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Cramer Launches Flash Defense Campaign

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Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:40 | 76224 Cognitive Dissonance
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"Something as insignificant as flash."

Straight from the mouth of Cramer.

While I agree the SEC is next to useless, so is Cramer and his Cramericans.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:54 | 76251 Missing_Link
Missing_Link's picture

I have to give the SEC some credit: they're at least TRYING to do the right thing, and occasionally, as with flash, they do sometimes get it right.

I don't think I've ever seen an honest word out of Cramer's mouth.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:42 | 76295 JohnKing
JohnKing's picture

Cramer is the "tell" for SEC findings, more than likely the SEC will parrot him, this stuff doesn't just pop into his head.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:33 | 76226 bonddude
bonddude's picture


Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:36 | 76227 phaesed
phaesed's picture

Gosh.... When this new sandcastle finally gets taken away by the tide, I so hope to see this idiot crucified by the same idiots who listened to him.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:53 | 76250 lsbumblebee
lsbumblebee's picture

It will never happen. He's a pathological liar and will deny he ever said this was a bull market. And his followers are idiots who believe anything he says because he's on teevee.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:55 | 76255 phaesed
phaesed's picture

I dunno... I truly loved the Jon Stewart interview.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 15:45 | 76629 Green Sharts
Green Sharts's picture

It didn't happen after his "Winners of the New World" speech and column at the Nasdaq peak in early 2000.  You can easily find via an internet search.  He was banging the table for a basket of stocks, saying they were the only ones to own, that subsequently went down over 95% as a group.

A few years later he was claiming that he warned people to get out of the Nasdaq before the tech bubble peaked.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:39 | 76228 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Former Golman Sachs employee defends flash trading. I'm shocked!

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:42 | 76230 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

Does anyone, with an IQ that requires more than ten fingers to count, actually listen to a word Cramer says?

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:54 | 76253 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Unfortunately yes. You would be surprised how many of my (reasonably intelligent) clients call me in the morning to inform me of the latest buy buy buy item of interest that came from the mouth of Cramer the night before.

I'm talking 2-3 calls a week and not from the same 2-3 clients. He has an audience because he tells people what they want to hear, which is the easiest job in America.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:14 | 76272 JohnKing
JohnKing's picture

ahhh..this may come as a shock to some but a LOT of fund manager/pension guys do listen to and act on Cramers "stuff".

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:36 | 76544 DaddyWarbucks
DaddyWarbucks's picture

That is a sobering thought. At least in baseball we get stats on all the players. I wonder if the SEC could handle that job? at least it would get them off their knees now and then.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 12:42 | 76396 snorkeler
snorkeler's picture

Cramer needs to do hard time.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 13:21 | 76446 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I get to 512 with base two and ten fingers.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:13 | 76512 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Then you are a magician.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:44 | 76232 Bearish Spirits
Bearish Spirits's picture

How can anyone take this seriously?  He never actually told the viewers what flash trading is, just some of the effects it has.  And to claim that it's good for the retail investor?  Please.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:07 | 76264 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Flash is/was either neutral for the retail investor, or slightly positive for them if they had trading accounts with a brokerage firm that passes on ECN rebates.

When you are a retail investor dribbling out small orders with no attempt to iceberg large orders (i.e. you are not a mutual fund trying to move millions of shares in stealth mode), then there is no way that the 30ms look ahead endangers your future trades to being affected by a HFT firm.... because you have no such future trades.

Pattern matching and any attempt to "front run" (a misused term but what you're all expecting to hear) a retail investor who is manually entering in small orders is a strategy to lose money... and if a retail investor is lucky enough to have their order placed on a flashing ECN hit by a HFT trader, than either they or their broker (depending on the broker) is going to get a price improvement via the liquidity rebate.

The way flash hurts retail is when retail holds mutual funds that are stupid enough to choose to route their big orders to venues that flash (something well within their control to avoid!). But retail investors would do well by pulling all of their money from those mutual funds and avoiding the much larger fees that they are paying to have nice glossy brochures printed up.

Cramer is surely a bafoon, but on this count, he is correct.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:14 | 76336 Bearish Spirits
Bearish Spirits's picture

Much of that may be true.  My point is that he is flat-out stating that it is "GOOD" for the retail investor in order to get them on his side against the SEC.  Of course, we know Cramer and the SEC have had a friendly history...

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:24 | 76341 monkeyshine
monkeyshine's picture

Indeed. Flash trading isn't the crime. High Frequency Trading is.  These machines are buying and selling and selling and buying shares back and forth all day every day. If I ping-ponged shares to you and you ping-ponged them back to me and we whacked up all the pennies we collected from the small lot individual traders at the end of each day, we'd go to jail for stock manipulation.  But if I set up two computers to do the same thing and keep all the money for myself, I'm just a creative investor.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:44 | 76369 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

You would not go to jail (there is nothing illegal in what you suggest provided you are trading your own money rather than a client's) - but you would go to the poor house.

How do you envision making a profit trading the shares back and forth with someone allied with you (i.e. seeking profit in the same way you are - which is identical to trading with yourself)?

You will need to cover the bid/ask spread round trip, and the ECN rebates you get from adding liquidity (assuming you are fast and lucky) will not cover a 1 penny spread.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:40 | 76549 DaddyWarbucks
DaddyWarbucks's picture

In cards it's called cutting up the pot and the practice has been known to cause broken fingers.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:19 | 76522 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Trust me, flash is negative for users. If you place a crossing Flash order on NASDAQ, and I see the order hitting NASDAQ and that's about to take out the remaining 100 on ARCA, I'm going to go hit ARCA before NASDAQ does. I get the price level and you don't, even though you placed your interest.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 15:45 | 76627 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Great - so you now have 100 shares you didn't want before, and you hope to unload them to who?

You just intercepted a retail order with nothing behind it... so there is no reason to think that you can improve upon the price you just paid....

It is a losing strategy. If you wanted the shares, you would have hit the ARCA initially... and if you didn't want them, you now have them and exactly no incremental information about further demand (since this was a retail order with no iceberg).

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:45 | 76233 NoBull1994
NoBull1994's picture

Who is that "strategist" CNBC puts on that proceeds to speak in Ebonics about how the stock market is going back to all time highs?  Is this the best GE can do in its affirmative action program?

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:05 | 76259 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I'm not sure but word is CNBC is committed to bring these 2 analysts in for daily premarket commentary.


Tue, 09/22/2009 - 12:53 | 76409 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

hahaha nice one. pretty much the type of analysts they have on CNBS most of the time..

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:45 | 76234 Tripps
Tripps's picture

anyone who had any respect for cramer's teaching ability...lost it all on this one



Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:47 | 76235 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Few know this... but according to several ex Cramer-Berkowitz employees, Jim Cramer was known to be Bi-Polar with heavy dependency on various prescribed drugs for the diagnosis and cure. With that tidbit of information -- is anyone surprised by this guy's often volatile, reckless, and impulsive behavior? Why even give this moron any more attention.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:49 | 76236 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Marc Faber doesn't paint a very nice picture. Silly me but I have a tendency to listen to people who got it right in the first place.

"The future will be a total disaster, with a collapse of our capitalistic system as we know it today, wars, massive government debt defaults and the impoverishment of large segments of Western society."


Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:51 | 76243 Gilgamesh
Gilgamesh's picture

A mind above all.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:48 | 76238 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

I hope SEC one would wake up and shut down the Cramer-like stock cheerleaders on CNBC. The average investor is being milked and it's incomprehensible that no one takes any action against those crooks on CNBC.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:49 | 76239 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

Why is there a shot clock on his cramerica infomercial set?

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:51 | 76242 Missing_Link
Missing_Link's picture

So according to Cramer:


-Leveraged ETFs are bad;

-Flash trading is good;

-There are a lot of "scam artists" and "scoundrels" out there who confuse and mislead individual investors, and he's actually NOT one of those people and is trying to PROTECT us from them.


Down is up, up is down, black is white, white is black.  Wheeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:53 | 76248 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Please post a poll.

What new torture technique should be adopted at Guantanamo?

1) 24/7 Cramer
2) 24/7 Obama speeches

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 09:58 | 76256 RobotTrader
RobotTrader's picture

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:13 | 76268 BobPaulson
BobPaulson's picture

But Cramer said the stock is a steal at 24 and the industry can only go up. 

"They're not making new coffee land anymore"

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:24 | 76278 JohnKing
JohnKing's picture

Is that what momo-junker algos do on a reverse slam?

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:32 | 76282 mule65
mule65's picture

Yuck, Burnt coffee.  Booyah!

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:48 | 76302 Dr Horace Manure
Dr Horace Manure's picture

Dear Tyler Durden, RobotTrader, Project Mayhem, etal:

By now ZH must be attracting thousands of new readers each week.

ZH challenges me to think in new ways, and to research and learn about things I've never heard of, and because of this I am now addicted.

BUT, too often I am left totally clueless about what people are saying, and this is very frustrating.

This post by RT is a perfect example of what I mean by this.  Please, just a short explanation for us Newbies would be greatly appreciated.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:57 | 76312 deadhead
deadhead's picture

i'll take a stab as far as the robo post...pls also know that i am not part of zh, just a commenter like the rest of us.

my view of rt's post is that he is very good about pointing out stocks that are continually gamed, whether it is ddrx, cit, aig, rf, ad infinitum.  what i perceive out of this is the macroscopic view that much of the u.s. equity action is a gaming exercise, certainly not an "investment" play in the traditional sense of the word.

the citi news is an example this a.m.....i've had an ongoing discussion with a certain someone about whether the house of saud or the singapore sovereign wealth fund was dumping their piece of shit C shares....this a.m.'s news confirms that (for now) the singapore team unloaded a boatload of this crap. 

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:09 | 76331 Dr Horace Manure
Dr Horace Manure's picture

Thanks for the explanation deadhead. 

Now I understand it, and your explanation will likely make it easier for me to understand some of RobotTrader's future posts.

I understand these guys are probably working at warp speed and have little time or patience for people like me.  But I believe people like me are becoming a larger and larger share of the ZH Nation.

Long live TD.  

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 12:55 | 76411 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

I am TD. You are TD.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:44 | 76552 DaddyWarbucks
DaddyWarbucks's picture

You are not a unique and beautiful snowflake ...  You know the rest.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:04 | 76322 Chief Hatuey
Chief Hatuey's picture

Go to bigcharts.com and see their tutorial on chart reading.


Tue, 09/22/2009 - 11:36 | 76360 Dr Horace Manure
Dr Horace Manure's picture

It's been on my "TO DO" list for quite some time.

I just moved it to the top of my list.  Thanks for the suggestion.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 12:59 | 76415 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

For other people peering down the rabbit hole for the first time, check out the Deep Capture blog for detailed reporting on how the mainstream financial media is corrupted by a small group of Wall Street bastards. Some of the stuff on there will make your head explode, it is mind boggling that the mainstream media does not touch these stories.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 17:38 | 76769 Anonymous
Anonymous's picture

Don't waste too much time on that, you'll become depressed, paranoid, and delusional.

Always keep in mind that the history books are full of this stuff. Greed, corruption, and war, are man's second nature.

Don't believe me, try reading Robert Graves 'I, Claudius' and 'Claudius the God'. An easy to read compendium of historical anecdotes from Roman historians during Emperor Claudius's lifetime. (Very good, fast read)

Just try to remember that the financial world is filled with sharks, snake oil salesmen, satan's little helpers, zombies, trolls, buffoons, shake down artists, and other assorted bunko experts willing to help seperate you from your hard earned money.

You have a long hard slog ahead of you, so in matters such as these, patience will be your only friend.

Caveat Emptor is my shield, and a good sense of humor my staff.

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 14:11 | 76506 long-shorty
long-shorty's picture

the one year chart on this name is mind-blowing

Tue, 09/22/2009 - 10:05 | 76260 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture

I wonder how much liquor and coke it takes for Cramer to look at himself in the mirror everyday?

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