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Gold Is The New Goldman
If there was any confusion before that gold is now the last flight to safety in the fiat devaluation war, the chart below should end that debate. As Portugal got cut, the move in gold was far more pronounced than a comparable move in the dollar. Investors are now bypassing the USD as the beacon of safety and heading straight for the yellow metal.
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debate over - gold (and silver) wins
there was never a debate.. it was some shallow bird brains . chirping away . the gold case is secure .
its the Pavlovian Keynesian trained trolls that shout from the roof tops their ignorance , and subsequent title to world champion no- nothings who think that their vioce will be heard in the dark cave of child litter ,
The only thing that is going to inflate is bodies.
Tanks run over people whether they have gold in their pocket or not. The winner will be the person that doesn't get rolled over by the tank.
Tanks run over people whether they have gold in their pocket or not.
Given the extreme nature of your assertion, here's the response: People with gold in their pockets are able to bribe border guards so that they can get out of the way of the tanks.
It didn't help the Jews, they cooked them and extracted the gold out of their teeth. Tanks don't stop they move forward.
Once the credit market completely blows up, productions will go down to near zero so you will have decreasing production chasing a fix or increasing amount of gold. I figure 5-8 decades of deflation or a generation. If nukes are used, there is the possiblity of deflation to zero for humans.
What you are referring to is exactly the same as saying house prices never fall, and we know how that turned out.
This time there will be people starving to death with gold and silver in their pocket, one of the last places I would want to live when the crap goes down is India and they probably have the most gold of any nation. That ain't going to mean crap.
My father-in-law was a young boy in Germany during WWII, literally saw people starving to death with gold and silver in their pockets. The ones who survived were the ones who kept food, blankets and carts (and had luck on their side).
Sure he did.
We tend to think that kind of thing is impossible, because it hasn't happened here in our lifetime. I'm pretty sure alot of Europeans in the 30's would have had your attitude as well (in spite of having just gone through the first world war, which was actually had a more limited impact on the civilian population). People extrapolate linearly from recent experience, which is why non-linear events catch everybody so off guard.
It meant the world to those who got out early and had to restart elsewhere.
Also, remember, these were victims of political persecution, not victims of economic collapse. The US isn't going to be putting the general population into camps any time soon, contrary to some of the more "out there" assertions.
Put them in camps. Who said that, you don't put dead people in camps.
No way you feed 7 billion once the credit market fully collapses, billions of unfunded liabilities are going one way or another. A couple of billion right off the top and I would say 5-8 decades or a lost generation or a little longer.
Someone got to go, the price you pay for playing with the equation... final balloon payment at the end of the cycle.
100+ million last time, that will look like chump change this time. My guess a 1-2 billion in the first 10 years once it all collapses.
Al Huxley is 100% correct, mucho luck better be on your side.
Interesting that you view the continued existence of the massive worldwide central bankster Ponzi scam as integral to the very survival of the world's population. I see it as rather the reverse.
The bankers allowed credit to get "loose", according to Daniel Sparks of Goldman Sachs, in congressional testimony today, when asked if Goldman had a hand in the downturn. Mr. Tourre, during the same testimony, conceded that it lead to human pain and suffering.
That "looseness" is malinvestment; a "boom"; not robust growth. 95% of the US population does not have enough food at home to last more than 4-5 days. Any, ANY, hiccup in the transport system will cause thousands to die. Everyone knows US infrastructure is crumbling. The third world is much more ready for a crash because their crops will still grow and their animals will still reproduce if the electricity fails for a time.
What happens when the printing press doesn't work anymore; the system that has allowed malinvestment for almost 100 years? Systemic gangrene always leads to the death; billions in this case.
You guys might have problems, but I'm surrounded by farmland. Currently, they grow cotton, but with food prices likely to take off, they will likely switch to all food production. Even without electricity, we have enough to feed the local population, and have some left over for export. I might get into that racket, as I will have the gold and silver to command access to the crops.
Dude,
Who are "they"?
Who is this royal "we"?
Get off your ass. Talk to the locals and listen. It's the difference between life and death, or play your video games. Your choice.
Strawman argument. If people are in such a desperate plight as to not even be willing to trade food for gold, I ASSURE you that they will not be trading it for fiat paper currency either! On the other hand, there are many more, and vastly more likely, scenarios in which gold and silver, and other tangible goods, would be traded for food whereas fiat paper would not be accepted. Any such "gold is no good" argument can always be likewise, and even more strongly, turned against fiat paper as well.
As others here have wisely pointed out, gold and silver excel at transferring wealth through any monetary, political or social upheaval and into the following period of recovery, even if by chance things descend into complete and total collapse in the interim --- and ONLY such a situation could make gold and silver "useless", as it would necessarily imply an absolute cessation of ALL trading and exchange. When has the world ever seen such a situation, short of highly localized and highly transient disasters?
I agree, gold and silver are the only way to go as far as preserving wealth over time. But first you have to survive the crisis, and I'm basically with Mako that this exponential spike is going to end with a catastrophic crash sometime in the relatively near future - whether thats 1 month, 1 year, 5 years, or 10 years, I don't know, but that's when you're going to need food, shelter and lots of luck to survive.
Strawman argument, that is what you are doing.
Sorry without credit you will probably struggle to feed 4-5 billion if not much lower then that.
My guess: 1-2 billion would be the min., 2-3 billion likely, 4-5 billion is not out of question, 7 billion if nukes are used on a large scale.
"I ASSURE you that they will not be trading it for fiat paper currency either!"
Here is the main point of your strawman. They won't be trading with anything, you can only trade with what is being produced. Production will decrease, once credit completely collapses, production will go down to near zero versus today's levels, less production means less production... doesn't matter what you use as your medium of exchange.
No, they can't trade what isn't being produced. Production will continue to go down until it hits it's bottom. You are assuming they have something trade with, which they won't... which is why humans came up with credit.
This will end the same way it always does, just on a much larger scale.
Oh come now, Mako, you really should go outside and take a deep breath. Worldwide food production going to zero because of no credit? Why? Absolute worst case scenario, the government nationalizes all food production. Yes, a lot less food gets produced but there would still be food produced. Especially in the U.S. of A. I agree with you that the world cannot sustain 7 billion people long term, but that is due more to peak oil than anything else. If you go back 100 years, we produced plenty of food (for 2 billion people) with little credit and no oil.
"Nationalize" doesn't help. The soviet union has done that countless times, and millions have died. The last time this happened on a large scale they were dumping grain out at sea in Europe to get the prices up, while people were starving onshore.
The nation runs off "credit" which is what the United State government runs off of... if what you said were true, there would be no starving people in the world and death to starvation.
You ain't going to feed 7 billion when the credit system collapses.
Millions died, not the hundreds of millions proportional to your claims. If what you said were the case, Russia would have seen a 1/3rd decrease in population.
Most people got by farming their own little plots of land outside of town. As spread out as we are in most parts of this country, I don't think we will have to go as far to grow our own.
Over a 100 million died last time, Russia lost around 20 million just during the war, and they killed some of their own people before the war even started.
I think you need to go back to school if you think a few million died.
We are talking past each other here. Mako et. al. are confusing survival/demise of society with survival/demise of the individual. Mako, I agree. At this point, PM's won't save society.
Spend FRNs to buy physical and food security and use what's left to buy PM's so you can come out the other side with some wealth preserved.
What's there to debate?
I don't think people in 1900 would have agreed that there was "plenty" of food.
And while oil was not a factor, most productive land was already in cultivation, along with some land we no longer consider worth cultivating (much of new england, for instance) and the soils were largely in much better health than they are today. Also nearly all farmers combined crops and animals, reducing their need for any artificial fertilizer. And something like 50% of the population was directly engaged in agriculture, and had the skills and muscles necessary for that.
Good points.
New England small scale farming (upstate NY as well) is coming back. Basically only positive thing I can come up with now.
Good points MM. The world we live in compared to 80 years ago is nothing a like.
If the stupid bastards would quit using human food for fuel, we do not need (Ethanol), and wanting to even increase it to 15%, over the current 10%...
We could lower the prices of corn, and beef.
Also, a 15% base of Ethanol will absolutely destroy automobile engines, in short order.
Something the Politicians(that never had a job) just do not seem to get.
Also, (not to be conspiritorial), but many Eco Nazi's have for years been promoting genocide on a mass scale.
The "O"'s admin, has one nut, that has already espoused publically that we should add sterilization chemicals into the H2o supply.
To limit population growth.The NEW Health Scam, IF it stay's intact, will serve as a Genocidal tool as well.
The middle aged, 55+ / 80's,group will be rationed care, and many will not make the time delay that this system will bring.
The only hope would be to go overseas for treatment.........
India has tremendous surgeons,and hospital technology.And at prices 10% -15% of what the same procedures here cost.............
When it's life or death, or insufferable pain, air travel cost's are nothing, if you can get the money, or have it.
Idiotic argument, a complete non sequitor, and utterly contradicted by all historical precedent.
There is utterly NO basis for assuming that ALL trade and exchange would cease with a collapse of credit. Societies and economies functioned for thousands of years with little or no DEBT, and will again if the situation arises again --- which is a wild supposition in any event.
Your hysterical assertions in defense of the massively corrupt and unsustainable financial status-quo just demonstrate how short-sighted, historically ignorant and intellectually and emotionally beholden to the current power structure you really are.
"Apres le Fed, le deluge", is that it?
"There is utterly NO basis for assuming that ALL trade and exchange would cease with a collapse of credit."
Nobody said zero, near zero compared to rate of trade versus 2007. You think all this stuff would be manufactured minus a credit system... you are dreaming, which eventually will be your worse nightmare. The last time the credit system didn't even collapse all the way yet, Hilter used the fast route to wipe out the non-funded liabilities.
Of course, you will be free to send me free food if you like.
It is clear that you are either unable or unwilling to argue in a logical or rational manner, so I will cease trying to converse with such a demonstrable idiot.
Of course, anyone like yourself that ignores 5,000 years of history and plain elementary Math is not going to having a logical or rational manner discussion with hardly anyone.
It's the houses goes up forever crew all over again. Yeah, I am sure in 2100 there will be 40 billion humans walking the Earth, good luck with all that logic.
LOL
Another day of Whack-a-Mole! on ZH.
Mako, you haven't been hitting that bottle have you?
Mako's having an argument in his head with his imaginary friend.
Mako - OK, many people are likely to die. That's the Macro picture. What's your plan?
It helped the Soviet Block. They made gold into clothing and painted it black when they jumped the border. I wish i could remember the name for it.
Although I agree that having a stable source of income, or food and sheltor are pritority number one.
People with gold better not spend it conspicuously. Or else they will be beaten and shot and their gold will be taken from them.
Later on, a tank rolls over their corpse.
Yep, and all along the way productions will continue to decrease until it hits the bottom.
The people in India are going to get flattened and they have plenty of gold, you could double their gold and they still will get flattened.
Someone has got to go, gold or no gold.
It's unavoidable.
Interesting that folks don't understand agriculture's dependence on credit. Jimmy Rogers has already stated that food stores are at an all time low.
I wonder how that situation came about..................
Yep.
He probably thinks people were going hungry in the 30s because production was tapped out.
The border guards will laugh at you after they've stolen the gold in your pockets. If it comes to that then the most valuable commodites will be lead denominated in 5.56 or 3.08, MREs, and water. Since everyone has to sleep your clan, if your fortunate enough to have one, will become very valuable. I personally intend to abandon my urban habitat and head home to Appalachia, and nestle in the bossom of my well armed family. I'll wait there until the dust settles and I can see what sides have formed up.
dumpster, hilarious descriptions — you've almost topped Tyler here!!!
debate of parabolic blowoff imminent begin!
Yeah, parabolic moves are so tradeable. Buy now before it's too late! That strategy worked so well for oil (and other commodities) in the summer of 2008. The Fed is going to crash this party and drive money into treasuries. Gold, silver, and all the rest will be casualties at the tent hospital.
Rogerwilco,
there will be SOME idiots that may fall for that trick TWICE, but after watching the debacles going on since '08, you will have surely noticed the peoples percentage of mistrust of anything Governmental..........esp Treasuries and Bonds.
The Flight to saftey, as Tyler said, is no longer the USD.
This is the beginning of the MAN ON the street, running to PM's.
And away from the USED to be safe haven, we provided.
Roger - there is no room for the Fed to raise rates. Last time, Volker pulled this off because the North Slope and the North Sea came on line, dramaticly reducing the cost of energy and therefore the cost of most business activity as well. In light of the drop in the cost of fuel, the economy could absorb the incresed cost of credit without going off the rails.
No such luck this time.
YOU CANT EAT IT!!!
au, biches?
That's "Aurum, unpleasant women!" I copyrighted, trademarked, trade-secreted and patented that phrase here on ZH a couple months ago. So you owe me royalties: 1 Troy Ounce, with a maple leaf, triumphant Liberty or maybe some dead S. African guy and a funny looking deer stamped on it.
1oz paper gold, coming up. Just print this sovereign out 4 times.
amazing that it took so long to figure out that your only true safe haven is the one that cannot be easily created out of nothing...
Except for ETFs. Need to get that bluff called...
MsCreant,
If you did not catch this............
http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/Broadcast_Gold+/Entries/2010/4/24_Ted_Butler_on_the_Metals_Market_files/Metals%20Wrap%20Ted%20Butler%204%3A24%3A2010.mp3
no confusion about gold here
this may come as a bender to the sour puss famous three amigos,, the three zit faced youngsters .probably all on food stamps . and masking a unemployed state
who frequent these boards to thrash gold
Where are all the paperbugs, to explain how foolish this is? I'll take a stab - 'you can't eat gold' (as opposed to $ or Goldman shares, which I understand are fantastic with a light raspberry vinagrette dressing and a good Chardonnay).
You can't have sex with gold, either. If you want to get screwed, dirty money is totally the way to go, yo.
You can't have sex with gold.
Yes you can. And it doesn't talk back or want to be cuddled afterward. It's perfect.
Astroglide, bitches!
I can't believe he recommended a Chardonnay.
Can someone tell me about Teichert Construction? I understand they're a construction company with California's oldest listed construction number, (8), thats been busy collecting, selling, processing, producing AU from their extensive aggregate,(gravel, as in rocks), in the Northern California region since the 1870's.
Yes you can.
Gold plated:
http://www.nakupovanje.net/images/600x/lelo-olga-gold-dildo--1201339.jpg
guess that pisses over what prechter has been saying then
I'm cutting that useless chump right away
I am just sorry that I have 20% Euros as a hedge against PMs, soon it could be 5%
Euros aren't bad... as long as they are Philharmonics!
(I like the fiddles on 'em)
I sometimes imagine a world where gold crashes to 20 euros a ounce - if that event ever happens then I will take a train to Vienna and have a fun weekend using harmonics as my currency.
deleted
Gold isn't the only player on the forex front. I would also be concerned on a Yen melt-up against the U.S. dollar, since its been in a bull market since 2002. Gold is acting positively on COMEX options expiry.
files.me.com/fransix/k95iib
-F6
I would eat some gold right now.
I believe PM's will ultimately be the currency of last resort when hyper-inflation eventually ensues. I wonder though with all this collapse, stimulus withdrawal ,and the looming collapse of china, will that lead to a brief period of deflation? With a chance to get alot more PM's for your money, in the coming months to year or so.
Gold is at the bottom of the liquidity pyramid. It is rising faster than the dollar.
Too many people realize that the dollar is a ponzi scheme, and are fleeing towards metals. Foreigners have more of them than they could ever reasonably want.
Yahoo finance showing gold price in the red... LOL... When I see incompetence like that from supposedly one of the biggest web sites in the world... it really makes me wonder... People who make web pages in their basement have more accurate gold prices than the Yahoo finance homepage. Oh OK. Yeah. Must be some kind of an accident over at Yahoo. I'm sure they'll get it fixed shortly.
And they only added the gold price a couple months ago. As you point out, it's wildly inaccurate compared to anyone who can pull a feed from kitco.
North West Territorial Mint also has an application that streams quotes live.
Hallefreakinlujah!
and an AMEN to that brother...
and an AMEN to that brother...
and an AMEN to that brother...
Gold is up .51% right now. US dollar up 1.42% vs Cdn dollar (touted the most stable).
Someone get Roubini on the phone.
Gold Rises to New Record High in Euros and Swiss Francs
Published in Market Updates Precious Metals Update on 26 April 2010
http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blog/gold-rises-new-record-high-euros-a...
This is very surprising on options expiry. The day's not over with yet but it would be nice to believe the Cartel is running out of ammunition.
Jesus tyler, this site goes down more frequently than my daughter at a frat party.
Agree. Why is that?
whizbang wins post of the day
Woot! Honey look what dad got!
this daughter you speak of... where can i find her? in case, you know, she's in terrible peril.
It's still a spec play. Most likely a growing bubble.
If it wasn't a spec play, investors would demand physical gold if you are really hedging against worldwide fiat currency and soverign debt breakdowns.
I mean really.. what good does electronic paper that says you own 5 million dollars in gold futures really do for you if the global fiat currency system breaksdown.
no good at all. all your really own is some electronic futures that nobody gives a shit about in Mad Max land.
Lots of people are taking delivery, though. Not a majority or anything, but much more than used to be the case.
Why is the price and even the direction of the gold miners so disconnected from the actual metal? Take a look at a pretty good company like QMM.
see my post above yours.
it's all speculative futures contracts.
not many people are actually out buying gold necklaces or bricks of gold.
no one is taking delivery.. if they all took delivery, there probably isn't enough physical gold mined in the world to cover it all.
Hmm. Silver is not responding as well as gold.
Will it lag or what?
The big money movers move to gold, and then when the sheeple realize whats going on then silver will make its move?
It is just not as tempting presently because gold is much more valuable and the market is bigger...but it will change soon enough.
Caution! if everybody runs for Gold like we did in year 2000 for Internet stocks and year 2006 for real estate, you better think twice. Because market makers will spot this trend and profit from it by using all weapons they can find. Most of investors always lost money either market going up or down unless they are sitting on the other side of table with market makers.
Not really. As long as they take delivery, it just means that gold will become money again. It's value won't drop after it enters daily transactions in a widespread manner. People will demand that any notes that government issues be freely interchangeable with metal, or preferably, just government minted specie.
this gold nonsense runs the gamut
gold is in a secular bull market , all currencies world wide are breaking out to highs . the reason.. fiat is being printed up/
during this gold bull ups and downs are expected
the zit faced and all the reason not to own are so shallow ,
gold is on the way to 1600,, then beyond
we will not have the real sharp 20 year sell off as before
nations and large banks will buy gold as a hedge against the weakening of the fiat.
nations realize as do china that to carry out international trade gold will be used to guarantee proper standards and was until Nixon closed the gold window
that day is coming .. to balance the financial statement of nations and using gold as the standard . will see many multipliers of gold
it is not about tanks running a person down not about the 100 and 1 reason those not equipped to handle Austrian economics can begin to realize . as their thought process has been shattered by mush for education
silly inane and thougless statements about gold .
little children running inot the sound of their own unknowing ,
and the point may well be,,most of the zit faaced have nothing to protect so they show their face a timeless boobs on the road to nowhere
Just uploaded Dow weekly chart showing a bearish broadening top pattern.
And Euro is breaking down now.
MARKET UPDATES:
http://www.zerohedge.com/forum/latest-market-outlook-0
What A "world wide" fiat-sco
Who can print the most??
I am rooting for Benny B.
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