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Following Core Meltdown, Reactor One At Fukushima Nuclear Power Plant Explodes - Video

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Following a report earlier that the Uranium at the Fukushima Power Plant may have melted, we sadly bring you this video of the explosion at Reactor one of the nuclear site.

A before and after picture, showing the loss of Reactor 1

From BBC:

There has been an explosion at a Japanese nuclear power plant that was hit by Friday's devastating earthquake.

Pictures show a blast at the Fukushima plant and initial reports say several workers were injured.

Nuclear expert, Malcolm Grimston told the BBC that nuclear materials may have been able to escape .

And as predicted by Zero Hedge first yesterday, the power plant has just announced that there is indeed a meltdown at the plant.

The core at Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant's No. 1 reactor may be partially melting, the nuclear safety agency said Saturday.

Radioactive substance cesium was detected around the reactor, it said.

Alas, as many may be affected by fallout, we present the wind data for Asia for Saturday:

http://images.intellicast.com/WxImages/Winds/seasi_day1.jpg

 

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Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:08 | 1043876 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

This isn't going to be good for uranium stocks.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:10 | 1043878 Motorhead
Motorhead's picture

This isn't going to be good for a lot of things.  A lot of nightmares coming true right about now.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:02 | 1044026 mophead
mophead's picture

Look at the bright side. This will be good for the economy. Sing along...

(countryish song, bum, buh-bum, buh-bum)....

Verse:

We're trying to inflate, it's another retake

The Bernake's in a corner, while (sentor) Paul's enraged

The QE they say, it's a gotta go

Can't wait for the next thing to blow

Chorus:

They say we're in a fix...

Just a runnin' out of tricks

Oh lord, what to do?

Please give us all a clue

(pause, deep country voice)

Try HAARP -- it's a better tool...

bum, buh-bum, buh-bum

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 14:59 | 1044774 nedwardkelly
nedwardkelly's picture

This isn't going to be good for uranium stocks.

On the other hand, it could be very good for uranium stocks if they actually get through all this without any significant problems. Hard to tell right now what is actually going on, Vs media hype. Something blew up here, but some reports say it was an exterior shell. Who knows what's true?

If things do get really ugly here, I'll probably BTFD on uranium stocks. Short of an energy revolution we're probably going to be desperate for power at some point sooner or later.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:14 | 1043879 malikai
malikai's picture

There is speculation that the explosion was not a steam explosion of the vessel, but rather a hydrogen gas explosion in the containment building, indicating the vessel may still be intact.

"The nuclear reactor is surrounded by a steel reactor container, which is then surrounded by a concrete building," Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano said.

"The concrete building collapsed. We found out that the reactor container inside didn't explode."

...

Edano said due to the falling level of cooling water, hydrogen was generated and that leaked to the space between the building and the container and the explosion happened when the hydrogen mixed with oxygen there.

http://www.forexyard.com/en/news/Japan-to-fill-leaking-nuke-reactor-with-sea-water-2011-03-12T123704Z

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:15 | 1043888 Arkadaba
Arkadaba's picture

thanks for the info. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:17 | 1043901 cossack55
cossack55's picture

That is the most "expressive" collapse I have ever seen, and I have seen many C4/semtex "collapses".

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:23 | 1043922 Arkadaba
Arkadaba's picture

Watching Canadian news - huge disinfo and we are usually pretty good at news. In trouble - powers that be be are covering up (and to what degree).

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:53 | 1044003 Bob Sacamano
Bob Sacamano's picture

Pretty sure reports will soon surface here that US government operatives (and likely GWB & Cheney in particular) were behind the cause of the explosion.

 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:56 | 1044176 Treason Season
Treason Season's picture

We would never do HAARP their Nip asses, would we Bobby?

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:10 | 1044531 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

I heard it was a Jap suicide cult jumping off their chairs all at the same time with rising sun bandanas around their foreheads, yelling banzaiiiiiii!  

Californians have tried it before, as did Lex Luthor, but back then they didn't have GPS available to synch up their jumps precisely enough.   The Mayans predicted the perfection of timekeeping technology ending the world in 2012, and this is how it goes down.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:07 | 1044209 Savyindallas
Savyindallas's picture

GWB and Cheney are certainly suspect-being the world's biggest terrorists. If it were a nuclear reactor in the U.S. or one of our occupied countries, we would be safe to assume that halliburton may be behind it. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:15 | 1044541 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Right.  The earthquake was a cover for their real motive of sabotaging a particular reactor in Japan built forty years ago.   They picked that one out like the crazy phonebook sniper in The Jerk you know, picking out one reactor at random that had to die, and setting off a giant earthquake to cover for their controlled destruction of the building.    That's how smart they are, and how evil they are.  Bwahahahahahahaaaa

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 20:58 | 1045316 nmewn
nmewn's picture

LOL...careful T...Russian News has footage of "an object" protruding from the front of the tsunami wave as it came ashore...also a UFO sighting over it.

Should be right up GW's alley ;-)

 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 16:15 | 1044926 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

nah, it was the aliens, or al quida...or maybe <gasp> it was alien al quida.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:58 | 1044015 Saxxon
Saxxon's picture

Yahoo! front page desperately spinning this.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:29 | 1043936 sushi
sushi's picture

A building filled with explosive gas will explode radially, the force of the explosion going in all directions.

If you examine the video footage you eill see an explosive jet shoot straight up where it appears to form a "lens." This if followed by a debris cloud as the cladding separates from the structural framework.

I interpret the jet and lens effect as being due to the top cover of the containment vessel having separated from the walls of the containment and having gone straight up. This suggests the core is open to the atmosphere and lacks cooling.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:42 | 1043971 malikai
malikai's picture

I see what you're saying. I thought the lens was odd as well, but if what they say is true, it is possible it was caused by the building structure itself (weak spots in the roof). I hope this is not another Chernobyl, but it sure does look like one.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:50 | 1044497 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

That looked like a powerful shock wave to me, straight up...doesn't look good at all.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:16 | 1044546 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Chernobyl burned, people, because the core was mainly graphite, i.e. pure carbon.   They couldn't make this worse than Chernobyl if they were trying to make it worse.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:47 | 1043988 duo
duo's picture

That looked like a shock wave to me. It takes significant over-pressure to do something like that.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:04 | 1044032 malikai
malikai's picture

TOKYO, March 12 (Xinhua) -- The Japanese government confirmed Saturday that while an explosion did occur at the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant earlier in the day, the blast did not happen at the location of its No. 1 reactor.


Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano said at an emergency press conference convened in Tokyo that owner and operator of the nuclear facility, Tokyo Electric Power Co., has confirmed that the steel container housing the reactor is intact.

Edano said that the blast, which occurred at 3:36 p.m. local time (0636 GMT), destroyed the roof and the walls of the reactor's outer container.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/world/2011-03/12/c_13775295.htm

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:39 | 1044120 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

"A building filled with explosive gas will explode radially, the force of the explosion going in all directions."

OR, like all buidlings designed to contain possible explosions in proximity to workers, the roof was designed to blow off more easily than the sides of the structure which is what I suspect is the case here.  It's just that the H2/O2 explosion in this case was much bigger than the small one it was designed to handle without having the walls blow off, too.

And the H2O dissociation into H2/O2 indicates that the core is melting or has melted since it takes temps of 2780 F and up to do that.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:58 | 1044181 LowProfile
LowProfile's picture

Dissociation seems likely.

That puff out the top he noted actually looks like a shockwave.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:17 | 1044547 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Ionizing radiation can easily split a water molecule too.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 16:54 | 1044988 malikai
malikai's picture

I extracted all the images from the zoomed RT video of the explosion. It looks like there is a yellowish front preceeding the shockwave. This is bizzarre because if it was a hydrogen fire, it should be very light blue, if even visible. I don't know what to think of that.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:38 | 1043962 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

This is why I have been saying that we are being pumped full of fear, and that most of what we are hearing is BS. These reactor's are not as fragile as what the media would have you believe. They are considered the most over engineered systems in the world for a reason. The level of safety and control they have rival's the economic control systems in the US.

 

Apparently, this particular reactor is a GE design. So expect a rally if the situation turn's out to be better than what was stated.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:43 | 1043972 JimS
JimS's picture

What, a rally in GE stock? Cool.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:43 | 1043973 malikai
malikai's picture

Watch for a GE rally on monday if there is no nuclear catastrophe. Or, expect a GE rally on monday if there is a nuclear catastrophe. I love this market.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:59 | 1044019 snowball777
snowball777's picture

So GE's check cleared? Spend it wisely.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:11 | 1044048 Paul Bogdanich
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"Apparently, this particular reactor is a GE design. So expect a rally if the situation turn's out to be better than what was stated."

 

Anti-social personality disorder or what one used to call a psychopath.  We may have and I stress may have just lost a freaking reactor core and the thing that goes through your polluted little mind is GE stock?   Sick puppy. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:30 | 1044099 Won_Over
Won_Over's picture

Could not have said any better. Thanks. Some people think life is all about stocks/money-money money (fuck you all)...  People are actually dying and will die.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:13 | 1044534 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

They are behaving like a Gangster Banksters.  Pretend you're listening in on a conference call with Lloyd and Jaime who are congratulating Jeffrey Immelt for a job well done.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:20 | 1044549 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Every living human will die. Get over it.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:53 | 1044343 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

This is why I have been saying....

Whatever you've been saying it hasn't been long considering you've been registered on ZH for 2 weeks and commenting for 4 days. Good luck with that.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:11 | 1044393 RockyRacoon
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People weren't listening at his last venue, so he comes here hoping for a more sympathetic audience.   Ooops.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:35 | 1044584 glenlloyd
glenlloyd's picture

No shit, I'm starting to get the feeling we're being loaded up with sockpuppets here.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 20:36 | 1045286 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

+1 pets.com sockdog

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 23:02 | 1045599 fuu
fuu's picture

I have been awfully grateful for the last 36 hours for all th ex-nuke plant workers, ex-miitary nuke experts, and nuclear engineers who hang out here.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:50 | 1043992 barkingbill
barkingbill's picture

why would the building explode and the container remain intact? it's the container that holds the explosive potential here or no?

 

i suspect the government is purposely understating things...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:25 | 1044084 sharkbait
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A 'nuclear' explosion (aka mushroom clouds) is a difficult thing to achieve.  Impossible in fact in a functioning reactor.  If the reactor core 'melts down' you may get a chunk of material large enough to explode but it will not be in the configuration to explode.

There is a lot of other material that could possibly explode resulting in an 'explosion at a nuclear facility' ( like Chernobyl ).

An hydrogen explosion is very likely and reasonable.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:39 | 1044125 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

Hydrogen.

As I recall, one of the problems encountered at TMI was that hydrogen built up in the containment dome. The source was apparently a chemical reaction between overheated metal plumbing and remaining cooling water. At TMI they managed to vent the hydrogen, but obviously Fukushima did not.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:36 | 1044287 Drachma
Drachma's picture

If the core temperature can not be contained, Fukushima is fukued.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 17:15 | 1045010 mt paul
mt paul's picture

should have replaced

the oxyegen 

with nitrogen...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:12 | 1043884 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

We are all living beyond our means. We only have this one rock we share together. What will it take to clue us in?

I am so sorry. I am going to spend some time today thinking about how to downsize my life more. There is nothing else to do.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:15 | 1043892 cossack55
cossack55's picture

I can recommend a wonderful Interior Designer.  New curtains always helps.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:31 | 1043948 sushi
sushi's picture

Lead cladding with faux satin is the latest trend in window coverings. A small Godzilla offering shrine is also tres chic.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:40 | 1043965 JimS
JimS's picture

+1000 It works for my wife. :))))

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:05 | 1044035 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

What do you mean what will it take to clue us in?  There are two choices, you either bomb people into submission or you let things naturally take their course.  Until we are willing to bomb other countries into submission for waste/pollution practices, our earth will continue to be polluted (and doing the same to ourselves of course).  This is what the greenies don't understand about their views...  they necessarily require armed conflict to come to fruition, save a universal volunteering of inefficiency.

What's going to make us snap out of it?  Evolving past the human condition...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:24 | 1044086 sushi
sushi's picture

Agreed.

Every time a country experiences an accidental radiation leak we should nuke them back into the stone age.

That will show them what "higher evolution" is all about.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:30 | 1044098 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Completely irrelevant and that whiffing noise was my post going over your head...  it was a responsive post...  see the post I was responding to in order to find context.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:51 | 1044335 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Macho, it's not us really. Not even US. It's cycles, large cycles, too long for us to feel, perhaps even remember.

We are actors as much as we are spectators to the game.

Nothing will change us. Only we can change us.

ORI

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/03/12/fukushima-blessed-island-trinity-unleashed/

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 19:19 | 1045185 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Your point is valid, but I think there's still room for differentiation between "leading" by example and coercing with fear.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:43 | 1044315 narnia
narnia's picture

MachoMan, you are absolutely correct.  National sovereignty yields the global advancement of "progressive" ideals (compelled on others, whether founded or not) impractical, especially on a global scale without a global military.  The second we sign some kind of envivornmental treaty with China or any other independent poor nation, guess what- they will use it as an economic advantage over us by not complying with it. The UN is a failure on inception for the same reason.  Some people espouse one global government & currency?  Give me a break- even if that conspiracy does exist- that can't even be accomplished in Western Europe, much less the world.  The sooner Americans come to the understanding, let's not spend the money policing the world, lets not subsidize anything, lets protect our borders, our water & our natural farmland, and let's accomplish advancement of global standards of living by intellectually producing affordable market tools to do so- the better we all will be.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:16 | 1044404 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Isolatonism has not ever been the strong suit of the U. S.

Don't expect miracles in this area.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:08 | 1044528 narnia
narnia's picture

Rocky, the opposite of intervenionism is noninterventionism.  The US does not have to be isolated to the world.  We're pretty good humanitarians- thanks to our wealth & ability to mobilze it, we should keep it at that.  Speaking of that, now that a no-fly zone and inevitable occupation of Libya are on the table...  do the people who want to do this, for good reason I might add- to protect innocent life- realize that if the USA does this, it will actually decrease our national security?  Want another 9/11?  Start bombing and occupying more countries in the Middle East.  Start picking more dictators.    

 

We are witnessing a non-violent deposition of repression throughout the world.  the more these dictators bomb their people, the more valuable liberty becomes.  arming both sides of a conflict will only produce more bloodshed and shift this into a political fight of strength rather than a fight for the indivudual by individuals. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:30 | 1044567 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

The revolts in these arab countries cannot result in any sort of recognizable liberation on their own.  These countries are infected by Islam, which means "submission" and codifies every godamned aspect of life, commerce, and government along seventh century standards.    Secular dictatorships are better than that.   Something like the (now failing) Ataturk approach could result in a modicum of prosperous liberty and non-craziness.   Or, a good century or so of occupation by an advanced western country could do it, if we cared to bother.     The British stayed in India for two centuries, and now they are the world's biggest democracy.    They skipped occupying these arab shitholes, so they remain extra shitty.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:42 | 1044604 Golden monkey
Golden monkey's picture

Some animals need coercitive religions.

 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 18:30 | 1045123 narnia
narnia's picture

I reject those two choices as the only choices.  Over half the population is comprised of women.  I'm not sure they'd see a repressive secular dictatorship or a radical islimist regime as the only two options, either.

 

Even if we assumed your two choices are correct, and the question is American involvement, is supporting secular regimes at the cost of $trillions and national security risk worth the difference of accepting an islimist region and maybe paying a little more for gas (I actually think we'd be paying less)?  The answer is clearly no, not that it is a choice really given our economic situation.    

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 19:24 | 1045194 snowball777
snowball777's picture

"My 14th century standards are morally superior to your 7th century standards." Whatever.

As long as candidates for POTUS in the US (or their equivalents) need to pander to the brainwashed masses of the Judeo-Christian ideal of the West, you'll remain a prisoner in a slightly less stinky cage.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 21:31 | 1045350 rich_wicks
rich_wicks's picture

This is what the greenies don't understand about their views...  they necessarily require armed conflict to come to fruition, save a universal volunteering of inefficiency.

No it doesn't.

Just make people poor.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:37 | 1044595 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

My wife and I have been talking seriously about going off the grid here, mostly because it would enforce a lot more austerity. I wonder if we would then be the only urban household in the US not tied to the electrical grid? We already have a tiny footprint in the world (no travel, no buying sprees, no new cars, shop at thrift stores, I'm remodeling the house myself) and have raised our kids to be frugal. Everyone is happy with all that. But there is always more.

The human race is headed back to a solar-based existence. Life always came from the sun, to that life we must return. I'll probably buy a 3Kw solar kit this summer to ease the transition, a small battery array for nighttime lighting, and then pull the electric meter. Good bye to that era!

Like it or not, it's headed our way too. Embrace the whirlwind ...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 14:22 | 1044693 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

++++.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 19:28 | 1045201 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Nope. There are hundreds if not thousands already (not mine, but many).

I admire your commitment (and no, I don't mean the $18k for the PV array).

Can you get by on 80kWh/month?

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:14 | 1043887 cossack55
cossack55's picture

FauxNews is saying roof collapsed.  If that is the case, we need to start dropping roofs on Al Queda, daffy, the whole MENA and anyone else who won't accept the dollar or who is trying to sell oil for other currencies. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:20 | 1044242 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

Exactly, this has the distinctive stench of Mossad all over it.

Fuk -u -shima.... Think people.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 14:32 | 1044721 Alienated Serf
Alienated Serf's picture

congrats, you have the first "mossad did it" post with regards to the current disaster.

ps- i hope you get luekemia.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 19:43 | 1045222 snowball777
snowball777's picture

fuk - u - judy.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:15 | 1043889 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Some of the tsunami clips they now show on Sky News are horrifying. Much worse than the 2004 clips I saw.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:49 | 1044156 UGrev
UGrev's picture

I watched the one where the flow destroyed the town and you can see cars in the background on the road. My God, cars stopped on the road and I'm in my chair watching in horror yelling at them "GET OUT OF THERE!". I couldn't believe what I was watching... I felt absolutely awful. That flow was moving incredibly fast; as fast as the cars were traveling. It was just unreal.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:07 | 1044377 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

I felt the same way. While you would think that flight would be the usual reaction to the fear of seeing a wall of water and debris coming straight at you, for others they became frozen in the on coming headlights.

I saw one car back up a little, then go forward a little, then just stop on the road. Forward and backward was parallel to the coming tsunami and wouldn't help. Too late the driver realized s/he could try to get off the road and drive into the open field and away from the oncoming rush.

We are trained to see our world a certain way. Some drivers only saw the option of driving their cars on the road and never had a chance. I read the same reaction being discussed in airplane accidents where many survive the actual crash, but died in the smoke and flames. The vast majority stand up in the aisle and wait to exit. The ones in back who survive climb over seats and other people to get out.

The vast majority of us can't see our conditioning because we are.......conditioned. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:11 | 1044535 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

This video shows the power behind the Tsunami, stunning. The camera man cut away before the wave swallow several cars who were obviously trying to escape.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjorLr5MUvc

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 14:24 | 1044703 UGrev
UGrev's picture

We watched the same video. I thought that car did a back up and go deal, but wasn't sure. Either way, I felt like the 1 person in the horror moving screaming "DON'T OPEN THAT DOOR". I still can't get the scene out of my head. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:31 | 1044573 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Obviously anything that happens in Japan would get massively photographed and videoed.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:15 | 1043890 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

I'm wondering if they used the bell curve distribution to calculate the probability of an accident and decided that this was a 6 sigma event, so go ahead and build it. Whoops, wrong probability distribution! Probably got Moody's or Fitch to calculate the odds.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:40 | 1044127 Implicit simplicit
Implicit simplicit's picture

With the historical data being so plentiful (not), The data significance must have been on par with the chance of a derivative meltdown. This creates a conundrum: Go with the insufficient data to reach a  far from bullit proof safety option, or have the world live in more poverty because of the high cost of energy. The derivatives were not necessary, while nuclear facilities probably are.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:17 | 1044409 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Essentially we believe what we wish to believe and then arrange the scientific, economic and social reasoning and justification to support the desired conclusion. I've read some of the "impact" studies for nuclear plants in the USA when they were being planned in the early 70's. These types of events were always concluded to be so remote that it was an "acceptable" risk. Acceptable that is until it happens.

My heart goes out to the average citizen in Japan, particualry those in southern Japan where the effects of the earthquake were relatively minor, who are now beginning to wake up to an extremely unfamiliar world. They won't be able to point to physical destruction to explain the suddenly frightening world. The rest of the world's turn is just around the corner.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:16 | 1043894 BigJim
BigJim's picture

And 'experts' wonder why people are a bit leery of nuclear power.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:47 | 1043982 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Oooh, I got junked.

Probably by an 'expert'.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:03 | 1044196 naughtius maximus
naughtius maximus's picture

Why do people care about getting junked? Makes no difference to me I can still see your posts.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:15 | 1043895 assumptionblindness
assumptionblindness's picture

According to CNN it was just a hydrogen explosion...no need to worry. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:29 | 1043942 zeusman
zeusman's picture

Meltdown = Uranium melting = Zirconium Dioxide creation = Hydrogen gas liberation = EXPLOSION.

This is likely the definitive sign that core is melting!

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:01 | 1044028 Saxxon
Saxxon's picture

Here's another thought . . . is there anyone willing to get close enough to see what the status is?  Any volunteers . . . ?  That film was taken from quite some distance.

I would put forward that no one knows yet.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:08 | 1044040 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

If no one is willing to get close, how do we fix it?

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:35 | 1044119 gruden
gruden's picture

'...No need to worry'?!?

Are you some kind of shill or a simple polyanna?  Nuke plants exploding is not a no-worry scenario!  It means they do NOT have the situation under control.  A nuke plant that is not under control is definitely cause for worry.  Read up on Chernobyl and you'll see the outcome of an exploding nuke plant.  And the Japanese nuke plants are much more powerful than Chernobyl, thus a similar outcome would be MUCH worse.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:27 | 1044261 CrazyCooter
CrazyCooter's picture

Wouldn't a full meltdown also imperil the reactors right next door? Once "free" is their enough radiant heat to threaten the neighbors?

Any nukes on here? Nothing over at TOD ...

Cooter

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:36 | 1044591 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Chernobyl burned.    This is getting old, but here goes again:   That reactor was made of graphite, i.e. pure carbon, which burns really well in contact with atmospheric oxygen, of which plenty was available, because the reactor had no secondary containment at all.      The reactor we are talking about here is not constructed of materials that are easily and energetically flammable.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:17 | 1043899 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

There goes Alternative Energy, I hope the world does not institute a nuclear moratorium for the next few decades

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:20 | 1043912 malikai
malikai's picture

Nuclear moratorium? As peak oil strikes? That will go down real well. More likely is a bunch of uneducated greens will be slaughtered as they protest human life.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:40 | 1044130 gruden
gruden's picture

When was the last time we built a nuke plant in the States?  According to Google it was 1996.  Sure looks like a moratorium to me.

 

But we are building lots of coal plants.  What does that tell you?

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:29 | 1044264 Charles Wilson
Charles Wilson's picture

It tells us that we prefer slow radiation release from radioactive material in coal to fast radiation release in a meltdown scenario.

CW

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:36 | 1044589 malikai
malikai's picture

+100000000

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:18 | 1043903 ShankyS
ShankyS's picture

Of course they will under play the event, be lax in evacuations in the fallout zones, and governments attempts to cover up the initial severity of the issue will eventually cause more deaths and harm than necessary. Just like with the GOM, bury the truth as fast as possible.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:02 | 1044027 Cursive
Cursive's picture

Shanky,

This is my concern as well.  Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see.  BTW, love the new domain and blog.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:38 | 1044302 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

Well you better believe this one:

"Lady Gaga Creates Prayer Bracelet to Benefit Disaster Relief in Japan"

To cut costs it was made in China out of depleted Uranium.

http://www.popeater.com/2011/03/12/lady-gaga-designs-japan-tsunami-brace...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:22 | 1043904 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

 

Fallout Map: link to img847.imageshack.us

10 days to reach the USA. Japan says meltdown possible at nuclear plant

 

Chernobyl map for morans:
https://qed.princeton.edu/getfile.php?f=Radioactive_fall-out_?from_the_C...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:24 | 1043916 malikai
malikai's picture

Stay away from 4chan. That image is a complete fabrication. 5000 rads for about 10,000sqm?! bahaha.. I'd venture to say there wasn't even 5000r/hr in the rubble of Chernobyl on the day it blew.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:24 | 1043919 Spalding_Smailes
Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:26 | 1043930 malikai
malikai's picture

That explains the revolutions in MENA more than anything. What does each dot stand for? Without a legend it's short on usable info.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:30 | 1043938 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Jet Stream Analyses

squall.sfsu.edu

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:34 | 1043951 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

Animated jet-stream map:

www.stormsurfing.com

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:26 | 1043926 doggings
doggings's picture

 "Morans" huh ? :)

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:57 | 1044008 tmosley
Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:20 | 1044247 bookwurm
bookwurm's picture

Its a wonkette thing...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:27 | 1043933 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

"Chernobyl map for morans:"

I passed it on to Terry and his gang.  He says "Thanks."

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:10 | 1044046 Trying to Understand
Trying to Understand's picture

If you do a search for "Australian Radiation Services" - you'll get no hits... the 'map' is a hoax.

Fallout Map: link to img847.imageshack.us

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:44 | 1044138 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

I didn't try yet, but was wondering.  The jet stream moves much faster than the map shows.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 12:40 | 1044471 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Still think the map is suspect, even though the Aussie place is legit.  Photoshop of their logo on a fake map?  

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 16:46 | 1044972 malek
malek's picture

You mean no hits showing that map on their website.

Produced by the Australian Radiation Services with a big fat logo, but no mention at all on their website?
Very suspect.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:01 | 1044187 pacu44
pacu44's picture

that link led to an attack on my machine.... not safe computing....

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:16 | 1044238 jomama
jomama's picture

congratulations on redefining fail.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:21 | 1043910 ukmetman
ukmetman's picture

I thought these places were safe these days?

Why didn't the have a petrol generator, a pump, and a piece of pipe ready to dangle into the sea, or am I being a bit simplistic.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:25 | 1043928 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Yes, this is why these things can't happen. We're just SOOOO much smarter than those dumb Russkies.

OUR engineers have considered EVERY contingency. It could never happen here!

    Million to one chances happen nine times out of ten

                                                     - Terry Pratchett

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:35 | 1044118 granolageek
granolageek's picture

They did, actually diesel not petrol. The tsunami destroyed it.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:26 | 1043911 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

Something doesn't sound right about this.  Japanese engineering skills are superb.  They're usually right on top of things like this. 

Getting emergency electrical power to run pumps should have been doable. 

It appears now there was more serious structural damage from the quake.  Perhaps major piping damage inside the containment building where 1000x radiation level prevented people getting in there and doing repairs.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:30 | 1043939 flacon
flacon's picture

Don't forget that this was the largest earthquake in Japan's history - 8000 times more powerful than the one in Christchurch, New Zealand. Just wait until the monetary earthquake that has been building ever since December 23rd, 1913 - now THAT will be something to write home about. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:01 | 1044192 pacu44
pacu44's picture

+1

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:40 | 1043966 honestann
honestann's picture

The problem appears to be the tsunami shoving 37 trillion gallons of water and debris into all that "safety" equipment.

200 backup generators full of debris and ocean salt water does them zero good.

The facility design is completely absurd, and any honest, rational non-scientist could have figured that out.  Japan has big earthquakes, Japan has major tsunamis now and then.  Yet they built this facility (and apparently most of their nuclear power facilities) literally on the coast or actually extending out into the water.

When government and large corporations issue reports authored by literally bought-and-paid-for scientists, those reports are pure 100% rationalizations.  And not just in the USSA, either.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:15 | 1044064 cossack55
cossack55's picture

They should have had their risk analysis performed by Moody's or Fitch.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:32 | 1044100 Ricky Bobby
Ricky Bobby's picture

+10

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:39 | 1044305 CrazyCooter
CrazyCooter's picture

Agree. Even the containment buildings could have flooded with all that water. How do we even know the control room was still functional? The forces and scale boggles the mind.

Cooter

Sun, 03/13/2011 - 01:24 | 1044551 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

-

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:58 | 1044012 dwdollar
dwdollar's picture

Superb?  They built the reactors on a freaking beach...  How's that for superb...

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:49 | 1044331 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

"How's that for superb"

He's in the glass business.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:18 | 1044512 Mesquite
Mesquite's picture

And at the concurrence of THREE fault lines...

Hmmm...

Oh well, while I'm at it..

1. Something wonky here..Look at pictures..

'Containment' buildings are round, with domed roofs, with thick concrete walls..(to 'contain' something..like pressure differential..) not cross braced steel construction with cladding..

And yes the book, from years ago, re: the event at Chernobyl is good, informative reading..

I'm sure one could dig up pix of many nuke projects to validate the above..

IF they hadn't already worked at a few, as I have..

And, yes re: Chernobyl, first response of home gov't was denial of any problem..(Matter of record..) Lot of folks gave their lives to 'contain' that mess..

 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:40 | 1044597 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

This thing was built in the 70's.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:21 | 1043915 honestann
honestann's picture

That huge reactor building just vaporized like a little toy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/art-levine/report-explosion-at-nucle_b_834765.html

0:45 to 0:50 shows a close-up; notice the shock waves.

I saw zero flames, so probably there was not hydrogen gas exploding or any other flammable exploding.

What it looked like was somehow a large quantity of water and the superhot fuel came in contact, and the water vaporized instantly, which expanded at a hypersonic rate and literally vaporized that entire huge building in a tiny fraction of a second.

Now, that could have been the fuel burning through the vessel.  But it is a bit strange that they have showed no additional activity in that location (unless they've suppressed everything after that explosion).

Assuming the vessel is still in tact, that explosion was huge, and that means the cooling tubes that go in-to and out-of the vessel are now probably just open holes.

That means no system exists to control anything.  If that's true, then presumably the next step is for the super-hot fuel and/or fuel by-products to burn right through the bottom of the vessel.

Once the fuel hits water in the building below the vessel or the water table 10 or 20 meters below ground, there will be a massive explosion of steam and radiative particles into the air.

Not good.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:26 | 1043925 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

They say on Sky News that they consider drowning the reactor in sea water/borium, rendering it useless forever. Expensive decisions like this aren't considered unless the situation is seriously bad, surely.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:32 | 1043946 honestann
honestann's picture

If the meltdown already happened, it is too late for that.

If the meltdown did not happen, and the vessel is still somewhat intact (albeit with 2+ huge holes where the connections for intake and output of coolant used to be), then that is one tricky prospect logistically.  I don't know enough to say it is impossible, but I sure don't see how they'd be able to do that before the super-heated fuel melts through the vessel, especially in the environment that must exist there now.

Expensive?  They don't know what expensive means.  But we might all know fairly soon if events continue as they have been.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:34 | 1043940 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

I saw zero flames, so probably there was not hydrogen gas exploding or any other flammable exploding.

Agree.  Had to be a steam explosion. 

My guess reactor vessel and containment structure blown to bits, uranium everywhere, massive radiation release.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:35 | 1043953 malikai
malikai's picture

I don't believe you will see flames when hydrogen burns, particularly from that distance and inside the building.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:36 | 1043954 Eally Ucked
Eally Ucked's picture

you can not see hydrogen burning

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:44 | 1043975 honestann
honestann's picture

Clearly you've never watched a Saturn V rocket take off.

Because the fuel for those rockets is pure hydrogen and pure oxygen.  But just take a look at the tail end of one of those rockets when they take off.  You see nothing?  Wow!

I've burned hydrogen before, in chemistry lab.  And I can assure you, I certainly did see flames!

Maybe if you burn hydrogen very, very slowly in tiny little quantities you might be correct.  But that certainly was not a teenie, tiny explosion we saw.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 09:54 | 1044000 malikai
malikai's picture

SaturnV first stage was RP-1/LOX, which is basically kerosene. Not sure what made you think its hydrogen. Perhaps you are referring to the 3rd stage? LH2/O2 there.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:05 | 1044034 LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

I think it is high time to make a reliability index for ZH commentary.  So many folks may rely on the "factual" nature of these comments, when the person making the comment or the rejoinder is talking out their ass.

In many cases the article itself is severely challenged and can easily be dismantled as a crock.

Does that mean that the author is welcome to contribute more crap to ZH?  It certainly seems that way from the continued contributions of non-factual crap that is offered.

I think ZH needs peer review, but I don't see how we can make that happen, any suggestions?

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:14 | 1044055 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

ZH does have a peer review, it's called the reply button...  and, it helps when you actually say who is the poster talking out his/her ass.  And, at least conceptually, it's what the junk button is designed to help.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:54 | 1044346 CrazyCooter
CrazyCooter's picture

What I would like is the ability to toggle certain parties off (a little +/- icon next to the avatar) so that when I get *my* page these posters are there but "collapsed" by default. My choices would never impact another community member. That way I don't have to listen to HarryWanger or Math Man or some of the other tools that camp the first post into oblivion. I often find myself scrolling down through the page trying to escape those threads. Typically its just a couple retards going in circles with their hands on each others meat. If this were the case, and a respectable community member has a compelling response to something I don't see, I could just expand up the chain to learn more.

ZH has a wonderful community of people who share unique opinions and insights, contrary or not. Sometimes the trolls are just too much work to sift through.

Simply stated, it's a time management thing.

Cooter

<aside>If my "negative toggles" were saved on the server with my profile, this list could be loaded once as a cached resource and used by a local JavaScript to toggle stuff on the client. This could be implemented at almost zero cost in terms of server CPU and bandwidth.</aside>

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:20 | 1044075 malikai
malikai's picture

I'd vote for that.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:23 | 1044080 uhb
uhb's picture

+1

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:23 | 1044082 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

We need a junk button for the original post.

And for the record, I'm not an expert on anything.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:29 | 1044096 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Slash (Slashdot.org) has a robust peer moderation system. I think zerohedge.com is run on Drupal, and Drupal has at least one comment moderation module: http://drupal.org/project/comment_moderation, but I don't know if it incorporates peer moderation.

 

You asked.

 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:12 | 1044522 Athena
Athena's picture

When I signed up for ZeroHedge, I donated some money and asked for a user ignore feature.  Since that time, not only have annoying posts increased, but the quality of the content has declined.  I think that authors and posters have the responsibility to find and correct their own errors.  These days, if something is annoying, or if I need to take pause to understand poor writing, or if I find that the facts are incorrect or misrepresented, I move on to another site.  Why bother to use an inconsequential junking feature? 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 15:25 | 1044821 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

One of the nice things about Slashdot's moderation system is that users are free to post any crap they want. However, if readers want to filter the crap, they can. It's not a perfect system, but it's the best I've seen. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:42 | 1044133 ZakuKommander
ZakuKommander's picture

Actually, I sort of enjoy how the community self-polices, in the sense that an errant poster may be shown to be a fool by a following comment citing credible sources, after which the errant poster's reputation becomes nil.  

On the other hand, you can be a political or scientific troglodyte and still have something interesting to add to the discussion on PMs. 

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 10:51 | 1044159 honestann
honestann's picture

I'm sure you've never mis-remembered anything, right?

I did mis-remember.

However, I just watched a launch of the Delta IV with 2 (??? or 3 ???) hydrogen-oxygen engines, and it had plenty of flames spewing out too... though perhaps somewhat less than the Saturn V rockets.

So my point about burning hydrogen + oxygen is correct... and is even more correct (slightly) when hydrogen and atmosphere burn, since the atmosphere contains other "junk" (particulates, pollutants, etc).

I also believe in first-hand observation, and I have burned pure hydrogen.  That's the best proof of all for me.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 11:18 | 1044220 LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

It is not a problem to mis-remember, and it is healthy to correct and come to a more solidly based conclusion as a result.  But how much of the material on ZH is mis-remembering?  How many folks have been professionally trained to "know what they are talking about?"

/lol/

"So my point about burning hydrogen + oxygen is correct... and is even more correct (slightly) when hydrogen and atmosphere burn, since the atmosphere contains other "junk" (particulates, pollutants, etc)."

The difference in the presence of atmosphere is slight, but important as you note.  The major emission is still going to be dominated by the Fuel (H2) in the case of the Hindenberg and the Fuel / Oxidizer in the case of the Delta Heavy.  In the case of the D-H the "only" reaction (emission in the red that is visible) is H2/O2 combustion.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 13:29 | 1044568 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

 - come on guys, the Space Shuttle has hydrogen/oxygen main engines, with two solid rocket boosters strapped on each side - every notice that big orange liquid hydrogen/oxygen tank the shuttle rides piggy back on?

 

Go back and review a few shuttle launches.

Sat, 03/12/2011 - 23:36 | 1045729 honestann
honestann's picture

Right, and thanks.  It bothers me too when people allow themselves to totally ignore observation in favor of some theoretical idea they have.

If what caused that MASSIVE reactor building to explode in a fraction of a second was indeed hydrogen and [oxygen in the] atmosphere, I'd like to know why we can barely see the upward thrusting shock wave without any signs of flame or red or anything whatsoever from either the hydrogen burning or anything else in that building burning that must have been vaporized in a flammable type explosion.

Part of the point is, that was a very fast, very powerful explosion, not unlike the power of those booster rockets (though the rockets keep burning for a lot longer, of course).  Why the difference?

Also, we should ask the nuclear facility experts in the crowd, "Why in freaking hell would any nuclear reactor building have large quantities of hydrogen?".  That seems incredibly stupid to me, not to mention the fact that I can't even imagine why they want or need hydrogen.  And if they do have hydrogen there, is it in gaseous form?  If so, there wouldn't be enough to vaporize that building so visciously.  And if they keep large quantities of liquid hydrogen in such a facility, they must be completely and totally out of their freaking minds!

Sun, 03/13/2011 - 01:40 | 1045987 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

 - Good points honestann, yes it was definitely a powerful explosion

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