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Guest Post: Veterans Get Lip Service, Bankers Get Billions & We Get Foreclosures
Submitted by Dylan Ratigan
One thing about doing a two hour show
that heavily covers both the financial crisis and the wars in Iraq and
Afghanistan is that you notice on a daily basis the shocking
juxtaposition between the lucky Wall Streeters and the unlucky
soldiers.
We all know at this point that our banking system is being used as
an unregulated bonus-seeking mechanism for bankers, now underwritten by
taxpayers with $23.7 trillion worth of national wealth.
Bankers lent pretend money to home buyers to award themselves actual
money in bonuses -- making home prices balloon and, in the process,
bankrupting America's treasury, currency, the states, and many of its
citizens.
To simply let the housing market rapidly correct itself (or more
likely over-correct) would result in massive societal disruption,
possible violence and unnecessary suffering.
So while we slowly attempt to close the taxpayer-funded bank casinos
and try to restore the basic rules of investment and lending in our
economy, we have difficult decisions to make. Unfortunately, our only
choice for a less jarring social transition so far has been to
artificially adjust the real prices of our homes via government
guarantees to banks (for bad mortgages and losing gambling bets) -- or
relatively arbitrary handouts to home buyers.
What did these people do to deserve the handout?
How do you feel about a Wall Street Banker who has been renting an
apartment here in New York and this year combined the bonus money he
made on bundling new taxpayer-sponsored Fannie Mae CDS with a
first-time home buyers tax credit gift from the taxpayers to buy the
penthouse in his building?
Meanwhile, we have already been at war for 8 years with no end in
sight. World War II was 5 years. We are fighting these wars with the
fewest number of soldiers in modern U.S. History. To avoid incorporating a politically unpopular draft, we deploy the same soldiers five or six times with comparatively minuscule breaks in between.
However, the dire state of the economy has been a boon to military recruitment, but I am not sure if we will ever see the Wall Street bank scammers claim their rightful credit for that.
So instead of using these bad- (Wall Street) to- arbitrary (first
time home buyers) ways to pump money into rescuing our housing market,
let's give it to those who are truly deserving of handouts: our
servicemen and women.
I propose that we immediately enact the following:
- Give every single man and woman that is fighting for
us a housing credit of $50,000, with the caveat that the credit must be
used by someone within two years. - Make it so that the credits are completely fungible,
meaning that if the veteran doesn't wish to buy a house, he or she can
sell the credit to someone who does -- and keep the money. If the
reselling of gift cards on Ebay is any indication, I am sure there will
be a thriving market where soldiers could probably get pretty close to
90 cents on the dollar for their credit.
Considering the roughly 2 million veterans
who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan so far, this would give a much
needed $100 billion boost to the housing market. Just as a template for
comparison, Goldman Sachs (albeit it doing "God's work") and the other
complicit banks like JP Morgan and Morgan Stanley will pay $29.4 billion in personal bonuses this year.
In reporting on this financial crisis, I have been most surprised by
the blatant disregard that our politicians and even some journalists
have shown for the most fundamental American notion of fairness. I
don't think handing taxpayer trillions to some of the least worthy
individuals is something that our country will stand for, regardless of
what the current incumbents think.
If we must resort to handouts to save our country, let's at least put them in the hands of the most deserving.
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But Dylan, the bankers are our best and brightest, we must reward them or our system will fail.
Indeed, the "top talent" will quit! And then we'll have fewer millionaire bankers taking a cut of our every financial transation!
Personally, I don't want to contemplate such a world.
Seeing our investment bankers award themselves ever fatter bonuses is the pride of every True American!
This is what our men and women in uniform are fighting for!
lets return to the fundamental premise of the founders; that would bring more honor to those who have fallen than any ill conceived handout - and in the process bring the prices down to a level where a 50K subsidy was unnecessary
Amen, brother. Is Dylan the pathfinder in the left's attempt to hijack populism?
Exactly. Perhaps if house prices weren't pumped up by easy credit then people wouldn't have to devote such an enormous part of their income to housing, maybe 2 income households would be optional rather than compulsory and perhaps not such an enormous portion of the country's earning would be diverted into the pockets of bankers as interest on the enormous mortgages.
Its bizarre that if the price of food or heating oil goes up its recognized as a bad thing whereas if the cost of housijng rises its considered a good thing
this was the norm before greenspan when many of us your youngins
Even better, when oil prices rise beyond what "fundamentals" suggest it is always due to "evil speculators", but when stock prices rise to 3X what their fundamentals suggest, it is a sign of economic recovery.
When does the 11th version of the Newspeak Dictionary come out?
No kidding, more subsidies is a horrible idea. We need less subsidies.
An overinflated housing market (such as we STILL have today) is a tax on the middle class.
Unfortunately, that is just as the Fed intends.
Well considering all the Mega millionaires in Congress...its just chump change to them!
dylan/dobbs 2012
Before Dobbs runs for anything on the back of his populist "throw out the illegals" and "i am all about the little guy", he might want to check and makes sure that the Mexicans mucking out the stalls at the equestrian center where his daughter keeps her horses (that cheap non elitist sport that kids like Georgina Bloomberg participate in) all have their papers.
Ahhh the sweet aroma of hypocrisy.
You fail to recognize that without illegal immigrants doing the job, there'd be others in their place willing to work to do it instead.
Remember when 15 year olds worked at McDonalds instead of illegal immigrants?
Remember when people made 15-20 dollars an hour as hired hands to build houses?
Ahhh... the good old days.
As long as they are neither democrats or republicans, I'd vote for them
Like Michael Bloomberg?!
That's definitely exactly the opposite of what I meant. I guess in the current system saying that I'd vote for anyone that is neither democrat nor republican does not really get my point across since that leaves only the super-rich candidates that have their own agendas and fortunes to push. What I meant is really as long as they are not already bought and paid for (through lobbyists, their party, or their own companies/industries) then they would have 100% of my support.
I think that is really a little insulting to Dylan...
Agree, really shouldn't be put in the same bucket as Dobbs, although I can see the similarity from the "born-again reporter" standpoint
And Marla wonders why people succumb to violent proclivities.
We'll see what happens when Dylan starts suggesting we string up politicians on lamp posts.
I am Chumbawmba.
Well then Marla won't allow Dylan to guest post here, will she?
links to max keiser are off limits too since he called for the "elimination" of that "enemy combatant" located downtown.
cnbc and msnbc is the vinegar and oil on the same squid salad...served on government china...lol
cnbc and msnbc is the vinegar and oil on the same squid salad...served to you on government china BY A WAITER NAMED DYLAN.
When Delorean was shut down by creditors a liquidation company went in to buy the assets of DMC. One of the buyer agents of the liquidation company pissed DMC off so bad that a waiter was paid to poison the food of the buyer agent while they ate dinner at a restaurant not far from DMC's manufacturing facility.
Waiters suck but sometimes they are so useful.
I honestly miss Elliot Spitzer. I don't care how many whores he boned or how big his ego was. I do think he was one of the few to call out those fucking scumbags (Grasso was worth 200mm????). Anyone have a differing view let me know.
I agree and besides Grasso earned that money...It was the best regulation money could buy...they paid him well to look the other way and protect the Den of Thieves.
@rhino. indeed, we got bigger things to worry about than spitzer with his socks on. ny is a month away from bankruptcy. wall street and the fed are bankrupting our country. yes we could use spitzer.
PMI US Market Risk Index indicating continued price deterioration of the usual suspects: CA, FL AZ, NV
http://www.pmi-us.com/PDF/q3_09_pmi_eret.html
Unfortunately, i don't believe that military personal have K street lobbyists.
So the chances of the happening are about the same as Kudlow turning bearish.
For a review on TARP reciepants lobbying efforts and the rewards those efforts generated please see;
http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2009/02/tarp-recipients-paid-out-114-m.html
(mikey & layne, as far as i am concernced you both should be given a $1M tax credit)
Very good point Lizzy... he who has lobbyists always get the lions share of whatever is being doled out. The link was very interesting... they should have banned lobbying by any TARP recipient for 5 years following their 'loan' payback.
Why not just ban lobbying to begin with - will outright fix most of what's going wrong with our world. The way things stand right now, it makes a lot more sense to put up the funds received by each candidate on the ballot instead of their names as the funds matter way more in what they will do than who they are.
Agreed... but then lets break the funds down to those received purely from individuals... and those recieved through coporations... and print those numbers right next to their name on the ballot.
Lobbying is cool with me. With the proviso that any lobbyist can only represent themselves. One voice, one vote.
Just a thought, but I think lobbyists are mostly for non-elite that somehow make it into public office. And if you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth you'll see all these bright, young, vulnerable sex objects as party planners.
Maybe I'm thinking nonsense.
Dylan...didn't you get the e-mail? THe bankers are doing God's work. Who are we to question?
Fire. Aim. It's all in the execution! Deficit neutrality is needed now that all $20T has gone to WallStreet. We should storm the Hill this one last time, and with this one page email in hand, demand $100B of TARP leftovers for the little folk.
Perhaps DR you will be invited to WH for tea in December to discuss this idea along with a plan to tackle unemployment next. Fire. Aim. It's all in the execution.
Purple crayons - hand 'em out instead & save the free market.
Don't be silly, that is too sensible and doesn't go via banksters
FHA did that. The allowed all Veterans and Police to buy Homes that were on the forclosure list for 50% off the current price. I am not sure if the program is still in effect but for years if you were a Veteran or a Police Officer (that carried a gun) you were elible. They may have extended to Firefighters also but cannot remember.
Nice point as well Minnesotanice, lobbyists are the devil.
FHA did that for years. They gave Veterans and Police Officers that carried guns 50% off all FHA forclosures. I also think but am not sure that they also gave Firefighters 50% off also. I do not know if the program is still in effect.
Imagine the poop hitting the fan when thousands of veterans return from I and A, to find no work, no money, nothing for them here in the US. Violence would be a very real probability.
TPTB are getting a blessing (yet again) in the wars that are being fought.
There's more than terrorism on the backs of the military personnel.
To suggest that veterans will have a tendency to deal with realities on the ground here in America in a markedly different manner than the rest of the civilian population is more than a little misguided. The stresses military personnel have dealt with overseas are more demanding than most anything likely to be encountered once home.
They deserve appreciation, not suspicion.
Shame. There is a simple and obvious solution. We all stop voting for both Democratic or Republican parties. Despite our lifelong allegiance to some of ideas those parties represent , it should be obvious to everyone, they have betrayed us.
This might work if you:
1) Let Goldman underwrite the creation of these fungible housing credits and earn a 10% commission on mailing them to the Soldiers - and pay for the stamps;
2) Let Goldman create an SEC "regulated" market for Operation Housing Freedom Tax Credits (OHFTCs) which is the ONLY market where these can be traded, thus guaranteeing monopoly-spreads;
3) Grant Goldman perpetual and irrevocable rights in all the known universe and all regions outside the universe not yet discovered, envisioned, or imagined to create derivatives based on these credits of any imaginable configuration to cram down the throats of US trading partners and gullible investors.
4) Grant Goldman monopoly rights to trade OHFTC derivatives with special VAR waivers allowing up to 10,000 x leverage.
Let Goldman have its employees do an internship swap with the soldiers. Kind of a real life "Trading Places".
From the Baltimore Sun:
Sgt. Charles I. Cartwright of the U.S. Marine Corps, 26, was killed on his fourth tour (emphasis mine) of combat duty This American hero was awarded two Purple Hearts before he was killed serving our country.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/carroll/bal-md.soldier11nov11,0,4718978.story
Military Pay
This is an Airman's response to Cindy Williams' editorial piece in the Washington Times about MILITARY PAY, it should be printed in all newspapers across America.
Ms. Cindy Williams wrote a piece for the Washington Times, denouncing the pay raise(s) coming service members' way this year citing that she stated 13% wage increase was more than they deserve.
A young airman from Hill AFB responds to her article below. He ought to get a bonus for this.
"Ms Williams: I just had the pleasure of reading your column, "Our GIs earn enough" and I am a bit confused. Frankly, I'm wondering where this vaunted overpayment is going, because as far as I can tell, it disappears every month between DFAS (The Defense Finance and Accounting Service) and my bank account. Checking my latest earnings statement I see that I make $1,117.80 before taxes per month. After taxes, I take home $874.20. When I run that through the calculator, I come up with an annual salary of $13,413.60 before taxes, and $10,490.40, after.
I work in the Air Force Network Control Center where I am part of the team responsible for a 5,000 host computer network. I am involved with infrastructure segments, specifically with Cisco Systems equipment. A quick check under jobs for Network Technicians in the Washington, D.C. area reveals a position in my career field, requiring three years experience with my job. Amazingly, this job does NOT pay $13,413.60 a year. No, this job is being offered at $70,000 to $80,000 per annum........... I'm sure you can draw the obvious conclusions.
Given the tenor of your column, I would assume that you NEVER had the pleasure of serving your country in her armed forces. Before you take it upon yourself to once more castigate congressional and DOD leadership for attempting to get the families in the military's lowest pay brackets off of WIC and food stamps, I suggest that you join a group of deploying soldiers headed for AFGHANISTAN; I leave the choice of service branch up to you. Whatever choice you make, though, opt for the SIX month rotation: it will guarantee you the longest possible time away from your family and friends, thus giving you full "deployment experience."
As your group prepares to board the plane, make sure to note the spouses and children who are saying good-bye to their loved ones. Also take care to note that several families are still unsure of how they'll be able to make ends meet while the primary breadwinner is gone - obviously they've been squandering the "vast" piles of cash the government has been giving them.
Try to deploy over a major holiday; Christmas and Thanksgiving are perennial favorites. And when you're actually over there, sitting in a foxhole, shivering against the cold desert night; and the flight sergeant tells you that there aren't enough people on shift to relieve you for chow, remember this: trade whatever MRE (meal-ready- to-eat) you manage to get for the tuna noodle casserole or cheese tortellini, and add Tabasco to everything. This gives some flavor.
Talk to your loved ones as often as you are permitted; it won't nearly be long enough or often enough, but take what you can get and be thankful for it. You may have picked up on the fact that I disagree with most of the points you present in your opened piece.
But, tomorrow from KABUL, I will defend to the death your right to say it.
You see, I am an American fighting man, a guarantor of your First Amendment rights and every other right you cherish. On a daily basis, my brother and sister soldiers worldwide ensure that you and people like you can thumb your collective nose at us, all on a salary that is nothing short of pitiful and under conditions that would make most people cringe. We hemorrhage our best and brightest into the private sector because we can't offer the stability and pay of civilian companies.
And you, Ms. Williams, have the gall to say that we make more than we deserve? You can kiss my royal red a**!!!
A1C Michael Bragg Hill AFB AFNCC
IF YOU AGREE, PLEASE PASS THIS ALONG TO AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE AND SHOW YOUR SUPPORT OF THE AMERICAN FIGHTING MEN AND WOMEN. THANK YOU!
I noticed he fails to mention the five figure bonuses that he got for enlisting, the free housing and food that he gets while he serves, the free training he gets while he serves, and the free college education that he'll get after he graduates, complete with a monthly stipend as long as he stays in school.
The military gets HOOKED up. Not to mention that he'll be next in line for the 80,000 dollar a year IT job after he gets out of the service thanks to the free training that he received.
You are absolutely out of your fucking mind. A five figure enlistment bonus?! Yeah, maybe if he decides to be a nuke or somehow finishes a SpecOps challenge contract. The vast majority of people enlisting in the military don't receive any form of signing bonus or push-button rank.
Contrary to popular opinion, the housing and food are not always free...that's only when you're deployed, and most of us still ending up spending our own funds to buy stuff in-country. The subsidy for housing is less than generous in those limited situations when the command authorizes something off-post. First termers almost never get seperate housing, even in garrison: that's why we have barracks.
The new G.I. Bill is sweet, but all of us who enlisted prior to 9-11 got a gigantic shaft. I have yet to meet anyone who has been hooked up with a high five-figure salary after their EAOS, with the exception of academy graduates and some ROTC officers.
Don't take this as a bitch about the deal I got, I signed the contract with clear eyes. You just don't seem to have any conception of what the average military experience entails, and the fiction you've postulated is complete and utter bullshit.
"You see, I am an American fighting man, a guarantor of your First Amendment rights and every other right you cherish. On a daily basis, my brother and sister soldiers worldwide ensure that you and people like you can thumb your collective nose at us, all on a salary that is nothing short of pitiful and under conditions that would make most people cringe."
I'm so sick of hearing this load of jingoist crap.
Nothing that this maggot is doing is for the benefit of the vast majority of US citizens. He is nothing but a tool of an organized crime cartel. The fists of the globe's biggest bully.
The US government and its hired goons as protectors of our rights. What a laugh.
Military Pay
This is an Airman's response to Cindy Williams' editorial piece in the Washington Times about MILITARY PAY, it should be printed in all newspapers across America.
Ms. Cindy Williams wrote a piece for the Washington Times, denouncing the pay raise(s) coming service members' way this year citing that she stated 13% wage increase was more than they deserve.
A young airman from Hill AFB responds to her article below. He ought to get a bonus for this.
"Ms Williams: I just had the pleasure of reading your column, "Our GIs earn enough" and I am a bit confused. Frankly, I'm wondering where this vaunted overpayment is going, because as far as I can tell, it disappears every month between DFAS (The Defense Finance and Accounting Service) and my bank account. Checking my latest earnings statement I see that I make $1,117.80 before taxes per month. After taxes, I take home $874.20. When I run that through the calculator, I come up with an annual salary of $13,413.60 before taxes, and $10,490.40, after.
I work in the Air Force Network Control Center where I am part of the team responsible for a 5,000 host computer network. I am involved with infrastructure segments, specifically with Cisco Systems equipment. A quick check under jobs for Network Technicians in the Washington, D.C. area reveals a position in my career field, requiring three years experience with my job. Amazingly, this job does NOT pay $13,413.60 a year. No, this job is being offered at $70,000 to $80,000 per annum........... I'm sure you can draw the obvious conclusions.
Given the tenor of your column, I would assume that you NEVER had the pleasure of serving your country in her armed forces. Before you take it upon yourself to once more castigate congressional and DOD leadership for attempting to get the families in the military's lowest pay brackets off of WIC and food stamps, I suggest that you join a group of deploying soldiers headed for AFGHANISTAN; I leave the choice of service branch up to you. Whatever choice you make, though, opt for the SIX month rotation: it will guarantee you the longest possible time away from your family and friends, thus giving you full "deployment experience."
As your group prepares to board the plane, make sure to note the spouses and children who are saying good-bye to their loved ones. Also take care to note that several families are still unsure of how they'll be able to make ends meet while the primary breadwinner is gone - obviously they've been squandering the "vast" piles of cash the government has been giving them.
Try to deploy over a major holiday; Christmas and Thanksgiving are perennial favorites. And when you're actually over there, sitting in a foxhole, shivering against the cold desert night; and the flight sergeant tells you that there aren't enough people on shift to relieve you for chow, remember this: trade whatever MRE (meal-ready- to-eat) you manage to get for the tuna noodle casserole or cheese tortellini, and add Tabasco to everything. This gives some flavor.
Talk to your loved ones as often as you are permitted; it won't nearly be long enough or often enough, but take what you can get and be thankful for it. You may have picked up on the fact that I disagree with most of the points you present in your opened piece.
But, tomorrow from KABUL, I will defend to the death your right to say it.
You see, I am an American fighting man, a guarantor of your First Amendment rights and every other right you cherish. On a daily basis, my brother and sister soldiers worldwide ensure that you and people like you can thumb your collective nose at us, all on a salary that is nothing short of pitiful and under conditions that would make most people cringe. We hemorrhage our best and brightest into the private sector because we can't offer the stability and pay of civilian companies.
And you, Ms. Williams, have the gall to say that we make more than we deserve? You can kiss my royal red a**!!!
A1C Michael Bragg Hill AFB AFNCC
IF YOU AGREE, PLEASE PASS THIS ALONG TO AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE AND SHOW YOUR SUPPORT OF THE AMERICAN FIGHTING MEN AND WOMEN. THANK YOU!
No offense (obviously) but salary isn't the only form of compensation.
Benefits:
-Housing Allowance
-Food Allowance
-Federal Thrift Savings Plan (TSP)
-Retirement (20 yrs)
-Health Insurance (full family)
-Active Duty Education
-Montgomery GI Bill
-30 days Vacation
-upto $30k signing bonus
-Recreational Activities
Obviously, this all doesn't quite add up to $70k (the engineer has other benefits as well - probably not as comprehensive), but coming out of High School and being able to get this kind of 'job' (whenever, recession or no) is pretty impressive. Not to mention the kind of technology and equipment you get to work with (and experience). It's not just that black & white as 'take-home' pay.
Stat:
Lowest grade monthly salary: E-1 (0-2 yrs experience) -- $1399.50
Source:
http://www.airforce.com/opportunities/enlisted/
No offense? What is the applicable financial premium for enduring a fucking mortar attack while you are taking a shit in a port-a-john on a 120F day? Have you ever had to take a dump in one of those in 120F heat with a helmet and body armor on?
I'm not saying vets are entitled to some $50K credit or anything, but until you have been shot at, you really don't have anything meaningful to add regarding the existing pay schedule for servicemembers.
Froggy - with all due respect - been there, done that, dude - Operation Desert Storm - so I do feel that I'm somewhat entitled to speak to this issue, and I have to agree with the other guy's post. There's a lot more to a servicemember's salary than base pay. Another thing that no one should forget, Dylan included, is that you and I both volunteered for military service, and it's not like we didn't know what we could be facing. Personally, I enlisted during Operation Desert Shield knowing full well what I could be headed to the Gulf. The situation in the Middle East has gotten progressively worse since then, so I would have a hard time believing that a deployment to Kuwait, Iraq or Afghanistan came as much of a surpise to you either. Don't get me wrong - not bashing you, but you came on pretty strong there, and I'm just saying.....everything you mention definitely sucks...but it comes with the job, and we all knew it.
Like you, I also don't think it entitles me or other vets to a $50k credit. I think Dylan's way off base with that part of his post, but agree, the f*ckin' Wall Street bankers certainly shouldn't qualify for a credit either.
Froggy, let me rephrase that for you:
I'm not saying are entitled to some <$-illion> credit or anything, but until you have been , you really don't have anything meaningful to add regarding the existing pay schedule for .
Don't discount someone just because they don't have personal experience, it's an immature retort.
There are perks to both outside of pay. Clearly if service was such a horrible alternative, the military wouldn't have the voluntary enrollment that they do.
The guy isn't taking a mortar attack while taking a shit.
He's comfortably back in Virginia or wherever living on a base.
How many people in the Air Force fight anyway? If they're not in intelligence, they fly a plane over a target and drop bombs from 30,000 feet.
This is fake. Google it.
+1000
Dude - did you even run that chain letter through snopes? I work onboard an installation and I can tell you that there is buku wrong with that argumant. Not defending either party in this urinating contest (if it is even real). My neph is home from Afghanistan, and no - they aren't paid enough to "work" there. Stateside, they do alright. The WIC and stamps canard is a product of so many bennies being "off the books". This doof claims to have been born with Cisco skills to provide his country? No? Then he might consider the $ value of his education as he poormouths. Yes, I'm a vet, and I was underpaid, and still had plenty of money to foolishly waste. Don't bother rattling my inbox with that tripe, thanks.
OK, Comrade Rat's argument can be boiled down to the old us-them, rich-poor, wealthy-prol, income gap diatribe, more or less. If in fact he is offering to up the pay of active vet's pay to more than than of my home ec. sister in law making 82k for 9 months work, I'm for that. If however this more drivel about the unfairness of the 'system'. Give me a break.
I am not defending the 'banker's'. And I am never going to use the plight of those who are dieing for me while I stay safe and warm here in my office. They are choosing some thing that the banker never did generally----pride of performance, service before self and excellance in excecution.
They need a raise. Badly. And, the sincere recognition that they deserve.
Its own thing supporting the troops but its another to reward imperialism. Hate to break it to you Dylan but these wars are imperialistic wars. Why dont you take a trip to Iraq and see what these "soldiers" have done to this country. The place is a utter hellhole. In addition, all the depleted uranium is causing a cancer epidemic with children being born with 3 eyes, melted faces, no genitals, etc. http://www.truthout.org/article/depleted-uranium-horror-america
On the other hand I do feel bad for the soldiers that are getting re-deployed over and over again even though they have PTSD. http://abcnews.go.com/International/WoodruffReports/story?id=6095812&page=1&page=1. These people will come back so fucked up i dont know how they will ever get jobs. The desertion rate is off the charts and deserters are told to go to jail or can go to the killing zone and have their record expunged. Many opt for the deployment.
Either way, as we write the US has dropped 647 bombs in Afghanistan in the month of October.http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2009/11/airforce_airstrikes_111109w/
Thats 21 bombs a day so basically a bomb every hour being dropped on a nation smaller than Texas. And then you propose rewarding these people with $50,000 for a house?? How about helping these people cope with the fact that they have killed innocents and enemy combatants fighting in their own land? Rewarding imperialism is the last thing we need to do right now.
You're blaming the pawns for the work of our government. The soldiers are only doing what they're told, they don't get to chose where and how many bombs they drop. The desertion rate you mention says it all about the actual soldiers' state of mind while doing this just so that there is no march on Washington once they return and can't find jobs. They just get send back over and over and with more and more senseless missions/wars just so that they don't have to get back and find there's nothing left for them. So don't blame the soldiers, blame the people sending them back just so that they can pretend and extend the real problems while they load up their trucks in the back with all the cash they pillaged or look for more to pillage from what's left of our country.
Actually, we rather enjoy going downrange and getting some payback for decades of islamic terrorism against US in the military. It was our barracks bombed at the Khobar Towers, USS Cole, Pentagon, US Embassy/Marine barracks Beirut and countless military installations attacked in Iraq/Afghanistan.
We aren't the retarded "pawns" that you suggest. That said, I don't really think that you should be particularly fearful of a bunch of psycho vets with no jobs starting a violent uprising. I do think that there may very well be some significantly violent civil unrest in the US that might last for an extended period of time though.
The thing you should fear is your personal inability to handle something like that. We know we can take care of ourselves...and each other... and we will.
Im blaming poth parties, the government + military industrial complex AND the footsoldiers that actually pull the triggers. Without the soldiers there would be no MIC, and with no MIC there would be no soldiers. Thus, the two are co-existent and require each other to survive. Also, the soldiers do have a choice where they go because they enlisted fully aware of the risks and the consequences of their actions. "You reap what you sow". If the soldiers would not enlist then there would be no invasions. Good luck issuing a draft with people being so opposed to the foreign INVASIONS.
I personally know a marine who just enlisted. 21 yrs old, got laid off from Bloomingdales and decided to go blow some taliban up. I tried over 20 times to talk him out of it. Last time i spoke to him he told me "im gonna go kill motherfuckers, drop some bodies, and take some names, and if i die i know i will die for my county's security". He has turned into a monster essentially.
You also say there are "only doing what they're told". Yeah well, so did the Gestapo, and Eitsengrappen, the Japanese Bombers of Pearl Harbor, and the Russians who invaded Afghanistan prior. All of these men in the end made their choice. Why do you think these troops suffer from such high rates of PTSD? Ill tell you why, its because they know deep down inside that what they are doing is WRONG. They know that they are there killing people to ensure Americas supply of natural gas, crude oil, or other "strategic interest". But men should not kill men over resources. There are other ways of dealing with resource shortfalls. In the end God will judge all those who orchestrate, participate and tacitly support these wars.
And to the other poster i have seen the ravages of war. Ive been to Serbia (Pristina) and Bosnia (Sarajevo). Ive seen what the good ol USA bomb can do to a bridge, road, hospital, home.
Hey GD. It's obvious that you have not been over there and seen the whole of it.
Imperialism is a fact of life, and history. Would you rather live under Radical Islamic Imperialism?
For your dissention, you will be arrested, tortured, have your eyes gouged out and perhaps a hand cut off so that you may not easily use your keyboard.
I like our brand of Imperialism.
"How about helping these people cope with the fact that they have killed
innocents and enemy combatants fighting in their own land"
Hey GD your a fucking idiot. Guess what most of the people that I was in battles with in Afghanistan were from foreign countries. Uzbeks, Chechnians, Pakistanis...etc. We wouldn't be in that piece of shit country if those dumb fucks hadn't sponsored and harbored Usama Bin Laden and his merry troops. That's ok...my ass and other people who are'nt first class pussys like you are willing to protect your right to spew such vitriole. Be my guess and respond...the only reason you can is because of veterans...
CIA created Taliban.
You are so brainwashed Lord help you. You think by shooting a bunch of Pashtun tribesmen that your protecting my freedom of speech?? No, if anything you SUBVERT my freedom of speech as you directly participate in these imperialist endeavors. You shoot to protect yourself and your men, as anyone would if there were in you situation. However, if you werent there then maybe you wouldnt have to shoot at anyone AT ALL!! In the end these wars will bankrupt america, which in turn will leave it into a fasicst heap of shit. Then both our rights to spew "vitriole" will be curtialed. But i can see your type being the one shooting people like me when the US turns into a fullblown dictatorship when peak oil comes and the dollar tanks. You will do anything to keep your job and pension, even if it means murder.
And with regards to the USS cole bombing, Iraq attacks and 9/11. Whats the body count: 10,000 dead USA. 2 MILLION PLUS MUSLIMS??? You ignorant fuck.
Sounds like a pretty damn good ratio to me. Enemies to us.
INTERESTING TIME LINE
1982. State Dept releases report stating world petroleum production will peak in the 1990-2010 interval at 80-105 million barrels a day
Dick Cheney in 1999
there will be an average of two-percent annual growth in global oil demand over the years ahead, along with, conservatively, a three-percent decline in production from existing reserves. That means by 2010 we will need on the order of an additional 50 million barrels a day
Dick Cheney in April 2001
The most significant difference between now and a decade ago is the extraordinarily rapid erosion of spare capacities at critical segments of energy chains. Today, shortfalls appear to be endemic. Among the most extraordinary of these losses of spare capacity is in the oil arena.
Sept 11, 2001. Attacks kill 300 in US.
Oct 7, 2001. Operation Enduring Freedom beings in Afghanistan.
March 2003. Operation Iraqi Freedom begins in Iraq.
Mid 2005. World oil production hits what is agreed upon to be a peak.
Summer 2008. Largest oil price spike in US history hits with $145 a barrel oil.
Iraq: +100 billion barrels of recoverable oil reserves
Afghanistan
STATEMENT OF JOHN J. MARESCA, VICE
PRESIDENT OF INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, UNOCAL CORPORATION
The key question then is how the energy resources of Central Asia can be made available to nearby Asian markets. There are two possible solutions, with several variations. One option is to go east across China, but this would mean constructing a pipeline of more than 3,000 kilometers just to reach Central China. In addition, there would have to be a 2,000-kilometer connection to reach the main population centers along the coast. The question then is what will be the cost of transporting oil through this pipeline, and what would be the netback which the producers would receive.
For those who are not familiar with the terminology, the netback is the price which the producer receives for his oil or gas at the well head after all the transportation costs have been deducted. So it's the price he receives for the oil he produces at the well head.
The second option is to build a pipeline south from Central Asia to the Indian Ocean. One obvious route south would cross Iran, but this is foreclosed for American companies because of U.S. sanctions legislation. The only other possible route is across Afghanistan, which has of course its own unique challenges. The country has been involved in bitter warfare for almost two decades, and is still divided by civil war. From the outset, we have made it clear that construction of the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan could not begin until a recognized government is in place that has the confidence of governments, lenders, and our company.
Mr. Chairman, as you know, we have worked very closely with the University of Nebraska at Omaha in developing a training program for Afghanistan which will be open to both men and women, and which will operate in both parts of the country, the north and south.
Unocal foresees a pipeline which would become part of a regional system that will gather oil from existing pipeline infrastructure in Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and Russia. The 1,040-mile long oil pipeline would extend south through Afghanistan to an export terminal that would be constructed on the Pakistan coast. This 42-inch diameter pipeline will have a shipping capacity of one million barrels of oil per day. The estimated cost of the project, which is similar in scope to the trans-Alaska pipeline, is about $2.5 billion.
THIS IS WHY YOU FIGHT SOLDIER
So, help me out here. Do you mean to imply that every Muslim is an enemy and therefore 2 million Muslims (not sure on the number here) dead is a good thing.
Or would you like to separate out the actual militants vs "collateral damage"?
What is the ratio of militant to "collateral damage" anyway? Be an interesting metric to know...
Captcha, no. Many of the attacks GD has were NOT muslim.
Well one day you'll be eyeball deep in the shit basterds that supply and support you and that $400 a gallon gas you burn to run around in armored humvees and have A-10 warthogs come give you air support won't be there. You better lose the cockiness mikey.
Really, Dyligan?
"I propose we immediately enact the following...handouts"
...
"If we must resort to handouts to save our country"
Way to throw some wiggle-room in there to appease everyone. Man up and take a stance, do we hand out money or don't we to 'save our country'?
Very clever naming convention. Loopholes-r-us?
Not bad save for some claim-inflation and such. Also, $8,500 1st time homebuyer tax credit isn't going to do jack squat for someone buying a penthouse apartment in NYC, which usually start (at the very low end) in the mid single-digit millions. Someone buying a place at that level would likely spend that much on a Viking Range or a Sub Zero refrigerator.
Ratigan is waaay of base here. The only thing he's advocating is that his ideas of central planning are better than Obama's. Perhaps, but it's still central planning. IF you let housing correct on its own, you wouldn't need a f*cking bailout!! How come now one understand this? THe assets will become affordable and order will be restored. Stop disrupting asset prices with subsidies -- that's what causes all these problems! Ridiculous.
Ratigan is waaay off base here. The only thing he's advocating is that his ideas of central planning are better than Obama's. Perhaps, but it's still central planning. IF you let housing correct on its own, you wouldn't need a f*cking bailout!! How come now one understand this? THe assets will become affordable and order will be restored. Stop disrupting asset prices with subsidies -- that's what causes all these problems! Ridiculous.
On paper, I have no fault with what you are saying.
Reality is much more...complicated.
I'd rather avoid some sort of civil war.
This idea that just letting everything bottom, to me, is one incredibly risky strategy.
The alternative... paying for people's ignorant choices as they threw a coat of paint on a house and sold it to some schmuck for 50k more than it was worth again and again... just doesn't sit well with me.
Let the assets tank. There's young people who are bearing the brunt of this poor policy who would love to be able to buy houses at low prices.
One man's mistake is another man's opportunity.
Frankly, at this point I say feature, not bug. The only way we as a country are going to remove the vampires from our collective neck is to be hurt enough to understand that the pain from the tearing flesh as the jaws try to hold is less than the damage done from being wholly drained. Only then can we bust out the stakes. Though the status quo of looking in the mirror and thinking "Oh, that monstrous blood-sucking leech flopping out of my collar isn't that bad. I'll just get a nice scarf and cover it up." becomes more and more obviously bs, it is still going to take real pain to get real change.
Unfortunately, I think you may be right.
I thought, with the right leadership, we could have some sort of orderly transition out of the crisis into a "new" economy, but that just isn't happening.
Maybe if the Obama groupies had slowed down to take a breath on their koolaid we couldve gotten someone to take the necessary steps.
Alas, that is not the case.
The problem being, if we made a nice "soft landing" and "transitioned" into some sort of "new economy" (I have no idea what that would mean at this point, barring overt serfdom) there would be absolutely zero impetus to avoid a repeat performance. If it becomes merely an annoyance when a small band of grifters torches the world economy so they can make off with whatever is left of the US treasury, I can assure you it will happen again and regularly. The only way to have avoided this would include permanent ruin for said band, including lengthy prison terms and confiscation of the ill-gotten gains. If anybody here is still holding out hope for this, I happen to have a marvelous bargain on a bridge.
The amount of force that is being employed to maintain the social structures of our world do not understand soft and gentle. You don't play tug of war like this with an old worn out rope and think it's going to be alright. There's always hidden unseen deeply buried forces to cope with.
This isn't a new dilemma, it's happened throughout history: read the story in "The Creature from Jekyll Island".
Central Bank(s) inflates a bubble, lends to the average Joe who invests in the bubble, Bank deflates the bubble & bankrupt Mr. Joe, and property goes to the Bank(s).
Do this over and over, and eventually everything belongs to the Banksters.
That's right, play in their casino and you lose.
i don't buy the social unrest bit; now that our money is 01010s on a hard drive we no longer worry about bank failure and the demise of the monetary system...the issue is the state of boomer retirement funds...no one wants to bite the bullet and so we are left with reflating the bubble...we're f'd
I wonder about the civil unrest part as well - spend a couple hours on YouTube and you'll see the nation's youth practically self-destructing in confusion. And that's if they're into politics!
The only reason boomers care is because their 401k crumbled and their other retirement plan, a home in the suburbs, is underwater. F'd is right. The fight has been sucked right out of us. Get ready for a massive trail of tears - swindlers and whiskey peddlers are already out in force.
I'm a Gen Y'er, and personally, I don't want to see the baby boomers bailed out at all.
Why should my generation pay for the people who ruined this country so badly?
Have you seen the unemployment rate for my generation? Most of us are just trying to get our education and jobs. But there aren't even enough opportunities for us to work as hard as we can. Many of us can't even get jobs!
So why SHOULD we bail out the people that sold our jobs to Mexico and China while running massive deficits that we'll have to pay eventually?
Good points, MB. We Boomers felt exactly as you do when we were involuntarily conscripted into the U.S. Military to fight a war that was complete and total bullshit. Then coming home ......light 58 thousand dead men.....to a nation of draft dodging asswipes our age who gave us the finger. And no jobs to boot.
There are thousands of jerks from my generation that fukked up this country for sure. Hopefully, your generation will do much better with what's left of it.
considering that the ethnic elites are under-represented or non-existent in the military, there is no chance in hell that this idea of Dylan's will ever be even debated. tsk...tsk...facts can be such bitches....
Has Dylan Ratigan ever mentoned, even once, that his parent company is the single largest benficiary of the FDIC-guaranteed debt program TLGP?
GECC, guaranteed by GE, issued more than $80 billion, about 25% of the total $350 billion TLGP program.
funny he mentions ebay: the only 3 times i've ever been scammed there in hundreds of transactions have been by active members of the armed forces.
one could only imagine the webtraffic on ebay from midtown manhattan lighting up like a xmas tree in search of the most desperate dealer if this 'cash for credits' ever became law.
gotta give dylan props for thinking out of the box tho. if he ever used his noggin to help the real victims, the law-abiding taxpayer/savers, he might actually be onto something.
The military has always had a massive black market operation run by the pukes in logistics. They've pilfered and looted and resold just about every sort of military hardware they can get the thieving hands on.
As such I'd be very leery of buying anything from a soldier on ebay that looks like it's meant for troops in the field.
Chances are you're dealing with a thief.
Kudos to Dylan for saying what the rest of the media won't.
Congress and the White House have been sold to Wall Street.
Let's see how long it takes Wall Street to Bankrupt the United States.
Too bad the rule of law failed many service members with respect to housing, debts foreclosure and evictions. Gotta protect the banks on the backs of those that serve since they serve.
http://www.defenselink.mil/specials/Relief_Act_Revision/