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Guest Post: Boiling Frog Alert: Congress Wants Automatic Wage Deductions To Pay Down The Debt
From Simon Black of Sovereign Man
Boiling Frog Alert: Congress Wants Automatic Wage Deductions To Pay Down The Debt
Folks… you just can’t make this stuff up.
On July 6th, just two days ago, at least a dozen busybody Congressmen sponsored the introduction of HR 2411, the “Reduce America’s Debt Now Act of 2011.”
They always come up with fantastic names for these pieces of
legislation… and rest assured, the better/more patriotic the name, the
more ominous the bill. This one follows the pattern.
HR 2411 states that every worker in America should be able to
voluntarily have a portion of his/her wages automatically withheld and
sent directly to the Treasury Department for the purposes of paying down
the federal debt.
“Every employer making payment of wages shall deduct and
withhold upon such wages any amounts so elected, and shall pay such
amounts over to the Secretary of the Treasury…”
That’s right. Uncle Sam is so broke that he wants to give all the
good little Americans out there the opportunity to contribute an even
greater portion of their paychecks to finance government largess.
Desperate? Hmmm…. Don’t worry, it gets better.
Obviously, if an employee feels so compelled and should elect to have
a portion of his/her paycheck withheld, the onus of responsibility is
now on the employer to make it happen. The employer has to do all the
paperwork, withhold the money, send the payment to the Treasury,
maintain the account records, and probably submit to all kinds of new
filing requirements.
You can imagine that, if passed, the bill will result in a host of
new IRS regulations, complete with a battery of penalties for employers
who don’t fill out the paperwork properly, submit filings on time, or
make some administrative mistake.
Think about it: if a small business owner has one single employee who
is dumb enough to think that it’s his patriotic duty to pay down the
debt and decides to contribute $1/month, that owner will have the
responsibility for all kinds of new forms and filings, plus submit to
new ‘debt reduction audits.’
But don’t worry, it gets even better.
So let’s say there are millions of sheep out there who elect to
donate a portion of their toil and sweat so that the Chinese and big
financial institutions don’t have to worry about an American default.
How does Congress plan on rewarding its most patriotic citizens? By
sticking it to them on their taxes, of course.
HR 2411 stipulates that any contribution made to the Treasury in order to pay down the federal debt IS NOT TAX DEDUCTIBLE.
“The [Treasury] Secretary shall include. . . a reasonably conspicuous
statement that any amounts deducted and withheld from wages. . . are
not deductible as charitable contributions for Federal income tax
purposes.”
Imagine this scenario: You make $100,000/year. In a fit of complete
insanity, you decide that you want to withhold your entire annual salary
to pay down the debt. Hey, you can always move in with mom for the next
year, right?
Well guess what– Uncle Sam will gladly take your money… and then
STILL expect you to pay taxes on the $100,000 that you earned, so you’d
have to come out of pocket with an additional $40,000 or so.
Don’t worry, though. The Social Security and Medicare wages are
reduced by the amount that you withhold, making you only liable for
state and federal taxes. Seems like a good deal, eh comrades?
There are so many things utterly wrong with his piece of legislation,
it’s hard to know where to begin other than by saying that such
intellectual and philosophical perversion is only capable of springing
from unprincipled sociopaths whose sole capability is the destruction of
value.
There’s a great quote from Atlas Shrugged that comes to mind which sums this all up:
“[W]hen you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain
permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is
flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; when you see that
men get rich more easily by graft than by work, and your laws no longer
protect you against them, but protect them against you. . . you may
know that your society is doomed.”
We’ve discussed the story of the boiling frog so many times before– a
frog, when put into a pot of water and slowly brought to a boil,
doesn’t realize that he’s in danger until its too late. I think the
boiling frog just got a little hotter. Have you hit your breaking point yet?
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-1
agree, silly fuck still doesn't get that there is no difference btween dems and repubs
Me, or the other guy?
By liberalism you mean free market capitalism of course.
ERRRT!!! No iinthesky that is not how it works. IRS is a private collection agency of the IMF. Your payments go to an IMF account that is used to pay against the interest generated by the national debt.
Any thing you pay to the US Treasury is totally outside the purview of the tax code enforcers.Timmah would be free to spend your foolish fundage on Cuban cigars if he wants.
Also the Internal Revenue is only generated by federal employees. Hence the definition of the term "income" which means profit derived through the exercise of the privilege of working for the federal US Government. All others "volunteer" when they swear under penalty of purjury that they are US citizens on a W-4 form.
Reclaim your status as a freeborn American by reclaiming your national status.
I've read a little about claiming your strawman. How does the process actually work?
The idea that you can claim on a tax form that you are not a taxpayer is bunk. It doesn't work. Not a US citizen or a federal employee? Stop using their forms. A withholding exemption certificate per US code 26 3402 that satisfies the requirements of section (n) is used in place of a W-4. See findlaw or cornelllaw.edu for the code.
it should look like this;§ 3402. Income tax collected at source
n) Employees incurring no income tax liability
Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, an employer shall not be required to deduct and withhold any tax under this chapter upon a payment of wages to an employee if there is in effect with respect to such payment a withholding exemption certificate (in such form and containing such other information as the Secretary may prescribe) furnished to the employer by the employee certifying that the employee— (1) incurred no liability for income tax imposed under subtitle A for his preceding taxable year, and (2) anticipates that he will incur no liability for income tax imposed under subtitle A for his current taxable year.
Thank you Tunga! I'll do some research.
That may work for a while.If your born here, your a subject of the American system, and obligated to pay taxes.
Many have tried this, and some have eluded the payoff,but most get nailed.
VOLUNTARY in the IRS guidelines, does not mean you can choose to pay or not to pay.
It means the Filing of same is voluntary,you get to do the paperwork,but is certainly doesn't mean you get to decide if you want to pay or not.
Lots of folks in prison for Voluntary non compliance.
True that, DosZap. Ask Wesley Snipes how this approach worked out for him.
Oh dont worry! We're about to be saved by QE3! AHHHH HA HA HA HAAAAA HA HA HAAAAAAA!!!!
Hi SheepDog-One.
You've been around here for awhile. How do you see things going down?
The cuter, nicer the name of the legislation, the more ominous... or something along those lines as written above...
........try Patriot Act.
helloooo!!! black market !!!
The only answer at this point is to withdraw from the system. Get your income down so that you don't pay taxes, don't keep money in banks or 401ks (But I'll use their lockboxes), and buy nothing except Food and utilities.
I wonder if I can convince my employer to pay me as a contract worker? I'd just as soon not be W2 employed.
Fuck these plutocrats. I'm tired of supporting people sitting on their brains while I'm out busting my ass.
(But I'll use their lockboxes)
Not a smart move.................
The USA will never be productive and competative if these nutjobs push this slave wagon through. What kind of professional would want to work in the USA and pay taxes up the spinkdo and and not get dink in return?
It will create an Army of Professional Ex-Pats.
If there were any REAL intelligent smaller/med sized nations out there, they would put out a blanket invitation, to apply for citizenship(for free) to those w/ample means,and passing back ground checks.
This would be great building blocks added to their national growth, add millions to their systems, and bring their populations up to speed with REAL workers, and quality people.
Hell, we are already exporting most everything of value now, why not another mini Exodus.
People can already do this.
Citizens who wish to make a general donation to the U.S. government may send contributions to a specific account called "Gifts to the United States." This account was established in 1843 to accept gifts, such as bequests, from individuals wishing to express their patriotism to the United States. Money deposited into this account is for general use by the federal government and can be available for budget needs. These contributions are considered an unconditional gift to the government. Financial gifts can be made by check or money order payable to the United States Treasury and mailed to the address below.
it should be mandatory! no?
It's all in the words. I think the definition of "voluntary", for the purposes ofthis bill, is stuck down on page 843,612,;Section A, subsection 3, paragraph (c), article 413,998; "whereas voluntary, as it pertains to all subsections of this bill, is determined to be considered a representation of mandatory required withholding. Failure to do so will result in enhanced water interrogation or contingent military exercise conscription. Mommy government loves you"
A little high toned for most tastes but keds was a great shoe nonetheless.
It should be mandatory for DEMOCRATS
Did you count the names of Republicans on that bill's sponsors?
Looks like 100% Republicans.
It should be mandatory for anyone who intends to vote again for any Democrat or Republican. Last time I checked, the water was already boiling. Big O is just following a long line of c[r]ooks who apparently like their frog legs well done.
Voluntary is the first step to mandatory.
The US government is so broke it is now seeking donations. What's next, a telethon?
They could have Pelosi and Clinton do a strip act. I'm sure that people would pay a lot of money to see them, "put it back on".
Great idea! What other acts would the ZH community like to see?
Pelosi's coin slot would be appropriate for the new pennies in circulation.
Sooooo....THAT's why people say pennies taste like that!
Eww...that is gross on so many levels.
We could balance the budget if Palin stripped. That's my kind of hopey changey feeley.
+1 +1 +1
ROTFL!!
I almost spit up my soda on my keyboard! One of the best come-back lines I've read on ZH in a long time!
(...but now I have that nasty image in my head of Pelosi's wrinkly coin slot...blech...so much for my lunch...)
Yeah, I am still giggling over that one. Apparently we have a Pelosi fan lurking as I was junked.
Pelosi is kind of hot in a GILF way. Come on, anyone else out there willing to take it to task?
Imagine... come on... imagine it... ohhhh yesss.... uhmmmmm!!!
I junked you. Calling your disgusting fantasy above (sarcastic or not) "junk" is giving junk a bad name.
I would put up 30 silver pieces (eagles) for each member of the scum class that commits hari-kari on live TV.
PPV event hosted by Anthony Weiner and Charlie Rangle? With special guest host, Jimmy Carter? WTF???
Buffett was on CNBS the other morning and said that the feds collect an extra $700K to 3 mil from voluntary contributions to lower the debt. Some ass wipes in congress must have seen it and said "if we only made it easier, more idiots would give us their money". I like to think my tax payment went to build the "shrimp treadmill". I can only fantasize where a voluntary contribution would go (maybe to help fill AF1's gas tank for a family trip to Martha's Vineyard or better yet pay for the dog's plane).
Why won't Warren just die already? He has already outlived his reputation. Now he is just a panty sniffing old fool with more money than decency or sense and a traitor to his nation.
Becky Quick gives him a viagra induced blow job for each "American Sunrise" interview.
double post.
That is one way to reduce the population without lifting a finger.
This is a joke right? They couldn't be seriously thinking that this is a good idea.
o yuck, nancy pelosi jumping up and down in bikini trying to get all phone lines busy.
would you rather janet napolitano?
I'll take Janet Reno any day!
Just stop! All of you stop! I can't stand another image of such things in my mind.
A lesbian show with Janet Reno and Madeleine Albright.
Congelesa with hip boots and a whip. Go Daddy
and......christina lagarde!
Who?
Shut up you cretin...
Coppertop stumbled upon ZH by accident. He/she thinks Zerohedge is a Yahoo xeriscaping forum.
Outloud chuckle of the day.
Somehow got by our Cheshire Cat captcha.
Hey guys, think a little about the Turing test. I have a strong suspicion we have an actual, real-live algo in our midst. Kinda primitive, responds to simple keywords related to the topic (see reaction to 'undervalued', large block posts of more than one paragraph, reaction to link posted, etc.) Now THIS is an account Tyler/Sacrilege should look into. Have you seen any multi-sentence reply from this account? Possibly just the handler doing the algo testing intervening, if so. No, this is a responsive, text recognition algo, constructing a response that attempts to be contextually tied to posts, based on pre-determined rules and patterns. I suspect it is also learning. See the other thread by Tony Pallotta on comparing 2007 top to current setup.
It is just good enough to fly under radar as an annoying/weird ZH reader or outright human troll -- but never inflammatory enough to be called out as such.
Sorry for the repeated postings of this text, let's try to see if we can poke it enough to respond.
Eliza V3.0, perhaps?
Barbara Mikulski?
On a trampoline?
You both shall be cast into the fires of Mount Doom.
There is not enough botox in existence.
Looong blow fish venom!!!
Yep, just like Jerry's Kids. They can call it "For the Amerikan Children Telethon" and have a big celebrity - maybe Warren Buffet or Jamie Dimon - be the MC.
Anyone remember "Americathon" from 1979. Great drive-in comedy - US broke and actually has a telethon to raise cash. Must see.
Best bit was that sweat suits had replaced business suits.
Look around some day...
LMAO, best comment today......... "telethon" yeah i wonder if jerry lewis is running the telethon down in florida.
Is this like when they passed the Motherfucking Un-American Piece of Shit Scoundrel Act and slapped a label on it calling it, "The PATRIOT Act".
I can just see Don Draper dreaming up such an idea and Roger Sterling grinning from ear to ear as the customer leaves the room with a raging erection. Sickening.
Motherfucking Un-American Piece of Shit Scoundrel Act!! Modern Poetry.
Genius!
Spoken like a TRUE patriot
You do realise, that for posting on here, we'll all be first against the wall in the first of Stalin's modern day purges..
Yeah, well at least we know they're coming for us, no long sleepless nights worried about whether they'll be knocking, we know we'll be some of the first, so might even get to do a show trial or two to inject some rascalish ZH'd cynical sarcstic humor into the whole proceedings, we know there'll still be enough bullets to make it quick, we know our names will be remembered by those still lurking about....
What are we waiting for, assembled in the forum?
The barbarians are due here today.
Why isn’t anything happening in the senate?
Why do the senators sit there without legislating?
Because the barbarians are coming today.
What laws can the senators make now?
Once the barbarians are here, they’ll do the legislating.
Why did our emperor get up so early,
and why is he sitting at the city’s main gate
on his throne, in state, wearing the crown?
Because the barbarians are coming today
and the emperor is waiting to receive their leader.
He has even prepared a scroll to give him,
replete with titles, with imposing names.
Why have our two consuls and praetors come out today
wearing their embroidered, their scarlet togas?
Why have they put on bracelets with so many amethysts,
and rings sparkling with magnificent emeralds?
Why are they carrying elegant canes
beautifully worked in silver and gold?
Because the barbarians are coming today
and things like that dazzle the barbarians.
Why don’t our distinguished orators come forward as usual
to make their speeches, say what they have to say?
Because the barbarians are coming today
and they’re bored by rhetoric and public speaking.
Why this sudden restlessness, this confusion?
(How serious people’s faces have become.)
Why are the streets and squares emptying so rapidly,
everyone going home so lost in thought?
Because night has fallen and the barbarians have not come.
And some who have just returned from the border say
there are no barbarians any longer.
And now, what’s going to happen to us without barbarians?
They were, those people, a kind of solution.
-C.P. Cavafay, "Waiting for the Barbarians"
Saw a car from New Hampshire the other day with the State's motto; "Live Free or Die". We're approaching the point where that will be tested.
I'll stand beside you comrade.
ta Prole, wherever you are, if one day this shit kicks off I hope even a peace loving, lazy idiot like myself will have the guts to tell them to shove it.. unfortunately, i have a nasty habit of going with the flow
but what form would these 'purges' take?
Times have changed. I don't think it will be 'night of the long knives'.
extraordinary rendition
WEll, I guess we all wanta chip in to save our Nation. Will this have a counter party type of thing, like reduction of spending?
Wow ok. So are they going to suggest this for all of the unfunded liabilities?
They should start with themselves paying money down. In fact anybody can do this RIGHT NOW, but the individual has to do it.
Basically all they are now wanting to do is employ businesses to collect money for the treasury department at the cost of the business, rather than the individual or the state).
Close. At the cost of the business and the state (the taxpayer anyway); someone needs to fill out the forms, but someone else needs to process them. If enough devious citizens signed up for $1 a month, they would likely end up with net negative revenue.
Why bother with that when you can just go here:
https://www.pay.gov/paygov/forms/formInstance.html?agencyFormId=23779454
I know it's been suggested before but it's genius.. All we need is for everyone to max out their credit cards paying down the federal debt, then default on their credit cards.
Thats actually not a bad idea. Although I think that just harms the credit card companies rather than the government.
Banksters get hurt? They issue the government it's credit card, I don't think so.
But then the govt. bails them out!!! Hilarity ensues!!!
there's probably a three's company episode similar to this...
good gawd i miss the prime time camel toe...
+INFINITY
And that's a bad thing?! LOL
I'm very seriously considering this very tactic. Non-violent resistance (while waiting for the time for violent resistance), bitchez!
I'm not buying a house anytime soon, and I don't buy things on credit, so FICO, JPMChase, AMEX, BofA, and the rest of them can suck my balls.
Buying a shitload of physical silver on credit, then defaulting on the credit, is also a fun tactic. Kinda more directly fucks JPM in particular.
Hmmm.. Interesting "Plan D" idea for when the balloon goes up.
Max out the big limit credit cards at Apmex and then let the bank try to find you....
Guerilla payback tactic?
Why not plan B (after taking your money out of the banks)? The bank will find me, but when they ask where the hard assets are they will be informed of my "gambling habit." Besides, once the "balloon goes up," all lines of credit, especially non-recourse credit cards, will be shut down immediately and indefinitely.
How soon they forget the CC companies dialing back credit limits and canceling cards in early 09.
Not even a credit card. Something like Paypal, where you can arrange for the payment. And since the current Pres__ent (no ID) Is BHO, we can call it BHOPal (tm) (RT).
Not sure if you meant to pun on the Bhopal chemical disaster (Union Carbide plant in India that leaked nasty stuff methyl isocyanate killing thousands, crippling tens of thousands, and injuring hundreds of thousands), but the joke's there.
"I know it's been suggested before but it's genius.. All we need is for everyone to max out their credit cards paying down the federal debt, then default on their credit cards."
I love ZH.
Read what I said just above you.
This creates an environment where legislation forces businesses to become collectors for the treasury. By removing the paper work and the work from the person doing it they're trying to get more people to do it.
The easier you make it (by putting the work on somebody else) the more likely you'll get donations.
Do you preach other places as well
I'm going to follow you around on this board and ride you like my wife after she has made herself Vegas drunk if you don't fucking behave. Seriously son! If you take a swing make it count. This nonsense you spout is worse than your hairstyle. Cock up biotch.
DocDickH, he just might be a smart bot as someone above theorized. And now that I think about it, there might be others. One line dropping non-responders.
Clever if true. regardless, waste of type space to engage.
ORI
Very probable. I was shittarded last night and felt like venting really. I have recently become self-aware of of my need to kick people in the proverbial teeth and have found the best outlet for these verbal lashings is online. Trust me, my wife appreciates bots as my targets, as opposed to her. Nonsensical one liners most of the time as Foreskintop's work, but every now and a blue moon I see relevance. Either he is a bot or a bipolar drunk.
Love your thoughts by the way. I have been enjoying your perspective.
Appreciate the appreciation Doc.
Better some on-line bozo-bot get's the kick than wifey, that is for sure! ;-)
ORI
I am not sure what biz you are crying about but in any of mine
it only takes 1 click to adjust your amount to the fed.
No extra paper or any paper is required.
However the thought that even sheep such as these would click is
comical.
This is blessed news and should be embraced. Only a visionary like our Messiah and his minions could construct such revolutionary policy.
Hope and Change I believe in!
"I'm dependent on the kindness of strangers." - Blanche Dubois
Without Googling it, like I really should...
Isn't it - "I've always been dependent on the kindness of strangers." ??
Picky, picky, picky...
I have always depended on the kindness of strangers.
Kinda strange to always be so dependent
I resemble that remark!
After a little while...
Strangers have shown kindness by providing Pelosi's Depends. Probably smell like her husband's Samoan tuna cannery..
Wow, I think you just singed my nose hairs.
And this my friends is Obamanomics!...do we seriously expect anything less from the CEO of this country who has less business and financial experience than a 7 year old kid running a fucking lemonade stand!
Wouldn't it be easier for me to just go into the subway and hand all of the government funded scum bags my debit card and PIN? That would cut out the middle man. Oh, wait, you have to have those middlemen. They are the public union drones that pay to have public officials elected. Never mind.
I agree with you about Obama's lack of experience, but this bill was proposed by a pack of House Republicans.
I thought I recognized a couple R's in there. Bastards!!!
Just fold it into the Patriot Act, after all only a commie wouldn't
support the USofA.
I was wondering when someone would notice that. Sure a lot of Democrat bashing for something they didn't do. One of the few things they are not guilty of...
Portugal has made everyone give up this years christmas bonus...Santa wont be comming this year.
LOL first thing I learned in the military...
NEVER VOLUNTEER FOR ANYTHING!
Hahahaha! No doubt!
ha ha reminds me of that scene in "no mans land" where they ask for volunteers to recon no mans land.
Fuck those cocksuckers.
Come and take it.
Molon Labe. Gold and guns out of our cold, dead hands.
Out of their cold dead hands!
How prescient.
In the UK you can volunteer to pay additional income tax. Since 2001 the total received, from the entire populous, has been about $10,000. How about, instead of paying extra money to the feds you buy some physical gold and silver, and tell them to swivel.
Isn't this just another tax? And don't they know that paying off the debt will simply destroy the money which pays the principal off?
This comment is genius!
http://66.147.244.196/~theinvio/?p=3522
Money is the base of a moral existence.
FAIL!
You tripped, smacked your head, looked up with teeth missing, and said, "FAIL!".
Ayn's poodle speaks!
It's "speakes".
Pleasure to meet you, Speakes.
Suppose the entire Nation quits work and the employers close it all up and lock it.
digitlman said it best.
Fuck.
That.
I second this! LOL!
You first!
Seriously, though, that would be awesome. I'd love to see the fed's try to respond. Unlike a situation involving picketing and blocking people from going to work, they would have no legal grounds to respond to a national strike. I imagine they'd cook up some kind of "emergency powers" reason to try to force us into submission. Fuck that. Let's take our country back. Default, bitchez!
THIRD
Its more taxation or confiscation or both.
I guess the word "voluntary" hasn't soaked in for ya.
is that "voluntary" like "background checks" for purchasing firearms are voluntary?
What? It's mandatory for licensed dealers, but it is not necessary for citizen sales.
You analogy falls flat.
I heard Harry Reid say that paying taxes is voluntary too....so it must all be true.
You could exercise Thoreau's option, had you the courage.
I remember one year at work the branch manager was soliciting "voluntary" pledges for payroll deductions for United Way. He was distributing a sheet around the office showing who was participating. It had a list of everyone's name on it, and it was obvious who was and was not participating. In the meeting he made it very clear that the other branches had 100% participation. All it takes is one manager, or owner to make many people miserable.
I was one of the few to stand up to managers and bosses. I don't hold jobs very long because of that. And never a mouse maze with cubicles.
*Snickers and murmurs of agreement from Hourly full employee staff.
When I discovered being a temp, it made it even more free.
Example.
Boss: WTF did you fail to help this customer with the equiptment?!
Me: The failure of your equiptment is not my problem, I am just a temp. Therefore it is you who have failed to ensure this equiptment is ready for the task at hand.
Boss: Turning Red into Purple... "OUT! No one talks to me like that! OUT!"
Customer: That temp is very good, your company is very bad. I take my business elsewhere.
The wizard of WHACK!
You mean the rest of you selfish bastards don't want to give more? Have you no pride? Give till it hurts - like on a scale of 1-10, whats your number?
(forgot to add:<sarc>)