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"Greece On The Verge Of A Precipice" As A "Lehman-Like" Avalanche Could Be Set In Motion As Soon As Sunday

Tyler Durden's picture


Keeping a track of all the fluid, hourly changing developments in Greece can be unbearably complex, and as a result one may be left with the impression that things are better than they really are. They aren't. As the SocGen report below summarizes, Greece may have about 72 hours before it gives itself a Pass/Fail grade on Sunday, which in turn will have massive repercussions on the Troica bailout, on the eurozone, on the EUR, and on all those "Lehman-like" consequences you have been reading about. Once again, just like 2000 years ago, the fate of the western world (we would say democracy but that has not been the case for centuries), is about to be decided by a few popularly elected parliamentarians in Athens.

From SocGen:

Greece: One step closer to the precipice

Greece’s sovereign crisis has reached a critical phase, and the likelihood of a disorderly outcome has risen dramatically in the last 48 hours.

Two-year Greek bond yields breached the 30% mark, while Irish and Portuguese yield spreads reached one-year highs.

In the meantime, Greek economic and fiscal data continue to disappoint, and public discontent is rising in the face of the human costs of an ever deeper economic downturn.

Against this backdrop, the backlash from yet more austerity has triggered a severe blow to the ruling Government. The catch is that the Government needs to approve the Medium Term Fiscal Plan for EU/IMF funding to be disbursed. This is looking challenging as the survival of Papandreou’s government hangs on a formal confidence vote on Sunday, and two more defections from the ruling PASOK party on Thursday depleted its majority even further.

Given these unexpected complications, the IMF is now reportedly ready to release its next quarterly instalment to Greece purely on the basis of assurance of EU funding rather than on formal conditionality, paving the way for the €12bn July tranche being disbursed. Olli Rehn stated  that the deal on this payment should be forged at this Sunday’s meeting in Luxemburg.

However, even assuming that the domestic political hurdle is cleared and the €12bn loan is issued, the divide between German and French positions on private sector burdensharing is unlikely to be resolved immediately, and so the uncertainties about Greece’s longer-term funding seem destined to persist.

Indeed, the degree of private sector involvement will have a material impact on Greece’s funding needs. The IMF estimates that Greece’s financing need for the next three years amounts to €144bn in the absence of private sector involvement, but it would fall to €120bn with a “voluntary” rollover, and to around €90bn with an outright maturity extension. Ultimately, we continue to see a Vienna-style initiative as the most palatable compromise.

Politics: Irish parallel

Greece’s rising economic and social tensions have morphed into a fully fledged political crisis. Just as in Ireland at the beginning of this year, the Greek opposition is now demanding more favourable conditions than those originally signed with the EU/IMF back in May 2010. But the political situation has become extremely fragile, posing a material threat to the EU/IMF disbursement of the July tranche of the loan, and a solution to Greece’s medium-term funding gap.


Despite some reassurances from EU Commissioner Olli Rehn on Thursday evening, the formal conditions for Greece to obtain funding from the EU are under severe risk of failing, because EU funding is conditional on the Greek Parliament passing the Medium Term Fiscal Plan. A failed vote of confidence could critically derail this process. In turn, the EU/IMF programme’s fifth quarterly disbursement of €12bn is conditional on  the EU providing funding for Greece over the next year. Only then will the IMF contribute its €3.3bn share of the total quarterly disbursement of €12bn. This double conditionality in principle creates a deadlock, and the Greek Parliamentary vote of confidence becomes a de facto  necessary condition for cash heading to Greece in early July. Right now, the odds don’t look so good.

The vote: The odds are tight

Prime Minister George Papandreou stated that he would reshuffle his cabinet on Thursday, and demand a confidence vote in Parliament. Taking into account the three days usually required for this process, the actual voting is unlikely to take place until Sunday June 19. There is a lot at stake with this vote. A successful outcome would throw the ball back into the EU’s court, and allow the EU/IMF policymakers to proceed with devising a medium-term funding solution for Greece.

But political risks remain extremely high. PM George Papandreou’s majority is extremely narrow after two further defections on Thursday. The  margin of victory may boil down to one or two votes, making the outcome virtually unpredictable at the time of writing.

Policy solutions: Two constructive developments

Notwithstanding the high hurdle posed by the vote of confidence, a legitimate question is how this policy deadlock might be overcome. There are two positive developments on this front.

Firstly, the IMF is now reportedly willing to release its next instalment to Greece purely on the basis of assurance of EU funding rather than only conditionally after formal binding commitment.

The second positive development is that Germany’s demands for private sector burden-sharing have been toned down slightly. This opens more leeway for negotiation between Germany and France, given their differences of opinion on the optimal degree of private sector involvement.

The impression is that this critical decision may be postponed to a later date.

Private sector involvement: a key divider

One possible way forward that is reportedly being evaluated is for the IMF to obtain the commitment “in principle” from the EU to meet any shortfalls in financing if a private creditor contribution cannot be agreed at a later date, but for the IMF to proceed with the disbursement anyway. But this area remains surrounded by uncertainty.

Private sector involvement makes a large difference on the aggregate funding costs

One of the few certainties is that the degree of private sector involvement could make a major difference to Greece’s financing needs.

The IMF is reported to estimate Greece’s financing need for the next three years to amount to around €144bn in the absence of private sector involvement, and to around €120bn with a “voluntary” rollover. The most effective way to reduce Greece’s financing needs would be an outright maturity extension which would limit the required financing to €90bn.

Also for these reasons, we continue to see a Vienna-style initiative as the most likely outcome as the most palatable compromise.

What to Expect from next week’s EU meetings?

Looking ahead, what seems increasingly likely is that next week’s Eurogroup and Ecofin meetings (June 20-21) are unlikely to result in a policy leap, and that the elusive “crunch time” will shifts to July 11, or quite possibly even later.

Against this backdrop, the only certainly seems that uncertainty is destined to remain high, alongside the perceived risks of contagion. Hardly a constructive environment for Europe’s highly indebted periphery.




To those who remember the Lehman trading Sunday, keep your Bloombergs close over the next 3 days. History may just repeat itself all over again.


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Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:37 | 1376498 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:35 | 1376502 mynhair
mynhair's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:55 | 1376787 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

The franco-germanic imperialist banking cartel will face a full blown greek intifada.

The power elite are about to get torched.  Already they have tried to divest themselves from the toxic greek assets, in effect transfering most of the burden to the US/french taxpayers.

The burning ball has been kicked to another player.  Who will receive the exploding ball now?


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:45 | 1376530 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

Emporiki,Credit Agricole ----------------------------->pink sheet .---------------------> DEFAULT

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:29 | 1376636 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

Just listened to Jim Sinclair's latest (16 June) KWN interview.  I've never heard him this worked up about the current state of financial affairs.  He feels we could well be at the cliff's edge. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:15 | 1376748 Maiden Lane
Maiden Lane's picture

Is it time for "This is it" again already?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:29 | 1376639 string
string's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:16 | 1376685 tickhound
tickhound's picture

dude, that's funny... precipice, bitchez.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:40 | 1376501 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

The IMF is a criminal exterprise, they redefine the word FASCISM. If Greece tolerates IMF 'Shock Theapy' they are doomed no matter what.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:38 | 1376509 mynhair
mynhair's picture

But what about the bonuses for TPTB?  Only riot dog has a clue in that country.

Fighting for his rice bowl, riot after riot.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:45 | 1376516 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

Angry Mob Justice is the solution. Just like the French proved in 1789.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:28 | 1376629 Concentrated po...
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.'s picture

though I normally relate to many things said on this site.  The idea of French Revolution style mob justice is not a solution to anything.

A mob is not a rational thing.  A mob is not a creative entity, only a destructive one.  I do not disagree with unity against a threat to society.  But the French Revolution was and is not a solution to anything.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:47 | 1376658 Rational Psycho
Rational Psycho's picture

It'll scare the shit out of TPTB, and maybe make them think twice before enslaving people with debt again.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 10:26 | 1377462 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

[It'll scare the shit out of TPTB, and maybe make them think twice before enslaving people with debt again.]---Rational Psycho

Psycho, I appreciate your optimism, but TPTB never "think twice."

Count on them to be consistent.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:30 | 1376745 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

I am just saying, it is one ultimate solution.

If I were POTUS, I would have offered up Bin Laden to the pubic (whether you believe the official story or not).

Public hangings have rich history in American and other western nations.

Many bankers and politicians deserve their necks stretched.

Angry Mod Justice is what republican democracy is all about. Freedom of speech ensures everyone's voice is heard

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:29 | 1376844 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

As long as you are willing to sacrifice your own head in the process.  These things don't tend to be about guilt or innocence. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 10:40 | 1377490 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

[Angry Mod Justice is what republican democracy is all about.]---baby_BLYTHE

Hi bBLYTHE. I can see you wrote this statement at 1:30am. Now today, do you still stand behind this statement?

Our Founders vehemently opposed "Mob Justice." The ends do not justify the means. The rule of law must stand.


Sun, 06/19/2011 - 09:04 | 1382245 jimhalpert
jimhalpert's picture

You assume the USA is still a free country.  There's room for debate on that one.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:53 | 1376854 Popo
Popo's picture

A mob is certainly not a rational thing.  But creative destruction requires destruction prior to creativity.


One must smash, tear down and destroy that which is beyond repair.  It is the natural way of things.  

The anarchists and nihilists of the early 20th century understood this well.  The mob is important even if it is dumb.   Terror and random destruction are both inevitable and vital.  Control *is* the problem.  A lack of it is the solution.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 05:21 | 1376893 Incubus
Incubus's picture

I understand it, but I don't have any faith in people to do anything proper. 

The next system--should it ever come to be anytime soon--will end up just as messed up as this one.  Everything "human" ends up corrupted, eventually.



Fri, 06/17/2011 - 08:42 | 1377133 j0nx
j0nx's picture

Agreed. It always re-corrupts at about the same time as the last of the generation who lived through the old corruption start to die off.

Sun, 06/19/2011 - 09:12 | 1382249 jimhalpert
jimhalpert's picture

Human is the problem but what should we do?  Kill ourselves? every last one of us?  By nature we are imperfect.  The key is to course correct when we have the opportunity to.  Unfortunately there is a condition that has spread of stick your head in the sand itis that may be incurable.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:45 | 1376653 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

I agree witht h eposter above.

Baby, violence begets violence. In a violent game, only the most violent wins. Logical right? Even if their viollence is hidden in the garb of intelligence/cleverness.

If you want to wish for something, wish for a CME that hits a machine reset.

That will be a "fresh" start.

Revolutions? It's what got us here, right?


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 09:12 | 1377232 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

Was that you in Vancouver Wed night?  :D

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 13:53 | 1378142 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Hah! Far away. Sporting related violence has to be TPTB wet-dream eh, Mayhem?


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 08:36 | 1377123 Silver Dreamer
Silver Dreamer's picture

The problem with a mob justice or French Revolution situation is that they only punish innocents and puppets.  The people responsible rarely ever get what they deserve.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 07:06 | 1376949 Tim White
Tim White's picture

I love Riot Dog! Have it saved on Fave's...

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:49 | 1376848 dolly madison
dolly madison's picture

Greece will face austerity with our without the IMF, so they might as well tell the IMF to go to hell.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:39 | 1376510 JustACitizen
JustACitizen's picture

I hope that the Greek citizenry continue to resist...and even if the gubmint somehow agrees to something - I hope that more of the economy just goes underground - y'know barter and such. Even if the elite have their hands on all of the levers - I like to think that there are ways around the machine... Good luck Greeks!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:40 | 1376513 mynhair
mynhair's picture

You mean the loser goobermint employees, right?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:40 | 1376646 JustACitizen
JustACitizen's picture

Regardless of their employment - I think that once the elites get done plundering the country - the only things that people will have - will be whatever they can keep physical control of - y'know - something like we are heading for...

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:46 | 1376656 The Profit Prophet
The Profit Prophet's picture

Agreed...the black market will grow exponentially and their funding shortfall will only increase. There is a palpable loss of control taking place by the world's financial Elites.

T.E.I.N. everyone!

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:51 | 1376850 dolly madison
dolly madison's picture


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:43 | 1376512 Mentaliusanything
Mentaliusanything's picture

The Old fart agrees - Greece is a no brainer for default

Which means it won't happen because he has never been right on any major issue.

But I know Greeks - first they get the money then they default while laying off some good side bets

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:45 | 1376824 A Man without Q...
A Man without Qualities's picture

The old fart hopes Greece defaults, so they can blame the US economic crisis on external elements and use it as an excuse to print more money.

It seems to be the global playbook.  Look how the Japanese markets are suffering because of Greece - not the damage from the earthquake, not the never ending nuclear disaster, not the 220% debt to GDP ratio, but the ongoing clusterfuck in Greece.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:41 | 1376515 NumberNone
NumberNone's picture

Eurogroup and Ecofin?  Let me fix that....Eurogrope and Ecoffin.  All better.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:47 | 1376523 mynhair
mynhair's picture

I long for the day TSA strikes.  Dem jet engines are hungry.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:43 | 1376524 Roger Knights
Roger Knights's picture

"the survival of Papandreou’s government hangs on a formal confidence vote on Sunday, ..."

Sever on Sunday?

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:32 | 1376711 The Fonz
The Fonz's picture

He is just guessing as to the day, the most important thing is to know when it is going to happen and make darn sure you know the results immed.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:46 | 1376825 A Man without Q...
A Man without Qualities's picture

So as long as the money has arrived into their Swiss bank accounts by Saturday, all will be well?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:45 | 1376534 JR
JR's picture

Here’s how the chief executive of Europe’s largest bank, Deutsche Bank, intends to play the Greek crisis.

Designated as “the most powerful banker in Europe and, depending on whom you ask, possibly the most dangerous one, too,”  Josef Ackermann is the man who has helped ECB’s Jean-Claude Trichet “ shape Europe’s economic and financial future.“

In a recent NY Times article, Deutsche Bank’s Chief Casts Long Shadow in Europe, the authors observe that it is no secret where the Jewish international banker’s allegiance lie: “with the banks.”

For instance, writes the Times, Ackermann “has insisted that providing some sort of debt relief for Greece would be a huge mistake. Such a move — a restructuring, in banking parlance — would involve writing down Greece’s debt, which is now more than 140 percent of its gross domestic product, deferring payments and cutting interest rates….

“European banks, including German ones like Deutsche Bank, hold many billions of euros in Greek government bonds, and the banks would lose big if those debts were restructured. For the moment, Europe’s solution for Greece is, essentially, Mr. Ackermann’s: more bailout money and more austerity — an approach that some economists say only buys time without offering any hope of recovery….”

The Times, which says Ackermann is admired by many but “has also become a lightning rod for public hostility toward banks,” keeps an apartment near Central Park and “his bank has a large operation on Wall Street – indeed, it helped inflate the American mortgage bubble.”

Ackermann, whose office in Frankfurt is just a few blocks from close associate Jean-Claude Trichet’s at the ECB, claims the biggest challenge now is to “convince people of any country to help Greece even more.”

Writes the Times: Ackermann "called on European governments to devise a ‘Marshall Plan’ for Greece that would offer more aid, while forcing the country to sell billions of euros’ worth of state assets, and provide a framework for rebuilding its economy.

European governments have largely followed that advice. At the same time, however, Mr. Ackermann has opposed the German government and sided with his friend Mr. arguing against restructuring the Greek debt, which would force investors — and banks — to share Greece’s pain.

“Any restructuring, Mr. Ackermann cautions, could be even worse than the crisis brought on by Lehman’s collapse. It could threaten the stability of major financial institutions, as well as the European Central Bank, which hold huge amounts of Greek debt, he says. “

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:21 | 1376620 desgust
desgust's picture

Yes, so is it! And he's Merkel's best friend. She invited him 2 years ago to celebrate his anniversary in Kanzleramt. He is the real Fuehrer in Germany, not Merkel! She's just another American vassal like all chancellors before. Germany has not peace treaty after the WWII and according to international lawa is still an occupied country. The rest is theater for the peasants. Germany is not independent, Germany has no constitution. Das Grundgesetz, the so called constitution in "Germoney" is a provisorium and should have be voted on by the sovereign after the reunification which didn't happen.

Germany is worse than Iraq, it's the hoax of the century!


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:49 | 1376661 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

It's all a scam des, even India. An Italian ruling us, whose father was a KGB agent. 

Every central banked country.... you can take it for granted that their "definition (democracy, republic...etc) is all one big farce.


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:57 | 1376662 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:03 | 1376673 JR
JR's picture

Alas, is America soon to follow Germany’s fate as retribution for her past sins?  By helping to seal Germany’s fate, did she seal her own?

In 1911, the year banker Paul Warburg was commuting between Germany and America to conspire with bankers and politicians here to birth a banking cartel, Professor Werner Sombart was summing up the situation in Europe where Finance had come to occupy a disordered dominant position.

“If we want to make clear in one sentence the direction in which modern political economy is moving, we can say: the stock-exchange agents of the banks are becoming in an ever-increasing measure the dictators of economic life.  All economic happenings are more and more subordinate to the decisions of finance.  The question whether a new industrial undertaking is to spring up or an existing one to be developed; whether the owner of a shop or a store is to get the means to extend his business, all these questions are decided in the offices of Banks and Bankers.  In just the same way the sale of products is becoming, in an ever greater degree, a problem of finance.  Our greatest industries are indeed already just as much financial associations as industrial undertakings.”

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:10 | 1376739 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:50 | 1376827 NoClueSneaker
NoClueSneaker's picture

 .... aber WIR sind der Export-Weltmeister ... :-P


( It's easy to sell 500 tanks to Greece with an argument of the knife under their troath . )

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:48 | 1376779 Michael
Michael's picture

I bought a Deutsche Bank owned home in Florida for 10 cents on the dollar. They lost 275k on the deal.

I did my part.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:31 | 1376873 FlyPaper
FlyPaper's picture

Ackermann's arguments are exactly what you'd expect from a cartel banker.  The bank wants to loan Greece more money - because they make interest.  A write-down is the 'end game' for that debt; no more accounting gimmicks to pretend they can keep the bad debt at book value.

This is when the banks have to take a loss.  

Followed by: "OMG, you know, if you don't bail us out, there could be MAYHEM in the economic life; people will be unemployed; the world will collapse..."  which usually means a politician can assume he/she will be out of a job.  

Followed by: "We must have the government help out" - which keeps the banker's game going - and puts the PUBLIC on the hook for the banker's screwup.

He's doing nothing more than playing the "central bank game," which translates: we make the money, we take the risk; and you bail us out if our casino game doesn't work.

Isn't that what they did in 2008 to the US Congress?  

How the hell did Goldman go from an uninsured investment bank to a commercial bank with FDIC backing?  

Frankly if I was Ackerman, I'd push the crisis, because its then that you can scare the politicians out of the public's money.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 08:55 | 1377171 M.B. Drapier
Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:46 | 1376535 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

Short Spain all Hedge Funds please, lets end this farce....We need a new government¡

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:47 | 1376537 dollartheque@ya...'s picture

shall we short the major indices tomorrow??????????????????????

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:53 | 1376540 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

Till 1.100 yes.

US will default Munibonds (100% California and Pennsylvania)

NO more US Debt Ceiling ...


*Did anyone know that Barack Obama has given a secret loan to Fidel Castro of a total amount of 4.000 Mn·$ From Presidential Account? (Cuenta de Fondos Reservados)

Has anyone know that in the US? where is wikileaks?





No one....

Ok, BIG BOMB in US------------------------ BARACK OBAMA GIVEN MONEY TO CASTRO´s Raul & FIDEL.--------------------

This world is getting crazy...

Please Barack Resign...youre playing with fire¡

Source: IMF member

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:59 | 1376558 Crisismode
Crisismode's picture

Loan? LOAN????



Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:09 | 1376586 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

With Nickel and offshore oilfields (Pinar del Rio basin) sir.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:29 | 1376631 wannabe traitor
wannabe traitor's picture

was the loan done in worthless fiat?

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:30 | 1376874 FlyPaper
FlyPaper's picture

Proof ?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:57 | 1376549 Eireann go Brach
Eireann go Brach's picture

Do you think Obama will keep his golf game scheduled for Sunday? .."ahhh Ben why are you calling me during tee time, Greece has defaulted, ahh so what now Ben, go visit your priest Jeremiah Wright and have him say some prayers for you, because you will go down in history as even more useless than Dubyah",

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 22:57 | 1376550 Crisismode
Crisismode's picture

Bring it on!

Sooner than later. I'm tired of all the drama and the wishy-washy dalliances.

Bring on the Denouement ASAP.

Third world cave-like structures for American Suburbanites immediately!

Stop dwadling!


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:14 | 1376556 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

I wanna to hear those presses burn bitchez!!!

"Satisfaction came in a chain reaction could't get enough so I had to self destruct....Burn baby burn, burn baby burn, burn that motha down"




Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:04 | 1376569 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

Do I have this right? Scenario A: Papandreou gets his vote, the IMF kicks in the dough, and Greece staggers under the growig weight of social unrest, falling productivity, rising joblessness, and ever steeper prices. Go ahead Papa-doo, I hope you win the "no-confidence vote", cause it will be like a millstone around your neck. It just kicks the can down the road, and where's the fun in that?

Scenario B, Poo-poohead loses the vote, Greece defaults, returns to the drachma, life is really shitty, in a sort of Cuban "special era" sort of way, with goat-herds in the suburbs if Athens and donkey carts on the streets. Then, the dominos start to fall, and meanwhile Greece turns out to be, again like Cuba, a place the rest of us turn for guidance and inspiration, and how-to kowledge for growing carrots and hitching up burros to our SUV's.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:18 | 1376752 Jasper M
Jasper M's picture

". . . like Cuba, a place the rest of us turn for guidance and inspiration"

?!?!? Are you KIDDING Me!?

Among those I know who have travelled there, Cuba is a place they turn to as a semen disposal facility. The place is so desperate, and so morally empty, that renting out their wives and daughters to the twisted whims of any foreign man with money is okay.

Now, they are not alone in this, and I grant that Cuba's history is not the same as Greece. But "turn to"?!? If Cuba is what Greece has to look forward to, they should start the mass suicides now. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 06:43 | 1376926 Sneeve
Sneeve's picture

When the peak oil folks try to choose a country that looks like what all countries will look like after China, India, Brazil, et al, have the same life style as the rich Western countries, looking at parameters like sustainable output of energy/oil, water, soybean, vanadium, kryptonite, etc. divided by the number of people on the planet, the Future looks a lot like CUBA.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 10:24 | 1377455 walküre
walküre's picture

Greece will resemble Albania more like Cuba.

The dirtiest, darkest armpit of all Europe.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:01 | 1376570 Troy Ounce
Troy Ounce's picture

Looking forward to chaos, bank runs an pension funds busts,
Government defaults and riots on the streets internationally.


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:08 | 1376577 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Private sector burden-sharing.

What the hell is that?

Secret code words for the IMF backending Preparation H on the Urectum.

Dr. Evil: Yes Frau, on the whole Preparation H feels good.

Mini Evil: No, I totally agree with you. Preparation H does feel good... on the hole.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:09 | 1376579 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Greeks better make sure their 100 tones of gold doesn't disappear over the weekend. 

Then only 72 hours to go. So it begins...

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:12 | 1376584 Imminent Collapse
Imminent Collapse's picture

OK, our attention span is being tested here.  Default and get it over with.  Give haircuts to all the banks.  Fuck them.  Let the chips fall where they may.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:16 | 1376596 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

I know.

Jesus, 13 months of foreplay. Main event time.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:05 | 1376720 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Won't it be amazing how many economists never saw this coming?

"Austerity fatigue" by the citizens will settle this thing for the bankers.

Just give it a little time and some more unemployed hitting the streets.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:45 | 1376774 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Keep posting Lizzy & Rockey.  A match made in  HEAVEN.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:42 | 1376847 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture





BoOBs! I like BoObs!



Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:11 | 1376591 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

I'll repost what I wrote earlier today

Greeks don't need IMF shock therapy.

Reissue the drachma, which naturally be devalued fairly significantly against the Euro, endure a quick 1-2 year deflationary depression. Then rebuild.

You don't want the IMF. Certainly not to pledge sovereign land as collateral to the jackals.

A nation state like Greece must maintain its sovereignty at all costs if it is to retain any semblance of a democratic republic

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:17 | 1376610 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

"A nation state like Greece must maintain its sovereignty at all costs if it is to retain any semblance of a democratic republic..."

The best quote of the day...

"Wut's sovrun?"

"Wha, sovrun over t' store n'git sum beer, wan sum?"

Are there really any sovereign, independent , democratic-republic nation-states left in the world?

Let's see...

I think Bhutan might still qualify! No... they have an absolute monarch...shit!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:21 | 1376612 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

that's pretty close to what Nigel Farage said in this interview from on RT:

(I'm reposting this because it was a great interview and precisely on topic in this thread)

Nigel Farage: Bankers+politicians = 'unholy alliance' vs people

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:29 | 1376638 AgShaman
AgShaman's picture


Nigel was a bit prophetic in the past

Have a taste of a classic:

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:51 | 1376884 A Man without Q...
A Man without Qualities's picture

Why do you equate conditions demanded by creditors to a loss of sovereignty?  It's like claiming that a bank refusing a loan is an attack on your civil liberties.  

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:15 | 1376601 Slipmeanother
Slipmeanother's picture

 As I posted before-----The USA and Wall St need to understand this: Europe continues to be the worlds leading economic and trade grouping having both the largest savings and political stability, It is the economic and trade group with the most multilateral experience. In addition thanks to the Euro the EU has the only real credible alternative reserve currency. The recent support and bi-lateral meetings with the BRICS countries has seen dollar to Euro diversification by the BRICS--headed by China. Without the Euro the BRICS would be condemned to suffer Washingstons unipolar world. So de-facto its the Euro which breached the Dollar wall, a breach that now the BRICS are enlarging using their wealth to stimulate the Euro as an alternative to the Dollar. No amount of BS spin from Wall St or the City of London can change the facts. Forget about the BS, the Euro is here to stay and the crisis has strengthened the EU institutions far quicker than would have been possible without it---watch and learn

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:21 | 1376619 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

Ad isn't all this sovereign debt crisis stuff simply a desperate ploy by dollar-backers to maintain themselves at the top? Which only porves your point.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:19 | 1376602 jtmo3
jtmo3's picture

If I had a dollar for every time I heard a story about a limited timeframe for greece.....

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:20 | 1376616 Timmay
Timmay's picture

Replace all references to "Greece" with "European Bank Balance Sheets" and then re-read the article. The IMF? = U.S. Central Bank. EU = U.S. and European taxpayers current and future.


And people here in the U.S. were so concerned about "redistribution of wealth" from Rich to poor. The exact opposite is happening all over the globe.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:21 | 1376622 Itsalie
Itsalie's picture

"the likelihood of a disorderly outcome has risen dramatically in the last 48 hours."


You can trust the pigmen to scream murder because the only drama will be banks like socgen, bnp, db etc ("PIGS will fly" - so said Socgen in Dec 2009). Iceland defaulted, stuck the middle finger to the brits and dutch twice, and just successfulky issued $1b new debt. Greeks will be alright in a year's time if they choose default the next week; if they don't, or if the troika slams it down their throat while they sunbathe in their rocky islands, then they can always migrate to free Iceland (as foreign labourers of course).

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:27 | 1376626 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Prescipice? Blyth a little help ? please?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:27 | 1376628 honestann
honestann's picture

Greece:  DEFAULT.

Abandon your debt.  It isn't real anyway, it is fiat, fake, fraud, fiction, fantasy, fractional-reserve mumbo-jumbo toilet paper and moldy computer bits.  It was created out of thin air by predatory thugs.  Screw them, not yourselves.

Hopefully this convinces everyone to NEVER lend you money again.  That is a good thing!  But just in case some total morons still want to throw their fiat away, add an absolute, unbreakable prohibition against government debt to your constitution.




Then forever more, spend less than you earn.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:37 | 1376642 JR
JR's picture

I wholeheartedly join you in the chant - Greece: DEFAULT!!

The two options given recently by Professor of Management Dr. Joseph Penbera to Americans fighting the financial oligarchs - who are “counting on the end of America” – apply also to the Greeks, IMO.  Our choices within the next 18 months, says Penbera, are 1) watch the slow bleed-out of American life as more jobs go overseas and communities decay, or 2) awaken and pull together and face the music by enduring the immediate pain necessary to correct the economy and rebuild.

IOW, don’t let the bankers have their day. Break the chains that bind into slavery.

"The modern banking system manufactures money out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most astounding sleight of hand ever invented. Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin... Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them but leave them the power to create money, and with the flick of a pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again... Take this power away from them and all great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear for then this would be a better and happier world to live in... But if you want to continue to be the slaves of the bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery then let the bankers continue to create money and control credit." --  Sir Josiah Stamp ((1880-1941) President of the Bank of England in the 1920's, the second richest man in Britain - Speaking at the Commencement Address of the University of Texas in 1927

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:15 | 1376684 rufusbird
rufusbird's picture

"The two options given recently by Professor of Management Dr. Joseph Penbera to Americans fighting the financial oligarchs - who are “counting on the end of America” – apply also to the Greeks"

I was surprised to see this reference. He is an intense guy and I know the man is well regarded by his students. You got my curiosity up so I tried to find any source of this perspective you quoted. Can you provide any link to a published source of the commment? Was it from a radio talk show appearance, or a lecture?

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:26 | 1376697 JR
JR's picture

Penbera was in a two-hour interview with Central California’s most powerful radio personality, KMJ’s Ray Appleton.  Appleton said it was the most informative show he’s ever had – and it was. This don't-miss interview can be heard here:

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:21 | 1376758 The Fonz
The Fonz's picture

Nice lead on that :) Listening now


Sat, 06/18/2011 - 07:21 | 1379895 rufusbird
rufusbird's picture

found it, thank you. Grooves in well wity my "Patriot" thesis posted here two weeks ago. I suspect Penbera is a ZH reader. Where else would he find such a rich source of information and links to sources.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:31 | 1376630 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

The inevitability of default is matched only by the exhaustion of all and every means to avoid it.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:27 | 1376633 wannabe traitor
wannabe traitor's picture

i hope it goes to hell. ive hedge accordingly

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:31 | 1376634 Clowns on Acid
Clowns on Acid's picture

There wil be a number of "in principle agreements" and markets calm, whilst still leaking lower. No worries, they will ultimately print to keep their reputations and wallets in place.

Printing begins again in Aug / Sept., but this time with talk of gold as a metric of the backing value of the currency. The question is what will the IMF/ECB/Fed cabal value the gold at.

$5000 / oz with the USD @ a 1000/1 conversion rate...or sumpthin' like that.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:43 | 1376647 Cursive
Cursive's picture

Ackermann cautioning about restructuring is like Rep. Weiner cautioning about an ethics code.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:40 | 1376649 knukles
knukles's picture

"just like 2000 years ago, the fate of the western about to be decided by a few popularly elected parliamentarians in Athens."

To what the fuck this referring?  
I know that I am dearly lacking.  My mother used to lament about her simple son, my father castigate me with "dumbass" and "dipshit", my uncle refer to me as "retard", my neighbor as "asshole" and was even hated by many in my field for being a disbeliever with respect to Efficient Capital Market Hypotheses and associated dogmatic drivel. 
Perhaps it has something to do with my  perpetually sarcastic cynical nature oft veiled as dry, altruistic humor.
Nor am I a student of Greek history within the decade following the birth of Christ as measured within the parametrics of the Georgian calendar.  In fact, aside from the movies "Jason and the Golden Fleece" and "Debbie does Delphi", I am somewhat helpless in this regard. 
So, pray tell, what is the decision by some parliamentary chaps in Athens 2000 years ago to which the aforesaid refers?
I remain mystified, your humble struggling servant in quest of that to which I remain freely and admittedly ignorant. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:14 | 1376807 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Since the world is under US propaganda,US propaganda has to be used as the contextual reference set and thus the guy probably refers to the preparations to the battle of Thermopylae, battle that is introduced and depicted by the US as the battle allowing the West to save freedom and democracy from the odious Iranian uh no persian tyranny.

Now lets see if this event as it is introduced by US propaganda fits the bill:

-was it decided by an assembly taking place into Athens? Absolutely as the Athenians built a large fleet and voted to start an alliance of city-states as they were lacking man power. Checked.

is it told to be a saving event, protecting the Western world from losing democracy and freedom and thus determining the fate of the Western world? Absolutely.Checked.

-It happened 480BC. Off but not really that terrible as US propaganda is accustomed to such imprecision.

This event, from the US propaganda book, fits the bill:

so preparations of the Thermopylae battle, when assembled Greeks saved the West from the Iranian yoke,  protecting democracy and freedom (us style of course)

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:02 | 1376862 Shylockracy
Shylockracy's picture

Leonidas was a Spartan king, and the 300 men he led in Thermopylae were also Spartans. Sparta, since the times of Lycurgus until the end, despised the so called "democracy" of imperialist Athens and fought it until Athens was finally defeated in the Peloponesian war. No, the West was not saved from the Iranian yoke as you say. Leonidas was defeated by the Persians and Sparta later sought an alliance with the Persians against Athens.

US zionistic imperialism under the cloak of defending Western civilization is a farce, pure propaganda. And so is the notion of modern democracy, which has proven in the praxis since 1789 Oswald Spenglers' thesis: "democracy is the political weapon of financial capital".

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 06:50 | 1376932 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

If you are that upset about democracy, just keep freedom.

The Greeks voted to preserve freedom in the West etc...


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:22 | 1376813 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

I never noticed your altruistic humor before. This is a facet of your personality I could come to appreciate.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:20 | 1376864 NoClueSneaker
NoClueSneaker's picture

Me thinks I remember sumthing, despite of the fact I share all of yer experiences with relatives, neighbours, "friends", etc.

Greece was build on traison - Attic Union of corrupt merchants attacked Sparta and won. Corruption grew, and there was not enough money to feed all the crooks and they came on genial idea to bombbombbomb I... erm, Sicily. And they went down helping the birth of Roman Republic .

Republic went corrupt and became an Empire so they bombbombbombed the entire world, but there was no money to feed all the crooks ... and there was an traitor called Arminius that sold his own troops, and so Roman Empire went down .... pretty much straight forward till today.


*retard*dipshit*weirdo*psychopath* Club Member


Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:43 | 1376652 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

I think the author was referring to the events of 2,340 (or was it 2,430?) years past, when a Jury of 500 Athenians condemned Socrates to death. What's a couple of hundred years when we're staring the Great Collapse in the face?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:52 | 1376663 knukles
knukles's picture

Good start...
But, the author does state parlimentarians, as per elected representatives, not jurymen. 
And mentioned that it was an event of sole great import for the future of democracy/the west or some such gravitas. 
Hemlock on the rocks, anyone?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:58 | 1376664 knukles
knukles's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:05 | 1376671 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

Right. The trouble is, I don't know where we would find a parliamentarian anywhere some 20 centuries ago. Rome had a senate, and Jerusalem had the Sanhedrin and the council of 70, but does that count? Athens was really and truly a democracy, where everyone, literally, had a say... I guess then, all the populace of Athens were parliamentarians.

Why nit-pick? It sounds good, and no-one but ZH posters would have ever caught on.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:31 | 1376768 Jasper M
Jasper M's picture

Mess, I appreciate you attempt to elucidate, but Athenian democracy was Very narrow by modern standards, and by NO mean was it anywhere near true that "everyone, literally, had a say". Excluding females (which, to be fair, only got the vote recently in modern times), their civilization had a Lot of slaves (though they were nearly unique in Greece in having laws that forbade the casual enslavement of citizens). And they had a large population of resident aliens (metics ?), who were not enfranchised. 

   By modern measures, Classical Athens was an oligarchy. But the Chosen Few overned fairl directly. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:16 | 1376811 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

I think the author was referring to the events of 2,340 (or was it 2,430?) years past, when a Jury of 500 Athenians condemned Socrates to death.


You've killed me with this one. Auch... Excellent. This guy is making a cultural reference. Especially toward the anglo saxon world. Cultural references are to be referenced to the context provided by the US propaganda.

Death of Socrates, an important event? It does not even involve war. Nothing can not be important for the US propaganda machine if it does not involve war.

My bet is on the preparations to Thermopylae battle, the battle for freedom and democracy, to save the West from the Iranian grip. Fits the bill, see above.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:03 | 1376668 infiniti
infiniti's picture

The bad shit will happen in Sep/Oct. The Germans will want to spend their holiday on the beach, so sending Greece over the cliff at this point would be a major inconvenience.

It'll happen... in 3 months.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:23 | 1376816 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

They can always go to Florida.  Beach property there is a good buy now.  

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:04 | 1376674 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

Yeah, I'm on the  DEFAULT NOW bus. Cold turkey is the way to go. F**k that tapering off bulls**t.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:05 | 1376677 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

Why do I have to stand in line at the public health clinic for this crappy IMF methadone?

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:19 | 1376691 kito
kito's picture

Are we to believe there have been no plans in the works by the banking elite to offset this pending default? It will hardly be a surprise to anybody when greece defaults, whereas lehman was an unanticipated shock.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:49 | 1376721 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

My impression is, that's not clear. The shadow banking system makes counter parties to the derivatives fairly opaque. Under that assumption, I don't think they really know what might happen if something gets unplugged from the system.

With another (fairly certain) assumption that Greece default is a given, what may be happening at this point is trying to determine who has what to assess the damage...and thus the delay.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:44 | 1376718 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

I get the sense that Greece has a fairly strong hand in front of it. The banks are so overlevered and add the shadow-system derivatives to boot that if Greece says 'blow me', the entire thing collapses. The Greek common might have MUCH more power than they realize.

HINT, HINT to other countries that are in debted.

Somehow, it would be ironic for Greece (Rome) to bring down the entire financial system once again.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 00:51 | 1376722 vegas
vegas's picture

Long D-Mark, Chf - short everything else. Bring back the '80's. Ahhhh for the good ole days trading forex. Even G-Pap and the boys would be long these spreads.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:00 | 1376731 edotabin
edotabin's picture

If they default, loans will stop.  If they accept medium term financing with the conditions attached, the public will riot.  If they do not accept: default. So, they need to get the medium term money with "softer" terms. This is probably what will happen. If I am not mistaken the IMF is already agreed to this.

Then, they will start becoming relaxed about paying back.  "TERMS" the EU/IMF will scream.The whole debate is repeated. The EU/IMF will accept the harshest terms possible without a revolt of the people.

Satisfied they scared the EU/IMF into relaxing the terms a bit, the people will eventually go home. In either case, the life of the average Greek citizen will deteriorate and the gubbermint will sell of half of the assets they intended to sell initially. No matter where the line of this compromise is drawn, the life of the average Greek person will deteriorate significantly and it would be very wise for them to fully comprehend this.

The only way out is for EU/IMF to lie through their teeth about how much better Greece is doing (they will gladly do it) and for Greece to alter the structure of its society. Very low tax on new businesses, stimulate the local economy and cut, cut, cut from the public sector. Once the Greek people get rid of the local monkey on their shoulder (greek super-inflated government) then they will have to deal with Brussels. By that time the status of Greece will have been reduced to that of Idaho in the US and there will be little the Greeks can do.

The educational system will have changed. The new European children will learn about how great the EU is while America struggles to stay afloat and how lucky they were to have made the sacrifices in order to avoid America's fate.

Isn't that what they were teaching in America for so long?

The Banks:100  The People: 0

The end.







Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:13 | 1376734 Element
Element's picture

And the MSM and Banksters are looking a bit worried:


Credit crunch warning on back of Greek crisis

By business editor Peter Ryan

Updated 1 hour 45 minutes ago

Ralph Norris says the Greek debt crisis will not force the CBA to lift interest rates. (AAP: Sam Cardwell)The head of the Commonwealth Bank has warned the deepening debt crisis in Europe has the potential to plunge financial markets into turmoil and create a new credit crunch.


Greece on brink of economic abyss

By European correspondent Rachael Brown

Updated 4 hours 33 minutes ago
Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou

Historic moment: George Papandreou says Europe faces a huge challenge. (AFP: Louisa Gouliamaki, file photo)

Greek prime minister George Papandreou has spent his 59th birthday trying to stop his government and the country's economy from slipping into an abyss.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:25 | 1376763 chump666
chump666's picture

Aust banks will get target hard so they are gonna scream for a rate cut. Double whammy on China slowing and EU meltdown

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:53 | 1376785 Element
Element's picture

They're more interested (pardon pun) in the cost of borrowing internationally, to supply domestic credit needs, so they're actually saying to the proles to not to worry, we don't think we'll have to raise rates, to cover the cost of our borrowing, and thus pass it onto you, by raising rates ahead of the RBA's probable wish to lower them soon.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:02 | 1376832 qussl3
qussl3's picture

The AUD is such a screaming short it isnt even funny anymore, the bounces are a real bitch tho lol.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:23 | 1376761 chump666
chump666's picture

Major divergence on the DMI (EUR), it's going down. All crosses are on sell.  CB's may try another meltup on the EUR, hilarious, hows ECB balance sheet looking?

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:27 | 1376767 glenlloyd
glenlloyd's picture

the eu will have to give assurances and the imf will just have to throw more good money after bad, even if the no confidence vote materializes.

i just don't see the players sitting around the table and letting this slip away.

then again I could be wrong...who knows.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:45 | 1376780 crash_davis
crash_davis's picture

Step back for a moment and think of whats happening and whats about to happen. Ironic it would be for the death of the west to start where the west began. The ideas of the people ruling. The idea of the people voting on their own. All the ideas that came forth from that foundation. Liberty, freedom,  that every man woman and child has certain fundamental rights given by god.

     I look at my kids and i want to weep that the country we are leaving them is a debt ridden shell of what was once a country built on an idea so noble. That all are created free. That all are entitled to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

     Now we are all debt slaves wondering where and when the next bailout or handout is coming. These "citizens" who know nothing of the men and women who have fought and died to give us such blessings, now these sheeple will sit in awe struck dumbassness as the end begins. They will wonder what happened. Then they will wonder how they will get by. And then we will all be on our own, praying for the loved and the lost.

     It is no surprise that a society so morally and socially bankrupt is so financially bankrupt as well.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:05 | 1376803 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Well said CrashD. Only thing I'd say is that the US was not built on any noble principles. The US was a scam from the beginning with all kinds of occult reasons to have DC be where it is etc.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 08:59 | 1377186 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

Only thing I'd say is that the US was not built on any noble principles. The US was a scam from the beginning with all kinds of occult reasons to have DC be where it is etc.

ORI...When you hear that loud POP, that would be your head coming out of your ass.

Good Lord what are you on Crack?????


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:48 | 1376783 Element
Element's picture

posted in wrong location

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:56 | 1376788 crash_davis
crash_davis's picture

sorry to get all preachy. sometimes i just can't believe whats happening.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 02:02 | 1376799 Element
Element's picture

er, sorry, that was not directed at you, I actually posted something in the wrong location.

Frankly +1

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:49 | 1376856 dust to dust
dust to dust's picture

 From the heart we are all concerned. 

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 01:59 | 1376796 Peter K
Peter K's picture

And this impending Armegedon can easily be avoided if Germany just left the Euro.



Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:00 | 1376834 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Funny but true.

Pretty sure China wouldnt like that tho lol.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:41 | 1376846 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

Funny how it's called a vote of confidence.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:29 | 1376870 NoClueSneaker
NoClueSneaker's picture


Peer Steinbrück was called "The Man Of The Year" after he obliterated german economy.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 03:54 | 1376855 Volaille de Bresse
Volaille de Bresse's picture

"The franco-germanic imperialist banking cartel will face a full blown greek intifada." I see things differently : to me history ALWAYS lands on its two feet.


Your grand-parents ate rocks and shagged goats. Your generation bought Vuitton purses and drove Mercedes cars... (thank you Europe and GS).


But I can GUARANTEE you your children will be back to eating rocks and shagging goats.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 04:27 | 1376868 anony
anony's picture

I don't believe it.  Didn't believe it about Lehman and I don't believe it about Greece.

This is nothing more than a setup so that the jews who own most of the leverage, don't get hit, just as they did when Paulson cried like chicken little to congress. 

Gawddamn them, let them fail!

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 05:33 | 1376895 Heroic Couplet
Heroic Couplet's picture

Banksters don't want regulation, shouts another blog. But then the top 1% are sitting down to decide who takes the haircut.

OK, what's the difference? a haircut is regulation.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 05:48 | 1376902 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

I'm sure I heard some IMF stormtrooper claiming that "Greece should be able to return to the bond markets in 2 years" recently.


I wonder where he is now......?


Unaccountable, unconvincing and uncoordinated.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 07:00 | 1376940 Version 7
Version 7's picture

Greece, as Portugal, as Ireland, as Spain, as Belgium, as Italy, as possibly others, will inevitably leave the euro and pay their debt one way or another through currency devaluation, ie inflation.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 07:27 | 1376979 Slap That Taco
Slap That Taco's picture


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 09:41 | 1376996 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

Thanks to those beautiful laws of mathematics, bankers will untimately fail.

Most developed nations have sold out their sovereignty to central banks, withdrawing their national currencies and adopting central bank currencies.

For example America withdrew its national currency, the US dollar, and adopted Federal Reserve Notes (FRN) issued by the Federal Reserve, a private non-government bank. European nations withdrew their respective national currencies and adopted the Euro, issued by the European Central Bank, a private non-government bank.

Amshel Rothschild said give him control of a nation's currency and he doesn't care what laws they make, implying he has more control than the nation's lawmakers.

We see that in here America where Fed chairman Ben Bernanke has more power than Congress and doesn't care what laws Congress makes. In Europe ECB head JCT has more power than any Euro-nation parliament and doesn't care what laws they make.

Central banks have one purpose: Steal the wealth of a nation.

Central banks have complicit corrupt politicians in a national government helping them steal that nation's wealth.  In America it's Obama, Geithner, and powerful people in Congress.

Central banks buy cooperation of corrupt politicians by offering to loan them unlimited amounts of their private currency the central bank creates out of thin air, printing it on a printing press more or less.   In America The Fed has loaned $14 trillion FRNs to the federal government, and all of it was created out of thin air.

(The US dollar no longer exists.  Calling FRNs "dollars" is convenient but it's erroneous.  There's no such thing as a US dollar anymore.  A 1 FRN note says "one dollar", implying 1 FRN is equivalent to 1 US dollar. But it's meaningless since US dollars don't exist anymore.)

The Fed is loaning America's wealth to the federal government, private companies like Goldman Sachs, and foreign banks like Deutsche Bank.

Yes, I said loaning it. The Fed owns it. The Fed owns America's wealth.

The Fed also buys stuff with America's wealth, like buying (worthless) securities from Goldman Sacks, effectively giving part of America's wealth to Goldman Sachs, and buying (wothless) greek bonds from Deutsche Bank, effectively giving part of America's wealth to Deutsche Bank.

A nation's wealth is carried in it's currency.

Whoever owns that currency owns the nation's wealth.

When a nation's government issues a currency, the government now owns the nation's wealth. Instantly.  Just that fast.

This is why America's founders said NO paper currency.  Only physical gold and silver would be allowed.  It's right there in the Constitution.  Gold and silver only.

It doesn't mean a gold-backed paper currency either. They said NO paper currency PERIOD.

When a nation withdraws its currency and adopts an outside currency, the owner of that currency now owns the nation's wealth. Instantly.  Poof, just like that.

The Fed owns America's wealth. The ECB owns all the Euro-nations' wealth.

Greece has consumed more wealth than they've created.  They've had to borrow wealth from other Euro-nations and the ECB for some time now. About 300 billion Euros worth so far.

Most of that borrowed wealth has been consumed by the Greek government, some going into pockets of Greek politicians, some  passed on to the Greek people in various welfare programs.

Greece has borrowed so much wealth fron other Euro-nations, those other nations are now saying "enough, no more, they can't pay back what they've borrowed already".

Some day the American people ...and nations like China... hopefully will say the same thing about our federal government.

But the Fed couldn't care less. The Fed would loan ALL of America's wealth to the federal government if we let them.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 10:35 | 1377488 walküre
walküre's picture

Without banks, the peasants can't afford shit.

Maybe that's the better route. But don't think for a minute, the elite will be worse off than the rest of us w/o the central banks. They go straight back to the feudal system and lease your body to you. You live at their mercy. Unless of course you organize with others and overthrow the elite and start the whole communist thingy again.

There's always someone richer and more powerful than you!

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 08:49 | 1377163 GFORCE
GFORCE's picture

Rather ironic this because if Greece goes down then the author will likely be gathering his career in a small cardboard box a la Lehman.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 09:26 | 1377274 americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Does anybody remember the lost years when the "Generals" ran Greece like their own personal slave labor camp? Does anyone think that the Greek Military ( US trained for the most part) hasn't made total plans for relieving the civilian leadership of their heads? Plus the Military aren't dumb - they have already made their deal with the banksters. If I was Greek I would be terrified, not of the IMF, and not of the EU, but of my own military. How much longer do you think they are going to stand by and watch the destruction of their country by outsiders? It's coup time again - very soon.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 09:48 | 1377337 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

Likewise, I believe a military coup is the only thing that would save America.

I don't foresee civilians doing it.

Fri, 06/17/2011 - 10:28 | 1377472 walküre
walküre's picture

Is it POMO day today?

Or are markets and EURUSD up in advance of Sunday's vote which will be guaranteed to extend the Greek malaise at French and German taxpayers expense?

Greek would have been bankrupt without the Euro 10x over by now. Their socialism is the real millstone around G-Pap's neck.

It's got nothing to do with banks which provided loans to the lazy MoFos.


Fri, 06/17/2011 - 11:29 | 1377648 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

The central banks regard sovereign governments as annoyances except where they serve as instruments of collection of debt service.  When the original security for the obligation (be it real estate sliding in value, or worse if the debt is unsecured) becomes worthless, the sure path to payment is to convert the obligation to a sovereign obligation, supported by the authority to levy taxes and seize property, garnish wages, etc.  This is all a collection plan.

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