Guest Post: The Alternative Market Project Has Been Launched!

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Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:05 | 1007143 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Eventually, the establishment will have to come after you, openly exposing its tyrannical nature, or it will have to conform to you. In either case, you benefit.

I'm not entirely sure that when the Establishment comes after me I'll be experiencing it as a benefit.

But thanks for the thought.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:11 | 1007164 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Better to fight a snake in the light than in the darkness.  Once they expose themselves for what they really are through overt violence, public opinion will crystalize against them.  Think about the Boston Massacre, and what that did for the American Revolution.

Certainly, not good for those who died, but many, MANY more will die by the hands of the government if we continue to play their game.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:28 | 1007608 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

Very astute. Great writing style!

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:48 | 1007693 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Exellent comment tmosely..

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:15 | 1007181 the mad hatter
the mad hatter's picture

All you need for an alt market is to establish full-reserve banks to compete with fractional-reserve banks. Full-reserve banks could provide a stable foundation for the economy to be rebuilt on. To be profitable they could charge depositors a storage fee. You wouldn't have to bail out these international banking conglomerates that hold the economy hostage.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:31 | 1007275 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Sounds good, who's going to stop the EE from seizing those assets?.

This is going to end one of two ways, Civil War Deaux, or Lemmingsville.

If the bstds are building /have built internment camps, for those that refuse to become serfs, then its door #1.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:39 | 1008985 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

/yawn. I refuse. Consent of producers is required to pay for these grand schemes of the looters. Problem is...are there any non-looters left?

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:55 | 1007398 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Good luck trying to break the Federal Reserve banking monopoly.  Anyone trying to start a "full-reserve" bank will quickly realize why it hasn't been tried before.

However, there's nothing stopping individuals from doing full-reserve banking.  I am a personal full-reserve bank.  I have gold and silver saved away and I use cash for everything.  Everything.

And I'm already part of a personal full-reserve banking network, made up of like-minded individuals.  When it's time, we'll come in and recapitalize society.

I am Chumbawamba.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:32 | 1007627 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

buy HSBC stock.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:03 | 1007770 CPL
CPL's picture

I'm not sure capitalization would be even needed at that point when it gets to that point.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 16:26 | 1008533 illyia
illyia's picture

Buy Chumbawamba stock.


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 19:02 | 1009273 Guy Fawkes Mulder
Guy Fawkes Mulder's picture

Spiritually or philosophically speaking, I think I will.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:02 | 1008752 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture


Here you say you use cash for everything, everything and then further on down in another post you say you use paypal because it's convenient.

At least stay consistent on the same thread.

You talk a big talk but have little credibility.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:25 | 1008897 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Who died and made you the dispensary of credibility?

Is this the best you've got?

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:29 | 1008909 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture

Just trying to keep a good man honest!  I just see that so many come on here ripping the system decrying revolution but yet participate in it so willingly.

It's like the first time I bought silver from APMEX and then I see they use JPM for all their transactions....

Or someone on here claiming they use only cash and then you find out they use paypal...

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:39 | 1008982 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Um, yeah.  Listen, you shit-eating cockmonkey, if you have something of substance to pick out then please bring it to my attention.  If all you're going to engage in is pissant semantics then I have a boil on my ass I have to lance.

I am Chumbawamba.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:47 | 1009000 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture

Then I suggest you go ahead and lance it and stop contradicting yourself in the same thread acting like your Mr. Anti-establishment, when your not, and then maybe you can have a little credibility. Make sure your Mom sterilizes the needle first.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 21:26 | 1009734 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Ok, nigger.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 22:21 | 1009886 oygevalt
oygevalt's picture

Allow me to point out another contradiction in Chumbawamba's sweet nothings.  He claims to have purchased his house in 1997, before the bubble... but to have ended up underwater.  Now, I'm betting there were no medical bills or similar sob stories, or we all would have heard chapter and verse about them.  So, either a) Chumbawamba refi'd for toys, and needs to defend why he's not a willful thief who's doing nothing more than welching on a bad decision; or b) Chumbawamba is a moron.  In any event, he certainly has demonstrated himself incapable of having a debate where there's the slightest chance of him losing without tossing in racial slurs, ethnic insults, and questions to his knowledge all around.  So, cash-on-the-barrel-Paypaller, do you care to respond to any of this?  Or would you rather go on blaming Israel and "the banks" for your financial problems?

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:50 | 1008304 Xkwisetly Paneful
Xkwisetly Paneful's picture

Exactly because it is such an efficient use of resources having them stashed in a closet somewhere.


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 23:41 | 1010132 Amagnonx
Amagnonx's picture

The main problem with the western world, and the reason that its people will never escape - is law.


Unless the people over throw the Roman based law - they will be subject to a legal system in which law is a commodity, and the system is designed to be inaccessible for ordinary people.

Also - debt and credit are both uneccesary and harmful.  Banks not only needed to have 100% reserves, but they should not issue credit and debt - it should be illegal to do so.


For a mortgage for example, a property can be divided into a number of shares.  The bank and the perosn who wishes to finally purchase the property both buy shares, with a contract that means the bank can not sell the shares to anyone else, unless there is a rental default.


Then the person who wants to live in the home pays rent on each share - and can purchase new shares from the bank whenever they have money to do so.


The value of the property and rent are revalued by mutual agreement annually or so (use of third parties).  If the value of the real estate falls - they both lose - but the rent will also fall, and the buyer can get the shares more cheaply from the bank.

EQUITY NOT CREDIT!  Debt and credit should be made illegal.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:19 | 1007210 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Just wait till the Jews declare war on this like they did to Germany in 1933 after Germany decided to circumvent the banks and trade barter

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:32 | 1007279 ChartreuseDog
ChartreuseDog's picture

Yeah, right, trust the Nazis to post the truth about the Jews.


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:46 | 1007341 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

NAZI means National Socialist, I abhor both (fanatical)nationalism and socialism/communism so calling me a nazi is out of place, just call me .... a truth seeker

"Yeah, right, trust the Nazis to post the truth about the Jews." -

So I guess it's fine to trust the jews to say the truth about the nazi/germans ?


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:13 | 1007830 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

You are a JP Morgan/Rockefeller/Vatican lackey trying to divert public anger from your masters to someone else, just like happened in nazi Germany. Germans might be idiots in believing such lies, but the rest of the world isn't.
You and your masters will soon hang.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:24 | 1007896 Cindy_Dies_In_T...
Cindy_Dies_In_The_End's picture

Tyler-- this is exactly why there needs to be a bare boned policy of moderators here who can toss these anti semitic assholes.


Lets face it, these type of statements do a disservice to ZH and its community. Who can take a site seriously that allows this?


Who will donate to a site that allows this.


Ps-- I'm not Jewish, its just gotten out of hand, though, really.


Why not allow writers on the site the ZH contributors to be mods?

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:06 | 1008118 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Drupal has an "Ignore User" patch, I've asked for it on several ocassions.

I understand that the site may not want to (freedom of speech, etc.) or cannot (time-consuming) deal with bigoted comments and commenters, but then why not give each individual user the ability to ignore members of their choosing.

To be honest, abusive, derogatory and inflammatory posts like those above (against any group or individual) are the sole reason why I don't come here as often as I used to.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:58 | 1008353 melachiro
melachiro's picture


It's gotten to the point of absurdity recently!

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 16:26 | 1008525 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

We must not curtail free speech, even the most offensive kinds. If you don't believe in freedom of speech that you despise, you don't believe in it at all.


Trust me, I would love to see less Jew-bashing around here. Many of these assholes leave a very bitter taste in my mouth, and I agree that it makes everyone on ZH look bad. Having said that, one of the things I love about ZH is that there is virtually no censorship. This is important, and it goes to the core of what I believe ZH represents: a beacon of free thought in an increasingly controlled world.


Perhaps people like you and I could act as 'unofficial moderators'. Maybe we could jump on these guys whenever they start up with the 'Jews did it' mantra. To this point, I've taken the position of simply ignoring them. However, I'm up for handing it right back to them if doing so isn't an act of futility.


"How it infuriates a bigot, when he is forced to drag out his dark convictions!"  -Logan Pearsall Smith

Maybe this is all that we need to do; ask them to state their beliefs. Hopefully, they'll tear themselves to shreds, and lose any and all credibility that they may (or may not) have had.


Zero censorship on Zero Hedge!

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 16:30 | 1008559 nathandegraaf
nathandegraaf's picture

Well said.  But I think your first instinct to ignore is the right one.  People stop yelling when no one yells back. 

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:16 | 1008633 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

I used to get all bent out of shape and yell back. Then I realized that most of the ugliness coming out of some of these posts have more to do with the poster than whatever it is that they're griping about. There is a whole universe inside of each of us. It can be quite terrifying to explore. Many people, even the smartest among us, would prefer to project that fear out into the world rather than undertake the journey. It isn't always the case, but odds are greater than chance.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:51 | 1008307 Xkwisetly Paneful
Xkwisetly Paneful's picture

Look Mikey it is your queen for the moronista movement.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:51 | 1007375 clymer
clymer's picture


Agent Provocateur must be nice to be on the federal payroll and post this kind of garbage to thwart to legitimate freedom movement by poisoning the well-spring of freedom with anti-semitism.


sounds like good work, if you can get it. (if you don't mind selling your soul)

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:02 | 1007408 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

'Antisemite' used to mean someone who hates Jews. Now it means someone whom the Jews hate. --LA Rollins

Anti-Semitism is nothing but the antagonistic attitude produced in the non-Jew by the Jewish group.
The Jewish group has thrived on oppression and on the antagonism it has forever met in the world...
the root cause is their use of enemies they create in order to keep solidarity...
--- Albert Einstein, quoted in Collier's Magazine, November 26, 193

Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it. - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001, to Shimon Peres, as reported on Kol Yisrael radio.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:17 | 1007559 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

I'm not sure if "Jews" control the world, but as far as the above: spot on.

I am Chumbawamba.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:51 | 1007711 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

++.. in full agreement chumba

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:17 | 1007867 CH1
CH1's picture

You're a troll. Divide and Conquer! You serve your masters well.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:23 | 1007889 grl
grl's picture

Could you give the link to your Einstein source please? Usually when I read comments that are sourced from old print media, there is a scan of the actual quote as it appeared in its original. As to the Sharon comment, since there is probably no way to validate it, I suppose it is up to the reader to believe it or not. I wouldn't doubt he made this comment as he was an arrogant politician but if you take it literally, well, I think that would be foolish. I agree that some Jews do use the term "anti-Semite" too loosely and sometimes manipulate it for some advantage but you have to understand the sensitivity Jews have towards perpetuating the notion that they control the world. That is the type of demagoguery that eventually ended in 6 million Jews murdered. In the last century the Jews were first vilified with words and stereotypes and when Germany’s economy and geo/political standing cracked, the Jews were blamed, i.e. scapegoated. I have always wondered how, if the Jews were so all-powerful and controlled the world, they let six million of their own get murdered. It never made any sense to me. Maybe some really powerful Jews actually engineered the whole thing for their own benefit…sort of like 9/11?  

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:33 | 1007944 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Or maybe a large but nowhere near 6 million number of Jews were killed to corroborate the horror, and the universities and historians and news media did the rest to fill in the collective memory to create the story we have today.

I'm not saying the Holocaust didn't happen, nor that 6 million Jews weren't put to death.  I'm just saying, by legal definition, that's all hearsay to me, because I wasn't around to witness it myself.  And based on my current knowledge of the way this society I live in called the "United States of America" functions, I would not doubt for a moment any credible evidence that comes forward disproving any part of the Holocaust legend.

We now know that the zionists were working with the Nazis*.  What else awaits to be discovered to chip away at the official story?

* and

I am Chumbawamba.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:51 | 1008054 grl
grl's picture

 Well Chumbawamba, I almost feel silly even replying but I just must say this...I am a 2nd hand witness to the atrocities. I personally knew (and still know a few who are alive) who were there and told me the stories. I have personally heard the stories about the camps. There are tons and tons of video archives of eyewitness accounts...of pulling entire Jewish populations out of towns, having them dig ditches and then shooting them one-by-one, including children, into the ditch, of the camps, of the ovens and gas chambers...I really don't think these witnesses were having a group delusion or lying and I know the witnesses I have spoken to weren't lying. To quibble with the numbers and whether it was 6 million or less is a red herring. There is no doubt that the Germans murdered huge numbers of Jews (the population censuses can prove it) and that it was done because the Jews were supposedly controlling the economy/world/power...whatever. Try using some sense rather than looking for someone to blame. I still want an answer to my earlier question, if the Jews were so powerful, how did they let the Holocaust happen? Give me a reasoned answer and I will consider it. 


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:03 | 1008105 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

You're arguing in a fashion most circular.

I am not here to either prove one thing or disprove another, merely to make you consider:

Everything you know is based on hearsay (second-hand accounts).

Given what we now know about the nature of our governing institutions (that they control through illusion and fraud), is it not possible that a story has been concocted to elicit the response necessary for them to carry out their agenda?

I'm sorry you had to reduce yourself a level to respond to me, but I would appreciate a reply that does not make yet another revolution.

I am Chumbawamba.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:04 | 1008108 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

I would suggest everyone must make the distinction between Zionists and Jews. There is a huge difference. Just as there is a difference between politicians and ruling elites. The failure to make these differences clear leads to misunderstandings and obscures the basic argument.

There have been many acts of genocide practiced upon many different groups. None more terrible than the next. It would behoove us all to understand how they happen, how they are allowed to progress and the characteristics of the groups and leaders that perpetrate them, so we can eliminate them in the future.

Hopefully, the beginning of this understanding resides in the abuse of power- power accumulated through centralized government.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:59 | 1008352 Judge Judy Scheinlok
Judge Judy Scheinlok's picture

There is a difference up and until the time comes to capitalize on the close relationship. There are Cancer cells and Cancer cells. There are no kinda-Cancer cells.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 16:45 | 1008591 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

Yes, humans, in all of their beautiful complexity, with all of their hopes, dreams, failures, ideas, and stupid-ass blog posts are exactly like cancer cells. Exactly. Apt analogy.....agent smith.


/sarc off/

Wed, 03/02/2011 - 01:35 | 1010347 long-shorty
long-shorty's picture


these posters who can so easily categorize by group need to go out and make a few friends belonging to some different groups. hatred problem solved.

I kind of agree with the posters who suggested some level of censorship here at ZH. It's dangerous for people to have their sociopathy validated by other sociopaths, like somehow it's normative. I'd hate for some kid reading this site to go lynch somebody or tie them to the back of a pick-up truck and drag them to their death.

Hard to see how creating a popular platform for putrid, hateful thoughts advances society's wellbeing.

Wed, 03/02/2011 - 12:28 | 1011481 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

I agree with your first line, but everything else is cabbage, as they say in jersey.

"It's dangerous for people to have their sociopathy validated by other sociopaths..."

I don't believe that sociopaths need validation for their sociopathic thoughts and beliefs. It is kind of part of being a sociopath. Sociopaths are dangerous because they don't/can't care about other people or feel what other people are feeling. They are not dangerous because they read some bullshit on the internet.


"I'd hate for some kid reading this site to go lynch somebody or tie them to the back of a pick-up truck and drag them to their death."

I think you'd have to be a pretty sick person to not be disgusted by such an act. However, you seem to be suggesting that removing hateful material from the internet will somehow curtail violent crimes. I don't know how you arrive at this conclusion. "Hate crimes" have been around much longer than the internet (personally, i believe all crimes require some degree of hate or at least indifference toward the victim, and thus we should not distinguish between what is a hate crime and what is not; it is pointless).

See my comment above 1008525
for thoughts on censorship.

I am not a bigot, but I don't believe we should try and silence the free exchange of ideas. I don't care how flawed, incorrect, unsettling, disgusting, or revolting the idea is, I want everybody to feel free to express what they're thinking. If you don't agree with me, you should examine whether or not you really believe in free speech at all.


Tue, 03/01/2011 - 15:52 | 1008308 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture

grl, do you really think you can have an intelligent discourse with someone who has an agenda and will bend and manipulate the facts to fit that agenda?  It would be like arguing with ben bernake... don't waste your time.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:29 | 1008925 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Oh really?  What is my "agenda"?

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:25 | 1008912 DarkAgeAhead
DarkAgeAhead's picture

Ah the Glenn Beck argument. 

Chumbawamba...a departure from your generally finely and lucidly argued other posts.

Tue, 03/01/2011 - 17:30 | 1008927 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Nigga please.  I've misspoken more words about this ridiculous subject than you've spoken.

I am Chumbawamba.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!