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Japanese Officials Say Nuclear Fuel Rods Likely Melting In All Three "Troubled" Japanese Reactors

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It just got worse. From AP:

Japanese officials say the nuclear fuel rods appear to be melting inside all three of the most troubled nuclear reactors.

Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano said Monday: "Although we cannot directly check it, it's highly likely happening."

Some experts would consider that a partial meltdown of the reactor. Others, though, reserve that term for times when nuclear fuel melts through a reactor's innermost chamber but not through the outer containment shell.

We can only hope that the team that did not test for an 8+ magnitude earthquake did a better job at fortifying the containment shell which is the only thing separating radiation from the outer world.

 

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Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:33 | 1050269 Deluxe186
Deluxe186's picture

Shotty the first three breasted prostitute!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:57 | 1050406 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

Tyler,

I find it interesting to note that the linked article doesn't say that...retraction?

"TOKYO (AP) -- A Japanese utility says fuel rods at a troubled nuclear reactor were once again fully exposed hours after authorities were able to stabilize a similar emergency.

Tokyo Electric Power Co. says the exposure happened at Unit 2 of the Fukushima Dai-ichi plant because a steam vent wouldn't open Monday, causing a sudden drop of water.

That reactor and two others at the plant are dangerously overheating and authorities are racing to prevent meltdown.

Truth, in this crisis, seems to be a very elusive thing.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:12 | 1050506 whatsinaname
whatsinaname's picture

If you want to see how truth can be subverted, read about chernobyl on wiki or on www.elenafilatova.com (although her work has been partially discredited, but the photos are real and indeed eye-opening on the callousness of the Ruskies). The Japanese are being far more open as can be expected from them.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:52 | 1050733 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

This article is so typical: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-03-13/japan-tries-to-contain-nuclear-...

The headline: "Japan Battles Nuclear Meltdown as Millions Are Without Power"

The actual text of the article says "Workers battled to prevent a nuclear meltdown..."  So are we battling a meltdown, or battling to prevent one?  Which is fact, and which is eye-grabbing headline?  Which gets re-reported as fact?

The article then goes on to say matter-of-factly "oh by the way 10,000 people are feared dead due to the earthquake and tsunami, but lets's all obsess about the very serious problems at the nuclear plant, and not worry so much about the hundreds of thousands of new homeless who are trying to survive freezing overnight temperatures, lack of food and water, injuries requiring medical care, and lack of power.

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:19 | 1050548 iDealMeat
iDealMeat's picture

One thing the nuke "experts" are neglecting to mention..  It's still freezing in Japan. If it rains, or even the moisture in the air soaks into cracks it the concrete then freezes, it will expand all cracks. At least the salt water lowers the freezing temp..

probably all for not.. 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:00 | 1050774 jus_lite_reading
jus_lite_reading's picture

TYLER YOUR DAY HAS ARRIVED! YOU MUST PUBLISH A POST ON THIS!

CNBC's Kudlow on Japan Quake - """ Be Grateful Human Toll Much Worse than Economic Toll."


 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:33 | 1050270 Deepskyy
Deepskyy's picture

You sure are full of good news today Tyler.  Is it too early to start drinking on the east coast?

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:35 | 1050290 snowball777
snowball777's picture

I'm in the PST, but the sun is over the yardarm in GMT so...bottoms up!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:17 | 1051189 Cookie
Cookie's picture

already dribbling in Asia ;-)

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:39 | 1050307 camaro68ss
camaro68ss's picture

this is all bad! 3 three mile islands at once going on at the same time..... Thats going to be a hard clean up and think of all those people living around those plants.

Is this the triger to start the world crash

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:42 | 1050331 Thomas
Thomas's picture

Bastiat's "Nuked Window Fallacy".

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:56 | 1050413 Count Floyd
Count Floyd's picture

Three Mile Island released little "deadly radiation."

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:05 | 1050459 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Or so you were made to believe.

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:48 | 1051353 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 Oh grow up.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:37 | 1050636 cossack55
cossack55's picture

Then how do you explain all the mutants in DC. Well Mr. Smarty Pants?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:58 | 1050755 Mesquite
Mesquite's picture

Heh heh heh

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:57 | 1050415 curbyourrisk
curbyourrisk's picture

The only way this could be worse is if the 3 were located throughout Japan.  Then contamination would be WIDESPREAD.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:41 | 1050323 schoolsout
schoolsout's picture

you haven't started yet?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:42 | 1050332 Rusty_Griswold
Rusty_Griswold's picture

I wonder who owns www.fukushimameltdown.com 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:44 | 1050335 Misstrial
Misstrial's picture

I live 12 miles from the Diablo Canyon nuclear reactor which has been built near seven (7) fault lines.

What Tyler is reporting, is what the MSM and pols have failed to do and that is tell people the truth so they can prepare/escape/relocate to save their lives.

For nuclear accidents, the sooner one knows of a reactor disablement, the sooner one can move to a safer location and reduce radiation exposure risk. Even moving 5 miles away opposite winds will reduce exposure tremendously.

Knowing the prevailing winds around my area, I know which direction I need to go in order to escape nuclear fallout.

~Misstrial

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:45 | 1050344 QQQBall
QQQBall's picture

I guess the real question is - Knowing what you do, why do you live there?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:47 | 1050372 Misstrial
Misstrial's picture

Job. 

~Misstrial

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:30 | 1050921 VinniPukh
VinniPukh's picture

"Job."

...at the plant, right?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 16:29 | 1051821 Misstrial
Misstrial's picture

No.
Check my username.

~Misstrial

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 16:00 | 1051683 Armchair Bear
Armchair Bear's picture

When I lived in Avila, the thing I hated about it was that damned reactor just a mile or two away.

 

Love the area, hate Diablo.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:48 | 1050371 chindit13
chindit13's picture

Why do you think I live in Asia?  I know Tyler's style, and by the time he gets warmed up, it's already cocktail time in my part of the world.  Takes his edge off.  I just wonder if potassium iodide tablets go well with Barbaresco.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:17 | 1050524 Crassus
Crassus's picture

Kingfisher Strong.

Good for rising or falling empires.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:58 | 1050418 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

I picked a bad week to stop freebasing.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:33 | 1050275 Count Floyd
Count Floyd's picture

In the words of Junkyard Willie, "Calm yo' ass down!"  and read this.

http://bravenewclimate.com/2011/03/13/fukushima-simple-explanation/

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:42 | 1050328 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

From your link.

Summary points at the end.

"The seawater used as cooling water will be activated to some degree. Because the control rods are fully inserted, the Uranium chain reaction is not happening. That means the “main” nuclear reaction is not happening, thus not contributing to the activation. The intermediate radioactive materials (Cesium and Iodine) are also almost gone at this stage, because the Uranium decay was stopped a long time ago. This further reduces the activation. The bottom line is that there will be some low level of activation of the seawater, which will also be removed by the treatment facilities. "

Has it not been admitted that the rods are exposed or have been exposed?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:55 | 1050402 Count Floyd
Count Floyd's picture

I read "exposed" as not being covered by water.  They are not "exposed" to the open atmosphere.

The coverage and reponse to the situation reminds me of the old DEVO song: Too Much Paranoias.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:17 | 1050538 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

I disagree.

In any event the article was posted on 13th.

The admission was made on the 14th.

In general the article uses to much "apologetics".

I wouldn't quibble with the "science" but it reads like a shill piece.

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:56 | 1050747 Count Floyd
Count Floyd's picture

Yeah, the MIT faculty are notorious shills.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:39 | 1050963 ZapBranigan
ZapBranigan's picture

 

Really dude?  Unbelievable.  You tell everyone to calm down, then post an article from a website that exudes a pro-nuclear platform and even includes multiple advertisements from pro-nuclear factions.  Jeez, get a clue.

Next you'll be telling everyone to 'chill-out' concerning the ills of the economy by posting a link from the Federal Reserve website with an article explaining how healthy FRN's are.  Truly hilarious. 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 15:41 | 1051608 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

Tell one thing, did you dismiss the article on the basis of banners before or after you actually read it?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:12 | 1050831 Quixote2
Quixote2's picture

The hundreds of tons of discharged fuel stored in the fuel pools on the top deck will be exposed to the atmosphere once the water boils away.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:28 | 1050592 trav7777
trav7777's picture

the core normally is immersed in water.

When that water stops circulating, aka cooling ceases, it begins to boil.  THIS is the steam they have been forced to vent.  As it boils off and is vented, the water level goes down.

When you see Cesium in the steam, you know that the water level inside the reactor has gone below the level of the top of the fuel rods.  This is what they mean by "exposed."

When they say fuel rods melting, of course, EVERYONE harkens back to "China Syndrome" hysteria of "meltdown."

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:51 | 1050380 Yikes
Yikes's picture

I hope the story is right but you see the problem don't you?  It's basically all theoretical.  Isn't it?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:33 | 1050277 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

This explains why they couldn't do something as simple as getting fuel to the fire trucks on scene, in order to restart their pumps, which they had been using to try and cool the cores.

How long until a huge swath of this area is a no fly zone?

 

Very sad.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:37 | 1050302 Cdad
Cdad's picture

Why the hell are they not dumping concrete on top of these things?  Good grief, how long shall they simply play the "everything is under control" nonsense?

It matters not which nation you are in...governments are simply incompetent.  A conglomeration of the lowest of the lowly. 

Bury those f'n things!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:42 | 1050321 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

Maybe because there is low supply opf concrete pourers running into areas where nuclear reactors are exploding.

Just a guess.

Unless of course you were volunteering your services?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:45 | 1050343 Cdad
Cdad's picture

You cannot be serious with this response...can you?  I'm not in Japan.  Were I, I guess I would have to consider it...considering what would happen if I did not!  There are about 14 million people in Tokyo.  Ummmm...

Are you a banker by any chance at all?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:48 | 1050362 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

I'll buy you a plane ticket if you will pour the concrete.

Not a banker

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 17:02 | 1052027 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Japan has fabulous robot technology, right?  Please tell that they worked on other robots besides life-like female robots.  Please tell me that their robots can do more than cuddle and giggle.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:05 | 1050469 Blankman
Blankman's picture

Can't say I've ever heard of a lead plated concrete truck.  There is a concrete plant next door I will go ask if any of them want to volunteer for the heroic job of dumping concreteonto this thing.  

 

I'm not sure you are being too rational about this.  Yes this thing is going to blow.  When it blows it is going to fuck up a whole lotta shit.  Based on the radiation readings they are giving out to the media I would more the 20x that reading to tell you what the true reading is.  It is not as if the japanese govt. hasn't been lying about this yet, now have they.  

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:10 | 1050494 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

You are not in Japan???? Why not?????

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:12 | 1050505 sschu
sschu's picture

Gosh I cannot wait for the "drop a nuke on it to stop the leak" or the "sink a ship and cover the hole" or "put a big cork in it" type nonsense that was so prevalent during the gulf oil crisis.

These guys are far more capable and dedicated than we can imagine.  Their homes, family and neighbors are NEARBY and are at risk.  Give them credit for heroic efforts, many have and will die in the process, but they are doing all they can given the hand they have been dealt. 

sschu  

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:03 | 1050790 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

I wonder if they can even get a truck in there.  I'm sure the roads are completely FUBAR.

Fer Christ's sake, they apparently can't even keep the one trashpump they have pumping seawater into reactor #3 going...

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 20:14 | 1051998 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Hate to be blunt, but this is Japan's problem and no one else's.  And it had better stay that way.

No problem rescuing people, but the radiation is their problem.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:49 | 1050377 Bob
Bob's picture

Surely there was a private sector role in this thing?  As in the design, construction, and operation of the plant? 

Who actually owns the plants? 

Of course the government was wrong to allow private industry to perpetrate the power plants upon the society, but now it becomes a spectacular demonstration of government fecklessness alone? 

Looks to me like yet another demonstration that government bought by big business is no more competent than its owners.  And, as always, it is the public that pays the price.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:00 | 1050436 Fernley Girl
Fernley Girl's picture

This is from memory, and I may be wrong, but I think I've read Toyko Power owns the plants, & the components came from GE.

Lots of problems with the plants, and lots of government cover-ups.  A brief overview here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_power_in_Japan

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:12 | 1050504 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

They were all old late 1960's stuff and were overdue for a redo......

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:51 | 1051370 redpill
redpill's picture

From BBC: "Japanese engineer Masashi Goto, who helped design the containment vessel for Fukushima's reactor core, says the design was not enough to withstand earthquakes or tsunamis and the plant's builders, Toshiba, knew this. More on Mr Goto's remarks to follow."

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:00 | 1050441 Rogerwilco
Rogerwilco's picture

The Japanese are not Russians. At Chernobyl, they had volunteers who ran with shovels of borax and thew it over the edge of a wall onto the exposed core. Each man was permitted do it once because the trip exposed them to a huge dose of radiation. Quite a few volunteered to run a shovel more than one trip. Later on they had helicopters on site to drop bucket loads of concrete in an attempt to stop the graphite fires. These helicopters were hastily-shielded and the pilots knew they were likely receiving radiation doses that could be fatal.

The Japanese are about saving face

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 17:00 | 1052007 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Two words: kamikaze pilots.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:14 | 1050507 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

From AP:

Japan 'Chernobyl' feared
US nuclear experts have warned that pumping seawater to cool a quake-hit Japanese nuclear reactor is an “act of desperation” that could foreshadow a Chernobyl-like disaster, referring to the 1986 accident in Ukraine.

...

Peter Bradford, former member of the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC), said that if the cooling attempts failed, “at that point it’s a Chernobyl-like situation where you start dumping in sand and cement.”

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:37 | 1050643 trav7777
trav7777's picture

Peter Bradford is NOT A NUCLEAR EXPERT.

He is a fucking LAWYER and was a member of the NRC, which makes him a BUREAUCRAT, not an expert.

He is a Global Warming guy who has written negatively about nuclear power in the past.  Fucking do some research.

AP is trolling for hysteria...and what Bradford says is materially FALSE.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:05 | 1050793 kreso
kreso's picture

+1

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:29 | 1050597 trav7777
trav7777's picture

you should be ashamed that you felt confident enough to express such a stupid opinion.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:52 | 1050728 Dr_Dazed
Dr_Dazed's picture

And dumping concrete on them would accomplish what?  You can't "smother" a nuclear reaction with concrete.  You really expect concrete to take a proper set in random conditions exposed to a freezing, possibly raining, water soaked environment?  Glad you're not in charge of emergency response.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:41 | 1050975 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

The concrete dumping was to extinguish the fires on the graphite fires... that's what the Soviets used for a containment structure.  Problem was, once it got hot enough it burned and carried radiation in the heat and smoke plume.   They also dumped lead and boron... this was to absorb zoomies, to help take the energy out of the runaway.
Back to Japan...
Water is to remove heat... without anywhere to go the water won't do shit except heat up, boil, build pressure and cause more damage.  Once enough pressure builds, those 150 psi firepumps won't move a damn thing.  No circulation, no heat sink.  Capping the unit now won't serve any good, the heat needs to be brought under control first, so the fuel will stay stable and manageable, so it won't build more heat.  See the cycle now?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:53 | 1051379 redpill
redpill's picture

The reaction has stopped, what's occurring is residual heat from the radioactive material.  You put concrete on it to stop as much of the radiation from escaping as possible.  If they get to that point it means they've given up.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:42 | 1050280 Spalding_Smailes
Spalding_Smailes's picture

 

• Live Feed - Geiger Counter Japan •

Koto City

 www.ustream.tv

Ota City

 www.ustream.tv

How to read a geiger counter.

www.ehow.com

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:46 | 1050353 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

Oh hey, a clock too.  Handy!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:52 | 1050393 snowball777
snowball777's picture

For reference, < 200 cpm is okay. > 700 cpm not good. These counters appear to be indoors which would limit the readings.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:35 | 1050281 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

When do we get the earth-shatter ka-boom and massive radiation dump into the atmosphere?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:08 | 1050480 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

On or about March 22nd. In fact, we will have a series of global, off the charts in the space of about 48-72 hours, from which we will never re-construct this power-maddened world again. 

Humpty dumpty and all that sort of thing.

ORi

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/03/11/axis-trembles/

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:39 | 1050655 trav7777
trav7777's picture

and if we don't, you will leave ZH and stop spamming with your fruitcake website?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:00 | 1050776 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Dream on, racist scum.

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:08 | 1050818 kreso
kreso's picture

Calling you a spammer is not racist. But you calling people racist is a libel.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:17 | 1050853 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Perhaps you are not familiar with his views on race? Not read the comment section much?

Say something original (oh regional anyways) or keep shut. Thanks.

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:38 | 1050961 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

Do you live in the united states? if so, what gives you the right to say such a thing?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:23 | 1051215 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

racist scum? nice talk. he called you a fruitcake; and you are a fruitcake, and a wingnut; I don't give a rat's ass what race you are; you're a mental cripple and you need to get gone from here and stop causing pixel pollution.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:33 | 1051269 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Ho hum genie ass.
Back into your deluded hole you go.
ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 15:44 | 1051620 Byte Me
Byte Me's picture

+10 trav7777

.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:45 | 1050676 TumblingDice
TumblingDice's picture

For fecks sake man! You may be emotionally attached to this but for all our sakes lets just keep this space free from drivel pertaining to the supernatural. The world around you is all you get. No magic formula into the future exists.

Shit happens all the time. Important shit happens all the time. I forget the name of the logical fallacy demonstrated here, confirmation bias or something like that but you can always attach important events to a graph and make it seem like it correlates. Anybody can do that. In order to have any weight your model must pass the the test of science. You have to isolate the variables, include all the relevant quantitative data yada yada yada. It's science man! Much better than bullshit.

This thing sparked my curiosity once. Then I read Carl Sagan. Science and logic are better than emotion and hope. View everything with scrutiny. Don't get attached to your hypotheses. A proper test of the hypotheses should be conducted. Back testing is not it, especially with so many variables. The theory's predictive power is it. Please test your hypothesis. You can't control the variables so you can't test it.

You've got faith. I recommend science.

/rant

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:09 | 1050819 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Tumbling, I'm afraid science is showing you it's limitations right about now. in your face. if you cannot see it, the loss is yours. And if you believe Carl Sagan, disinformation agent extraordinnaire, your loss is even greater.

Perhaps you need a new pair of eyes. Science is giving up, at the limits, all it sees is metaphysics. I suggest a quick read of Fritjof Capra and the Tao of Physics.

Good luck. Your virtual reality is going to get a reset. 

Also, do explain how, on my fruitcake website, as racist scum Trav above calls it, Cathartes Aura (a fellow ZHer and amazing astrologer0) predicted that on 3-11-11 the world would change, in a big way, probably forever? Science mix with astrology much?

Here, go check it out for yourself.

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/03/04/astrological-and-other-deep-insights-from-ca/

it will take your obviously erudite self less than a pornographic minute to do a quick read. In fact, skip to the bottom, since I'm sure your time is precious.

Good luck again. You do sound all right. Sort of.

;-)

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:37 | 1050949 TumblingDice
TumblingDice's picture

Carl Sagan was a gentleman and a scholar. Let us not speak ill of the dead.

I have gone through many transformations and while I appreciate your recommendations as they were probably made with good intentions, my current approach of logic and science has treated me very well thus far.

I apologize if I seemed a bit crude in my reply above. I become irritated when integrity of information is not up to the proper standards. I know about science and its limitations. Everything has limitations...on a long enough timeline and all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del%27s_incompleteness_theorems

It is only logical for science and any model to be incomplete. If it was complete that would be we would be perfectly able to predict the future and than would make the world pretty dull. But so far we haven't found anything that would let us control our future and present any better than science.

Writing poems does not prove you can predict the future. If you try to argue against logic you are arguing the very thing you are using. Science and logic got us this far, lets not abandon them when they are needed most. They still work.

Thanks for the good luck, but luck really does not mean much to me. I will wish you good luck since it seems like it means something to you.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:14 | 1051178 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

I'm afraid i cannot agree with your take on Mr. Sagan. Perhaps, for all his dis-innformation, he should be rolling in his grave. He helped squelch some of the brightest minds/concepts in astronomy/astrophysics. 

And I cannot help but laugh at your comment on not needing luck and them looking at yoru handle, tumbling dice. All about chance, are you?

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:14 | 1051171 RichardP
RichardP's picture

Luck was defined for me once as all those things that I could not control. Luck is that point where life acts on me and I cannot provide any modifying input.  Such action on me could be negative (bad luck), neutral, or positive (good luck).  If I can control it in anyway (even if I choose not to), it is not luck.  If I cannot control it in any way, it is luck.

That is probably the most useful definition of luck I have encountered.  Otherwise, the word luck has not much meaning for me either.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:31 | 1051258 cossack55
cossack55's picture

My luck always begins with the letter F.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:27 | 1051231 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 Kiss my ass racist fruitcake.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:10 | 1050822 ZakuKommander
ZakuKommander's picture

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Just because you don't understand/can't test theories at one point in time does not mean that there will never be what you would refer to as a "scientific" explanation. 

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, er, TD . . . 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:03 | 1050791 steve2241
steve2241's picture

At that point, we'll be able to use your favorite source of cooking fuel - cow dung!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:16 | 1050856 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

You'll be surprised at the benefits steve, but you sound disparaging, so I'll leave it.

ORI

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:39 | 1050967 High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter's picture

Is that called stanky fuel? 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:37 | 1050291 Dr. Porkchop
Dr. Porkchop's picture

Shit.. check

Fan.. check

Catalyst.. several

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:36 | 1050292 the_magician
the_magician's picture

 


 "Although we cannot directly check it, it's highly likely happening."

 

Like I said, there's nothing they can do. Just keep a cap on run away media hysteria and hope for the best. 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:37 | 1050293 ietalon
ietalon's picture

Fuk Us hime!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:36 | 1050294 Zero Debt
Zero Debt's picture

Triple meltdown?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:38 | 1050303 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

Leave it up to the Japanese to do it in Style :)

 

2012 = THE YEAR EVERYBODY GETS CANCER!!

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:45 | 1050347 Thomas
Thomas's picture

Mayan Revenge

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:38 | 1050298 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

FREE RADIATION FOR EVERYBODY!!

 

CHERNOBYL³

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:41 | 1050320 the_magician
the_magician's picture

Your caps-locked posts fit good with your avatar. Sense of panic. INTENTIONAL?

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:38 | 1050300 jesusonline
jesusonline's picture

Nuclear winter? Commentary: Japan shakes decades of work rebuilding an industry

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/nuclear-winter-2011-03-14

This whole debacle makes the coming (or rather ongoing) energy crisis even more complicated. Nuclear was supposed to be one things that would help to cushion the process of oil depletion. Now it doesn't look it's gonna happen. Of course you can always dream of abiotic oil if it makes you happy.      

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:51 | 1050359 MachoMan
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It's not like the oil industry has a solid reputation either...  we can either have incredibly inefficient fuel/energy or we can have more efficient fuel/energy and face significantly more dire environmental disasters...  Given our infrastructure is built around the latter...

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:11 | 1050832 steve2241
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Has the science of thorium-fuelled nuclear reactors been discredited? Anyone here follow this issue?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:38 | 1050305 johnQpublic
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i am become death, destroyer of worlds

 

Bhagavad Gita-

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:31 | 1050603 Confused
Confused's picture

i am become death, destroyer of worlds

 

- Oppenheimer   ;-P 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:44 | 1050677 cossack55
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i am become death, printer of dollars

 

 

     -The Bernank

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:18 | 1050862 Confused
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Well played </golf clap> 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:41 | 1051303 mt paul
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I become inflation 

printer of dollars..

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:39 | 1050312 malikai
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The question which keeps coming back to me is: Why didn't they put their backup gennies in a tsunami-proof location? All of this would have been averted with working gennies.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:47 | 1050360 jerry_theking_lawler
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I would hate to be involved in the RCA for these reactor failures....

 

I personally think that a few simple measures like this would have averted complete meltdown.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:13 | 1050500 Ident 7777 economy
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Excellent CD; I concur with the assessment -  much more damage than Unit 1.

 

It looks like several large 'windows' (walls blown out) were opened in the concrete part of the structure, too ... unlike what happened with Unit 1.

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:43 | 1050313 Cognitive Dissonance
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Here is an admittedly grainy image of unit 3 after the explosion. There appears to be damage to the concrete containment building and not just to the upper third where the overhead crane operated. The upper steel structure was also heavily damaged. But we are supposed to continue to believe all is well and that containment is still secure.

 

Contrast that with unit 1 after the explosion.

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:44 | 1050339 Jim in MN
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CD,

BBC is running an AFP satellite pic of the damage to 1 and 3.  I can't post the pic....wanna grab it?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/

--JinMN

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:56 | 1050405 Cognitive Dissonance
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Thanks for the link.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:02 | 1050444 Dr. Porkchop
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That second one looks much more angry.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:07 | 1050471 Cognitive Dissonance
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Some would call it a smoking hulk. This is pure insanity.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:17 | 1050532 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

Wow ... just - wow ...

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:45 | 1050675 trav7777
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your hysteria and paranoia is pure insanity.

You and the rest need to STFU until and unless you have evidence beyond "gee that looks fucked up."

As I have repeatedly said on the previous threads, there IS NO WAY FOR THE GOVERNMENT TO HIDE RADIATION in the event of a primary containment failure.  Does that COMPUTE for you?

There are about a few THOUSAND dosimeters now operating in Japan WELL CLOSE ENOUGH to detect such an event, whose effects will be unmistakable.

Please, all the hysterics, go into your bunkers for fuck's sake...bug out NOWWWWWWWWWWWW and stop posting.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:00 | 1050773 Geoff-UK
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Is Trav7777 really Kevin Bacon reliving the last scene from Animal House?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:22 | 1050878 IQ 145
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 That's why I gave up. If you tell them anything factual, simple, straightforward, in plain English; they screech at you for being part of the cover-up; or whatever. They'll forget all about it in another week; it's too late now for any "exciting" melting down; too much residual heat has already been dissipated; it's all over but the pissing and moaning.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:26 | 1050894 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 Be gentle with him; he's a philosopher, he doesn't actually know anything.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:56 | 1051066 Head for the Hills
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OK People, move along.  Nothing to see here.....

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:39 | 1051296 Cognitive Dissonance
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Trav,

The building is actually the secondary containment. The core is surrounded by the primary containment. I have never inferred the primary containment has been breached. I did infer that the containment building had been breached.

But if they are venting the core into the building, and they have admitted they did and still are doing so, then some of the core gases are now in the atmosphere and on site if the containment building has been breached.

Try educating yourself on the difference between the two containment levels.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:40 | 1050652 Convolved Man
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The long rectangular buildings to the upper left of the damaged reactor containment buildings are, more than likely, the turbine buildings.  Based on the appearance of holes in the roofs, the turbines may be damaged.  After the number 2 reactor containment building blows from a "hydrogen gas explosion", this facility will probably be a total loss.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:26 | 1050897 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

 you want to worry about turbines? what; are you a turbine salesman?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:42 | 1050667 RmcAZ
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Here is a hi res version from Digital Globe's Flickr page:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/digitalglobe-imagery/5526481182/sizes/o/in/...

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:46 | 1050340 Spalding_Smailes
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Nothing To See ........ 

 

 


Nothing To See Here - Naked Gun

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:39 | 1050314 prophet
prophet's picture

Where is the fleet of boats with the mitigation equipment?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:52 | 1050391 Rusty Shorts
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Good question.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:05 | 1050460 Ahmeexnal
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They are probably busy butchering innocent whales.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:39 | 1050316 schoolsout
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you haven't started yet?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:40 | 1050319 JW n FL
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Just for shits ans giggles.. but there are no fire trucks that can pump sea water on too all 3 cores? 1 fucking truck can run 3 hoses.. I have seen them up close.. but that is to, too much common sense... lets have G. fucking E. fly in pump from fucking where?

 

Get in the truck.. start the truck.. drive the truck to the plant(s).. run a hose to the ocean (or water connection of any kind).. run hoses to the hawt cores..

and then..

Turn the fucking pumps on..

if anyone makes it any more difficult than that.. they are fucking stupid.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:44 | 1050336 the_magician
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they propably did it. problem is they keep getting blown away. is it hard to understand?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:51 | 1050379 Boilermaker
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There are no roads to get there anymore.  Which is why this is almost certainly doomed.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:56 | 1050404 Dr. Porkchop
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Firetrucks on the scene of the reactors would conflict with the message of calm.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:02 | 1050410 depression
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I think they rolled the fire trucks in as first responders, hooked up the fire hoses and ran as much sea water into containment they could pump in. In parallel they sent in mechanical crews to fix/rebuild the on-site generators, and also are shipping (?) in new replacement generators (on back order ?!!) This all assumes the pipes are not cracked or dislodged/ disconnected from the containment, and also assumes (probably incorrectly) containment is not cracked and leaking containment water (explaining why the condenser backup system (3) failed... ie. water is draining out of the bottom of containment vessel).

Also doesn't help these buildings keep exploding and killing the work crews. Not to mention the radiation levels do limit the duration a worker can remain on site.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:04 | 1050455 tekhneek
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Right. Because the reactors are 100ft apart from each other and the salt waters just a hop skip away.

It's pretty much the same thing as turning on a water hose and dropping it in a bucket, right? What a moron.

Think before you comment, please. The last thing we or Japan need is someone who thikns everyone's being stupid for not "fixing" the nuclear melt down already. This is almost as bad as the guy who just said pour concrete on it.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:07 | 1050473 Boilermaker
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Honestly, I am an Engineer and I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express, the problem isn't getting the water on it but rather CIRCULATING the water.  Without the circulation, which carries the heat away, you're pissing in the wind at those temperatures.  Simply turning a fucking hose on it doesn't do jack shit.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:15 | 1050516 High Plains Drifter
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Its called the laws of thermodynamics, no? 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:15 | 1050523 snowball777
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I guess you missed the point about the pressure in the 'hawt cores' being excessive and making it difficult to pump with puny firehoses? Or the point about the roads to the plant(s) being out of service?

Looks like 'fucking stupid' comes in a variety of flavors.

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:24 | 1050569 sschu
sschu's picture

Turn the fucking pumps on..

Also, there was a report that the pressure in the containment building and vessel was hampering the injection of coolant.  Furthermore, they were using the fire water pumps for this effort.  Not the best. 

Piping and wiring this stuff up in a virtual war zone with limited power, tools and resources knowing that you could be dead in seconds if this thing blows (which it did).

Maybe a cursory reading of what is transpiring would be helpful. 

sschu

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:40 | 1050325 nobusiness
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Japanese consumers forced to move to USA, bullish for priceline, apple and amzn.

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:55 | 1050397 High Plains Drifter
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If they flood Cali with some more Japanese, maybe they can buy up Hollyweird from the Russian jews, and for once , start making some decent movies for a change. Godzilla would be a nice change, no?

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 14:50 | 1051360 StychoKiller
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"History shows again and again, how Nature points out the folly of men":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6rDWqjnW7w&feature=related

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 13:43 | 1050995 steve2241
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The Japanese Government has decided to loosen their extremely restrictive immigration policies and accept 10 million of America's illegals. Viva la melting pot!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:41 | 1050327 Jim in MN
Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:46 | 1050352 Yikes
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Hope that's not what I think it is: track of radioactivity over the Pacific?

 

Yikes!

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:05 | 1050452 Rusty Shorts
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Jim, what's on the monitor to the right at 1:43 ??

Is that a projection of the radioactive plume?

 

EDIT, nevermind, it was a tsunami projection, they say.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:25 | 1050577 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture

 

 

 

Looks like reactor schematics at :14

 

Showing most likely the cooling/coolant flow paths ...

 

 

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:50 | 1050383 Lord Welligton
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Well spotted.

There tracking something there.

And it appears to be heading for the USA.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 11:52 | 1050395 Jim in MN
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I am used to working in places where you shouldn't wander around with video cameras.

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:13 | 1050509 depression
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Note the text at the top of the graph on the screen. 14 Mar 2011 to 17 Mar 2011. That is a toxic plume forecast footprint plot, showing the location of the radioactive plume  based on three weather forecast scenarios (3 lines on the plot).

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:25 | 1050570 Lord Welligton
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The time given is UTC(GMT/Zulu) 03:00 14th March.

Are they forecasting something that they know has already happened?

And the Sixth Fleet leaving?

France telling it's people to evacuate?

 

Mon, 03/14/2011 - 12:19 | 1050543 GoinFawr
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Tracking or projecting.

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