Guest Post: In A Currency Tug Of War The US Dollar Loses

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Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:08 | 1374026 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

 

THIS IS A TRUE FREE MARKET ECONOMY!!!

 

you just have to know the right people to get involved.

 

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:10 | 1374036 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Who sets interest rates in your "TRUE FREE MARKET ECONOMY"?

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:18 | 1374043 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

The GDP generators of course.

 

Example:

Your pic: 0% interest rate, and a free QE1 if you send the rest of the pics.

 

BUT!!! If they drop below the belly button, the rates go up to 20%!

BUT!!! You can have a boobjob done at Dr. Goldman S. and rates go down again.

 

get it?

Believe me, this isn't a -18 year old access thing.

 

 

 

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:39 | 1374121 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Congressman Weiner - is that you???

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:06 | 1374241 Hurdy Gurdy Man
Hurdy Gurdy Man's picture

like

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:28 | 1374330 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

The PURPOSE of these trillions in bonds is not the government spending.  It's not to 'produce jobs', not to 'stimulate the economy', not to 'invest in America'.  It's not to produce a 'safe haven' for people fleeing out of other fiat currencies.

The PURPOSE of those bonds is to put us in bondage, forever.  The only thing that gives a bond its 'value' is the government gun pointing at your head.  It's 'secure' because the buyer has absolute faith in the ability of your government to extract the wealth to pay it -- from you.

I got news to any holders of U.S. treasury debt:

It's not my debt, and I'm not paying it. 

The 'debt' was incurred without my consent and in opposition to my interests, over my objections.

It cannot be paid back, mathematically.  And I will not produce at the point of a gun.  I am in hunker-down mode.  No more employees.  No more risking everything on projects that add productivity.  Any FRN's I get above cost of living expenses are kept away from banks and traded for metal at the earliest opportunity.  You might be able to inflate away my earning power, but you will not inflate away my savings.  And as you inflate away my earning power, you inflate away your own ability to pay off those bonds.

Anyone who holds those bonds deserves to lose every dime, they are the symbol and instrument of your attempt to enslave me.  You will NEVER get them all paid off.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 13:44 | 1375138 Rational Psycho
Rational Psycho's picture

+1

reminds me of Stefan's "The Money sold abroad is you!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cd-SLRyuRq0

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:08 | 1374033 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

The fake millionarie not paying his mortgage.  Well guess what he's doing better than the chumps still paying. And nobody can touch him cause the rule of law is breaking down. Plus he thinks all the extra money hes spending in the economy is the only thing keeping the recovery together.

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:26 | 1374088 the not so migh...
the not so mighty maximiza's picture

I don't know about this, The Chinese will take the U.S. over do to  contract violations.  Creditor/ debtor agreements will focus our new overlords to focus on the deadbeats.  The ones already paying on time have givin "protection money" to the Chinese.  Their are no armies involved in this outcome.  Debtor prisons will be back in vogue. 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:31 | 1374104 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

And they will be filled with the youth with student loan debt,  not the senile boomers who feel entitled to their McMansions that they took out home equity loans on and are getting a kushy fixed income check.  

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:33 | 1374112 the not so migh...
the not so mighty maximiza's picture

I have seen many boomers in debt up to eyeballs.  It will not just be the youth.  Youth provides better slave labor though to pay back debts.  Boomers will die after so much real labor work.  

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:41 | 1374137 LawsofPhysics
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Ditto, very few are prepared for retirement and, depending on the profession, most of them are holding on to their jobs and planing never to retire.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:21 | 1374281 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

They may pick and scratch a few properties here and there, but the Chinese have two primary ways in which to accomplish the feat which you describe above: (a) conquer us militarily; or (b) send enough of them over here to breed us out or push us out of the land.

In the end, the reason why we're so anxious to give them I.O.U.s is because, regardless of the pledged security (none?), there will be no tit for tat exchange of value.  They can try and infest our country, but they will get pushed out by the yokels...  how well do you think a chinese colony would go over in the mississippi delta?  Idaho?  Sorry, but the yokels wouldn't have it...  and the yokels get the last say.

In the end, we're going to tell them to piss off and if they want to do anything about it, then come get some.  (along with every other sovereign).

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:41 | 1374371 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Agree, goes double for baby boomer yokels with vast arsenals or vietnam/Iraq/afghanistan experience.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:46 | 1374684 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

"(b) send enough of them over here to breed us out or push us out of the land."

They best get on it.  They've got a lot of competition to our south where they're popping out Anchor Babies like rabbits.  Reconquista, chingadera!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:46 | 1374689 MrButtoMcFarty
MrButtoMcFarty's picture

I agree also....but I think it will only be after Bernanke has completed his mission to crush the serfs with inflation. Hopefully when that day comes and the yokels realize that the Banksters destroyed our economy then Banksters will become the child molesters of the new society.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 12:31 | 1374851 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

The whites become the new native tribes, checker boarded up in 'sovereign' enclaves, flanked by Indians, and both drinking firewater while lamenting about their sinovial eyed masters!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 23:02 | 1376572 lostintheflood
lostintheflood's picture

They can try and infest our country, but they will get pushed out by the yokels...  how well do you think a chinese colony would go over in the mississippi delta?  Idaho?

maybe...

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/12/31/1472023/chinese-company-eyes-bo...

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:28 | 1374082 Hedgetard55
Hedgetard55's picture

"Imagine that you are a loan-shark (for some this might be fun). Now, imagine that you have lent considerable sums of cash to a chronic gambler who claims to be a millionaire. You figure, hey, he’s rich, he’ll be good for it. Suddenly, you discover he’s NOT rich. He’s in debt up to his eyeballs. His luxurious home, expensive cars, extravagant yacht; its all an illusion, a fantasy built upon borrowed money and borrowed time. His IOU’s aren’t worth the paper they are printed on. "

 

     That's the world's dumbest, and brokest, loan shark, if he can't ask why the "rich millionaire" needs to borrow money, and especially from a loan shark with a huge vig.

    

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:03 | 1374229 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

That's the world's dumbest, and brokest, loan shark, if he can't ask why the "rich millionaire" needs to borrow money, and especially from a loan shark with a huge vig

 

Your post would have been enough to garner you a movie deal in 2007. Tought luck.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:29 | 1374086 Tonesvette
Tonesvette's picture

Three scenarios ...

Outright collapse of the dollar and we go back to work exporting

China repatriates their dollars by buying America

US embroils the world in total war

I'm guessing War ...

 

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:36 | 1374110 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

With Islam, cause we all know those bastards flew planes into our World Trade Centers messing up our entire world economy.  The U.S. is the only one that can save us from the Islamic menance.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:09 | 1374237 falak pema
falak pema's picture

I can only explain your hallucinating phobia in very simple terms of personal body mechanics specific to your type of mind set :

Your ass hole hates to rise above your head when you pray. And your eyes hate to look towards a place called Kaba when you do same.

Apart from that I can't think of any rational reason you should confuse Islam with those very arab terrorists, disguised as true muslims, but in fact rebels to perceived betrayal of Wahhabism by a clan that is totally incestuous with the Bush lobby, and that came and said hello like rogue surrogates to their insolent, arrogant, hegemonic masters; anything a true westerner having read of Spartacus and Rome would understand right down to his short hairs, especially if fed on ..."In the course of human events...etc.". Be a true american and you'll forget your medieval phobias. Take a course in yoga and you'll cure your body mechanics of ass-hole "dystopia" feeling.

Disclaimer : I have no interest in Islam or in yoga personally except from far.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:29 | 1374335 ceilidh_trail
ceilidh_trail's picture

flake pema why are you so anti-american? It shows in all your drivel...

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:50 | 1374408 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Hey, I am not anti-american. I can respect your opinion, "drivel" is fine by me. I don't buy Ethnic slurs or ideological mis conception, IMHO.

Why is being anti-american-administration-hegemonic-play being anti-american?

Is anti-papal play opinion during medieval times of Inquisition being anti-christian?

Facile to hide behind 'drivel' and 'anti-american' label. Just remember that the US administration since 1949 is the biggest betrayer of US founding father values...since the CIA was born and since Mccarthyism became synonymous for being pro-american.

I can't say it more simply than that. Either about the mind set or about what US foreign policy did abroad on its mayhem trail. They ran the world. Which makes it all the more disgraceful.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:55 | 1374461 Orly
Orly's picture

Well-defended, falak.

It is how the trolls keep the truth from everyone nowadays.  So simple.

Oh, you're trashing the Bushes: you're un-American.

Oh, you're trashing Obama: you're un-American.

Amazing how they can use the very trappings of "patriotism" to keep the people from the true mission of the Founders, especially Thomas Jefferson, who said, paraphrasing, "Oh, so you want to keep your freedoms?  Well, let me tell you something: once in a while you're going to have to ask tough questions of your 'leaders' and sometimes those people are going to end up strung from a tree."

Thomas Jefferson was the most un-American man who ever lived.

Don't ask, falak.  Go back to your X-Box and stop being a hater, okay?

/:

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:08 | 1374502 falak pema
falak pema's picture

I love Apricots, lol, does that make me true american?

Orly, I just ate Apricots from my garden. Buckets of them as summer is early. We are also going to make apricot jam with it. I hope your chicken breast BBQ went well.

Trooooolllling my way to the kitchen....

 

 

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:23 | 1374569 Orly
Orly's picture

It was very nice, thanks.  Today is chicken pot pies with the leftovers.  :D

Disheartening as it can be for those of us who have espoused lunatic conpiracy theories all these years, I do feel that the tide is turning and fairly rapidly at that.

More and more people are beginning to question many, many things about what we have been told all this time.  My prediction is that the mainstream media is about to pick up the ball and run with it in a big way.  The shame they will feel for not having investigated this stuff thoroughly before, along with the guilt they feel for having been bought and sold by the CIA for the price of a salisbury steak is going to break them finally.

The most motivating factors in the end of this world seem to be guilt and shame and the people who should have done something back then will do it now.  It is all going to come out in the wash and our suspicions will be vindicated one and for all.

I am surely looking forward to that day, I tell you.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:46 | 1374688 falak pema
falak pema's picture

We had a president in France who used to say : "donner du temps au temps".

Meaning "let time work..." It was a two edged philosophy. It allowed things to decant and for the truth to be seen in true perspective without passion. But it also allowed people to try and rewrite history to defend a political line that was felt worth defending by vested interests for future indoctrination of people's mindset.

I hear what you are saying and one day the history of "power plays" and real motivations will become clearer. But the fight to cover up the trail will never falter either as big interests are at stake to defend the purity of any Empire, which writes its own official history. And this remains vested as long as living people, witnesses, are still there to stoke the fires of that ongoing fight. It only ends, belongs truly to history, the days ALL living witnesses are dead and the spin loses its passion. Then only the cold eye of history rests. If it has all the facts...made available to it!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 12:36 | 1374832 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

let us, the tin-foil clad freedom fighters, congregate and spread our good tidings of liberation!

 

O. i'm with you 100%. Either they will start to report this stuff in the spirit of ZH and other truth tellers, or they will become so ridiculously absurd in their misinterpretations of events that they will become a laughingstock and lose all [or should i say any remaining] credibility. I doubt that MSM giants would allow themselves to dwindle into insolvency and irrelevance in order to maintain the public myth, but I suppose not even that would surprise me given the apparent misanthropic cynicism of the MSM.  

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 12:53 | 1374933 Orly
Orly's picture

"I doubt that MSM giants would allow themselves to dwindle into insolvency and irrelevance in order to maintain the public myth..."

I am banking on it.

Besides the guilt and shame that I mentioned above, the two other motivating factors will be pride and money.  They are not going to have their livelihoods and thus their legacies tarnished because of what they know are absolute lies.

It will happen much sooner than you think.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:40 | 1374136 BlackholeDivestment
BlackholeDivestment's picture

...almost.

...there is no U.S., there is the ''want'' defining the writing on The Great Wal Mart of China.

''by peace shall he destroy many''

...and then all hell breaks loose ...about 3.5 years later.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 11:48 | 1374697 MrButtoMcFarty
MrButtoMcFarty's picture

Which benefits TPTB the most?

 

That is what will happen.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:29 | 1374089 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

It's compound interest. Geometry will trump mathematics every time.
Even Einstein knew that much.
ORI
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2010/07/07/another-pearl/

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:43 | 1374148 falak pema
falak pema's picture

ORI, you mean compound geometric growth will trump simple arithmetic growth...they are both math! I think Einstein knew much more than just this progression disparity!

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:23 | 1374293 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Was wondering who would say that. ;-)

3,4,5 are just numbers till you put them on the side of a triangle shaped just so.

That is where the majick begins Falak. Mathamatics is number play.

Geometry is living numbers.

You cannot precisely square a circle in mathamatics, but you can surely do it on a drawing or a field.

Eh Falak?

I'll say it again, geometry trumps mathamatics everytime.

ORI

PS: Beyond pithy isms like this and the ability to cover a board with meaninglessly complex squiggles and constants, Einstein's papers were his wife's. Didn't you know that? Also a lot of work that he tok credit for had already been published.

He was a zionist shill too. Think about that for uno momento, SenoR Falak "Sidi" Pema!

The Great Dr. Al Mr. Atom bomb, oh noooooooos, don't build it, look the part with hairy ears Al was probably the greatest plagiaristic success in history.

ORI

 

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:38 | 1374360 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Ori, you should write a book on your conspiracy theories...and the insider knowledge on the inside of the inside of their private celebrity lives....))). 

My humble attempt at novelistic play is much simpler and tries to espouse known history and never find an inside play for historical play that I cannot substantiate. That leaves my fictional characters lots of latitude for insider plays in mythical ways to spice up the novelista in as many novel ways I can think of. 

I feel no shame for having fallen into your logic trap. Its a game like chess. So its Ok by me. I love your concept of living numbers. I won't quarrel with you on semantics...

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 13:31 | 1375089 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Maybe I should eh?

Maybe I am?

Hmmmmm.....

Your prose is rich, only too heavy on a rare occaision, always a pleasure.

ORI

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 12:34 | 1374887 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

It always seemed to me that geometry, like mathematics, are simple but useful reflections/projections of a soul temporarily bound by the perception of physicality.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 13:47 | 1375130 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Nice.

ORI

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:26 | 1374090 SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

Let me ask this: Credit Default Swaps on sovereign debt, which currency are they predominantly written in?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:16 | 1374257 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture


All currencies are fungible.

Let me ask this: who wears the pants in the creditor/debtor relationship?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 10:51 | 1374416 Boxed Merlot
Boxed Merlot's picture

Reminds me of the stories about the church in the middle ages and their relationship with kings.  The issue then was who has the authority to annoint who? 

 

As an interesting side note, even father Abraham who the three major religions of the world all recognize as foundational paid homage to the king of Salem.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 12:08 | 1374781 SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

My point is, after whatever happens in Greece happens, when it comes time to pay off the failed swaps, there will be a mad scramble for USDollars. IMHO.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 13:30 | 1375069 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

And it is a good one SF. There's nothing like 600 quadrillion in red ink lying around at the ready to create an artificial, if temporary, dearth of something; gotcha.

OTOH, my questions are:

Creditors ultimately choose any method of repayment, denominate the debt in what you will. If you were a creditor what level of ever-increasing counterparty risk would you want in your currency of repayment?

Who are the creditors of that 600 bazillion, and who are the debtors? IE Who will be taking the 6000 bazillion hit on their investments, and who will be defaulting?

It all hinges, IMHO, on how much of that 6000 gazilliion has already been offloaded onto the gov'ts of the world, how much more there is to go before 'mark to market' will destroy every economy that's been suckered into taking it, and how far the banks that created those weapons of mass financial destruction have managed to distance themselves from the consequences.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:33 | 1374095 Robslob
Robslob's picture

Simple enough:

1) Everyone must first go back to "loving" the dollar

2) Then it crashes

3) Guess who wins both ways?

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:30 | 1374099 sunnyside
sunnyside's picture

So at what point do enough people ask the simple question of "What is or could be wrong with a fractional reserve banking system based on a fiat currency with a private central bank?"

 

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:40 | 1374100 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Come on now.  You do more than simply break his legs.  You identify the useful organs and extract them in order to recover some of you losses.  The real problem comes when you find out that not only was he a gambler, but he was also an alcoholic and drug addict and all the organs are useless.  At that point you might be able to do something with the blood or bone marrow if he was a universal donor, otherwise, you are left with the only option of burning the body to warm your tea.  Although, that is one dumb loan shark if he is loaning a "millionaire" money, everyone needs to do their own homework, even loan sharks.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:34 | 1374117 gwar5
gwar5's picture

World Tax: Everyone in the world who holds FRNs is being taxed to subsidize the US debt every time the US Fed Reserve debases the USD. Can't blame people rioting over that.

Thu, 06/16/2011 - 09:36 | 1374125 falak pema
falak pema's picture

If TD's account of QE-2 transfer to EU PDs is true...its USD bolstering of Euro in a big way. EU now tied into temporary USD monetary dominance, even if its built on hot air,  to save euro banking system. The central bank led 'hot potato' war will be China vs USD. The upcoming role of IMF will be fundamental in this stand-off. 

While the US oligarch market led HF/PD plays will continue to spark commodity, interest, and currency raids all over the world for speculative ST gains, the basic central bank ground work to save monetary system from SYSTEMIC RISK, which rogue oligarchical speculative plays superbly ignore and feed-off, will be to build the new monetary global mark to allow the world economy to TRY avoiding total collapse, in the upcoming deflation cycle which is inevitable. Its a question of kicking the can by US and tightening of belts on EM sides, until the monetary divide leads one side to throw in the towel.

Big tug of war now in perspective, between central bank led initiative between EM and DC stand-offs, in this interim period where each side will try and gain some short term psychological advantage. Any EU-USD rivalry will not be central bank led but rogue HF/PD speculative plays. This will be tempered by QE-3 monetary pumping to weaken USD, fuel export commodity inflation and support DJIA-WS, all the while the USD falls.

We will see clearly the outlines of this new-new world monetary order after January 2013 and before end 2016. 

But the dates are obviously just star gazing as any new black swan appearance could upset the apple cart!

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