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Gold Bar Premiums At 17-Year High In Hong Kong
Submitted by GoldCorp.
Gold Bar Premiums at 17-Year High in Hong Kong – Safe Haven Bid on Inflation and Egypt Concerns
The geopolitical ramifications of the revolution in Egypt and the likelihood that it will spread throughout the Middle East, North Africa and possibly further afield is leading to volatility in markets. Equity indices in the Middle East and Far East were mostly down (except for China) overnight. European bourses were under pressure this morning but have recovered somewhat.
Gold and silver are marginally lower after their strong showing Friday which resulted in silver closing the week 1.7% higher and gold being tentatively lower (-0.14%). Remarks by a People’s Bank of China advisor that the Chinese should diversify into gold and silver are very important (see below).
(Click to enlarge) Gold in USD and CFTC Gold Open Interest - 2 Years (Daily)
NYMEX crude is up some 0.4% to just over $90.00 (see long term chart below) and Brent crude remains close to $100 a barrel this morning. Oil’s nearly 5% surge on Friday to end the week higher was ominous and the possibility of unrest spreading to other oil rich dictatorships such as Saudi Arabia is making investors nervous. The Middle East and North Africa produce more than a third of the world's oil and OPEC has warned of a possible oil “shortage”.
Oil in USD – 5 Years (Daily)
Any speculative froth seen when gold recently rose above $1,400/oz has been removed from the gold market as can be seen in the gold futures open interest numbers. Open interest has fallen by more than a third since early September. Those short the market have once again managed to flush out the weak paper longs who have been shaken out of positions.
Open interest levels are now well below those seen after the last period of correction and consolidation in the first quarter of 2010 (see first chart above) and we may now have seen capitulation.
Short positions remain high and concentrated with a few market players, especially JP Morgan, and they are vulnerable to a short squeeze, should prices begin to move up again. This seems likely given the tight physical demand situation in the market internationally.
Further evidence of this was seen in the fact that premiums for gold bars in Hong Kong are at their highest levels in 17 years (since 1994) as Chinese, Indian and wider Asian buying continues. Deepening inflation has led to strong demand and the geopolitical instability in Egypt and the possibility that it could spread throughout the Middle East and North Africa will lead to safe haven buying.
China Should Buy More Gold, Silver for Reserves – Chinese Central Bank Advisor
People's Bank of China adviser Xia Bin told the Economic Information Daily today that China should steadily increase its holdings of gold, silver and other precious metals. In an interview with the paper Xia said that “holdings of gold and silver can help establish the yuan as an international currency by increasing China's "final payment capacity." He advised buying precious metals on the dips and while gold and silver are marginally lower today, the remarks are another long term positive for the gold market.
Only last month, Xia made similar comments saying that the People’s Bank of China should diversify their massive $2.7 trillion foreign exchange reserves away from US dollars and increase their gold reserves as a long term strategy in order to help internationalise the yuan. The Chinese wish to make the yuan an accepted international reserve currency and establish it as a currency that will be used for payment and settlement in international trade.
China’s gold holdings, at 1,054 tonnes, remain miniscule compared to the over 8,000 tonnes held by the US Federal Reserve (gold only accounts for 1.6 percent of China’s massive currency reserves). With the supply and demand equation already tight due to international investment demand and central banks having become net buyers rather than net sellers, even a small amount of diversification out of their US dollar holdings and into gold should lead to much higher gold prices.
The reference to silver was important as it marks the first time in modern times that a central bank advisor or official has spoken about diversifying currency reserves into silver. It shows how the Chinese view silver as money rather than as simply a commodity to be consumed. Indeed, the Chinese like most of the world, used silver as currency for most of their history.
The comments may signal the start of a growing shift from seeing silver purely as an industrial commodity to seeing silver more like gold – as both an industrial commodity but more importantly as a store of value and as money. As Milton Friedman pointed out, the major monetary metal throughout history was silver, rather than gold.
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Does anyone in the world buy gold before the daily Blythe gold dump? Just wondering...
CNBC is parading the gold bleed quote like the moneychangers paraded JC's crucifixion...
quite the display...
wow, look, there it is again...
try getting this level of reliability when gold happens to be green...
i always know when gold is up when watching muted CNBC... the damn quote never comes up.
I've sold all my gold one week ago, and I don't regret it.
Even your gold plated dildo?
he couldn't find it. His wife hid it somewhere...
Warmer warmer, HOT HOT HOT, colder colder....
Libertarians and permabears are so rude.
They are just bitter from being so wrong all the time.
Look out behind you! Bondzilla is coming!
LOL
Give it up losers.
I cant believe you just uttered those words...didn't you mean "right 27% yoy of the time"?? I can sympathise with the gold bugs, i really can.
I JUST CANT BELIEVE YOU HAVE WATCHED GOLD HEADING FOR THE MOON IN THE LAST 10 FOIKIN YEARS AND SAY WHAT YOU JUST SAID...YOU KNOW WHAT, F*** IT, I GIVE UP. ITS TRUE WHAT THEY SAY, "ARGUMENTS ONLINE ARE LIKE THE SPECIAL OLYMPICS-EVEN IF YOU WIN YOUR'E STILL A SPASTIC. GO LOOK AT A CHART.
Calm down, it's just a redneck.
Actually I would say, "not a redneck". The redneck is WAAaay more likely to be a goldbug than a bondholder
Over the longer term, too, the case for gold seems less compelling, say some analysts. While the metal has traditionally been seen as a buffer against runaway inflation and a collapsing dollar, at these prices gold may have less value as an insurance policy than investors might think.
Take inflation. From 1968—when investors started to price in the possibility of the U.S. dropping the gold standard—to 2001, the price of gold rose 5.6% a year, while the Consumer Price Index gained 5.1% annually. That hasn't been the case recently: Since 2001 gold has surged 18.8% annually, while the CPI has risen just 2.3%.
I also like how those "analysts" conveniently forget to factor inflation into the value of their stock portfolio.
Even assuming the price of gold now includes a premium for protection against a falling dollar, a collapse in the stock market and inflation, gold still looks expensive, says Vadim Zlotnikov, chief market strategist at Alliance Bernstein Research. He calculates that the current price reflects fears of a 20% decline in stocks, a 20% drop in the dollar and an inflation rate above 4%, based on historical performance. (The inflation rate is currently 1.5%.)
Yes, and the econ. pundrity has been spot on to date. Uhm not. Only time is going to tell. Market analysts make money pumping a market. I don't lend them any more credence than a Goldline ad tearing it down.
I don't shill for metal; do whatever you want, and best of luck. Rather, I never cease to be amazed at the vehemence towards people who are taking the other side of the trade.
99% of the gold vs. fiat arguments here are started by trolls.
"gold still looks expensive, says Vadim Zlotnikov, chief market strategist at Alliance Bernstein Research"
And who the fuck is this guy? Nice try Bill. All those numbers are crap and if you took the time to investigate, you'd already know that and wouldn't post this propaganda.
"over the longer term"???
Over the longer term gold WAS money for 5,000 years!
We now have a lot of worthless paper currencies 'floating' against each other...and, they are falling apart.
If there is no center...and, gold is the center...the the center cannot hold.
Gold is money amd it is worth less and less dollars as the days go by.
Which really doesn't explain how as money supply goes up, so do premiums for physical. Denying the effect of ETF's on price is a Flat Earth approach to the debate.
You'll find a new theory as people sell more and more of the ETFs out of portfolio. Don't be a ham brain.
Damn, you really are the crappiest troll yet.
That is 100% reliant on an individual's need for short term liquidity. If you really believe that LONG TERM, a store of wealth with thousands of years of stability will be beaten to death by global fiat... As I've said before, "All the best." I personally don't care what your play was. I won't be knocking at your door looking for supper, regardless of the outcome.
If you are so heavily tied to physical that you may need to sell in the next six months to live, than I may side with you in the Ham Brain argument. That isn't my scenario. I personally like the fact that I'm cushioned regardless of the outcome. I TRULY hope my children inherit my worthless Barbarous Relics. I just kind of doubt it will be the case.
Are yu any relation to Fat bastard?
You sound the same
Not in any currency I look at. Gold hasn't had a down year since 2001. I'd say, on that basis, my gold is worth more and more as the days go by. Unless your math is different from mine.
Phew
At least we know Hammy the Wanker and Billy the f'headbondholder aren't gold bugs.
That assures us of at least another 3 year run. However, be on guard once these two fucknuts start pounding the table on the precious then you know the top is in.
Yup the BillyBastard and the Wanker Oscillator is now active bookmark accordingly.
Libertarians are too quaint, im more of a libertine.
Nice, bet you made a hefty profit too. Gold bugs are loons No way we will go back to pinching gold dust. We will go all digital before we go back to the barbaric bartering with gold.
Libertarian loons are living in a dream world or are actively hoping for total collapse. Sickening.
Best of luck to you. I love how you equate cynicism with hoping for a total collapse. Add that to the performance of metal in the last few years and your argument is pretty thin.
Since 2001 gold has surged 18.8% annually, while the CPI has risen just 2.3%.
Which means it is outpacing inflation by a satisfying margin. I would actually say that it HAS NOT performed as well, because CPI is a joke. If you are calling it a bubble, that's the million dollar question isn't it?
Don't get me wrong, I firmly believe that if gold hits $50,000, it will mainly be because of inflationary pressure rather than some reversion to a gold standard or magical gold fairy dust.
When the fiat bubble bursts, and the dust settles Gold and Silver will still have value. What it will be is anybodies guess, but I'm all in on the bet that it will be more than Bernanke Bucks or Ipad stocks.
Re: William the bastard - Always nice to see the dolts amongst us still have the moxy to show up on ZH and flap... And so, once again ladies and gentlemen, we seem to be dealing with a totally fucktarded individual.
Dear William,
Please feel free to rejoin the conversation when you've pulled your head from the FED's asshole and realize inflation has been a tad in excess of 2.3% annualized since 2001. Until then, enjoy playing with your Tonka trucks in the shitbox while the grown-ups engage in serious conversation.
Yours Truly,
Nathan Wind
Digital what? Dollars? Maybe you havent heard, but we are currently experiencing problems with the dollar.
can i quote yoda? "you will be... you WILL be....."
STOP REPLYING TO THIS DOUCHE!
can't you make them wiggle?
Perhaps if you were to post a list of the software that you used to create domokun, we all could be twitchin'!
If it doesn't rain would you cancel your flood insurance? Think of metals as insurance.
Sold all your gold? Smart move.
Hopefully you've reinvested all your money in municipal bonds. Suckers are sorely needed to keep the system running for a few more months. Is retirement in Egypt an option?
Sold your gold tooth?
Gold toof, Bitch!
One thing I fail to understand is that why most analysts are recommending the purchase of Gold as a safe investment? The problem today is that the price of Gold is not derived by it's physical demand or supply but more by the speculative positions standing long or short on the commodity exchange like any other traded commodity, stock or currency.
The basic mechanism of price discovery (based on demand and supply for actual use) of anything traded on an exchange has been terminally infected by speculators having access to unlimited funds and super fast computers for trading leading to volatile price swings. This has been made worse by the launch of ETFs for anything and everything under the sun by the financial community.
The price of everything including Gold is likely to suffer when the speculators unwind their positions due to some event that they have not anticipated or foreseen.
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article24581.html
Will you please stop posting this shit on every gold thread? Please??
Gold certainly is cheaper these days, having fallen 5.7% in 2011 alone. But investors who rush in now could be setting themselves up for disappointment.
Classically a hedge against inflation, gold morphed into a hedge against economic collapse during the financial crisis and rallied strongly last year as fears mounted of a double-dip recession in the U.S. and a debt crisis in Europe. Those fears have largely eased, though gold did rally Friday on turmoil in the Middle East. By and large, investing in gold is once again a bet on global inflation.
While there are signs of higher costs for raw materials in the U.S. and abroad, prices might not be rising fast enough to justify gold's current price of $1,340.70 an ounce, say some strategists. Emerging-market central banks, meanwhile, are raising interest rates to tackle rising prices.
"For gold to rise there needs to be demand for a safe haven, a weak U.S. dollar and inflation fears," says Pierre Lapointe, a strategist at brokerage firm Brockhouse Cooper. "We don't see any of these in 2011."
lol. Damn right alone. No other declines anywhere for the past ten years.
How can you idiots fail to understand the simple concept of a correction in a bull market? There has been no parabolic blow off, which is the only thing that can confirm the end of a bull market, aside from, say, a year long decline.
Hehehe, this guy doesn't see a demand for safe havens in the next year. Must have his head up a unicorn's ass.
"Damn, you really are the crappiest troll yet."
God I miss Johnny Bravo. At least he had actual thoughts in his head. Lately all we get is cut and paste dumbasses that don't even understand what they're pasting. It gets more amazing by the day.
I don't. JB used to threadshiat to the extent you'd see his name on every other post, all with inane comments, to the extent I just gave up reading threads he "contributed" to.
I don't really either. But at least he cracked a book, and talked about some broken rising inverted tea cup wedgehandles. He is a kid, and trying. I HATED his immaturity, but actually appreciated that he was making an effort to learn. Better than most his age.
Pierre Lapointe? Another one of your experts? LMAO.
You should be a stand up comedian Bill.
Lollll
old copypasta is old
Seriously, next time I see this posted on here, I'm taking a scalp.
LOL Post of the week.
I will give you a Silver Eagle if you actually post one,, just one original thought. I will give you two Silver Eagles if you just fuck off and die.
One thing I continually fail to understand is why you continue to post this silly nonsense here. ZH readers are (mostly) too smart to fall for this.
Another thing I don't understand is why most analysts are recommending the purchase of US T-bills and Equities as a safe investment. The problem today is that the price of US Treasuries and Equities are not derived by it's physical demand or supply but more by the speculative positions standing long or short on the US Fed POMO buy-back scheme.
The basic mechanism of price discovery (based on demand and supply for actual use) of anything traded on an exchange has been terminally infected by speculators having access to unlimited funds (e.g Banks with the Feds money) and super fast computers for trading leading to volatile price swings. This has been made worse by the launch of ETFs for anything and everything under the sun by the financial community.
The price of everything that speculators are net long is likely to suffer when the speculators unwind their positions due to some event that they have not anticipated or foreseen. While the price of things that speculators are net-short on (Silver, Gold) will spike due to a short-squeeze.
There I "fixed your post for you.
1 OZ silver costs 32 euro here in europe. NOW THAT'S A PREMIUM!!
43$ !!!!
http://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/silver-coins/austrian-philharmonic/austri...
£20.27 = $32 (in quantities of 500) in Ole Blighty, pre-VAT. $38.50, including VAT.
I bet if you buy 5000, you'll even get a bigger discount.
If I buy 500,000, the LBMA might even give me cashback (provided I settle in cash)!
I can get 1 oz coins for 24 euro in Germany (including) a 7% tax
where's that?
Just west of Poland
LOL...even funnier that it was our resident Belgian doing the asking.
http://westgold.de/html/prizeList.php
Maple Leaf silver 23.90 euro incl. 7% VAT
or look at the ads at Hartgeld.com
not exactly the kind of site where I'd buy my silver.
Have you ever bought on it?
Try this website, it updates prices from different German websites :) Avoid buying in the Netherlands, since they now apply 19% VAT to bullion coins. Germany is still 7% and they do ship to Belgium (as long as their exporting limit is not reached).
http://www.bullion-investor.com/price
"1 OZ silver costs 32 euro here in europe. NOW THAT'S A PREMIUM!!
43$ !!!!"
Example of physical price decoupling from paper? Can't be. Metalbugs are just loons.
Where is that then? I got it for around 26 euro: zilver999.be
I have no idea. I was quoting another post.
Sorry. I junked you accidentally.
UNJUNK
are there just dildos, sheep and lemmings left??? ... http://www.kronwitter-muenzen.de ... you can get it for 23.90€ including 7% VAT
Don't ask me, ask the guy upthread WHOM I WAS QUOTING. That's what the little " " thingys mean.
@ S D
Don't know where you shop, but I bought some (silver eagle) yesterday for €24.67 each.
BTW Did someone tell you that you have a lousy avatar.
open interest is useless as the decline was revealed to be due mostly to closed out spread trades, as reported here on Zero Hedge on Friday. Speculative net longs have indeed declined sharply, but are well above 2008 lows (in fact, double the lows). Too early to call capitulation in my view.
We as humans need to recognize, there are more important matters in life than material things which can't and won't buy a single day of life.
like what?
Sounds like a person who utterly and totally failed at life
Yes.
Must be a guy who hasn't enjoyed the company of 3 luxery call girls in a Vegas hotel room in his life!
I'm pretty sure food counts as a "material thing" and that your life would end abruptly in its absence.
"We as humans need to recognize, there are more important matters in life than material things which can't and won't buy a single day of life."
What beautiful sentiment. Where does your food come from? I have yet to see one of the food replicators from Star Trek. Course that would fall into the "material things" category so I'm sure you would shun of of those as well.
This coming year might be a good opportunity to rethink that approach.
This is how I lost that last piece of pizza last week. I'm not falling for this one again.
Just love the way they take it down, most mornings. Well, fine. Am buying more physical gold and silver today to add to our stash. Market will go up and up, maybe for a while. Outside of oil, coal, gold and silver, just does not bother me.
When The Bernank is indicted, Geithner is fired and Obama resigns, then I sell my gold.
The price of gold largely reflects investor sentiment rather than fundamental demand, which is one reason it kept rising for most of the past 10 years. But speculators already have cut their bullish bets on gold to the lowest level since 2009. Heavier selling, in turn, could beget still more selling.
Exchange-traded funds are particularly worrisome: Big redemptions there could force enormous amounts of the metal into the marketplace, further pressuring prices. The amount of gold held by ETFs has dropped by about 2.8% since the beginning of the year, according to Brockhouse Cooper, bringing it to the lowest level since June.
FAIL.
You do not actually understand what these "redemptions" from the ETFs are do you?
Dipshit. Educate yourself: http://fofoa.blogspot.com/
bad money pushes out good. gresham's law. but what happens when the law is reversed? get ready for the collapse of the money changers babylonian fractional reserve magick currency system. it's all over but the cryin !
There was so much going on last night this was kind of lost in the shuffle.
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/washington-state-joins-movement-public-...
Any volunteers to start a facebook campaign to bring it to your state?
Gimme back my picture!
Why would anyone pay a premium for gold bars? Over at the Comex they have an infinite supply of them. They'll sell you a billion bars of gold if you want, at spot price, and for sure there'd be no problem when you came to collect them from the Comex warehouse.
Another recent source of buying—by gold producers unwinding hedges used to protect profits against price fluctuations—also has nearly come to an end. That is because most of the hedges were put in place at much lower price levels, forcing companies to sell well below market prices and damping profits. On Jan. 13, AngloGold Ashanti Ltd. said it had closed its hedge book, becoming the last of the major gold companies to do so.
"Financial demand propelled gold higher over the past few quarters," Mr. Lapointe says. "We doubt more is on the way."
I think we are beginning to see the first real disconnect between Value and Price, a trend that will probably explode over the coming weeks and months.
Needs are looking overwhelmingly bullish. Wants, not so much!
ORI
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2010/07/24/value-vs-price/
FOFOA on GLD holdings, excellent piece:
Who is Draining GLD?
http://fofoa.blogspot.com/2011/01/who-is-draining-gld.html
deleted
something up with my ISP ?
FOFOA on GLD holdings, excellent piece:
Who is Draining GLD?
http://fofoa.blogspot.com/2011/01/who-is-draining-gld.html
The Chinese...rich dudes...it could be anybody.
Paper gold has been decoupling from physical since the beginning of the month.
If you dont buy your Gold today expect to pay more after the comex report is released.
More than 30,000 options were exercised yesterday with even out-of-money options being exercised of strikes at $1335, $1340 and $1345. This is a sign of investors wanting to stand for delivery. The large open interest which is still open in FEB was no doubt the reason for the vicious attack today (the reason why silver suffered relatively little by comparison). Tomorrow is the last trading day before First Notice day so it will be an interesting day and will give an indication of the FEB gold delivery problem for the cartel.
Monday will be a very important day for gold as we await the number of gold oz that will stand. There may be a squeeze as many seek the precious metal.
End
http://harveyorgan.blogspot.com/
Lets see how many stand for delivery today ?
deleted
You Gold bugs are all morons.
China won't touch Gold above $1000/oz, just like they didn't touch oil above $70 barrel in '08.
They're waiting for the crash to buy, and so should you.
Even Egypt couldn't save your asses on Friday. It still closed down on the week, and it's down again this morning.
How does it feel to be invested in something that requires death and destruction to succeed,and then when you finally get some chaos, it doesn't even help?
You're all pathetic.
"Requires death and destruction to succeed"? No. Just a bunch of financially illiterate morons with access to a giant printing press and a firm conviction that real wealth can be generated out of nothing by putting ever more cash into circulation.
Loving that 'Strong dollar' today :-) Looks like the 'Global Flight to safety of the dollar' schtick isn't working quite as well as it used to, no?
Keep your green paper buddy. You're welcome to it. It looks like the rest of the worlds agrees with that sentiment.
Even assuming the price of gold now includes a premium for protection against a falling dollar, a collapse in the stock market and inflation, gold still looks expensive, says Vadim Zlotnikov, chief market strategist at Alliance Bernstein Research. He calculates that the current price reflects fears of a 20% decline in stocks, a 20% drop in the dollar and an inflation rate above 4%, based on historical performance. (The inflation rate is currently 1.5%.)
Bollox. The only factor you need to consider is that The Bernank cannot and will not stop printing money. Ever. Nobody else will buy $1 trillion+ of crappy US debt per year.
He cannot withdraw the money he's already printed, because much of it was spent on worthless MBS dross that nobody will buy off him even if he's dumb enough to try and sell it back into the market.
It doesn't require "death and destruction" just continued debasement and loss of confidence in the dominant fiat money system.
So Basiat - What the f*ck do you think the consequences of that are?
Massive global starvation. We live in a global economy, where payments need to be exchanged for goods and services. What are we going to do, start shipping pallets of Gold bars back and forth around the world to pay for food?
You want people to die, just so you can say: "I told you so"
Go invest in a real company and create some jobs, instead of hoarding a barbarous relic.
Jobs=Good
Contributing to deflation by slowing monetary velocity because you're hoarding a stupid yellow rock = Bad
What barbaric relic? We are not talking about trends and movements (the newer the better), we are dealing with values and principles. As far as values and principles are concerned, the older the sounder.
The only means of payment sanctioned in the Bible are gold and silver.
Just like the only kind of sex sanctioned in the Bible is heterosexual intramarital vaginal missionary intercourse. What's wrong with that?
I can care less if the stock market tanks straight to zero. It has turned from a mean of investment into a giant casino facilitating the fraudulent transfer of wealth from ordinary folks to wall street banksters and greedy corporate weasels. Jobs? America doesn't need more jobs. We need more business owners who refuse to kiss ass, who think for themselves and cover their own rear end.
All we need to live a happy life is God, gold and gun. God is the foundation and guarantor of our freedom, gold is the our honesty money that can not be arbitrarily debased by a tyrannical government. Gun allows us to kick some ass if anybody dares to mess with our money and our freedom.
"The only means of payment sanctioned in the Bible are gold and silver."
To you Gold is just God with an 'l'.
You are so f*cking stupid you can't even see the inherent inconsistencies in your Kentucky logic.
You follow the bible, but you stand ready with your gun and hope the world collapses.
Get a life.
I thought Christians were supposed to love their fellow man, not sit in their bunker with a shot gun waiting to kill anyone who tries to take their God. I mean Gold.
Take gold out of the equation for a moment. You speak of mass starvation. We are on the verge of this already, and there is no gold standard. Why do you so hate those who take steps to protect themselves and their families? Few if any of the people here that you attack are looking to amass great fortune and become some sort of fuedal lord. They aren't buying the spiel, and are taking steps to protect themselves. Who is going to protect you? Nobody, if you don't do it yourself.
I have no bunker, but I do have a shotgun. I would use it to defend my home. Gold and silver IMO are the best way to hedge monetary collapse. It may be my best means to feed my family. Someone may kill me for it, and my family may perish. It is what it is. Too "survival of the fittest" for you? Sorry. The real world is screaming at the top of its lungs that that IS what's coming. No angry God, no hate, just life. Not good, not bad. Life. Sucks doesn't it? Sorry it isn't working out the way you think it should.
Speculation is the only thing that is pushing up food prices.
Just like speculation is the only thing pushing up Gold.
Gold is part of the problem, not the solution.
How does money in gold push of food prices? Does the Chinese government encourage investment in gold to stimulate domestic food price inflation? Think a little.
Earlier you posted:
Contributing to deflation by slowing monetary velocity because you're hoarding a stupid yellow rock = Bad
Now you say gold is part of the food inflation problem. So what is it? Deflationary or Inflationary?
Wrong. Speculation is only a part of the problem. Speculation isn't anything new. It's human nature. An ever increasing money supply is a large culprit. As are "clean fuels" like ethanol and bio diesel whose subsidies have driven up the cost of corn, beans and livestock, while decreasing the amount of grains on the food market.
If your argument is correct, what harm does pushing up the price of gold cause? Sheeple investors, and foolish goldbugs to lose more money? You should like that, because I'm putting valuable fiat to work and trading it for a worthless relic. You cannot make the claim that it takes my money out of circulation because I gave fiat for it, and that fiat is put to work elsewhere by the people who sold me my gold.
The reason I argue with you is because you stake your claim based on speculation fueled by greed. Have you considered that maybe said speculation is fear and uncertainty? People are ceasing to believe what they're told, because it isn't standing up to the smell test. When people are afraid, they go to tangibles. Gold, land, tools, food, oil, you name it. People are afraid, and they want things they KNOW HAVE VALUE. It's no different than a mom buying a couple of extra cans of soup, just on a different scale. Don't mistake preservation for greed.
Speculation is the only thing that is pushing up food prices.
You sound exactly like governments throughout the history. Every time there is inflation, they never blame their printing press which churns out banknotes 24/7. They always blame the greedy speculators and hoarders. I can guarantee you, if the BenBernank stops QE today, prices will stop rising in one minute notice
No, bad money and CB Liquidity pumping is the cause of rising food prices. It is because people continue to "believe in the system" that the "elite" use Seigniorage and printing to effectively steal productive output for themselves. It is those that refuse to buy Gold that continue to "feed the beast".
Spot on.
Yes, we should instead create a state agency that tells us how much things cost, or better, simply distribute goods according to the need of those applying for access. Of course, the goods must come from somewhere. Clearly, we can take those goods from the producers according solely to their ability to produce.
lol
Yes, we should instead create a state agency that tells us how much things cost
Socialist planned economy. The Russians still cherish the fond memory of waiting in long lines for bread, milk, butter, ham, cloths, oil, vodka and virtually every necessity. Of course, if you had hard currency like US dollar or deutsche Mark, you could always go to the black market and get a few things.
I am concerned that America is heading the wrong direction and we might see the above dreadful scenario in this country soon. When that happens, the dollar won't be a hard currency. Better save some silver coins to buy Jack Daniels on the black market!
Well said, Colonel--same page here.
My "Kentucky logic", antiquated and hillbillish as it may sound, dates straight back to 1776, when the founding fathers took their guns, kicked some English ass, and reclaimed their God-given freedom and God-given money. And quite frankly I am not ashamed of my 18th century thinking. In this chaotic world, one either thinks in term of "barbaric relics", or becomes himself a piece of barbaric relic when the defecations collides with the oscillation (TSHTF). I happen to choose the former.
Contrary to your biased opinion, I love my fellow men. I don't miss a single chance to warn my family, friends, colleagues and even strangers of the impending melt-down, and suggest that they prepare the same way I do. My suggestion to you is the same. If they heed the warning, great! If they don't, there ain't nothing I can do about it.
Just like the only kind of sex sanctioned in the Bible is heterosexual intramarital vaginal missionary intercourse.
Correct except for the 'missionary' restriction. Its not there. Paul elaborated on marital relations in Hebrews 13:3 and 1 Corinthians 7:3-5.
sigh of relief, you guys.
for a second, i thought i was gonna rot in hell, for my lifetime of 'doing it' wrong. i was just watching the dogs out back and figured...
written right there in the bible too... must be true
(don't mind me stirring the pot here...)
Ooops, sorry, my bad! What a mistaka to maka. Missionary isn't what the bible teaches. Missionary was actually what missionaries taught.
maybe that's why they're never smiling in those old pictures! heh
FWIW, i'm with you on the original intentions of the founders, but not so much the church as a governing body.
if there's a relationship with the dude/dudette, it should be one-to-one. no book needed.
Do we ship pallets of dollars around the world? And yes I know, you cant eat gold.
Go invest in a real company and create some jobs, instead of hoarding a barbarous relic.
Math Man, I have a substantial amount of money invested in real companies that create jobs -- producing stupid yellow rocks and such.
"Hoarding" is saving. It turns out that putting savings into stupid yellow rocks has had a much better return over the last 10 years than most anything else. I have even more in stupid white rocks and they've been good to me too. Those barbarous rocks helped my kid through 6 years of school. And the people I sold some of those rocks to along the way have done well too--so everybody's happy.
Going forward, I'll contribute to "velocity" as I need things. I need to save/hoard so that I can support myself and wife when I retire since the corrupt government and monetary authorities have looted SS and busted pensions funds.
So you keep your iCrap and I'll keep driving my 12 year old diesel VW and adding to my pile. I refuse to join the last stage of the Great Ponzi.
Why not direct your anger and frustration at the politicians and monetary authorities who have gutted the US morally and financially. They have undermined the wealth of the country and with it, the power. What violence results from that you can lay on their doorstep.
Stop making perfect sense. It infuriates trolls when they have to go look for more inane shit to paste.
It infuriates trolls when they have to go look for more inane shit
He'll have to go look for a new nick -- after that performance, "Math Man's cred-meter is pinned on zero. In record time too. Where do we send the tuition invoice?
It seems to get easier and easier (maybe I'm just getting older) to pinpoint the young posters isn't it? I fail to understand the VEHEMENT anger towards anybody who is capable for doing for themselves. These people aren't attacking TPTB, squid, oligarch, tyrant despots, they're lashing out against middle class people who simply toil along, try to do right by their children, and shutter up the windows of their own home.
Things are maybe going to be tough for all of us soon. Things are really going to suck for people like Math Man if he doesn't quit pouting and find a new outlook on life. My bet is that in a year or two, you and I aren't going to have the time or luxury to coddle him along amore.
I guess if he doesn't have his own resources he might end up getting shot as a looter--most likely he'll end up back with his parents, though. Which is fine if he pitches in and shows a little respect--gratitude might be too much to hope for.
You guys are buying a shiny rock, with the hope of selling or exchaning the rock for more later.
Said shiny metallic rock has no almost no industrial uses, except that it can be made into pretty jewelery.
But yet, you think it will hold its value?
People thought tulip bulbs would hold their value too, because tulips are pretty too.
And I have zero credibality?
What the hell is wrong with you guys?
Inflation/Deflation - it doesn't f*cking matter. Stop speculating and get out and do some real investing.
If you're rich enough to buy some Gold, you're rich enough to help create some jobs, which is what we need more than anything.
Stop buying Gold and help out the economy, instead of hoarding rocks like a selfish a$$hole.
"Contributing to deflation by slowing monetary velocity because you're hoarding a stupid yellow rock = Bad"
Translation: "How can we steal your hard earned savings if you hide it from us?"
++++, mr hills
and while it is simply true that buying hard assets and end-user consumables halts that velocity (that the CBs like so much) dead in it's tracks, so long as i am still really free, i will be able to stop the velocity of my own assets, for any reason i chose.
i wonder how long that will be?
Hmmm, so you think that you stick dollars into the ground and gold pops out? Buying gold increases monetary velocity, as do all transactions involving currency. This is clear with even the tiniest amount of critical thinking.
time will tell who has been foolish and who has been wise.
tsk,tsk. i think i detect a sound of professional jealousy. please return to your seat at your wall street casino table and buckle up as you are coming in for a hard landing. vegas with out the cocktail waitresses. nah nah, nah, nah nah.
Add MAth Man to the Billy Bastard/ Wanker oscillation device, I see Johnny Bravo is back that must be a glorious sign of a gold bounce.
Every time he shows up in whatever form he takes that day gold pops 20 bucks.
You go math boy. You count to potato.
I wouldn't say pathetic. I would just say hopelessly misguided and ignorant.
You should change your handle - Math implies logic.
gold just rebounding, silver positive over $28..
just buy PM's the fiat world is awaiting the Jurassic meteor of it's fate.
bar up bitchez.
"It hasn't rained thus I'm canceling my flood insurance." I love mentality of the people selling their physical.
Gold is an insurance policy, and the cost of insurance has been going up
Not as fast as the probability that you'll need to call on that insurance.
Along with the cost of everything else. You gotta better plan, TROLL?
50$ Silver by April 2011, caused by a physical shortage.
http://thehardrightedge.com/2011/01/30/50-physical-silver-by-april-2011/
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Scott J
Sell me, no, give me your gold.
I'll take silver too.
I've got to have a way to "get to the next life" after I blow out the people's currency.
They don't care as long as there's fresh straw in the manger and slops in the bucket.
Suck on the state teat, dripping with fresh and tastless milktoast news!
Whoo - EEE- Pig - Sooo EYYYY!
In short, I feel gold and silver are nearing a short term resistance level and will find selling pressure in the coming days only to continue on their journey down for a few weeks. The dollar on the other hand broke out of its falling wedge on Friday and could have a strong rally for 2-3 days. I feel most traders and investors have been shorting the dollar for two weeks straight, so once they realize it’s going higher there will be a ton of short covering and the dollar should rip higher
I luv it, the middle east is disintegrating before our eyes and gold drops 10 bucks. That more than any other ocscillating vibrator tells the market is rigged.
Backed'r up again today. Toilet paper rolls emptying fast.
Feeling better every day.
Interesting stat I didn't even think of looking up, Canada, my beloved country, is 89th in gold holdings. Harper must think he'll rent an excavator when he needs some.
Christ I have more than he does.
Interesting policy movement or bowel movement - not sure which. Christ Venezuela has more than we do.
Leo!@!
Get on the case man!
"... That more than any other ocscillating vibrator ..."
classic!
Gold is doing the same as its little sister (silver). I feel the general public is still very bullish on metals and before we see higher prices (new highs) the market will have to shake the majority out of their positions first. At this time gold looks like it should test the $1285 level. Depending on how long it takes to get there and the price action it forms in the following days that outlook could change but expect sellers to step in at the $1350-1355 area
Dude. Please go back to the Yahoo boards where your silly cut and pastes will baffle and amaze. You need another semester of Troll School if you want to play here.
As the Middle East collapses in upon itself, a lot of folks will run to the safety blanket of gold and silver.......real gold and silver, not the imaginary kind offerred by the various ETF's.
I and others who even fractionally disagree with even one thing gold bugs say have to say these things because in the history of investing I’m not sure if any group has been so ‘testy’ (shall we say) as metal bugs. (maybe dotcommers, maybe realtors a bit ago, bond guys in the 80’s) all of which had/have tunnelvision.... hint hint
No. You take shit because you are so ill informed that you paste shit that disagrees with your own argument. Then when called on it you simply move down the board and start over. Then, you move to threads that have nothing to do with metal and start over YET AGAIN.
You are a troll. There are some good ones here. You aren't making the cut.
I can't get no go golden fraction.
I can't get no sucker action.
And I tried and I tried and I tried.
I can't get noooo...