The Flash Trading Org Chart

Tyler Durden's picture

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akreitman's picture

    What's the deal with the add/remove liquidity rebates.  When I look at the rebates published on the IB and Lightspeed price charts, they show exchange charge when you add liquidity and a rebate when you remove liquidity.  The direct edge price seems to charge for removing liquidity and a rebate for adding liquidity.  What am I missing?

KidDynamite's picture

this (DirectEdge) is standard. pay to take liquidity, get paid (rebate) to provide liquidity

nicholsong's picture

Any thoughts on working with/like WikiLeaks?

Marla Singer's picture

I'm sure they are great folks.

That said, we have no idea who they really are or where their funding comes from.  We'd rather be masters/mistresses of our own destiny.

We don't actually need them either.  We've got our own infrastructure in place.

:)

Anonymous's picture

You can do whatever you want. Enough.

But saying that wikileaks has no transparecy applies to you also.

nicholsong's picture

I don't think Marla meant that as criticism; just factually.  I agree with her. I don't know who they are either, nor where their funds come from. They take donations (who doesn't) but that doesn't tell much.  For my part, I didn't mean for ZH to hitch their mules to WikiLeak's wagon. I'm just thinking about a constellation of truthiness.

GeoffreyT's picture

Hey there nicholsong,

 

WikiLeaks will be suborned eventually - jsut as Google has been. Once they develop enough penetrtion to be worth bribing, they will get bought.

 

There's nothing wrong with that - and as they become more and more kosher, the market will provide alternatives.

 

(Wikileaks is really only for proto-whistleblowers... real ones use freenet: much much much smaller audience, but the entire audience is highly motivated. Plus, you can shop there for any assassination-fulfilment needs you might have [kidding!])

 

In unrelated news, I decided to weigh in on the whole HFT debate...it is like diligently trying to remove a stray tea-leaf from a cup of tea, when the teapot has a gigantic turd in it.

Cheerio

 

 

GT

GT's Market Rant

deadhead's picture

As a New York State resident, I'd like to thank Senator Schumer for taking up this matter.  I would urge the Senator to contact Mr. Durden for any assistance and background information that will be helpful.

 

Thank you.

Anonymous's picture

hey, deadhead, this is off topic - I just wanted to make sure you know that YOU were not the intended recipient of my rhetoric critique in the other thread! :)

nicholsong's picture

The recipient of who's rhetoric critique, Anonymous?  :)

deadhead's picture

I appreciate you saying that. My regrets as well for misreading the thread responses.

 

Best of luck to you.

JohnKing's picture

ring-a-ling..

Immelt: hello

Rahm: this doesn't get out there, CNBC runs infomercials next week

Immelt: infomercials?

Rahm: Fuck you. And tell Blankfein to pick up his fucking phone before I have to send ACORN to his house

Immelt: ok

Rahm: Fuck you

 

 

 

 

MsCreant's picture

They are all one big company posing as individual companies.

{Insert image of head blowing off shoulders here}

Anonymous's picture

Are you attempting to create an ownership chart or Direct Edge? If so, why link in NYSE? Why point out that Duncan N. is former GS? NYSE and Direct Edge are competitors, full stop. Stick to the flash order topic, leave the GS conspiracy novel out this.

Anonymous's picture

Vaan Praaaaaag is that you ?

Tyler Durden's picture

I appreciate your consistent stylistic advice. The post focuses on any and all relevant Flash trading relationships, of which the SLP falls under.

Anonymous's picture

Consistent? Are you tracking IP's over there in Liechtenstein. Or Chicago?

Anonymous's picture

I am a different anonymous user from the original critiquer. I don't understand how that is a relevant relationship, considering NYSE is trying to get rid of flash trading.

As an aside. You cannot simply connect the Goldman Sachs dots and assume a relationship. Goldman hires the absolute creme de la creme who go into finance. Why is it surprising that there are Goldman alum all over the place?

Anonymous's picture

Now who does the sleeper Sergei really work for ?

joann's picture

How will Citadel's bankruptcy fit into all of this, will GS just buy it out?

lizzy36's picture

Never count Ken Griffen out.  Looks like they are expanding their HFT skills by taking a majority stake in Equiduct. 

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2009/07/24/63651/high-frequency-trading-in-europe/

Howard_Beale's picture

Citadel is not in bankruptcy. They are weaseling into the European markets now in the electronic trading arena.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aayJKbKSm3ZY

Well that was redundant...lizzy posted while I was yelling out the window!

whacked's picture

Hmm Blackrock ... another 800lb gorilla being backed by the US Government..

Comrade de Chaos's picture

'em good old boys network, neat charts. I guess everyone wants their own Cylone.

A Robot should never bring any harm to a human. P.S. I wonder, what if those boys created the pandora box instead of the skynet. Then they should be aware that whoever runs first, loses the least.

 

 

 

 

 

Anonymous's picture

if i was a baby boomer who had my pension funds in this kind of crap, I would look at something like this and wonder just what in the hell I am doing....

Anonymous's picture

Personally, I am looking at transferring all my investments to a country where corruption is less organized at the top. Any other country fits that profile. Sure, corruption exists in other countries but not to the extent of organization and institutionalized here. I now know why Jim Rogers left this country and is now in Singapore.

Anonymous's picture

Why don't you leave the country too, you traitor? We don't need this type of citizen.

Anonymous's picture

Yup that's the plan.

spekulatn's picture

2x

 

"MARK IT ZERO, DUDE"

Anonymous's picture

It will be a beautiful sight to watch the implosion from afar. Demolitions are beautiful.

nicholsong's picture

Uh, he's no traitor, and YES we need that type of citizen--or at least that type of freedom. If you don't have the liberty to move your funds where you want, you are slave to governmental mandates anyway.  The greatest vote of all is the vote with your feet, and if you disallow that, every sort of abuse and predation is possible.

Anonymous's picture

Patriotism is for suckers or should I say taxpayers. When the system is hell bent on removing you from your hard earned wealth it no longer makes sense being part of that ecosystem. Pride and Patriotism never assured anyone a comfortable retirement. Only suckers and gullible folks get carried away by that fervor waving the flag, while their trousers are on fire.

agrotera's picture

common, here anony.  He isn't a traitor, he is just afraid for his family because of the corruption that has become pervasive here in the US. 

Anyone how leaves fine. but the rest of us are left with the task of saving our country from this corruption.  Yes, officially, we live in a banana republic.  But, we can vote out the current corrupted bought elected officials and insist on a new way of governance, and that is a great thing we can look forward to...

Ben_the_Bald's picture

Please follow your hero.

 

Singapore is totally corrupt.

Ruth's picture

I think the US is ranked below Italy now on the CPI, in '04 ranking 53/104 surveyed.  We need to start prosecuting and cleaning house.

RobotTrader's picture
I guess we are going to have to watch the most heavily traded lotto tickets trade on a 1-minute chart for entertainment purposes, to see how well the "Channelingstocks.com" Program Robots buy and sell these issues thousands of times a day.

http://clearstation.etrade.com/cgi-bin/bbs?post...

Wondering how the robots handle a scenario where they suddenly burst out of the channel and start going off in a different direction?

Primary examples would be the XLF, RKH, and KRE. They have been "pinned" in a small trading range for months.

Which way will they break?

And if so, how will the robots trade these once they break off in a different direction?

http://clearstation.etrade.com/cgi-bin/bbs?post...  

Anonymous's picture

Sorry, awful chart.
Assume I'm totaly ignorant and sell me your argument with a crisp cogent graph that CNBC can post and display while its kissing TDs wonderful ass for exposing this shocking scandal.

Tyler Durden's picture

go here, and look up HFT, program trading, market liquidity event, flash, and goldman sachs.

Anonymous's picture

Thanks, extremely useful.

"Awful" wasn't meant as a critism. I meant to suggest you dumb down the graphics for an ignorant audience . I get the graph but only because I've been following the story.

You've graphed it well enough for an informed audience. I don't think it would take much tweaking to make it comprehisible to CNBCs audience that GS through its ownership interests has its squiddy tentacles in all these markets.

Your audience for this graph should be Gasbag's audience. If they get it , the more informed will surely get it, and they'll appreciate a handy baseline graphic.

You're doing great work. Thanks

labster's picture

As for graphics, ZH might draw on the artwork of the late Mark Lombardi, who attempted to diagram such conspiracies as BCCI using hand-drawn "narrative structures," but update his index-card backend with wiki-like functionality and a dynamic visualization a la Visual Thesaurus. All this would be less something to give to CNBC and more of a collaborative tool to map the Flash Trading tentacles in real-time.

Anonymous's picture

Renaissance are the HFT kings - see
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=agxVXC.r9Edw
for evidence of what they have been up to for years.

Tyler Durden's picture

rentec is following the flash debate closely. very very closely... and we (and a few others) are following their reponses even closer.

Anonymous's picture

Makes sense that they follow it so closely given all the profit they must make from it in equity trading. Or do not.

http://dealbreaker.com/2009/05/dear-renaissance-investor.php

Anonymous's picture

Money follows freedom and the rule of law. That's why all the money with half a brain has gone offshore. Fuck the USA, Who needs it?

Anonymous's picture

B.S. Apparently you ether have never lived overseas (living is different from visiting) or you have never lived in a free country in general. So ether get your facts straight or F yourself for a practice purpose, cause once you live somewhere else, you'll be doing it on regular bases.

Anonymous's picture

That was remarkably incoherent. It seems, though, that you are unaccountably proud of your shitty little Constitution, which is honored solely in the breach and anyway pathetically inferior to what many dirt-poor third-world wastelands have. They have the ICCPR and ICESCR, executed as law. You have... "Freedom." That means, evidently, that you bend over for predation by a commercial oligarchy and suck the dick of every passing cop to show respect. So stick your preening assumption of worldly sophistication up your ass. You have not been around, in the scheme of things. It shows.

Comrade de Chaos's picture

Well, looking up the world corruption statistics based on survey of businesses could be a good starting point to solve this argument. It might be true that there are number of EU countries that would score higher than the USA.  However you ve got to remember the size, homogeneity and the degree of conformism do skew the data. Even without those adjustments we still are ahead of curve. I am not saying we should be idle, however we shouldn't jump to conclusions or lose the respect to constitution. We should fight for our rights, because rights and freedoms are well worth sweating over. Running and wishing problems away does not solve anything anywhere in the world. And we are blessed because we have opportunities to defend our rights, in many other parts of the world this is not the case, period. 

And YEAH, if you ask an average CHinese in China if they have corruption the answer will be obvious, what corruption.