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Guest Post: While Greece Burns, Spain Test Drives A Post-Euro Future

Tyler Durden's picture




 

From Simon Black of Sovereign Man

While Greece burns, Spain test drives a post-euro future

I’ve stopped briefly for a quick lunch en route to Andorra, which is a
scenic three hour drive due north from Barcelona. The spot that I
picked to stop and write to you is absolutely stunning.

DSCN1332 300x225 While Greece burns, Spain test drives a post euro future

When I first started traveling years ago, I fell in love with
Barcelona and the Catalan region of Spain. Part of it is the beauty, and
part of it is the area’s staunch independence.

In a way, Catalonia is much like Quebec in relation to Canada– these
people have their own language, their own culture, and they don’t take
kindly to those bureaucrats in Madrid telling them what to do.

I tend to pass a fair amount of time in Spain and usually find myself
here for odds and ends business matters. The last time was almost
precisely a year ago when Matt and I were attending the most
fantastically bizarre function at a remote, mountainous monastery in
Catalonia.

The rest of the group consisted of Russian gangsters, sycophantic
European businessmen, jet set playboy types, African royalty, and senior
leaders of splinter Christian and Muslim sects.

Supposedly it had something to do with diplomatic positions for a
government in exile, though to this day I have no idea how the costumes,
chanting, and rituals fit in. Think ‘Eyes Wide Shut’ without the sex.

Anyhow, since I arrived to Spain a few days ago from London, I’ve
been sniffing around to get a sense of how Spain’s crisis is unfolding.
We see the news clips and YouTube videos of protests, of governments
collapsing, of soaring unemployment, but I wanted to see for myself how
feels on the ground, and how things have changed over the last year.

The most startling change that I’ve noticed, without doubt, is the
inflation.  Literally everything I’ve looked at– food prices at the
local market, restaurant tabs, local electronics, highway tolls, raw
material construction costs, mobile phone tariffs, taxi fare, etc. are
much more expensive, to the tune of 10% to 25%.

So much for the theory that an economic slowdown would decrease prices.

John Maynard Keynes, who is consistently held up as the father of
modern macroeconomics, suggested in his General Theory that keeping
interest rates low and government spending high in order to sustain a
boom (or get an economy moving again) would likely NOT result in
inflation.

This has been the underpinning economic theory behind worldwide
government efforts since the Lehman collapse… it’s the old “spend your
way out of recession” play. Politicians and central bankers alike seem
to believe, as Keynes did, that inflation is a low risk consequence.

Spain is one of many examples that proves this theory to be utter
nonsense.  Everyone on the ground knows that inflation is high; local
newspapers are even running stories about how to best deal with
inflation and preserve your savings.

As an aside, I should mention that I read one such article in a
popular newspaper called Money Market in which the reporter interviewed
several top fund managers and asked each of them how individuals should
preserve their savings.

Most of them responded with the same dangerous herd mentality– buy
stocks. How many recommended gold or silver? Zero. This is a bullish
sign for precious metals.

Among other things I have noticed is the decline in service. Part of
the reason Spain’s unemployment rate is so high is because it is so
costly and bureaucratic to keep employees. Payroll taxes are quite high,
so businesses have laid off their workers en masse.

You notice it instantly when you try to buy something at a retail
shop or restaurant; there may be one person working for dozens of
customers, and it takes forever to get anything done.

The other thing that has me quite concerned about Spain is the police
presence. I don’t think I ever went 5 blocks in Barcelona without
seeing a cop on the street. What’s more, they don’t just stand there
waiting for something to happen, they’re actively going around harassing
people.

My assessment is that the government is intentionally having the
police turn up the heat on their intimidation tactics in hopes of
squashing any future rebellion before it happens. They want to instill a
sense of fear in the society to keep everyone quiet.

On that note, the most interesting part of this trip so far has been
passing through small towns outside of Barcelona that are starting to
circulate pesetas again– Spain’s pre-euro currency.

Apparently quite a few people have woken up to the euro’s fundamental
weakness and begun circulating an alternative within their local,
internal economies. The post-euro future is already here in Spain, it’s
only a matter of time before the rest of the continent catches up.

Overall, the situation in Spain is not as dire as in Greece, which is
literally burning at the moment. But Spain is running out of cash
quickly, and its Keynesian bubble deflating rapidly. There will be a
time, probably this year, when the country will need to secure emergency
funding just to keep the lights on, and that’s when things will really
start to fall apart.

 

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Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:45 | 1412850 Cassandra Syndrome
Cassandra Syndrome's picture

I sense a Flash Crash, its a bit like that electric feeling before a thunderstorm

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:30 | 1413032 Cassandra Syndrome
Cassandra Syndrome's picture

What's up with Visa and Mastercard shares?

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:13 | 1413194 SeverinSlade
SeverinSlade's picture

Fed announced new debit transaction fees are going to be more favorable for banks and credit card companies.  Cap was originally to be 12 cents.  Now is going to average around 24 cents.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 20:11 | 1413981 eureka
eureka's picture

And therein is indicated the rub - when government favors banks over consumers - and when government gives the money "its" Fed bank "prints" to banks, rather than to infrastructure, R&D, education and Capital Goods - THEN, those BANKS create inflation by giving all the nice "government" money to its wealthy/rich/non-productive clients for their "investment", i.e. gambling and leverage purposes.

KEYNESIAN UPDATE:

"keeping interest rates low and government spending high in order to sustain a boom (or get an economy moving again) would likely NOT result in inflation..." THAT IS, UNLESS SAID GOVERNMENT "SPENDING" TAKES THE FORM OF FREE MONEY TO BANKS TO GAMBLE WITH AND "PURCHASING" GARBAGE CARD-HOUSE "ASSETS" FROM SAID BANKS.

Anyone want to do mankind a favor?  Blow up a bank, or better yet, two - or just don't put your money into them.

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:41 | 1414674 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

The Fed was only favoring banks over consumers if you believe that retailers will pass along the swipe fee savings to those consumers.  If you believe that, call me, I may have a bridge available for purchase.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:47 | 1412853 Franken_Stein
Franken_Stein's picture

 

This clearly proves that Keynes is/was not German.

He wouldn't have written this nonsense if  he had lived through the Weimar inflation years 1918-1923.

Whenever one injects CB money into the economy and keeps interest rates low, one will only then have no inflation, if GDP grows at the same pace and with the same sign as as monetary base.

 

As soon as GDP growth gets less positive or even negative and monetary base isn't immediately adjusted accordingly, i.e. shrunk, then you automatically get an inflationary overshoot.

 

The problem is that inflationary effects have a built-in time lag of about 6 months, so a cooling of the economy must be anticipated in the future by a prudent CB head and already in advance must the monetary base be reduced so that it's full effect falls together with the actual GDP slump in the future.

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:48 | 1412880 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

At some point even the world's greatest juggler would have too many balls in the air.  It's only a matter of time when the Masters lose their balls. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:50 | 1412895 Going Loco
Going Loco's picture

I would pay good money to watch the Central Bankers lose their balls. Emasculation is always entertaining when it is happening to someone else.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:31 | 1413044 mr_T
mr_T's picture

I moved to Madrid from LA a few months ago .. Things here are not cheap especially when you convert your single ply non quilted USD's to euros... I voted for none of the above.. no usd nor euros ... I feel a lot more comfy with my gold chains .. things are not great here but the situation in LA AIN'T any better... U still see the resteraunts full people and families out enjoying themselves... U learn to live with less shit...

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:32 | 1413463 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Paul Krugman, The Bernank & William 'let them eat iPad2' Dudley all told me that what you're saying is not reality, even if you are experiencing it.

So there.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:11 | 1413175 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

I thought they already had [melted down like Fukushima that is].  Hence the reason Viagra is so en Vogue, and why Jamie "Blue" Dimon is running a major institution.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:57 | 1412929 ZackLo
ZackLo's picture

That's why mises was a better economist he DID live through weimar and he knows how far the govabankocracy can push it...

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:55 | 1413120 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

This clearly proves that Keynes is/was not German.

 

Keynes was probably a German. Most of the English are germans as the result of the apartheid enforced on celtic populations following the invasion by Saxons.

Keynes was thus extremelly friendly to the Germans in his own times, forcing the removal of the debt on Germans so that they could re arm and unleash WW2  backed by US funding( US citizens are mostly Germans themselves, at least in the leading positions)

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:54 | 1414686 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Keynes was talking sense at that time - what we are doing is not what he would at our times

Franken_Stein, as far as I know/read/see the time lag is more around two years

As soon as you have CB interest rates below 3-4% you are either in heaven or in a future hell.

Police presence in southern Europe has a different (cultural) flavor. Southern Europeans are often quite appalled when traveling in the North about what they call "no police presence whatsoever, isntitdangerous". They like their uniforms on the street. And protests look different, by having less weapons a protester in Europe can do things that would get him shot immediately in more trigger-happy countries...

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:47 | 1412857 css1971
css1971's picture

Germany also experiencing inflation. Rail, fuel, lebensmittel etc all up. 2% inflation my arse... I don't partake of iPad.. religious reasons.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:47 | 1412859 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Al Jazeera has been covering Spain all morning

with 21% unemployment reported money to buy food is becoming an issue...

http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:05 | 1412960 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

they still have the arnie gunderson interview from 6.16:  Fukushima: It's much worse than you think - Features - Al Jazeera English

along with dr. sawada, who was 13 y.o. and lived 1.4 kilometers from ground zero in hiroshima...  Gundersen's assessment of solving this crisis is grim.

"Units one through three have nuclear waste on the floor, the melted core, that has plutonium in it, and that has to be removed from the environment for hundreds of thousands of years," he said. "Somehow, robotically, they will have to go in there and manage to put it in a container and store it for infinity, and that technology doesn't exist. Nobody knows how to pick up the molten core from the floor, there is no solution available now for picking that up from the floor."

Dr Sawada says that the creation of nuclear fission generates radioactive materials for which there is simply no knowledge informing us how to dispose of the radioactive waste safely.

"Until we know how to safely dispose of the radioactive materials generated by nuclear plants, we should postpone these activities so as not to cause further harm to future generations," he explained. "To do otherwise is simply an immoral act, and that is my belief, both as a scientist and as a survivor of the Hiroshima atomic bombing."

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:11 | 1412972 carbonmutant
carbonmutant's picture

Too bad Fiat's Fire took the day off...

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:44 | 1412861 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Keynes.was a FuckTard.....

Pain and simple.

Just like the FuckTard psycopaths running the USA govt...

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:50 | 1412889 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

A useful idiot is still useful.  TPTB don't reward truth.  They reward people that say what backs their agenda.  Or have you never seen Carl Quintanilla, Bob Pissonme and Steve Tell Me Lies-Man and the rest of the CNBC clown brigade?

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:49 | 1412866 hugovanderbubble
hugovanderbubble's picture

Spain is in default = SIID

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:45 | 1412870 falak pema
falak pema's picture

spain is fine, the IMF said so some months ago...you know the guy who is now holed up in NY, he said "the Spanish banks are solid and will never cave in"...but then he caved in didn't he...so maybe, we should wait n see what the new IMF boss will have to say on the rain in Spain.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:55 | 1412900 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

So many Irish were buying up Spanish real estate.  I wonder how that is going.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:46 | 1412871 Going Loco
Going Loco's picture

In the UK a number of towns started circulating their own currency a while back, nothing to do with the current crisis, more to do with climate/peak oil and trying to keep money circulating locally instead of being sucked away elsewhere.

eg: http://www.transitiontowntotnes.org/totnespound/home

Is there anyone on this board who has direct knowledge of the situation in Spain? Is Black exagerating?

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:54 | 1412918 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

I was surprised by how unimpressed I was with the food.  That is always a bad sign to me.

The funniest moment for us came at the concert we were attending.  While we were waiting I bought a beer.  It was about $5.  My wife got a Coke Lite.  That was $10. 

I saw a lot fewer closed stores there than I do here.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:17 | 1413007 css1971
css1971's picture

Worth reading up on Wörgl.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:21 | 1413241 Ag1761
Ag1761's picture

I've been working in Spain for several years now, commute from UK. There is some discontent with fuel costs, food prices et al, but I see it as no different than what's going down across the rest of the Euro Zone, even the UK.

There is definately a play on by central banks / govs IMHO to direct the sheep away from inflation. EVERYONE is talking about rising prices no matter where you go, UK, France, Spain in my recent experience.

What is total shite about this article is the reference to a police state and the police actively seeking to hasstle you.
Total fucking shite, the Spanish cops have always been like this and they know how far to push it. They also know that if they push it with the locals too much, then boom, little bits of police flying everywhere.

Now, what is worrying is that one in two young'uns are unemployed in Spain and this is a growing trend across Europe and getting worse.
It's a combination of failing and contracting businesses such as retail sector who hire a lot of young kids, frankly this is not happening any more and also, a lot of the youth have been born and brought up in the boom years, they want life on a fucking plate and are not prepared to earn it.
A lot don't know how hard it can get, aka UK early 80's.

Spain is still cool, the biggest issue I see just now is the debt in the US - Imminent death of the Dollar. Makes Europe look like a kids piggy bank.

Focus required.

Keep on Stackin

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 10:24 | 1415393 DrunkenMonkey
DrunkenMonkey's picture

True dat.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:06 | 1413783 Dabale arroz a ...
Dabale arroz a la zorra el abad's picture

I'm Catalan and I have never seen pesetas circulating, and have never before heard of such thing. Which doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

As for the police, well, since we began our protests on May 15th there has been quite a lot of police brutality as response. But outside this protests, I haven't noticed anything strange. Some more police on the streets, yes, but not harassing people.

Well, yesterday I saw something which made me really angry: as I learned later, princess Letizia came to Barcelona to give a 70,000 € prize to an organisation for its investigations in the field of oncology. That may be fine, but there was a massive presence of policmen circling the venue (MACBA museum), the square in front of it and in lots of nearby streets, including one helicopter. I'm pretty sure the cost of such police deployment is many times higher than the amount of the prize. Pretty nonsensical, therefore. Anyway, seeing that amount of policemen around gave the message to everyone around "there is someone important there that deserves a lot of protection from you dangerous and inferior people". Well, that is what seemed to me: we are seen as a sort of angry rats, therefore "important people" have to be protected. How can they be surprised that we want to stop the parliament, as the Greeks do? But of course, I forgot, they are the elites, a higher and better class. Pitty us.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:46 | 1412873 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

In March my wife went to Ireland.  She said the moment she got into her first cab the cabbie started complaining about the Irish economy.  From then on it was obvious that eveybody was upset.

A week later we went to Spain.  I don't know Catalan but I didn't see one bit of discontent with the economy.  I got no sense that anything was wrong.  We went to a concert at Palau Saint Jordi.  It was packed.  People were buying 35 Euro t-shirts (not me).It didn't seem ready to crash. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:54 | 1412890 falak pema
falak pema's picture

they had a sound economy apart from and thanks to the real estate...thank you the banks... and now they have mass unemployment as RE was the main economic driver. How can you live off a one nut economy? When you lose it your are impotent and orphan.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:05 | 1412937 kaiten
kaiten's picture

perhaps third(or even half) of "unemployed" actually work - in black economy, southern Europe has huge black economy, so I wouldnt take the official unemployment numbers very seriously

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 20:12 | 1414015 jonytk
jonytk's picture

well i can testify that many people under unemployment benefits work in part time jobs, mainly family jobs and repairs.

Of course there's inflation but at under 3% is better than in the boom times.

Also i can testify that you can live with just 400Eurs, i myself choose to not cash in benefits and expend half of this money in a room and with the other half  i buy food at the discount supermarket. life is good althought lonely and i can only go out on the weekends. Currently attending some course.

Thank god i finally will be able to go work abroad soon.

Any room for lend in Madrid??

Idiomasen>es GoogleDicCE emprestar, prestar, dejar, quitar, añadir, dar, prestarse, darse, añadirse
Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:00 | 1412898 kito
kito's picture

soveriegn man is paranoid. probably explains why he travels so much. we have relatives who actually live in spain, not just their for walking tours. nothing of which soveriegn man speaks of jives with their take on the country.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:14 | 1412968 hambone
hambone's picture

Kito, you are a Tool -

4 things mentioned in the article...

  1. inflation
  2. high unemployment
  3. increased police presence
  4. reversion to Peseta's in a few villages)

And you retort "nothing of which soveriegn man speaks of jives with their take on the country".  Amazing your stupidity to craft such meticulous bullshit.

You sir, are a waste of digital space.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:18 | 1413008 kito
kito's picture

thank you for honoring me with a capital "T". have you been to spain recently, or have you had any conversations with anybody other than traveling salesmen?

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:43 | 1413060 hambone
hambone's picture

I lived in San Sebastian for 2 years and travel there yearly.  Doesn't mean I know more or less but your comments that nothing in the article was correct...what bullshit.  This site is for the exchange of info and ideas...spouting utter bullshit with nothing to back it up is a waste of everyones time.

I didn't think the article offered a lot as it's pretty well known to most (excluding Kito and his family living underground in Spain) that Spain's UE is through the roof and doubly so for the younger generation.  Same for inflation...I'm in Germany every  other month and can attest to the inflation (and doubly so for dollar holders) although there is almost no UE in Germany and Germans generally are quite bullish on the recovery.  Don't know about police presence or local currency. 

At least have a constructive POV - ZH needs balance between doomers and perma-bulls but at least both should bring evidence for their POV.  Give it a shot.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:13 | 1413185 kito
kito's picture

you want constructive? lets start with an article that is constructive. we have family in barcelona and madrid. the comment by mr. black indicating some stepped up police presence that has begun harrassing people is blatently false. he spews this crap about nyc police as well, a city that i happen to work in.

the idea that somehow, as indicated by his vast shopping and dining experience, stellar spanish customer service has fallen off a cliff is also ridiculous. i have been to spain numerous times since the 1990s and have stayed as long as a month. while by no means does that make me an expert, its enough to know that the spanish have never had wonderful customer service, at least by american standards. waiting a lengthy period of time for a meal is a national pastime. his articles are devoid of any helpful information.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:18 | 1413232 hambone
hambone's picture

Exactly - now that's good shit...agree, author has a slant and customer service never existed in Spain to begin with.  Not exactly an indicator of anything. 

Agreed the article was fluffy and didn't really offer insights beyond a Bloomberg or similiar puff piece.  Nice picture though and a nice diversion to the real structural issues that plague us.

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 03:53 | 1414717 Highrev
Highrev's picture

A hobnob snob.

 

And people actually make investment/trading decisions based on this kind of “information”?

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:26 | 1413029 Highrev
Highrev's picture

Anybody who goes to Barcelona to get a read on Spain doesn't have the slightest clue.

 

(I really should just leave it at saying that anybody who goes to Barcelona doesn't have the slightest clue.)

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:24 | 1413247 kito
kito's picture

i junk myself for spelling "there" "their".

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:52 | 1412904 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

hahaha!  simon b.  is at his best when he is up a tree, somewhere...

thx!  esp. for the first-hand report on the "active" law enforcement. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:52 | 1412905 Juice Box
Juice Box's picture

The pain in Spain stays mainly in the plain.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:52 | 1412906 Duuude
Duuude's picture

My assessment is that the government is intentionally having the police turn up the heat on their intimidation tactics in hopes of squashing any future rebellion before it happens. They want to instill a sense of fear in the society to keep everyone quiet...

 

This sounds familiar...

Something about travel...

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 14:55 | 1412922 Atch Logan
Atch Logan's picture

I lived in an apartment I owned in Barcelona for many years, in Val Pineda, just out of Sitges, overlooking the Mediterranean. I remember when Franco died and overnight, Spain came alive with borrowed/financed money from GS and their ilk. Stupendous financial events occured; people with basic incomes become middle class overnight. 

But, it was all done on funny money, a ponzi scheme.  Now, 30 years later (and many more financial events since ) Spain is just like Greece.  You can say what you want, but if you look beneath the beautiful scenic surface and marvelous culture, Spain is a house of cards. The Spanish people, like the Greeks, are going to have to decide whether to exist under the fascist hands of the bankers, or whether to "suck it in" like the Argentians and the Icelanders.  Also, remember that Sweden disciplined its bankers a few years back.

When it comes to America, we will be faced with the same crisis. Americans will fold, roll over, because they think it is "patriotic."  We are a cowardly and pathetic people.

God bless Greece and Spain and Ireland and Portugal and give them the guts and balls to make make long term decisions to save their countries.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:11 | 1412993 Silver Dreamer
Silver Dreamer's picture

We are a cowardly and pathetic people?  Clearly, you do not know the same people, who love their country (i.e. liberty), that I know.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:58 | 1413133 taraxias
taraxias's picture

You just made his point, responding the way any "patriot" would. Wake the fuck up, out flag means nothing, the constitution means nothing, patriotism means nothing, IT'S ALL ABOUT THE BANKING CARTEL and Americans have bought into the myth.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 22:57 | 1414316 i-dog
i-dog's picture

"people, who love their country (i.e. liberty)"

You need to separate the two ... "country" and "liberty" ... and recognise the difference!

The Founding Fathers were not fighting for their country, they were fighting for their freedom ... from the blood-sucking British monarchy! Ninety years later, "Americans" were fighting each other over whether they should keep their individual, loosely confederated, communities as set out in the Constitution (the Confederates) or whether they should have a central planning authority headed by Lincoln (the Yankees)!!

The push for central planning and "loyalty to the flag" started in 1808 in Germany -- when Fichte published his 'Addresses to the German People', which began the movement to state brainwashing of the people to submit to "the State". Hegel picked up this philosophy and ran with it to glorify the State as the vehicle for the dissemination of statist and materialist ideas and policies in education, science, politics and economics. Both Marx (follower of the 'Left Hegelians') and Hitler (follower of the 'Right Hegelians') were keen disciples of Hegel ... the NWO is pure Hegelian!

The Hegelian dialectic and political philosophy was brought to America by the founders of the 'incorporated' version of the Yale 'Skull & Bones' secret society in the 1850's and was spread through their strategic infiltration of the critical faculties at the other 'Ivy League' universities (even becoming the founding heads of Cornell and Johns Hopkins). The American Civil War of the 1860's was a direct result of their actions and family connections ... and by 1890 they had complete control over the direction of American education (ie. brainwashing).

Put down 'the flag' and fight for freedom from Washington!

End the Feds!! (Federal Reserve & Fed.gov)
End the European 'Experiment'!! (EU & EUR)
De-fund the IMF!!

Here endeth the lesson.

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:12 | 1414652 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Here endeth the lesson?

 

Americans" were fighting each other over whether they should keep their individual, loosely confederated, communities as set out in the Constitution (the Confederates)

 

Cheap propaganga...Really cheap. The Confederates did not fight for that, they fought for domination, like the Unionists.

Confederates not wanting to further their own central plan? Smoking plant, they wished for a tropical empire going down to Brazil.

 

” Cheering him on was Jefferson Davis, then a senator from Mississippi. “Cuba must be ours,” he said, to “increase the number of slaveholding constituencies.” Once the plan to buy Cuba failed, Mississippi’s other senator, Albert Gallatin Brown, started drooling over Mexico. “I want Tamaulipas, Potosi, and one or two other Mexican states; and I want them all for the same reason—for the planting and spreading of slavery.”

 

So long...

And the best, is that it is the same people who say they have been brainwashed by public education and have now started on saner basis.

Brainwashed... They are simply unhappy with the flavour of propaganda they have been served and want to to spread their own.

If you understand the gangs, you understand the US. Confederates against central planning, that is a good one...

 

 

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 03:17 | 1414697 i-dog
i-dog's picture

LOL ... quoting from 'The Economist' ... the official organ of the [Marxist] Bilderbergers! (Or, to be more accurate, quoting from an author who got his Ph.D from Johns Hopkins -- a captive university of American History Revisionism). Neat rebuttal...not.

On the other hand, from Wiki:

As a senator, he [Davis] argued against secession, but did agree that each state was sovereign and had an unquestionable right to secede from the Union.[2]

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 05:17 | 1414769 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

A rebuttal?

Another fine example of US citizen mindset. One guy who is that says this, because of that, it makes this wrong.

If one understands the gangs, one understands the US.

The Confederates wanting a tropical empire is a well known fact, that is what made the propaganda attempt so cheap.

 

Confederates were for central planning.

 

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:28 | 1414661 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

The push for central planning and "loyalty to the flag" started in 1808 in Germany -- when Fichte published his 'Addresses to the German People', which began the movement to state brainwashing of the people to submit to "the State".

 

No opposition with previous assertions of course, Confederates were not loyal to their flag.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:08 | 1412952 PulauHantu29
PulauHantu29's picture

Let 'er RIP, men!

Inflation is running at least 12% in most places except for the serverely Bubbled assets like house prices which will drop another 30-40% at least.

I added more KOL, USO and GLD as my broker advised. he has been 90% right so far which is better then the MSM outside of ZH.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:10 | 1412985 Marley
Marley's picture

“You are all in Syntagma Square. You just don’t know it yet.”

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:59 | 1413038 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Personaly I do not plan to stand up and fight(Germany will fall lats anyway), however I think all of this would be much more productive if everybody just stayed home for an Indefinite Strike, if you put a country out of business for let's say 4-6 weeks non-stop the system would have to reset it self no matter what, than I would immidietly start a barter economy to get things on track again, no taxes no government

 

Goinng head to head against police who are armed to the teeth is ... how shall I put it ... counterproductive and bad for your heath, the best way to crash a parasitic system is to starve it not fight it

 

You know the people who for 1 reason or another go on a hunger strike ? Well this would be a reverse hunger strike, starve the government refuse to pay taxes work only for cash ignore the banking system, we'd break their stranglehold in 1-2 months tops, who cares about a government that has no power to enforce it's rules

 

50%+ of the people are directly on government support either through social security or they work directly/indirectly for the goverment only 25% max people are actually producing things so it would only take about 15% of the most productive people to walk out and the system would be done in under 2 months, let the stupid riot if you are a productive member of society insure your self(by putting your wealth in gold/silver and offshore) than 'walk out'

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:30 | 1414664 Troublehoff
Troublehoff's picture

I believe in small gov but to say that all public services produce nothing is just plain wrong.

If these services were not part of the government then they would exist in the private sector - and would then somehow be producing something by the definition of many ZH'ers/Libertarians?

 

 

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 07:19 | 1414861 i-dog
i-dog's picture

"then they would exist in the private sector - and would then somehow be producing something "

Indeed ... and the private sector would then be producing them more efficiently, with competition driving innovation ... and they'd only be paid for by those who actually need/use them. Exactly as it was in the US before the growing government started handing out monopolies to those willing to pay the entry fee, then creating excuses to grow even larger through foreign wars.

No private company -- not even the old British East India Company! -- can go to war without backup from taxpayer (or serf) funding of the fallback military.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:23 | 1413013 Highrev
Highrev's picture

Catalonia is where they are famous for “blackmailing” Madrid for more money in exchange for their support of a minority government. Nice place. Nice folks.

 

What one sees in Catalonia has almost nothing what-so-ever to do with the rest of Spain. What it has to do with is the Catalan mafia running their autonomous region into the ground (while making the rest of us pay to boot!).

 

(There is one other comparison I will admit: the Basque Country. Truth be told, the best thing that could ever happen to Spain would be for the Basques and Catalans to really strike out on their own, but they’ll never do that since they could never afford it. They’re too happy throwing a perpetual tantrum and leaching from the rest of us.)

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:22 | 1413020 Greeny
Greeny's picture

Welcome to the real world..

"most startling change that I’ve noticed, without doubt, is the inflation. Literally everything I’ve looked at– food prices at the local market, restaurant tabs, local electronics, highway tolls, raw material construction costs, mobile phone tariffs, taxi fare, etc. are much more expensive, to the tune of 10% to 25%."

Buy EBAY, punks and sell it later for $200/share.. Last flagman

left, another Amazon.. Then you don't have to worry about

inflation.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:37 | 1413037 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

I was in Northern Spanish towns & villages (Aragon) last autumn and everything was the same low price or less.

Everything was very subdued.

Barcelona on the other hand was rocking as usual.

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:18 | 1413205 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

Hey DOC!

Spain is most definitely a place where the various regions have far more power than is the case in most OECD nations.  As your quip clearly illustrates, the dynamics of cross regional issues, to include cultural & their mastization in finance is becoming clearer by the day as the tide that is supposed to life all boats a la JMKism refuses to roll back in.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 18:02 | 1413562 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Miles

I remember (berely) having a drunken conversation with a Drunken Galician in Barcelona, Galicians are essentially Celtic in background.

He was bitter with the Catalans as they have all the money - it was quite funny really.

The Catalans ,Castilians, Basques , Galicans etc have quite different cultures - expecially in rural areas although in Urban areas not so much.

In Aragon up the the 1930s certain valleys had their own unique language - I think it was similar to old Languedoc but I am not quite sure to be honest ( when Franco built Tunnels through the mountains this culture died).

Much as been lost to modernity - both the landscape and even more so the culture.

One picture that captures this transition is Pans Labyrinth

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nqfz6PNCrc

 

 - its portrayal of Pyrenean Scots pine forests is very accurate , they are quite beautiful places at night but somehow haunted with strange forces.

There are still a few weird places in Northern Spain if you are willing to walk & camp in the wild although development is creeping. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:40 | 1413836 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

Back in November when I changed my avi from Layne Staley to Manu Chao I was asked why.  I replied that Layne had gone to Spain for the plain explain, and was broadened by the experience.  Sounds like I need to return since camping in Northern Spain sounds much like camping in the Northwest, Southwest [four corners] and north along the great western slope of the Rockies in the US and Canada.

Thanx for planting this particular seed.

Cheers

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:41 | 1413884 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Its more like the Sierra Nevada although less wild but with strange old world bits such as remains of Nights Templar hospices in remote border passes and such. , you need to stay  High in Spain though.

The Atlantic to Med high route is the best of the best but very tough - this is a slightly lower but in parts beautiful Trial - the Gr-15 , 19, 11 with those lovely red Spanish Scots pine - notice the scotsman.......

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw2iJWnSQFw

 

 

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 22:46 | 1414074 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

Fab !!

There are advantages to being Scots-Irish, besides balls and luck.

Cheers

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:14 | 1414649 Dugald
Dugald's picture

Och aye, an yer gets to wear a skirt.......

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 04:21 | 1414707 Miles Kendig
Miles Kendig's picture

Welcome to Hellbillyland -- Freshly roasted

http://youtu.be/QvfA4MwVynE

Fire 'em up!!

http://youtu.be/-M4Au99oxG0

Check at 4:00 and try again

Meanwhile, welcome to Fight Club.  Do you got actual game?

http://youtu.be/1lXXvUIEy2o

There ya, go, Rice Krispy -  Your kind of 4:20 snack just snaps, cackles & pops

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 15:43 | 1413067 Atch Logan
Atch Logan's picture

Well....Highrev. No disrespect intended, but you might read some history. History can be tough, so how about some novels: those of Hemingway re the Spanish civil war. I do not know anyone with a brain who thinks Barcelona was wrong and Franco the fascist was right.

Little TROLL, you need to go back to school, read history, get your fucking story straight and grow up.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:35 | 1413472 Highrev
Highrev's picture

That was then, and this is now, and I think the only one who ended up without a brain, was Hemingway and his crowd.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:09 | 1413172 flow5
flow5's picture

Keynes's liquidity preference curve is a false doctrine. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:16 | 1413214 Tenma13
Tenma13's picture

Alternative currencies bitchez!

Bet if you went to pay for a meal they'd accept silver. I'm convinced that rather than the end of the world scenario on biblical proportions that folks keep peddling , people will just start ignoring the central government, stop paying taxes and revert to trade amongst themselves. 

Still... Probably best to burn the finance ministry to the ground ala Greece. Better safe than sorry in my book. 

 

 Exciting times! BTW Folks in the UK, tomorrow we should have are own, all be it much more subdued protest in London. :) 

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 02:26 | 1414663 Dugald
Dugald's picture

Yeah, piss weak Poms!

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:34 | 1413266 Atch Logan
Atch Logan's picture

Silver Dreamer:  When you and your friends (patriots) take to the streets in America like the Greeks and fight against the fascist bankers and wall street, then, happily I will kiss your ass and beg forgiveniss. 

In this, I am sure that Americans will never fight in the street, stand up for themselves, or do what is right.  I truly wish we had money on this, for I could sell my gold and silver and retire in South America.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:34 | 1413268 Atch Logan
Atch Logan's picture

Silver Dreamer:  When you and your friends (patriots) take to the streets in America like the Greeks and fight against the fascist bankers and wall street, then, happily I will kiss your ass and beg forgiveniss. 

In this, I am sure that Americans will never fight in the street, stand up for themselves, or do what is right.  I truly wish we had money on this, for I could sell my gold and silver and retire in South America.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 16:36 | 1413275 johnsilver
johnsilver's picture

gold, gold, gold - again. the only medicine, they have for all cases, is gold.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:00 | 1413360 speconomist
speconomist's picture

Everyone on the ground knows that inflation is high; local newspapers are even running stories about how to best deal with inflation and preserve your savings.

 

Nothing further from the truth.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:06 | 1413379 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

I hope this guy told everyone to exchange their toilet paper euro for gold and silver.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:09 | 1413395 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

"same dangerous herd mentality" ?

The entire herd is going to get slaughtered.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:08 | 1413402 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

"police turn up the heat on their intimidation tactic" ?

Thomas Jefferson said "When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty."

Spread the word.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:20 | 1413428 Volaille de Bresse
Volaille de Bresse's picture

"I lived in an apartment I owned in Barcelona for many years, in Val Pineda, just out of Sitges, overlooking the Mediterranean. I remember when Franco died and overnight, Spain came alive with borrowed/financed money from GS and their ilk."

GS and US other european countries. How many bils have we dropped on your Spanish heads? 100 bil Euros since the early 80's? At least with all that money you didn't do as bad as the Greek did... (they're absolute dorks). 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:25 | 1413442 Racer
Racer's picture

In the UK house and contents insurance has gone up 30 to 50% since last year!

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 17:55 | 1413531 FunkyOldGeezer
FunkyOldGeezer's picture

My wife and I go to Spain fairly regularly for holidays and the one major feeling that we are left with is one of total under-utilisation.

There are swathes of commercail properties without any businesses to fill them, apartment blocks and hotels that far more empty than they ever used to be, conference centres that are like something out of a sixties sci-fi film set, beaches that are deserted, bars that are empty and restaurants that are lucky to have a few customers in the evening. In fact, on our last holiday, we saw restaurants that didn't have a single customer in two or more hours.

The police certainly do have more of a presence if traffic cops are anything to go by. They were pulling cars over left, right and centre (in order to gain more income from fines, for the local government), on our last visit in May.

As for service. We saw plenty of relatively small shops that had assistants who were obviously surplus to requirements. Waiters are fewer in numbers, BUT their service is just about as good as it has ever been. How anyone could possibly say that the service in Spanish restaurants is poor, or never been any good, is beyond me.

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 06:57 | 1414841 i-dog
i-dog's picture

"we saw restaurants that didn't have a single customer in two or more hours"

Haha ... what time in the evening were you looking?

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 18:01 | 1413555 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

At this point hopefully portugal and irish spreads stabilize and spain and italy shrink, proof of near term isolation of contagion and time to continue to go long risk.

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:08 | 1413788 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

Keep the police kicking the citizens but so to keep them from overthrowing us, that is the technique in use today in many nations. 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:23 | 1413799 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Simon Black

Truth is we have an inflate-stag-deflate-ion economy right now! There are big downward price pressures for retailers to compete for declining sales (see the explosion in new £Pound World type retailers in Britain) while there is undoubtedly inflation going on in the commodities and price of raw materials. Property has collapsed 20% and looks like it's hovering on the cliff edge for another deflationary nose-dive. Meanwhile GDP is stagnant in most EU countries

This is a massively confusing economy (to describe) and beyond any typical academic classifications and quite beyond what Keynes ever experienced in his lifetime to be fair

Regards Spain i couldn't agree more regards the Police presensce but take my word for it they're everywhere in Europe hassling and bullying Joe Public with road stops/blocks for petty fines (State petty theft). The number of Police patrols in Spain are higher than an already high average as is the number of traffic lights (Barcelona and Valencia are beyond a sad joke, every 20 yards another dumb-arsed lolly-pop box road block). 

You can judge the freedom/authoritarism of a country by its road/car culture and Spain is without doubt the worst in Europe with Govt now into totalitarian control freek over-kill territory. That fits perfectly with its bankrupt green energy sector, property, banking and socialist dependency culture gone bonking mad

'Everything Govt touches turns to crap'... Spain has defo' put down another big marker for that absolute truth

 

Wed, 06/29/2011 - 19:25 | 1413835 kita27
kita27's picture

i dont recall Keynes ever saying that using tax payer funds to liquify the banks or to monetize the debt was ever a good thing. He suggested using tax payer funds for public works programs that would put money in the hands of the consumers as well as constructing social infrastructure. He never advocated putting public funds in the hands of tight fisted elites.

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 00:50 | 1414567 Fiat Money
Fiat Money's picture

yeah!  ditto that.  I can't believe  Simon Black actually believes obama's  "Of, by, and for Goddamn-Sachs" crew,  http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/US-Israel/obamajews.html  have  ONE MOLECULE  of "liberal,"  progressive,  genuinely Keynsian moral concern or compassion in them.      Hey Simon - I've got a hell of a deal on a bridge you're gonna wanna get in on" !!

 "Keynes... suggested using tax payer funds for public works programs that would put money in the hands of the consumers as well as constructing social infrastructure.

He never advocated putting public funds in the hands of tight fisted [greedy, bankrupt, insolvent, fraudulent, welfare sucking banking pigs &   con-gress bribing]  elites."

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 01:47 | 1414281 alexwest
alexwest's picture

as stupid as it gets

###concerned about Spain is the police presence. I don’t think I ever went 5 blocks in Barcelona without seeing a cop on the street

MR BLACK.. ACTUALLY THERE'RE TERRORISTS IN BARCELONA /Catalonia region.. its called ETA.. actually they sometimes blow off some things and kill policeman..

read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ETA_attacks

alex

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 00:43 | 1414555 Fiat Money
Fiat Money's picture

"John Maynard Keynes, who is consistently held up as the father of modern macroeconomics, suggested in his General Theory that keeping interest rates low and government spending high in order to sustain a boom (or get an economy moving again) would likely NOT result in inflation.

This has been the underpinning economic theory behind worldwide government efforts since the Lehman collapse…"

 Oh, B.S.!    the ENTIRE  obama "economics team"  is composed of G.S. banksters and their white collar partners in crime/appartchiks.    Larry Summers &  little economic hit man Timmy Geithner may never have worked for Golddamn-Sachs... but they are both career Bob Rubin toadies  (as in, "FORMER  Goddamn-Sachs co-CHAIRMAN bob rubin." )

   They care NOT A WHIT for the American economy, the American people, the world economy... or ANYONE but themselves and the hyper-wealthy gangsters ("call from bill clinton for mr. perleman!") they front for.

      HELL -  GEITHNER and  BERNANKE - the TOP TWO appartchiks of   the treacherous obama's so-called "Democrat" economics 'team' -  DON'T EVEN PRETEND to be "Democrats", they are both unrepetent  "KILL SOCIAL SECURITY!"  Rethuglicans!

   How anyone can claim to be a competent financial observer,  without  noticing that Goddamn-Sachs is a RADICAL RIGHT-WING company...  who will HAPPILY LIE, CHEAT, and STEAL about EVERYTHING, including    PRETENDING to be  "keynsian liberals" who "genuinely" want to "stimulate the economy"  

(NOT!  GIVING billions $$  to banksters,  allows them to go on LBO buyout sprees, so they can     MONOPOLIZE commodities and buy up real, productive assets - which they then, "economic hit man" style, JACK UP the prices extorted consumers must pay, which REDUCES economic activity, SUCKING the "DISCRETIONARY SPENDING" OUT of American consumer pockets.) 

is beyond me....  

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 04:46 | 1414745 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

What?

Ive been to Barcelona just recently (and 2x in past year) and havent seen a single instance of a Peseta being in use - pretty sure it would be illegal to do so and the shopkeep accepting it would be liable for fines. And yes yes, ive visited small towns around the outskirts as well. 

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 05:15 | 1414772 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Any cause why they would circulate pesates to you?

Thu, 06/30/2011 - 07:00 | 1414846 midnight
midnight's picture

WHY THE HELL DOES ZERO HEDGE COPY & PASTE NON-REPRESENTATIVE EURO-SCEPTIC ENGLISH GARBAGE? Why do you keep giving bad advice on EURUSD?

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