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Invader's Remorse: Arab League Now Criticizes Western Attack On Libya

Tyler Durden's picture


Not even a full day after the UN-endorsed attack on Libya began, and the "invader's remorse" is already manifesting itself as discontent among the "peacemakers" emerges. Per the AFP: "The Arab League on Sunday criticized Western military strikes on Libya, a week after urging the United Nations to slap a no-fly zone on the oil-rich North African state. "What has happened in Libya differs from the goal of imposing a no-fly zone and what we want is the protection of civilians and not bombing other civilians," Arab League secretary general Amr Mussa told reporters." We wonder what the Arab League will say when reports of innocent civilians, up to a million of whom have been forcefully armed by Gaddafi, being butchered en masse begin emerging. And how long before the entire operation is deemed a total failure... to be redeemed only by a full scale land invasion?

More from the AFP:

On March 12, the Arab League urged the United Nations to impose a no-fly zone on Libya and said Moamer Kadhafi’s regime had "lost legitimacy" as it sought to snuff out a rebellion designed to oust him from power.

In the West’s biggest intervention in the Arab world since the 2003 US-led invasion of Iraq, US warships and a British submarine fired more than 120 Tomahawk cruise missiles into Libya on Saturday, the US military said.



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Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:39 | 1078549 monkeyfaction
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The Arabs must have expected that the UN resolution would get vetoed by China or Russia. Looks like China and Russia decided to call someones bluff.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:46 | 1078576 J.B. Books
J.B. Books's picture

War and more wars....  When will it be necessary to reinstate the draft?


My boys, your boys - cannon fodder?



Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:55 | 1078624 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

Perhaps that may stir people to action.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:11 | 1078648 66Sexy
66Sexy's picture

i hope the enforcement wing of the Corporate dictatorship gets it's ASS kicked.

absolutely NO pride or patriotism here....


china and russia are pussies... for letting the United States of Corporate Dictatorship do whatever they want in the world causing death and destruction to steal the resources of much weaker countries in their backyards.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:18 | 1078705 Dangertime
Dangertime's picture

World to the US pre-involvement:  Where are you?  Civilians are being killed in Libya.


World to the US post-involvement:  How dare you attack Libya!!!!


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:31 | 1078753 Tenma13
Tenma13's picture

Its the same on the ground: pre-UN No Fly, burning French flags, post decision, waving. WTF Catch -22 every time. Let the Arab League man u for once. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:31 | 1079030 dearth vader
dearth vader's picture

It really was Sarkozy's wounded pride that pushed the allies into Operation Odyssey Dawn. He's an idiot, and a dangerous one into the bargain.

Look at his hidden personality.

On the other hand, as ZH reported earlier, Obama was pushed into this stupidity by the three Fates, Hillary and two other influential women politicians.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:36 | 1079083 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

The French involvement is getting played up, and so is the British, but the heavy lifting is American so far.    We've been doing bombing sorties with B-2s, F-15s, F-16s, and electronic warfare aircraft, on top of the expensive volley of tomahawks already sent.    The French are basically not even equipped, electronically, to play in the  same skies as the US.   So again, all this messaging about the US not leading this is strictly absurd.  

Obummer and Clinton want to put a fig leaf in front of our raging junk, but it is now sticking out, throbbing and leaking.     The subterfuge will have lasted about five or ten hours.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:40 | 1079362 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

can use the clock to deconflict the airspace.  Frogs get the daylight, US playz at night. - Ned

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:54 | 1079594 Malcolm Tucker
Malcolm Tucker's picture

AMAZING speech by a brave Iraq war veteran. So inspiring!

I can see clearly now...

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 18:56 | 1079764 Hey Assholes
Hey Assholes's picture


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:08 | 1079960 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

speech: probably (no certainty) a playa.  If so, kudos. u play--u get to have certain views that can be used.

Mal-what do u see clearly now that u didn't see before?

just wonderin'

- Ned

{I won't, yet, bring up nay playaz in this situation}

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:48 | 1079108 dearth vader
dearth vader's picture

Sorry, fucked up the link address - animated gif. Sarkozy goes apeshit.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 18:32 | 1079704 knukles
knukles's picture

Hidden personality... disorder?
His standing in the pols has shrunken from a terribly can't possibly fuck it up lead to even between the other 2 parties.... each at about 25%.
So, when in doubt, create a diversion, lead the troop (no pun intended) call to arms, unite the country...
One fucking blister on a troopies foot and they'll be screaming bloody murder about how the American Imperialists sucked them into the abyss and hop right back home (as in retreat) claiming moral superiority.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:46 | 1079105 knukles
knukles's picture

At best, the Arab League spokesperson said what he meant.... a no fly zone, not a free fucking fire zone.

At worst, ever get the feeling the West been suckered again?  Now that they're officially pissed with the Western Christian Crusaders invasion of Sovereign Arab Islamic territory, if you thought yesterday that the price of oil was goin' up, you gotta rethink that position.

It's goin' up even more.
Known some places as a goat fuck.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:41 | 1079239 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

And here we have the nigger of the A-rab variety, the venerable sandnigger.  In fact, a whole group of them, applying the label of "Arab League" to themselves and pretending to represent the interests of the Arab people in the various countries from which they hail.  Contemporary history has demonstrated decidedly that whenever the White Man is invited into their home they don't take off their shoes before entering; hell, they don't even bother to wipe their feet.  Why, when they're only going to make a mess of the place anyway?

So in comes Whitey with his Shock and Awe, and the A-rabs get shocked but not awed by the new plateau of barbarity unleashed in an ever increasingly futile endeavour to arrest the decay of the status quo of the A-rab elites (which are still just niggers to Whitey) and to cover up the abortion of the American empire.

Meanwhile, Americans gather around their televisions watching re-runs of "That's My A-rab Dictator!", the sitcom that has captivated audiences for generations.  No matter how old that show gets, it never gets tired.  Of course, over the years they've edited in the laugh track and updated some special effects to keep the interests of the newer generations, who are raised on sugar subtitutes and a cynicism so acidic it would dissolve gold.

So grab your popcorn and sugar water and sit back and enjoy the spectacle, brought to you by your sponsor: you, the American Taxpayer.  It's your show, designed to specifically simultaneously titillate and numb your senses, so the pain of your wretched existence is never meaningfully compared to the niggers you see eating shit and dying on your television screen, not realizing all the while that you are merely looking at a reflection of yourself in a mirror that tells the future.

I am Chumbawamba.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:12 | 1079280 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

Holy shit.

That was very poignant.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:09 | 1079290 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

I like this viewpoint, but jest aside, are you for the UN and others helping to put an end to Qaddafi or did you think its best to leave the sand people to their own shit and ruin?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:22 | 1079319 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

What have 40 years of the war on poverty and 20 years of the war on drugs done but sent people to prison and destroy communities? You can't help people who aren't willing to help themselves.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:32 | 1079349 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

Absolutely. They bitch and cry for money, jobs, and help; then when you provide it they go to shit anyway.

Such a waste of resources on a non-returning asset.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:53 | 1079384 joker78160
joker78160's picture

You can't expect miracles from people who are too lazy to work. They don't deserve help.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:05 | 1079531 Abitdodgie
Abitdodgie's picture

Who you describing Americans.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:37 | 1079356 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Ah yes, the false dichotomy.  It is erroneous to call it "their own shit and ruin", because it's imported.  So now we should turn our focus to the exporters of shit and ruin.

Cause causes effect effects cause causes effect effects cause ad infinitum absurdum.

I'm not saying left to their own devices they would have created Utopia by now, but why should we care either way?  Oh yeah, they have something we want.  And having that thing is more important than having integrity.  So we mettle.

I am Chumbawamba.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:44 | 1079492 SteveNYC
SteveNYC's picture

"Cause causes effect effects cause causes effect effects cause ad infinitum absurdum."


Nothing more ever need be said.....all argument is void in the face of this one sentence. No winners no losers, just truth.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:52 | 1079383 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

I like this viewpoint


So implicitly, you stated that you know the recipe to help the sand people out of their shit and ruin.

The only solution that I know is going to apply to them is oppressed by a violent dictator peaceful civilians turning into a bunch of not worth the effort rag tag unable to make it by themselves and showing their inherent inferiority... All this overnight.

Meaning that what was considered an issue before will no longer consider as such.

Still, if you have real propositions other than denying/redefining the problem, it would be interesting to know.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:13 | 1079300 gordengeko
gordengeko's picture

+33, now how many good american patriots do you think will even comprehend what you just said?  There needs to be more synapse sparking comments like this.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:25 | 1079317 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

"There needs to be more synapse sparking comments like this."

The problem is that 98% of the politcally correct Western world would take melodramatic offense at the subject sentence, label him a racist, and call for a research grant to figure out how to make Chumba more "peaceful" and tolerant; of course, missing the entire point.  I would say missing it on purpose, because the topic is uncomfortable and requires critical thinking.  It is easier to play politic and ignore the issue at heart.

Unless we grow the Hell up and learn to talk through the hard shit once and a while, and I mean SOON, we are flat ass fucked.

Good post, Chumba.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:36 | 1079353 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

Yes, the "racism" (in their words of course) would overshadow any point. Im still trying to see the insight into the post as to how we're fucked? You know, the shit is going on on THAT side of the world. Not ours..

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:59 | 1079394 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

Sorry.  I was trying to comment on Chumba's directness which is generally frowned upon today.  We refuse for example to have responsible adult conversations about SS, Medicare, taxes, and spending.  The old "Have our cake and eat it too."

After Japan, we collectively panic about nuclear power, without being willing to talk like grownups about the cost or result of turning them off.

Pick any tough issue.  We will always kick the can down the road before we will EVEN ATTEMPT to address it head on.  Chumba's comment was way too freaking direct (as many on ZH are) to be considered by any number of people.  Normalcy bias reigns supreme, and whatever I can be distracted from by Jersey Shore doesn't really exist.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:07 | 1079406 gordengeko
gordengeko's picture

my two cents, depends on how deep the individual cares to look into it.  The rabbit hole is very deep but can be cut off at certain levels to suffice the comprehension level.  When I say comprehension I couple that with right brained imaginative critical thinking.  That type of thinking is not utilized nor is it instilled at an early age.  Keep in mind this important fact, people are bitching about this bitching about that asking why why why...The ones in control of this planet have been studying and analyzing human behavior their cognitive processes for a very long time.

These people are scientists in every sense of the word imaginable, whether its science, health, education, advertising or finance.  Every one of these systems are so meticulousy put in place it's tough to even imagine how or from where their origins came from.  The purpose is to remove your selfhood, your individuality or "soul" if you will.  If you don't have that what are you left with?  A mass collective souless entity that is easily controlled and manipulated to do whatever you want them to do.  Since they have the means now to print yes literally print up human organs (God forbid a health clone of the bernank gets a hold of one of these suckers..)(

and oh btw in new york they now have two abulances that go out to 911 calls, coming to a city near you...

So I beg the question, this is the type of technology we know about now, they cloned the sheep (funny how they cloned that animal first) back in what 1996?  Do I even need to pose this question???



Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:22 | 1079556 Segestan
Segestan's picture

White House sources confirmed last night that President Obama is still seething following the incident at the Macdonald Inchyra Hotel and is unlikely to back down. In an astonishing attack on the British establishment, he told FOX News:

"The regime in Britain, whilst not as superficially brutal as in Libya is nevertheless a disgrace to the democratic world. All them Limeys are sick of immigration, taxes and EU rule but the subtle way the media is controlled means that in effect they are forced to live within a Marxist, police state. The subjects of Great Britain have become nothing more than tax-generating cattle enslaved to a political regime they dare not criticise in case they are denounced as racist."

"What they need is freedom and proper debate because at the moment what they have is a media so biased, journalists are actually forced to report on the opposition alternative in a negative way. Man, it's like something out of the Soviet Union. God damn it, it's so bad over there now that even the human rights organisations try to put the opposition in jail."

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:07 | 1079530 Matte_Black
Matte_Black's picture

I think that was one of the most disgusting displays of superior intellect I have ever seen. Revolting. And Brilliant.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:41 | 1079580 agrotera
agrotera's picture

your poetry makes me weep chumbawamba

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 18:43 | 1079731 frankthomaswhite59
frankthomaswhite59's picture


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:01 | 1079935 Rastadamus
Rastadamus's picture


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:19 | 1079988 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

Sarcastic but up front straight thinking. I find it refreshing that someone has used the epithet "nigger" in a constructive manner that provokes thought  not one sided prejudice.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 22:02 | 1080316 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Thank you.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:04 | 1079277 Arch Duke Ferdinand
Arch Duke Ferdinand's picture

""At best, the Arab League spokesperson said what he meant.... a no fly zone, not a free fucking fire zone.""

USA Building Islam to create War...

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:27 | 1079334 Dangertime
Dangertime's picture

You cannot create a no-fly zone without taking out air-defenses.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:55 | 1079388 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Air defense includes the guy armed with a pistol.

Wreckage shows troops transportation lorries.

Only way this can endanger an airplane is through troops.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:44 | 1079493 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

for those that havent seen it, the National Radiation Map........updated every minute

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:44 | 1079583 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

meh - that's US plants; I thought you were gonna show me the shit coming in from Japan

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 22:58 | 1080471 ZakuKommander
ZakuKommander's picture

Yes, you can.  Say you want to protect rebel populations in Eastern Libya.  Well, there are no defenses there that are not controlled by the rebels.  But let's say that the rebels allowed Qadaffi to plant AntiAircraft devices around Benghazi.  US says, "Don't flu over Benghazi or we'll take you out."  The US patrols over the Med. When EWACS  or ground radar spots aircraft heading from Q-man's place to Benghazi, we have air-to-air stuff capable of taking out those planes without getting near to the Q-man's AA emplacements which we have for the sake of argument permitted to exist in rebel territory.  

Many variants on this theme possible.

Don't believe everything the Government says.

Mon, 03/21/2011 - 01:03 | 1080706 i-dog
i-dog's picture

if you thought yesterday that the price of oil was goin' up, you gotta rethink that position.

It's goin' up even more

That's the plan! Some countries just refuse to declare bankruptcy and capitulate to the IMF, so an oil price increase should fix 'em!

BTW, of every dollar spent on oil to the Arab front men, most gets funneled back to purchasing US Treasuries. That was the deal made with them by Kissinger around 40 years ago. See the connection?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:39 | 1078778 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

I'm thinking this was all pre packaged from the get go. We will support your no fly zone with the understanding that we will later criticize it in order to save some face.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:23 | 1079201 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

That makes sense. These same Arab League leaders may also be experiencing a much greater tide of discontent and insurrection from their increasingly (dis)loyal subjects, which is sure to go unreported by the MSM.

It is an intensely fascinating time to be alive.

"Basically, the worst parts of the Bible." -- Billy Bob Thornton


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:24 | 1080003 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

"May you live in interesting times" I'm told is an old Chinese curse.

Be careful what you wish for. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:33 | 1078758 Motorhead
Motorhead's picture

I wonder what deal the U.S. cut with the Russians and the Chinese for them not to veto this UN b.s.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:12 | 1078878 zaknick
zaknick's picture

This is more of a Euro deal, IMO. Le Baron's gang have ties and interests with both.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:13 | 1078886 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

My first guess was vodka and opium.

I have now been informed that Poland and Taiwan were ALSO part of the deal.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:05 | 1079067 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

My first guess was vodka and opium.

I would go for vodka, given that alternative is the american understanding of freedom and democracy.
Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:58 | 1079143 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

A few years ago, as the environment was so tainted with that China's veto thing (it was during Darfur's crisis), propaganda had it that the Chinese had vetoed an intervention in that country, I took time to investigate the topic of UN veto uses.

I think to remember that China used their veto power nine times or so, mostly on domestic related issues.

They did not veto any intervention in Darfur.

The US was leading the way with more than one hundred veto issuances or something.

Dont expect the Chinese to veto a vote on foreign invasion of a sovereign country, the record showed they are not used to doing that, prefering to avoid meddling into national domestic issues.

Their line has been constant so far. So no surprise at all, it is not in their habit to put their veto on this kind of stuff.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:33 | 1079570 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

They're biding their time and drinking their wine, and when everyone has gone to sleep they vault gold bricks.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:30 | 1079214 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

What's that old saying about giving a dog enough rope?


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 18:26 | 1079688 Founders Keeper
Founders Keeper's picture

[I wonder what deal the U.S. cut with the Russians and the Chinese for them not to veto this UN b.s.]---Motorhead

This is IMO the most penetrating Post I've read so far on this ZH article. Thank you, Motorhead.

Your question goes to the heart of the problem: Political/economic terms = more US Entanglement foreign policy.

Libyan No-Fly Zone. Western nations gasping their last. Dangerous, pathetic, destructive, and predictable.

History witness, the folly of unlimited government.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:23 | 1079196 caconhma
caconhma's picture

The issue is NOT Gaddafi is a good or a bad guy. No, the real issue is the former colonial powers committing once again indespicable crimes & wars of aggression against other independent countries with total disregard for international laws and and the world peace.

The fking Bush administrations put the USA on a slippery road of wars of aggression, and now, the WallStreet & Zionist puppet from a Chicago gutter is trying to accelerate the process with more and more new wars.

The USA on a very dangerous course with many millions (many of them Americans) will perish in a not-too-distant future.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:37 | 1079227 Cynthia
Cynthia's picture

Professors Walt and Mearsheimer have made a "near airtight" case that the Zionists Powers That Be were the biggest pushers for the war in Iraq. Which explains why five Israelis were caught dancing in a New Jersey parking lot following the 9/11 attacks. It also explains why the Israeli economy, unlike most other western economies, has remained in positive territory for the last eight years or so.

And this is what Jim Lobe reported back in February:

"Two prominent senators whose foreign policy views often reflect neo-conservative thinking, Republican John McCain and Independent Democrat Joseph Lieberman, called Friday in Tel Aviv for Washington to supply Libyan rebels with arms, among other steps, including establishing a no-fly zone over the country."

So Walt and Mearsheimer should take this and other information from Jim Lobe's piece entitled "Neo-Con Hawks Take Flight over Libya" and make yet another "near airtight" case that the Zionists Powers That Be are the biggest pushers for the war in Libya. Our war against Muammar Gaddafi is strikingly similar to our war against Saddam Hussein in that it has nothing to do with bringing freedom and democracy to the people of Libya, and it has little to do with keeping cheap oil flow to the West. It has mostly to do with us wasting our blood and treasure on Israel so that the Israelis can continue to profit by keeping all of their neighboring countries under the iron fist of dictatorial rule.

This is why I predict that if Obama and his neo-con masters remain on a warpath in Libya, Obama's War in Libya will become a repeat performance of Bush's War in Iraq.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:40 | 1079359 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

No, this one is most definitely about oil.

I am Chumbawamba.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:40 | 1080038 Alienated Serf
Alienated Serf's picture

+1 chumba

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:49 | 1080065 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Interesting. Before the euro-colonialist aggresion,  Gadaffi was being called a "zionist" by the anti-israel cabal. Now that there's an obvious euro-colonialist war against Gadaffi, the same anti-israel cabal is calling it a "zionist war".

Some people have are sure stupid. This is an aggression by the post-imperial colonialist powers.  It directly is intended to benefit the post-imperialist bankrupt plutocracies of europe and America. But here come the JPMorgan lackeys trying to sell their anti-israel hate.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:01 | 1079274 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

At least the dolt Bush pretended that Iraq was a threat and went to congress. The chicago clown didn't even bother with congress and everyone knows Gaddhafi hasn't been a threat to the US for the past 20 years.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:12 | 1079544 cossack55
cossack55's picture

CONgress is irrelevant.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:46 | 1079585 cosmictrainwreck
cosmictrainwreck's picture

you got that right... even if they weren't bought & paid for whores of the corp. entities, they couldn't agree on whether the sky is actually blue

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:25 | 1080006 rich_wicks
rich_wicks's picture

china and russia are pussies... for letting the United States of Corporate Dictatorship do whatever they want in the world causing death and destruction to steal the resources of much weaker countries in their backyards.

China and Russia is just letting the US destroy itself.

You people just don't seem to get it, the United States - it's completely bankrupt.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:01 | 1078641 bankrupt JPM bu...
bankrupt JPM buy silver's picture

Does anyone remember the days on the 486 playing command and conquer?  Seems like its real life now...

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:20 | 1078716 Josh Randall
Josh Randall's picture

I was always partial to Axis and Allies board game

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:39 | 1079087 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Risk bitchez.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:40 | 1079233 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

I've conquered the world many times with that boardgame. Concentrate your forces in Australia or South America and you can destroy your enemies and rule the world.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:02 | 1078644 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

The Democrats have been trying to reinstate the Military Draft sense Nixon ended it in 1973. Two years later Jimmy Carter reinstated the registration requirement.   Voluntary enlistments skyrocketed during his term in office for obvious reasons so the Democrats could not restart the draft. Bill Clinton never had any interest in restarting a draft. Now with Obama in office the Democrat efforts to restart the military draft has gone into hyper-drive. Obama ended Don't ask-Don't tell in an effort to force a Military or Public service draft system where everyone (Women included) will be forced into Military or Public service. Already Military enlistments are down substantially as are re-enlistments. This will force congress to reinstate the Military Draft for National security reasons and in the process will bring about national service for everyone starting at the age of 18.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:24 | 1078732 Endstrategy
Endstrategy's picture


Stop posting bullshit.  Your argument might have merit, but the part about enlistments being down is nonsense.  Military recruitment is doing very well.  The Air Force is actually cutting thousands this year, paying them to leave, and can't get enough volunteers to leave service. The reason? Because the eocnomy sucks.  When the economy is down, and finding civilian jobs is tough, the military becomes a very stable, attractive option.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:41 | 1078780 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

It's obvious when you take the blinders off.....

In Obama Era, National Service’s Time Has Come

Rep. Charles Rangel Introduces Universal National Service Act

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:55 | 1078795 Endstrategy
Endstrategy's picture

So you post an op-ed over 2 years old that has nothing to do with enlistments being down?

<sarcasm>Great counter argument.</sarcasm>

Yes, we know there are designs on reinstituting the draft.  It's for future economic and force sustainment reasons.  If WWIII kicks off next year, it will be impossible to have an enormous WWII-size military without a draft.  Also, by FORCING people to serve, you can pay them less.  You don't have to make service financially attractive.

To re-prove my point that you totally ignored in your rebuttal, here is a 2-years-old forum on Oprah's ass. With your reasoning ability, it should make perfect sense!

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:02 | 1078855 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

Congressman Charles Rangel on Thursday introduced the Universal National Service Act, commonly referred to as the draft bill, ahead of the 8th anniversary of the invasion of Iraq on Saturday, March 19, 2011. The Congressman, a Korean War Veteran, has introduced similar legislation in the past that addresses not only the need for a more equitable military draft, but also establishes a universal requirement for National Service.

Read more:
Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:12 | 1078881 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

They will not start the draft. If they did, the anti-war protests would be huge and could result in real political reform.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:48 | 1079110 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Also, our military itself hates the draft.   Yeah.    The Dim-ocrats behind this mandatory service thing are not doing it to beef up our military.  Au contraire, they hate the military as it currently is, because our military is chock full of patriots, and votes something like 80% republican.  That's why we see efforts at disenfranchisement of military ballots everywhere during each federal election cycle, in parallel with efforts to let felons vote.    The former vote Republican mostly and the latter loooove Democrats.   Even the Afghanistan campaign is at least 50% about wearing out our military in a less than useless campaign under rules of engagement that make the mission impossible, with a pre-scheduled pull out date telegraphed to the barbarians, hint hint wink wink.   The Democrats love to send our military on missions in which the US has no imaginable strategic interest, and scream bloody murder, descending into abject Sheehanism and Code Pink pantywaistville whenever the US engages in activity that could benefit our interests...i.e. the expansion of pluralistic, freedom oriented representative government and capitalism, the best way we know of to improve the human condition for all concerned.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:08 | 1079289 Bernank Sheeple
Bernank Sheeple's picture

So true  - Rangel, is very crafty, especially when it vomes to weakening this country. Hope he retires soon.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 19:20 | 1079821 ihedgemyhedges
ihedgemyhedges's picture

"Hope he retires soon."  LMFAO!!!  He just broke laws that would have many of us in jail if we did it.  He got "censured".  WOULD YOU LEAVE THAT GIG?????????

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:27 | 1080010 rich_wicks
rich_wicks's picture

because our military is chock full of patriots, and votes something like 80% republican.


How can anybody be this stupid in this day and age?

What's patriotic about being a thug for an out of control government?  They're not patriots, they're government workers.

They'll be patriots when they start working in the private sector, working in what remains of our capitalist system.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:31 | 1079219 caconhma
caconhma's picture

Do not count of any wisdom of American people. The majority is brainwashed and brain-dead.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:48 | 1079374 Shock and Aweful
Shock and Aweful's picture

Personally, I think a draft would be a great thing for this nation...


A conscripted military might just be the thing that would keep our "fearless leaders" from going to war so easy...because they would know that millions of families, with loved ones in the armed forces, would demand to know what in the hell is so important and pressing that we have to go to war over it - and potentially lose the lives of thousands.


The way it is now, very few Americans have to sacrifice anything when we go to war...hell...they don't even raise taxes anymore when we go to war...they just charge it.


By allowing a small, all-volunteer military (and a massive cadre of over-paid private military contractors or mercenaries if you will) to wage our makes the political costs less of an obstacle to waging wars.


I can guarantee you that if well-off white familes from the east and west coats started being notified that THEIR child has to go to war...the questions about why we are going into this war would be asked...with force...repeatedly....until a satisfactory answer was given.  I don't think we would be having the ridiculous and costly misadventures like we have in Iraq, Afghanistan (and now Libya) unless there was a damn good reason for it...and our nation and exsistance was most cetainly in danger.


Honestly...I think a draft would be the BEST weapon we could employ to defeat the ever-growing power of the military-industrial-politcal complex that has run amok in the last 40 years (since the last draft!)

JUNK AWAY....hahahah 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:41 | 1078786 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

So they draft people economically, much more efficient than facing another vietnam anti war backlash. I'm sure the recruiters tell you whatever you want to hear in order to get a signature.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:15 | 1078893 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

The recruiters are having the best times of their life. The economy sucks and people are banging on the doors to get in. Besides, over 90% of the military are non-combat support jobs. Look at the navy and air force. How many of them are in actual danger? 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:22 | 1078909 Yardfarmer
Yardfarmer's picture

indeed life is soooo good for all of us rear echelon MF'ers, arm chair generals, various neo-con chicken hawks, and re-edumacated neo-liberal pacifists. war IS the answer! isn't it? there's no profit like war profit. no risk. no strings attached. and endless upside potential. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:01 | 1079272 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

"Look at the navy and air force. How many of them are in actual danger?"

Depends on who they're fighting. China and Russia have the ability to inflict catastrophic loss on ANY modern navy, and they know it.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:40 | 1078944 Tucson Tom
Tucson Tom's picture

absolute nonsense.We don`t have the number of qualified instructers for the number of age eligible inductees.The cost,in the absense of QE policy, is prohibitive.Then ask yourself how would you like to be a drill instructor with gang bangers and non-english speaking draftees and high school kids who don`t give a rats ass about anything.The riots would start on campuses and make Madison look small time.However,maybe they will all be wearing "brown shirts" instead of digital camos and then all bets are off.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 18:55 | 1079759 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

Two things:

I was just at West Point at a banquet and the guest speaker was a serving US CSM; he is the last draftee in the US Army. He was inducted in April 1972 at 19 years of age.

I joined the Army in March of 1972, at 17 years of age, delayed entry, went active in June 1972. I was the only Regular Army solider in my basic training company. You just described my basic company. Mexicans without English, gang bangers white and black, homemade tattoos were the norm. I never saw a Drill Sergeant without a CIB. It was not the boy scouts. You could drink on the Fort if you were in uniform. Pay had been raised from $78 a month to $200 a month to attract volunteers. They got me. It was called MVA, the Modern Volunteer Army. Those are the roots of the current Army.  

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:13 | 1078685 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Exactly JB dumb war (Vietnam) follows another dumb war (Iraq) and another dumb war (Afghanistan) and yet another (Libya) well have we done with 'regime change' (the stated aim this time)? Tragically. It has never worked and it won't work

Dumb proliferates in monopolies (no higher IQ to compete with being dumb). Which is why Govt and the UN/EU are the dumbest organisations in the world and will be forever until we rid ourselves of these shit-loaded institutions 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:52 | 1078810 ciscokid
ciscokid's picture

It never works with us sheeple

but I am sure it works for them and

the Fat Cats of wall streek.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:51 | 1079123 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Uh, let's see, "Germany" and "Japan".      I refute your argument thus, and fart precisely in your direction.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:22 | 1078718 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

Like I said in a previous thread. Daffy's a tyrant whom is and has done terrible things to his people. This is the characteristic of a tyrant. Daffy, who has a bad brain, will be removed and who but the U.S.A. can do it cleanly and swiftly?


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:29 | 1078749 cossack55
cossack55's picture

Lead the way, death-lover, I'm right behind ya and I threw away the pin.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:38 | 1078776 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

Will the Gadaffi lovers please step forward....

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:50 | 1078813 cossack55
cossack55's picture

So the last 40 years was OK, but now that gas is $3.50+ it cuts into sewing SS runes on your silk undies fund, now we need to kill all the Libyans. Is that right?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:09 | 1078874 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

I hear many noble righteous claims here on ZH and indeed I agree with many of them, but one thing is for sure, Daffy is finished! ;-)


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:17 | 1078898 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

You must be an Ayatollah lover since you don't want to invade Iran

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:34 | 1079076 Malachi Constant
Malachi Constant's picture

I wish I could upvote you.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:54 | 1079126 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Screen printing is more comfortable in practical application.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:53 | 1078820 nonclaim
nonclaim's picture

I love logic... since the reason to kick out Gadaffi is the number of innocents he killed, when the 'coalition' kills as many or more are we (anybody with a brain) entitled to depose Obama, Sarkozy and the rest of the troupe?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:38 | 1078940 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

We could do that. All in favor of deposing Obama next, say AYE!

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:59 | 1079523 francis_the_won...
francis_the_wonder_hamster's picture


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:52 | 1080074 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

I conquer!!!

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:04 | 1078993 scaleindependent
scaleindependent's picture

Will Kim Il Young lovers, Congo tyrants afficionados, Zimbabwe baby killers fan-boys, Bahrain dictator mass killer true believers, and plain ole Retards,   etc., etc. STEP UP!



Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:38 | 1079574 45north
45north's picture

well they don't really love Gadaffi but they just love to criticize.  They worship power and are so jealous of those that have it when they don't.  As if they would ever admit responsibility for anything.  Paradoxically they do have the freedom to criticize while denying that they have freedom. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:44 | 1078783 Tenma13
Tenma13's picture

Seriously? You have to be joking. 'who but the US can do it CLEANLY and SWIFTY'. Iraq and Afgan ring any bells? Unless by 'cleanly' and 'swiftly' you mean an absolute shambles costing billions never ending. You have the internet, best to use it. Unreal. Take it as a point of pride that you are able to dress yourself in the mornings. Move on from there. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:45 | 1078789 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

I think we might have a true believer right up there. Of course they are usually too busy cheerleading the death and destruction to sign up and go.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:49 | 1078804 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

I love the U.S.A. and many have no idea the value we are to the world despite our defects.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:28 | 1078923 Yardfarmer
Yardfarmer's picture

more sycophantic cheerleading for our latest Nurmeberg party pep rally. reprehensible chicken-hawk dipshit.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:34 | 1078935 G-R-U-N-T
G-R-U-N-T's picture

Will the American haters please step forward...

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:02 | 1079156 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Facts are a matter of emotion, love and hate.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:13 | 1079017 scatterbrains
scatterbrains's picture

Yardfarmer, Was it you that mentioned you leave some portion of your potato crop in the ground until early spring? This was maybe a year ago, if it was you how did they do this spring ?  and which variety was it ?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:31 | 1078927 zaknick
zaknick's picture

The US stopped adding value to the world about 40-50 years ago when Rockefeller, Bush, Kissinger "figured out" that instead of helping the 3rd world build roads, hospitals and industrialization (creating pressures and competitors to their oil/gold etc mineral wealth that just happened to be in other peoples countries) they should be destroying these natives.

The highest ranking CIA ossifer to renounce their ways is a man named John Stockwell (YouTube). He says that AIDS should be investigated in this context because they were experimenting with stuff like it. But it fits in with every other genocidal policy (like the huge Orwellian black mark called the war on drugs which finances most of the violence in this world: from petty gangsters in inner cities (destruction of the family unit is a priority) to region wide armed combatants) that their XX century eugenics tradition foreshadows ( see War on the Weak by Edwin Black).

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:58 | 1079139 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Hmmm, if that what the plan was, it isn't working.   The population has more than doubled, and most of that in this 3rd world you evidently want us to go build free infrastucture for.  

Go google "white man's burden" and read up as to the mental biases imputed to its adherents.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:30 | 1079217 lesterbegood
lesterbegood's picture

The Strecker Memorandum on AIDS and the World Health Organization connection.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:00 | 1078841 ciscokid
ciscokid's picture

Ohh! I remembe the glory of the

Royal Navy in the old days.Board

all vessels at sea and claim it for

Queen of England.We used to be the best in that.

Now its the USA that does it best.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:34 | 1078757 jesse livermoore
jesse livermoore's picture

If that happens the left-wing-nuts will march on the white house.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:00 | 1079149 macholatte
macholatte's picture

My boys, your boys - cannon fodder?


This is the same routine that has been going on since Viet Nam. There is no justification for this war. Everything was fine until Quadaffi pissed off the banking cartel. Now he's got to go. American resources get spent. American blood gets spilled. American tax payer gets screwed. American prestige gets trashed by the people who begged for help. (see Kuwait)

wash - rinse - repeat

These questions remain:

-- who are the "Rebels"?

-- where did they get their toys? (lots of guns, lots of ammo, anti aircraft guns, rocket launchers, aircraft, etc, etc.)

-- who trained them?

-- how long have they been active?

-- where did they get the money?

-- they even had a "General" giving a news conference last week. He was wearing a uniform. A uniform? Where did he get it? Who pays him?


WTF is going on?



Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:25 | 1079327 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

Would like to hear some thoughts on the above mentioned Qs.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:42 | 1079489 gmj
gmj's picture

Good questions.  Do the rebels represent the majority?  Why are the allies getting involved in this fight, but not in Darfur, the Congo, Zimbabwe, Syria, Bahrain, etc?  What about North Korea?  Talk about a whole nation getting screwed by its leaders.  

IS ANYONE ANSWERING THESE BASIC QUESTIONS?  If not, we are all firing blanks.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:37 | 1079572 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

Those are excellent questions. I suspect that some of the answers may involve highly classified information, which would no doubt include the missions of many covert intelligence assets. I read something a few days back about arms being smuggled across the Egyptian/Libyan border for purposes of arming the "rebels". It would also be interesting to know how many foreign contractors (mercenaries) are embedded within the rebel army.

Operation Odyssey Dawn is an outstanding opportunity for many foreign states to fight a proxy war. To the victor go the spoils.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:39 | 1079231 Hat Trick
Hat Trick's picture

Really surprised Arab countries went along with it in the first place, since many have uprisings of their own right now. Guess they figure if we are tied up in Libya, we can't come looking for them too! But they have a very legit point; the purpose of the mission was to prevent air power from bombing the rebels...not to start our own air campaign against the gov't. They have every reason to be upset!!

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:57 | 1080094 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

Lay off those Slap shots. Hockey will knock your teeth out.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 22:11 | 1080339 Milestones
Milestones's picture

It won't happen when Congress hears about 50 million 00 rounds get chambered into 12 Ga.'s. That issue will be Dy-no-mite with a lot of heat behind it....Milestones

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:59 | 1078630 Thomas
Thomas's picture

Discussed this with a leutenant colonel in the marines who used to debrief Wolfowitz. He pointed out that the first step in establishing a no-fly zone--the very first step--is to knock out ground installations. Anybody who wanted a no-fly zone but not what we are currently seeing is woefully under-informed.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:30 | 1078747 Larry Darrell
Larry Darrell's picture

"is woefully under-informed."


That is by design.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:59 | 1079146 RichardP
RichardP's picture

No.  What it is is folks not thinking through what a no-fly zone means.  No airplanes in the air.  That means you either shoot down every enemy plane that takes off, or you make it impossible for them to take off - all while keeping your own planes safe.  Which means you need to disable all the anti-aircraft capabilities on the ground.

Folks who don't think that through are woefully under-informed - although I would have used the phrase are not careful thinkers.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:07 | 1079167 macholatte
macholatte's picture


from March 2:


No-fly zone for Libya would require attack: Gates

(Reuters) - Setting up a "no-fly" zone over Libya would require an attack to cripple its air defenses, the defense secretary said on Wednesday, as the United States intensified pressure on Muammar Gaddafi to step down.

"Let's just call a spade a spade. A no-fly zone begins with an attack on Libya to destroy the air defenses ... and then you can fly planes around the country and not worry about our guys being shot down," Defense Secretary Robert Gates told a congressional hearing.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:55 | 1079389 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

RP: good points, but

"Which means you need to disable all the anti-aircraft capabilities on the ground."

or have the fast movers stay above 15,000 feet AGL (outside the envelope of even the best 'golden beebee').

Be interesting to understand the Libyan's air search radar situation.

- Ned

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:58 | 1078840 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

++++.  No fly zone sounds so innocuous doesn't it?  Where were all the hopium snorting, unicorn piss gargling fools when general after secdef after retired military explained what a "No-Fly Zone" entails?  Probably at each others throats about unions and NPR, and searching frantically for KI. 

Face it.  We are in another war.  Might last three weeks, and only involve some bombs and missiles on our part, but it's war none the less. 

If you thought otherwise, you were completely uninformed.


Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:21 | 1079035 scatterbrains
scatterbrains's picture

If I'm on the ground in Libya and I'm carrying a boomerang technically I need to get taken out because in theory I could throw it and have it lodge in a low flying fighter jets engine. 

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 15:32 | 1079346 ColonelCooper
ColonelCooper's picture

I have no clue why you would respond to my post with what you just said.  Find for me, the spot in my post where I approved of this action.  Being aware enough of what a no fly zone actually means, AND laughing at those who cheered it on AND THEN get buyers remorse does not make me a hawk.  It is not as though it wasn't laid out in full in advance, even by the MSM.   



Sun, 03/20/2011 - 20:53 | 1080082 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

I like boomerangs. AKA AWAC-s

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 12:15 | 1078895 Moe Howard
Moe Howard's picture

SecDef Gates announced this publicly and loudly well before the UN resolution. You don't need to know someone who debriefed [WTF - did you mean brief?] some asshat neocon. In fact, any armchair military quarterback could tell you the same.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:07 | 1079169 RichardP
RichardP's picture

You brief someone who wants to know what is going on.  Military brass get briefings on all kinds of things every day.  Debriefing is the process of quizzing someone after the fact.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:06 | 1078649 Twindrives
Twindrives's picture

Obama and Clinton secretly depise Muslims so they don't care what Arab leaders think.  

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:23 | 1078728 falak pema
falak pema's picture

"Hussein" despises muslims...You will have the christian fundamentalists breathing down your neck...As for Hillary, she probably loves anything male that does not remind her of a certain Havana smoldering Bill...

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:05 | 1079158 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

Well, Obummer bowed so deep to some of them, it looks overdone.     Guess the frequent dissing of the British and the Cairo muzzie-fellating speech were part of this great misdirection.   That's a lot of spending of political and alliance capital just to cover up their secret hatred of Muslims, but OK.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:36 | 1078763 APC
APC's picture

That's about the smartest thing I've read in this thread monkeyfaction.


A question for the poster of this entry, Tyler is it?  How do you "forcefully" arm a million citizens?  I mean under what threat, the threat of arms?  Isn't the cat out of the bag once you've given these folks guns?  Logical fallacy if you ask me.


Before I'm shitcanned by the entire ZH community I should like to point out that I love the blog...   ;O)

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:50 | 1078807 Tenma13
Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:55 | 1078819 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

The russians and the chinese got bought off somehow. Not sure what happened on that one.

here are the crowds walking around looking at the destruction and waving and raising their arms and laughing and celebrating the destruction of their own country. fools........




By the way,  I told that boy to get his stuff off the roads and pull back from the rebel held areas and hide his stuff and fly his planes to Zimbabwe for safe keeping but I guess he didn't believe me....He should have listened to his old Uncle HPD.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:06 | 1079405 tempo
tempo's picture

Didn't the US supply billions in military hardware to Libya?    Italy is Libya's trading partner.  So France must expect to bounce Italy out and supply billions of military hardware to the new dictator they are supporting.  This is all about who sells the next round of planes and tanks to the middle east.  Obama's statement that this is about the young people is a bunch of crap.  Its about selling more death.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 21:16 | 1080158 morkov
morkov's picture

no-fly means NO-FLY, no?  whoever is flying is the agressor. the french, no? the ships and submrines on the coast were enough to "enforce" this no-fly thing. destruction of defence systems is a crime. the shit is slipping out of control, no?

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:40 | 1078552 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Did they promise to use a condom and didn't? Some folks you just don't get in bed with.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 10:42 | 1078561 umop episdn
umop episdn's picture

For realz! I have heard that there is an arabic saying: "The Americans are never to be trusted unless they promise you war."

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:04 | 1079160 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"The White man promised us many things, but the only promise they kept was that they would take our land...and they took it."  Native-American Chief (whose name escapes me!)

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 17:57 | 1079602 serotonindumptruck
serotonindumptruck's picture

Possibly Chief Seattle.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 11:21 | 1078713 AuShoot
AuShoot's picture

condoms? No. lybia interruptus.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 13:59 | 1079140 knukles
knukles's picture

BTW, did you know that it was the Arabs that first utilized goat and sheep intestine as condoms?
Later in the 1800's the British, during their colonial era improved on the practice by removing the intestine from the animal before use.

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 14:05 | 1079164 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

So the Muzzies invented the condom too, in their way....

Sun, 03/20/2011 - 16:17 | 1079428 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Very experienced approach to hotel hopping. Spitzer style on credit card. A true veteran of Vietnam once said : what I miss most is the ambiance of those hooker bars in Bangkok on R&R. Thai massage is like Thai cooking for the guy who is new to oriental spice.


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