This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Europe Imploding (Again): Greek Two-Year Note Yield Surges 213 Bps to Record 35.19%, More Italy Stock Suspensions

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It's getting very scary out there. First there has been an unsubstantiated rumor that Spanish PM has resigned based on an El Pais editorial, and then we have the fact that Greek 2 year bonds have just collapsed by another 2% to an all time record 35.19%. The cherry on top are reports that Intesa Sanpaolo and some other volatile bank shares are suspended after continuing their last week plunge. One day soon the entire European stock market will just shut down and not reopen (which will naturally simply be an excuse for the US HFT lobby, which now feels unfairly attacked for being a malicious parasite, to levitate the Russell 2000 to unseen levels).

As usual, this is worth a thousand words:

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:30 | 1466162 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

How many times is Europe gonna implode? You'd think after two world wars they'd have their technique down pat.

Send in the clowns.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:34 | 1466189 trav7777
trav7777's picture

Too bad we don't have Yahooligans around to crow about their fat 35% coupon LOL.  Those were the days, when shit like WM was imploding and the bagholders were bragging on the huge dividend ROTFL

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:41 | 1466213 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

Momofade likes to brag about his blue chip divvies.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:26 | 1466454 trav7777
trav7777's picture

if you're in equities, you really ought to be defensive like that.  Coca cola will do well in a contraction climate as will MO and plenty of others.  Companies can't fake dividends.  Nothing wrong with low beta either, and non-growth stocks.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:55 | 1466270 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

Hi CD,

I've lived in/around Brussels since 1997. They do have their technique down pat; this is it.

The Europeans believe that an institutional arrangement will save them. Just as they believed that the League of Nations and punishing Germany after WW1 would solve things (JM Keynes' warnings notwithstanding), so they believe now that the mere existence of the EU and eurozone will prevent new conflict.

In fact, these institutions seem to be doing all they can to hasten their own demise. After all, it stands to reason that if they know how to solve the problem now, they would have known how to prevent it in the first place.

The bad part is that the Europeans I talk to almost all believe the big-government myth. They say "but there hasn't been a war since the EU was founded".

Personally, I suspect that the 100K US troops in Germany is much more the reason for the long peace, and may be Europe's only hope to avoid violent implosion.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:00 | 1466286 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

The key is keep the Germans employed. You don't want them unemployed and drunk. All the others will cannibalize themselves.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:07 | 1466327 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Banzai7

Your comment and Gold taking off are oddly connected. Did you buy a gold nugget in HK just now?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:14 | 1466373 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Gold was jealous that silver and platinum were having all the fun today.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:10 | 1466657 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

The Key is to liquidate France. Period.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:21 | 1467225 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 Probably not politically correct, (weak joke), but I wish I could un-junk you. Your post makes perfect sense to me.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:03 | 1466302 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Who do you think payed for those troops Goldbricker ?

Tue, 07/19/2011 - 05:35 | 1469406 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

Actually Dork, I don't know. I suppose the Germans. With a reserve currency, it's an open question who pays America's bills.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:04 | 1466305 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

I'm smart enough to know that when I don't know something I should refrain from publicly discussing the subject that I don't know about. It's still OK to make an ass of myself in front of my wife and adult kids however. At least they understand and make allowances.

So I watch what's happening in Europe with puzzled looks and genuine befuddlement that the citizens of each country would allow themselves to walk so far out on the ship's gang plank. Then I look around me here in America and I instantly understand why. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:00 | 1466611 Crisismode
Crisismode's picture

In talking with the general public, friends, relatives, etc., it still is absolutely stunning to me on a daily basis how utterly and completely clueless the American people are about what is going on around them. The ship is sinking, but the band plays on, the guests continue dancing, and although there are plenty of lifeboats, only a few are being launched because everybody else thinks we've just "hit a bad patch" and before long things will be right back to "normal."

 

Simply amazing.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:47 | 1466805 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Our President and CNBC call it a "Soft" Patch...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:51 | 1466822 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

More like flaccid penis. Or castrated.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 17:12 | 1467992 NumNutt
NumNutt's picture

I have noticed the same thing, except I don't think they are clueless, more like not willing to except reality. Kind of like being at a party and hearing rumors that the beer keg has gone dry. No one wants to admit that the party is over, but deep down everyone understands the situation.

Tue, 07/19/2011 - 00:54 | 1469224 old naughty
old naughty's picture

and look also in Asia (Japan 'excluded'), without the tinted lens. Would I not befuddled (or fuddle-duddled in P.E.Trudeau's context), although not instantly understood by most, yet.

Oh, I am such a grasshopper.

Thansk for sharing, CogDis.

 

Tue, 07/19/2011 - 00:58 | 1469227 old naughty
old naughty's picture

ignore the grasshopper...Clue-less or not, flaccid penis, that WAS me.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:59 | 1466480 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

punishing Germany after WW1 would solve things (JM Keynes' warnings notwithstanding),

 

Nice story again but only valuable if it stands on facts. The fact is that on paper, the plan was supposed to be punishing. In reality, it was quickly eased up, later abandoned with many work arounds allowing countries like the US to fund largely the German military and eugenistic policies.

Propagandists have grown so imbued with themselves they want to believe themselves able to cover up for anything.

Would have been quite an interesting case if a country crushed by debt and various other constraints had been able to invest heavily in a military.

Alas, the reality is otherwise: the plan to crush Germany under debt was quickly eased and abandoned, to draw the classical scheme.

Very promising story though in these times: consider, it would mean that by crushing people under debt (with effective repayment) they are more and more able to consume. The solution in the solutions.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:14 | 1466675 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

Liar. The Germans were able to escape reparations only by killing their own currency. Quite punishing, actually. Esp. in view of the fact that the Encirclement Powers - France, Britain, Russia, backstopped by Brother Woodrow - forced the World War, not Germany. As usual - as with Round II - the defeated got the blame.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:25 | 1466715 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Huh no. The plan was quickly eased up. By  the 1920s, it was memories.

Not only that, but Germany benefited from the US pressing former allies like UK and France to repay their loans taken during WW1, giving liquidities to the US to be injected in the german economy.

 

No miracle here, Germany followed the normal pattern: building up a military while not being deprived of resources.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 13:51 | 1467080 malek
malek's picture

Pick your facts, and make up for the holes, as it suits you.

The Morgenthau plan was also first imposed in 1945, but eased up within two years into meaninglessness, mostly out of fear of communism spreading.  So?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 15:45 | 1467692 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

What holes?

WW2 was not caused by the reparations. Period. No hole.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 16:03 | 1467765 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

What holes?

WW2 was not caused by the reparations. Period. No hole.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:30 | 1466728 Marx_it_2_market.
Marx_it_2_market.'s picture

You are 100% ignorant of history and its lessons. Yes, the terms of Versailles were intended to crush Germany. War reparations were NOT, as you wrote, "quickly easened [sic] and abandoned."  In fact, British and French troops reoccupied the Ruhr 1923-25 for non-payment, and the Rhineland stayed occupied until June, 1930 or later. Your second factual error is "countries like the US to fund largely the German military and eugenistic [sic] policies." The US was the ONLY country to fund German debt in the 1920's.  More importantly, that aid stopped when the Nazis came into power. Ford and General Motors kept the factories they got in the 1920’s and profited by building trucks and bombers for Nazi Germany, but they did not, as far as I've ever read, do FDI in Germany after 1932. Your most stupid item is to ignore one of the big history lessons of the 20th Century: that trying to destroy the German economy was a mistake because it led inevitably to the Nazi takeover.  Not knowing this makes you a fool who should go troll elsewhere.

Readers of Zero Hedge are more interested in another  thing you don’t know. Nazi Germany rebuild and re-armed using a FIAT CURRENCY that did not depend on outside finance.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:35 | 1466751 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

In fact, British and French troops reoccupied the Ruhr 1923-25 for non-payment,

 

Funny how propagandists these days shoot themselves bullets in the foot.

So the debt was not repaid? When somebody does not repay one's debt, one does not abandon the plan to repay the debt?

Sure, sure. Cheap propaganda.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:02 | 1466629 PY-129-20
PY-129-20's picture

You're right about the 100k troops in Germany - they helped to prevent a war against Soviet Russia. But if you think there might be another war coming from Germany you are dead wrong.

I am grateful about the support Americans showed West Germany. And so are many people I know in this part of our country. East Germans might have a different view and I respect that view. Sure, you will say that we were part of the American Imperialism and bla - yeah, so what? What would've been the other choice? To be an ally of Soviet Russia at the time? Nope, it served us well and it was in our interest - as well as it was in the interest of the US.

But the cold war ended 20 years ago - there is no Soviet Russia anymore, just the oligarch Russia. And we've improved our relationship to Russia (thanks to our East German brethren) - I am glad about that. I was fascinated by the warm welcome I got when I met Russian people - ordinary people, not on trade fair or any other scripted event. Now keep in mind the horrible, horrible crimes some of our soldiers commited there, about the hatred from the NAZI regime towards the Russian people (Untermensch, Lebensraum im Osten). I am glad that things changed - just let us do business - I do not want to interfere in Russian internal affairs - they need to find their own way.

About the 100k troops here in my country:

Most of the people are glad they are here. But more important than the dreams of some girlies to meet an American GI is the fact that most cities depend on the money that is created through the military bases. But is it necessary for the US to have so many bases in Germany or Italy or Japan? No, it's definitely not. Sure, I am not speaking about Ramstein Airbase. But what about all these other bases? You will not hear me complaining about the fact that there are still American soldiers here - I personally know nobody that would complain about this - there might be a small percentage (5 %) that might not be happy about this. But do I think it is healthy for the United States from a fiscal point? No, definitely not. If I would be an American citizen I wouldn't like it.

The image of the US has changed over the past 20 years. Some horrible mistakes were made by some people and some strategic mistakes.

About that big government - you're probably right about that. But I don't like the current EU - still I like the European idea, I like to travel to France without being checked on the border anymore, to travel around Europe without being harassed.

You do not need to fear another war coming from Germany. I guess you don't understand our cultural experience - it was the ultimate defeat (and we deserved (most of) it) - our cities in ruins, our nation divided, families destroyed, manufacturing halted, the economy destroyed, our soldiers kept as POW for over ten years, being hated everywhere around the world for the crimes we had commited in the name of the fascist regime - that's how it felt. We were finished. It was our Stunde Null (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stunde_Null).

No, we don't want to start another war or to be dragged into another war. We think other nations should handle their internal problems by themselve and not with our help.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:12 | 1466670 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

 I guess you don't understand our cultural experience

 

Making money through war for Germans is not only cultural, it is part of the genetics. So is segregationist leaning.

The English are Germans genetically speaking, part of the French are, which makes that a large chunk of the US are also genetically german. And those people will always try to make money through wars because it is part of their genetics. It is not only a cultural problem.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:21 | 1466697 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

OK. You are a Liar...and a moron.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:26 | 1466717 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

If you say so...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 13:51 | 1467059 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

Most the bases that Americans armed forces took over were German Kasernes.  We just fell in on them after the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Army_installations_in_Germany

After the end of the Cold War and with German Reunification, Clinton cashed in on the so-called Peace Dividend by reducing the size of the force in Europe by over half.  That downsizing continues.  Check out the list for the number of facilities Americans have turned back over to the Germans.  

You are right about the economic impact on some small communities.  It was mighty tough on them when we left.  It was tough on the American soldiers too.  Many American Soldiers will tell you that Germany was the best place in the world to be stationed --- better than any post in the USA, that's for sure (imho). Warm people, great food, cold beer and a sense of history, culture, and a desire to preserve it absent in the USA.  

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 15:05 | 1467490 PY-129-20
PY-129-20's picture

You're right and I stand corrected.

Yes, it was a mighty tough. Some of the cities never recovered. They are still in decline. I cannot say a single negative thing about the American soldiers here. As I said many are still glad that they are here. Not just economically. In my region they are not seen as a foreign force, they are seen as an ally and good friend.

Always felt sorry for the young soldiers that had to go to Iraq and other hostile places. They weren't clueless about their missions. Many were well-informed. I've also seen how Germans and Americans work together in hospitals to save the lifes of American soldiers or Americans helping out Germans.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:24 | 1466437 anyways
anyways's picture

instead of implode, one could say: The Incredible Shrinking Europe.

Btw over 200 bps in 2-year-notes Is a price imploding.

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:52 | 1466679 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

I wasn't arguing. Just trying to be a smart ass and miserably (index) failing to boot.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:12 | 1467176 Ying-Yang
Ying-Yang's picture

Implosions like orgasms are better in multiples...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:30 | 1467273 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

What's this? Multiple orgasms?

That's just crazy talk.

Tue, 07/19/2011 - 01:03 | 1469240 old naughty
old naughty's picture

seemed to me like perpetual orgasms for some... Ying, Yang, or both.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:24 | 1467245 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

  35%, eh? Well, well. things are moving right along, here.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:28 | 1466163 oogs66
oogs66's picture

Greece will default by end of summer, or the banks will write-off about 25% of their exposure, basically the same thing, just the spin is different.  The 25% is not random now that we have seen what they stressed Greek debt at in the bank books.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:40 | 1466212 slaughterer
slaughterer's picture

I would say August is the month of the Greece default.  There are still some hopes being pinned to this week's developments.  But after this week's discussions break down, there will be a Greece default event horizon forming. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:46 | 1466237 qussl3
qussl3's picture

PM buying opp coming soon then, if not gold then at least silver.

I hope lol.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:51 | 1466253 CH1
CH1's picture

I think the only substantial buying op is ending now.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:05 | 1466287 fuu
fuu's picture

Uhh you sort of missed the window already. Although at $40.57/oz I suppose we are still 18% off the most recent high.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:08 | 1466334 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Well Im not adding to the shiny here.

Its always the end of the world till the sun rises tmr.

PMs will correct, they could go straight up, but we are on the verge of deflation not inflation.

Till the ECB, BOJ, FED or PBOC ramp up the presses, i'm comfortable waiting.

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:30 | 1466473 trav7777
trav7777's picture

paper doesn't get more worthful in cascading sovereign default situations.

this is like a nightclub fire...you need to be making your way to the exits at the first sign of smoke and not after the stampede begins.  Those deflationists looking for that huge "buying opportunity" for their precious paper notes (backed up by defaulted debt and BK sovereigns) are akin to people saying they'll stay in the nightclub and pick up dropped cellphones and wallets after the panic begins.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:54 | 1466574 qussl3
qussl3's picture

True, but i have enough of a chunk of my net worth in bullion as is, and my fiat isnt USD,EUR, CHF or RMB either and no more than annual expenses plus a bit.

So I'm comfortable waiting, defaults are usually deflationary, though due to the size of this one perhaps they will go nuts and choose to print and hyperinflate rather than be hung now.

We are still a few steps away from truly damaging inflation tho, the wage price spiral only exists now in China, and if it wasnt for them being exporters of deflation for the last 2 decades and a billion strong, i daresay commods would be MUCH lower than where they are now regardless of how much QE is done.

Likewise PMs to a degree.

I see no benefit to chasing prices here, as everyone's hair is on fire, odds are we dig a deeper hole but no societal breakdown, so i wait.

Not anywhere near where TSWHTF so im somewhat sanguine.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:26 | 1467255 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 "On the verge of deflation--" It must be terrible to not even understand the standard definition of what you imagine you're discussing.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:50 | 1466243 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Bah dupe.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:29 | 1466166 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Can someone pass the marshmellows?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:38 | 1466205 old naughty
old naughty's picture

Be patient.

It is 'Coming Soon".

All this is foreplay to get the Aug 2 thing passed.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:30 | 1466172 LaLiLuLeLo
Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:30 | 1466173 Conrad Murray
Conrad Murray's picture

Bear Sterns is fine!

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:32 | 1466181 jtmo3
jtmo3's picture

Yee of little faith. Give them time. They're fixing it up. Nothing that a shitload of printing can't fix. Just ask big Ben.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:32 | 1466183 Arch Duke Ferdinand
Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:00 | 1466285 KlausK
KlausK's picture

Still not funny. Sorry.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:33 | 1466185 Franken_Stein
Franken_Stein's picture

 

Funny how many times Europe , at least according to Tyler, has imploded in the past.

 

I look around myself and see nothing of this alleged implosion.

All the buildings and infrastructure are still standing, people greet me on the street, smiling.

 

Where is the implosion ?

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:35 | 1466191 trav7777
trav7777's picture

thus the genesis of the term "jew confetti"

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:43 | 1466215 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

Wonder what this means, Tyler or anyone else?

 

The number of dollar bills rolling off the great government presses here and in Fort Worth fell to a modern low in the last fiscal year. Production of $5 bills also dropped to the lowest level in 30 years. And for the first time in that period, the Treasury Department did not print any $10 bills.

The meaning seems clear. The future is here. Cash is in decline.

 

A cashless society is the ultimate form of enslavement, IMO. Garage sales, paying 'under the table' or anything of the sort will become impossible. We will be trapped forever in their system

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/07/business/07currency.html

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:45 | 1466230 Conrad Murray
Conrad Murray's picture

Barter, precious metals, bitcoin. There's more than one way to skin a tyrant.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:56 | 1466268 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Revelation 13:17

...so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name.

And that no man might buy or sell - That is, this mighty power would claim jurisdiction over the traffic of the world, and endeavor to make it tributary to its own purposes. Compare Revelation 18:11-13, Revelation 18:17-19. This is represented by saying that no one might "buy or sell" except by its permission; and it is clear that where this power exists of determining who may "buy and sell," there is absolute control over the wealth of the world.

                            -Barnes' Notes on the Bible

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:59 | 1466281 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Okay everyone, nobody eat the brown eucharist...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:17 | 1466397 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Don't join facebook and you should be fine.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:01 | 1466291 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

Incredibly prophetic. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:04 | 1466312 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

racist

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:08 | 1466333 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

You know CM, one of the most powerful trends visible in the US is th epimip/ho trend.

I think sex will become the ultimate trade in America. Sexting, Cams, Grinding, puberty at 7 for girls, 8-9 year old boys shaving....

Everyone, think about that for a minute or three. It's a huge trend. Is it OT? Hardly.

Joke as folks do here about sex, look at the trends.

I think watching Craigslist's devolution to a prostitution board, anyone denying that the trend towards prostitution as a way to get by is exploding, worldwide, but perhaps th emost in the US of A.

ORI

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/07/16/66th-anniversary-of-trinity-and-thoughts/

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:30 | 1466468 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Just talkin' bidnass, ORI, that''s all.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:33 | 1466487 trav7777
trav7777's picture

how dem hoez be comin up wit my moneys when they ain't no paper on the strizneets?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:50 | 1466571 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

You did lose a lot of versitile solutions for modern living.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:52 | 1466578 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

SNAP cards, which are then discounted/laundered through a local restuarant.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:38 | 1466511 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

@ORI

Toss it into the "Cognitive dissonance" (no association to you cd), pile...

"Blissfully Unaware" would be another expression that comes to mind... I told my brother (a few years ago), that instead of ponying up $100+ grand to send his daughter to college [it's not even his daughter - it's his step-daughter] he ought to save his money, buy Au & Ag... Spend $50 on a pole & some dancing lessons...

My suggestions were both ridiculed & frowned upon...

3 years later... & $80 grand in to the experience... The kid is just entering into the senior year... Waitressing at Hooters over the summer... &, um... speaking of "waiting"... wait while I pull up those Au & Ag charts for the past 3 years...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:59 | 1466861 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Interesting anecdotal evidence Francis. Thanks :-)

What I saw happening blew my mind back in 2006.
Now I see stuff on the web and I cannot believe my eyes. Or even out in the real world.
It's happening here in India too. The 9 year olds are going "Dude" this and "dude" that. The eight year old girls are like "whatever". The much touted mobile phone revolution here played it's designed role to a T, got porn to the masses, cheap!

Fascinating.
Long prostitution!
ORI

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:19 | 1467215 greenbear
greenbear's picture

Yes!  People should look into Bitcoin.  TPTB are terrified of a decentralized, potentially anonymous, electronic currency.  It has the potential to allow people to "starve the beast"; exit the system to a greater degree.  Bitcoin can afford the means to get around capital controls. It is the perfect companion currency to PMs.  This genie can't be put back in the bottle.  Bitcoin is an idea whose time has come.  

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/BitcoinChannel?blend=3&ob=5#p/u/12/5pk9J3bqtm8

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:54 | 1466265 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

@baby_BLYTHE

That is a very good observation... I made a few comments directly about that notion on another thread this morning (the $1600 Au one - I'm too lazy to look it up)...

Bottom line... People 'should' be wondering about that...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:02 | 1466296 LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

Transactions in an era of confidence get settled after a period with paper money.

But during high confidence the period is longer and the outstanding balance is allowed to run higher.  This means the paperless society runs smoothly and transcontinental transactions take place instantaneously.

When we switch over to a less confident paper world each and every transaction will need to be followed by cash settlement (real paper on the barrel head).  This makes commerce slow down a great deal.  AND it also makes the amount of paper required INCREASE.

This causes the denominations on the "daily" transaction highest commonly circulated bill to go up.  Because if you need $10 M in Tokyo it is much more effective to print $10k notes rather than $100.

That is why one of the first symptoms that will be seen in the coming hyperinflation (the larger denom bills) takes place not due to price inflation but the lack of confidence in currencies (the core of hyperinflation).  Hyperinflation is a crisis of confidence brought about by confidence inflation (debt/credit) over a given period.

This entire scenario is manipulated so beyond the event horizon that I can't even begin to say what we will go through.

But it is a grand return of the Sun to the Galactic Ecliptic celebration, so it is going to be a long BIG party.  Lots of the red (arterial), blue (venus), and white (semen) flowing.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:33 | 1466486 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

+1,000,000,000,000

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:05 | 1466316 jmcadg
jmcadg's picture

Too busy printing $50000 bills for the oncoming hyperinflation lol

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:18 | 1466401 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

@ baby blythe....try paying for a motel with cash, most will still ask to swipe your card, even if you offer a deposit.  People using cash are being frowned upon, nowadays. 

No, Blythe, i'm not shacking up.  I just prefer not to leave a trail when in travel.  Old predator / prey instinct. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:30 | 1466465 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

The Apple store refuses to accept cash.

I tried to buy as case for my Ipad attempted to pay with cash and the clerk flat out refused.

I told him by law he was forced to accept the payment and he gave me the "well... it's store policy".

The trend is firmly established. We are ever slowly moving to a cashless society. Infact, I bet they attempt to implement it to control the inevitable run on the dollar. It won't work, but it might be one of the steps that is attempted

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:47 | 1466560 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

How about this....

Firefly Money:

http://www.fireflywiki.org/Firefly/FireflyMoney

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:55 | 1466589 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

Yes, cash is the new barbaric relic.  I agree with you, it's not going to work.  Control freaks always lose in the end, because they can't control themselves. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:57 | 1466599 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

You should report Apple to the Attorney General, just to see what their response will be.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:48 | 1466632 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

What is this Attorney General thing you speak of?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:55 | 1466590 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Depends.  If you're booking a room through the owner, then I promise you cash will be more than fine...  If you're booking a room through an employee, then the employer doesn't want them handling cash...  it's that simple.

I promise you, cash for transactions of virtually any sort are not on the decline...  in fact, they're a necessity to getting by as a pleb in today's economy...  given currency devaluation combined with asset depreciation.  Further, given the economic downturn, those participating in cash transactions have more leeway with the prying eyes of taxing authorities given the plausibility of a decline in economic activity on the micro level...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:45 | 1466550 FederalReserveB...
FederalReserveBankofTerror's picture

I refer to this: http://www.zerohedge.com/article/what-american-bank-run-would-look

The sheeple will flock to cash when liquidity is frozen. Deflationary depression, wealth destruction, write-downs, gold deflates with every other rock, then massive inflation and accumulation. FRNs and bartering. When the Fed gets the message that it needs to print more physical FRNs it will be too late. One can only hope that the coming crash will result in the rescission of the Federal Reserve Act and the reclamation of the constitutional right for the United States Treasury to actually print a dollar. It is impractical to think we will conduct commerce with gold on a broad scale. When the seismic shift happens everything goes down and the dollar goes up as physical dollars become scarce.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:06 | 1466644 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

It is impractical to think we will conduct commerce without gold on a broad scale (as evidenced by the last 40 years).

Like before, physical gold does not have to circulate in order to act as a standard of currency valuation. As long as any notes/credits can be exchanged for physical, the note issuers can be held accountable. Nixon broke the final link of accountability between the gold and the dollar, but luckily for him he is safely dead, and does not have to pay the price for his actions. Those of us still living though...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:49 | 1466248 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Trav

As far as I am aware most of the debt is internal so the Eurozone can monetize by introducing raw currency into the medium rather then QE nonsense.

However the euro price of oil will explode.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:08 | 1466338 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

Yup, in the end, oil decides everything.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:56 | 1466594 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Oil and....gold!  And probably silver.  And maybe platinum.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:37 | 1466503 trav7777
trav7777's picture

and?  The point of my statement is that all this paper shit is just so much confetti...it's meaningless.  This is what the bavarian producers were getting at.

The buildings and power plants will still be there and those back in the Weimar era repudiated the authority the jew confetti had over their REAL lives.

Think about the world and the "crisis"....a bunch of paper claims dictating who eats and who starves?  WTF.  Sure the peak oil issue means contraction but the rest of this confetti could vaporize and only those who peddle it would be affected in any material sense.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:27 | 1466720 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

In my cab, no plastic allowed. It's Cash, Grass, Ass, or no ride.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:40 | 1466211 Franken_Stein
Franken_Stein's picture

 

That's because Tyler lives in America, has never had to experience a war, where the whole country is reduced to rubble, where people have their faces shot off, their intestines scattered on the street, a small piece of coal that once was a human being lying in a corner.

 

That is an implosion !

But not some fake stock market.

 

It's only numbers, man-made numbers, totally virtual and therefore meaningless.

It can be declared zero at any time, arbitrarily.

It only exists in the minds of people.

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:44 | 1466222 Internet Tough Guy
Internet Tough Guy's picture

The Weimar hyperinflation led to Hitler, led to WWII. Wealth destruction was not all in their heads.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:52 | 1466258 Ethics Gradient
Ethics Gradient's picture

And the big bang led to Godwin's law.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:27 | 1466453 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

The wealth destruction was already embedded into the system after the human loses of WW1 - the allies decided to send the Bill to Germany and Germany quite rightly hyper inflated.

But I think Euro debt is internal (so it can create new currency without hyperinflation although high inflation is inevitable)

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:01 | 1466620 trav7777
trav7777's picture

read Mein Kampf and you will see that Hitler had a lot of bees in his bonnet.  There was an immense amount of social corruption in those days and the confettiers ended up controlling almost the entire nation after they bankrupted it.

Their cousins in the banking system assisted them in acquiring physical ownership of a whole nation.  At that point, the masses of Germans were dispossessed of their own homeland by self-proclaimed outsiders.  How can that NOT lead to war?  I mean hell, one of the reps at Versailles for the US was Paul Warburg and his BROTHER was a representative for the Germans.  It should be unsurprising what transpired as a result of the collaboration of relatives and cousins who regard themselves as their own nation.  Neither side in those negotiations had any allegiance to the country they lived in.  They had allegiance to their ethnic clan and their relatives.

The Weimar hyperinflation was VERY good to certain people and horrible to a lot of others.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 18:41 | 1468243 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

2+ unjunks for Trav....insightful, as usual. Tribals rage.....

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:55 | 1466247 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

I'm wondering... just wondering - this is only a 'theoretical' argument -  what 'fate' would be more devastating in the mind of a Rothschilds, Blankfein, or dimon?...

a) Suffering a TOTAL loss of their wealth (forcing them into a job on the Mcdonalds assembly line)

b) suffering an atrocity such as a Nazi Germany concentration camp

---

Junk away at your leisure, but also understand that I'm narrowing down that theoretical reasoning to a "clustered few" at the top of the pyramid...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:59 | 1466283 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

Do a web search for the title

"Occult Technology of Power"

and there your questions may become answers.

Good reading.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:11 | 1466356 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

I imagine there is a similiar effect at the outset.

Total loss of dignity.

I still think the best punishment for Madoff would have been to let him live on the outside. Subsidized housing in NYC (where all his former rich pals live and play). And make him work at a minimum wage job for the next 50 years.

I imagine you analogy would work better if b) was say being moved from a penthouse on 5th to the Warsaw Ghetto.

I think the horrors of a place like Auschwitz, can't really be properly imagined and thus makes for a poor analogy. Just my opinion.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:25 | 1466438 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

@lizzy

I agree with you 100%... Your 'Madoff' scenario is a much better one...

Truthfully... I struggled even posting that (using a concentration camp reference - which is utterly inhuman), but I couldn't think of anything else that had the same power of impact...

In the end... I just wanted to pose a theoretical argument (and I'm sorry for having to use a crass analogy)... I'm more interested in 'truth' than 'feelings' sometimes...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:38 | 1466509 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

No worries.

I actually got the spirit of the theoretical argument you intended.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:44 | 1466544 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

grateful for that, I am (says Yoda)

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:22 | 1466424 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

@ francis.  Remember the old Jack Benny line?  Your money or your life?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:50 | 1466251 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

Tyler currently lives in America.

You should never assume the personal history of anyone. Because often you will be WRONG.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:05 | 1466313 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

Tyler currently lives in America.

You should never assume the personal history of anyone. Because often you will be WRONG.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:27 | 1466457 Raymond Reason
Raymond Reason's picture

This shocks a lot of people.  I have a close personal friend who spent his whole live in Kosovo, except for the last three years in America.  He's moving back...doesn't like it here.  Quality of life is better there, he says.  It makes you think.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:17 | 1466685 trav7777
trav7777's picture

I know several people who make that observation

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:06 | 1466321 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

there is truth in what you say, but it may not be enough this time.

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:41 | 1466216 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

Did you see the people on the streets of North America in September/October of 2008?

How many realized that they were within hours yes hours, of their ATM's not working?

They smile because they don't know better. Which is exactly how the Kleptocrats like it.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:14 | 1466370 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

So ignorance IS bliss?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 19:58 | 1468460 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

The turkeys on Thanksgiving eve seem happy...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:01 | 1466292 vib
vib's picture

It's an implosion engine that keeps on puffing.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:33 | 1466488 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Funny how many times Europe , at least according to Tyler, has imploded in the past.

 

Phoenix of modern times... The pipe dream of free energy lovers...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:36 | 1466196 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

I blame those stupid Americans.

Father forgive them for they know not what they have done.

Its time to hit the red button me thinks.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lWz8-TOpKI

 

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:39 | 1466207 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

'Americans'? Remember its always just been a British colony corporation from the start.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:53 | 1466580 pods
pods's picture

Sorry dork, most over on this side of the pond think that the red button is just the Staples Easy Button.

pods

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:40 | 1466209 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Is it too late to bring Generalissimo Juan Francisco Franco back from the dead?

Worked with Bin Laden anyway...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:42 | 1466219 dir
dir's picture

These look like good investments for the Social Security Trust Fund (tm).

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:42 | 1466220 RunningMan
RunningMan's picture

I have been bearish for a while now, and seem to have lots of company on ZH. But this whole drama playing out in Europe, which has been looming for a while, coupled with the US debt crisis, is truly terrifying because I think no one can predict what "recovery" looks like until we know how deep the rabbit hole goes.

I've had several conversations this weekend describing the US economy at best as "in limbo" or "stuck in neutral", and at worst "freefall". This is not the stuff of recovery.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:43 | 1466221 lieutenantjohnchard
lieutenantjohnchard's picture

it's scary if you lose your head. worrying is for the birds. the end game ought to be clear. if you have possession of the shiny you will be ok relative to the paper shufflers. also, keep in mind if the banks start accumulating gold and silver then the incentive to raid the comex will decrease a little bit.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:50 | 1466239 VFR
VFR's picture

And therein lies the mystery. We have become anaesthetised to shock and consequently nothing ever will implode or cause a catastrophe. It will simply evolve at lightening quick pace and be an acceptable part of history. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:48 | 1466241 monopoly
monopoly's picture

We are just moving along as discussed so many times here. Miners doing well after consolidation and I guess Robot does not want us to buy AMZN today. Oh well.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:48 | 1466244 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

What the hell is going on in FX land? Nothings moving.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:53 | 1466249 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Burp.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:54 | 1466266 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

Yes it is. Theme: strong USD.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:10 | 1466347 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

USD just happens to be the turd that bobbed up a bit higher among all the others in the punchbowl.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:50 | 1466252 monopoly
monopoly's picture

Dollar at day high, gold at day high. :)))

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:51 | 1466254 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

Vecchio danaroso che colma di doni l'amante giovane
(sugar daddy Fiat) running low on sugar for Daimlar AG? 

Down 3.5%

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:51 | 1466255 SilverDoctors
SilverDoctors's picture

HKMEx Silver Futures to Launch Friday July 22nd!

http://silverdoctors.blogspot.com/2011/07/hkmex-to-launch-silver-futures...

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:01 | 1466290 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Silver dip come expiration week?

Nah couldnt be.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:27 | 1466458 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

What ever happened to that million dollar SLV July $25 strike put that was publicized back in April???

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:02 | 1466627 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Probably closed for a nice fat profit awhiles ago.

Wonder who paid for them the second go around lol.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:29 | 1466461 KingdomKum
KingdomKum's picture

now, how will the Morgue stop this?

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:51 | 1466256 Cone of Uncertainty
Cone of Uncertainty's picture

What the fuck can't we just get on with it already.

Pussies.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:58 | 1466280 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Cold feet? They seem to be not so sure as they once were of the outcome now.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:56 | 1466271 uranian
uranian's picture

gold @ £1000. first krugers i bought were just under £300. and still i've convinced a grand total of 2 friends to buy gold. good day to be a goldbug :)

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:03 | 1466300 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

My folks STILL laugh at me today about the subject of gold at $1,600 like Im a deranged lunatic, although I started buying and telling them to buy when it was $400 and all the experts then said it would never see $500, ever, and in fact they said it was a big bubble back then.

The same experts are still running the show today.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:29 | 1466462 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Sad, isn't it Dog? Many of us are in the same boat. I have maybe two or three friends who have done anything in the last ten years. No family at all.

My old college roommate, who is VP of a large bank in a big city, holds GLD as his gold. He had no idea of the counterparty risk when I tried to explain it to him.

It's truly an amazing sitiuation when people like Nadler and Gartman are still considered "experts" to quote on PM's. 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:07 | 1466318 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Man, Tylers got the best financial website around, but a posting system from the early 90's! 

*dup*

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:11 | 1466354 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

As one 'prisoner' to another, I disagree. It is a bad day.

All the fears that made us buy the stuff in the first place are coming true. The transaction structures that underpin our extreme division of labor (that makes our comfortable lives possible) are teetering. We are ruled by shadowy banking families who post silly, interchangeable, this-guy-can't-possibly-be-in-charge faces as our political rulers. These families use crises to further consolidate their wealth and power.

Some goldbugs laugh confidently at the prospect of collapse, most likely because they have not experienced really hard times. Few westerners younger than 80 know what things like war, famine, plague, etc. really mean. This insulation is why Americans are so matter-of-fact about war; to them/us, it's an abstract, Rambo-type thing.

Buy gold and hope that you lose money on it.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:30 | 1466472 Bob
Bob's picture

+1

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:37 | 1466493 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

No offense, maybe you feel that way about the world and gold, but not me.

I hope to preserve wealth through gold and silver, not lose money. 

 

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:53 | 1466834 Marx_it_2_market.
Marx_it_2_market.'s picture

You missed GoldBricker’s point.
Better slow down, back up, and re-read it.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 14:29 | 1467270 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

No I didn't. I just disagree with some of his observations, that's all.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 12:31 | 1466735 trav7777
trav7777's picture

POG now 4 digits in every currency

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:57 | 1466275 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Anybody have any idea what commercial Mtg interest rates are in Greece, Italy, etc?  Do they have adjustable rate products going nuts over there?

What a Nightmare it must be for small businesses.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 10:57 | 1466276 Larry Darrell
Larry Darrell's picture

"It's getting very scary out there...."

 

The only ones scared are the ones who are always scared when real work needs to be performed by real producers.  The scared are all the same: keynesian kool aid drinking, paper pushing, paper asset holding, nanny state fucktards.

Those with a brain, some common sense, and a work ethic don't get scared.

Mon, 07/18/2011 - 11:10 | 1466344 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

speak it bro!

 

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!