned by ruling US oligarch families

- Julian Assange hostile to other progressive revelations, Assange hostile to questioning about US 11 Sept for example

- Julian Assange childhood troubled, under tutelage of parental figures involved with CIA-mind-control-experiment-type application of severely mind-altering drugs upon children

- Assange has previously used internet code name 'Mendax', ancient Latin word for 'liar'

- Weird situation with Assange and Swedish girls, one of them previously published web treatise on how to get revenge on ex-boyfriend re false accusations, one of them has departed for Israel

- The best lies are those that mix some truth with the lies, and the US gov't, has little problem with a further expansion of the well-known fact it is a torturing, murdering, killing-of-innocents regime. A few more Iraq and Afghanistan war atrocities exposed, are a small price to pay for a world-class media manipulation project to help sponsor more upcoming wars, and which will enable US to achieve greater dominance over internet content.

Just sayin'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brGAgrxscOg

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 09:10 | 777923 Tense INDIAN
Tense INDIAN's picture

exellant... the leaks are about torture , crime , killing of innocents....whats new there...the uS govt is aware that the people already know of these going ons......what r the people going to do anyway.....but suppose if u just plant a few more leaks like "dirty bombs found in Libya leads to Pakistan"....or something similar....their job is done ...people will believe it to be true work of a HERO.....i cant believe so many ZHers are prasing this guy.....

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 12:05 | 778044 CD
CD's picture

"- One of Wikileaks site names registered by Jimmy Wales founder of Wikipedia, notorious CIA-agent disinfo site (proven in Wired news etc.), Wales himself part of CIA-linked CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) major US gov't policy tool for oligarchs & establishment"

 

cryptome.org founder John Young leaked the (alleged) emails around the foundation of WL, and some of them discuss this very issue - check out the site. If you Google GeorgieBC, he's got a pretty good summary/Cliffnotes version.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:53 | 776066 slaughterer
slaughterer's picture

Tyler, you do wear a thick condom, I hope.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:54 | 776070 kaiten
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"Since 2007 we have been deliberately placing some of our servers in jurisdictions that we suspected suffered a free speech deficit inorder to separate rhetoric from reality. Amazon was one of these cases."

 

Ouch!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:55 | 776071 tony bonn
tony bonn's picture

go julian go!!

"It is correct that Mr. Flanagan and the others seriously making these statements should be charged with incitement to commit murder."

this is the complete hypocrisy of the fascist american state....if you uttered the word sqirt pistol at an airport you would be shot dead where you stood without a trial just as happened at the miami airport during caligula's reign a few years ago....but a senior government official can call for assassination of an individual by the usa and get away scot free...

this is perfect proof that security has nothing to do with safety but with power and subjugation

fuck the tsa, candians, and americans...they are lying hypocrites...

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:07 | 776116 digitaldorobo
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"fuck the tsa, candians, and americans"

 

How about specifying which Canadians and Americans? There are many Canadians, myself one, and many Americans who support what he is doing.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:15 | 776149 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

A valid point. However the actual number is so low that it is in no way a stretch to say "fuck Americans" on the specific issue of opposing fascist elements in government and industry. This is a battle we are losing and badly.

Americans really are too busy getting rich or staying rich to do much to rock the boat. And so we slide into the abyss where awaits the moral undertow. So sure, fuck Americans. We're self-involved losers.

I won't say "fuck Canadians" because I'm not Canadian. Hey some Canadian: Little help here?

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:47 | 776255 WaterWings
Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:31 | 776381 revenue_anticip...
revenue_anticipation_believer's picture

Lets pretend, imagine, for the moment this scenario:

Inverse 'rendition': Assange is an 'asset' to be protected from the mob, simply by placing him police protection for the moment

Assange and zerohedge BOTH can be considered 'assets', and therefore protected and funded as needed (along with other 'special operations'

BOTH Assange/ZH were enabled/activated/protected as part of the 'management of information/propaganda' mostly in relation to the financial TOTAL COLLAPSE that did NOT...indeed  occur....sucessfully averted/diverted from mass-critical...

It is near CERTAIN that Assange/ZH do NOT know that they were selected/to perform 'management actitities...employed, but yet subject to be 'fired' at anytime = 'cutout-nullified/discredited'

the pseudo 'controller-agent' probably is something like the CFR....no way mere 'hired hands' could regulate/control, sucessfully, while unbeknown/unconscious to Assange/ZH while,yet,these "assets"BOTH pre-existed, not necessarily as 'sleepers' but simply were 'selected'/utilized/hired to perform the perceived necessary functions, that they would do anyway, self motivated...but nearly as well, and not nearly as policy-perfected...'good employees for the job'  

indications: 'protected', continuity-like with evolving business-like improvements, influential/yetinfluential beyond their basic internal structures...IE outsiders have been draftedto ensure/assist sucess...to provide extraordinary access to inside information, to be provided/from time to time...extraordinary, professional commentary mixed with intentional 'noise-commentary'....fundamentally well within conventional ways and means..'revert to the mean policy-steered'

...just a thought experiment..

 

 

 

 

 

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:38 | 776431 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Fair enough.

Hmm ...

Having thought about it, I don't think so. Too complicated and too many untested/untestable assumptions.

But thank you for bring that to my attention.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:53 | 776497 WaterWings
Fri, 12/03/2010 - 22:27 | 777371 romberry
romberry's picture

One problem. Wikileaks isn't doing the redations. The newspapers/media they released these documents to are doing the redactions, and the redactions are a specific effort to protect innocent people from potential harm. Anyway, take it up with Der Spiegel, The Guardian and others.

BTW, as valuable as Cryptome has been and is, some of the criticism from that corner is beginning to strike me as something akin to jealousy. Do the people at Cryptome resent the high profile status of Wikilleaks and the fact that they have not been able to achieve similar levels of recognition even though they have been at it much longer? I don't know the answer to that, but I do know that much of the criticism from that direction in recent weeks does not seem to me well founded.

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 03:52 | 777825 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

Uh, where did you read the cables cuz I read 'em from their very organized site; directly. Yeah. Redacted. WTF? I didn't read what the papers pushed - I read it live.

Redacted.

 

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 16:22 | 778377 romberry
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The cables you read directly on Wikileaks are the redacted versions that have been published by their media partners.

 

WikiLeaks has not published "250,000 classified documents."  They've only published 612, and the only documents from the leak of diplomatic cables published on the WikiLeaks site thus far have all been ones published by its newspaper partners such as The New York Times, The Guardian, Der Spiegel, etc., including with the same redactions.   - Source: http://is.gd/iaqUB

 

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 17:25 | 776651 Jasper M
Jasper M's picture

Not Enough 'scare quotes'!!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 19:25 | 777067 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

The new "needs more cowbell"

Sat, 12/04/2010 - 01:24 | 777648 DaveyJones
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funny

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:40 | 776442 Bolweevil
Bolweevil's picture

Fu&k the 'Leafs!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:25 | 776392 RowdyRoddyPiper
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Flanagan is a idiot. I had the misfortune to take a intro Poli Sci class of his back in the 80s at the glorified high school called the University of Calgary. Like lots of tenured folk, he believes he alone among the masses has wisdom that makes him wise.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:23 | 776175 Village Idiot
Village Idiot's picture

"How about specifying which Canadians and Americans? There are many Canadians, myself one, and many Americans who support what he is doing."

 

Yes, and there are Jews who are supporting him as well.  The "clarification" thing doesn't work so well around here - I've tried.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 18:07 | 776820 Bring the Gold
Bring the Gold's picture

I know. I get so enraged by idiots who think that if an organization of Arab Terrorists blow something up, therefore all Arabs are evil. You can extrapolate this to Jews, Americans, Chinese and so forth and so on.

This myopia allows the real threat, leadership amongst these groups, to be protected by layers upon layers of people who identify as one of the groups now wholly demonized. Been working like a charm since Babylon.

Be specific about who you dislike or else STFU because you are merely propping up the powers that be or the powers that WANT to be. Freedom starts with the individual recognizing that everyone is an individual who is part of various groups. It's rare to find a group anywhere whose membership is evil through and through. It happens, but most of the time ordinary people who don't know what the fuck is going on are lumped in with Saddam or Ariel Sharon or Bush or Obama or the Queen of England.

No more collateral damage. "Leaders" are and always have been the problem.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 18:06 | 776819 Eureka Springs
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+++

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 21:36 | 777284 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

As he stated, for them to be after him so bad it shows that whatever he's doing and what he has is earth shattering and can change.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:55 | 776072 jus_lite_reading
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I wish I would have known! I would have asked about BAC!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:55 | 776078 moofph
moofph's picture

...bravo! mr. durden...and we are all suspects at this point in time...here's a toast to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:01 | 776084 spekulatn
spekulatn's picture

 

Isopod
Julian, why do you think it was necessary to "give Wikileaks a face"? Don't you think it would be better if the organization was anonymous?
This whole debate has become very personal and reduced on you - "Julian Assange leaked documents", "Julian Assange is a terrorist", "Julian Assange alledgedly raped a woman", "Julian Assange should be assassinated", "Live Q&A qith Julian Assange" etc. Nobody talks about Wikileaks as an organization anymore. Many people don't even realize that there are other people behind Wikileaks, too.
And this, in my opinion, makes Wikileaks vulnerable because this enables your opponents to argue ad hominem. If they convince the public that you're an evil, woman-raping terrorist, then Wikileaks' credibility will be gone. Also, with due respect for all that you've done, I think it's unfair to all the other brave, hard working people behind Wikileaks, that you get so much credit.


 

 

Julian Assange:
This is an interesting question. I originally tried hard for the organisation to have no face, because I wanted egos to play no part in our activities. This followed the tradition of the French anonymous pure mathematians, who wrote under the collective allonym, "The Bourbaki".
However this quickly led to tremendous distracting curiosity about who and random individuals claiming to represent us. In the end, someone must be responsible to the public and only a leadership that is willing to be publicly courageous can genuinely suggest that sources take risks for the greater good. In that process, I have become the lightening rod. I get undue attacks on every aspect of my life, but then I also get undue credit as some kind of balancing force.

 

 

 It was a great question and Assange's answer shines a bright light on his psyche. Hopefully wikileaks survives the ego of its leader.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:03 | 776103 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Agreed. People here who claim he is vain and WikiLeaks is an ego trip sound like jealous fucktards.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:26 | 776190 SignsAndWonders
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Umm, you mean people like Zero Hedge?

We at Zero Hedge have watched with interest (and some horror) the Wikievents of the last several weeks. Of particular notice to us recently has been the complete inability (or unwillingness) of Wikileaks to release any new material not related to the self-promotion of its ubiquitous figurehead "Julian Assange." Despite a massive budget, it would seem more than an order of magnitude larger than ours, the Wikileaks enterprise seems totally unable to do more than tweet pleas for patience while sending Mr. Assange to, e.g., Brussels to debate freedom of expression. Where are the millions of documents leakers risked to liberate? This is quite sad for us to see, as we were some of the earliest and most enthusiastic supporters of Wikileaks, as individuals as well as under the umbrella of "Zero Hedge."

http://cryptome.org/0001/wikileaks-zero.htm

 

 

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:41 | 776231 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

There are many Tylers. I don't agree with the tone and sometimes the content of a good part of what they post. But they are entitled to their opinions one must suppose.

WikiLeaks is a moving target, in both senses of the word moving.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:11 | 776340 CrockettAlmanac.com
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Where are the millions of documents leakers risked to liberate?

If you read the transcript above you'd know that individual cables are reviewed to ensure that individual's names may be redacted if releasing the name would put the person in danger.

Please tell me how Wikileaks can redact information which is potentially dangerous to individuals if they do a document dump?

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 20:11 | 777158 Bring the Gold
Bring the Gold's picture

http://coto2.wordpress.com/2010/12/01/former-wikileaks-activists-to-launch-new-whistleblowing-site/


“I am the heart and soul of this organization, its founder, philosopher, original coder, organizer, financier and all the rest. If you have a problem with me, piss off,” Assange famously wrote to one internal critic.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 22:19 | 777359 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

All government is cospiracy and all governed are conspired against. My guess is Julian's transgressions are planned and his forgiveness pre-ordained.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:22 | 776173 YHWH
YHWH's picture

He could have easily picked psuedonyms from popular movies and used that.  It's been known to work elsewhere.

I suggest Wikileaks pick names out of "Resevoir Dogs".  Cool movie.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:04 | 776318 MurderNeverWasLove
MurderNeverWasLove's picture

"Hey!  Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?"

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:03 | 776089 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

"Courage is contagious."  

So is truth.

People need to rip their fascist overlords of oppression from their places of high worship, unmask the incorporation of violence, evil, and war profiteering at the expense of the public -- one and the same Congress.

Assange is a threat because he's right and armed with truth.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:05 | 776110 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Being right and armed with truth won't get you very far in a world where the MSM are part of the fascist control grid.

What makes Julian and WikiLeaks a threat is the Internet.

It is why you are at ZH. Always keep that in mind. Always.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:46 | 776131 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

Do you work for 2600 or something?

I agree, the Internet has no master, and somehow manages to leverage information with freedom.   It can hurt when its pointed at ya though!

 

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 17:25 | 776653 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

I predate 2600. But we would recognize each other in a dark alley.

Welcome to our world.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 15:14 | 776147 spekulatn
spekulatn's picture

It is why you are at ZH. Always keep that in mind. Always.

 

Wow.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:28 | 776403 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

What makes Julian and WikiLeaks a threat is the Internet.

Very much so. I would go as far as to say that this case is not about Wikileaks, but about the conflict between governments and the Internet, governments will not win this fight unless they succeed in seriously altering the way information is disseminated through the web, which I don't see hapenning given its highly decentralized structure. However, that will not stop them from trying.

What's interesting: Wiki, relying mostly on the help of volunteers and anonymous sources regularly releases some very sensitive material on the government, while the only thing government with their multi-billion budgets and a huge security apparatus has succeeded so far are some sex crimes allegations and taking down WL website, which was predictably reinstated. It is an assymetric information warfare, much like a regular army vs guerillas.

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 16:44 | 776467 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

And the Internet was originally a DARPA project. I just love irony, don't you?

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 23:36 | 777493 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

You would think that TPTB would ask the designers of Arpanet if the intrawebz can be taken down -- we both know that:

No, it cannot and

even if it could, eCommerce is more important that saving the Govt's face!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:59 | 776090 The Third Man
The Third Man's picture

Viva le Assange!!

Fri, 12/03/2010 - 14:59 | 776092 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

Wow. I like him more now. Still skeptical...

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