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Guest Post: The Governance Of A Free Society

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Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:31 | 1107284 Oligarchs Gone Wild
Oligarchs Gone Wild's picture

But anonymous is trying to rally the citizens too, this is too complicated for them.  This uses big words, and concepts that are quite difficult to grasp.  Can you put this in a 30 second youtube video with rage against the machine music bed?

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:55 | 1107346 Oligarchs Gone Wild
Oligarchs Gone Wild's picture

Anonymous junker, I support your effort and your concepts to entice change, but you get an F for what you pulled in the US.  At least give it the same creative effort, planning and strategic timing as you did when you went after Scientology.   That was well done, provoking and moved people to action and rethinking their positions.  I appreciate the need to speak to a diverse and common denominator audience, but you cannot expect to target 14 year olds and get traction.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:00 | 1107741 Michael
Michael's picture

We need to enact a "Nanny State Control Freak Law Abatement Act of 2011".

We must means test and odds test every nanny state law based on a benchmark with say the number of teens(10,000) killed on our nations highways in car accidents each year, or something like that. 

If your odds of being killed by drinking something like "Four Locos", as an example, are less than being struck by lighting twice in the same year as it is or being killed by terrorists as it is with those odds, there should not be a law made against it or a new cabinet position like the DHS created to improve those odds. I like those odds.

Do you get what I'm saying? No need to punish an entire country for stupid shit that doesn't improve your odds of survival and it's too costly in terms of sacrificed money and personal liberty.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 02:43 | 1107791 Broken_Trades
Broken_Trades's picture

I couldn't read it all... Too many big words. 

This guy has some interesting ideas, although I think he's missing some massive realities n some of his thinking.



Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:35 | 1107950 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil. – Thomas Paine

From this remark the author deduces that Government in essence is "antisocial". I challenge this concept. The Welfare State was not anti-social, anti-economic maybe, to the extent where economic efficiency, exemplified by Entrepreneurship and Free Markets, is in the industrial world the dominant paradigm...the holy grail of "pursuit of happiness". This paradigm invented in Capitalist England (Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations, Ricardo's Comparative advantage theory), enhanced in an empty, resource rich continent by the USA, is now coming to an end under the double constraint of world raw materials resource limitations and the realisation that markets are not "free" but "manipulated", oligarchic, even monopolistic, (as Marx predicted). When the Scions of this Capitalism, WS and its capital class EN MASSE, break with the trust of the people and overtly JUNK the model their forefathers created, we know that the USA has crossed a Rubicon. This is irreversible now. Like for ancient Rome. The model is dead as no plutocrat will EVER let you break his stranglehold on society. Indeed, he is now the ROLE model for the ages to come, as in Rome. The current world has therefore opened TWO PANDORA's boxes concomitantly in it's mad quest for finding 'chimeral' outlets to defeating the thesis of resource limitation : 1) Fukushima, which proves that MAN does not CONTROL the ATOM; it is the ATOM that now controls MAN. 2° WS : The Market is not the image of man's Esperance but of his addiction to greed and self destruction. Power corrupts so absolutely, when the markets represent Oligarchy, Tarquin's hold on Rome.

This is a terrible, FACTUAL double indictment of this current model playing itself out in front of our very eyes.

One that will lead its promoter to hurtle down the path to irremediable decadence. 

The World community needs to URGENTLY move out of this double calamitous situation, this double edged sword of Damocles over our collective heads. It may already be too late for our generation and the next. But we cannot give up hope. We must first learn to recognize the facts, NEVER junk them and then find a solution. In energy terms it has to be solar and renewable. Lets stop playing at devil's disciples and learn to be humble. In geo political terms it means going back to more stable sustainable geo political and financial-economic models. We have the knowledge to formulate them but do we have the will...?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:53 | 1108206 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture

wow.... how depressing to think it may be too late for our generation and the next...


In geo political terms it means going back to more stable sustainable geo political and financial-economic models. We have the knowledge to formulate them but do we have the will...?



I don't think this will ever happen in a peaceful manner but only through violent revolution...unfortunately.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:03 | 1108231 falak pema
falak pema's picture

I am extrapolating a "black swan" scenario from current news about Fukushima and what the dominant player does today in USA; what that implies for this and future generations in  the geo-political sense.

I sincerely hope my extrapolations are wrong! But still food for thought.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:14 | 1108268 pazmaker
pazmaker's picture

Yes  indeed food for thought.  I enjoy reading your post not always agreeing but always learning!  thanks

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:31 | 1107285 Nobody special
Nobody special's picture

This might be possible, in a free society that recognizes liberty and the rights of citizens.  Freedom in the US has been collapsing since the late 1800s.  I suspect a few genuine attempts at leveraging one's freedom would make its absence quite apparent.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:54 | 1107343 bonderøven-farm ass
bonderøven-farm ass's picture

"We are strictly confined to our men to whom we give liberty..."  ~H. D. Thoreau

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:36 | 1107608 TemporalFlashback
TemporalFlashback's picture

Inadvertent junk... Apologies.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 00:07 | 1107556 AnonymousAnarchist
AnonymousAnarchist's picture

It is possible and, in large part, already exists. All of society is inherently anarchistic (it's unavoidable). As Hasnas said in "The Obviousness of Anarchy" (+Lots to Free Radical for linking it), it's all around you. It always has been.

The state is just a social fiction, it's not really "in charge". The people who make up "the state" are subject to the same anarchistic characteristics that every other member of society is. Even with all their guns, the state controls very little. Sure, the state may kill and steal with impunity but that is not the same thing as control. In fact, the state controls so little that once enough people stop believing the myth that the state is legitimate, it will just fade away.

As Anna Morgenstern said...

Anarchism, truly, is simply the understanding that the state is merely a social fiction and has no legitimacy. When you live that truth, you will not follow the law simply because it is the law. You will let your conscience be your guide. At that point you are no longer being ruled, though you might have crimes committed against you by the "government" and its lackeys. When the Mafia forces someone to pay protection money, that guy isn't being ruled, he's being robbed.

Start here: Introduction to a Stateless Society

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 04:48 | 1107894 Clampit
Clampit's picture

Even the most die hard anarchists (deciding whether or not to capitalize that word just makes my head hurt) seem to agree society needs some means of establishing law and inflicting justice for the violation of others rights. Arming everyone and dismissing the cavalry, is a very, very hard sell [perhaps unfortunately]. In a stateless society how can society violate the rights of those who would do the same? Lew describes DRO's, which near as I can figure are just mini-states without immunity, and certainly the world would be a much better place if states were simply scaled back so as not to pool enough resources for real harm. But do this function autonomously without a king (elected, anointed, or appointed CEO of a DRO) ... then you have a beast worthy of the anarchy title. Something out of everyone's control individually.

My feeble brain can't work out all the intricacies of how this craft would fly, but I've used a hand helicopter and looked at steam powered spinning gizmos - it ain't rocket science to guess what will transpire. And what I see of younger generations so freely embracing Orwellian networking online, and how effective civilization has been at reducing nearly every injustice to a dollar amount (FWIW, the rich don't do the time) all while the currency stands as possibly the most convoluted clusterfuck creation I've yet to stumble upon ...

Think ~2050 Facebible coins wiki-currency with a personal exchange rate determined by your propensity to violate rights. That's as close as I can convey my hand waiving guess as to how it will transpire, but one day our Taylor series of tubes will be complete. Internet will topple government. And as states have correctly surmised, there will be no stopping it.


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:53 | 1108053 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Freedom in the US has been collapsing since the late 1800s.


Yep. In 1898, the last bit of Indian land was transfered to US citizens. Hence a collapse in freedom as Indians were the source, the generous volunteering patron of the US quest for freedom, justice and liberty.


I like your type. They remind any of the intellectuals like the author of the article the reality and debunk the efforts of propaganda in a trice.

See, the man puts a whole page to propagate and you, with one single sentence and the behaviour going with it, you debunk it.

Thanks for being a US citizen.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:37 | 1107299 decklap
decklap's picture


Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:44 | 1107324 jimijon
jimijon's picture

hey I resemble that remark

highly recommend a National Rainbow Gathering.. it will be held in the state of Washington this year.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:37 | 1107303 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

the Bill of Rights in our Constitution was not demanded.  It was asked "as a matter of honor"--and James Madison put it there.  Perhaps they were just "peculiar people" with their "peculiar institution"--but how does a slave holder like Thomas Jefferson create one the greatest testaments for the need of freedom in human history?  I have no professional expertise in this matter but i would say "because he knew something about freedom as a slave owner."  In other words "the yearning."  I still read that Bill of Rights and i really have a hard time imagining anything better.  this is in no way saying that this "bill" has been anything other than eviscerated over the past decade or so.  kind of sad when you "look to Egypt" for inspriration on how to actually "effect" a legal right.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 07:57 | 1108066 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Equality is concrete, straightforward. that is why US citizens are ill at ease with it.

Indeed, Jefferson knew freedom not by himself but through proxies he owned, the yearning of it.

Freedom is vague and is never better illustrated than when people are given to see examples of slavery.

That is why slavery was so important in the US. Very hard for a bushwacker to figure out what freedom is, how the King was oppressive. But, the illustration of slaves and what deprivation of freedom should mean...

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:39 | 1107308 Dooud
Dooud's picture

Just like New Hong Kong in Snow Crash, that book gets more relevant everyday!

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:38 | 1107311 Raymond K Hassel
Raymond K Hassel's picture

We own it, or we don't, our choice. Our choice.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:39 | 1107314 jimijon
jimijon's picture

I have been taking the tact that the Internet obsoletes many industries, why not governance. My meme of Socialocracy moves regulatory bodies back to the people via a Yelp type system. In other words, enforce the publishing of data and let the savants comb through it and present their case to their peers and to the judicial system.

I have about three or four writing on this topic at my blog


I believe that this will put a stake through the heart of the regulatory capture and hypocrisy that we both feel, see and witness one way or another, especially when it concerns big business and finance.


Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:50 | 1107336 Oligarchs Gone Wild
Oligarchs Gone Wild's picture

You're on to something there, I would certainly add big education to that too.  Internet changes the game.  Decades ago, you needed the resources which you received through a great mentor (hopefully) at a university in order to work your lifelong career to provide for your family.   Technology is now obsoleted in less time than it takes to obtain a degree.  The model is broken.  A college should be reworked to leverage the power of the Internet, and really so should all schooling supporting it. 


"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction."


Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:43 | 1107320 jimijon
jimijon's picture

I was over at Rense today, I know reptilian shape shifting, et al, but this was very interesting and something I never knew that surely gives a bit more credence to the "birthers."

This little research was one of those things that made me go hmmmm, on this matter.


cheers and goodnight from ChiTown

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:45 | 1107325 prophet
prophet's picture

In addition to its self preservation characteristics, government provides those who have or seek priledge, power and wealth (ruling class/elites, TPTB) a mechanism to assert their control over the broader population in what amounts to a protection scheme.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:54 | 1107339 pods
pods's picture

Absolutely correct.  And that is why the sovereign individual can never exist within a system of government.  Because sooner or later, the mob will become powerful enough to usurp the rights of the individuals.  The mob could be the government, or from a privileged class created by the government (corporations), but they will always win.  


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:03 | 1108078 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

You have a very loose definition of government.

The US government has always been as big as it could be.

Yet, as it started from scratch, some actions were left to the general populace, like patrolling the plantations to keep slaves in check and settling without permission on Indian lands.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 10:10 | 1108430 pods
pods's picture

Well my definition can (and I think should) be looked at as a loose one.  A government is simply a group of people who exercise power.

In modern amerika I would say that corporations act as governments.  In fact, governments are corporations.

What I will not do is go back throughout history and look for this or that fault and only be satisfied when all previous wrongs are righted.  Like slavery, indian genocide, etc.  Those are valid points, but are we going to go back thousands of years and start there?  Because if we are to go back 100, or 200, we should go back further.  And where is the correct stopping point?



Mon, 03/28/2011 - 12:39 | 1109089 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

No. The stop back in time is clear for anyone wishing to assess a system by its own merits. So the stop is put back to 1776, the day one government rises to promote freedom, truth and justice, when those values became the goals.

Why one should expect freedom from systems that proclaimed outrightly slavery? I agree it might be tricky at this point as some of these systems performed better in the freedom, individualistic, justice departments than the US, but it only exhibits what the US is. 

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:45 | 1107327 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

We need a reasonably educated public that is able to recognize when they are being screwed and by whom, and to be able to act upon it by articulating their grievances in the public sphere, along with their peers. We can't simply have people vote and then walk away from politics for a few years. Obviously politicians, left to their own devices, are liable to get up to all kinds of shenanigans. People attracted to offices of power are usually mediocre, narcissistic, or at worst, sociopathic. Whether you are liberal or conservative, none of the current parties can be trusted to uphold your particular viewpoint. 

An aware public is what keeps them honest. The question is how to get back there. The national hologram (apologies to Joe Bageant), is what keeps people rooted in the belief that they are doing fine when they aren't. Only a major shakeup is going to change things now. The educational system has failed more than a few generations of youth.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:01 | 1108071 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

We need a reasonably educated public that is able to recognize when they are being screwed and by whom, and to be able to act upon it by articulating their grievances in the public sphere, along with their peers.


Just like the Founding fathers who were slave owners and ignore the Indians' right to property.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 10:18 | 1108454 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

I think the desire to "educate" the populace is exactly the basic underpinning and contemptuous view held by the purveyors of the nanny state.  In the end, even the most well educated people can still be completely oblivious to the destructive and immoral actions of their government.  This need for education is not really something that can be taught per se, but something that must be evolved...  as so long as there are humans, there will be humans taking advantage of others, including demanding power and control.

I think mostly what you're advocating is diligence and a real desire to learn, know, and participate.  Well, that's not how humans operate...  we are naturally prone to boom/bust cycles.  We lay everything on the line, set up our utopia, and then take a nap...  forgetting in our slumber that the only way the system continues to function is through our diligence and willingness to continue participating...

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 22:45 | 1107328 NonAggressionPr...
NonAggressionPrinciple's picture

Isn't is much simpler than this?


If more people would just acknowledge that no one, including governments, has the ability to initiate violence (kidnap or steal: ie take from anyone without consent or threaten to do so) then all of the above is making things more complicated than they have to be.

Sun, 03/27/2011 - 23:19 | 1107417 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Any system that requires everyone to subscribe to a given philosophy is destined to fail.  One can, however, design non-aggressive social systems that cause all involved parties to recognize natural law by default.  

Characteristics of such a society are the separation of church, law, and militia (where what we now consider to be the "state" is the combination of "law" and "militia"), as well as the existence of social insurance providers of some sort, whether they are family based, or provided by a company.  See my post below for more detail.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:14 | 1107658 Mark McGoldrick
Mark McGoldrick's picture

Any system that requires everyone to subscribe to a given philosophy is destined to fail.  One can, however, design non-aggressive social systems that cause all involved parties to recognize natural law by default. 


WTF are you talking about? 

I've just read through all your posts in this thread and I'm utterly astonished that someone could actually believe that your version of society would be a workable and better alternative to what we have today.

Anyone who reads through this thread, just substitute "gang" every time you see "clan" if you want a better understanding of mosely's bizarre, "natural law" universe.  It is difficult to imagine a worse version of society than one ruled by an infinite number of "gangs."


You have truly outdone yourself, mosely.  This is clearly your most ridiculous series of posts, to date. 


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:20 | 1107686 tmosley
tmosley's picture

DO you notice how you never actually REFUTE anything, but rather just laugh off realities you don't want to think about?

No, a "gang" is not a clan.  A gang is a militia.  It is a group of armed people.  They don't make the law, they protect an area from outside aggression.  They can't commit aggression against those inside their territory simply because EVERYONE IS ARMED, and everyone is a member of the militia.

Your inability to see things for what they are is...normal.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:30 | 1107694 Mark McGoldrick
Mark McGoldrick's picture

You call it a "clan" because it sounds better than "gang." It's the same fucking thing, just spelled differently.  In reality, you're promoting a society that would lead to constant gang warfare.  

Your society is just a bunch of self-ruling "gangs," where the individual - should he choose to leave the "gang" - is protected by some sort of car insurance-like company. 

Holy Fuck!  *LOL*

WTF are you talking about, mosely?  FOR THE LOVE OF CHRIST!

This is truly, truly the most absurd series of comments that you've ever posted.  You are in outer-fucking-space.  

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 01:36 | 1107711 tmosley
tmosley's picture

In any event, you are ignoring the point of my post.  The use of clans as social insurance agents has held back this system from spreading beyond the few areas that use it today.  This function should be carried out by insurance companies.

And again, you have made no attempt to understand, and instead simply deride an idea you do not understand, and have no interest in understanding.

Don't you have some books to burn?

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 03:24 | 1107831 CH1
CH1's picture

Don't waste your energy, tm; that's what these guys want.

God only knows whose payroll they may be on.


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 11:33 | 1108787 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Let me guess, you deny this basic reality, but will be cheering for your favorite Politician, or your favorite sport's team later on.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:30 | 1108103 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

They can't commit aggression against those inside their territory simply because EVERYONE IS ARMED, and everyone is a member of the militia.


Made me laugh. Where does this come from? From the very same location that the problem was the Indians not respecting property rights and the big bully US not respecting them?


Quite a number of gangs, be them street gangs or gangs like frats, have violent initiation rites. The violence does not stop there because in gang governance type, a release outlet is required. Gangs work on the principle that hitting the same within the gang is a factor of stability.

Anyone with memories of a US military boot camp knows what it is all about. Usually, there is a guy who is going to serve as the release outlet. The sergeant instructor barks orders, pressures and to avoid rebellion, others can release their hatred and their resentment on a specially chosen guy, ordering him to tasks, beating him, humiliating him. Anyone who does not side with this kind of gang organization is in for a wild run.

The second big fallacy is that weapons are for protection. Nope, weapons' primary design purpose is to kill people or intimidate people in order to build up coercion schemes.

The evidence of it is that groups of people  that reject use of weapons are a target for gangs. If indeed, gangs were armed for protection only, they would not go on aggression against unarmed people.

As US citizens can not cope with what they are, they are very prone to developp kinds of reverse thesis.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:33 | 1108323 tmosley
tmosley's picture

So you're saying that Indians never stole anything, and were just nice, happy, magical people who never killed each other or white settlers?  Give me a break.  If your family got scalped by Mohawks, I can guarantee you you would be first in line for revenge.  The only way to avoid such violence is to have law respected, not just within a group, but among all groups.

But you know, you're right.  It'll never work.  Someone had better call all the religions in the world and tell them that they can't coexist peacefully either, and that each state should have only one religion.  Uh-oh, you mean there is exceptionally little religious violence in America, where there are a truly maximum number of religions co-existing?  And any place that has state sponsored religion has much more violence (Ireland, Israel).

Come on.  You aren't paying attention.  The social insurance providers are SEPARATE from the militia, just as church and state are separate now.  

And your "purpose of weapons" diatribe is laughable.  It's like saying that a hammer is for removing nails rather than driving them in.  Yes, most hammers have both functions, but 95% of the use is for driving them in.  Similarly, 99+% of weapons are never used for aggression, but are kept as a deterrent.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 12:55 | 1109157 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Never said that the Indians never stole something. I underlined the very fact that their relation to private property is irrelevant in the US citizens behaviour.

The US citizens were the ones tieing private property to the human condition. They were the ones who hold the belief and they were the ones who showed their support to that belief.

Their support to that belief was so deep actually that to put in line their actions and their beliefs, they started the trend of dehumanization, that, yep, human rights existed but they only applied to humans, not to non humans. The non humanity philosophy and all its consequences.

Come on, in the US, there are truly maximum number of religions co-existing? Since when? The US started much more diverse in terms of religions. Since the inception of the US, it has been forced march to monolithic religion.

US religious make up: in the US, more than 80pc Christians, 10 pc unafilliated, rest judaism, islam and the rest.That is indeed a maximum number of religions co existing.

Ah, US citizens, unable to picture themselves as they are... The US is highly monolithic when it comes to religion.

Hammers are for driving nails in. Not to remove them.

Tools to remove nails: a nail puller or a claw.

Deterrent of what? If indeed weapons'primary use was defense, no use for weapons.

It is cheaper not to invest into weapons. People buying guns and using them for defense waste money when they do not use them for their primary purpose. It is the main divider between gun owners: there are those who put their weapons to use and get the benefits going with and the others, those who sit on their weapons, for defense.


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 05:33 | 1107895 Voluntary Exchange
Voluntary Exchange's picture



As usual, your comments best apply to yourself.  This need not be a problem as long as you do not act based on your criminal tendencies or support the same in others by paying "taxes". Your expectations are a reflection of yourself.  Free market defense is much more competent at handling aggression than a monopoly that insists by force that you pay for it,  thus being a contradiction. And this same comment equally applies to "justice" services. The free market is always better than a criminal monopoly of force ever could or ever will be. When you can understand that, you will be starting to develop antibodies to your mind "virus".

"A Virus of the Mind" - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suNzxthcTJs

You appear to be so limited by your statist thinking that you seem to not understand that "order" and "security" do exist outside a "state", and in fact, will exists far more so when free people who respect natural rights are not being continually "raped" or murdered by the continuous predation of the biggest gun gang in town.


Good luck as our future arrives.


Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:19 | 1108106 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Free market defense is much more competent at handling aggression than a monopoly that insists by force that you pay for it,  thus being a contradiction. And this same comment equally applies to "justice" services. The free market is always better than a criminal monopoly of force ever could or ever will be. When you can understand that, you will be starting to develop antibodies to your mind "virus".


Please quote examples so people can draw comparisons by themselves.

What are the examples of free market defenses, justice system.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:18 | 1108108 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Inflicting violence, extortion, is the very basis of tribal law, then feudal law. We are going back there when we deny the emergence of the nation state. There is no universal anarchistic Utopia..never will be... History has proven that. The only way forward compatible with man's history is more rule of LAW and more effective enforcement of governance against the Oligarchy now firmly entrenched in the global NWO.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 08:37 | 1108151 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Why stop at feudal law? The US type of law (aka modern world) is also based on coercion, save it is much more efficient at it and a much larger scale.


rule of LAW


The rule of law is scam. The exercize of authority does not generate revenues by itself and therefore authority holders side naturally with players generating the biggest revenues.

The rule of law is just a machine to favour the rich and cripple the poor. 



Mon, 03/28/2011 - 09:39 | 1108343 tmosley
tmosley's picture

You confuse law, which exists on its own, with legislation, which is what happens when you conflate judicial authority with the militia to create the state.  When they guys with guns get to pick the "neutral" arbiter, then the arbiters always find in favor of the state.  Under the system as proposed here, you get a panel of three (or more) judges, with one knowing and being associated with the defendant, one with the plaintiff, and the rest are agreed upon by both parties as neutral.  This system favors the rich in no way save that they are more able to pay fines.  Every other way, the imbalance is reduced greatly.

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 10:35 | 1108484 Mark McGoldrick
Mark McGoldrick's picture

When they guys with guns get to pick the "neutral" arbiter, then the arbiters always find in favor of the state....

That's fucking NUTS.

So defense lawyers never win?


Under the system as proposed here, you get a panel of three (or more) judges, with one knowing and being associated with the defendant, one with the plaintiff, and the rest are agreed upon by both parties as neutral.

Um....  that's exactly what we have now!  A lawyer who represents the defendant. A lawyer representing the plaintiff.  And an independent lawyer who mediates the whole thing (a judge) and/or a jury. 


Give it up Mosely!  You're NUTS!

Mon, 03/28/2011 - 13:05 | 1109220 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

The exercize of authority does not generate revenues by itself. It derives its revenues from its actors.

It is not about the state or anything. It is all about authority and the exercize of it.

Eg: in the US, the sports scene is totally rigged with competitors chosen on their financial merits first. So the side is hidden.

But lets take a look at football when small and poor teams are allowed to take on big and rich teams.

Referees do no generate revenues by their exercize, they derive their money from the money generated by football.

Now lets take a tournament: two small teams, and two big teams.

Potentially, the various matches are unequal, it is better in terms of money that the two big teams face each other in the final. This is when the big money will be. Lots of viewers. Lots of supporters. Lots of advertisements.

It is natural for the referees (authority) to favour the outcome that will allow them to gain the most money possible. So the ref whistles in favour of big teams.

The more money in football, the richer the authority is.

It has little to do with the organization. It has all to do with authority and the exercize of it not generating revenue by itself but deriving it from actors.

Your point, all organization, does not address the issue. Better to ask the libertarian maestros about their thoughts on that issue.

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