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"End Of The World" Inflation: 47% In Six Months
Back in October, Zero Hedge discussed a Costco offer for Shelf-Reliance THRIVE's one year's supply of dehydrated, freeze dried food, better known as "apocalypse rations." Six months ago a one year's supply of food for one person which included 5,011 total servings (84 #10 cans) could be purchased for $799.99 (the link for the offering is here, or rather was, here). A series of events made us encounter a comparable THRIVE offering at Costco. To our amazement in six months, the real price inflation in apocalypse rations, when factoring proportioning, is almost 50%! While the original set that was presented back in October is no longer available, what Costco does offer is a Shelf Reliance THRIVE 6 month supply supply for the price of $579.99: this represents the pinnacle of that ultimate in inflation disguising techniques: cutting the price by X while cutting the amount offered by Y>>>X. Indeed, to last a person a full year, one would need to be two of the 6 month supplies for a price of $579.99 or $1,159.98. And even that has to be indexed: the current set has 2,470 total servings, whereas the previous offer had 5,011, or 203% more. In other words, to index for the proper serving ratio the final price is actually $1,176.65. We can only hope that there are those who purchased this product when we first presented it (and don't worry, with a 25 year shelf life, it lasts a looooong time) and saved themselves the 47% inflation in 6 months! And then there are non THRIVE product offerings, such as the one below for 2 people for 3 months for $999.99 (and includes its own 55 gallon water storage set), which represents price inflation well over 100% for those who need a little extra caloric kick (and, naturally, post-apocalypse social status with the neighbors). Something tells us in another 6 months, the Costco price today will be just as lamented as the price from 6 months ago currently is.
Then (link):
And now:
And for those for whom greeting apocalypse in style means price is no object...
A description of the "cost-effective" apocalypse ration:
Shelf Reliance is known for providing unsurpassed quality in all of
its products, and their line of food storage is no different. THRIVE
Food Storage is a premium name you can trust. Every THRIVE product has
been carefully selected based on taste and quality, and we are confident
that you will look forward to using THRIVE in your everyday meal
planning and emergency food storage.
This THRIVE Package was
built to provide a 6 month supply of food for 1 person. This package
offers a variety of grains, vegetables, and protein-rich foods, along
with comforting goodies like chocolate milk, fudge brownies, and
strawberries. Adding this package of 54 cans to your long-term storage
will provide extra flavor, nutrition, and energy when you need it most.
For questions or additional information please email costcosupport@shelfreliance.com. Please include your the item number and description that corresponds with your question.
- Shipment arrives in 9 separate boxes
- 2,470 total servings
- Freeze-dried products have up to 25 year shelf life if unopened
- Dehydrated products have up to 20 year shelf life if unopened
- TVP products have up to a 10 year shelf life if unopened
- Shelf life varies per can/product (see individual cans for optimum shelf life suggestions)
- All items are suitable for vegetarian diets
- Wheat can be easily milled into flour, and non-milled kernels can be cooked to make a variety of recipes
- Easy rehydration instructions, useful tips, and recipes on each can
This THRIVE 6 Month Food Supply contains 54 #10 (gallon size) cans. See below for specific package contents.
- 2 cans of Instant White Rice (48 servings per can)
- 6 cans of Hard White Winter Wheat (44 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Elbow Macaroni (25 servings per can)
- 2 cans of 6 Grain Pancake Mix (46 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Cornmeal (46 servings per can)
- 4 cans of Freeze Dried Potato Dices (41 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Freeze Dried Sweet Corn (46 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Freeze Dried Green Peas (41 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Freeze Dried Green Beans (50 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Freeze Dried Broccoli (52 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Freeze Dried Mushroom Pieces (47 servings per can)
- 1 can of Freeze Dried Spinach (41 servings per can)
- 3 cans of Freeze Dried Strawberries (45 servings per can)
- 1 can of Carrot Dices (49 servings per can)
- 1 can of Mixed Bell Peppers (42 servings per can)
- 3 cans of Non-fat Powdered Milk (43 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Chocolate Drink Mix (48 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Bacon TVP (47 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Beef TVP (44 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Chicken TVP (45 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Taco TVP (42 servings per can)
- 1 can of Pinto Beans (49 servings per can)
- 1 can of Lentils (51 servings per can)
- 1 can of Black Beans (49 servings per can)
- 1 can of Kidney Beans (44 servings per can)
- 1 can of Lima Beans (49 servings per can)
- 2 cans of Fudge Brownies (75 servings per can)
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He's probably bipolar, and even on a good day is barely tolerable. Most certainly is a complete loser in life though.
Chumba's cool. I wish he was a helicopter racist like me. I fucking hate helicopters. I don't even know why any more. It's just a blind freaking rage. I want to shoot them all in the fucking face. There's a goddamn shinnook that keeps flying over my house. It was on a schedule for a while but got off it.
If it comes back. I think I am going to blast it's ass out of the sky and if the cops hassle me about it I'll stick the screw drivers I want to jamb in it's ass in the cops. Whoever flys the bastard better get a warning that he's about to be hunted.
I'm a total helicopter racist. I hate the way they look. I hate the way they smell. I hate the way they sound. I just want to run a belt sander all over their windshields till the fuckers are blind. I didn't used to hate helicopters but I learned to hate them. If anybody has some 7 inch rockets give me a call. Because rockets hate helicopters as much as I do so I love them.
I fucking hate you stupid ugly helicopters.
.
lol, ya ok that was pretty f'in funny... u prick.
+1 on canned goods
Get about a hundred can-openers. The shit ass junk from china usually breaks after two or three cans of peas.
Or just use concrete. If your can opener is broken, you can rub the can top on a concrete surface in a circular motion. It will wear off the rim and you can pop it open.
Buy a "Swing-A-Way" can opener made in U.S.A.
You can still find them in some K-Marts and Grocery Stores.
They switched manufacturing to China because the only thing America makes anymore is babies.
Look for one of the U.S.A. made still in stock or second hand - indestructible.
I just bought 20 lbs. basmati and 20 lbs. short grain brown, have read alot of different suggestions on storage. I have them in my pantry in original packaging, do you think there are any issues with this? I also bought a Burke water filtration system but need to load up on filters.
Brown rice has a much shorter shelf life than white rice. That is because of the oil content which will go rancid after 36 - 48 months tops.
Hear me now and believe me later (girlie men). You guys storing rice are generally on the right track, so might as well do it properly. Parboiled rice. Say it with me -parboiled rice. It has the nutrition from the husk pressurized into the kernel, with the oily husk removed after. Resistant to spoilage, much more nutritious than polished white. Store in a bucket with an airtight lid. These are recommended:
http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_MS%20L702_A_name_E_GAMMA%20SEAL...
+1 Big Burkey
Get some oxygen absorbers to store the rice if you plan on keeping it for longterm storage.
Try to "tupperware" bagged food - ie rice,oats cereals, etc.
Maybe even them bigger plastic storage containers?
Smart move on that "Burkey"
Is this crap any good?
Only with water and hunger.
It is a five course meal at a Michelin five star restaurant compared to a boiled rat.
Hey, rats ain't all that bad.... properly prepared.
A squirrel is nothing but a rat with a furry tail.
What does Racoon taste like?
Greasy, but the pelts are quite nice.
Come and get it, boys!
This is actually a supply and demand issue, on both ends. I occasionally help people prepare and talk with the suppliers from time to time, and demand is WAY up for storage food. On top of this, the government placed a pretty big order with Oregon Freeze Dry, which is one of the main upstream suppliers of freeze dried food, and that killed supply as well. Current product is backordered about 5-6 months, so I'm sure costco has picked up on the demand and, having stock, took advantage of it.
I'm also hearing that prices are going up due to input costs -- the backorders are being placed and the suppliers will need to buy the raw materials at a later date to process them.
A big part of the problem is the cycle time on freeze drying is pretty long (I think it's about a week per cycle) so there's no way to speed up production other than more equipment, and making a huge capital expense for a short-term demand spike doesn't make any sense, so they're not doing it.
"This is actually a supply and demand issue, on both ends."
I rather suspect that depends on how much psyllum fibre you stockpiled prior to the appocalypse.
Fuck that noise. Two bottles of jack Daniels and a Seymore Butts video will suffice. If i am going to die, I would like to at least Cum and go at the same time.
End of the world, i think not but some just do not want to believe that it is going to fall apart to some degree, sooner rather than later. You really think there is an easy answer to 14+trillion in debt. May not look so obvious now but just wait a few months and lets see where we are at. I would much rather know what our options are than just go along and keep smiling and believe in what our govt. is doing.
Thanks Tyler
Excalibur 3900 FTMFW.
Oh, and Amazon S&S. Your local supermarket will be a wasteland but just think what Brown can and will Do For You.
If you're looking for caloric bang for the buck, it's still tough to beat peanut butter.
Rather pointless as well.
Still, the good stuff does need a good stir now and again.
Nice avitar.." Love dead, Hate living".
Freaking bread will be few and far between when the SHTF.
Mountain House does make pilot crackers in #10 cans :)
B&M Boston Brown Bread - with raisins. I used to take it camping all the time. It's actually pretty good.
Sorry for the tripple posts... User error...
This site has helped me in so many ways I cannot even begin to list them. Let some ridicule and laugh at what is posted on this site. How much of this do you see on MSM> It is so sad how they try to funnel to us only what they think we should see and hear.
And did many of you notice how many sold miners today. My goodness, gold, silver go down for 1,2,3 days and the top is in for the 86th time. Good way to get rid of the weak holders who do not have a clue why to own them, and we pick up more at a discount. Kinda like those sales at Kohls. I have never seen so much emotion in One sector in my entire career trading. Just amazing.
Amazing it goes up at all, give that the only institutional TBTF money is on the short side.
As the day approaches, the price approaches infinity. Give me a few more data points and I'll give you a date.
Are you taking into account the day the radiation gets here?
That's a lot of beans. Could be more fall-out inside the bunker than outside with those servings.
Potatoes contain an enzyme which reduces gas from beans and other vegetables.
The same enzyme is found in Beano. Just cook the offending vege with potatoes, and you won't get gas.
Oscar Wilde has a wonderful recipe for dissected frog that could go with those taters ;)
Crap, what an expensive crock! Head to Aldi and stock up on cans. Then over to HoneyvilleGrain for freeze dried veggies, beans, and grains. Back to Costco for rice, canned chicken, TP and batteries. Pack it all up nice and neat in 5 or 6 Gal pails with mylar liners and O2 absorbers. Once that's done, sit back and clean your weapons of choice with your abundant supply of Hoppes and Break Free. What's the worst sound in the world? "Click" when you should have heard "Bang." Spend the rest of what you saved investing in lead, copper, a canner, dehydrator, tampons and learning to farm.
Think "Alpha Strategy."
Sidenote(and I think I posted this before); a neighbor doing heavy hauling pulls into a metal works shop in GA and notices 1500lb. bags of bulk foods hanging over a #10 canning line. When he asks the owner about this, the owner says he's LDS and it's part of what they do to support their community. On a recent trip he noted that the activity on that 'side business' was more active than the metal fabrication and that the owner says they are running it 1 1/2 shifts now. I asked the neighbor to find out where those bulk sacks are coming from...
Hopefully it's not a small farm in Texas...
That was a strange one huh? I noticed something peculiar, that Branch Dividian nutball and that Million Man Marching madman both claim to have taken a ride. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtiVP-E2eFI ...and then there was that other wacked out spazz that was put to death, after the FBI building in Oklahoma City was blown up, Old ''Knights of the Secret Circle'' Mc Veigh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_7z5eUK7F0 ... know if he ever said he ever took a ride. All pretty weird stuff though huh?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVeKsbqH-Ag
At this year's NOI Saviour's Day U.S. researchers Dr. Roger Leir, Donald R. Schmidt and Steve Colbern along with three international researchers presented evidence of UFOs, including declassified government papers, to members of the Nation of Islam. It's worth watching.
http://www.noi.org/sd2011/ufo_symposium.shtml
...yeah man, weird stuff. Got a feeling it's going to get very strange. The whole occult bullshit and the 2012 timing crap, combined with the prophetic scriptures, and then you throw in all this UFO demoic Knights of the Secret Circle junk and Chairsatan's new world order cabal of creeps with that U.N.screwball Benjamin Le Creme talking http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx74R8BHtBA ''Maitreya'' and Dalai Lama doing his http://www.consciouscontenttv.com/1/category/all/1.html Maitreya Invocation this February. Taint lukin gud. It's no big wup though, if yer a Saint sealed by God in Christ. FBI seems to have a record on this UFO stuff http: //www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/51593226-90/fbi-utah-documents-vault.html.csp and it looks like they are leaking stuff just in time with all the meltdown and wars going on, ain't that nice of the spooks? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1375203/The-memo-proves-aliens-landed-Roswell--released-online-FBI.html?ITO=1490
http://www.officialdisclosure.com/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dz1LNUg6zw
...nothing like mixed DNA ta do yuh? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sygUmPoyvm4&feature=related There's a black hole in the Sun? Looks like the Sun has been pulsing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azlmqcoYzHs&feature=related and hey, did yuh see that comet (twice the size of Jupiter) miss the Sun? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ux9D37BU98g
this is a weird one too http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4182905293548090350#
Old Billy Thorpe song kinda fits about now. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR2oct3zeTM
It would be interesting to know whereabouts of this metal shop in Ga. The most recent word I've heard is that official LDS canneries are now closed to non-LDS individuals unless accompanied by an LDS member. Don't know the veracity of this but apparently it is nation wide due to demand.
duplicate
MRE's are all you need, they have a shelf life of 7 years, that's about 3 1/2 -ish more than you need. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj4T0HLowP8&feature=related
http://vimeo.com/15748916
http://vimeo.com/13306308
For all you slackers who want some Mountain House #10 cans- good luck. The boat left 6 months ago and will arrive back in another 6...
I was going to suggest the sellers on ebay, but I just checked and their prices are up too.
First step to survival is to go vegetarian. You will not know what you hunt. It could be diseased, radiated or something equally bad.
Lentils, beans and rice can last you a long long time. And in case you think it weakens you, i'd suggest a little arm-wrestle with a Zen Monk. Or me.
;-)
ORI
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2010/09/03/the-curse-of-free-energy/
Vegetarian is good for the body and mind. Beans and rice will get you enough protein and calories to make it by. Rice by itself is an incomplete protein and your muscle mass will slowly deteriorate.
F'ing DT.
Four fingers of burbon will take care of that.
You stupid fuck, the spinach is irradiated worse than the chickens! Bawk!
I AM CHUMBADUMBA! LOLOLOL!!
And that's the catch-22 of proposing a space for free speech: it's really easy for psy-ops fools to derail the conversation with idiotic charicatures of real commenters. Here is our newest copy-cat - Chumbadumba
http://www.zerohedge.com/users/chumbadumba
Notice that this character was created at least 43 weeks ago, but only started posting a bit over two months ago, which coincided with the return of the real chumbawumba. I know we all love this space, but when I see stuff like this, I can't help but think that all that the Tylers do is create a pen to direct all the like-minded individuals to in order to make their identification easier. There are at least 10 similar characters around. Now that Redneck isn't around anymore, we get that green mouse. At least Redneck was funny. The green mouse, not so much. His M.O. is ad hominem every single time. Dedicated Trolls are all over this board, just like they are over at the Wall Street Journal (Marcia Crowley anyone?). Sad...
Although I love this ZH information outlet, I often wonder if it isn't much more than a Langley/Brzezinski creation that the Russian trader Tyler had to agree to as part of his plea deal...
has anyone tried road kill. use Tobasco with the road kill, they taste like chicken.
The trick is to pick up the carcass without stopping. Just slow down a bit, open the door, scoop it up and toss it into the back seat in one smooth motion. Make sure it has baked in the sun for a bit first though - decreases the cooking time back home.
Skip the cooking. It will come out just right if you set it on the manifold for about twenty minutes. Avoid skunks.
That's how we cooked potatoes. Wrap 'em in foil and under the hood they go.
You know, there's precedence here. The Mongols used to "cook" their kills by riding on them in the saddle for a day.
Skunks - nasty.
Excellent idea.. We don't want the fucking EPA snooping at my power bill usage stating I overused power this month and charge me carbon tax.
You really need the Tabasco with porc-u-pig since you have to stew it till hell freezes over and the spines fall out, by which time it really doesn't taste like chicken...
Better yet, simply stockpile antibiotics, cigarettes, TP, sanitary napkins and AA batteries. Desperate people will trade you a truckload of food for these items.
I plan on bartering with the sheeple's drug of choice: DVDs of American Idol.
FTW!
I keep about 25 lbs of this stuff on hand...
http://www.tobaccogeneral.com/good-stuff-natural-pipe-tobacco-50-prd1.htm
... along with five boxes of rolling papers, 100 (100ct) bags of filter tips and a half dozen hand-rollers. Enough for 10,000 smokes for about $400. One of the first buys we made for the SHTF stash.
living on that shit doesn't sound like thriving to me.
Does living suit you?
When you have had no meals for 7 days, it will be amazin what you will eat.
I bought during the last sale and my wife still gives me shit about it. I don't know how I could live without it. The idiot trolls are right, you can't eat(sustain yourself with) gold. If you are smart enough to realize what may be coming, you would be foolish not to cover all your bases.
Yes, it is expensive considering what you are getting. Yes, you could do it yourself cheaper. Yes, it would be better to buy bulk food and rotate out. However, I don't want to have to worry about it. It's just a cheap insurance policy. Buy it, stash it in a closet/room you never use, and forget it.
I told my wife I will start eating every bit of it around 10 years out.
If you're interested in cheap insurance, could I interest you in some China Biotics put options?
oh quit yer bitching.....when you add in the hedonics the price drops below 0. now that's what i call a zerohedge....
FX traders check your crosses...something major is up. AUD has been hit all morning, could be nuclear (BIG!) problem
...either that or japan hits it nuclear asset buy up i.e country cound be close to being an insolvent.
Either way they are F******
Yikes down 1 percent. I wonder if the Aussies will revolt like the USA for currency manipulation, o never mind the sheeples are busy with American Idol Crap. Aussies will revolt if the price of Fosters goes up.
"price of Fosters goes up"
hahaha...
No shit. Australians don't drink Foster's.
Hey Tyler;
Well this is cool. Mike Ruppert putting a plug in for ZeroHedge.
9:30 into the talk he quotes ZeroHedge.
"He's doing a great job BTW"
We Have Until July at Latest Even a Caveman Can See It
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0r_NP7Yv_4
Listen to his justification about Corporate Earnings next quarter.
Crossing the Rubicon Bitchez!
About two months ago I began to notice some of the talking heads on CNBC and some politicians on TV being interviewed were pronouncing Bernanke's name Ber nank like the Silver Bears, which could not properly pronounce Bernankeeee because of the computer program. I think a lot of people are coming to ZH for the real info and serious analysis of financial data.
And for the food storage reviews.
Oh God I would love to see a clip of that.
Different foods have different shelf lives and different nutritional value. Buying a Costco kit marketed by some marketing marketer whose greatest satisfaction is an optimal price point does not a survivalist make, nor a real inflationary burden measure. I shop at Costco for some things, I took a look at the kit sometime around the original ZH post, and I did not buy it. I don't dispute the 47% inflation figure - I'm just saying that this is a survival kit that impulsive people might purchase as a put option on the future temporary availability of food, not for those whom everyday self-reliance for food collection/preparation is a primary concern, who routinely match the quantity of their food stores to their local availability, nutritional value, shelf life, and proportion of their primary diet, with the goal of surviving whatever food shortages might come.
Truth.
Store what you eat
and eat what you store.
Just get a 12-month supply, and keep rotating it into your diet, and replacing it regularly.
Must.Hoard.More.
The biggest problem for me is trying to answer these two questions 1. given where I live what do I need to survive a reasonable time, and where can I safely keep it. I used to think that a superior emergency kit was a 45 and a few clips, but if no one else prepared properly there would be nothing to take, except the women :) No really, if I move I have lug all that crap with me, it takes away some funds from PM investment, and if there is massive earthquake my crib may burn down, crush or damage most of my supplies. If I am ordered to evacuate to a FEMA camp, what good does the stuff do for me then? Do Store enough water to drink for a year, get a First Need XL water purifier, or the First Need base camp model and all that water. This whole prep thing is taking a lot of work and I am the only one I know that is doing it.
Just think, if you have the only supply of chocolate when the SHTF, you won't need to take the women. They will come to you. LOL
I'd suggest that if they come to "order" you to go to a FEMA camp that .45 will immediately come in handy. . .
Until 4 reactors melted down in a week, the atheist Armageddon scenario was a distant second to the financial meltdown scenario. If the religious Armageddon scenario comes to pass, then all the stockpiles and preparations are irrelevant unless one worships Ra or some similar deity. The financial meltdown scenario is still the most likely, and there are plenty of templates in recent history, just not in such large, economically sophisticated, and interdependent societies.
If the situation deteriorates to the point that you have to evacuate an urban center (which are the most dependent on a functioning financial market), so be it, life isn't always easy.
If you want to know how prepared you are (structurally and mentally) for the first stages of urban breakdown- take a week off, flip the main on the fuse box off, turn off the water & gas mains, unplug the phone, hide the credit card and car keys, and enjoy the week long vacation. On the bright side, recent economic breakdowns are progressive, so if you can make it without electricity, gas and water you are in better shape than most.
I have a sense of humor about this and all, but goddam I hope this isn't just a marketing ploy.
Those of us who have been this crazy for more than a year or two know how/where to do much better than this.
Is this the commodization of batshit-crazy apocalyptic preparations? Yuppies in Park Slope and the Hamptons jumping on the freeze-dried nutrient-drum bandwagon?
Aw, shit.
Some stuff (some grains) can last a very long time in nitrogen. But. Freeze dried food has zilch nutrional value. It really is close to worthless. I participated in a study where I ate freeze dried and concentrated food for 60+ days; and even though I took a big megavitamin every day the blood tests showed my vitamin and mineral levels falling constantly during the whole 60 days. If you think you will survive on freeze dried for a year you are wrong -- you would starve to death with a full belly.
Learn to distill. Demand in good times and hard.
Instructions please!
Edit: My grandfather was involved in some Boston/Nova Scotia trade but I never learnt the details.
?
Arkadaba asks -
Instructions please!
GOOGLE!!! Real easy to make wine.
Also, those of us on prescription meds be sure to ask your doc for large 'scrips.
Read on survivalblog.com to use fish antibiotics if needed/no choice.Get at pet stores.
Someone else may have posted this but hey - it's the end of the world and I feel fine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2UhvN0k74w
Older song from a band that is sometimes inspirational. Edit: Not the end of the world - yet.
The cosmic joke of it all is when the shit hits the fan you won't want to be alive. Sure, the finely developed urge to survive at any cost that all living organisms possess will exist, but the reality will be so awful that death will look like the rational option. Some know this. You know who knows this. You lament about their sociopathic tendencies toward aravice and gluttony on a near daily basis. When the SHTF and you find yourself living in a bunker, surviving on pablum, and fending off organized groups of thugs while using precious metals to as a means of transaction for the daughters of those in similar situation; always remember that the individuals who caused your circumstances lived for the day, treated it all as a fleeting game, and are laughing at your struggles post-humously.
And if you are care at all for some others, be it family or friends, you will protect them at all costs.
I don't know what's funnier. That sociopath's can maintain glib superficial responses for an entire 5250 year cycle or that when they are confronted with the ultimate meaning of the end of the 5250 year cycle they can no longer maintain it because their glibness has made it that much easier to respond appropriately.
Keep an eye out for this peculiarity. It will be manifesting itself strongly. Especially watch mathman has silver becomes a completely predictable yet entirely unstoppable force running him over like a train running over an insignficant pebble on the track.
The depressing thing here is that you're absolutely right.
When the shit hits the fan, the people who are actually setup to survive will be BEGGING for a military take over and for a bunch of gas chambers to get rid of the people who didn't plan for it, and are using any means at all to survive it.
That's the reality folks. You're going to welcome a dictatorship because like it or not, there's a lot of idiot narcissistic morons who will happily kill you for the fun of it, because what the hell? They can get away with it. The horrible reality is that all the stands between society and a bunch of people murdering, raping, and burning down whatever they can is just the government - not their morality. Only consequences.
A lot of atheist make fun of religion, and I am an atheist - but I know that it serves a function in any stable society. The boogeyman in the sky has been replaced by the government, and without the government there are no consequences for a lot of people today.
oops - double post.
I really don't understand some the post apocalyptic sentiments that people have. The PTB want everyone to distrust each other. They want everyone to think it's dog eat dog. Then everyone will rip each other apart effectively doing the dirty work for them.
There is enough junk in the landfills of this country to rebuild it 5 times over. I don't think everyone in America are going to forget how to generate electricity or start a fire. There are probably enough vitamin supplements alone to keep evey man woman and child alive for atleast a year.
WTF happened to common sense?
While I appreciate the general sentiment, 'cause this is all in good fun, if you're at all serious you need to re-assess that whole "common sense" concept.
*Most* folks can't build a fire. Give it to the 50% or so who grew up rural, camping, or Boy Scouts. *Most* folks can't generate electricity. Give it to about 15% or so who understand how electric motors work.
Vitamins have no calories. Unless you're tremendously obese *and* have access to the amino acids, it doesn't matter one lick that you live next to a Vitamin Shoppe.
Overall, though, I agree with you about the tone of these threads. They do tend to be a bit over-the-top.
There is something else that these sofa cowboys can't do: kill somebody with those guns they practice with at the range and show off to their friends. For the most part, there are very few of the citizenry who have had any military training at all. I mean some training in pure, simple discipline. Most are soft and incompetent. Watch any typical TV commercial and you'll see them typified as an average American. Dumber than a box o' rocks.
Krav Magna takes care of that.
No doubt, Rocky.
Personally, I'm a strong advocate of understanding your limits. I suspect that for me to kill someone, he (or she, I ain't sexist) is going to have to deserve it.
So if it comes down to two good people, of whom I'm one, trying not to starve on the life-raft, I'd tend to give odds to the other guy.
OTOH...
I've already been through seeing the great white light. I know full-well that as soon as I'm convinced someone needs killin', he's one dead motherfucker. Or I am, 'cause he was better.
So there's a bit of balance involved in all that. We all do what we can.
I'd only consider myself incompetent and soft if I broke down and took a government job to be a goon for the government and living off from tax payers who actually do work, then paradixically calling myself hard as nails for giving up all my rights just so I can have a job, perhaps killing off some brown skinned people who supposedly had a dictator that was going to make a nuclear weapon or was working with Al Qaeda - and wasn't.
I agree the sofa cowboys over estimate their capabilities, but I think their numbers might be dwarfed by the ostriches (head-in-the-sand), those who have served (with at least the muscle memory of discipline), and them ignorant rednecks beyond the 'burbs.
I find that my response to hostile engagement tends to be reflexive (more skillful as a result of training, but the same underlying response as in a bar fight when young), whereas when hunting (which relies on exactly the same muscle-memory of trigger pull and calculation of shot placement), I sometimes have to overcome the inertia of introspection.
The total urban population in the US enjoys a 3 or 4 to 1 numerical advantage to the rural. In the event of a breakdown, since urban infighting and dependence on external supply will reduce the advantage, and because exodus would occur over time, there may be no numerical advantage.
Victory always requires casualties, both intended and unintended, but in the end, good people will find good people. I think the biggest challenge for the sofa cowboys may be shedding their potentially fatal notion of "I want..." or "I have a right to..."
Common sense is still there. Happened to catch a radio interview with the following on her no energy fridge and it blew me away. Lots of innovation in the world but we need to share it:
http://inhabitat.com/solar-powered-fridge-by-emily-cummins/
Amazing, TD....in a horrific way. In fact, I did take advantage of that offer last summer. Twice. Thought it would be good to supplement our stores. We've tried some of the TVP mixed in with macaroni, dried cheese (a seperate purchase) and reconstituted broccoli, it's really quite tasty.
Costco has a pretty good deal on their case of hard winter wheat, price is fair (was fair?) and it's already vac-packed in #10 cans.
Found a lot of USA grown beans at Honeyville.com, and a good price for a 50lb. bag of wheat farina (cream of wheat) there too.
I think you could put something far superior together yourself for the same money, or less. If it comes down to not being able to go outside long enough to tend a small garden, for fresh greens, and you have to live on TVP, then you might as well just off yourself.
Speak for yourself. You might as well off yourself if the going gets tough.
Me? I plan to hang around and be a mid level manor lord in the new feudalism, and expand my harem.
Interesting anecdote, but more likely this is chalked up to accelerating demand and fabrication not keeping pace (remember silver bars).
A good example are geiger counters. You could buy a civil defense geiger counter for about $50 last year. Now they are going for $250-300 on ebay.
Do people even remember that christchurch new zealand was completely flattened just a couple months ago.
The beauty of freeze dried food is that it doesn't taste any worse when it's flattened.
Jesus,... Tyler, if things got so bad that you'd need a years worth of food it would be because an asteroid had hit the earth and created a post impact nuclear winter like the one 10,000 years ago, and if that's the case all the food isn't going to do you any good unless your either way underground in a sub-terrainian cavern or along the sea coast where the mass of the ocean provides sufficient heat to survive. Short of that, as long as you live in a relatively rural area but large enough to resist marauders the stash your talking about would be a back-up which I think one could assemble within a short period of time once it is clear that the shit is going to hit the fan.
I don't know what it is with you Americans.. you're all or nothing with these apocalypse narratives. They are really just secular versions of biblical apocalypse and rapture fantasies.
A long slow decline with various regional hotspots is the more likely scenario. That doesn't put asses in seats at the theater though, so instead we get 2012 and Armageddon.
The word "Rapture" is not mentioned once in the Bible.
Read Ferfal's blog: http://ferfal.blogspot.com/
Better yet buy his book and read it too. He went through the recent economic collapse in Argentina. He's been there. The number one thing, which he cannot stress enough, is the need to stockpile food. He recommends enough for 1 year and, if you can afford it, says you should have 2 years worth. Check out that blog its insanely full of info based on reality.
Already stocked and ready to go, not from Cosco either.
Growing Crops as I type this as well. I am getting ready to ship in a few greenhouses to give us a chance at winter crops as well.
Has anyone noticed the avalanche of Grow your own foods Hype marketing going the rounds on Satellite lately?
Went to Wendy's today, and of course it is another fast food chain that has raised prices.
Well if anyone remembers, they had a 99 cent 1/4lb double cheeseburger. Well first they raised it to 1.19, then 1.49. But then they decided to make it smaller, I don't remember when, I usually don't get Wendy's, so I'll say they made it smaller ~1 year ago. Since then they raised the price to 1.09, and today the same small ass 'where's the beef' hamburger is 1.49...woo hoo. Which, is ~2x as expensive as the original 1/4 double stack (volume reduction and price hike) as the old double stack cost ~ a couple of years ago.
No worries, I didn't throw it back through the drive thru window, or get holed up in a hotel room with any of Sheriff Joe's boys outside.
So in the past few weeks, there's been prices increases (and/or stealth inflation through size reductions) that I've personally seen at the fast food restaurants I visit at...
Wendy's (obvious)
Burger King
Carl's Jr.
Arby's
Pizza Hut
Papa Johns
Jack in the Crack
...and lately I haven't been going to as many different places overall or else the list I'm sure would be longer. Hell the only ones that I have visited recently that hasn't raised prices are one of the quadrillion burrito places around here. But seeing the mexican food inflation, it shouldn't be far off. Ahh wait, Pete's Fish N Chips seemed the same as well.
Haven't visited recently
Taco Bell, Whataburger, Dominoes, Peter Piper Pizza, McDonalds, In-n-out, Chick-Fil-A, Sbarro's, Panda Express, Subway, KFC, Church's, El Pollo Loco, Chipotle, and many others.
This is just a small smattering of the phx metro area. So not NY extra, nor as a right-to-not-work state.....none of this can be blamed on unions, fwiw.
Address addictive foods while rationing, and eat for total physiology while eating much less.
Check waisays.com
Address addictive foods while rationing, and eat for total physiology while eating less.
Check waisays.com
Can't be so...
That smelly carcus of a cunt,Janet Yellen said inflation aint so bad......
She would not lie.....Right...???
Are we all crying now? It costs considerably less, out of pocket, to grown your own vegetables and fruits and learn to hunt/trap meat than it does to suffer this moronic deluge of offers for "disaster supplies," though I'll admit that one might actually have to learn something outside of how to add boiled water to a package of powder.
Yuk - I hate boiled powder. LMFAO
Dude - I don't believe you've ever had a garden in your life.
Yeah,it might be cheaper, but a garden doesn't grow itself. You have to weed it, you have to water it, you have to tend it. Pulling potatoes out of the ground isn't fun either in October.
Plus, it really helps to have land, don't forget canning for presevation, or packing vegetables in sawdust in a root cellar. I've done all that crap. For $700, I'd be happy to buy survival rations if I was really worried about it than to spend a few hours a day being eaten alive by mosquitos as I weed the damned garden, or have to spend 6 hours in a hot kitchen boiling canning jars and packing cucumbers with vinegar, salt, and garlic - or making freaking jam and jelly.
Everybody seems to think farming is some idyllic life - well there is a reason people left farming in DROVES to work on white collar professional jobs, or even blue collar jobs - farming is hard. If you're a large farmer today you have to hedge your production in the futures market, you have to juggle loans, and you can make a million dollars one year and lose 2 million the next. You always need to have cash on hand, and at the end of the day, the bank might just foreclose because a blight killed off your entire wheat crop your cows got foot and mouth disease. It's a hard job. You work from sun up to sun down, and if you don't have the physical ability and the stamina and the downright freaking work ethic - you'll never come close to making it.
Plus you have to be incredibly smart to be a long term successful farmer. Dealing with complex living organisms and.optimizing growth and capital efficiency requires more intelligence.than most people have.
Plus you better understand finance and derivative.contracts.
Gardening and farming are two different things. If you've 'done all that crap' and figure that spending $700 on some freezed-dried canned goods is going to be better for you nutritionally than having fresh-grown foods, that the exercise derived from adding water to a can compares to spending several hours a week working outside, and that people left farming because it was hard and not that there just lots of new 'shiny' baubles to be had when you could earn a faster buck elsewhere, then you're the epitomy of what is f'd up in this country. Boo f'in hoo, you had to work to feed yourself. Plenty of people produce food on standard city lots and in backyards, without acres and acres of land, tractors, hours in mosquito infested environs, or buried up to their elbows in canned cucumbers. You're whining because you can't think outside the box? Or is it Xbox? People in this and other countries still grow their own foods because it's cheaper, more reliable, better for them, and if they didn't they'd be some worthless form of non-producing meat popsicle who wants it delivered in a sterile can so they add some water and microwave it and not miss AI. Problem is for you is that if someone doesn't produce it, you have nothing to put in your #10 can. You think endless mono-cropping by giant Ag businesses with tons of energy inputs is going to produce the same yields year after year at the same costs? The gist of this article is that food prices are going up. How much longer can you afford your shiny new can? Farming would probably look very different today without gov't intervention in markets, gov't subsidies, and lobbying by corporate Ag that put the likes of Monsanto at the top of the food chain and your health and well-being at the bottom. Gotta like a gov't that is willing to regulate the small producers the same or worse as the big one corporations so competition, if there exists such a thing anymore, is next to impossible and forces the small producers out of business by sheer weight of paperwork/fees alone, limiting your choices of what to eat and how much you pay. At some point you're going to figure out that putting a $1 packet of seeds into the ground/bucket IS a whole lot better than trying to afford the resultant output at the grocer for $4 a pound. Sure it takes some effort, maybe a lot less if you use your brain and read up on techniques that people used for centuries to grow foods without tons of added water and fertilizers, add some modern-day knowledge and some wizz-bang technology and you actually need to spend relatively little time in your garden. Note on potatoes; cut the bottom off a 5 gal. bucket or storage container, dig a hole a few inches deep, insert container, fill with dirt, plant potatoes. When ready to harvest, lift container, potatoes fall on ground, geez that was hard...30 minutes a bucket, 2 crops a year...
Look, I'm not going to argue this with you.
You have no idea how much you have to farm to make enough food to live one year. You have no clue. You think spending 400 hours gardening to save $700 is a useful use of your time? Fine - believe what you like. I know you have no idea how much work it is. I can tell by what you write.
There is a reason we've become interdependent on one another, and it's not because the government has forced us to do it. It's like this because we have cheap energy, increased productivity as a result of it, and because you can't compete against machinery and you wouldn't want to anyhow. Now if you're forced to garden, you're in a for a big surprise on how much you're going to have to do, just to live.
You think a few rows of corn is going to help you, or a couple tomato plants. It takes about an 1/2 an acre per human being to subsistance farm. That's 2000 square meters. 44 by 44 meters. You farm that smartass, see how it's just a little bit of labor. You do without a horse, or an ox, you till it yourself. Remember, gasoline isn't around. You run out at night, and cover the green shoots that are about to die because of a late frost. Cover all 2000 square meters, or stay up all night pumping water to keep the vegetables warm by spraying them with water.
You got NO CLUE city boy. A freaking lot in the city - you have no idea.
A couple of morons doing some agriculture for fun, to can zuchinni (which by god, that's a weed) to get fresh vegetables at the end of the year is not the same as living off from the food you produce. Farming is only 25% of it too. Preservation is a total bitch. I bet you don't even have the first clue how you preserve vegetables without a fridge - which you won't have of course, and even if you did, that only extends shelf life for about maybe 3 months.
If the shit really hits the fan, you're going to want to be dead. You'll be BEGGING for a dictatorship to restore order. That's what it will really be like. This isn't the 1920s where farmers still used animals to plow, and where everybody lived, at worst, a hundred miles from any farm.
In a real collapse here, there will be food, it will just be expensive.
Oops, forgot you have a huge brain and a magic crystal ball so you know everything about me. Well, you don't, not by a long shot. I grew up in the country, spent summers gardening AND farming, real farms. I live in the country again, I produce several hundred pounds of berries, fruit, vegetables, etc. a year and eat it every day. 400 hours? You pull that out of your ass? Remove your head while you're at it. You're stuck in the paradigm of 'conventional agriculture' and can't wrap your small mind around the possibility that people have and do exist without your vision of food production. Talk about useless f'in comments you shitless Wonder Troll, go pawn your crap for marbles, you've obviously lost some. And no, in a real collapse, there will be plenty of refrigerators and no food to go in them, no matter how many FRN's you have or is reading the current news too tough for you?
While you're outside, breaking a productive sweat, those with food storage will be able to pursue other endeavors. They realized the value of time and how cheap it is to store caloric energy these days. Only $999!! many will marvel someday. They can still have their small garden, their goats, and their reading time. They won't be dead tired from weeding. It's about calories and free time. Their #10 cans won't last forever, but their higher-value sweat will enable them to purchase yours.
Wow, another one...who'd a thought? "It's about calories and free time." "Higher value sweat" WTF? Apparently not many people know about permaculture; there really isn't a lot of sweat involved, plant stuff, it grows, you eat off it, year after year after year. What makes you think I'm running a commercial farm operation? I have a small garden, I have a food forest, solar, pumped water, generator(s), etc. My time outside in the garden is minimal; I put up seedlings twice a year, drop them in the ground, and harvest. I grow year round so the only preserving I do is freezing or drying; drop it in a slicer, throw it on a sheet, drop it in a ziploc. I buy calories in bulk products far under what FD costs(you do realize how expensive and specialized that equipment is even before you add the consumables and raw materials?) per calorie. What your $999 special does is increase the cost of those calories and give someone a false sense of security. I guarantee the putz's who throw gobs of money at this 'one size fits all' fix will likely not have a garden, goats, and will be watching AI before they ever open a f'in book; I know people like this personally. One I know doesn't even have water storage to use with his FD food. And ctually I'll be boning up on my trades, skills, and target shooting and increasing my data stores(over a TB of AT files, videos, PDF's on all manner of survival, training, and farming info with a spare laptop in a Faraday box). When the hungry people start showing up with their 'higher value sweat' money it better be PM's or they ain't buying bupkis and if they don't like it then they better have transferred Xbox skills to real guns because they won't be taking them either. What a bunch of couch cowboys. Do you actually read your shit before you type it?
Right here:
So you admit permaculture won't provide all your calories. And it looks like we agree that most people won't last long without other preps. Other than your insults I think we'd get along pretty well.
Best.
I'm selling a few rolls of silver. Need more ballistic wampum.
Rumor on the survival blogs is that government has contracted.for huge amounts and most current production is going to fill those contracts. What is left is being bid up.
Peter Schiff 4/11/11
http://youtu.be/99w1mpoJ8dk
The hosts just laugh at him... sad!
We're going into a Depression. Be careful folks!
Look, if you want food that will last forever:
http://www.andysmarket.com/sunshop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=4054
It's TVP - a meat substitute. 25 lbs - that will last you forever. TVP has to be reconstituted, 25 lbs of TVP dry is like 100 lbs of meat. Get some vitamins too, any multipurpose will do.
And no, I don't work for Andy's market, but I have bought stuff there - and trust me 25 lbs of TVP is a lot of food.
the best part about freeze dried and the radiation we're getting latley, is that you dont have to boil the water for it to cook
Oh please go on - there can never be too many stupid flippant remarks here.
Ever!
I'm serious!!!!
Actually, truthfully - just shut up.
What is NOT mentioned in this article is that there is an industry-wide SHORTAGE of this type of food storage.
I was with a friend last week who stopped by the largest US retailer of food storage while I was with him. Their store was almost empty. The store clerk who helped my friend told me that their supplier is so backlogged with orders that they won't even receive another shipment of product until SEPTEMBER! There were huge areas of the store that were virtually empty!
In other words, it is probably already too late to acquire food rations because the demand is so high and the delays are so long to acquire it.
Ferfal wrote that just having a fruit tree put you way ahead during the first six months of the economic collapse in argentina.
Plant fruits that will grow in your area without sprays and with minimal labor.
In zone seven A in.arkansas i have carlos and noble muscadine and cynthiana grape nicely pruned on my pool fence.
Four paw paws growing in part shade
Montmorency cherries and bluberries in the front.
Evergreen sunshine blue and various rabbiteye make a nice contrast to open pruned cherry and grow underneath it. The red cherry and blue blueberries make a beautiful front yard landscape.
In my area this low maintenance landscape takes me ten hours of work per year
Also the true survivalst will have a korean tea camella that is good up to zone six b and yaupon holly for caffeine supplies.
Dwarf yaupon hollies interspersed with blueberries looks nice.
Day lillies and tiger lillies have many edible parts. I have a.survivalist landscape that is fashionable and trendy landscaping without appearing paranoid to my neighbors.
Permaculture much? Have to agree, it's amazing that 99% of lawns are sterilized wastelands that take ridiculous amounts of inputs(water, gas for mowing, fertilizers, pesticides, etc.) to be 'green' and they don't even provide food for bugs. Putting in fruit producing bushes and trees is more expensive initially in most cases but actually pays you back over time. Bill Mollison did a series called Global Gardener years ago and one video showed how a community in CA planted all the common areas in fruit and nut trees and basically it was a food plot for everyone. I put every type of plant with a food production output or medicinal use in the ground here and wait to see what takes off. Put 40lbs of blueberries in the freezer last year and this year's crop is coming in just fine. Saw a 3lb. bag of frozen ones at the store the other day and it was $14.99 on sale. I have them in yogurt, smoothies, and pies year 'round and you clip them once a year and I mulch them with pine bark grown on-site and citrus leavings(citric acid) and that's about it. Can't even list all the things I have in the ground now...
end of the world
end of me†
I went to Costco and bought a years supply of food. That's a lot of pop tarts!
Actually, bought a lot of staples, and did cost just about $600. Been adding other items in bulk when they go on sale. I prefer to shop that way anyway, rather than once per week.
The costco kit would be for people who don't have the time or inclination to assemble those items. Looked at that way, an expensive convenience.
Have any of you lived on this kind of thing? Freeze-dried food is far too expensive for most folks for extended periods. Pretty tasty, but with a sameness and one will want to add some kind of fats to the regimin, as they don't freeze-dry well, and some spices or fresh veggies and pasta or ramen dishes to make it go further. Laugh at such helpful suggestions as "Serves 4", maybe four hungry chipmunks.
Inadequate re-hydration will cause serious intestinal, ah, distress. Virtually all the meals will benefit from an hour or so soaking or even overnight in some cases. Military rations are another useful adjunct. They too had problems. Early MRE rations, certain meals were marked "Not For Pre-Flight/Inflight Use", that is the meals containing beans. Rapid changes in altitude, etc. In recent years military meals have improved, but they are still only intended for short term use. The number of calories required under heavy exertion is extreme, and one will lose weight quickly. Members of the Lewis and Clark expedition were eating 20 lbs of lean elk or deer and still hungry. They were at times reduced to a little flour, some berries, and boiled game meat. What they needed were fats, which makes for gravies and allows frying and calories to weather the cold. We later hikers don't boil boots and eat our dogs and horses but find about ten days is the longest one can be out hiking and subsist without resupply or caches. Long distance hikers supplement with lots of Ramen and Oatmeal, Pasta, etc. My hiking favories were pilot bread, pepperoni, cheese, coffee, chocolate, hard candies, kipper snacks, jerky, raisins, peanuts, etc. Freeze-dried is good to have, but is not good for those on a budget.
I was fortunate enough to decide to visit my relatives in rural Serbia in October once. I happened to be there during brandy distilling time. Our neighbor across the road is one of three still owners in the village (a village of 200-300 people supports three distillers), so I tagged along with him as he went from farm to farm distilling for people (he takes a cut of the end product, which he then sells, plus they supply the firewood for the still, and feed him, what a life!). When I told people, as we sat around the gleaming copper still, drinking last year's plum brandy and eating smoked pork, that what we were doing was a felony in the US, they could hardly believe it...
Order from these guys instead: http://survivalacres.com/
You'll have to wait 8 weeks for delivery (due to high demand), but they have an honest serving size and are reputable.You won't starve with these food plans so you can take care of your family rather than ending being one of the rioting rubes who are hauled off to FEMA camps.
High demand may be due to big govumint order for 140m servings. Seems they're worried about a disaster in the New Madrid fault area.
FEMA RFI: https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&id=eaea338540a0aea155a...
FEMA camps: http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/54475.html