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Cornyn On The White House Stasi Solicitation, Or Would McCarthy Love flag@whitehouse.gov? (Hint: Yes)
Senator Cornyn foolishly thinks McCarthyism has no place in 2009. And here we were, happy recipients of the first one million flagged complaints in less than 24 hours...
Zero Hedge makes it easy for all law and constitution abiding citizens to rat on anyone and anything they think may be fishy by clicking here and notifying your favorite White House 1984 inspector. And please, 89.2% $50MM+ trading days in a quarter does not qualify as "fishy", merely statistically impossible.
h/t Grotjan
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Awesome gfi!!!
All this from a Texas senator...BFD. I've had enough of Texas politicians. Gee, too bad Dubyuh couldn't have run for another term. Then there would be no information on GS or anything else. Doesn't anyone see the logic here?
So asking people to report on their neighbors is OK? I am not sure I understand your message, Adolph.
now THAT is funny
+1
Howard_Beale, forgive me please, i must have missed something here, but, could you please say what logic everyone is missing?
The irony of your avatar is clearly lost on you. Have you even seen the movie Network?
Let me quote you a narrative: "But, man, you're never going to get any truth from us. We'll tell you anything you want to hear; we lie like hell. We'll tell you that, uh, Kojak always gets the killer, or that nobody ever gets cancer at Archie Bunker's house, and no matter how much trouble the hero is in, don't worry, just look at your watch; at the end of the hour he's going to win. We'll tell you any shit you want to hear. We deal in *illusions*, man! None of it is true! But you people sit there, day after day, night after night, all ages, colors, creeds... We're all you know. You're beginning to believe the illusions we're spinning here. You're beginning to think that the tube is reality, and that your own lives are unreal. You do whatever the tube tells you! You dress like the tube, you eat like the tube, you raise your children like the tube, you even *think* like the tube! This is mass madness, you maniacs! In God's name, you people are the real thing! *WE* are the illusion! So turn off your television sets. Turn them off now. Turn them off right now. Turn them off and leave them off! Turn them off right in the middle of the sentence I'm speaking to you now! TURN THEM OFF..."
The logic here is slight of hand, but you have to understand that the system is larger than a mere President. If you had a printing press, wouldn't you hand pick desirable candidates that have been groomed in the CFR from both parties with loyalty to you and the principles you taught - you could fund their campaign and they could be forever indebted to you and promote legislation you want. You can be mad as hell, but you should understand the source of the frustration.
From the movie, "You are an old man who thinks in terms of nations and peoples. There are no nations. There are no peoples. There are no Russians. There are no Arabs. There are no third worlds. There is no West. There is only one holistic system of systems, one vast and immane, interwoven, interacting, multivariate, multinational dominion of dollars. Petro-dollars, electro-dollars, multi-dollars, reichmarks, rins, rubles, pounds, and shekels. It is the international system of currency which determines the totality of life on this planet. That is the natural order of things today. That is the atomic and subatomic and galactic structure of things today!
Scary.
amen apocalypse now.
This government Marxist- stalinist tactic is well within our history. Remember, the US fought, financed and died for Stalins marxism. this is our history. Read your hitory books. 600k american soldiers died fighting for stalins marxism. No way around this. Hence, this is a logical extension of our historical policies. Next up? death camps for anti-communists, anti-obamaites, anti wall street sheisters.
oh so true. roosevelt himself was a communist and probably a mole for the soviet government as were many of the people in his administration.
Relax people - if found guilty you will just be required to attend special classes at the Ministry of Love (and Hope).
Can you say rat hat?
"(Hint: Yes)". More thought control please.
I tried to donate but there is something wrong. I can't really say what it is...please check into it. If it is my error, I apologize.
MCCARTHY WAS RIGHT!!!!!
WE NEED TO STOP LETTING HIS NAME GET BESMIRCHED.
AS JFK SAID, MCCARTHY WAS A FUCKING HERO.
damn it.
actually he was right. but his work (as usual) was sabotaged from within his own staff, by the same people who he was trying to stop in our own government. if the truth was fully known, he probably should be a hero with a statue in washington dc somewhere on the mall. but what we are told is that he was just some drunk with some silly ideas, etc and of course the communist always whine about freedom of speech, until they don't need anymore, which is what they are doing now and have been doing for a long time.
Maybe this is the first (goose) step toward the "citizen police" (aka brownshirts) he mentioned during his campaign (takeover).
Where were these tea bagger idiots for the past 8 years? All of a sudden their trailers are gassed up and riding the country state to state.
RNC can go to hell!
Riding the country? I hate to break it to you, Pal, but we're everywhere. We're in the car behind you on the freeway, across the street and in the market with you. We are the resistance. As for your comment about the last 8 years, are you really that clueless? Most of us couldn't stand Bush either. Better wake up buddy. BHO isn't just going to take what's left of our America. He's taking yours, too.
And many of us cherish and practice the 2nd Amendment. Don't let the suit and tie fool you...
I love flag@whitehouse; just forwarded there all of those resumes I received at work that are gunning for my position, this is FUN. It's fun unless you start thinking about it. And then it hits you, what have we done wrong? Were all of those ideas of our rights and freedoms just in our heads to begin with?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYjj-qzUWWA
This is the ladies room at Whitehouse.gov
Dick Armey is the one running this Freedomworks campaign that's trying to recruit an army of Glen Beck sycophants and Sean Hannity fans and get them out there at these town hall meetings to stir up a ruckus. The same Dick Armey who, as a lobbyist, is currently on the payroll of the big insurance companies that are really the ones fighting to the death against any real health care reform. Then you have Rick Scott, who as chairman of one of the biggest hospital chains in the country, was once fined 1.7 BILLION for defrauding medicare (now THAT'S a proud American for you), also bankrolling this whole "grassroots" movement to stop any reform.
And they truly are spreading misinformation. Because the insurance companies will lose out big time if this bill goes through in its present form. Anyone who argues against universal health care reform is a foolish stooge who has been duped into fighting for their master's profits. Is isn't about fighting against socialism or big Government or Big Brother or "real" American virtues; it's about fighting to make sure these insurance companies can continue making BILLIONS upon BILLIONS of dollars every year by fucking the average American right in the ass when they need help the most. And what these unimaginably conscienceless scumbags are doing is riling up very stupid people to go out there and fight for them to retain the right to continue fucking those very same stupid people right in the ass. It's comedy, is what it is. Tragic comedy.
It was a stupid idea, this flagging bullshit (I think the link has been taken off line.) But the misinformation that's being put out there by these insurance company shills is just boundless in its magnitude. And I guess they felt they had to try and do something to combat it.
For any of you to argue against this healthcare bill would be like you arguing for GS to make a dollar off of every share of every stock you buy or sell. Don't you get it? These guys, these insurance company fuck-tards, make the crooks running Wall St. look like 7-11 stickup artists. Like rank amateurs when it comes to thievery. And all these sad, poor, dumb fucks out there ranting and raving against "socialized medicine" and "Barack Hussein Obama" are gonna feel real stupid if they succeed in shouting this down when they get cancer or MS or whatever and their carrier cancels their policy on some small print technicality. Because that's what they do. They do everything in their legal powers to keep from having to pay what you pay them to pay for. So go out there and fight against socialized medicine if you want. Just don't get sick, is all.
Vicelord: I have fantastic healthcare. Why shouldn't I defend it?
You only think that because you are healthy. According to insurance exec. testimony, you have a 50% chance of getting kicked out of your policy retroactively if you have a serious medical condition. Here's the math:
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/08/government-taken-in-dealings-with...
duoh.. posted the wrong link
http://tauntermedia.com/2009/07/28/unconscionable-math/
sorry.
You're right. So what? 50% odds are still better than what BHO has in mind.
STFU..How can we accept something our government won't use???? Yeah, the insurance companies are awful, but this is a wake up call for them too!
I do understand you thoughts on this subject... likely better than most because I am a health care professional and see the ramifications of the uninsured everyday... but I also own a medium size business and I do understand the ramifications from that side also. From my perspective Obama has spent to much time trying to please everyone... and now he has nothing that pleases anybody... he missed the window to show strong leadership so the informal leaders such as the insurance companies gained the upper hand.
You can send me in to flag@whitehouse.gov for spreading more disinformation :-)
Anyone who argues against universal health care reform is a foolish stooge who has been duped into fighting for their master's profits.
Right. There isn't any principled resistance to universal health care from people concerned about, oh, say, the tenth amendment.
There are plenty of ways to deal with the multinationals. News flash: centralized government power ain't one of them. Case in point: Goldman Sachs.
Cheers,
prat
Principled perhaps, but deeply misinformed. Medicare hasn't even been challenged on constitutional grounds. Then there's that whole "General Welfare" part of the preamble. Finally, the insurance industry stooges are also opposed to states having the option to run their own public healthcare system, which even the teabaggers can't oppose on dim "constitutional" grounds.
preambles are not law, too vague to be enforcible or accurately interpreted, could be construed to mean anything or nothing, and therefore of no legal import unless read with reference to enumerated powers
merely hortatory
Its just a piced of paper!
There are so many things you do not understand, but I'll list two. One, any political involvement in the "tea parties" was secondary to an ever-increasing anger on the part of Americans to decreasing freedom. Two, healthcare is not a right. If you think it is, then answer this: to be delivered by whom?? You are advocating the slavery of doctors, sir. Slavery. Figure it out.
Oh, get a grip! Does the very name "Cheney" give you seizures? Disconnect all your synapses? Don't you understand that BOTH parties, for the last 100 years, have been busily peddling the same damn dogfood, in differing packages?
There is not a "healthcare" problem per se in America. There *is* a problem with how it is paid for. Health "insurance" is nothing more than a prepaid medical expense plan. "Insurance" as it is ordinarily understood is supposed to provide protection against calamity, not to pay for the medical equivalent of oil changes and tune ups.
Why does it cost so much to get health care? Simply put, because the system in place now is *almost* as backwards as it can be, if the object is to deliver quality health care efficiently and at the lowest possible cost. Shopping for a car? You may very well buy a Ford, even though you like the Lexus better. When's the last time you shopped for anything to do with health care? Or asked the price before you took delivery on the services you wanted or needed?
Our current system is already almost 50% paid for by government at one level or another. The scheduled rates that Medicaid and Medicare pay to providers are so far below what the private insurance companies pay it is criminal, and the "discounts" that Blue Cross et al get of of the "billed" charges from providers are pretty eye-popping to begin with.
Try negotiating a cash on the barrel head price next time at the doctor's office. Start by asking the proprietor of the establishment - the doc himself - "How much?" Try not to be alarmed when he does not know. He'll direct you to his "business manager". This person will explain to you that you needn't worry about that, they'll just turn it in to your insurance carrier. Once you explain that you do not intend to turn in a claim, but wish to pay here and now, you will need to wait for a spell, while (probably) she makes the short but uncomfortable journey from stunned, to suspicious. Congratulations - you are now a trouble-maker, for you have had the temerity to insist on paying in cash for goods and services you procured on the premises, for your own use and benefit. Once in a while, you'll find someone that actually gets it, and that understands the time value of money. You'll pay somewhere between the Medicare and Insurance Company rate, depending on how good you are at haggling, and how many re-re-re-filed claims there are in play between that office and the insurance carriers. Cash today is way better than cash in 60 to 120 days. Somebody offer her (or him) a bond trading job. They already have the correct instincts...!
There are plenty of doctors that have already kicked over the traces and left "the system". They operate on a strictly cash basis - no Medicare, no Medicaid, no insurance. The schedule of fees is prominently posted in the waiting room. Instead of 6 or 8 filing clerks wearing fake scrubs and playing nurse, the doc will have one real nurse, and a part time bookkeeper. Low overhead, low cost, just see the doc, and pay him. How quaint.
There is one sentence in your screed that tells the whole story. "They do everything in their legal powers to keep from having to pay what you pay them to pay for." ... You PAY the insurance company to PAY YOUR BILL FOR YOU ... why? Why not pay for it yourself? Are we Americans AFRAID to pay the doctor directly? Is it against our religion?
My solution is far too simple to even be considered. Simply make "health insurance" as it is currently sold, illegal. Hospitalization insurance? Sure. Cancer insurance? No problem. Accident insurance? You can get it now. The only reason that being "uninsured" has gotten to be such a scary notion for many Americans is because the whole system has been corrupted - the is no free, transparent market for any of those goods and services, so there are no market prices. Is there a model for such a marketplace? Sure. Orthodontia is an excellent example. There is no insurance for it as far as I can tell. You can charge it, you can pay cash. If you pay up front, you get a nice discount. And you pay for the outcome, not the procedure.
I'll stop now. It is hard to write coherently in a tiny box, and I've gone on too long as it is. Call it what you will - single payer/socialized/all-your-doctors-are-belong-to-us medicine... it is worse than a horrible idea. The Federal Government's track record in providing health care is already abysmal (Veteran's Hospitals, anyone?), and when it comes to "taking over" and "saving money", the batting average is pretty much zero point zero.
Somebody please turn me in. I just KNOW the White House will be chilled to learn there is an irate peckerwood loose somewhere in Appalachia, spreadin yet more lies and disinformation. So turn me in. Twice.
I'll turn you in, because I want you in the same camp with me :) You are great! Thank you for writing all of that.
DONE
oh and ill take you as my consigliere once we end up in a camp
I have never seen this said so well. It's funny to see someone argue for capitalism in the united states. If anyone has went to a doctor in foreign third world countries they would know you couldn't be more right. It is just as you say but at a fraction of the cost of the united states. Another example why the u.s. will be left behind.
Cheney? When in the hell are you losers going to move on?
mark it bona fide
This is so dead on. We have had a high deductible or HSA plan for a number of years and this has been our experience time and again. The dumb stares when you ask how much a procedure costs is priceless. The three day response when you ask for a cash discount. The number of places that aren't prepared to receive cash, etc. At first it's frustrating then the haggling becomes fun.
I'll also add that if you look at elective surgeries (not BHO's elective surgeries like that hip replacement or painpill scenario he laid out) like cosmetic surgery the prices are all discussed up front and agreed to and the prices continue to drop over time because the consumer pays for it directly and their is price competition.
Great post #26957.
Well said. Cash for services... who would have thought?
Cut the middleman out!
Your appointment might even last more than 12 minutes.
Is health care “reform” life support for managed care?
“There is not a "healthcare" problem per se in America. There is a problem with how it is paid for. Health "insurance" is nothing more than a prepaid medical expense plan. "Insurance" as it is ordinarily understood is supposed to provide protection against calamity, not to pay for the medical equivalent of oil changes and tune ups. … My solution is far too simple to even be considered. Simply make "health insurance" as it is currently sold, illegal.” (Anonymous)
Healthcare “reform” is not about medicine, it is about money.
Background: a managed care enterprise.
Employer based health care: Employer based health care means a boss or union collects money in advance to pay for a worker’s medical care later on. The “bank” is an insurance company like Blue Cross or Kaiser. The money belongs to an employer like GM or a union like SEIU.
The less money spent on medical care, the more the employer or union keeps.
Economics 101 – increase revenue, decrease expenses: It is advantageous for employers and unions to promise first-dollar coverage for inexpensive services like vaccines and well-baby check-ups. Health care premiums increase.
It is also advantageous to transfer the cost of catastrophic medical care to someone else. After sick or old workers quit, employers and unions can keep their health “insurance” premiums and use this money to pay for the medical care needed by the next crop of healthy workers.
Taxpayers pick up the tab for many disabled and old workers by financing Medicare and Medicaid, both of which are massively underfunded. These health plans stay afloat by coercing physicians to accept payments that are below the cost of doing business with extortionary threats of $12,000/incident fines and jail time if caught “over-charging” for a $100 office visit.
He who pays the piper calls the tune: In managed care, physicians often work for the Payers (employers, unions or the government) instead of patients. Payers hire managed care companies such as HMOs and PPOs to keep physicians in line. A managed care enterprise is in the catbird seat; the tail wags the dog.
HMOs: Some employers, unions and governments pay HMO physicians a fixed monthly stipend to “provide” care. Any money not spent on patients goes to physician bonuses, executive salaries and other perks. HMO physicians have financial incentives to both give medical care and to withhold “unnecessary” care. This is called “distributive justice” or a “complete lives system.” As Dr. Emanuel notes, it “considers prognosis, since its aim is to achieve complete lives. … When implemented, the complete lives system produces a priority curve on which individuals aged between roughly 15 and 40 years get the most chance, whereas the youngest and oldest people get chances that are attenuated.”
PPOs: Some employers, unions and governments rent physicians from PPOs, paying the PPO a stipend, a percentage of billed charges, or a percentage of the “discount” on billed charges. Think of PPOs as temporary agencies that have physicians for hire. The less medical care a PPO physician gives, the more the PPO earns - and the more money the Payer keeps in its bank. See: http://www.principal.com/partners/providers/ppomap.htm
Some HMO physicians rent other physicians from PPOs. For instance, Kaiser-Permanente rents around 400,000 physicians from PHCS/Multiplan, Inc., a portfolio company of The Carlyle Group that “covers” 40 million Americans.
Managed care middlemen include medical associations like AMA: Some medical association insiders run PPOs. See www.cfmcnet.org. The American Medical Association (AMA) sells software that is at the heart of managed care. The AMA also mines data. Electronic transmission of confidential medical records makes data mining simple – and lucrative.
Civil war now rages between physicians who manage health care and physicians who give medical care.
Managed care is underfunded: Some employers and unions that promise to pay for health care have not put enough cash aside for a rainy day. GM and UAW were tips of an iceberg. SEIU National Industry Pension Plan, a plan for rank-and-file SEIU members covering 100,787 workers, was 74.9% funded in 2006 - $19,025/union member. (http://atr.org/seiu-crashes-private-efca-event-meanwhile-a3609#) Other examples abound.
Health Care for America Now (HCAN), whose members include the SEIU, ACORN, the AFL-CIO, the National Education Association and the National Council of La Raza, is actively lobbying to help its members get out from under their crushing debts by “reforming” health care.
Medicare and Medicaid are underfunded: Medical care is already almost 50% paid for by government at one level or another. Medicare alone is underfunded by more than a trillion dollars. Obligating governments - and taxpayers - further without fundamentally changing health insurance is a recipe for disaster.
Obamacare, advertised as health care reform, will not work because:
• It separates physicians from patients.
• It puts managed care on life support rather than creating the fundamental changes needed.
• It rewards a vast army who profit by denying that medical care recommended by a patient’s personal physician is necessary. By legislative fiat, “generally” accepted “standards” like the Interqual Criteria will be used to force physicians to ration medical care even more. Middlemen have lobbied hard for this lard.
• It destroys the medical practices of independent physicians and tramples on their constitutional rights. Physicians will continue to be compelled to work as indentured servants of a managed care enterprise.
• There will be a Big Brother. Electronic health records are a license to snoop, and data mining will become even bigger business.
• The American Medical Association’s (AMA) will continue to earn hundreds of millions of dollars from CPT and ICD-9 codes, arcane sets of payment rules at the heart of managed care. AMA’s mouth is stuffed with gold.
• It lets unions and employers that have promised health care that they cannot deliver to shift unfunded obligations to taxpayers.
• It costs too much. Congress promises health care but fails to rehabilitate health insurance.
Support Real Solutions:
Slow down. There is no “crisis.” America does not want socialized medicine no matter what it is called.
Show us the money. Do not underfund and overspend. Unions, employers and politicians promise health care but still have not come up with a way to put enough money in the bank to pay for it.
Clean house: demand that Congress enforce the Pension Preservation Act.
Diet: do not ask our children and grandchildren to pay for broken promises of first-dollar managed care health plans.
Enforce laws that outlaw fee-splitting with physicians – taking a cut of the action for pushing paper. Shut down the PPO market that escalates costs and siphons as much as 10% of the health care dollar away from giving medical care into managing paper.
Enforce anti-trust laws against both health insurance companies and managed care physician groups. Of course prices sky-rocket when more than half of a market can negotiate collectively.
Get physicians out of the bureaucrat’s bed. Eliminate the American Medical Association’s control over the CPT codes. Hold physicians who run HMOs and PPOs accountable for their actions under current tort laws.
Put a stop to middlemen prying into the secret lives of the sick – electronically. Revise HIPAA to close this gigantic privacy loophole.
Promote the Hippocratic Oath that requires a physician to care for the sick and to keep every patient’s confidence. Physicians will first, do no harm. In return, society must respect those who carry this special burden of knowledge and trust.
The government can only take from one group and give to another. We can no longer get foreigners to pay for it or claim that our children or their children will pay for current spending - we will pay for the spend through tax receipts. Why might we have reservations?
This reminds me of Logan's Run, the book's fictional society is governed by a computer that kills everyone at 21 to guard against overpopulation. Runners flee death at a tender age, and a political resistance aids runners and is busy co-opting the computer, so one day a new system will be born.
Why would you trust Obama with this after taking our tax dollars and giving them to the bankers? Do you want everything to be centrally controlled like Autos, Finance, and Media because then we would be a dictatorship and less capitalistic than China. Money and media are completely controlled, property rights have been taken under the guise of eminent domain, the last frontier is your body & privacy rights- should the government own those too?
What do we even know about him, he magically came on the scene a few years ago? He won't release many of his normal records, and is being protected from critical questions by a media that resorts to ad hominem attacks in an attempt to silence any valid inquiries. The media and Obama have the same sponsors, the media hero worship was designed to ensure he had the full support of the populace for bringing in the sponsors game plan. Despite the unprecedented media propaganda/worship, his poll ratings are falling and are lower than Jimmy Carters at this stage (amazing). The banker bailout was strike one, jamming this down the throat of America is clearly a second strike.
The powerful interests behind Obama chose and funded him, he has more than repaid the banks in bailouts, backstops, and is attempting to have them self regulate (Fed). The second largest campaign contributor was health care companies, what is the real plan here if I can be pragmatically cynical. Congress gets an epic fail approval rating at 33%, one of the lowest, perhaps because they are not reading the bills before voting. I have met business people that I trusted and liked, but I can not say the same for most politicians.
Like everything else, this is probably just an attempt to add a tax to health care which will increase prices and not decrease them and you will pay for the health care of illegal aliens - TANSTAFL (there aint no such thing as free lunch). If we want to really focus on prevention, overhaul the FDA - it's a crime that hydrogenated oil, aspartame, msg, and hexane extracted soy protein is used in our food. Companies have taken out expensive nutrients over the years and replaced them with chemical flavors, cheap fat lard, cheap sweeteners like high fructose corn syrup, and salt (read your labels).
If we all stopped smoking (Pres) & drinking, ate our vegetables, ate less calories, and walked 5 miles a day we wouldn't be having this discussion. We have no right to eternal life, and if you tax me to pay for everyone else's healthcare you infringe upon my right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Your blind faith in government is naive, the lyrics to the O'Brother Where Art Thou song Big Rock Candy Mountain come to mind:
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains,
There's a land that's fair and bright,
Where the handouts grow on bushes
And you sleep out every night.
Where the boxcars all are empty
And the sun shines every day
And the birds and the bees
And the cigarette trees
The lemonade springs
Where the bluebird sings
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.
Just say no. Your avatar is sporting a magic marker mustache, do you have a little captain in you?
Vicelord, I agree to a certain extent: the insurance companies are dirtbags. I wouldn't go as far to say they make they make the banksters looks like 7-11 stickup artists only because it's so subjective at this point. I guess it all depends whether you've been short the past month vs. my mom got cancer and insurance didn't pay out. All a matter of perspective on that one.
BUT just because the insurance companies are skim-off-the-top pieces of shit, does not make the administration right. Nor does it give them the constitutional authority to do any of this. At least when I enter an insurance contract it's voluntary exchange. When it's the government, they will confiscate your property to give you "access" to their system, and, if you resist, they will eventually put a bullet in your head.
This can all be solved through a different means. we don't need the government to enforce contracts.
Standing up to GS capture of US then carrying water for insurance industry shills?
TD, stick with what you know.
2/3rds of the posters on this board are "carrying water for insurance industry shills",.. they just don't realize it.
Well said.
Ridiculous. Your "arguments" boil down to nothing more than silence-by-shaming, and that's no argument. But it IS a common tactic, used by Repubs against the anti-foreign-war crowd,and used by Dems against anyone opposing socialist takeover schemes.
I get excellent health care and I stand to lose under your system. You want to provide health care to people to can't or won't get it for themselves, and you want to do it by holding a government gun to my head and making me pay for it, and reducing the amount of it that I get in the process by making me wait to get mine. Is there anything else they "need" and "have a right to" that they're not currently getting that I happen to have? I already pay for their housing and food, and educate their children. I subsidize their consumption of other goods and services, including police and fire. In return they use their vote to elect people like you who are willing to point the government gun at my head to take even more. So for you, theft and force are important vehicles for government activity.
Fuck you.
You just said that you stand to loose with new system and then go on with that false assumption. Who told you that you gona loose? What is in the bill that will make it loose something? Will you loose when someone else gets healthcare? WIll you loose when there is no bankrupcies due to unpaid medical bills? Will you loose when doctors know that everyone will pay their services?
Proove it.
If your going to e-mail fishy.gov Because you believe in freedom of speech and the first Amendment you may as well
copy that and send it to your congress person too.
http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Elected.shtml
As of tonight, I will never donate a penny to this site. And I liked it for a few weeks...now, not so much and pretty sure there is not a Fight Club agenda really operating here. I will state as Howard Beale--I'm Mad as Hell and I'm Not Going to Take it Anymore! Any of you who don't know where that came from are young enough to be my spawn. You bore me. Rent Network or download it.
Good riddance, don't let the door slam you in the ass on the way out.
Not sure where that quote came from.
Why would you? Your brain is dead.
I thought you were leaving.
In your dreams Ghosty Boy. I will leave when I am truly done. Who knows? I could show up as some else tomorrow and act like all you braindead wizards are AWESOME! I know how to change my IP address. I know how to act like I actually think what TD says is Ghandi--too bad Ed Norton wanted to kill him. Just because you say things that TD likes, doesn't make you an asset. The truth is still unknown.
Suddenly all is clear. They cut you off your lithium again, didn't they? Those health insurance bastard cut off your lithium! They'll pay! Oh yes! Say...you'd be much more effective at getting THEM back if you stopped posting.
So go back to ASW...
Oh...wait...you're the retard that wants the website to criticize the establishment, and then you get mad when a post makes fun of the establishment because the establishment is now run by your political party. If you haven't figured it out yet, the Democrats are running the system now, and thus are fair game for all anti-establishment jokes. If it makes you feel better, I'm pretty sure that TD would have written the exact same post if Bush had been stupid enough to set up "flag@whitehouse.gov."
My antics have nothing to do with political party or any other matter. I see sheep here. Lots of SHEEP. Include yourself as one of them.
I, also, thought you were leaving.
Cheers,
prat
you can always leave and hang out with wolf's ..
Another idiotic analysis of my psyche. You don't have a clue who I am or what I believe. Thanks for telling me. Moron.
Come on Howard... a good mix of ideas is not a bad thing... you simply have to stay... you have at least one person who likes Bill Maher:-) And I won't mention my love for Jon Stewart to loudly...
Well that's two of us.
They are just stuck with us... the only two Jon Stewart loving fools on the site I would expect :-)
Ahh, but we know you better than you know yourself. You will get bored soon enough and flit on to somewhere else. Either way is fine. You're really irrelevant.
Doubt it... I have been on this site since the inception... and I give money regularly... how 'bout you?
jon stewart works for comedy central, which is owned by time warner. do you think for one minute , everything and i do mean everthing he ever says on his show is not scripted for him by these people? he makes fun of things that should not be funny but are made to appear to be funny. what he makes fun of should not be funny to us but the obedient idiots laugh at his offerings as if on cue. it is another of example of people laughing at themselves and the very people who do the things to us, making us do it. so i would have to say, the joke is on us, as it has been for a very long time. television is just a tool to control the masses and they have known this for a long time. the last wild west show is the internet. they wanted to control it and will in the end, but right now , there is some modicum of freedom of speech but this too shall pass.
I can clearly see why you don't find Jon Stewart funny... you're just overanalyzing the whole thing :-) Maybe The Colbert Report might be better for you... you might be one of those people who take the show literally and think he is serious.
well, it is easy to see things that happen, when you start thinking like the enemy. the show is just a spoof, i am well aware of this. but in order to understand the show, you must look at who runs the show and who owns the show. that is all i am saying. its like CNBC. GE owns CNBC. we say on here, that we do not trust CNBC because it is owned by GE. yet you perhaps will agree with this statement, but also you will say, to me , perhaps, that you trust jon stewart, even though jon stewart works for time warner. a dichotemy that cannot be supported, would you not agree? imho, all media cannot be trusted. all media......i know it is a sad state of affairs, but this is the view from flyover country. to understand really, what i am talking about here, .....
watch the video on youtube century of self
about edward bernays and study what they have done with
television. you may be surprised that i am not speaking out my ass sir. you can also see this film in its entirety on google video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUYFr-uDQgg
jon stewart is just another small cog in the machinery playing his part on the television stage, a stage set up for him by his owners, our owners etc. he is just working there, doing a job, a job where he does what he is told and says what he is told to say. i am sure he has a family, which he must feed so he just goew with the flow. perhaps he knows what he is doing. maybe not. i suspect the former, but i digress.
the things that he portrays are not really funny, do ya think? think about it......
remember, all media is controlled. all of it. there is some of this on the internet too but in the future (very soon, i would think) , they will attempt to control this too.
because there are too many people like me running around asking too many questions and reading too much stuff. the internet right now, is the poor man's library of congress and as it stands now, you can learn what you want, more or less.
but unfortunately, this is changing but maybe the remnant, who will refuse to bow the knee to moloch , in this country, will learn enough to help them, during the times of the troubles. one can only hope and pray this is so.
They are just stuck with us... the only two Jon Stewart loving fools on the site I would expect :-)
yes ugly, unfunny failed comedians and those who worship them unite!!!! you now have bill maher and stuart smalley as your leaders! bwwwahahahaa
Don't know this Howard or like Steward all that much, but love Maher--too bad he doesn't know shit about econ (admitted it on his show just the other day.)
What is it with you lefties quoting movies? Is your whole world just a fucking fantasy? Is that what excessive drug use year after year leads to?
And then, you have the audacity to quote a really sucky movie? And in addition you actually believe that someone, anyone gives a rat's ass that you're leaving the site?
Boo freaking hoo. Go break out the bong and the VHS tapes. Network? Wasn't there anything worth quoting in Ishtar?
:) Just reported CNBC, CBS, CNN, when party calls people must answer OR ELSE!
Health care. Bloop!
o
0
O
>C<
It is really interesting to hear that Obama is communist and fascist. There is no limit for hate to bring oxymorons into discussion.
I am with Dem party and there was no such memo for flag@whitehouse, that is another con job from Republicans.
Whats so cool about it is that the latest polls show that there is only 5 states solidly republican left. Even Texas is a toss state now. Unamerican and undemocratic atitude works to get deeper into the wildernes and soon to join Wig party. By 2010 there will be only 3 republican solid states.
Keep up the good work republicans
you are a moron, if you dont realise it is not about republicans or democrats ... and you can tell obama that he can go fuck himself just like all politicians before him and after him
What are you complaining about cheeky. You are enjoying socialised healthcare in Europe, even single payer.
Don't let you these hard core blind republicans pull you astray. Just as they twist facts about reform thats how they twist facts about this flag@whitehouse
No such memo? Guess this isn't really the whitehouse website.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are-Stubborn-Things/
apparently the dude above has not heard of Google
+1 GFI
Yes, your're right... must have gone at the same time at you to see if it was really there... it is...
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Thanks for the link.
It just isnt nothing like you guys present it. It is just normal information gathering about the anti-reform means out there. It doesn't ask for any informations about "fishy" citizenry as you present it to be, like it is a fascist measure.
It is just looking for misinformations that astroturf is doing so they learn how to combat it.
I would say that you guys consider that fascist or communist means. I would guess, You have no quarel about astroturfing from insurance industry against reform.
and as Obama says: If you like your insurance , you can keep it. This is about single coverage, not about employer provided insurance. And just to let you know that doctors and hospitals keep raising their charges since there is more and more medical bills going unpaid from underinsured ones or uninsured ones. Doctors are making up for losess by overcharging those who pay. So you pay for those that can not pay and go bankrupt. Your premiums would be lower if everyone has insurance, and your wages would be higher if your employer has smaller health benefit costs. Think about it, if you are able to.
And as i pointed out you guys are going whig steps. Less and less republicans as time goes by. Keep going.
wow, an economic genius --- not
anon 26940,
kind of like, "the shower is this way folks."
"I am with Dem party and there was no such memo for flag@whitehouse, that is another con job from Republicans"? Riiight. Google is your friend:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are-Stubborn-Things/
Hurry up and look, before it's taken down or changed.
As opposed to Bush is Hitler? Give it a rest.
there might not be a memo but, how come when I search the whitehouse.gov web site for flag@whitehouse.gov I actually get the following hit:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/search/?keywords=flag%40whitehouse.gov
does the First Amendment mean anything to you? or is it just words? do you comprehend exactly why the first 10 amendments were added to the Constitution? seriously.
Why can you not understand that neither party wants to follow the constitution?
For the Obama salute the right arm is raised at an angle of about 45 degrees above the horizontal and slightly sideways to the right, and is almost always accompanied by the exclamation of the words Heil Obama! said in a firm and usually loud voice. Or if Brian Williams a 45 degree bow downwards!
Ja und das ist, warum unser Führer an Amerika' so interessiert ist; s-Jugend.
während ich Sie verstehen kann, würde ich höflich sein, um auf Englisch zu schreiben, weil das eine amerikanische Seite ist und Englisch die formelle Sprache hier ist.. so dude, please
Aber unser Führer war nicht hier geboren. er ist ein falasha Jude von Afrika, Teilschwarzes, zerteilt Weiß, mit einem großen Lächeln auf seinem Gesicht und einer Lüge für jedes Ohr.
das kann wahr sein, aber es ist nicht passend, in einer Fremdsprache über eine Website zu schreiben, die auf Englisch geschrieben wird oh, und es gibt eine Theorie, dass Hitlers Großmutter teilweise jüdisch war, aber wer weiß, aber wir zugeben können, dass er ein Lügen, psychotischer Mord war EDIT: oh Scheiße hatte ich nicht begriffen, dass Sie über Obama, nicht Hitler sprachen, jetzt wo eine Freudsche Fehlleistung ist
Opponents of health insurance reform may find the truth a little inconvenient, but as our second president famously said, "facts are stubborn things." …
And they go on to ask people to snitch on those who do not toe the government line:
There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.
And, coincidentally, we are immediately seeing the fruits of this campaign in our email inbox:
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: Kevin XXXXXX
Date: Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 9:10 PM
Subject: Health Care Reform Issues
To:
Hi!
I’m so sick of getting untruthful e-mails about health care reform, that I’ve decided to send these links to Snopes regarding two of the most commonly sent e-mails. Please read them carefully.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/seniordeath.asp
http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/euthanasia.asp
Thanks,
Kevin
Of course no one is in favor of disinformation. But the Obama folks are past masters of spreading untruths. (See our link to the Fight The Smears site above.)
Moreover, how does this do anything to encourage an open debate on the subject of healthcare?
Ronnie: Trust but verify...
Pelosi: Town Hall Protesters Are "Carrying Swastikas"
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/08/05/pelosi_town_hall_prote...
Gee I guess we know why Nancy
I don't get it. If this is stuff that's being posted or said in public places, then who cares if someone forwards it to the White House? This seems like a silly overreaction.
that's what the Jews also said
Bingo! Think about this. 40% of people to be underwater on their mortgages by 2011. Then the foreclosures will begin as the Chinese begin buying America suburban lot by suburban lot. Don't worry, says the government. We have nice air conditioned buses to take you to your new home. Free donuts on board. Let's go.
Yeah, I see it coming. You obviously do too. Remember though, most people will simply get on the bus and go. I guess when that day comes we will all see what we're made of.
This is only about finding out how astroturf twists the truth and how to counter it.
Paranoid republicans twist this move as :suddenly Obama is employ 2 million to search each individuals emails and spy on them. Like Stasi in east Europe or Nazi in west.
It is overreaction on black president and repugs are using the fear to get back to power. But no more, after 10 years of fear most people are sick of it, and they will lose even more seats midterm.
If the whitehouse only wants to know how astroturf works, why is Obama asking for all this other identifying information???
"Obama wants to know down to the individual what the individual has and how much the individual pays. Specifically, the NTIA is now requiring internet provides to give the government “average revenue per end user and data regarding type, technical specification or location of broadband infrastructure,” i.e. your home address, IP address, how much you pay, and where the connection is at your house.
The law does not require it. Congress does not want it. The NTIA admits the information will not be used to compile the map of national broadband, but Barack Obama still wants it."
See: http://www.redstate.com/erick/2009/08/05/john-cornyn-takes-on-obamas-fla...
Actually, President Obama is half white and if I were to ever criticize a policy of the President it would be the policies of that side of his heritage. To quote Jerry McGuire, "I am Mr. Black people." It would in fact be patronizing to not engage on the issues and simply give a pass for being the first part minority President. The lazy response doesn't address the issues and facts, but simply questions motive and hides behind an accusation of "racist".
I'm independent, and am an equal opportunity critic of any government policy that seeks to increase its centralized power (including the last).
Wrong site, Chief. www.dailykos.com Go. You'll feel better.
signed, klueless in Kali
There were members of Stormfront present at some of the protests in Texas. Hate groups are definitely taking advantage of every opportunity to get out and scream about how terrible the black president is.
Don't 'chall worry about that. The new hate speech laws will kick in soon, and we can round all these negative people up. Teach 'em how to love their new hood the way they should.
hate groups, you mean like Nashen of Islham, ACORN, SEIU???
Tensions seem to be running high all over - first it was Steve Rattner pulling out the big stick on the bondies.. then Rahm - Tim lost his mind in a meeting.. town halls are turning into riots.. and Jefferson county's 'emergency alternative' is to call in the National Guard.
Meanwhile O's admin is saying 'hey man, let us know if you hear someone saying something 'fishy'...'
which would be like Bush saying on 9/12 - report anyone who seems suspicious to us....
this is a slippery slope... the U.S. Gubbmint needs to be careful with regards to its choices here.
"The most dangerous man, to any government, is the man who is able to think things out for himself, without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost invariably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane and intolerable, and so, if he is romantic, he tries to change it. And if he is not romantic personally, he is apt to spread discontent among those who are."
Henry Louis Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Ah, if only the Sage of Baltimore were alive today! He would have a trawler full of fishy things to say, make no mistake ...
"Positions Elitism Instead of arguing that one race or group was superior to another, Mencken believed that every community — whether the community of train porters, blacks, newspapermen, or artists — produced a few people of clear superiority. He considered groupings on a par with hierarchies, which led to a kind of natural elitism and natural aristocracy. "Superior" individuals, in Mencken's view, were those wrongly oppressed and disdained by their own communities, but nevertheless distinguished by their will and personal achievement — not by race or birth. Based on his achievement and work ethic, Mencken considered himself a member of this group."
Douchebag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._L._Mencken
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Call me a tin foil hat wearing mo'fo.. but I get the feeling things in the U.S. are unraveling under the surface faster than we realize. Yes - as a full disclaimer I am bearish and have been for a while. But each and every green shoot that matters (employment, spending, house prices, etc) seems to be getting worse.. and the Administration seems to be getting more and more desperate. The lies are getting bigger and bolder - the subtle screwings of Wall Street are front and center... if only to keep the market alive for 'one more day'.
I can't help but wonder how those bond auctions would be going if the S&P were back at 667.. or lower.. and AIG, C, BAC and Wells were finally put down..
and before any of you GS trolls try to say anything about this post.. I hope I don't need to remind you Lloyd said "lay low.. don't stand out..."
so STFU.
fully agree +1
fully agree +2 GS heads on a stick at the next town hall.
munt
New world order by 2011. You heard it here first.
:\
Gotta a legal question on this for ya - How does Obama's action in this square with USC 552a(e)7:
maintain no record describing how any individual exercises rights guaranteed by the First Amendment unless expressly authorized by statute or by the individual about whom the record is maintained or unless pertinent to and within the scope of an authorized law enforcement activity;
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode05/usc_sec_05_00000552---a000-.html
What say ye?
well, it doesn't square. then again we already have the PATRIOT Act: "unless pertinent to and within the scope of an authorized law enforcement activity." "Holy civil rights trampling, Batman!"
you are 21 years late; Fukuyama already declared the End of History in a speech he made in the UN General Assembly. Hegel must still be turning in his grave.
I stopped paying my credit cards, $45K Mayhem for the total of all three. GREEN CHUTS AS WE SAY IN HINDI...
The great recession
Paid enough tax and won't pay a single dime going forward. Start getting 1099's people and claim to the max, even better don't show income unless 1099 is issued to you, many of my vendors don't issue so guess what? no reporting and paying tax from now on.
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RE: Healthcare
These dopes in Washington could have had a LOT more support in the countryside IF ONLY they were willing to volunarily rescind ALL CLAIMS against the health plan of the House/Senate and White House for the remainder of their lives (families included) and agree that they will be serviced by the government plan, paying the same as the average Joe and getting THE SAME SERVICE.
We'd see how many of the prositwhore would sign on.
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It's time for one state, any state, to push the 10th Amendment issue. If one takes the 5 minutes necessary to read the Constitution and Bill of Rights it becomes clear that the Feds are an occupying force on state soil. We not only have the right to send them packing, we have the obligation to do so.
Texas should secede post haste, et tu Cornyn?
pavlik marozov, i seem to remember, was the first decorated hero of the Komsomol.
he was so honored for turning in his parents for speaking against the collectivisation.
he was stoned to death by his neighbors.
so there may be hope...
Here is my message just sent to flag@whitehouse.gov
I supported the Obama campaign with generous donations and a lot of talking to friends and acquaintances. The health care plan is also something I support, for the most part. However, that pales in comparison to my support of free speech and tolerance of dissent. The 4 August White House communication "Facts Are Stubborn Things" asking that "fishy speech" be reported to flag@whitehouse.gov is yet another reason why I will not be supporting Obama or the Democrat party in future elections. McCarthyism is not something that was even remotely expected from the Obama administration.
Obama has on several occasions (including resistance to HR 1207 allowing audits of the Federal Reserve) demonstrated that he lied in the campaign about government transparency. He continued the Bush policy of transferring the wealth of future generations of taxpayers to the world's most wealthy, under the guise of saving a banking system that should have been immediately nationalized for restructuring with the investors taking all the losses. He paid off the unions for their votes by giving them a disproportionate share of Chrysler/GM while flip flopping from his big bank stance to screw those at the top of the capital structure, trashing a long history of fair bankruptcy law. The Obama stimulus package was huge pork barrel feeding frenzy for politicians which is going to do very little for the economy, at a time when instead we most needed spending efficiency on things with the highest possible future value. Now so much is being borrowed that another proper stimulus spending bill will not be supported by enough buyers of Treasuries to make it feasible. The Obama administration and Federal reserve are currently manipulating currency, bond and stock markets with secret money and transactions which have created a very unstable market situation that is going to end very badly. The Obama administration has made the economic situation far worse and I now fear even more for the future we are leaving the children who will have to live under the burden of our debt.
The two things that need to be done to restore health to our economy are destruction of excessive debt and a return to healthy savings. People have begun saving at an increasing rate, in spite of government and Fed efforts to the contrary and ridiculously low rates of return on low risk investments. Meanwhile, destruction of bad debt has barely begun. The cowardly politicians of both major parties have instead been transferring massive amounts of debt (including financial backstops and guarantees that will be called upon) onto the backs of future generations for them to deal with. This generation may well go down in history as the one that destroyed the US Empire, with named credit going to the current political leadership.
That's my "fishy speech" which all receiving may share with anyone,
cc: my US Senators and Representative
Bravo! It's nice to read an actual post rather than dick waving because someone needs to prove they are right or clever. Sort of trying to create a heirchy in the jungle tribe. Anonymous speech is still on a learning curve here, much like an excited 5 year old that has just learned how to say fuck. It will be interesting on how this progresses. Will it continue to grow or crash and burn in a heap of insults...Consider this a ruler to the back of your hands..
I am SI, too lazy to log in..
Thank you for that. You saved me a lot of writing in summing up most of my disgust regarding Barry Obama, the man I actually worked to elect.
Rahmster and Obamer can shove some fish up their asses as far as I'm concerned.
Thats nice and all, however given O's background...how could you possibly be surprised by this?????
Until every member of government, in all venues, from the POTUS on up and down is covered under a single payer system, subject to every facet of ObamaCare, they can take their central planning Health revolution and stick it up their fat asses.
The White House just vaporized ANY chance they had of getting their health care reform legislation passed.
This program can not be "explained away" nor can it be justified on any level. Didn't Obama study/teach constitutional law?
If this doesn't reveal a CULTURE OF CONTROL in the White House then I don't know what does!
For those needing help spotting town hall agitators:
http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2009/08/know-your-town-hall-mob-agi...
"They came first for the communists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the Jews and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics because and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me and by that time there was no one left to speak up."
I believe everyone should send an email and let the White House know that the President has been spreading false information, ie that the Feds can improve the healthcare situation and/or reduce costs, ha
It took me about ten minutes into his Presidency to grow weary of Obama and his schtick when it became abundantly clear that he either knew nothing about economics (his personal financial history suggests that might be the case) or actually thinks the likes of GS need and deserve the entire range of alphabet soup programs the taxpayer is funding to make sure no GS heir is ever born without a silver spoon in his mouth.
Now this.
As I write this I am behind a SOCKS proxy in a land where the government censors the internet and monitors its usage. The line between here and the US is growing ever thinner.
And though I did not like Bush, I guarantee every Democrat and every Obama worshipper would have been apoplectic if Bush had pulled this same stunt.
WHERE'S THE POST OF THE ORIGINAL "FACTS ARE STUBBORN THINGS" PRESS RELEASE THAT THIS LETTER RESPONDS TO??????????????????
google it goddamit
void TakeThatMutha()
{
system("c:\\windows\\system32\\ping.exe whitehouse.gov");
}
int main()
{
double icount = 0;
while(icount < 100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000)
{
TakeThatMutha();
icount++;
sleep(1);
}
return(0);
}
Disclaimer to Big Brother: Lighten up, this is a freaking joke
here is a link
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are-Stubborn-Things/
yes they could just be using this to gather info about misinformation so they can rebut.
yes they could use it to develop an enemies list.
at least cheney's office was in a different building. rahm's is at the whitehouse. in chicago they play for keeps. beware of stasi rahm
i just sent them the newest poll data showing BHO falling like a rock...seems fishy.
the text of email i sent to flag@whitehouse.gov
Dear Whitehouse,
I want to report something “fishy”: I heard that an element(s) of the federal government -- the government that takes an oath to defend and protect the US Constitution including the first amendment – is asking American citizens to report on “fishy speech” that disagree with the President’s goals of nationalizing the US healthcare system. This seems a direct violation of the first amendment, protecting the right of free speech, due to the “intimidating” nature of collecting names, numbers, and presumably taking action against citizens for engaging in “fishy speech”.
I request that the Whitehouse investigate this matter immediately, and identify the element(s) of the federal government that are engaging in suppression of free speech. I am quite certain that President Obama would not want his administration associated with suppression of free speech, “fishy” or otherwise, and will do anything in his power to root out such activity and terminate those involved.
Regards,
Here's something revolutionary. Who here has read the health care proposal(s)? 1000+ pages. Lots of arguements, no substance.
"None of your civil liberties matter much after you're dead."
Sen Cornyn defending Bush era total domestic surveilence in 05.
You have no rights you are not willing to exert. Exerting them requires...exertion. I think this is what they mean when they say "freedom isn't free".