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IAEA Says "There Might Be Re-Criticality At Fukushima"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Remember Fukushima?

  • IAEA SAYS `THERE MIGHT BE RE-CRITICALITY' AT FUKUSHIMA
  • IAEA COMMENTS AT PRESS CONFERENCE IN VIENNA
  • IAEA DIRECTOR GENERAL YUKIYA AMANO SPEAKS AT BRIEFING IN VIENNA
  • IAEA HAS NO INFORMATION FROM TEPCO ON NEUTRON DETECTORS

If indeed the reactor has gone critical again, the whole concrete dome idea may have to be promptly scrapped.

More soon

 

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Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:49 | 1117563 arnoldsimage
arnoldsimage's picture

i don't love what's going on in our markets. i loathe it. i'm just saying there are supernatural powers in control which cannot be stopped until you know who comes back.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:58 | 1117619 hambone
hambone's picture

Arnie,

no argument from me...I just won't "go long" in a criminal enterprise.  I can only hop along for the ride on PM's, miners, commodities.  What's the fucking difference you ask...I dunno, I really dunno anything any longer.  All I thought I knew I now know is wrong, my spidey senses no longer function, my radar is down.  I fly blind into the abyss.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:19 | 1117727 arnoldsimage
arnoldsimage's picture

i hear ya. i'm also having a difficult time finding any truth i can hang my hat on.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 15:32 | 1118445 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

 

lol!  the "avatar sans chapeau" is fine by me! 

sound like youse folks are thinking slewie thoughts:  sure, ride the wild QE bull!  the higher it goes, the LESS yer after tax "unearned income" is worth, in real terms, due (correct-0!) to criminal control of all ponzi programming and end games.  well, almost all... 

those who have "cashed out" their "investment portfolio" paid the Taxman, and gone to PM's, especially USMint-produced coins and continue to add the ounces, even now, have no counterparty risk and also other advantages to being "wealthy" in this manner. 

now that you've realized that the trading floors aren't make "real" by 24/7 "news coverage and prop-spin" and that the last decade ++ of our "modern financial history and credit creation" is nothing but criminality and victimization of all but the uber-elite, fatally, as we shall be seeing soon due to the 3rd largest economy facing "new challenges daily" and the accelerating advent of wwfamine, and the "wake-up call" of USA '08 being prop-spun to all sheeple, do the best you can.  if you haven't started, start today, and if you have, xlnt!

more and more people are being more and more honest about what they are seeing and the "quality" of the logic and econ "thought" involved. 

thank you for your honesty.  t.y.v.m.

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:01 | 1117302 americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

At least some high-level Japanese planners are urging the GOJ to immediately begin dispersing Tokyo's businesses and residents around the country, recognizing that Tokyo sits on the same plate that just produced the 9.0 at Fukushima and that anything near that magnitude close to Tokyo would be the end of modern Japan. Imagine dispersing New York City into every nook and cranny of New York State and abandoning the city itself and you get some idea of the magnitude of that proposal. I for one would love to see Wall Street dispersed approximately 100 miles eastward, in the general area where NYC has been dumping its garbage for decades.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:13 | 1117379 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

+1 Good idea re: "At least some high-level Japanese planners are urging the GOJ to immediately begin dispersing Tokyo's businesses and residents around the country"

Would work to help reduce the impact the up-coming power shortage issue is going to present, too.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:03 | 1117319 romanko
romanko's picture

operative word = "might"

anyone else notice the pattern to the ZH headlines these past two weeks?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:27 | 1117468 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

Here you go - explanation <-- click on it.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:08 | 1117350 dogismyth
dogismyth's picture

More propaganda from the pocket puppets!  Sesame Street returns starring IAEA and TEPCO!!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 22:32 | 1120026 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Brought to you by the letters F & U and the number 137!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:09 | 1117356 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

Critical Mass...bitchez

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:10 | 1117363 Tense INDIAN
Tense INDIAN's picture

...i dont understand ...why the DOME idea has to be scrapped

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:14 | 1117375 Dapper Dan
Dapper Dan's picture

The DOOM idea has hatched.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:22 | 1117429 sabra1
sabra1's picture

the bernank said he still needs his head! when QE2 ends, we can have it!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:24 | 1117439 Stormdancer
Stormdancer's picture

Maybe not permanently...and long term the entombment idea is probably the only realistic one. But not yet.

Imagine trying to pour wet cement on molten material. You'd get steam explosions, not sealed concrete enclosures.

The heat and gas production from this mess almost has to be stabilized before anything can be sealed off.

This thing won't "smother" like a combustion heat source would. In this case, "smothering" is more likely to just make it hotter.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:40 | 1117527 john2011neb
john2011neb's picture

I would think an earthquake or two might pose a problem to any structure they try to erect. 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:17 | 1117394 Serfs Up
Serfs Up's picture

A little isotope analysis would go a long way here.  Was that really 1-134 the other day?  Then there's fission happening.  Period.

For myself, I knew from the moment the TEPCO dude got on TeeVee about an hour after the reactor #3 directed-energy explosion (up, baby!) and proclaimed that there was no harm to the containment vessels that they were lying and it was 'game on!'

I'll bet if you accidentally dropped a pallet of salt bags on the top of that containment vessel they'd need a week of gamma scanning to assure that no cracks resulted...and I seriously  doubt anybody got within 300 yards of that puppy inside of an hour for a visual check.  Further, we all saw the secondary containment vessel launch parrt of itself about 1,000 feet into the air.  

So let's just cut the crap already, give us the isotope analysis, tell us how many pockets of re-criticality we are dealing with, where they are located, and then let's get on with the task of figuring out what the heck is implied and what might happen next. 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:24 | 1117434 CD
CD's picture

Welcome on board. +1 on the handle/avatar combo...

Reasonable requests, all, but this would require a degree of rationality thus far not seen from the PTB on the scene. Or rather, a form of thinking WE consider rational, I'm sure it seems to make sense to them...

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:44 | 1117541 john2011neb
john2011neb's picture

Does anyone know what that big hole in the roof in the building adjacent to reactor 3 after the explosion of reactor 3 on March 14th could be from? 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:16 | 1117397 wally_12
wally_12's picture

Since info is sparce to none, could it be that re-criticality is firing up 5 & 6?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:28 | 1117405 Carl Spackler-t...
Carl Spackler-the Creator of Spackler Feather Bent's picture

Now we have a place to send all the radioactive spent fuel assemblies - to Fukushima.  Hey, if the place is already glowing, what is a few more Rems going to do? 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:18 | 1117409 US Uncut
US Uncut's picture

Well Fukushima DAINI is smoking now....... 

I am actually starting to get on board with the Stuxnet virus as part of why cold shutdown failed. . It would help explain why WE are so quiet. 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:28 | 1117454 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Fukushima DAINI is smoking now....... 

WTF?   Got a source or information?   Give! :)

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:31 | 1117487 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

Ham sandwich over-warmed in a uWave oven ?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:28 | 1117459 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

What? Link?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:37 | 1117520 Stormdancer
Stormdancer's picture

I haven't seen any evidence that shutdown failed. To all appearances the plants all shut down automatically at the time of the earthquake. At that point the reactors were 'SCRAM-ed', but far from "cold".

Subsequent loss of cooling capability due to the tsunami seems to be the starting line for this slow-motion trainwreck.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:28 | 1117456 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Smoke Briefly Detected At Fukushima Daini Nuclear Power Plant

 

 

Wednesday, March 30, 2011

Smoke Briefly Detected At Fukushima Daini Nuclear Power Plant

TOKYO (Kyodo)--Smoke was temporarily seen at the No. 1 reactor of the Fukushima Daini nuclear power plant, but it soon disappeared, its operator said Wednesday.

Tokyo Electric Power Co. said smoke was detected at around 5:56 p.m. from a power distribution panel on the first floor of the turbine building at the reactor. The company, known as TEPCO, said it made a call to a local fire department.

The announcement came at a time when efforts are under way to contain the nuclear crisis at the radiation-leaking Fukushima Daiichi nuclear complex, hit by the devastating March 11 earthquake and ensuing tsunami.

The Fukushima Daini plant is located about 10 kilometers from the crippled Fukushima Daiichi plant, and its four reactors have been stable in so-called ''cold shutdown'' after suspending operations following the quake.

 

Well, that's good.

At least NFLX is up.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:27 | 1117467 john2011neb
john2011neb's picture

The IAEA is a little late to the game here.  I read their status report last night and they made it sound like TEPCO still was in control of the reactors and they were cooling them down.  They tried to make it sound as if spraying water on the reactors was restoration of the cooling systems.  Even TEPCO hasn't spun the reality of the situation to that point lately.  The IAEA report was a day after Japan officials had pretty much admitted there has been containment vessel breaches and meltdowns and issues with cooling of spent fuel pools as well as outside the plant leaks of highly radioactive material. 

I'm not sure who the IAEA is trying to fool, or maybe they really don't know what is going on, or they know less than TEPCO, which could be since that seems to be their only source.

I don't know, but I envision a world where there would be an IAEA nuclear expert on site in Fukushima with a live cam feed showing us, instead simply telling us things we've been told by TEPCO.  They could walk around the plant and show us how much time it would take before workers had to take breaks or not.  They could show us readings from the measurements of radiation at the site instead of telling us. 

They could film the reactors and the spent fuels pools close up and show us how there is no damage and everything is okay.  They could take off the protective gear and sit down and have lunch with some of the workers at the site prooving once and for all how safe and clean and beautiful nuclear energy really is.   

I know, it's the year 2011 and apparently there is no live web cam feed technology available still in Fukushima.  What am I thinking?  How about over at Fukushima Daini is there live web techonology 6 miles away at that plant as it overheats as well?  NO?  Really?  Yes there is.  Then why not use it?  Can someone please explain to me why no live feed from the sites that are melting down in Japan?  It really would save a lot of having to explain things and then having to believe what you are being told. 

There is only one explanation for no live feed...do you know what it is?

 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:09 | 1117667 CD
CD's picture

Appreciate the effort, but a camera updated once an hour from (dozens of?) kilometers away just ain't the same thing as a 'live feed'.

But really, do you TRULY want to watch the plant workers still on site potentially die slowly in front of you on a monitor? Real information and plausible action plans would be a start, and more useful than a gushing geyser of invisible radiation 24/7.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:22 | 1117746 flattrader
flattrader's picture

Conditions for the workers are abysmal.

http://ex-skf.blogspot.com/2011/03/fukushima-i-nuke-plant-4855-per-day-2...

Kaku is right.  They will need to call in the military.  This fucking mess will never get mitigated with TEPCO "in charge."

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:29 | 1117480 Truthiness
Truthiness's picture

I'm gonna go out on a contrarian limb here and wager the following:

The Fukushima situation muddles on like this for the next several months, never really turning into an apocalyptic nightmare and most likely just causing a localized mess and a regional headache. Eventually, they wrestle this thing under control and it becomes boring, culiminating with them putting some type of "hat" on it...

The real story is still the 20k dead from the earthquake/tsunami and accompanying devastation, granted not as "exciting" as the Fukushima...

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:53 | 1117592 FranSix
FranSix's picture

When you have a large conflagration such as a forest fire, you have no choice but to let itself burn out.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:02 | 1117650 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Considering Tokyo is still in the "region", even this regional "headache" is going to bring the international ponzi much closer to or over the tipping point.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:40 | 1117877 Truthiness
Truthiness's picture

I'm not trying to underplay the seriousness of this, I'm simply stating that there is currently a LOT of hysteria based on a potential worst case scenario outcome, which may or MAY NOT happen. Yes, this is not good for Japan's economy, and not for the international economy either...but the future has yet to be revealed. 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:18 | 1118099 tmosley
tmosley's picture

People can hyperventilate over radiation all they want (in the US), it won't change a thing whether they are calm or not.  The real effect of this is that Japan won't be able to buy more US bonds without triggering hyperinflation in Japan.  No Japanese purchases leaves the Fed and China as the only buyers, and I highly doubt China will double up their purchases.  

Looks like the first guy to head for the door is being carried on a stretcher.  The only question is, when will the others follow?  This SHOULD be enough to start a stampede.  Honestly, I don't understand why it hasn't happened yet, save the hand waving argument of "normalcy bias".  If they hold onto that bias for too much longer, those countries will outright collapse, like a blood donor that gave 8 times in a day.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 15:55 | 1118531 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

the idea that a 4+-banger nuclear disaster can be viewed as a "localized" problem shows the wonderful depth of true avataric thought which, in this case, is, indeed, right outa the freaking cartoons!

good for you Cartman!  slewie is laughing his ass off!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:26 | 1117765 flattrader
flattrader's picture

The real story begins when the winds change from out to see to onto shore.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:33 | 1117489 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

A similar scenario was studied a number of years ago by the Swedish Nuclear Power Inspectorate. 3 computer models were used in their analysis, and in each hypothetical model recriticality was predicted.

Severe Accident Recriticality Analyses

ftp://ftp.cordis.europa.eu/pub/fp5-euratom/docs/09-sara.pdf

"Recriticality is possible during reflooding with unborated water of a partly degraded
core"

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:59 | 1117987 trav7777
trav7777's picture

bingo...and I don't imagine they put the borax into those water cannons.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:33 | 1117491 tahoebumsmith
tahoebumsmith's picture

One of the best places to get updates on Fukushima is from Arnie Gundersen from Fairewinds Associates. Yesterday he posted a grim outlook for Fukushima backed with very detailed information and today his website doesn't seem to be up anylonger. I hope he didn't go in the hot tub last night?

 http://www.fairewinds.com

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:42 | 1117517 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

I'm pretty sure he's getting a lot of traffic.

This link works for me, though:

http://www.fairewinds.com/updates

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 16:37 | 1118754 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

i was on it 4 about 2 hrs. along with opening this string about 4 hours ago, and again, now.  it's was ok then and it's ok now.  his latest video (3,29,11), the 7+ minute one was a bit confusing to me b/c he started w/ reactor a, then started talking about other fuku reactors, then went to statements about "the core". 

which fuking core, arnie???   maybe just #2?  paraphrase:  TMI, after only ten hours without coolant was 10% core fubared.  this is probably closer to 70-80 %, after several days without coolant. 

so, maybe 1-4, eh?

the amount of radioactivity in the water?  "it's a troubling, a really troubling scenario, b.c the containment isn't containing."

"core damage appears to be minimized by Tokyo Electric." 

apparently the radioactivity releases have been ginormous, magnitudes X TMI, hence the elevated readings, many places, globally.  pro-nuke neo-con "depleted uranium bombs are good" thinking and spin will soon be advocated by only the most terminally confused zeroHeads, trolls, and junksters, here, and their paymasters.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:53 | 1117580 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Site off-line The site is currently not available due to technical problems. Please try again later. Thank you for your understanding.

Pretty sure he blew through his bandwidth limits.

 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:15 | 1117707 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Here guys.

This is his March 29th update, and should work:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9vCekm6AOY&feature=player_embedded

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 15:23 | 1118413 Antarctico
Antarctico's picture

This link works fine -- thanks!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:24 | 1117767 Elliott Eldrich
Elliott Eldrich's picture

From Arnie Gundersen's latest video, published March 29, 2011.

 

"At Three Mile Island, the reactor was only without water for about ten hours, maybe twelve. So for half a day it didn't have water cooling it. And also, it (Three Mile Island) only ran for three months before the accident, which means there's very little decay heat. At Fukushima, on the other hand, that reactor ran for four years. So the fuel had an enormous amount of decay heat in it. And the other piece is that it was uncooled for many days. So more decay heat plus very little cooling tells me that the damage inside that core is enormous. TMI lost one-third of it's core, it wouldn't surprise me if there's seventy or eighty percent of the core that's been damaged. 

 

Now what that means is it (the fuel - ed) falls to the bottom of the reactor as slag, radioactive slag, molten slag, at the bottom of the reactor. At the very least it's damaging those seals that I talk about, at worst it's gradually eating it's way through the nuclear reactor, and a meltdown is possible. Combine this with the salt water they've been adding, you have hot water, an incredible source of heat, and salt, corrosion of the vessel is likely. 

 

The net effect here is that I believe that the quantities of radiation that are going to continue to leak from that reactor into the containment, and now apparently out of the containment, are large. Frankly, I don't see how they're going to be stopped in the short term. Well, sorry it's kind of a gloomy picture today. I will get back to you when I have more to tell you."

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:40 | 1117872 FranSix
FranSix's picture

One thing they're missing is that the molten slag falls directly into the control rod assembly in the bottom portton of the reactor core. So they have no other choice but to allow this to carry out with large releases of radiation in the process. The more they pour water over the meltdown, the more likely this irradiated water will become part of the environment.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:12 | 1118068 Fast Twitch
Fast Twitch's picture

Thank's for the link guys. That's a smart man. Wish he was on TV. The aerial shot shows water rushing into the ocean. I wonder if that's the uncontained water?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:46 | 1117925 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

So summing it all up, is he saying to buy REITs?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:46 | 1117555 john2011neb
john2011neb's picture

Gee I wonder if the tsunami damaged any of the other plant's cooling systems in Japan?  I doubt it, they don't need all that equipment they put by ocean for anything.  Those were just ornamental structures and are not needed to pump anything or condense anything.  I can tell you this much.  At least 2 plants cannot "reboot" currently.  It has now been reported that Daini plant is overheating.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:44 | 1117916 Truthiness
Truthiness's picture

"It has now been reported that Daini plant is overheating." - what is your source? 

 

The only thing that that I read, is that some black smoke was released from an electrical panel:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/30/idUSTKB00740920110330

 

 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 16:43 | 1118787 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

correct as far as i know.  point to mr. cartman.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 16:49 | 1118811 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

correct as far as i know.  yet, must wait for for cyclops to give update, if possibe, before awarding point to mr. cartman.

ass-u-me-ing that we are getting the correct "reason" from the japanese spin doc-tors?

hey, fool me 37 times over 2.5+ weeks, shame on my styoopid ass, bigtime!  let's wait & see what "authority" sez what about this, next, ok? 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 12:51 | 1117583 Fix It Again Timmy
Fix It Again Timmy's picture

In an industry which touts regulation and safety, it's not very reassuring that no one factored in the possiblility of all diesel generators failing and made preparations for that contingency - the tsunami revealed that the emperors had no clothes on and none in the closet...

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:05 | 1118030 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

 the possiblility of all diesel generators failing and made preparations for that contingency

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Yeah, it's not like the PHONE LINES were overloaded, like the central switches were inundated with seawater by the Tsunami as were the cellular or the Japanese Handi-Phone cell sites as well.

 

oh, wait -

 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:04 | 1117657 Eddie Stobart
Eddie Stobart's picture

More speculation from afar. All these supposed meltdowns, containment breaches and uncontrollable core temperatures don't seem to be producing many extra gamma rays. You know those things which can be detected miles away.

We're into the tedious endgame that frustrates the media.  So they (and you) try whip it up into something it isn't; any old stuffed shirt dangles some bait - a dire prediction based on what might be happening worse case  - and you swallow it.

The situation is most likely:

1. There are lots of dangerous substances.

2. There are lots of problems to solve.

3. Making sure the problems don't get worse is highest priority.

4. Everybody* has an interest in getting the problems fixed and there are lots of people working on them.

5. No one wants anyone to die.

6. Things happen very slowly.

 

*Well, everybody apart from the Illuminati, the New World Order and other conspiratorial organisations that we do or don't know about who are bent on world dominiation, obviously.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:06 | 1117659 Amish Hacker
Amish Hacker's picture

I have noticed over the last couple of days that the Wall Street Journal has been doing its part to mislead. On the CBS Marketwatch site, there is a daily link to the WSJ, with a picture. Yesterday the picture showed an aerial view of the 4 Fukushima reactors, taken before the earthquake, with a caption that said something like, "Workers labor to get plant back on line," or some similar BS. Today's caption says, "TEPCO workers still scrambling," with a picture of the control room in happier times. A few operators in coveralls are standing around with their clipboards looking at a fully functioning array of controls and sensors. (http://www.marketwatch.com/   scroll down)

What else could this be but an attempt to mislead the public into thinking that the situation is much better than it is?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:37 | 1117868 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

IIRC, a couple of days ago,  the WSJ wrote some palliative plattitude like "Ingesting plutonium is relatively safe because it mostly passes through the GI tract without being absorbed".

Well that's a huge relief. Just make sure to hold your breath after you take a dump so you don't get fatal lung cancer.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:21 | 1118112 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Gives a whole new meaning to Shrek's saying "if it were me, you'd be dead!"

I guess that's why ogres are green.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 17:17 | 1118936 VisualCSharp
VisualCSharp's picture

Damn, I already have to hold my breath while I'm pinching a loaf. I dunno if I can hold it much longer than that!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:09 | 1117685 Dollar Bill Hiccup
Dollar Bill Hiccup's picture

So what exactly were the chain of events that led to this point in time which is leading to something that could be even worse ...?

1) Earthquake (big, hence bad)

2) Tsunami (very big, hence worse)

3) Loss of power for cooling and pumping water (bad)

4) Loss of backup diesel generators to run pumps (worse)

And that the plant was not built on rollers to withstand the earthquake?

Oh, and that profit motives (greed) caused an understatement of and unpreparedness for Risk?

Oh, and corruption (greed) also combined with the above, to allow for

substandard construction?

Am I missing something?

So is it that Nuclear Power is not an option because People can be so utterly short sighted?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:40 | 1117878 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

dual use reactor and weaponizable fuel rods stored on site

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:26 | 1117766 Mudflap
Mudflap's picture

Once they collect enough of this stuff it's all over...

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B8YaD7fzRSp6NmU2ODUwYzMtNzAwMy00NzI2LWI...

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:32 | 1117821 gina distrusts gov
gina distrusts gov's picture

On 23 July 1964, a criticality accident occurred at the Wood River Junction facility in Charlestown, Rhode Island. The plant was designed to recover uranium from scrap material left over from fuel element production. An operator accidentally dropped a concentrated uranium solution into an agitated tank containing sodium carbonate, resulting in a critical nuclear reaction. This criticality exposed the operator to a fatal radiation dose of 10,000 rad (100 Gy). Ninety minutes later a second excursion happened when a plant manager returned to the building and turned off the agitator, exposing himself and another administrator to doses of up to 100 rad (1 Gy) without ill effect.[13][14][15]

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:09 | 1118051 trav7777
trav7777's picture

neutrons must've missed him lol

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:34 | 1117848 The Count
The Count's picture

let me tell you guys something about the IAEA. i lived in vienna and had several friends working at the IAEA. guess what, they are mostly a bunch of sorry bureaucrats, sent there by the king or whoever to live a very cushy life in Europe. do not expect anything of importance to come out of there....

 

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:46 | 1117926 FranSix
FranSix's picture

It would not come as a surprise should the entire nuclear industry including the physicists, nuclear chemists and engineers was at best an aggregation of arsonists.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:45 | 1117911 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

Nuclear power may be dangerous, but at least particle accelerators are perfectly safe:

http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:56 | 1117979 Mudflap
Mudflap's picture

hmm... so if we require one of these accelerators next to every nuclear power plant we should have a reliable emergency cutoff switch.  I like it!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 13:57 | 1117976 Kassandra
Kassandra's picture

Not to panic or anything, but when does typhoon season start?

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:25 | 1118125 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Don't worry.  The government cancelled it this year.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:41 | 1118195 Rayden
Rayden's picture

I share the feeling of many here that the risk of the Fukushima Daiichi meltdown is underestimated and the likelyhood that it will spin completely out of control is significant.  I would like to try to help in any constructive way I can.

Therefore: I give you a method to prepare iodide (as a substitute to commercial potassium iodide pills) from povidone-iodine disinfectant ("Betadine" or any other iodophor) and commonly available other ingredients (vitamin C).  Potassium iodide pills are probably not available in the vast quantities that might be needed in a worst case scenario (a few billion doses?), and even if they were available would be hard to distribute, whereas this method uses commonly available ingredients that many people have at home and which are also available in hospitals and farms in very large quantities.  The method does work, the chemistry is very simple, and I've tested it.

I hope this is not necessary and Fukushima Daiichi can be contained, but I think that someone in the Japanese authorities should be aware of this just in case, and ready to use it quickly if needed.  I really don't know *who* to tell about this.  I've sent this to every Japanese government contact I could find, every major newspaper, etc.  I'm posting it here, to a group of people intensely concerned about the problem, in the hope that the more people know about it, the more likely it is to actually be applied if needed.  Pass it along.

P.S. Yes I'm aware that iodide pills only solve a small part of the problem, it doesn't help with cesium and strontium and a bunch of other nasty isotopes.  Still, much better to have iodide than not.

***

Preparing iodide from povidone-iodine disinfectant

Ingredients:
1. Povidone-iodine disinfectant (Betadine tm or generic equivalent)
2. Vitamin C (ascorbic acid) pills, ideally generic 1000mg pills.
3. Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate)

Steps:
1. 3000 mg ascorbic acid (Vitamin C, for example three 1000mg pills) are crushed and dissolved in 100 ml (~1/2 cup) of water, then let sit for an hour with occasional stirring.  There may be some undissolved residue from the pills.

2. 15 ml (1 tbsp) povidone-iodine disinfectant (Betadine or generic equivalent) is added to the solution of ascorbic acid and stirred.

3. The brown-purple color from the povidone-iodine should disappear almost instantly.  If it does not, more of the ascorbic acid solution is made and added slowly to the mixture until it is clear.  The mixture MUST be clear and not brown at the end of this step.

4. (optional) 1 tsp baking soda is added slowly, a few grains at a time, until adding more does not produce foam.

The resulting solution contains the iodide equivalent to 2000mg or twelve 165mg pills of potassium iodide (in this case as hydrogen iodide or, with the optional step, as sodium iodide).  It is made entirely from food-grade or pharmaceutical-grade ingredients, and is IN THEORY a substitute for potassium iodide pills.  One twelfth (9.6 ml, ~2 tsp) of the solution above (roughly equivalent to one 165mg pill of potassium iodide), measured out and taken with at a cup of milk or juice, would be IN THEORY the daly dose for an adult.

Explanation:
Ascorbic acid is a mild reducing agent, in step 2 it reduces the free iodine in Betadine to iodide, and is itself oxidized to dehydroascorbic acid.  This causes more of the iodine bound to povidone to be released and reduced to iodide until all the iodine is reduced.  In step 3, the disappearance of iodine color confirms the reaction is complete.  In step 4, the solution is neutralized from fairly acidic to neutral pH with baking soda.

Oxalic acid might be used instead of ascorbic acid, but is less preferable.  Electrochemical reduction might also be used.

Disclaimer:
This is not medical advice or a recommendation to do anything or to consume any chemicals/medicines, merely information on how to convert iodine to iodide by titration with a reducing agent, as may be found in many chemistry textbooks.

References:
http://www.outreach.canterbury.ac.nz/chemistry/vitamin_C_iodine.shtml
http://www.csiro.au/helix/sciencemail/activities/Titration.html
http://wwwchem.csustan.edu/chem1112/1112vitc.htm
http://paws.wcu.edu/bacon/vitamin%20c.pdf

http://www.bt.cdc.gov/radiation/ki.asp

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 17:19 | 1118949 VisualCSharp
VisualCSharp's picture

Excellent, excellent post. Thank you for providing good information, references and using proper grammar and spelling. If only more posts were like yours.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:46 | 1118227 Fix It Again Timmy
Fix It Again Timmy's picture

Communications [phone, voice, and data] from the plant could have been managed with a MacBook Pro, A BGAN satellite antenna [about 1/2 the size of a MacBook Pro], and access to the BGAN [Broadband Global Area Network] network provided by Inmarsat.  They could have been communicating with anyone in the world in minutes - I helped design and build the BGAN network used by CNN.  An urgent call for assistance and a coordinating search to get diesel generators on site could have begun in minutes.  When building temporary critical data networks for coverage of CNN major events, there are multiple layers of redundancy built in along with a clear proceedure for expedited shipment of any critical equipment that failed [the rule was never to have just one major component in the mix, if something failed, the redundant component took over and a backup for it would immediately begin to be shipped to the site - next day air or quicker if necessary.]

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 18:15 | 1119113 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

Sales - are you the sales mgr?

There are about half a dozen other choices too, including point-to-point HF (2 - 30 MHz) radio to VHF/UHF portables/mobiles using the island's civil defense or other utilities' trunked 2-way terrestrial radio systems through to those hand-held sat phones ...

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 14:57 | 1118279 Fix It Again Timmy
Fix It Again Timmy's picture

Here's the BGAN displayed - http://www.inmarsat.com/Services/Land/Services/High_speed_data/default.a...

No excuse for not communicating within minutes and beginning an action plan!

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 18:10 | 1119126 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

It will be interesting to hear, and see what those early comms were ... did Fuku I plant personnel have contact or not? Were there requests for support or not? Was the support denied and if so on what grounds ... many questions and no ans at present ...

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 15:40 | 1118485 FreeMoney Bernie
FreeMoney Bernie's picture

Those neutron beams oughta give solid support to wall street definitely bullish. this offers another ray of hope.

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 16:28 | 1118703 NaN
NaN's picture

I think nuclear power has lost the race with solar.  All the cost studies will not be able to sweep aside the fuel storage pool hazard anymore.  I'm sure the studies cut corners on the cost of exclusion zone real estate.  

Is that a real nuclear waste storage plan or a Sears storage shed?  

http://allthingsnuclear.org/post/4210176617/lochbaum-senate-testimony-on...

 

Wed, 03/30/2011 - 18:06 | 1119108 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

I think nuclear power has lost the race with solar. 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Is solar out of the gate yet?

Thu, 03/31/2011 - 02:40 | 1120513 Neutron Ray
Neutron Ray's picture

Neutron smootron, move along nothing to see here without a gas proportional or scintillation detector. Everyone is taking this too seriously can't we all just get along? After all we're just talking insignificant levels that won't immediately cause harm the experts can always revise the "safe" standards upwards like they did for the valiant fukushima 5000. For all we know the radiations healthful rays may spawn an army of Spiderman like superheroes that can actually fix the problem it does wonders for Ann Coulter's sallow sunken face. I think we need more radiation in our lives that's why I support the DOE policy of burying the plutonium problem at the defunct nuclear weapons facility Rocky Flats. Burying the waste Pu and changing the soil burden regulation level below a certain depth was the only way to "solve" that 24,000 year dilemma and make everything safe for future generations (as long as they don't like digging around).  I for one like to see the nuclear issue out in the open it makes it so easy to see why it is so non polluting and green it was withering in dark dank of ancient misunstandings but this is the kind of PR you can't buy. I can't believe everybody is calling the reactors at Fukushima old, tired ancient technology when it just got a ten year license extension. It isn't like regulatory angencies just hand those licenses out to anybody who asks ....you have to fill out some paperwork too or it wouldn't be "safe".

Thu, 03/31/2011 - 12:40 | 1121763 MSimon
MSimon's picture

Radiation hormesis.

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