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German FinMin Capitulates, Says PIIGS, Global Moral Hazard Win
Obious 101 from Reuters:
German Fin Min: Crisis Largely Over In Europe and Germany
German Fin Min: If Greek Budget Consolidation Succeeds, No Tax Money Will Be Lost
German Fin Min: Without Consolidation In Greece We Will Have Unforeseeable Market Consequences
German Fin Min: Failure With Greece Would Put Euro In Question
German Fin Min: Cannot Throw Greece Out Of Eurozone
It's over - the excess debt/GDP terrorists have won, and Moral Hazard is now a global phenomenon. There will be no more failures anywhere. In other words, all your stock profits will come straight from your taxes.
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Nobody fails, everybody is a winner and all governments are corrupt....
And that surprises you?
Should this development have surprised anyone?
Insanity is the new official worldwide ideology, and willful ignorance of that insanity the new worldwide hobby.
It is not insanity - it is perfectly logical.
My god, the beauty is astounding.
I know I came too late to the party to be a participant (ie a Goldie MD), but man, I'm stoked to be allowed to watch from the inner-sanctum.
It's like watching grand-master chess, or a Napoleonic battle. The beauty & (as)symmetry are breathtaking.
Bravo, bravo we cry at a well-played point. Shee-it!
4/29/10 5:56pm. Strauss-Kahn: That was fast. Still time for some schnitzel and a bier?
4/29/10 5:58pm. Strauss-Kahn: Calls Obama to say thanks for leaning on that ol' Hun
4/29/10 6:00pm. Strauss-Kahn: Calls Blankfein. Asks, "How are my Euro shorts holding up?"
Time for the actions to challenge the legality of this bailout package in the German Constitutional Court to kick off then.
As if that wasn't a forgone conclusion.
This train doesn't stop short of revolution.
CC and others, i implore you to read at least the first sections of Nesta Webster's French Revolution (found in the left column of :: http://yamaguchy.netfirms.com/7897401/webster/webster_index.html). Realise that it was all a manipulation. That nothing changed and that in gross society nothing may happen. Whatever, just my $0.000000002
This will be their choice, not mine. I am a man of peace, and I pray for an awakening. I pray for peaceful change. I pray that my people will follow the path of Ghandi and Dr. King in turning their cheek in disobedience. I don't want riches, all I want is to be able to support and raise my family in peace. I don't want fame or power, all I want is to progress spiritually in the time I have hear on earth. However, if they impede my ability to live my life in peace, they will find a wolverine not a field mouse. I have no illusions of social change, I have no grandiose visions of changing the ways of man and government. No, mine will be the hand of retribution, eye for eye tooth for tooth livelihood for livelihood family life for family life. What they take from me, so will be taken from them.
I'm literally begging for intervention. Stop participating. It doesn't have to be this way. Stop paying mortgages and credit cards, stop investing in the crooked machine, stop voting for the corrupt two party system, stop paying taxes, stop watching and listening to the propaganda.... Just stop, please just stop.
Luke 23:34
And Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.”
It should be noted that President Obama was on the phone with Merkel yesterday prodding her to approve. Amazing how he talks out of one side of his mouth against bailout and then encourages another nation to participate. We are truly in a New World
Politicians speaking out of both sides of the mouth is as old as democracy herself. I am surprised at your conclusion this is something new, Mr. Jefferson.
Those crazy NWO Global Elitest are obviously behind schedule. Just buying time....
It's obvious that we now live in a time where governments do too much and individuals do too little. Complacency kills Citizenry. Bottom line: We've been too fat and lazy for the past century y'all.
I don't want a their New World Order - how do we stop them?
How far are you willing to go down the rabbit hole?
And now it is put to rest, for the time being, allowing equities to continue marching upwards. It's a matter of time before it truly becomes a major economic problem but it looks like we just bought 3 more years time.
With all the negative news out of the way, it will truly take a major global event like war in Iran to derail the current trend. This really shouldn't be surprising to anyone.
Before responding to the virtually ubiquitous ZH poster "HarryWanger", please be aware of just whom and what you are dealing with in this person:
http://www.minyanville.com/businessmarkets/articles/AAPL-apple-gm-psycho...
His real name is James Kostohryz, and he is here posing as a troll in dishonesty and in disregard for the fundamental purposes of this forum. He is NOT posting here in good faith, but is purposely antagonizing those with independent, anti-establishment views and opinions for his own selfish and cynical purposes, as part of a self-styled study on "the psychology of permabears".
He believes that anyone who opposes the current widespread fraud, corruption and rampant lies within our societies and governments are "utopian" and unrealistic, "pollyannish dreamers".
And for those ZeroHedgers who are advocates of sound money backed by gold, this bankster shill is already out there with one of the most disingenuous, dishonest, historically ignorant pieces of pro-establishment propaganda on the topic, expounding on how such monetary and financial integrity is "impossible", and merely "the rants of an ideological fringe":
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/The-Gold-Standard-Solid-as-minyanville-285...
Please do NOT respond to this reprehensible troll, here or anywhere else on ZeroHedge. He is NOT here in good faith, and should be shunned!
Thanks for the research, akak, but I think most of us already knew he was a troll of some kind, reprehensible or worse.
Referring to Mr. Wanger as a shill does a disservice to all the really good shills out there !
Even the trolls are amusing on ZH. What a site!
Fact-free opinions, whether supporting or refuting my own point of view (developed from data) have no bearing or impact on the discourse.
Harry "Oracle of my Oriface" Wanger can post here until he wears the prints off his fingertips for all I care. I don't understand what he's trying to achieve, or what feelings of self-esteem he's dealing with.
The signal to noise ratio in the Zerohedge broadcast is impressive. I can understand why people want to shield themselves from the bad news -- the uncomfortable truths -- the unintended consequences. But unless you understand a problem, you can't act to solve it. I want to be in control of a solution, not a victim of consequence.
Buy some more, Harry. You're another retail outsider on an inside game.
Very good info, thanks. Why can't ZH just delete his account and ban his IP?
Failing that, why don't we have an "ignore" option?
Harry,
Well, not exactly Portugal is in the warm up circle. Matter of fact Portugal is going to have to come up with some money it doesn't have.
akak, give it a rest. He is a short-term trader.
You've won me over. Extend and pretend can work indefinitely in a country full of idiots. These games won't end until the bombs start falling and the maps change.
EDIT: You're obviously a troll, but all that matters these days is the official propaganda. It's what everyone trades on (those who make money anyway). No point in being short until the global collapse is the leading story on Entertainment Tonight.
yawn. harry you're far too transparent to piss me off... you can do better harry!
Absolutely, things are really great now. Absolutely no reason to be the least bit concerned about anything. Thanks for pointing that out.
Now we can all relax and watch the Greek austerity show. That should be interesting. Wear a helmet.
The man is just looking to get his Chancellor reelected. Let's watch the actions and not listen to the words. I vote that the jury is still out and that the election is only a few days away.
Dunno nothing , but as I watch the oil spill devastate the gulf, I can't help but think it's going to be the black swan we all have been looking for.
I agree, I posted this on another thread. They are doing "test burns" of the ocean and they are saying the spill is 5 times worse than they thought. That is what they are willing to tell us. Louisiana can't get a break for nothing.
Believe it or not, things here in Louisiana are currently a little bit better than in most of the rest of the country, thanks to the $250 billion or so sent down here after Katrina. The question is who will end up paying for the many billions in damage this oil spill will cause, and I suspect that it will once again be US taxpayers.
How about those who spilt it? They are insured, right? :-/
Curious - why do you think this would be a "black swan" other than the obvious joke about oil covering marine life? In all seriousness, though, I'm wondering why you would think that. Thanks for the response.
Why not put your great intellect to the task and think for yourself? If you are an academic, this should be easy for you
</sarcasm>
Modern Keynesian Economics (sic) + "Academic" = "Great Intellect" = Non Sequitur
And the gap continues to widen between the interest of the out-of-control politicians and central bankers and the taxpayers. Shocking.
"German Fin Min: If Greek Budget Consolidation Succeeds, No Tax Money Will Be Lost"
is this like saying if the sun doesn't come out tomorrow? or if the dog doesn't lick his balls? or if GS cared about its clients money?
"Greek Fin Min: Let the Germans inseminate themselves. This is month 14. Pass the ouzo."
I agree with the problems of moral hazard, the only problem is that so-called "moral hazard" has actually worked. Every single place where a bailout was done, it solved the problem. It's been over a year since the bailouts, and everyone around the world has recovered save for a few crappy places, like Greece. You clean them up a bit, slap a band-aid on them, and it seems like things will just heal themselves.
Look at the US: everything is largely hunky dory, despite the high unemployment (which seems to be abating).
Although it's easy to say in theory it's bad to do it, where is the proof? The proof largely appears that bailouts and "moral hazard" worked. What am I missing? This isn't rhetorical question, I really want to know, because in my head I know that it's wrong, but there just isn't any proof anymore.
I guess you are probably right. Time to stop worrying and learn to love the bailout. Can I still wear my Zero Hedge t-shirt?
it always works, but it has never worked. it all works until it doesn't.
It works the same as that next hit of heroin or that next bottle of whiskey. A hit of heroin will revive a corpse-like junkee, make him/her look pretty good for a little while. Then it wears off......
And the heroin is hidden.bad.assets . It's a powerful economic drug. Without an ongoing fix, the withdrawal brings misery.
Watch for Bunds to weaken, followed by Gilts, and then US Treasurys. The crisis will simply move to the core more quickly as a result of a Greece bailout that is perceived to be "market favorable."
Greece was smart, they grabbed the cash first before its out!
harry if equities continue to go up so do commodities like oil
if youy think we can handle 100 dollar oil now think again.
This sick joke just keeps getting sicker
all big players get bailed out
individuals get the shaft
what about all I have lost with my currency debasement of the pound
where is my bailout
I do admit that I find it puzzling that Shanghai is down 12.5% YTD and Hong Kong is at 5 week lows and there is hardly a mention here. This concerns me more than Greece getting a bailout frankly. I truly don't know what to make of it, if anything.
This isnt exactly the first "Greeced saved; Crisis over; nothing to see here" announcement from the players in this PIGS soap opera.
Still a no win situation for the euro. Greece will of course give only lip service to slowing down the gravy train and much fatter pigs are running to the trough, squealing with delight at the smell of freshly minted tax dollars from Uncle Ben.
Now how on earth will they keep people out of gold? They cant jack equities much higher without strangling the fake recovery with oil priced for a boon unless they crack down on the manipulations of the squid in that regard.
All in all, this "Greece is saved" news is only good for a pop in equities that will run some stops but fizzle out in short order,imo.
Of course it might result in the melt up surging onward and upward, but that will not come as a scot free ride without something else causing Ben some trouble.
The rock and the hard place are creeping closer with every surge in the equitiy markets resulting from the IBs circle jerk bonus generating game. The stakes keep getting higher. Ben is going all in and has the luxury of a cartel of crooks assisted by the MSM to have his cake and eat it too.
These cracks keep popping up in the carefully crafted plan but eventually just plastering them with scarce US taxpayer revenue will not work and then something will have to give, PM prices, inflation, energy prices, 10 year rates, bond yeilds etc.. Ben really is the man of the year for herding a dozen cats and marching them exactly his way with not a single cat stepping out of line. He has so far been sucessful in pulling it off.
I think he is running out of painless options, and a couple cats are about to run astray.
BTW I dont agree with Harry being a troll. I actually resent self appointed board moderators who often break rules of the board in their zeal to discredit a poster who posts different viewpoints, but is civil in their conduct.
Guys like Harry turning out to be right really chaps my ass because I think their calls are running on pure luck and they ignore all evidence to the contrary. I defer judgement of his troll status to the owners of ZH, and Mr Market will ultimately judge his calls just like ours.
Then you clearly did not examine the linked article and the obvious connection between James Kostohryz (who is a known troll in other forums, by mulitple other posters' observations) and "HarryWanger", who identified himself as the author of the attached article.
I hate, HATE having to point out egregious trolls --- I would infinitely rather be reading and posting pertinent financial information --- but I also resent those who, like most Americans, turn a blind eye to obvious and underhanded wrongdoing. You should be venting your misplaced resentment on the REAL guilty party here, not me.
I have seen too many foremerly valuable online forums degenerate and even be outright destroyed due to the harassment and incessant bombardment from committed trolls, and if the managers of this forum think that it will avoid the same fate without some modicum of moderation, they are sadly mistaken. It is always the most intelligent and valuable posters who have the least tolerance for bullshit, and who are inevitably the first to flee from a troll-induced forum degeneration. Mark my words.
I question whether the Finance Minister is truly speaking for Germany. He may well be using up all his rope and Merkel et al are letting him hang himself. We have to wait and see. Is Karlheinz still around pulling strings? Maybe George is now his best friend.
The May 9th state elections will set the tone for Germany. That will not go well for Greece. Capture of the German Finance Minister by the banksters will not go well for his political party.
Check out Der Spiegel international edition on the level of German debt:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,691802,00.html#ref=nlint
I would not be shocked by futher German balking and more downgrades of pig related assets. Futhermore, I dont think even Uncle Ben can print enough money to subsidize
the entire herd of pigs without adverse effects to other areas in capital markets.
The problems are too quickly escalating for anything but a massive european pigs TARP to soothe the markets, piecemeal payday loans to one pig at a time keeps the threat of default alive which tanks the euro, and the hundreds of billions of euros to keep the wolves at bay also tanks the euro.
This would throw a wrench in Bens helicopter, because the piddling earnings of the USA are dependent on a weak dollar.
I could be wrong, but I dont see todays bounce or Germanys caving (if even real) really changing even the short term picture. 2011 is mostly downhill from now, and the equity markets are priced for an imaginary boom largely derived from a temporary confluence of mildly positive data which "suggests" a lot more than can be delivered in terms of a real recovery.
The stock market looks ahead and it isnt seeing nirvana after all and is correcting,imo. Im thinking not just a double dip but several dips at least and some very painful belt tightening before any real sustainable recovery can be had.
First pain to be administered is greater taxes and new taxes,like VAT. It wont matter how mad the sheeple get, they will pay and at most elect the other wolves in elephant clothing on a promise of lower taxes that of course will never come short of revolt. Sheeple by and large are dumb, lazy, and even the ones that might tar and feather the crooks in principle, just cant be rallied from their sofas while their favorite reality show is on.
So Im thinking multiple dips, lowered living standards, no real doomsday at all, just a bizzare mediocre grind with the dems and gop maintianing complete power over the populace.
Its nice to dream of third parties deposing the old system, but they would jut get bought off as well,imo. Look at the tea party getting infiltrated by Sarah Palin and so on.
I agree with you. Also I wonder if they will try a TARP but call it an IMF fund to the countries (remember the increase in IMF funding to 500 billion and more). They may be getting ready to do another European TARP but with US money via the IMF. Look at how fast they started to downgrade the Portugal and Spain debt, it's going from country to country. Someone is counting on the US printing up money to keep the game going on for awhile. The US is in the same position that it was back in 2008 with the mortgages from the banks (which is still on our books). And that is the banks caught themselves in a scenario or bubble where they couldn't force people to pay for something that was underwater, so people where walking away (watch out that they may make a law that makes that impossible to do in the very near future). So internationally the US can't let Europe default because they are tied together in this debt game, if they fall on bad debt/toxic debt then the US falls. So where damned if we do and damned if we don't, but if we do nothing the problem is at our doorstep within days or weeks and we don't want our population to be out for blood.
They have to delay and pray, delay and pray. This way an idea can come about that will make it easy to do the hard things. But it won't, eventually we will feel the pain and when it does it will be like a damn breaking and crashing all those wait and see days and years onto our economy.
I didn't realize Germany was such an Economic powerhouse, capable of bailing out everyone. Maybe they can give all greeks a nice new car also with the Bailout.
Why would Greece want a bailout from the IMF anyway (debt enslavement) , none of it makes any sense but not much does lately.
If this domino effect actually kicks off then we will be watching the countdown to the NWO I suspect. I believe that bailing the Greek government out will not stop the need to bail out the Spanish, Irish, Italian, and English governments. Thus, there is no way a bailout for the Greek government, by the German government-is going to solve anything. If this madness is to stop, the EU needs to kick Greece out, along with any other country that is threatening to blow up in order to save itself, and perhaps AT LEAST delay the spread anywhere else. The EU may only have a core after removing these countries-but at least the core could stabilize and go back to the drawing board, come up with a unified fiscal policy, and then go about selecting member countries again based on real-time criteria. The bailouts will likely doom the EU and bankrupt the core of the EU.
Exellent points, all. Also consider just how much paper out there is riding on either a bailout happening/not happening, default/not defaulting etc. Those who try to claim that a few pigs getting tossed out the pigpen wouldnt affect the USA very much are crazy.
God knows how many zombie banks have direct exposure to the PIGS fate and just how much of it might be 100X leveraged CDO garbage that no one could really afford to cough up if the pigs start going under. This time Uncle Ben might not be there with a fat 100 cents on the dollar check. I bet the premise behind these derivatives is that the pigs would never fail, just like real estate only appreciates exponentially.
Boy, I hoped the sheeple would wake up when they saw what happened to Greece after they spent more than they had (followed by spending more than they could borrow).
Guess that's not going to happen (for a while at least). No hope of waking people up.
Now the Greeks get to spend more than the rest of the world can give them.
We are so f*#$ed.
Damn! And there I was preparing to go long on Drahma. Oh, well...
EURO buying support has returned ...
MARKET UPDATES:
http://www.zerohedge.com/forum/latest-market-outlook-0
Far from over - Germany has elections in May - if Merkel actually issues a check to the Greeks, the Germans (rightfully) will vote her party out. Within 24-months the Deutsche Mark will be back - unfortunately it would be a relatively strong currency so they'll have to find a way to debase it in order to keep their industries competitive - so perhaps the Greeks will do it for them.
Merkel out - Deutsche Mark in - debased by Athens.