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GFI Group Is All About Not Leaking Block Orders To The Algos During Melt Ups
With JPM doing the ritualistic gold slaughter in the hour before the close, it was all systems go. The SPY IOIA in the last 20 minutes of the meltup is nothing short of a work of art, with every single ETF desk going nuts doing their best to telegraph to whatever HFT algos are left that massive blocks are on the bidside and that it is safe to lift every offer. We wish we could present them all but we will limit ourselves to the hundred or so "trades" at 3:49 PM EST by GFI Group. Because this is precisely the best way to split a massive order block into "unobtrusive" child algorithms.
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Reason #122 why the market is rigged. Don't worry - I can outlast Skynet.. because ES will be hitting 600 before it hits 1200..
hmm dougnut
try the off buttom
Math Ph.Ds have become financial carpet bombers.
OK, so no one obeys NYSE or NASD Regulations any more... and the market is more or less rigged, baby...
(1) Regulations have 100 exemptions or are not enforced at all.
(2) If actually enforced, fines are 2 orders of magnitude << profits.
(3) The Top 10,000 securites executives, money managers, and traders understand this perfectly. This has all evolved rather slowly over the past 10 years.
So none of this is even remotely news to Pros. GFI stock is down 80% last 2 years... they are hardly a Robber Baron, my friends.
Trading is all about adapting and staying ahead of the curve. No one is forcing you to trade securities that are gamed by Algos. There are endless things to trade where this is not a big problem. Please read the previous sentence several times.
The ONLY solution is to CRIMINALIZE regulatory non-compliance. Make it DEAD SERIOUS. Right now theft of millions is basically a civil misdemeanor. Send people to JAIL for market manipulation. Either get THAT serious... or do nothing.
Idiotic proposals like Transaction Taxes are a Marxist Sledgehammer... you hurt all the Good Guys to shout down the Bad Guys... and destroy what's left of market liquidity.
+3.141592653589793238462...
True dat. God forbid we should regulate markets.
GFI = Get Fucked Immediately
How can one profit from Skynet?
That's exactly my point : how to profit from skynet ? Buy yourself a market scanner software and compare volumes in SPY 2 hours before market close. Should make you $$$$$$...:=)
Remember the "good ole days" when we all complained about those "damn specialists & market makers"? Who was the gangster who while taking a NYSE floor tour and having it explained to him what the specialist did said "I joined the wrong mob". He would really shit a brick if he saw this.
Tyler Durden for investigative journalist of the year.
Make that Independent Blog Investigator. He should never be insulted with the demeaning term journalist.
Yea but 'blog' is gay so Independent Investigator.
You won today, I'll say you won today. I do not want to lump you with the other guys.
Is that the latest rubber doll in your collection?
Robotrader wannabe
Are the good guys brownshirts?
This cannot be velobabe. She has clothes on.
If she didn't have her clothes on, I'd venture to say that her nipples wouldn't be crosseyed either. Nor would we all get herpes from looking.
...I'm not saying, I'm just saying I have to fight the sudden urge to gnaw my arm off every time her name gets brought up...
Jeez, Leo, a closing pop by manipulation and you act like it's 1950 in America again.
Try taking the high road when you are right, or learn to take the abuse when you are wrong. You can't have it both ways.
Leo
I hope you are right
It gives me more time to prepare.
When the States start defaulting or are being bailed out by the Gubment.
It's game "ON" !
How many airmiles do I need to collect to get one of those?
Dammit Leo, I can't make out the airline!
Grrr.....they look like that, I'd put up with TSA and fly it.
Russian skank. Bist du ruska leo?
umm..Leo hijacked the thread, no content, not even OT.
Since revealing himself as a choirboy of the BoCanada I think we are quickly narrowing the possibilities here.
STFU
SYOSTFU
Whatever. The folks who run Skynet at taxpayer's expense would sell their mom for a buck.
Whoever wrote this subsection of Skynet is probably an Asberger's case, which would put them low on the "likes people" scale.
This has got to be Dennis Kneale AKA Beaker AKA Leo.
Only dood stupid enough to post this type of shite.
They need the robots to feel secure enough to create momentum in this bidless market? Maybe they should just have the robots watch CNBC.
Maybe they should have the robots as anchors on cnbc...oh wait....
The robots have been hitting the Yayo too hard and are becoming paranoid.
If those are robots ...some of them have some amazin bewbs
I count 17,900 shares of SPY.
That is a whopping 934 shares of Exxon Mobil, and less of the other 499 S&P components by market cap.
In SPY, this is nothing.
I believed you missed the point. The big block buying to prop up the market 10 min. before the close.
> I believed you missed the point. The big block buying to prop up the market
> 10 min. before the close.
17K shares of SPY is NOT a big block.
On 357M shares traded today, if you are going to post about a big block trade, I would think you could do better than 0.005% of the volume.
This represents 100 trades at 3:49 ET (1 minutes worth of trading and not even all the trades that happened in that 1 minute)not the whole day. If your talking about 375M shares trading in one minute rather than a whole day then I understand your comparison otherwise I don't get the correlation.
There are a lot of small block trades and Tyler is suggesting that they were big block trades broken up into small blocks as to not attract attention, this is very hard to prove even though he probably is right. I was looking at the Big block trades(1-2K) that came right when divergance was showing that a selloff was imminent and rather than selling off it was pumped back up. BTW I was trading the ESMO.
Who cares..all big 'block' trades these days (unless you dont give a fuck, check out the single 2.3mm RIG print around 16:30) go through HFT so as to minimize potential loss from having a front running bastard jump in a few seconds before you buy that 1MM shares of F for your fund.
I can't speak for the ES but i know first hand its more common than not to do so with regular equities.
7.5 hours * 60 minutes = 450 minutes
375M / 450 = 833.3K per minute.
So, this block trade in SPY on an even distribution of trades throughout the day was still meaningless, representing 2% of the volume that minute.
Of course, given that trading at 3:49PM is anything but average, the real figure for that minute was much below 2%.
"I was looking at the Big block trades(1-2K)"
I guess big is relative, but in SPY, noone notices 17K shares, let alone 1-2K.
The total volume at 3:49 was 862,576. You would have to see all the trades to tell which was buying or selling, and thats a lot of trades to post or go through. Like Tyler said 200 pgs.
But the point of the article was that they are breaking up the big blocks into smaller ones so you can't distinguish the big buyers from the small, and gives the appearance there is wide spread support on the buy side IMO.
Good to see you back peterpeter after proclaiming previously (http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2010/04/zero-edge/#comment-276590) that "any utility Zero Hedge may have had has been lost." We welcome you with open arms and value your added lack of utility.
That means: "Go stand on the porch again, space monkey."
Lack of utility doesn't equal lack of entertainment.
People getting all wet about 17K SPY is amusing.
In that case I am confident you can entertain and/or make yourself all wet elsewhere as you pull the other 200 pages of EOD IOIA action, where all your other favorite desks disclose millions in SPY being split into child orders in a fashion that would make exhibitionists blush.
Forgive him, Tyler, for he knows not what he says.
slurping spoos and sucking spreads
The way that the page shows in my Firefox has the usual right blocks eclipsing where the screenshot presumably shows page X of 200 pages.
My home comp spreads it out enough to show it properly. Perhaps some cannot see the full screenshot to get the point of your post.
I see this all of the time on buys of shares. Even on a purchase of 2000 shares of some 2.50 stock, it is littered with up to 20 trades or more. Who trades 125.00 worth of shares twenty times in a row, and in ten thousandths of a dollar?
Yeah, I know the answer.
Why is "everybody" obsessed with SPY "manipulation" ? You should concentrate more on heavy weighted equity constituents in S&P 500. If low beta equity constituents pricing = constant AND high beta equity constituents beta = exploding => effect : KABOOM...momo players like this very much
Obvious optimism from the big boys. Can't wait to see GS's 2Q trading results. If no loses again then they are complicit in the market fall as well as the rise.
"If no loses again then they are complicit in the market fall as well as the rise."
And considering the market topped out in April, we shall know in 2 months if you're supposition is correct. I bet they lose money for a few days so they can say they weren't perfect and thus it's not rigged.
BTW while watching CNBC yesterday the GS and friends perfect quarter was brought up during a conversation. I won't mention anyone who said what because I can't find the clip on CNBC but it was at the very end of that new "strategy session" at noon.
The perfect quarter was mentioned and the other person said yes, wasn't it very interesting, they they went to commercial. As the music played and the camera started to pull back, that unmistakable look passed between them that spoke a thousands words.
They knew exactly what it implied and they were not surprised or even bothered. There is no doubt in my mind that not only are they aware of the Ponzi but they also know they are shills for the Ponzi.
all players on television are actors. some are method actors, but all of 'em are reciting script (whether self-scripted, or authored) for cameras. . . actors.
"There is no doubt in my mind that not only are they aware of the Ponzi but they also know they are shills for the Ponzi."
I'm not so sure about this. Humans are remarkably adept at deluding themselves.
In the words of George Costanza, "It's not a lie if you believe it."
I bet they lose money for a few days so they can say they weren't perfect and thus it's not rigged
This is what I thought when they announced their record profit in previous quarters, but not only did they not downplay it, but the next quarter was more, then a no loosing trades quarter. No loosing trades quarter, are you fucking kidding me they might as well say we frontrun, manipulate, and own the market. Its like pitching a perfect season not game, but season. Its just impossible.
I looked for the Strategy Session online couldn't find the reference you were talking about. OMG how do you stomach that shit. Love the Faber prelude "Context is Power" utter crap. The spin is over the top and Faber's I'm in love gaze while looking at John Mack, Jesus .
Hate ramp jobs, it is a waste of time, let the freaking thing just die already!!
Once we are at S&P 200 everyone will realize this type of jobs were a freaking waste of time.
Whack gold, pump spy. That's all the plan they have? No wonder we are all doomed.
This, this is a very DANGEROUS plan.
I isn't smart nuff, someone splain to me. Is this demonstrating that the broker intentionally broke up a huge sell order into smaller blocks so skynet will gobble it up?
Tyler, is there an ioia primer for dummies? I think it would be very helpful to have a for dummies section for new readers. I am not a new reader, but I still don't understand some of the things you have covered. It sounds like you are saying that this is all a giant conspiracy by prop desks to pump the market. Has any whistle blower ever come forrward (in the last year and a half)? Also, the amount of spy's in the picture don't look like a lot.
ZH is the Marianas Trench, with thousands of sharks in search of blood and one giant vampire squid lurking at the bottom.
There is no kiddie pool, jump in at your own risk.
+1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFOEZh1Lbbg
BIG squid
Has any whistleblower not been jailed or suicided in recent times?
One got hit by a car.
They caught the kid that leaked the murder the Bloomberg Photogrophers video. I just hope they are smart enough to be nice to him.
...the combination of your generic name and use of industry specific "key words"; I am convinced you may be a gov. blog drone of sorts. I hope they are not that stupid though
If you are looking for law and order, you have come to the wrong place. Law and order is for Statists. This is Deadwood.
Okay, some of you are really not paying attention to a thing you have read here. Those of you that are saying that it is such a small order seem to have missed the fact that it says page X/144, and that it is only one broker you are looking at. Additionally, all of these orders were for the last 10 min of trading. If you still do not understand, please just continue reading marketwatch.com
+∞
as in 10^200 teeny weeny below the radar trades. Nothing to see here.
Who's not paying attention?
Few things:
1: Each order compared to the daily volume is as large as a modicum of plankton in the ocean. Even the total volume as presented (note its 3 pages) is still small.
2: Could be one broker, could be many brokers. The focus on this post was only on GFIG.
3. Yes, these highlite orders the last ~10minutes of the day, and yes, mostly to the upside. So? Are you also surprised the 15:59 minute candle always has the largest volume as well?
News tomorrow pre-market? All short term shit but could be a set up for tomorrow. No?
Well those Spaniards were rioting while they were supposed to be on siesta. So all hell might be breaking loose there soon.
Siesta and rioting are not mutually exclusive? I'm thinking something along the lines of ECB activity to give the markets a jolt or QE 2.0.
Us regular folk are always the last to know.
I know goldbugs hate Denninger but I really enjoyed this piece. If there is any gravity to his observation, our little bump up today could mark a big jump down very, very soon.
http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/2355-Whistling-Past-The-Grav...
Duh. Look at the ramp they are building. This is definitely one big shark they are trying to jump. Poor poor fonzi. Poor cracker is going get turned into a lunchable.
So can we expect the S&P to catch up with the EUR like it began to do today? Seems like they are vigorously attempting to decouple.
Come on ladies and biatches... It was so predictable, sp bouncing off of the low forties twice, early in the day. You couldn't possibly think that they were going to let it go when it probed down through forty-five at around 2pm... No Way....! Although I agree with Tyler, they played it like a bunch of amateurs. Don't send a boy to do a man's job.... This market is like a Backgammon match vs. a computer, if you make the "next to best" moves, you will always win.... That's how you play against the algos, that's how you mess them up.
Best regards,
Econolicious
Like the EUR interventions these ramps to are becoming more expensive and yielding smaller and shorter life spans.
Yes, the market action for the day is always predictable after the close.
WORD
ma. nip. u. la. tion.
I think I will start a religion and turn each of those syllables into mantras. Each will have their own meaning. I will have a lot to do with the ganga smoking and incense. Lots of cash flow and babes. Standard model actually.
TD, KNEW you'd be on top of this -- was hoping you would, and posted this on StockTwits.com:
girl_money $ES_F $SPX $NQ_F hope Zerohedge.com will cover what's behind the decoupling of the major indices tonight. not too subtle, was it? Jun. 8 at 4:30 PM
Have just gone back and posted on StockTwits how you've got the screen shot to prove the pump.
So, if your site gets bombarded, it's my fault.
Fight on, TD, Marla, et al, fight on.
I will try to keep this simple, for you morons out there that keep harassing the happy-happy KoolAid drinkers.
Why use derogatory and inflammatory language against those that think things are good?
Treat them like Gods, and keep them around.
Who will buy the shit you want to sell if they leave the market?
'Nuff said.
Bull support has evaporated, technical levels breached. The (bear) trend in equities is re-asserting itself. The past 15-18 months have been a fabricated bear market rally (botox for bank balance sheets) that probably cost US taxpayers $3 trillion+.
I think Leo and many other rearview mirror-types believe that TPTB are actually 'in control' and everything is going 'according to plan'. This is where they are wrong. The economic paradigm is shifting and it is NOT going the direction that TPTB had anticipated. TPTB are NOT in control... matters are well out-of-hand, and NOT manageable by the NWO.
If you think flat/negative growth in the eurozone - and an abnormaly strong dollar - are somehow positive for US equities, then I have some pristine FLA gulf coast property to show you...
Leo (and other 20th-century paradigm nostalgists) are in DEEP denial.
Crushing the hope of the hopeless though, is self-defeating.
+1
Need to fill out that right shoulder. lulz
Yes sir, I'll take it for the gift it is and add more exposure. These tools are trying to rig an already fixed outcome. How do I spell joy? Sovereign default bitches!
Just wanted to point out that chopped up block trades wouldn't have been economically viable before they substantially lowered per-trade expenses. Law of unintended consequences strikes again.
What good is all the smoke and mirrors going to be after jobs continue to disappoint and real estate sales tank in coming months. Unemployment benefits are about to be extended yet again to prevent an absolute crash in housing.
Hey All,
I think Zero Hedge is by far one of the best and honest sites out there. But I think we do Tyler and all a disservice by voicing our personal opinions with profanity, vulgarity and disrespect to others who post here.
I do not agree with Leo on many of his thesis, but I respect his opinion to voice them and share them with us. That is why there are markets. Always two sides. Leo puts a lot of effort, time and thought to his blog and this site. To constantly rip his thoughts, and attack him or anyone personally, right or wrong takes away from what we are trying to do here. Voice honest yet opposing opinions on a subject.
I believe we are in big trouble and gold is the way to go moving forward. But am I always right. Of course not. And his thoughts on pensions and how broken they are is a tell for us also.
So, maybe a little less vulgarity, a little more respect for each other and I think we will get a lot more respect from those who really do hate this site.
Thanks Zero Hedge
+ a couple of CHFs contracts
Pepper bitchez!
Just who the fuck cares if the fucking haters don't like ZH.
Fuck them. And thier little dogs too.
Learn to spell, Toto.
The free market is a bitch and free speech is overrated. You want to be moderator?
Moderation is for monks. To enjoy the full flavor of life, take big bites.
Cheers.
Self-moderation is godly, except in the consumption of adult libations.
That's right! Get stiffer than a preacher's dick in a calf's ass and you won't give a flying fuck what some uptight prude thinks bitchez!
"To discuss how Greece's crisis will affect your portfolio, we have three hot blondes."
LMAO! That is a classic!!!!!!!!
This a public service announcement for the department of little engines that could.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dYgjtwNwpw&feature=related
The saddest thing about the gold whack is that they do because it is one of the few places they can find any liquidity. That right there ought to tell you something.
Oil went from $80 to $150 to $30 in a few months. A commodity that every soul in the world (bar a few tribes) uses every day. "They" can - and will - do anything to the markets in the short and medium term. Reality is of no consequence.
I'm fearing a stupendous long squeeze on Gold. If they take it down to $300 an Oz will you sell?
I wouldn't - but then I know the market is insane. Not "wrong" so much as manipulated into pure theatre. Get ready.
"Make that Independent Blog Investigator. He should never be insulted with the demeaning term journalist."
That's for sure. In Tyler we trust.
What are your orders sir ?
This country is going down fast: No morals, brain dead from idiot boxes, two wars, lies from everyone 'in charge', an oil leak destroying the gulf, and bankers in need of a lead delivery tune-up.
We are one crop failure from cival war.
This isn't trading its hacking. Deficiencies in electronic trading systems are being exploited with help from the exchanges who also make money off it.
This gold issue, seems like it is still pretty high to me. Isn't it normal for some folks to take profits after a sudden run up like this? I guess I am pretty happy with how it is performing and don't want to complain.
I expect major volatility. This ain't it.
voice of reason, I am surprised that you weren't junked by the glod fundamentalists.
Looks like the hacking begins after coffee,
drops off during the noon pussy break,
and picks up when the someone breaks out the cocaine.
Day after day after day.
Is this a great country, or what?
I wanna know how much a bankster screams when angry mobs with pitchforks and torches drag them onto the streets to kick the air. Let me know when they do the JPM crowd I want a front row seat.
Just do it quietly and feed 'em to the pigs in Chinatown, Deadwood style.
Met a guy from this HFT trading firm this morning. He said "it's all about connectivity." He trades the ES and looks for correlation with other trades. I said, "the EURJPY?" He said, "yes, that and others". He elaborated: "the ES is traded in Chicago, the SPX is traded in NY. Factoring in the speed of light between NY and Chicago, we can trade on that. Also, fiber optic is better in Chicago, which allows for some trading."
Based solely on what I have learned from ZH, I asked, "Do you believe that yesterday's sell off had to do with the rollover of the ES from June to September?" He said, "Maybe. It is true that we trade less during the rollover time since the normal patterns get jumbled up during this time, and it is hard to understand the trading."
I looked up the types of people they are hiring. Does not in any way resemble a trading firm:
Open PositionsI noticed that CNBS and Bloomie are rolling out the buy, buy, buy talking heads. They are telling us that this is the best time to buy in our lifetime...no lie....sounds very familiar but I could be wrong ????
PONZI, PONZI, PONZI, OIH, OIH, OIH
PPT (plunge Protection team) , pop to dow 10,400 ish.. load the shorts.